Played my second game of KT today, made sure to take it a bit slower and really focus on learning the rules and start paying attention to some of the interactions.
One of the weird thing is how much "winning" the initiative roll-off can really end up biting you in the ass. Situation was that last turn the enemy leader charged my leader, they exchanged blows and neither managed to kill the other one. Start of the next turn my opponent one initiative and opted to stay in close combat. So I just opted to have most of my kill team take the ready action, and then walked my own leader out of close combat, and then shot the fuck out of his leader. In hindsight he probably should have just retreated his leader out of LOS on his turn, but that would have given my leader the chance to charge him again and attack first.
By winning initiative he ended up in quite a disadvantageous position.
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StragintDo Not GiftAlways DeclinesRegistered Userregular
So I like the KT terrain but it is also really annoying. If the nubs for putting terrain on are off it doesn't sit well at all.
Deathwatch kill team
PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
The killteam book generally has names tables for each faction so even if you wanted to make your own you still know what theme they should have to be fluffy
Hmmm, I really like the idea and looks of Tau Breachers, but the shooting rules really seem to make them not good compared to their alternatives. having to be within 2.5" to not get negative modifiers for the close range attack is a bit of a hinderance.
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ExtreaminatusGo forth and amplify,the Noise Marines are here!Registered Userregular
ExtreaminatusGo forth and amplify,the Noise Marines are here!Registered Userregular
I have managed to work in a single Chaos Cultist into my Heretic Astartes kill team. I will name him Sugar Bear and work towards keeping him alive every game as a personal objective.
I'm trying to built a craftworld kill team and not make all the specialists Rangers. Sniper is the obvious one for them, veteran from level 2 on seems tailor made for Rangers, Comms looks great if you go with at least two rangers close together.
Even leader might not be so bad to put on a model that tries to stay away from the enemy anyway and it would also free up the Exarch to be the combat specialist so you have at least one model in the Eldar kill team that can do some close combat.
The other direction I was thinking of was taking an Exarch with the Shimmershield and make him the center of a close assault team with flamer/fusion gun storm gurdians. I just wish Storm Guardian gunners could be demolition specialists.
I'm trying to built a craftworld kill team and not make all the specialists Rangers. Sniper is the obvious one for them, veteran from level 2 on seems tailor made for Rangers, Comms looks great if you go with at least two rangers close together.
Even leader might not be so bad to put on a model that tries to stay away from the enemy anyway and it would also free up the Exarch to be the combat specialist so you have at least one model in the Eldar kill team that can do some close combat.
The other direction I was thinking of was taking an Exarch with the Shimmershield and make him the center of a close assault team with flamer/fusion gun storm gurdians. I just wish Storm Guardian gunners could be demolition specialists.
I'd be wary of over investing into rangers myself. They seem good, and I can definitely see 1 or 2 being a good asset to an Eldar Kill Team. But, to be honest the profile on the rifle isn't that amazing for KT.
They are heavy weapons, which means you'll be taking -1 to hit if you move and shoot. Let's assume your opponent is being smart and not just leaving things out in the open, so you are either looking at a -1 to hit to avoid obscurement or a -1 to hit from that. Let's assume you are fighting space marines, as they will be the most common foe. 4 strength vs 4 toughness. And then no AP vs Saving throw of 3+ Then injury roll.
So you have one shot that is looking at a 50% chance to hit, a 50% chance to wound, a 33% chance to get through armor, and then either a 50% chance or a 33% chance to take the enemy out of action (depending on obscurement). It's not fantastic odds. I feel like in KT you really want guns that can put out multiple shots to help guarantee a hit, or guns that do high damage to give you multiple injury rolls.
Even with my AdMech I've been iffy on my sniper specialist. And they are rocking a strength 7, AP -2, D3 damage sniper rifle (that can ignore long range and obscurement via wargear). One shot guns are really feast or famine in KT, and if you get a flesh wound on you it gets even tougher.
On the other hand, an Exarch running around with 2 avenger shuriken catapults sounds like death on wheels to me.
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Gabriel_Pitt(effective against Russian warships)Registered Userregular
I'm trying to built a craftworld kill team and not make all the specialists Rangers. Sniper is the obvious one for them, veteran from level 2 on seems tailor made for Rangers, Comms looks great if you go with at least two rangers close together.
