I am rounding the bend on Death Masks and wanted to ask, what would be the ideal place to slot in Side Jobs? I would imagine the stories take place at different points on the timeline, so is there a good place to read it that wouldn't create too many spoilers or whatever?
You can only read the first 2 shorts if you read it after Death Masks. Which is perfect timing if you want to start it ASAP (not counting the first story, before book 1).
It came out after Changes if you want to read it then, but most of the stories take place before then. They pretty much slot between each book if you want do that, just pay attention to the blurb that RT800 mentioned of when it's happening.
When I did a series relisten for my wife (her first time through), I used http://dresdenfiles.wikia.com/wiki/The_Dresden_Files to determine when to switch to Side Jobs between books. It's got a Chronology section that includes all the short stories and no spoilers.
If you're not already reading them, I recommend Ben Aaronovich's Peter Grant / Rivers of London books. It's another "He's a wizard! Who solves crimes!" series. It's pretty great.
Civics is not a consumer product that you can ignore because you don’t like the options presented.
Man, I got stupid excited for a minute because I'd missed the thread's conversation back in May, so I saw 100 new posts and thought "That has to be a new book, that's way too many posts for just a random bump." And now I'm sad.
I really miss the time when Butcher could pump out two books in a year back when he was doing the Fury quintet.
If you're not already reading them, I recommend Ben Aaronovich's Peter Grant / Rivers of London books. It's another "He's a wizard! Who solves crimes!" series. It's pretty great.
Read them (except it seems 6 is out, so 1 behind). Not as good as Dresden as it's Dresden (Nightengale) is always sitting on his ass while Butters (Peter) plods around. Book 5 was especially bad about this. Though they're OK overall.
If we're talking about series that are like Dresden, I liked the Nightside series by Simon R Green. It's more of a hodgepodge universe than Dresden-esque urban fantasy, but the style is very similar.
And yeah, Butcher is pulling himself a lot of different directions recently. Comics, games, the Windlass series, etc, but there's also the issue of (I think it was actually discussed here before) but he is having a house built for himself and in the meantime he's living with his wife, but it's like her house and he has a mental block on creativity when he's not in like, his own space. The house is way way behind schedule and it basically lines up with his hard time just sitting down and cranking out word count.
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amateurhourOne day I'll be professionalhourThe woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered Userregular
I'm sure it's been said, but the Patricia Briggs Mercy Thompson series is amazing and I mean it's essentially the same universe. Like there's no reason if you squint your eyes you can't tell that it's the same Earth, but one story is in Chicago and one is in Washington State.
In the same urban fantasy genre as Dresden and Mercy Thompson I recommend Kevin Hearne's Iron Druid Chronicles. It has a really great mix of serious stuff and humor.
If we're talking about series that are like Dresden, I liked the Nightside series by Simon R Green. It's more of a hodgepodge universe than Dresden-esque urban fantasy, but the style is very similar.
And yeah, Butcher is pulling himself a lot of different directions recently. Comics, games, the Windlass series, etc, but there's also the issue of (I think it was actually discussed here before) but he is having a house built for himself and in the meantime he's living with his wife, but it's like her house and he has a mental block on creativity when he's not in like, his own space. The house is way way behind schedule and it basically lines up with his hard time just sitting down and cranking out word count.
Nightside works more on the "everything is true" principle, which can make for interesting stories, but fails to really build a world and makes trying to figure things out all but impossible.
Still a decent read, just not as good as Dresden Files.
Though i would not say the styles are similar, beyond that both draw from detective tropes early on.
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BlackDragon480Bluster KerfuffleMaster of Windy ImportRegistered Userregular
I really miss the time when Butcher could pump out two books in a year back when he was doing the Fury quintet.
Who knows how much Pokemon and/or Roman Legion fanfic JB had in his early portfolio to draw on to help the plotting and writing process for the Fury books.
No matter where you go...there you are. ~ Buckaroo Banzai
Didn't he supposedly have ideas for another half dozen books followed by an 'Apocalyptic Trilogy' to wrap things up?
