It’s when you smack the pinball machine too much and it won’t let you smack the flippers anymore.
ive never actually tilted a pinball machine in real life, but i haven't tried very hard.
... .... no Seraph don't go on about -- SO HOW MUCH YOU CAN TILT A MACHINE AND WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU TILT OFTEN VARIES BY MANUFACTURER AND SOMETIMES EVEN BY MACHINE (BASED ON AGE, MAINTENANCE, ETC), SOME MACHINES ARE MORE FORGIVING THAN OTHERS AND THE REALLY HARDCORE PLAYERS KNOW WHICH ONES AND THEIR PRECISE TILT POINTS; SOME MACHINES JUST STOP THE GAME UNTIL YOU STOP FUCKING AROUND BUT OTHERS WILL ACTUALLY SHUT DOWN COMPLETELY AND YOU'LL LOSE YOUR SCORE
Wait a sec...
Is that were tilting comes from?
Moreso, IS IT CALLED TILTING BECAUSE YOU LITERALLY TILT THE MACHINE???
It’s when you smack the pinball machine too much and it won’t let you smack the flippers anymore.
ive never actually tilted a pinball machine in real life, but i haven't tried very hard.
... .... no Seraph don't go on about -- SO HOW MUCH YOU CAN TILT A MACHINE AND WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU TILT OFTEN VARIES BY MANUFACTURER AND SOMETIMES EVEN BY MACHINE (BASED ON AGE, MAINTENANCE, ETC), SOME MACHINES ARE MORE FORGIVING THAN OTHERS AND THE REALLY HARDCORE PLAYERS KNOW WHICH ONES AND THEIR PRECISE TILT POINTS; SOME MACHINES JUST STOP THE GAME UNTIL YOU STOP FUCKING AROUND BUT OTHERS WILL ACTUALLY SHUT DOWN COMPLETELY AND YOU'LL LOSE YOUR SCORE
Wait a sec...
Is that were tilting comes from?
Moreso, IS IT CALLED TILTING BECAUSE YOU LITERALLY TILT THE MACHINE???
Ohh Phoenix down
Ohhh Ash Ketchum
Bnet: CavilatRest#1874
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The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
Does anyone remember the reasoning they had for getting rid of the attack speed on ETC's trait?
Does anyone remember the reasoning they had for getting rid of the attack speed on ETC's trait?
Would need to check with heroespatchnotes.com but I think the change coincided with his hp nerfs, both of which came due to his strength as a main tank over others. With Powerslide (lol AoE Storm bolt), Face Melt and Mosh (land it and you win the tf), his trait just gave him too much utility.
Bnet: CavilatRest#1874
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Inquisitor772 x Penny Arcade Fight Club ChampionA fixed point in space and timeRegistered Userregular
Ooohhhhh Damp-hair...
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The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
Does anyone remember the reasoning they had for getting rid of the attack speed on ETC's trait?
Would need to check with heroespatchnotes.com but I think the change coincided with his hp nerfs, both of which came due to his strength as a main tank over others. With Powerslide (lol AoE Storm bolt), Face Melt and Mosh (land it and you win the tf), his trait just gave him too much utility.
Yeah, I honestly wish they'd bring that back. I don't remember the exact reasoning behind it's removal, but it was from that period there he was just too strong across the board.
I think they are pushing away from specialization that way, with the previous talent, you'd have situations where your team has AA heroes, take etc. Have mages, don't.
This doesn't really hold up since mages combo well off mosh pit, but it seems consistent with their current direction that they wouldn't bring it back
PSN SeGaTai
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Inquisitor772 x Penny Arcade Fight Club ChampionA fixed point in space and timeRegistered Userregular
When a duo queue, both with a sub-50% win rate, insta-pick Valla and Jaina in the second rotation and then complain that it "shows why you never first pick Genji" when we inevitably lose the game.
i like QM cause i can literally play whoever i want without worrying about whether or not it gets banned, picked away from me, or otherwise not fitting into/against a given comp
(or being forced into a role i didn't want to play)
and yeah it's a roll of the dice, a lot, but it also can come down to outskilling the enemy team rather than "welp you lost cause compfucked". which does happen, sure, but not nearly as often.
i just like being able to play who i wanna play without hassle or fuss
I like qm because it's not 10 minutes of bs before I'm even playing the game. After waiting in q already!