Even leader might not be so bad to put on a model that tries to stay away from the enemy anyway and it would also free up the Exarch to be the combat specialist so you have at least one model in the Eldar kill team that can do some close combat.
The other direction I was thinking of was taking an Exarch with the Shimmershield and make him the center of a close assault team with flamer/fusion gun storm gurdians. I just wish Storm Guardian gunners could be demolition specialists.
I'd be wary of over investing into rangers myself. They seem good, and I can definitely see 1 or 2 being a good asset to an Eldar Kill Team. But, to be honest the profile on the rifle isn't that amazing for KT.
They are heavy weapons, which means you'll be taking -1 to hit if you move and shoot. Let's assume your opponent is being smart and not just leaving things out in the open, so you are either looking at a -1 to hit to avoid obscurement or a -1 to hit from that. Let's assume you are fighting space marines, as they will be the most common foe. 4 strength vs 4 toughness. And then no AP vs Saving throw of 3+ Then injury roll.
So you have one shot that is looking at a 50% chance to hit, a 50% chance to wound, a 33% chance to get through armor, and then either a 50% chance or a 33% chance to take the enemy out of action (depending on obscurement). It's not fantastic odds. I feel like in KT you really want guns that can put out multiple shots to help guarantee a hit, or guns that do high damage to give you multiple injury rolls.
Even with my AdMech I've been iffy on my sniper specialist. And they are rocking a strength 7, AP -2, D3 damage sniper rifle (that can ignore long range and obscurement via wargear). One shot guns are really feast or famine in KT, and if you get a flesh wound on you it gets even tougher.
On the other hand, an Exarch running around with 2 avenger shuriken catapults sounds like death on wheels to me.
The key with snipers having one or two is good. It gives you hard to hit long range support. And the last part is the mortal wound. Even with all that if you get a 6 on your wound roll you get a mortal wound and mortal wounds in KT are rare and amazing. Unlike normal 40k where a single mortal wound is okay in kill team it can take out ~20% of a deathwatch or grey knights kill team in one shot.(If you build them with upgrades)
While the exarch witch twin catapults seems nice, I think you really need some cc and storm guardians seem lackluster in that regard. This gets worse when I look at the models I might for them back when chainswords didn't have their own rules, so mine are all modelled with aeldari blades. They cost as much as as an Ork with choppa!
I'm trying to built a craftworld kill team and not make all the specialists Rangers. Sniper is the obvious one for them, veteran from level 2 on seems tailor made for Rangers, Comms looks great if you go with at least two rangers close together.
Even leader might not be so bad to put on a model that tries to stay away from the enemy anyway and it would also free up the Exarch to be the combat specialist so you have at least one model in the Eldar kill team that can do some close combat.
The other direction I was thinking of was taking an Exarch with the Shimmershield and make him the center of a close assault team with flamer/fusion gun storm gurdians. I just wish Storm Guardian gunners could be demolition specialists.
I'd be wary of over investing into rangers myself. They seem good, and I can definitely see 1 or 2 being a good asset to an Eldar Kill Team. But, to be honest the profile on the rifle isn't that amazing for KT.
They are heavy weapons, which means you'll be taking -1 to hit if you move and shoot. Let's assume your opponent is being smart and not just leaving things out in the open, so you are either looking at a -1 to hit to avoid obscurement or a -1 to hit from that. Let's assume you are fighting space marines, as they will be the most common foe. 4 strength vs 4 toughness. And then no AP vs Saving throw of 3+ Then injury roll.
So you have one shot that is looking at a 50% chance to hit, a 50% chance to wound, a 33% chance to get through armor, and then either a 50% chance or a 33% chance to take the enemy out of action (depending on obscurement). It's not fantastic odds. I feel like in KT you really want guns that can put out multiple shots to help guarantee a hit, or guns that do high damage to give you multiple injury rolls.
Even with my AdMech I've been iffy on my sniper specialist. And they are rocking a strength 7, AP -2, D3 damage sniper rifle (that can ignore long range and obscurement via wargear). One shot guns are really feast or famine in KT, and if you get a flesh wound on you it gets even tougher.
On the other hand, an Exarch running around with 2 avenger shuriken catapults sounds like death on wheels to me.
