Because my time is limited and if I'm going to spend some of it playing games, I'd rather it be games I actually enjoy playing? Because I can read about a game in my spare time at work, but I can't play games during that time? Because I don't want to?
Take your pick between any of those or probably several others. It's crazy to have to justify not wanting to play The Newest Video Game, especially when it's a sequel to a game that was so massively Talked About that people could learn a ton about it without ever playing it.
well it's a 3-4 hour game in the style of undertale, if that tells you anything
I can’t blame Toby for being anxious about literally any game after Undertale. For a freshman release, that was a grand fucking slam and the thought of making ANY other game is terrifying because of expectations.
That it’s even tangentially related to Undertale is pretty brave.
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Goose!That's me, honeyShow me the way home, honeyRegistered Userregular
edited November 2018
Spoilered just in case
I disagree with the idea that nobody has ever done a game with the same characters/motifs but a plot that has little to nothing to do with the former game. FFX-2 comes to mind.
I just hope he gets the team together and finishes it. He seemed completely overwhelmed by the thought of doing that and I hope that he doesn’t let that stop him.
The foundation of something really good is here. I love the new battle system. The characters are great. The music is amazing as always.
It’s ok if it doesn’t end up being as good as undertale. It’s still very good.
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Goose!That's me, honeyShow me the way home, honeyRegistered Userregular
Devolver has expressed interest, at least via Twitter response.
I disagree with the idea that nobody has ever done a game with the same characters/motifs but a plot that has little to nothing to do with the former game. FFX-2 comes to mind.
True but at least that game treated the previous entry as canon.
FF XIV - Qih'to Furishu (on Siren), Battle.Net - Ilpala#1975
Switch - SW-7373-3669-3011
Fuck Joe Manchin
I disagree with the idea that nobody has ever done a game with the same characters/motifs but a plot that has little to nothing to do with the former game. FFX-2 comes to mind.
It's less common in games, I think, but you see it all the time in other media. Especially in film, but there's plenty of literature, comics, and animated series that do similar things - often just because they're an adaptation of one of the other categories and didn't care much about being faithful to the source material.
You see a bit less of it in games because they're expensive and hard to make and generally don't have that much of a budget for experimental things, but even the I'm pretty sure that I've seen a couple visual novels with similar What If takes on everything.
Or just, well, Mario. It helps to have almost zero continuity and simple, repetitive plots with a handful of important characters. How many unrelated games are You Have To Save the Princess From Bowser? The motif of the working-class hero who kills the monster to save his upper-class love interest is consistent, if sexist and slightly confusing.
Of course, the reason for a lot of that is because, like Miyamoto said, they're Popeye-style "actors" - Popeye, Bluto and Olive play a bunch of different characters with the same personality and look. Similarly, Looney Tunes: consider the opera episode with Elmer Fudd vs. Bugs Bunny.
In Deltarune's case it really just seems to be a What If They Lived On The Surface (and Undertale never happened) thing.
beat deltarune so now i gotta watch them schweet reactions
also the last thirty minute of the game had me... just imagine the part in undertale where the dog stupidly spins and vibrates
just whuuuuuuuuuuh
Gundi on
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Mx. QuillI now prefer "Myr. Quill", actually...{They/Them}Registered Userregular
edited November 2018
Oh neat, the game does have controller support after all. I assumed not since my PS4 controller wasn't recognized, a friend had told me that PCs natively do so without the need for DS4Windows now.
Goose!That's me, honeyShow me the way home, honeyRegistered Userregular
edited November 2018
Ending spoiler, really
Last warning
So...I just watched a streamer play...and instead of the ending I got they got a variation.
Instead of Lancer leading a throng of mutineers, Ralsei pacifies the King while Susie distracts him, they have their moment about keeping your guard up always, Lancer shows up, tells them everyone "freaked out" and is coming for you, and you have to book it and don't get to say goodbyes to more than I presume because she let Susie kill too many people.
So...I just watched a streamer play...and instead of the ending I got they got a variation.
Instead of Lancer leading a throng of mutineers, Ralsei pacifies the King while Susie distracts him, they have their moment about keeping your guard up always, Lancer shows up, tells them everyone "freaked out" and is coming for you, and you have to book it and don't get to say goodbyes to more than I presume because she let Susie kill too many people.
Compared to "an entire branch of the game, considered by many to be the 'true ending', is potentially locked out based on your actions", the Fight/Act divide doesn't affect much in Deltarune.
My favorite musical instrument is the air-raid siren.
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
So does it matter
If you fight or ACT on the optional boss?
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
So...I just watched a streamer play...and instead of the ending I got they got a variation.
