I'd say that Ladies & Gentlemen isn't as easy to teach as it should be. The rulebook is one of the worst in recent memory, with important parts scattered all over in places you'd never think to look. Teaching it was stressful as I had constantly had 10 people waiting on me as I was desperately scanning the entire book to look up a rule I didn't know where to look for. I remember there being a bunch of stuff that wasn't clarified by the rules too.
But you're trying to teach it to upwards of 10 people, probably a lot of them casual because that's how it's sold, and there's fiddly stuff that gets lost. The whole mechanic of ladies "owning" or "favoring" boutiques is confusing, and the giant group sitting at a long table far from each other glazed over and forgot the whole "unshopped stores get a discount for the owning player" rule.
It was a game that people had a blast with once or twice based entirely on the theme, then no one has wanted to play again 6 months later.
(oh yeah, in addition to the cardinal sin of paper money, they don't even give you nearly enough of it for a large game. Constantly running out and forced to make change with everyone else at the table)
I played Heroes of Land, Air and Sea this past weekend. It was really fun. I rarely enjoy dudes on a map game, and i think this one joins Forbidden Stars, and Blood Rage as my favorites in the genre. I have yet to play Twilight Imperium and the space politics look promising on that end.
Really is a shame that licensing issues caused Forbidden Stars Lifespan to end.
Huh. What did you like about it? It fell completely flat for us, and I couldn't even imagine the possible audience for it.
Edit: Not a dig, genuinely curious. Like, what did you see as its killer features? What was a highlight from your game?
I played Heroes of Land, Air and Sea this past weekend. It was really fun. I rarely enjoy dudes on a map game, and i think this one joins Forbidden Stars, and Blood Rage as my favorites in the genre. I have yet to play Twilight Imperium and the space politics look promising on that end.
Really is a shame that licensing issues caused Forbidden Stars Lifespan to end.
Huh. What did you like about it? It fell completely flat for us, and I couldn't even imagine the possible audience for it.
Edit: Not a dig, genuinely curious. Like, what did you see as its killer features? What was a highlight from your game?
The action selection and trying to maximize your army movement actions by predicting other actions and following. I liked the decisions about whether to use your peons for following or for resource generation. I think the factions were interesting enough (I played lizards). I also liked diceless combat.
I thought it was light and thematic. I put a lot more weight on theme than most, probably.
Hm. I guess for me, it's hard for me to give it the okay on theme when its theme is "Warcraft III".
I've always been a sucker for warhammer/tolkien/etc fantasy settings, so even if it wasn't original i still enjoyed it. But I can see how it would be tiring for a lot of folks.
I'd say that Ladies & Gentlemen isn't as easy to teach as it should be. The rulebook is one of the worst in recent memory, with important parts scattered all over in places you'd never think to look. Teaching it was stressful as I had constantly had 10 people waiting on me as I was desperately scanning the entire book to look up a rule I didn't know where to look for. I remember there being a bunch of stuff that wasn't clarified by the rules too.
But you're trying to teach it to upwards of 10 people, probably a lot of them casual because that's how it's sold, and there's fiddly stuff that gets lost. The whole mechanic of ladies "owning" or "favoring" boutiques is confusing, and the giant group sitting at a long table far from each other glazed over and forgot the whole "unshopped stores get a discount for the owning player" rule.
It was a game that people had a blast with once or twice based entirely on the theme, then no one has wanted to play again 6 months later.
(oh yeah, in addition to the cardinal sin of paper money, they don't even give you nearly enough of it for a large game. Constantly running out and forced to make change with everyone else at the table)
Yeaaah, I tried introducing that to my seasoned board gamer group, and I had to wrestle with the rule books before putting the whole thing away, defeated.
I'd probably try Waterdeep as a worker placement intro.
EDIT: Has anyone played Adrenaline at five players?
Looks like instead of roll to move they replaced it with cards, and you have two and pick one to play each turn for movement. I dunno, it would be fun to own, but man, that's an expensive game for what it is. And the expansion content just takes it straight into overpriced territory.
Looks like instead of roll to move they replaced it with cards, and you have two and pick one to play each turn for movement. I dunno, it would be fun to own, but man, that's an expensive game for what it is. And the expansion content just takes it straight into overpriced territory.
More dollars than sense. I'm a sucker for gimmicks.
Mechanical game/flow questions for people. I'm working on prototyping a deck driven dungeon crawler for a personal challenge event, and I'm trying to get a sense of balance on having the fights be interesting while still keeping things moving.