The key with snipers having one or two is good. It gives you hard to hit long range support. And the last part is the mortal wound. Even with all that if you get a 6 on your wound roll you get a mortal wound and mortal wounds in KT are rare and amazing. Unlike normal 40k where a single mortal wound is okay in kill team it can take out ~20% of a deathwatch or grey knights kill team in one shot.(If you build them with upgrades)
Mortal wounds are indeed good, sniper rifles just aren't a super reliable source of them. And keep in mind a mortal wound is just one roll on the injury table, as opposed to say, 3 rolls for a high damage weapon. They are certainly good though. And reliable sources of them (pretty much just psychic powers right now) are very scary.
My guess is the number of snipers you'll want will be directly equal to the number of tall buildings with long sight lines you have on your map, so as you said, 1 or 2 on a map with a good amount of terrain.
I don't have the book because I was waiting on pay day but my general sense for my KT for my deathwatch is:
1x Stalker patter bolter+chainsword bro which is my sniper
1x Intercessor for the commander, those two wounds
1x Sgt for close combat
2x heavies or at least one heavy one breacher (shield+bolter)
I mean it is variable based on point cost though. But the stalker brings a good double tap at long range for a sniper. Intercessors are similar but half the shots.
I'm feeling like the KT builds are hugely dependent on terrain density on your board. We've been playing with extremely dense terrain that makes snipers significantly less useful.
Got to play my first real full game of KT last night.
My Crimson Fists vs. Genestealer horde.
Had a great time. Failure Cascade was definitely a thing for the genestealers once a couple were down and the Reivers were in their ugly xenos grills.
Kill Team- Kantor’s Hounds- 100pts
Oath of Moment- Hit and Run
Heroic Origin- Oath Sworn- Recover a lost Crimson Fist artifact
Codex Emphasis- Strategists
Intercessor Sergeant Davius- Leader Specialist, Power Sword, Bolt Rifle, Bolt Pistol, and Frag and Krak Grenades (18pts)(Noble)
Intercessor Gunner Lucas- Comms Specialist, Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Bolt Rifle, Bolt Pistol, and Frag and Krak Grenades (16pts) (Charismatic)
Intercessor Marcus- Sniper Specialist, Stalker Bolt Rifle, Bolt Pistol, and Frag and Krak Grenades (15pts)(Mysterious)
Reiver Felix- Combat Specialist, Heavy Bolt Pistol, Combat Knife, Grapnel Launcher, and Frag, Krak, and Shock Grenades (17pts)(Ferocious)
Reiver Vega- Heavy Bolt Pistol, Combat Knife, Grapnel Launcher, and Frag, Krak, and Shock Grenades (17pts)
Reiver Alejandro- Heavy Bolt Pistol, Combat Knife, Grapnel Launcher, and Frag, Krak, and Shock Grenades (17pts)
(Reiver Felix is named after Felix from John Steakley’s novel Armor. He was also a damned blender in melee.)
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Dr_KeenbeanDumb as a buttPlanet Express ShipRegistered Userregular
I'm feeling like the KT builds are hugely dependent on terrain density on your board. We've been playing with extremely dense terrain that makes snipers significantly less useful.
I like that kill team list building happens from a pool of units at the table after the mission is chosen and you know what faction your opponent is running.
It's like how Infinity works or is supposed to. I think most people are stuck in the mindset of trying to make a take all comers list and that's just not necessary.
StragintDo Not GiftAlways DeclinesRegistered Userregular
The terrain with a second floor continues to be massively frustrating. I can see why my LGS uses almost exclusively custom terrain, this GW terrain is not fun to deal with.
PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
In my experience it was a bit of a pain in the butt to build, especially the larger cathedral. Just tricky to get everything to line up well due to the modular nature.
In Kill Team, the reason a model can't fire a pistol when it is charged is a pistol specific rule right?
Namely, the Tyranid Flesh Hooks which are not-pistols (can shoot in melee but are assault weapons) can be used if charged.
Did I miss anything?
Seems to check out to me.
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Dr_KeenbeanDumb as a buttPlanet Express ShipRegistered Userregular
I think the new terrain is an absolute joy. Lightyears ahead of the previous city terrain. It's even better than the sector mechanicus stuff and that was pretty great.
Are you not cleaning off the sprue connectors or filing down the mold lines at connection points? I can see how that might cause them to sit awkwardly.
StragintDo Not GiftAlways DeclinesRegistered Userregular
edited August 2018
I'm cleaning off the remaining sprue bit and filing the mold lines.