Butcher, damnit, I hope you're either trimming that shit back a little or planning to start releasing two a year, because otherwise this is going to take decades. :-(
First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKER!
Didn't he supposedly have ideas for another half dozen books followed by an 'Apocalyptic Trilogy' to wrap things up?
Butcher, damnit, I hope you're either trimming that shit back a little or planning to start releasing two a year, because otherwise this is going to take decades. :-(
We are on 12? 13? The total series was 20ish I think.
I picked it up late last night for my Nook app... really loved the first short story involving Luccio. What I'm not happy about is that three of the stories were already released in their own Jim Butcher collection - the Bigfoot stories. If he was going to do that anyhow, why release those three on their own?
Other than that, I'm looking forward to reading a number of new (to me) Dresden file stories. It's been so long since the last actual book that I almost feel like I'm going throuh withdrawal - constantly checking his twitter, his site, and his forums for release details.
I actually thought you meant Cold Days. I had to look at the contents to notice there was a story with that name. I really hope there isn't a bad story in there. The two I've read so far were pretty good.
RingoHe/Hima distinct lack of substanceRegistered Userregular
I didn't like that particular story! I felt like it was a real disservice to the characters involved as it moved them in arcs that are disappointing to me.
In particular
The Winter Lady being oversexed yet denied release is interesting in how it retroactively reframes Maeve as a character, but who cares about Maeve at this point?
It seems fantastically unfun to me to read about Molly dealing with it
And the story does absolutely nothing to advance our knowledge about Carlos' "Galahad" thing. He's just down to bone, and that's the extent of it
It was easily the least satisfying story in the collection for me
I purchased the Brief Cases audiobook as soon as it came out, but I've been hesitant to start it. I'm about 80% certain that Jim Butcher has become a member of the alt right in the time since Skin Game, and I'm worried I'll run into something in one of the newer stories that confirms it.
I purchased the Brief Cases audiobook as soon as it came out, but I've been hesitant to start it. I'm about 80% certain that Jim Butcher has become a member of the alt right in the time since Skin Game, and I'm worried I'll run into something in one of the newer stories that confirms it.
I'm scared to ask because I have never looked him up on social media. Is this like Orson Scott Card, where one day (was it in the 90s?) he just goes publishes a hugely hateful thing and proceeds to harp on it or become even more hardline on it ever after? Because ugh.
I purchased the Brief Cases audiobook as soon as it came out, but I've been hesitant to start it. I'm about 80% certain that Jim Butcher has become a member of the alt right in the time since Skin Game, and I'm worried I'll run into something in one of the newer stories that confirms it.
Uh, where did you get this idea?
Edit:
His twitter is so boring that I fell asleep looking at it. Mostly "I am playing overwatch" or my nerdy niece or Justice League was trash.
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WhiteZinfandelYour insidesLet me show you themRegistered Userregular
I picked it up late last night for my Nook app... really loved the first short story involving Luccio. What I'm not happy about is that three of the stories were already released in their own Jim Butcher collection - the Bigfoot stories. If he was going to do that anyhow, why release those three on their own?
Other than that, I'm looking forward to reading a number of new (to me) Dresden file stories. It's been so long since the last actual book that I almost feel like I'm going throuh withdrawal - constantly checking his twitter, his site, and his forums for release details.
It's been so long since the last actual book that I went through withdrawal, had a minor relapse with short stories, went through withdrawal again, and have now been clean long enough that I no longer twitch when law enforcement walks by think about Harry unless I get a notification here.
I purchased the Brief Cases audiobook as soon as it came out, but I've been hesitant to start it. I'm about 80% certain that Jim Butcher has become a member of the alt right in the time since Skin Game, and I'm worried I'll run into something in one of the newer stories that confirms it.
Uh, where did you get this idea?
Edit:
His twitter is so boring that I fell asleep looking at it. Mostly "I am playing overwatch" or my nerdy niece or Justice League was trash.
I think it might be a walk, but here's at least part of the sitch from what I remember.