I think this game has become incredibly draft dependent, and while the number of heroes may not warrant a fourth ban, the importance of the draft and the overspecialization of heroes may force the issue.
Braxis is a great example of this. If you don't ban Yrel then you forfeit the solo lane. If you don't ban Chromie then you forfeit the 4-person lane. If you don't ban Genji then you screw your solo laner and not only give up the boss in a number of normally-winnable scenarios but make the mere act of fighting around the boss a near-certain loss. If you don't ban Fenix then you might as well never win the objective because he solo clears it. It's frustrating when you run into people who don't understand how to ban the map and the other team just snap-picks accordingly, because you spend the entire game losing to what amount to draft errors. You might as well not play the game at that point because it just feels inevitable.
Also, I'm sick of Yrel. She needs to get nerfed.
The funny thing is I can remember guys like Dunktrain talking about this issue like a year at least and maybe even 2 years ago. That their push towards niche heroes was pushing more and more of the skill of the game into the draft and away from the actual game itself. From an esports perspective it makes the games less interesting. From a player perspective it makes the game harder to learn and more frustrating to play. And from the HOTS perspective where like 50% of the playerbase is in QM, it's even worse on that front.
and then ducks and i had the final destination game that always happens when you somehow, someway win a game you shouldn't win.
we had valla alex dehaka, and our last picks were showing artanis illidan. ducks asks for a tank, artanis asks him "aren't you going to play durable dehaka" and we are both wtf, illidan swaps to alarak at the last second, i contemplate dodging for about another 20, but give in to the darkness and accept my L.
and then somehow, despite all odds, we won again.
our dps tried so hard not to let it happen and ducks didn't go durable dehaka which was a pretty big throw, but we did it.
i basically instantly closed hots after that, no regerts. never tempt fate three times.
Yeah, in all seriousness, though; we get paired up with Unstoppable all the time and I absolutely loathe him because this is what he does every single time. As soon as he perceives that a game is going poorly, he immediately begins to feed on cooldown. I've never heard him speak a word because he's literally always silenced. When the match started, we checked his match history to see if he was in a good mood or not, and he had lost his last 8 games in a row, so you can bet he's tilted as fuck and he's going to throw as soon as shit goes badly for him. And yeah, sure enough, he's died 4 times in the first 3 minutes, and after that, he's just spawning, walking into the enemy team, and trying to score as much damage as he can before he goes down. Over and over and over again. I can't speak for everyone else, but my 3 deaths were literally all from just trying to save him. Then I realized it wasn't worth the effort, and just let him feed; the four of us were better off without him.
Of course, it helps when you've got a GM Tracer main like Mochrie on your team with Hawkray playing his pocket Tassadar.
Yeah the overspecialization of heroes has been an ongoing issue, but I think it's coming to a head with more hero reworks and releases.
I think the opposite has a bit of an effect as well though.
Like look at the history of, yknow, Ranged AA Heroes. Especially now with Jimmy, I look at say, Zul'jin, and go "well why play ZJ when you can just play Jimmy".
(overlooking the fact that Jimjams gets banned 90% of the time)
That's sort of been an ongoing issue with Ranged AA Heroes though. A new one comes out and completely outclasses the rest due to sheer numbers, but also because they all basically have the same kind of kit and tools; strong ranged AAs and a bit of Ability damage. Or the opposite, a Hero hasn't been touched in forever that they completely fall off the wagon. Look at Valla, she's pretty unpopular right now, even if that wasn't always the case.
And that happens because their designs have been and continue to be the exact same. It's why they pushed Tychus into being niche, because they wanted to try and carve out a specific role for him. Do I agree with that change? Ehh, not necessarily, but. That's their reasoning, at any rate.
Aaaanyway, I'm not arguing for making niche Heroes or anything, just pointing out that the opposite also holds true in that this is what happens when you have too many Heroes that are all of the same design.
Yeah the overspecialization of heroes has been an ongoing issue, but I think it's coming to a head with more hero reworks and releases.
I think the opposite has a bit of an effect as well though.
Like look at the history of, yknow, Ranged AA Heroes. Especially now with Jimmy, I look at say, Zul'jin, and go "well why play ZJ when you can just play Jimmy".