I have one floor tilting slightly down, one where the floor sections wont stay glued together and keep shifting, and the little nubs for stacking the terrain don't connect properly for some of them.
Edit: Also, my brother's super shitty attitude to anything not going perfectly his way has really soured my first KT experience. 100% not going to be playing with him at all anymore.
Edit2: Rules are kind of confusing concerning injury roles, shaken, and broken. It seems like it is very hard for Necrons to fail anything and their reanimation protocols feel almost nonexistent.
I also swear I saw a rule about the injury roll having a -1 modifier I'd they are within 1 inch of an obscuring piece of terrain but I can't find it.
Stragint on
PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
Special Weapons Gunner
Gue'vesa Dushenko (Flamer)
Gue'vesa Grytt (Flamer)
Guardsman and Guardsman Gunner
Gue'la Altarem (Grenade)
Gue'la Hekler (Vox)
Human soldiers that have defected over to the Tau in service of the greater good. Everyone who joins starts off as a Gue'la, they get some Tau armor and a nice slap on the back for encouragement. If you stick with it, you'll get promoted. Hekler is on the fast track to promotion by carrying the vox to ensure the group never misses their three times a day messages about the glory of the greater good. Install some tau comms equipment in your helmet and you get to become a Gue'vesa proper, no shiny toys yet though. Ready to take the next step? You need to get some minor invasive head surgery in order to communicate better with the Tau, but hey, look at this nifty helmet you'll never want to take off. Congratulations, here is your new, cutting edge, experimental Tau plasma. We are trusting you with some guns that REALLY push the envelope here. Yeah, sometimes they overheat and kill you but... you want to advance the greater good don't you? Besides, Atsumo has some cutting edge Tau medicine (with completely unknown long term side effects) to patch you back up.
Personal rule I'm considering for myself: Yes, I am bringing a fuck ton of plasma. Yes, I think this list is going to be pretty mean. So, I am thinking I am going to track on each unit. Did they fire their plasma last turn? Well if they fire it again this turn they have to overcharge it. Experimental weapons are so temperamental!
I also swear I saw a rule about the injury roll having a -1 modifier I'd they are within 1 inch of an obscuring piece of terrain but I can't find it.
I believe it's stated in the shooting phase section. It also only applies to ranged attacks (and not melee). But a model in the way also counts!
It also applies to psychic attacks.
Yup, it was part of the shooting phase section under the injury portion. I knew I saw it before. I did that with shaken as well. It was a very dumb moment of mine.
One of the many questions I have for this right now is about the flail of corruption. My brother runs a DG army and he was using it. It says roll a D3 hit rolls each time the model attacks. Does that mean if the model has 3 attacks it rolls D3 for how many actual swings it does?
Another question. For multi wound weapons, if a weapon does D3 damage and wounds a model, do I roll 1 save or D3 saves depending on what they roll? I don't know why this is escaping me right now but I feel like I keep switching it around and I want to be sure.
PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
I also swear I saw a rule about the injury roll having a -1 modifier I'd they are within 1 inch of an obscuring piece of terrain but I can't find it.
I believe it's stated in the shooting phase section. It also only applies to ranged attacks (and not melee). But a model in the way also counts!
It also applies to psychic attacks.
Yup, it was part of the shooting phase section under the injury portion. I knew I saw it before. I did that with shaken as well. It was a very dumb moment of mine.
One of the many questions I have for this right now is about the flail of corruption. My brother runs a DG army and he was using it. It says roll a D3 hit rolls each time the model attacks. Does that mean if the model has 3 attacks it rolls D3 for how many actual swings it does?
Another question. For multi wound weapons, if a weapon does D3 damage and wounds a model, do I roll 1 save or D3 saves depending on what they roll? I don't know why this is escaping me right now but I feel like I keep switching it around and I want to be sure.
for the flail, you make a D3 roll for each attack the model can make. so a Combat Specialist Plague Marine with the flail makes 3x D3 (from 3 to 9) attacks instead of the 2+1 attacks on the dataslate.
To make it even nastier, its also a plague weapon so you get to reroll any 1's during the following wound roll.
saving throw is step 3. of the shooting phase. then inflict damage is step 4. (order is the same for melee)
so you don't worry about how much damage a weapon does until after the save has already been failed.
I also swear I saw a rule about the injury roll having a -1 modifier I'd they are within 1 inch of an obscuring piece of terrain but I can't find it.