So from 2014-2017(?) in the Hugo Awards a couple groups of alt-right, anti-minority, anti-LGBT voting groups got together with the intent on gaming the Hugo Award nominations so that the vast majority of the nominations to be picked to win would be almost exclusively by white-male, often right wing, authors with very little LGBT or minority representation in the books themselves. These were primarily the "Sad Puppies" and the "Rabid Puppies" and they were pretty damn awful about everything, including openly harassing people into not attending the voting and nomination events, and being very publicly racist, sexist, and homophobic. Even their attempts to seem reasonable were anti-representation, stating that they wanted good books "without the politics".
One of the books selected by them for 2015 was Skin Game. This was also the only time Jim had been nominated for an award for his novels (The Aeronaut's Windlass was nominated the next year). Before the awards, Jim was very silent about being nominated, but in a reply to my asking about it on twitter he seemed to be coy about the whole thing.
However, as many authors were pretty openly denouncing them, including some who were picked by them, it came off as too little of a reaction.
During the Hugo awards Skin Game came up fifth in the voting, behind the option to not give an award. The Sad Puppies, however, have continued to back him, but also he has continued to stay silent on the issue.
My takeaway has been generally that he's most likely not secretly alt-right, but that there's a fair amount on that side who like him, and no one should be holding their breath for him to denounce them.
I wouldn't be shocked if that was somehow tied to how he writes his protagonist. An 'old fashioned' kind of guy, while overlooking any aspects they don't like (female characters growing in number and power, Murphy not taking his shit, etc).
I'm by no means throwing a line in the sand that he's some hardcore secret SJW Paladin throwing holy smites of equality and justice for all, but I can see how the puppies of various sorts might've latched onto his works, but am not quite ready to abandon him as an author for not denouncing them just yet.
... god damnit just release Peace Talks already.
Edit: this is entirely off the cuff and a few beers into the evening, I certainly don't want to nitpick every last bit of the Dresden Files. There are problematic elements for daaaaays, but for now it's generally inoffensive enough to enjoy without feeling too bad about it. I'm just saying that I can see how that element might've drawn a line from A to B.
Forar on
First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKER!
At this point it wouldn't surprise me if he doesn't want to get involved. I didn't even know which is kind of what most people would think since most wouldn't even pay attention to stuff like that.
To me seems like he was just being evasive. I am not sure if I would call it proof or he is the camp. Most of these folks don't keep quiet about that shit. So I wouldn't say I would take that as any proof outsome maybe reading into an event what may or may not be there.
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WACriminalDying Is Easy, Young ManLiving Is HarderRegistered Userregular
Yeah, that reaction is disappointing, BUT there's a lot of ground between "secretly alt-right" and "unwilling to dive head-first into Twitter hell".
That doesn't hint at anything. Only problem with his reply is it isn't part of Peace Talks, damnit.
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WACriminalDying Is Easy, Young ManLiving Is HarderRegistered Userregular
That being said, if Butcher did turn out to be secretly alt-right, I can't say it would necessarily come as a huge shock. A disappointment and a frustration, but not a shock.
I like Butcher's work but he doesn't have much in the way of literary pretension. The nominal complaint of the Puppies was that stuff like Butcher doesn't get recognized with awards. (It was absolutely a stalking horse, or at best was coopted into one, for racist/sexist exclusionary assholes.) That's generally true as far as it goes and has pretty much always been true. It wouldn't surprise me if Butcher was sympathetic to the nominal statement but not onboard with the rest of it. Also note that his tweet on the matter was really early in the saga before it became super obvious just how bad the puppies were.
On the other hand, if I were a writer who wrote pulpy style of books and that was my entire livelihood I can understand not wanting to piss off a portion of the fan base for pulpy work. While I'll commend folks like Scalzi and Stross who very publicly told fans of those hateful ideologies to fuck off and keep fucking off forever, I have trouble blaming folks for not wanting to draw that section of the internet hate machine down on their head.
Just from his writing I'm doubtful of the alt-right complaint. Dresden's outmoded gender views aren't presented in a way where he's almost ever right. He's even quite often wrong to his own detriment. I think part of the reason it is there is because it is a classic piece of noir detective trope.