(overlooking the fact that Jimjams gets banned 90% of the time)
That's sort of been an ongoing issue with Ranged AA Heroes though. A new one comes out and completely outclasses the rest due to sheer numbers, but also because they all basically have the same kind of kit and tools; strong ranged AAs and a bit of Ability damage. Or the opposite, a Hero hasn't been touched in forever that they completely fall off the wagon. Look at Valla, she's pretty unpopular right now, even if that wasn't always the case.
And that happens because their designs have been and continue to be the exact same. It's why they pushed Tychus into being niche, because they wanted to try and carve out a specific role for him. Do I agree with that change? Ehh, not necessarily, but. That's their reasoning, at any rate.
Aaaanyway, I'm not arguing for making niche Heroes or anything, just pointing out that the opposite also holds true in that this is what happens when you have too many Heroes that are all of the same design.
Yea that was kinda the problem when they first made Hanzo - hey we want an AA hero but make him have a longer range and maybe a little squishier - O whoops he outclasses every assassin.
Cassia and Tychus are both in a really good spot now where they can perform well, have a niche they are designed to counter, but still seem to do decent in a general team comp.
they've kinda struggled to find things for ranged AA characters to do beyond "stand in the back and click on people and try not to die"
other mobas are a bit better at creating diversity within the role, "this one's a lane bully" "this one's for splitpush teams" "this one's for big aoe wombo combo games"
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
It’s when you smack the pinball machine too much and it won’t let you smack the flippers anymore.
ive never actually tilted a pinball machine in real life, but i haven't tried very hard.
... .... no Seraph don't go on about -- SO HOW MUCH YOU CAN TILT A MACHINE AND WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU TILT OFTEN VARIES BY MANUFACTURER AND SOMETIMES EVEN BY MACHINE (BASED ON AGE, MAINTENANCE, ETC), SOME MACHINES ARE MORE FORGIVING THAN OTHERS AND THE REALLY HARDCORE PLAYERS KNOW WHICH ONES AND THEIR PRECISE TILT POINTS; SOME MACHINES JUST STOP THE GAME UNTIL YOU STOP FUCKING AROUND BUT OTHERS WILL ACTUALLY SHUT DOWN COMPLETELY AND YOU'LL LOSE YOUR SCORE
Wait a sec...
Is that were tilting comes from?
Moreso, IS IT CALLED TILTING BECAUSE YOU LITERALLY TILT THE MACHINE???
Yes.
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Here's the youtube upload of the PA Pallytime DAMAGE LUCIO!!!! game ya'll played. I haven't laughed this much in a while.
My wife and I watched this last night and just laughed and smiled together. She doesn't even play HotS but she likes watching his videos as he's obviously having fun. Like I know he gets some flack for playing poorly at times but dammit if the dude doesn't know how to have fun.
Yeah the overspecialization of heroes has been an ongoing issue, but I think it's coming to a head with more hero reworks and releases.
I think the opposite has a bit of an effect as well though.
Like look at the history of, yknow, Ranged AA Heroes. Especially now with Jimmy, I look at say, Zul'jin, and go "well why play ZJ when you can just play Jimmy".
(overlooking the fact that Jimjams gets banned 90% of the time)
That's sort of been an ongoing issue with Ranged AA Heroes though. A new one comes out and completely outclasses the rest due to sheer numbers, but also because they all basically have the same kind of kit and tools; strong ranged AAs and a bit of Ability damage. Or the opposite, a Hero hasn't been touched in forever that they completely fall off the wagon. Look at Valla, she's pretty unpopular right now, even if that wasn't always the case.
And that happens because their designs have been and continue to be the exact same. It's why they pushed Tychus into being niche, because they wanted to try and carve out a specific role for him. Do I agree with that change? Ehh, not necessarily, but. That's their reasoning, at any rate.
Aaaanyway, I'm not arguing for making niche Heroes or anything, just pointing out that the opposite also holds true in that this is what happens when you have too many Heroes that are all of the same design.
It doesn't hold true the same way though and it doesn't create issues with overdependence on the draft. Plus that's mostly an issue of being bad at balancing.
Yeah the overspecialization of heroes has been an ongoing issue, but I think it's coming to a head with more hero reworks and releases.
I think the opposite has a bit of an effect as well though.