I believe it's stated in the shooting phase section. It also only applies to ranged attacks (and not melee). But a model in the way also counts!
It also applies to psychic attacks.
Yup, it was part of the shooting phase section under the injury portion. I knew I saw it before. I did that with shaken as well. It was a very dumb moment of mine.
One of the many questions I have for this right now is about the flail of corruption. My brother runs a DG army and he was using it. It says roll a D3 hit rolls each time the model attacks. Does that mean if the model has 3 attacks it rolls D3 for how many actual swings it does?
Another question. For multi wound weapons, if a weapon does D3 damage and wounds a model, do I roll 1 save or D3 saves depending on what they roll? I don't know why this is escaping me right now but I feel like I keep switching it around and I want to be sure.
for the flail, you make a D3 roll for each attack the model can make. so a Combat Specialist Plague Marine with the flail makes 3x D3 (from 3 to 9) attacks instead of the 2+1 attacks on the dataslate.
To make it even nastier, its also a plague weapon so you get to reroll any 1's during the following wound roll.
saving throw is step 3. of the shooting phase. then inflict damage is step 4. (order is the same for melee)
so you don't worry about how much damage a weapon does until after the save has already been failed.
Damn, I'm not happy that I was right about the flails, that weapon is scary.
Alright, that is the way I thought saves and damage work.
Thank you for helping with my questions.
Stragint on
PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
Are hand flamers worth it for GSC in KT? My current draft has 5 metamorphs with hand flamers, and if I instead used autopistols I could squeeze in two neophytes instead (or even a single purestrain).
(Rest of my list are 2 neophyte gunners, 4 neophytes, 1 neophyte leader, 4 metamorphs and 1 metamorph leader. Neophytes for shooting, metas for cc.)
imo, neither is really great but hand flamers are the better option if you have to take one.
the flamer technically has less range which becomes less of a problem once you realise the autopistols have a -1 to hit between 6" and 12"
also autohitting flamers could be handy in overwatch.
that said, I would take the extra bodies over the flamer.
big problem is you can't fire either one if you charged or were charged this round which really limits their potential and makes them a bit of a trap choice.
imo, neither is really great but hand flamers are the better option if you have to take one.
the flamer technically has less range which becomes less of a problem once you realise the autopistols have a -1 to hit between 6" and 12"
also autohitting flamers could be handy in overwatch.
that said, I would take the extra bodies over the flamer.
big problem is you can't fire either one if you charged or were charged this round which really limits their potential and makes them a bit of a trap choice.
You can fire the handflamers in Overwatch and auto hit with them while you are being charged. (Assuming you have range and LOS.)
Yeah, I think it's indisputable that hand flamers are better than autopistols (and you have to take one or the other). The question is if it is worth 2 pts for the hand flamer vs 0 pts for the autopistol.
Especially since skipping all the flamers allows 2 extra neophytes or 1 extra purestrain.
I haven't played Kill Team yet, but it seems interesting because it feels like the importance of list building has really been minimised as much as possible. Upgrades are cheap enough that you can slap them on whoever you want without any major problems, you have your full 20-man roster so you can swap at leisure and don't need to worry about a take-all-comers build, and there aren't that many options to worry about in the first place.
It really makes the system feel like the focus is on the actual tabletop, which is quite refreshing.
Edit2: Rules are kind of confusing concerning injury roles, shaken, and broken. It seems like it is very hard for Necrons to fail anything and their reanimation protocols feel almost nonexistent.
I also swear I saw a rule about the injury roll having a -1 modifier I'd they are within 1 inch of an obscuring piece of terrain but I can't find it.
I've seen a lot of bitching from Necron players that reanimation protocols feel useless to them and they're just getting gunned down. Flayed Ones die before they can get into melee as well. So far, most seem to be reacting to this by going towards heavy Deathmark / Immortal (Gauss) builds with a Warrior helping for points.
XBL: Bizazedo
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
Finally was able to look at the DW KT points. I can fit way more than I thought due to the reduced prices. The breacher boys (storm shield+bolter) are 17 pts each which is nice. So I should be able to build what I was planning I think.
In 40k like normal 40k I feel like my mind was blown. Just remember I am coming from Chaos Marines, we don't have combat squading we are more like angry roving bands of marines that have lots of special weapons.
