Is the matchmaking any good for the multiplayer? Will it actually find people as bad as I am at the game?
Any ELO system is good with a sufficiently large playerbase if you are patient and give it a dozen games or so to learn your skill level
Yes, but is the playerbase big enough again now and is their particular algorithm good enough to match players that have never played the game competitively before?
Is the matchmaking any good for the multiplayer? Will it actually find people as bad as I am at the game?
Any ELO system is good with a sufficiently large playerbase if you are patient and give it a dozen games or so to learn your skill level
Yes, but is the playerbase big enough again now and is their particular algorithm good enough to match players that have never played the game competitively before?
I think it's fine for me either way. I doubt I could beat a blind tortoise, much less anyone who goes "oh, I'd love to play the original scbw again!", so it'll be about the same no matter who it matches me against! Haha haaaa...
What has in the past made SC2 (and I would presume SCR too) unfun for me is the constant advice of "If you have time to look at your army you are likely not macroing good enough. Never be not macroing, ignore the battles.". Economy stuff is fun to me sure, but I also want to micro battles and enjoy fighting them! If the only way for me to win is to just macro and a-move units at my enemy then I don't endup having any fun. Yet I endup usually losing due to being out-macro'd so the advice is sound. Not sure what to do about that.
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Watching a guy stream and he just barely held against this crazy lurker/ling/defiler push using tank/marine/medics. Man this is exciting to watch! He went on to get annihilated by ultras because the zerg kept him contained but that hold was cool. It was like an actual battle that wasn't just boom boom boom GG in 30s.
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Steam Profile | My Art | NID: DarkMecha (SW-4787-9571-8977) | PSN: DarkMecha
But I don't think that's very common right? It's been a long time since I played SC2.
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VariableMouth CongressStroke Me Lady FameRegistered Userregular
I will maintain that longer games with more than one big battle are much much more common in modern sc2 than previous iterations.
won a game on bnet! my 4th multiplayer game, all protoss. There are certain things I have no idea how to handle in the 'best' way, like laying spider mines. doesn't appear that I can shift-place them, and also doesn't seem that I can grab 3 of em and drop them. but then I may be hitting the wrong keys or getting distracted or any of a number of things.
slowly figuring out how I will be managing certain elements. building hotkeys really doesn't feel worth it besides in certain cases but even then it's mostly just to double-tap the key and cheat it as though it was a camera key.
ANYWAY I am rambling, suffice to say it's hard and I need to practice outside of a stressful game to see how certain things work.
I thought I'd check out Twitch even though I own SCR, because I wanted to check out how it all looked in the hands of someone who can actually treat the game right, instead of a a-move scrub like me.
Turns out barely anyone with an english speaking channel remembers how to play StarCraft either! So that made me feel a bit better. When I browsed for the game a couple of times this afternoon the top-viewed channel that wasn't Chinese or Korean had the guy asking chat what he needed to build a lair. And he had over a thousand viewers.
I thought I'd check out Twitch even though I own SCR, because I wanted to check out how it all looked in the hands of someone who can actually treat the game right, instead of a a-move scrub like me.
Turns out barely anyone with an english speaking channel remembers how to play StarCraft either! So that made me feel a bit better. When I browsed for the game a couple of times this afternoon the top-viewed channel that wasn't Chinese or Korean had the guy asking chat what he needed to build a lair. And he had over a thousand viewers.
There's a few former bw ppl who stream pretty frequently, you might have just been browsing at a bad time. A lot of the sc2 scene streaming it now and though I like most of them, they didn't all play bw competitively previously. Incontrol is pretty good and is streaming a lot these days.
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VariableMouth CongressStroke Me Lady FameRegistered Userregular
bw being on the launcher really makes me want d2 and wc3 on there (and hell, the older ones too!.. I have both of those installed though)
you can navigate from there for other races... it's far far more detailed than the sc2 liquipedia ever got strategy wise. I haven't poured over every inch of it so it may not have everything you want but after a quick read through just TvP I was pretty impressed.
edit - I know some people don't find this as helpful as I do (and it's not as helpful in BW as in SC2 since there's no production tab) but there are VODS of lots of bw games from this year, korean or otherwise, on various twitch and youtube channels. if you'd be interested in learning a bit from pro games I will search for some for you... again it's not as great for specifics as sc2 VODS are but it'll at least help with some general timings and strategies.