Like look at the history of, yknow, Ranged AA Heroes. Especially now with Jimmy, I look at say, Zul'jin, and go "well why play ZJ when you can just play Jimmy".
(overlooking the fact that Jimjams gets banned 90% of the time)
That's sort of been an ongoing issue with Ranged AA Heroes though. A new one comes out and completely outclasses the rest due to sheer numbers, but also because they all basically have the same kind of kit and tools; strong ranged AAs and a bit of Ability damage. Or the opposite, a Hero hasn't been touched in forever that they completely fall off the wagon. Look at Valla, she's pretty unpopular right now, even if that wasn't always the case.
And that happens because their designs have been and continue to be the exact same. It's why they pushed Tychus into being niche, because they wanted to try and carve out a specific role for him. Do I agree with that change? Ehh, not necessarily, but. That's their reasoning, at any rate.
Aaaanyway, I'm not arguing for making niche Heroes or anything, just pointing out that the opposite also holds true in that this is what happens when you have too many Heroes that are all of the same design.
It doesn't hold true the same way though and it doesn't create issues with overdependence on the draft. Plus that's mostly an issue of being bad at balancing.
No, yeah, I wasn't saying it held true the same way and that it created issues with overdependence on the draft.
I was simply remarking that the extreme opposite of overspecialization (overgeneralization) also comes with its own independent issues and problems separate from all that, but problems nonetheless.
Yeah the overspecialization of heroes has been an ongoing issue, but I think it's coming to a head with more hero reworks and releases.
I think the opposite has a bit of an effect as well though.
Like look at the history of, yknow, Ranged AA Heroes. Especially now with Jimmy, I look at say, Zul'jin, and go "well why play ZJ when you can just play Jimmy".
(overlooking the fact that Jimjams gets banned 90% of the time)
That's sort of been an ongoing issue with Ranged AA Heroes though. A new one comes out and completely outclasses the rest due to sheer numbers, but also because they all basically have the same kind of kit and tools; strong ranged AAs and a bit of Ability damage. Or the opposite, a Hero hasn't been touched in forever that they completely fall off the wagon. Look at Valla, she's pretty unpopular right now, even if that wasn't always the case.
And that happens because their designs have been and continue to be the exact same. It's why they pushed Tychus into being niche, because they wanted to try and carve out a specific role for him. Do I agree with that change? Ehh, not necessarily, but. That's their reasoning, at any rate.
Aaaanyway, I'm not arguing for making niche Heroes or anything, just pointing out that the opposite also holds true in that this is what happens when you have too many Heroes that are all of the same design.
It doesn't hold true the same way though and it doesn't create issues with overdependence on the draft. Plus that's mostly an issue of being bad at balancing.
No, yeah, I wasn't saying it held true the same way and that it created issues with overdependence on the draft.
I was simply remarking that the extreme opposite of overspecialization (overgeneralization) also comes with its own independent issues and problems separate from all that, but problems nonetheless.
Not directly related, but still somewhat related.
The big thing for me is that the issues of more generalized heroes is just a practical one. Getting multiple characters that do roughly the same thing different ways to all be balanced is not easy. The issues of specialization are inbuilt and can't really be worked around. I think that's really the key distinction between the two.
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Ohh Phoenix down
Ohhh Ash Ketchum
Steam: CavilatRest
Would need to check with heroespatchnotes.com but I think the change coincided with his hp nerfs, both of which came due to his strength as a main tank over others. With Powerslide (lol AoE Storm bolt), Face Melt and Mosh (land it and you win the tf), his trait just gave him too much utility.
Steam: CavilatRest
yeah but it was fun :c
This doesn't really hold up since mages combo well off mosh pit, but it seems consistent with their current direction that they wouldn't bring it back
I like qm because it's not 10 minutes of bs before I'm even playing the game. After waiting in q already!
Goes CS.
Cool. We lose.
For you.
The funny thing is I can remember guys like Dunktrain talking about this issue like a year at least and maybe even 2 years ago. That their push towards niche heroes was pushing more and more of the skill of the game into the draft and away from the actual game itself. From an esports perspective it makes the games less interesting. From a player perspective it makes the game harder to learn and more frustrating to play. And from the HOTS perspective where like 50% of the playerbase is in QM, it's even worse on that front.
It's the boring part and it takes up like 1/3rd of my playtime.
I appreciate the skills involved but it's not what I want to be doing when I load the game up.