So with my deathwatch like all loyalist have combat squading. Unlike normal loyalist I can fill a vet squad with vanguard vets, bikers, and termis. So something I read on Frontline Gaming the other day is a 10 man squad. 5 vets with stalker bolters/heavy bolters and the other half 2/3 bikers and 2/3 vanguard vets. Combat squad and you have a 5 man backline sniper squad and a super fast objective secured squad that probably has at least 2-3 storm shields. Which is nice.
And reading combat squad rules it is before deployment which leads me to a question:
1. If you combat squad out 5 termis/vanguard vets do they get their normal deep strike rules? I am thinking not because that is tied to the data card and the normal veteran group does not have them.
2. Combat squading happens before deployment to me reads as if I can spend CPs to put them in the teleportarium after I combat squad them out so I can deep strike troop/objective secured termis/vanguard vets. Seem right to all?
Man I love the DW book though. So many options with how you build them out.
Posts
One of the weird thing is how much "winning" the initiative roll-off can really end up biting you in the ass. Situation was that last turn the enemy leader charged my leader, they exchanged blows and neither managed to kill the other one. Start of the next turn my opponent one initiative and opted to stay in close combat. So I just opted to have most of my kill team take the ready action, and then walked my own leader out of close combat, and then shot the fuck out of his leader. In hindsight he probably should have just retreated his leader out of LOS on his turn, but that would have given my leader the chance to charge him again and attack first.
By winning initiative he ended up in quite a disadvantageous position.
Deathwatch kill team
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
The guy I play against mostly if going to be super confused by the genestealer leader named Dr keenbean
Gamertag - Khraul
PSN - Razide6
All things considered, it's not that ludicrous to name a genestealer after him.
Don't presume to know the will of the Hive Mind.
3DS: 1650-8480-6786
Switch: SW-0653-8208-4705
Even leader might not be so bad to put on a model that tries to stay away from the enemy anyway and it would also free up the Exarch to be the combat specialist so you have at least one model in the Eldar kill team that can do some close combat.
The other direction I was thinking of was taking an Exarch with the Shimmershield and make him the center of a close assault team with flamer/fusion gun storm gurdians. I just wish Storm Guardian gunners could be demolition specialists.
I'd be wary of over investing into rangers myself. They seem good, and I can definitely see 1 or 2 being a good asset to an Eldar Kill Team. But, to be honest the profile on the rifle isn't that amazing for KT.
They are heavy weapons, which means you'll be taking -1 to hit if you move and shoot. Let's assume your opponent is being smart and not just leaving things out in the open, so you are either looking at a -1 to hit to avoid obscurement or a -1 to hit from that. Let's assume you are fighting space marines, as they will be the most common foe. 4 strength vs 4 toughness. And then no AP vs Saving throw of 3+ Then injury roll.
So you have one shot that is looking at a 50% chance to hit, a 50% chance to wound, a 33% chance to get through armor, and then either a 50% chance or a 33% chance to take the enemy out of action (depending on obscurement). It's not fantastic odds. I feel like in KT you really want guns that can put out multiple shots to help guarantee a hit, or guns that do high damage to give you multiple injury rolls.
Even with my AdMech I've been iffy on my sniper specialist. And they are rocking a strength 7, AP -2, D3 damage sniper rifle (that can ignore long range and obscurement via wargear). One shot guns are really feast or famine in KT, and if you get a flesh wound on you it gets even tougher.
On the other hand, an Exarch running around with 2 avenger shuriken catapults sounds like death on wheels to me.
"I'm sensing... Maker's Mark."
The key with snipers having one or two is good. It gives you hard to hit long range support. And the last part is the mortal wound. Even with all that if you get a 6 on your wound roll you get a mortal wound and mortal wounds in KT are rare and amazing. Unlike normal 40k where a single mortal wound is okay in kill team it can take out ~20% of a deathwatch or grey knights kill team in one shot.(If you build them with upgrades)
Mortal wounds are indeed good, sniper rifles just aren't a super reliable source of them. And keep in mind a mortal wound is just one roll on the injury table, as opposed to say, 3 rolls for a high damage weapon. They are certainly good though. And reliable sources of them (pretty much just psychic powers right now) are very scary.
My guess is the number of snipers you'll want will be directly equal to the number of tall buildings with long sight lines you have on your map, so as you said, 1 or 2 on a map with a good amount of terrain.