Instead of Lancer leading a throng of mutineers, Ralsei pacifies the King while Susie distracts him, they have their moment about keeping your guard up always, Lancer shows up, tells them everyone "freaked out" and is coming for you, and you have to book it and don't get to say goodbyes to more than I presume because she let Susie kill too many people.
Trolls, see, they aren't like humans, and that includes reproduction.
Their reproduction is handled through giant grubs (Mother grubs) that take in genetic material to lay eggs that hatch into larvae.
Now, to gather the genetic material, the government sends these big hulking Mating Drones (pictured above) which have two pails. One is for red romantic reproduction and the other for black romantic reproduction. Because troll romance is different from human romance and is handled with quadrants that are conveniently represented by the 4 suits of a card deck.
Now, in Troll culture, the pail is a sexual thing, so a pail with a spade on it would be very explicitly sexual in nature.
Thank your lucky stars i didn't go in more details or mention the incestuous slurry.
The problem is that when the subject of troll romance is broached, our sparing human intellects instantly assume the most ingratiating posture of surrender imaginable.
But we will do our best to understand regardless.
Humans have only one form of romance. And though we consider it a complicated subject, spanning a wide range of emotions, social conventions, and implications for reproduction, it is ultimately a superficial slice of what trolls consider the full body of romantic experience. Our concept of romance, in spite of its capacity to fill our art and literature and to rule our individual destinies like little else, is still just that. A single, linear concept. A concept usually denoted by a single symbol.
Troll romance is more complicated than that. Troll romance needs four symbols.
Their understanding of romance is divided into halves, and halved again, producing four quadrants: the FLUSHED QUADRANT, the CALIGINOUS QUADRANT, the PALE QUADRANT, and the ASHEN QUADRANT.
Each quadrant is grouped by the half they share, whether horizontally or vertically, depending on the overlapping properties one examines. The sharpest dichotomy, from an emotional perspective, is drawn between RED ROMANCE and BLACK ROMANCE.
RED ROMANCE, comprised of the flushed and pale quadrants, is a form of romance rooted in strongly positive emotions. BLACK ROMANCE, with its caliginous and ashen quadrants, is rooted in the strongly negative.
On the other hand, the vertical bifurcation has to do with the purpose of the relationship, regardless of the emotions behind it. Those quadrants which are CONCUPISCENT, the flushed and caliginous, have to do with facilitating the elaborate reproductive cycle of trolls. Those which are CONCILIATORY, the pale and ashen, would be more closely likened to platonic relationships by human standards.
There are many parallels between human relationships and the various facets of troll romance. Humans have words to describe relationships of a negative nature, or of a platonic nature. The difference is, for humans, those relationships would never be conceptually grouped with romance. Establishing those sort of relationships for humans is not driven by the same primal forces that drive our tendency to couple romantically. But for trolls, those primal forces involve themselves in the full palette of these relationships, red or black, torrid or friendly. Trolls typically feel strongly compelled to find balance in each quadrant, and seek gratifying relationships that each describes.
The challenge is particularly tortuous for young trolls, who must reconcile the wide range of contradictory emotions associated with this matrix, while understanding the nature of their various romantic urges for the first time.
Of course, young humans have this challenge too. But for trolls, the challenge is fourfold.
When two individuals find themselves in the flushed quadrant together, they are said to be MATESPRITS. Matespritship is the closest parallel to the human concept of romance trolls have. It plays a role in the trolls' reproductive cycle, just as it does for humans.
This is pretty obvious! Not much more needs to be said about this. Moving right along.
When a pair of adversaries delve into this quadrant, they become each other's KISMESIS. As one of the concupiscent quadrants, it plays a role in procreation as well. There is no particularly good human translation for this concept. The closest would be an especially potent arch-rivalry.
For instance, human players would never be able to adequately diagnose the relationship between the queen and her archagent. But troll players could immediately place it as a dead ringer for kismesissitude. They would think we were all pretty stupid for not getting it. And they would be right.
Trolls have a complicated reproductive cycle. It's probably best not to examine it in much detail.
The need to seek out concupiscent partners comes with more urgency than typical reproductive instincts. When the IMPERIAL DRONE comes knocking, you had better be able to supply genetic material to each of his FILIAL PAILS. If you have nothing to offer, he will kill you without hesitation.
The genetic material - WITHOUT GOING INTO MUCH DETAIL - is a combinative genetic mix from the matesprit and kismesis pairs, respectively. The pails are all offered to the mother grub, who can only receive such precombined material. She then combines all of it into one incestuous slurry, and begins her brooding.
This doesn't mean the initial combination was for naught, however. In the slurry, more dominant genes rise to the fore, while the more recessive find less representation in the brood. Especially strong matesprit and kismesis pairings yield more dominant genetic material. The more powerful the complement or potent the rivalry, the more dominant the genes.