Ay Jim.
Any plans for future collabs with Larry Correia? Just recently finished Monster Hunter Files and thought your addition was unique but fit the tone of that universe well. I'd love to see you write more in that universe, and maybe even have a (not canonical, just for fun) Dresden x MHI crossover.
His response :
I hesitate to collab with anyone I don't already hate with a seething passion, since it seems like I wind up there anyway. Plus, I'm like the WORST person in the world to work with.
I like Larry. I doubt I'd want to do anything beyond a short piece with him.
Correia was the origin of Sad Puppies and an alt right goose. Butcher has mentioned him favorably on his Twitter before, wrote a short story for an anthology of his last year, and made a post once defending the idea of Sad Puppies.
It’s possible Correia is just an old friend with conflicting politics, but it’s more likely that they share similar beliefs.
It’s not like I think he’s gonna turn Harry into a Nazi or something, but I think there’s a painfully high chance we get some subtle digs. He already busted out the “trust but verify” line in the Peace Talks preview chapter. The saying wasn’t created by Gamergate, but they sure loved using it, and him choosing it might point to the kind of company he was keeping at the time he wrote it. I’m not going to be surprised to see something like a woman with dyed hair getting a stern lecture from Harry about “how the world really works”, or a female character who turns out to be a “professional victim”.
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I know the first story in Side Jobs takes place before the events of Storm Front. The second story takes place between Death Masks and Blood Rites.
I think the rest of the stories take place after Blood Rites.
It came out after Changes if you want to read it then, but most of the stories take place before then. They pretty much slot between each book if you want do that, just pay attention to the blurb that RT800 mentioned of when it's happening.
If you're not already reading them, I recommend Ben Aaronovich's Peter Grant / Rivers of London books. It's another "He's a wizard! Who solves crimes!" series. It's pretty great.
I really miss the time when Butcher could pump out two books in a year back when he was doing the Fury quintet.
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Read them (except it seems 6 is out, so 1 behind). Not as good as Dresden as it's Dresden (Nightengale) is always sitting on his ass while Butters (Peter) plods around. Book 5 was especially bad about this. Though they're OK overall.
I hope Butcher finishes the book this year!
And yeah, Butcher is pulling himself a lot of different directions recently. Comics, games, the Windlass series, etc, but there's also the issue of (I think it was actually discussed here before) but he is having a house built for himself and in the meantime he's living with his wife, but it's like her house and he has a mental block on creativity when he's not in like, his own space. The house is way way behind schedule and it basically lines up with his hard time just sitting down and cranking out word count.
that series is just too short
they were really good tho
Nightside works more on the "everything is true" principle, which can make for interesting stories, but fails to really build a world and makes trying to figure things out all but impossible.
Still a decent read, just not as good as Dresden Files.
Though i would not say the styles are similar, beyond that both draw from detective tropes early on.
Who knows how much Pokemon and/or Roman Legion fanfic JB had in his early portfolio to draw on to help the plotting and writing process for the Fury books.
~ Buckaroo Banzai
Didn't he supposedly have ideas for another half dozen books followed by an 'Apocalyptic Trilogy' to wrap things up?
Butcher, damnit, I hope you're either trimming that shit back a little or planning to start releasing two a year, because otherwise this is going to take decades. :-(
We are on 12? 13? The total series was 20ish I think.
Dude has written a lot of books.
From the FAQ on Butcher's site;
So another 8 or 9 to go, assuming that's still the plan (which of course can change for any number of reasons).
There's three stories in it set post Skin Game, the last of which is exclusive to the collection.
Let's all discuss how much these stories rock!
And how much
Other than that, I'm looking forward to reading a number of new (to me) Dresden file stories. It's been so long since the last actual book that I almost feel like I'm going throuh withdrawal - constantly checking his twitter, his site, and his forums for release details.
I do need to read brief cases though.
Wut.