1x Stalker patter bolter+chainsword bro which is my sniper
1x Intercessor for the commander, those two wounds
1x Sgt for close combat
2x heavies or at least one heavy one breacher (shield+bolter)
I mean it is variable based on point cost though. But the stalker brings a good double tap at long range for a sniper. Intercessors are similar but half the shots.
My Crimson Fists vs. Genestealer horde.
Had a great time. Failure Cascade was definitely a thing for the genestealers once a couple were down and the Reivers were in their ugly xenos grills.
Oath of Moment- Hit and Run
Heroic Origin- Oath Sworn- Recover a lost Crimson Fist artifact
Codex Emphasis- Strategists
Intercessor Sergeant Davius- Leader Specialist, Power Sword, Bolt Rifle, Bolt Pistol, and Frag and Krak Grenades (18pts)(Noble)
Intercessor Gunner Lucas- Comms Specialist, Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Bolt Rifle, Bolt Pistol, and Frag and Krak Grenades (16pts) (Charismatic)
Intercessor Marcus- Sniper Specialist, Stalker Bolt Rifle, Bolt Pistol, and Frag and Krak Grenades (15pts)(Mysterious)
Reiver Felix- Combat Specialist, Heavy Bolt Pistol, Combat Knife, Grapnel Launcher, and Frag, Krak, and Shock Grenades (17pts)(Ferocious)
Reiver Vega- Heavy Bolt Pistol, Combat Knife, Grapnel Launcher, and Frag, Krak, and Shock Grenades (17pts)
Reiver Alejandro- Heavy Bolt Pistol, Combat Knife, Grapnel Launcher, and Frag, Krak, and Shock Grenades (17pts)
(Reiver Felix is named after Felix from John Steakley’s novel Armor. He was also a damned blender in melee.)
I like that kill team list building happens from a pool of units at the table after the mission is chosen and you know what faction your opponent is running.
It's like how Infinity works or is supposed to. I think most people are stuck in the mindset of trying to make a take all comers list and that's just not necessary.
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What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
Bravely Default / 3DS Friend Code = 3394-3571-1609
Namely, the Tyranid Flesh Hooks which are not-pistols (can shoot in melee but are assault weapons) can be used if charged.
Did I miss anything?
Seems to check out to me.
Are you not cleaning off the sprue connectors or filing down the mold lines at connection points? I can see how that might cause them to sit awkwardly.
Stacks up like Lego! (semi painted)
3DS: 1650-8480-6786
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I have one floor tilting slightly down, one where the floor sections wont stay glued together and keep shifting, and the little nubs for stacking the terrain don't connect properly for some of them.
Edit: Also, my brother's super shitty attitude to anything not going perfectly his way has really soured my first KT experience. 100% not going to be playing with him at all anymore.
Edit2: Rules are kind of confusing concerning injury roles, shaken, and broken. It seems like it is very hard for Necrons to fail anything and their reanimation protocols feel almost nonexistent.
I also swear I saw a rule about the injury roll having a -1 modifier I'd they are within 1 inch of an obscuring piece of terrain but I can't find it.
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
Bond: Prototype Weapon Testers
Service to the Greater Good: Weapons Test
Philosophy: No Heroes
Tempestor
Gue'vesa'ui Lebesnev “Or'os” Leader, Pragmatic (Plasma Pistol, Power Fist)
Scion Gunner
Gue'vesa'la Ashmyr “El'sim” Veteran, Scholar of Puretide (Plasmagun)
Gue'vesa'la Kolm “Nishino” Scout, Monat (Plasmagun)
Gue'vesa'la Pavlo “Atsumo” Medic, Haunted (Plasmagun)
Gue'vesa'la Raheim “Kurami” (Plasmagun)
Special Weapons Gunner
Gue'vesa Dushenko (Flamer)
Gue'vesa Grytt (Flamer)
Guardsman and Guardsman Gunner
Gue'la Altarem (Grenade)
Gue'la Hekler (Vox)
Human soldiers that have defected over to the Tau in service of the greater good. Everyone who joins starts off as a Gue'la, they get some Tau armor and a nice slap on the back for encouragement. If you stick with it, you'll get promoted. Hekler is on the fast track to promotion by carrying the vox to ensure the group never misses their three times a day messages about the glory of the greater good. Install some tau comms equipment in your helmet and you get to become a Gue'vesa proper, no shiny toys yet though. Ready to take the next step? You need to get some minor invasive head surgery in order to communicate better with the Tau, but hey, look at this nifty helmet you'll never want to take off. Congratulations, here is your new, cutting edge, experimental Tau plasma. We are trusting you with some guns that REALLY push the envelope here. Yeah, sometimes they overheat and kill you but... you want to advance the greater good don't you? Besides, Atsumo has some cutting edge Tau medicine (with completely unknown long term side effects) to patch you back up.