TROLL REPRODUCTION SURE IS WEIRD. We all take a moment to lament how pedestrian the human reproductive system is, and further lament that the phrase "incestuous slurry" is not a feature of common parlance in human civilization.
This quadrant involves a particular type of three-way relationship of a black romantic nature. Falling on the conciliatory side, it has no bearing on the reproductive cycle, except for indirect ramifications.
When two trolls are locked in a feud or some otherwise contentious relationship, one can intervene and become their AUSPISTICE. The auspistice mediates between the two, playing the role of a peace keeper, preventing the feud from boiling over into a fully caliginous rivalry.
Since such lesser feuds are quite common among trolls, there is a significant need for auspisticing parties. Without them, too many ashen feuds would become caliginous, and begin to conflict with other exclusive kismesis relationships, leading to a great deal of social complexity and sore feelings (even more so than black romance usually involves). Without auspisticism, the result would be widespread black infidelity.
The relationships each quadrant describes tend to be malleable, if not volatile, especially on the concupiscent half where more torrid emotions reside. It doesn't take much to flip a switch and transmute blackrom feelings to redrom, and vice versa.
In many cases, one party will have red feelings while the other has black. But it will often be the case that one party's feelings will swap to match the other's, since there is no quadrant which naturally accommodates such a disparity. But thereafter, it's not uncommon for the two to toggle between red and black in unison now and then. These scenarios naturally result in both red and black infidelities.
This sort of relationship volatility is why conciliatory relationships are an important part of troll romance.
An auspistice can stabilize particularly turbulent relationships. If the auspistice fails to mediate properly, or has no interest in the role, or perhaps has different romantic intentions him/herself altogether, then the relationship often quickly deteriorates into one of an especially hostile and torrid nature. There are many outside factors and influences tugging and pulling these relationships in different directions, and unlike humans who have very orderly, simple, straightforward romantic relationships without exception, trolls exist in a state of almost perpetual confusion and generally have no idea what the hell is going on.
Being confused by troll relationships is one thing we do have in common though.
This quadrant presides over MOIRALLEGIENCE, the other conciliatory relationship. A reasonable human translation would be the concept of a soul mate, but in a more platonic sense, and with a more specific social purpose.
Trolls are a very angry and violent race. Some are more hot-tempered and dangerous than others, to the extent that if left to their own devices, they would present a serious threat to society, or even to themselves. Such trolls will have an instinctive pale attraction to a more even-tempered troll, who may become their MOIRAIL. The moirail is obliged to pacify the other, to function as the better half. The two partners in a strong pale relationship will serve to balance and complement each other's emotional profiles, and thus allow their other relationships to be more successful.
It's often ambiguous especially among young trolls whether a bond formed between an acquaintance is true moirallegence, or the usual variety of platonic involvement. Furthermore, romantic intentions of a more flushed nature can often be mistaken for paler leanings, much to the frustration of the suitor.
But some pale pairings, as the one above, will be strikingly obvious to all who know them.
God you just can't get enough of this can you! That would have been a great point for a transition out of this illustrated sociological study, but ok, if you insist.
Now see, what's going on here is...
It's perfectly simple. When the full matrix of troll romance is in action, we have... uh...
Hey, why don't you figure it out! You should be an expert on all this by now anyway.
Later our troll hero would try to explain this to our human hero, attempting to convey all the nuance of troll romance through a nearly verbatim recitation of the preceding excerpts.
He would try to describe how rich and textured the troll romantic comedies were compared to the one dimensional schlock of our human cinematic counterparts. He would barely scratch the surface of Troll Will Smith's virtuosity with the delicate lattice of troll romance, as he would assist the bumbling fudgeblooded Troll Kevin James through the interwoven minefield-briarpatch of redrom and blackrom entanglements, all the while sifting through his own prickly romantic situation and ultimately learning the true meaning of hate and pity. But would they succeed before the imperial drone came knocking with his thirsty pails at the ready??? Yes, they would.
But John didn't understand any of this because he's a moron, and he wouldn't shut up about his awful bullshit Earth movies. He would just go on and on and on about that garbage.
But if there was one theme to be hammered through his thick skull, it would be the trolls' cultural preoccupation with romantic destiny. Yes, the romantic landscape is rife with false starts and miscues and infidelities, red and black. But every troll believes strongly that each quadrant holds one and only one true pairing for them, and it is just a matter of time before the grid is filled with auspicious matchups through the mysterious channels of TROLL SERENDIPITY.
In short, their belief is that for each quadrant there exists a pair or triad of trolls somewhere in the cosmos that were...
MADE FOR EACH OTHER.
Sterica on
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darunia106J-bob in gamesDeath MountainRegistered Userregular
Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
At least we were spared the pictures.