In particular
It seems fantastically unfun to me to read about Molly dealing with it
And the story does absolutely nothing to advance our knowledge about Carlos' "Galahad" thing. He's just down to bone, and that's the extent of it
It was easily the least satisfying story in the collection for me
I'm scared to ask because I have never looked him up on social media. Is this like Orson Scott Card, where one day (was it in the 90s?) he just goes publishes a hugely hateful thing and proceeds to harp on it or become even more hardline on it ever after? Because ugh.
Uh, where did you get this idea?
Edit:
His twitter is so boring that I fell asleep looking at it. Mostly "I am playing overwatch" or my nerdy niece or Justice League was trash.
It's been so long since the last actual book that I went through withdrawal, had a minor relapse with short stories, went through withdrawal again, and have now been clean long enough that I no longer twitch when law enforcement walks by think about Harry unless I get a notification here.
I think it might be a walk, but here's at least part of the sitch from what I remember.
So from 2014-2017(?) in the Hugo Awards a couple groups of alt-right, anti-minority, anti-LGBT voting groups got together with the intent on gaming the Hugo Award nominations so that the vast majority of the nominations to be picked to win would be almost exclusively by white-male, often right wing, authors with very little LGBT or minority representation in the books themselves. These were primarily the "Sad Puppies" and the "Rabid Puppies" and they were pretty damn awful about everything, including openly harassing people into not attending the voting and nomination events, and being very publicly racist, sexist, and homophobic. Even their attempts to seem reasonable were anti-representation, stating that they wanted good books "without the politics".
One of the books selected by them for 2015 was Skin Game. This was also the only time Jim had been nominated for an award for his novels (The Aeronaut's Windlass was nominated the next year). Before the awards, Jim was very silent about being nominated, but in a reply to my asking about it on twitter he seemed to be coy about the whole thing.
During the Hugo awards Skin Game came up fifth in the voting, behind the option to not give an award. The Sad Puppies, however, have continued to back him, but also he has continued to stay silent on the issue.
My takeaway has been generally that he's most likely not secretly alt-right, but that there's a fair amount on that side who like him, and no one should be holding their breath for him to denounce them.
I'm by no means throwing a line in the sand that he's some hardcore secret SJW Paladin throwing holy smites of equality and justice for all, but I can see how the puppies of various sorts might've latched onto his works, but am not quite ready to abandon him as an author for not denouncing them just yet.
... god damnit just release Peace Talks already.
Edit: this is entirely off the cuff and a few beers into the evening, I certainly don't want to nitpick every last bit of the Dresden Files. There are problematic elements for daaaaays, but for now it's generally inoffensive enough to enjoy without feeling too bad about it. I'm just saying that I can see how that element might've drawn a line from A to B.
To me seems like he was just being evasive. I am not sure if I would call it proof or he is the camp. Most of these folks don't keep quiet about that shit. So I wouldn't say I would take that as any proof outsome maybe reading into an event what may or may not be there.
That doesn't hint at anything. Only problem with his reply is it isn't part of Peace Talks, damnit.
And I remember thinking, "At least this series will be released with greater regularity. Look how many there are already!"
So over the course of about 2 months I read all 15 books and now here we are.
On the other hand, if I were a writer who wrote pulpy style of books and that was my entire livelihood I can understand not wanting to piss off a portion of the fan base for pulpy work. While I'll commend folks like Scalzi and Stross who very publicly told fans of those hateful ideologies to fuck off and keep fucking off forever, I have trouble blaming folks for not wanting to draw that section of the internet hate machine down on their head.
Just from his writing I'm doubtful of the alt-right complaint. Dresden's outmoded gender views aren't presented in a way where he's almost ever right. He's even quite often wrong to his own detriment. I think part of the reason it is there is because it is a classic piece of noir detective trope.
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His response :
Correia was the origin of Sad Puppies and an alt right goose. Butcher has mentioned him favorably on his Twitter before, wrote a short story for an anthology of his last year, and made a post once defending the idea of Sad Puppies.
It’s possible Correia is just an old friend with conflicting politics, but it’s more likely that they share similar beliefs.