The mineral lines are so funkily spread out (campaign) that I just make a ton until they all look busy.
Witty signature comment goes here...
wra
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VariableMouth CongressStroke Me Lady FameRegistered Userregular
edited August 2017
for zerg there 100% is and it's strict. for the other races I am sure it's somewhere but I couldn't begin to guess where it is.
just beat a zerg by making lots of marines and medics. that felt great, he messed me up a LOT with mutas but I counter attacked to take out the third and then built up a 'big' force and rolled him over. even stimming is a pain, you can't have any medics in the group so you can't just box and go. I can make my ctrl groups smarter I just didn't realize...
oh, also. the game keeps messing up my mouse, at a certain point in game it turns into like a vertical line with dashes in it and then it's all messed up outside of the game too. it happens in sc2 sometimes too though very rarely. if anyone has seen or heard of this lemme know. grrrrrrr.
edit - quick googling says it's my videocard. fuuuuuuuuck man, I will be dealing with this for a long fucking time.
edit2 - it seems that if you turn on the windows magnifier the problem goes away. small price to pay since I'd rather not restart. it IS related to ATI graphics cards.
The mineral lines are so funkily spread out (campaign) that I just make a ton until they all look busy.
I played a game against Vari as Protoss and basically didn't stop making workers the entire game until I maxed out. I have no idea how many I had, replays don't show it. But I never felt like I had enough.
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VariableMouth CongressStroke Me Lady FameRegistered Userregular
2 stim timing wins vs zerg 2-0
5 games vs toss trying to go mech, lost every game but 1. twice I just got walked over, twice were decently long but I either got outproduced or beat by DTs (I would have had that game if I had a sweeper)
0 other terran
also: though I can cure the mouse issue in windows, the mouse is then invisible in BW . at least it's not quite so bad, when it first happens it turns into a stick which is intolerable but it quickly turns back to a standard arrow just a little glitchy, I can tolerate that.
Lord_AsmodeusgoeticSobriquet:Here is your magical cryptic riddle-tumour: I AM A TIME MACHINERegistered Userregular
I'm trying to get through the campaign one mission a day, it'll take awhile but it's fun. I should probably check out the custom games scene see if the remaster has revitalized any of the classics I love. Starcraft 2's modabiltiy is great and fun, but sometimes I feel it's a bit TOO open. That way has a lot of advantages and I love a lot of it's arcade games, but part of the charm of Starcraft and Warcraft 3 custom maps was using a limited palette to create a masterpiece, and the fun of creating something totally different and cool out of the parts you were given and still making them fit.
Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if Labor had not first existed. Labor is superior to capital, and deserves much the higher consideration. - Lincoln
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3cl1ps3I will build a labyrinth to house the cheeseRegistered Userregular
I remember BW's campaign as being much harder when I was younger. Starting Mission 7 now and so far my strategy of "macro up, get 3/3/3 upgrades, a-move ~20 each of zealots and dragoons with a few archons and DTs mixed in" has yet to fail.
The story writing (and the character dialogue) still holds up a head above SC2's, just as I remember
Im pretty sure as you go back in time with blizzard games all the writing gets better. D2 was better than D3. Warcraft 3 is way ahead of WoW, and even old wow is better than the garbage theyve been putting out the last couple expansions.
The story writing (and the character dialogue) still holds up a head above SC2's, just as I remember
Im pretty sure as you go back in time with blizzard games all the writing gets better. D2 was better than D3. Warcraft 3 is way ahead of WoW, and even old wow is better than the garbage theyve been putting out the last couple expansions.
WoW's stories have not changed much, what's dragging your opinion of them down is repetition and power creep. They re-use the same types of stories over and over but just increase the stakes. From saving a single NPC to saving a village to saving a city to saving a zone to saving a continent to saving a new continent to saving Azeroth to saving the entire universe.