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Lord_AsmodeusgoeticSobriquet:Here is your magical cryptic riddle-tumour: I AM A TIME MACHINERegistered Userregular
So two things, 1. Should I watch a let's play of Undertale? I have never seen the game more than a bit and it's game I'm not very good at and 2. Do I need to see Undertale before I check out Deltarune?
Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if Labor had not first existed. Labor is superior to capital, and deserves much the higher consideration. - Lincoln
I would think that deltarune will have less impact if you haven’t played or watched undertale.
If the gameplay doesn’t work for you there’s a bunch of good let’s plays out there. I’m partial to game grumps or laurentheflute for undertale. I’m sure there’s other good ones. i remember a lot of people watching jacksepticeye’s.
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Goose!That's me, honeyShow me the way home, honeyRegistered Userregular
So two things, 1. Should I watch a let's play of Undertale? I have never seen the game more than a bit and it's game I'm not very good at and 2. Do I need to see Undertale before I check out Deltarune?
The website says its for those who have played Undertale, and it would give some context of the characters from that story (because the characters are in this game, too) but Toby says in his FAQ not to worry about what the relationship of Deltarune is to Undertale, they're meant to be separate stories and not sequel or prequel.
I would still recommend checking out a Let's Play because its really good! Steam Train (Game Grumps) did a great one, as did JackSepticEye, Cryoatic, Dodger, and others. I've watched all of those and enjoyed them individually
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well it's a 3-4 hour game in the style of undertale, if that tells you anything
That it’s even tangentially related to Undertale is pretty brave.
The foundation of something really good is here. I love the new battle system. The characters are great. The music is amazing as always.
It’s ok if it doesn’t end up being as good as undertale. It’s still very good.
Switch - SW-7373-3669-3011
Fuck Joe Manchin
Tumblr | Twitter PSN: misterdapper Av by Satellite_09
And it's on youtube! Three hours long, though, so I'll have to watch it during an online RPG session or something.
It's the first part. Next part is about the same size and has her decompressing her thoughts.
Tumblr | Twitter PSN: misterdapper Av by Satellite_09
You see a bit less of it in games because they're expensive and hard to make and generally don't have that much of a budget for experimental things, but even the I'm pretty sure that I've seen a couple visual novels with similar What If takes on everything.
Or just, well, Mario. It helps to have almost zero continuity and simple, repetitive plots with a handful of important characters. How many unrelated games are You Have To Save the Princess From Bowser? The motif of the working-class hero who kills the monster to save his upper-class love interest is consistent, if sexist and slightly confusing.
Of course, the reason for a lot of that is because, like Miyamoto said, they're Popeye-style "actors" - Popeye, Bluto and Olive play a bunch of different characters with the same personality and look. Similarly, Looney Tunes: consider the opera episode with Elmer Fudd vs. Bugs Bunny.
In Deltarune's case it really just seems to be a What If They Lived On The Surface (and Undertale never happened) thing.
also the last thirty minute of the game had me... just imagine the part in undertale where the dog stupidly spins and vibrates
just whuuuuuuuuuuh
Instead of Lancer leading a throng of mutineers, Ralsei pacifies the King while Susie distracts him, they have their moment about keeping your guard up always, Lancer shows up, tells them everyone "freaked out" and is coming for you, and you have to book it and don't get to say goodbyes to more than I presume because she let Susie kill too many people.
Knowing this now, it's weird Toby says fighting/acting doesn't change anything though, then.
at knife point if necessary
I have Don't Forget stuck in my head.
god fucking damn it
okay, so, see....
Trolls, see, they aren't like humans, and that includes reproduction.
Their reproduction is handled through giant grubs (Mother grubs) that take in genetic material to lay eggs that hatch into larvae.
Now, to gather the genetic material, the government sends these big hulking Mating Drones (pictured above) which have two pails. One is for red romantic reproduction and the other for black romantic reproduction. Because troll romance is different from human romance and is handled with quadrants that are conveniently represented by the 4 suits of a card deck.
Now, in Troll culture, the pail is a sexual thing, so a pail with a spade on it would be very explicitly sexual in nature.
Thank your lucky stars i didn't go in more details or mention the incestuous slurry.
Hope that helps.
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If the gameplay doesn’t work for you there’s a bunch of good let’s plays out there. I’m partial to game grumps or laurentheflute for undertale. I’m sure there’s other good ones. i remember a lot of people watching jacksepticeye’s.
I would still recommend checking out a Let's Play because its really good! Steam Train (Game Grumps) did a great one, as did JackSepticEye, Cryoatic, Dodger, and others. I've watched all of those and enjoyed them individually
It’s short. It’s funny. You the full spectrum of genuine emotional reactions.