COME FORTH, AMATERASU! - Switch Friend Code SW-5465-2458-5696 - Twitch
ah well just another game with a feed
wait what
we had valla alex dehaka, and our last picks were showing artanis illidan. ducks asks for a tank, artanis asks him "aren't you going to play durable dehaka" and we are both wtf, illidan swaps to alarak at the last second, i contemplate dodging for about another 20, but give in to the darkness and accept my L.
and then somehow, despite all odds, we won again.
our dps tried so hard not to let it happen and ducks didn't go durable dehaka which was a pretty big throw, but we did it.
i basically instantly closed hots after that, no regerts. never tempt fate three times.
His name is "UNSTOPPABLE". Even 17 deaths cannot stop him from victory. He obviously lives up to his name.
Steam ID
AHHHH FRESH AVATAR
1300, woot.
Of course, it helps when you've got a GM Tracer main like Mochrie on your team with Hawkray playing his pocket Tassadar.
Not confused Varian/10.
I think the opposite has a bit of an effect as well though.
Like look at the history of, yknow, Ranged AA Heroes. Especially now with Jimmy, I look at say, Zul'jin, and go "well why play ZJ when you can just play Jimmy".
(overlooking the fact that Jimjams gets banned 90% of the time)
That's sort of been an ongoing issue with Ranged AA Heroes though. A new one comes out and completely outclasses the rest due to sheer numbers, but also because they all basically have the same kind of kit and tools; strong ranged AAs and a bit of Ability damage. Or the opposite, a Hero hasn't been touched in forever that they completely fall off the wagon. Look at Valla, she's pretty unpopular right now, even if that wasn't always the case.
And that happens because their designs have been and continue to be the exact same. It's why they pushed Tychus into being niche, because they wanted to try and carve out a specific role for him. Do I agree with that change? Ehh, not necessarily, but. That's their reasoning, at any rate.
Aaaanyway, I'm not arguing for making niche Heroes or anything, just pointing out that the opposite also holds true in that this is what happens when you have too many Heroes that are all of the same design.
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
I just get Garrosh whenever I want. Seriously ya'll, this has to be my super power, right?
Edit: Next game....
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
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(loud warning during some parts
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
Yea that was kinda the problem when they first made Hanzo - hey we want an AA hero but make him have a longer range and maybe a little squishier - O whoops he outclasses every assassin.
Cassia and Tychus are both in a really good spot now where they can perform well, have a niche they are designed to counter, but still seem to do decent in a general team comp.
Here's the youtube upload of the PA Pallytime DAMAGE LUCIO!!!! game ya'll played. I haven't laughed this much in a while.
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
Steam ID
Twitch Page
other mobas are a bit better at creating diversity within the role, "this one's a lane bully" "this one's for splitpush teams" "this one's for big aoe wombo combo games"
Yes.
My wife and I watched this last night and just laughed and smiled together. She doesn't even play HotS but she likes watching his videos as he's obviously having fun. Like I know he gets some flack for playing poorly at times but dammit if the dude doesn't know how to have fun.
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
Steam ID
Twitch Page
It doesn't hold true the same way though and it doesn't create issues with overdependence on the draft. Plus that's mostly an issue of being bad at balancing.
No, yeah, I wasn't saying it held true the same way and that it created issues with overdependence on the draft.
I was simply remarking that the extreme opposite of overspecialization (overgeneralization) also comes with its own independent issues and problems separate from all that, but problems nonetheless.
Not directly related, but still somewhat related.
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
The big thing for me is that the issues of more generalized heroes is just a practical one. Getting multiple characters that do roughly the same thing different ways to all be balanced is not easy. The issues of specialization are inbuilt and can't really be worked around. I think that's really the key distinction between the two.
Wife (after my HL loss): "Wait, you're still Silver 3? Your rank never changes."
Me: *sob*
4-ever Silver
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
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Yrel might be a little too strong. Just a little!
The enemy team just let me get constant 2-3 people E+D+Q hits off, which does stack up the damage a fair bit.
Dps and supports on both sides having a mosh pit on the boss cap point. Tanks of to the side arm wrestling.
Steam - Talon Valdez :Blizz - Talonious#1860 : Xbox Live & LoL - Talonious Monk @TaloniousMonk Hail Satan