Dhalphir on
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Lord_AsmodeusgoeticSobriquet:Here is your magical cryptic riddle-tumour: I AM A TIME MACHINERegistered Userregular
The story writing (and the character dialogue) still holds up a head above SC2's, just as I remember
Im pretty sure as you go back in time with blizzard games all the writing gets better. D2 was better than D3. Warcraft 3 is way ahead of WoW, and even old wow is better than the garbage theyve been putting out the last couple expansions.
WoW's stories have not changed much, what's dragging your opinion of them down is repetition and power creep. They re-use the same types of stories over and over but just increase the stakes. From saving a single NPC to saving a village to saving a city to saving a zone to saving a continent to saving a new continent to saving Azeroth to saving the entire universe.
No I'm pretty sure the stories are actually worse, because before the power creep they didn't feel the need to rewrite massive parts of the lore, or completely redefine established characters, or kill off every interesting non-hero the universe had. So not only do they keep retelling the same stories, they're running out of genuinely interesting content and either have to completely rehash or destroy old good content to keep things going, and so the product is moving farther and farther away from it's quality foundations to a mire of hastily formed retcons and contrived new threats.
Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if Labor had not first existed. Labor is superior to capital, and deserves much the higher consideration. - Lincoln
Reusing the same story is basically Blizzard's MO for SC2 and more recent WoW. Like Kerrigan = Illidan in almost every single way. In the original SC its space politics and kind of a fallen angel story, SC2 is not. Also it's super fun to be able to just get on and play some of the old school UMS games.
I went ahead and started with BW because I MISS my lurker babies.
Did anyone else skip straight to BW?
No, but I very nearly skipped all of the campaigns to jump straight into The Antioch Chronicles.
It was my favorite thing in Starcraft, though it be fan-made. Good running jokes, good story, more memorable characters. Very interested to see how it plays in Remastered, though I assume/hope the answer is: "It just does."
Of course, I'm going through the normal campaign like a doofus. I like the campaign just fine. Except for the late Zerg campaign. I hate trying to throw 6 control groups of zerg against a fortified Protoss defense force full of bullshit, only to have to make a new 6 control groups all over again because they all died and only did half the job.
I'm also playing this using wine-staging since I exclusively use Linux on my gaming rig, and it runs beautifully, Multiplayer included. Also have found that the other Bliz titles run as well, so I'm looking forward to finally getting into SC2 when I've had my fill of SC Remastered.
Lord_AsmodeusgoeticSobriquet:Here is your magical cryptic riddle-tumour: I AM A TIME MACHINERegistered Userregular
I wish I was better at this game. Like the actual game. Currently in the late Protoss campaign, nothing so far has been terribly challenging though there've been a couple annoying bits, but I'm afraid to go for multi since I'm not actually great at optimized macro. Custom games are fun though. One thing is, I remember Bunker Wars being hugely popular, and I think it's probably way more fun with the original gameplay than the SC2 version since the Ball O Death isn't as much of a thing. Maybe I should try and find an up to date version of it and host it myself.
Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if Labor had not first existed. Labor is superior to capital, and deserves much the higher consideration. - Lincoln
I wish I was better at this game. Like the actual game. Currently in the late Protoss campaign, nothing so far has been terribly challenging though there've been a couple annoying bits, but I'm afraid to go for multi since I'm not actually great at optimized macro. Custom games are fun though. One thing is, I remember Bunker Wars being hugely popular, and I think it's probably way more fun with the original gameplay than the SC2 version since the Ball O Death isn't as much of a thing. Maybe I should try and find an up to date version of it and host it myself.
This is how I feel. I took the plunge and played a few ladder games this weekend though. I won some, I lost some. I found them all pretty fun. I've definitely had a lower apm than every opponent I've faced, but that's not a big deal to me.
I see bunker wars going on pretty often if you just look a bit. I should give it a try one of these days.
Yes and no. Basically there was a later patch, pre-Remastered, that removed the portraits and sounds folders from the Starcraft directory, and as a result the portrait and sound mods don't work. So the dialogue portions before the map starts have the correct voice work, but the portraits are the newer standard ones. The same whenever there are dialogue triggers during any of the campaign itself. It's just that the portraits aren't the intended ones, and the voices for the units themselves aren't changed to his VA work.