Is there a standard length of combat you're shooting for per encounter? Like, if the fight is supposed to be super easy, are you aiming for it to be 1-2 rounds per person?
Conversely, as players, is there a point where combat just feels tedious? Obviously some people enjoy RP way more than fighting, but in a combat focused game, would you prefer a series of rapid encounters that you can blow through, or fewer, more dangerous and dicier encounters with rejuv/regen breaks in between (both for the characters and the people playing)?
Edit: Please @ me in replies so I can have a quick reference to posts! Thanks!
Double Edit:
Combat would be thinned out RPG style - You have 3-4 abilities to choose from, and an energy pool. Depending on the area size, there would be Close, Mid and Far as ranges, with mobs drawn from a deck and put into ranges on the draw. Players could pick their location at the start of combat (minus some events shuffling them). Certain abilities and attacks for both players and mobs would have range restrictions.
@Mvrck it really depends on how the flow of combat works. Are the players using a deck of cards, ala a combat deck builder? Or is it more traditional RPG stuff with randomized encounters? If combat is based off of cards, it should try and be fast paced to start and get gradually longer/tougher as you proceed.
Need a voice actor? Hire me at bengrayVO.com
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051 Steam ID Twitch Page
@Mvrck it really depends on how the flow of combat works. Are the players using a deck of cards, ala a combat deck builder? Or is it more traditional RPG stuff with randomized encounters? If combat is based off of cards, it should try and be fast paced to start and get gradually longer/tougher as you proceed.
Updated my post with a more detailed description. Let me know if you have other questions!
Is the game actually fun or just riding nostalgia?
They redid all the mechanics to make it an actually fun game, is my understanding. I haven't looked at the Kickstarter yet so I'm not sure exactly what all that entails.
AstaerethIn the belly of the beastRegistered Userregular
@Mvrck There are two things to consider—how an individual battle should feel, and how the pacing of the whole game should go. A video game or DnD battle might easily take an hour and be really complicated and intense, but that might be your entire board game session. Or they might be two minute trash mob affairs for grinding, which in board game format might be repetitive and annoying.
If games are about interesting choices, how interesting are the choices during combat? How interesting are the choices outside of combat (like whether or not to get into the next fight)?
Also, how many player and how fast are their turns? 1-2 rounds of six players in Mage Knight is incredibly long, 1-2 rounds of two players in Uno is pretty quick.
@Mvrck
I'd would say that if you have to use the same move more than 3x in an encounter it will feel tedious. If my turn consists of, "I'm doing this, again." Then combat is boring. The choice and strategy have left.
However, if I only ever play 1-2 cards before combat is over, then I won't feel as though there's any challenge or room for failure or long term planning.
If the game is combat focused, I would make sure people constantly have new or various options to choose from, and aim for people to choose 5+ turns. Also make sure turns can be planned, so it can still move quickly. Maybe everyone chooses their action simultaneously kind of deal.
If you need a play tester or someone to bounce ideas/rules off of, let me know. Not to toot my own horn, but I’ve got a degree in game design and live collaborating with others to improve their game ideas.
Need a voice actor? Hire me at bengrayVO.com
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051 Steam ID Twitch Page
If you need a play tester or someone to bounce ideas/rules off of, let me know. Not to toot my own horn, but I’ve got a degree in game design and live collaborating with others to improve their game ideas.
The goal is to do a digital prototype in addition to the physical, so I'll definitely be hitting people up from the forums to try to do some testing towards the end of the period.
To answer @Astaereth and @ArcSyn
I'm definitely open to a wider variety of abilities, I'm just also trying not to overload the players too much. I would say, the goal is for a solid, if slightly lucky run should take around 2 hours, with that ideally having at least 1-2 boss fights.
The basic gameplay loop will be traveling room to room through the dungeon, choosing your own path when branches occur. The rooms will have Events and Loot. When you enter a room, you draw from the event deck (more important rooms get more events) and then the loot deck. The party is trying to recover a number of mystical artifacts that are shuffled into the loot deck. If they get enough from exploring and fighting, they can win just from that. They also have a chance to find the main bosses reliquary to defeat him "permanently". The main boss will always be available to slay at the end of the dungeon with enough mystical artifacts to "win". For every room explored, enemy defeated and artifact recovered, the party will get points added to their overall score.
For RP aspects, I am experimenting with the idea of each person having a hidden goal they want to accomplish as well on the run. Nothing "betrayal" styled, but little side missions they get bonus points to their scores if they can accomplish them during the run. Say one person is a "Survivor" and must never get knocked out in combat. Another might be a pillager and wants to get at least X wealth in treasure from the run.