Personal rule I'm considering for myself: Yes, I am bringing a fuck ton of plasma. Yes, I think this list is going to be pretty mean. So, I am thinking I am going to track on each unit. Did they fire their plasma last turn? Well if they fire it again this turn they have to overcharge it. Experimental weapons are so temperamental!
the who and the why of a team are as exciting to me as the paint and dice rolling.
Bravely Default / 3DS Friend Code = 3394-3571-1609
I believe it's stated in the shooting phase section. It also only applies to ranged attacks (and not melee). But a model in the way also counts!
It also applies to psychic attacks.
Yup, it was part of the shooting phase section under the injury portion. I knew I saw it before. I did that with shaken as well. It was a very dumb moment of mine.
One of the many questions I have for this right now is about the flail of corruption. My brother runs a DG army and he was using it. It says roll a D3 hit rolls each time the model attacks. Does that mean if the model has 3 attacks it rolls D3 for how many actual swings it does?
Another question. For multi wound weapons, if a weapon does D3 damage and wounds a model, do I roll 1 save or D3 saves depending on what they roll? I don't know why this is escaping me right now but I feel like I keep switching it around and I want to be sure.
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
for the flail, you make a D3 roll for each attack the model can make. so a Combat Specialist Plague Marine with the flail makes 3x D3 (from 3 to 9) attacks instead of the 2+1 attacks on the dataslate.
To make it even nastier, its also a plague weapon so you get to reroll any 1's during the following wound roll.
saving throw is step 3. of the shooting phase. then inflict damage is step 4. (order is the same for melee)
so you don't worry about how much damage a weapon does until after the save has already been failed.
Bravely Default / 3DS Friend Code = 3394-3571-1609
Damn, I'm not happy that I was right about the flails, that weapon is scary.
Alright, that is the way I thought saves and damage work.
Thank you for helping with my questions.
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
(Rest of my list are 2 neophyte gunners, 4 neophytes, 1 neophyte leader, 4 metamorphs and 1 metamorph leader. Neophytes for shooting, metas for cc.)
the flamer technically has less range which becomes less of a problem once you realise the autopistols have a -1 to hit between 6" and 12"
also autohitting flamers could be handy in overwatch.
that said, I would take the extra bodies over the flamer.
big problem is you can't fire either one if you charged or were charged this round which really limits their potential and makes them a bit of a trap choice.
Bravely Default / 3DS Friend Code = 3394-3571-1609
You can fire the handflamers in Overwatch and auto hit with them while you are being charged. (Assuming you have range and LOS.)
Especially since skipping all the flamers allows 2 extra neophytes or 1 extra purestrain.
It really makes the system feel like the focus is on the actual tabletop, which is quite refreshing.
Downside of Kill Team: I already have models for KTs for a lot of factions...
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
In 40k like normal 40k I feel like my mind was blown. Just remember I am coming from Chaos Marines, we don't have combat squading we are more like angry roving bands of marines that have lots of special weapons.
So with my deathwatch like all loyalist have combat squading. Unlike normal loyalist I can fill a vet squad with vanguard vets, bikers, and termis. So something I read on Frontline Gaming the other day is a 10 man squad. 5 vets with stalker bolters/heavy bolters and the other half 2/3 bikers and 2/3 vanguard vets. Combat squad and you have a 5 man backline sniper squad and a super fast objective secured squad that probably has at least 2-3 storm shields. Which is nice.
And reading combat squad rules it is before deployment which leads me to a question:
1. If you combat squad out 5 termis/vanguard vets do they get their normal deep strike rules? I am thinking not because that is tied to the data card and the normal veteran group does not have them.
2. Combat squading happens before deployment to me reads as if I can spend CPs to put them in the teleportarium after I combat squad them out so I can deep strike troop/objective secured termis/vanguard vets. Seem right to all?
Man I love the DW book though. So many options with how you build them out.