This sucks, but is still fine. The actual campaign runs as intended, though it's as friggin' impossibly hard as I remember it being, and I don't feel any shame at typing "power overwhelming" a couple of times here and there. Especially that very first map, where you barely get the base up and running and they throw 100 zerglings and 'lisks at you.
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Yes, but is the playerbase big enough again now and is their particular algorithm good enough to match players that have never played the game competitively before?
I think it's fine for me either way. I doubt I could beat a blind tortoise, much less anyone who goes "oh, I'd love to play the original scbw again!", so it'll be about the same no matter who it matches me against! Haha haaaa...
What has in the past made SC2 (and I would presume SCR too) unfun for me is the constant advice of "If you have time to look at your army you are likely not macroing good enough. Never be not macroing, ignore the battles.". Economy stuff is fun to me sure, but I also want to micro battles and enjoy fighting them! If the only way for me to win is to just macro and a-move units at my enemy then I don't endup having any fun. Yet I endup usually losing due to being out-macro'd so the advice is sound. Not sure what to do about that.
I went ahead and started with BW because I MISS my lurker babies.
Did anyone else skip straight to BW?
Witty signature comment goes here...
wra
You mean no deathball.
Witty signature comment goes here...
wra
Yes exactly. Everything is more spread out and it makes the battles take longer and just way more interesting to me.
To be fair I found this SC2 match on YT that was crazy fun to watch:
But I don't think that's very common right? It's been a long time since I played SC2.
won a game on bnet! my 4th multiplayer game, all protoss. There are certain things I have no idea how to handle in the 'best' way, like laying spider mines. doesn't appear that I can shift-place them, and also doesn't seem that I can grab 3 of em and drop them. but then I may be hitting the wrong keys or getting distracted or any of a number of things.
slowly figuring out how I will be managing certain elements. building hotkeys really doesn't feel worth it besides in certain cases but even then it's mostly just to double-tap the key and cheat it as though it was a camera key.
ANYWAY I am rambling, suffice to say it's hard and I need to practice outside of a stressful game to see how certain things work.
Turns out barely anyone with an english speaking channel remembers how to play StarCraft either! So that made me feel a bit better. When I browsed for the game a couple of times this afternoon the top-viewed channel that wasn't Chinese or Korean had the guy asking chat what he needed to build a lair. And he had over a thousand viewers.
Def playing piano a lot more than before.
Though, I notice that I have to hit control group keys hard as they don't register too easily for some reason.
Also, my hand keeps being out of position for some reason. Always one key to the right. It's strange...
Witty signature comment goes here...
wra
There's a few former bw ppl who stream pretty frequently, you might have just been browsing at a bad time. A lot of the sc2 scene streaming it now and though I like most of them, they didn't all play bw competitively previously. Incontrol is pretty good and is streaming a lot these days.
you can navigate from there for other races... it's far far more detailed than the sc2 liquipedia ever got strategy wise. I haven't poured over every inch of it so it may not have everything you want but after a quick read through just TvP I was pretty impressed.
edit - I know some people don't find this as helpful as I do (and it's not as helpful in BW as in SC2 since there's no production tab) but there are VODS of lots of bw games from this year, korean or otherwise, on various twitch and youtube channels. if you'd be interested in learning a bit from pro games I will search for some for you... again it's not as great for specifics as sc2 VODS are but it'll at least help with some general timings and strategies.
The mineral lines are so funkily spread out (campaign) that I just make a ton until they all look busy.
Witty signature comment goes here...
wra
just beat a zerg by making lots of marines and medics. that felt great, he messed me up a LOT with mutas but I counter attacked to take out the third and then built up a 'big' force and rolled him over. even stimming is a pain, you can't have any medics in the group so you can't just box and go. I can make my ctrl groups smarter I just didn't realize...
oh, also. the game keeps messing up my mouse, at a certain point in game it turns into like a vertical line with dashes in it and then it's all messed up outside of the game too. it happens in sc2 sometimes too though very rarely. if anyone has seen or heard of this lemme know. grrrrrrr.
edit - quick googling says it's my videocard. fuuuuuuuuck man, I will be dealing with this for a long fucking time.
edit2 - it seems that if you turn on the windows magnifier the problem goes away. small price to pay since I'd rather not restart. it IS related to ATI graphics cards.