For the actual combat, I'm hoping that a lot of the fighting will be a mix of dealing damage and puzzle solving via displacement. Enemies will attack off of dice rolls, after the players have all gone (events may flip initiative). Players get to determine their order each round. So it will be less "oh I'm fireballing again" and more "Okay, if I do my fireball THIRD this time, you guys can clump them all up first...". Or at least, that's the hope.
I just backed Crypt and unbroken.
Crypt is a minimalist card and dice game with set collection and push you rluck mechanics in the style of mint works. It looks great and is only 9 dollars.
Unbroken is a solo dungeon crawl. I might still back out because I don't play solo a lot these days.
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KetarCome on upstairswe're having a partyRegistered Userregular
I just backed Crypt and unbroken.
Crypt is a minimalist card and dice game with set collection and push you rluck mechanics in the style of mint works. It looks great and is only 9 dollars.
The guys who designed Crypt are super nice. I used to see them at a big board game Meetup in the Chicago burbs, where they did a lot of play-testing of different designs. I haven't been able to go in a couple of years though; I'd bet they're still there most weeks.
Their other games are both light fun - Road to Infamy and Cosmocracy/Galactic Debate.
Huh. Ran into an old coworker and they invited me to PAX east on their guest pass for Saturday afternoon. Never been to one before. Should be an experience. which anime character should i dress up as
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Mojo_JojoWe are only now beginning to understand the full power and ramifications of sexual intercourseRegistered Userregular
I just backed Crypt and unbroken.
Crypt is a minimalist card and dice game with set collection and push you rluck mechanics in the style of mint works. It looks great and is only 9 dollars.
Unbroken is a solo dungeon crawl. I might still back out because I don't play solo a lot these days.
It feels too simple. I'm not sure there's enough game there.
Homogeneous distribution of your varieties of amuse-gueule
Posts
But you're trying to teach it to upwards of 10 people, probably a lot of them casual because that's how it's sold, and there's fiddly stuff that gets lost. The whole mechanic of ladies "owning" or "favoring" boutiques is confusing, and the giant group sitting at a long table far from each other glazed over and forgot the whole "unshopped stores get a discount for the owning player" rule.
It was a game that people had a blast with once or twice based entirely on the theme, then no one has wanted to play again 6 months later.
(oh yeah, in addition to the cardinal sin of paper money, they don't even give you nearly enough of it for a large game. Constantly running out and forced to make change with everyone else at the table)
Huh. What did you like about it? It fell completely flat for us, and I couldn't even imagine the possible audience for it.
Edit: Not a dig, genuinely curious. Like, what did you see as its killer features? What was a highlight from your game?
The action selection and trying to maximize your army movement actions by predicting other actions and following. I liked the decisions about whether to use your peons for following or for resource generation. I think the factions were interesting enough (I played lizards). I also liked diceless combat.
I thought it was light and thematic. I put a lot more weight on theme than most, probably.
Nintendo ID: Pastalonius
Smite\LoL:Gremlidin \ WoW & Overwatch & Hots: Gremlidin#1734
3ds: 3282-2248-0453
I've always been a sucker for warhammer/tolkien/etc fantasy settings, so even if it wasn't original i still enjoyed it. But I can see how it would be tiring for a lot of folks.
Nintendo ID: Pastalonius
Smite\LoL:Gremlidin \ WoW & Overwatch & Hots: Gremlidin#1734
3ds: 3282-2248-0453
Yeaaah, I tried introducing that to my seasoned board gamer group, and I had to wrestle with the rule books before putting the whole thing away, defeated.
I'd probably try Waterdeep as a worker placement intro.
EDIT: Has anyone played Adrenaline at five players?
Uhmm Kickstarter rerelease is April 17th.
Perhaps I can interest you in my meager selection of pins?
i still got my eye on you
And of course the traveling preview to actually play it will be in my area when I'm out of town later this month.
Not even a so you have the old board but lost all the pieces kit pledge level bah...
I have the bridges in my old bin of Legos for whatever reason. But my mom pitched that game eons ago.
Selling Board Games for Medical Bills
Nintendo ID: Pastalonius
Smite\LoL:Gremlidin \ WoW & Overwatch & Hots: Gremlidin#1734
3ds: 3282-2248-0453
Steam: Elvenshae // PSN: Elvenshae // WotC: Elvenshae
Wilds of Aladrion: [https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/comment/43159014/#Comment_43159014]Ellandryn[/url]
Yes
More dollars than sense. I'm a sucker for gimmicks.