I played a game against Vari as Protoss and basically didn't stop making workers the entire game until I maxed out. I have no idea how many I had, replays don't show it. But I never felt like I had enough.
5 games vs toss trying to go mech, lost every game but 1. twice I just got walked over, twice were decently long but I either got outproduced or beat by DTs (I would have had that game if I had a sweeper)
0 other terran
also: though I can cure the mouse issue in windows, the mouse is then invisible in BW
Witty signature comment goes here...
wra
Man I really do like the new images they're using during the campaign epilogues (is that what you call them?) with new art.
Kinda neat to give it a new look and more immersion.
Witty signature comment goes here...
wra
I just started the terran campaign
was kind of sad that the protoss one had ended and not too thrilled about playing terran.... dirty boring terrans...
... then I heard the siege tank talk about justice...
the room got real dusty real fast
Witty signature comment goes here...
wra
Oh you skipped straight to bw I forgot
Im pretty sure as you go back in time with blizzard games all the writing gets better. D2 was better than D3. Warcraft 3 is way ahead of WoW, and even old wow is better than the garbage theyve been putting out the last couple expansions.
Steam: https://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198004484595
WoW's stories have not changed much, what's dragging your opinion of them down is repetition and power creep. They re-use the same types of stories over and over but just increase the stakes. From saving a single NPC to saving a village to saving a city to saving a zone to saving a continent to saving a new continent to saving Azeroth to saving the entire universe.
No I'm pretty sure the stories are actually worse, because before the power creep they didn't feel the need to rewrite massive parts of the lore, or completely redefine established characters, or kill off every interesting non-hero the universe had. So not only do they keep retelling the same stories, they're running out of genuinely interesting content and either have to completely rehash or destroy old good content to keep things going, and so the product is moving farther and farther away from it's quality foundations to a mire of hastily formed retcons and contrived new threats.
Steam: https://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198004484595
No, but I very nearly skipped all of the campaigns to jump straight into The Antioch Chronicles.
It was my favorite thing in Starcraft, though it be fan-made. Good running jokes, good story, more memorable characters. Very interested to see how it plays in Remastered, though I assume/hope the answer is: "It just does."
Of course, I'm going through the normal campaign like a doofus. I like the campaign just fine. Except for the late Zerg campaign. I hate trying to throw 6 control groups of zerg against a fortified Protoss defense force full of bullshit, only to have to make a new 6 control groups all over again because they all died and only did half the job.
I'm also playing this using wine-staging since I exclusively use Linux on my gaming rig, and it runs beautifully, Multiplayer included. Also have found that the other Bliz titles run as well, so I'm looking forward to finally getting into SC2 when I've had my fill of SC Remastered.
Maybe he will finally do episode 3.
https://www.sc2mapster.com/projects/antioch-chronicles-remastered
This is how I feel. I took the plunge and played a few ladder games this weekend though. I won some, I lost some. I found them all pretty fun. I've definitely had a lower apm than every opponent I've faced, but that's not a big deal to me.
I see bunker wars going on pretty often if you just look a bit. I should give it a try one of these days.
Yes and no. Basically there was a later patch, pre-Remastered, that removed the portraits and sounds folders from the Starcraft directory, and as a result the portrait and sound mods don't work. So the dialogue portions before the map starts have the correct voice work, but the portraits are the newer standard ones. The same whenever there are dialogue triggers during any of the campaign itself. It's just that the portraits aren't the intended ones, and the voices for the units themselves aren't changed to his VA work.
This sucks, but is still fine. The actual campaign runs as intended, though it's as friggin' impossibly hard as I remember it being, and I don't feel any shame at typing "power overwhelming" a couple of times here and there. Especially that very first map, where you barely get the base up and running and they throw 100 zerglings and 'lisks at you.
It's been probably 15 years since I played this game, let's see if I can remember anything.
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