Is there a standard length of combat you're shooting for per encounter? Like, if the fight is supposed to be super easy, are you aiming for it to be 1-2 rounds per person?
Conversely, as players, is there a point where combat just feels tedious? Obviously some people enjoy RP way more than fighting, but in a combat focused game, would you prefer a series of rapid encounters that you can blow through, or fewer, more dangerous and dicier encounters with rejuv/regen breaks in between (both for the characters and the people playing)?
Edit: Please @ me in replies so I can have a quick reference to posts! Thanks!
Double Edit:
Combat would be thinned out RPG style - You have 3-4 abilities to choose from, and an energy pool. Depending on the area size, there would be Close, Mid and Far as ranges, with mobs drawn from a deck and put into ranges on the draw. Players could pick their location at the start of combat (minus some events shuffling them). Certain abilities and attacks for both players and mobs would have range restrictions.
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
Steam ID
Twitch Page
Updated my post with a more detailed description. Let me know if you have other questions!
They redid all the mechanics to make it an actually fun game, is my understanding. I haven't looked at the Kickstarter yet so I'm not sure exactly what all that entails.
If games are about interesting choices, how interesting are the choices during combat? How interesting are the choices outside of combat (like whether or not to get into the next fight)?
Also, how many player and how fast are their turns? 1-2 rounds of six players in Mage Knight is incredibly long, 1-2 rounds of two players in Uno is pretty quick.
I'd would say that if you have to use the same move more than 3x in an encounter it will feel tedious. If my turn consists of, "I'm doing this, again." Then combat is boring. The choice and strategy have left.
However, if I only ever play 1-2 cards before combat is over, then I won't feel as though there's any challenge or room for failure or long term planning.
If the game is combat focused, I would make sure people constantly have new or various options to choose from, and aim for people to choose 5+ turns. Also make sure turns can be planned, so it can still move quickly. Maybe everyone chooses their action simultaneously kind of deal.
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
Steam ID
Twitch Page
The goal is to do a digital prototype in addition to the physical, so I'll definitely be hitting people up from the forums to try to do some testing towards the end of the period.
To answer @Astaereth and @ArcSyn
I'm definitely open to a wider variety of abilities, I'm just also trying not to overload the players too much. I would say, the goal is for a solid, if slightly lucky run should take around 2 hours, with that ideally having at least 1-2 boss fights.
The basic gameplay loop will be traveling room to room through the dungeon, choosing your own path when branches occur. The rooms will have Events and Loot. When you enter a room, you draw from the event deck (more important rooms get more events) and then the loot deck. The party is trying to recover a number of mystical artifacts that are shuffled into the loot deck. If they get enough from exploring and fighting, they can win just from that. They also have a chance to find the main bosses reliquary to defeat him "permanently". The main boss will always be available to slay at the end of the dungeon with enough mystical artifacts to "win". For every room explored, enemy defeated and artifact recovered, the party will get points added to their overall score.
For RP aspects, I am experimenting with the idea of each person having a hidden goal they want to accomplish as well on the run. Nothing "betrayal" styled, but little side missions they get bonus points to their scores if they can accomplish them during the run. Say one person is a "Survivor" and must never get knocked out in combat. Another might be a pillager and wants to get at least X wealth in treasure from the run.
For the actual combat, I'm hoping that a lot of the fighting will be a mix of dealing damage and puzzle solving via displacement. Enemies will attack off of dice rolls, after the players have all gone (events may flip initiative). Players get to determine their order each round. So it will be less "oh I'm fireballing again" and more "Okay, if I do my fireball THIRD this time, you guys can clump them all up first...". Or at least, that's the hope.
Crypt is a minimalist card and dice game with set collection and push you rluck mechanics in the style of mint works. It looks great and is only 9 dollars.
Unbroken is a solo dungeon crawl. I might still back out because I don't play solo a lot these days.
The guys who designed Crypt are super nice. I used to see them at a big board game Meetup in the Chicago burbs, where they did a lot of play-testing of different designs. I haven't been able to go in a couple of years though; I'd bet they're still there most weeks.
Their other games are both light fun - Road to Infamy and Cosmocracy/Galactic Debate.
It feels too simple. I'm not sure there's enough game there.
Sailor Moon
Perhaps I can interest you in my meager selection of pins?
Also thigh-high stockings.