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How do you spell justice? BDS! BDS?
tinwhiskers
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
What is the BDS?
The Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions is a non-violent global campaign to encourage companies, universities, and governments to boycott Israeli companies, Divest from Israel(not make investments in Israel or Israeli companies), and encourage their governments to sanction Israel. It was started in 2005, on the 1 year anniversary of the International Court of Justices's ruling that the Israeli separation wall, which annexed 10% of the West Bank was illegal, that Israel had to dismantle it “forthwith” and offer reparations to those it had harmed, and that every signatory to the fourth Geneva convention – meaning nearly every state in the world – was under an obligation to ensure Israel complied with international humanitarian law.
None of which had occurred, the wall still stands to this day. An even greater part of the land beyond the wall is settled.
What are the goals of BDS?
The goal of BDS is to apply non-violent pressure to Israel in order to force it to end its illegal occupation and settlement of Palestinian lands; grant full equality to Arab-Palestinian citizens of Israel; and respect the rights of Palestinian refugees to return to their homes and properties.
Why should we care about these things?
The West bank and Gaza are essentially large open air prisons. Under constant blockade by the Israeli military. With extremely high poverty, limited running water and electricity, and a general shortage of means and opportunity. To the point that one should care about injustice anywhere, we should care about this.
That is a map of the West Bank, nominally part of Palestine, and the pink and purple areas are regions where Palestinians are not granted freedom of movement.
Here's is the growth and expansion of the Israeli settlements over time. There has been no slow down in recent years, and the population of these settlements and outposts continue to grow.
/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/7724079/Israelisettle_outpost.gif)
link to giant UN made map of the situation, with some key facts.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/fd/West_Bank_Access_Restrictions.pdf
Has this ever worked before?
Yes, The boycott of Apartheid era South Africa was one of the factors that lead to the end of South African Apartheid. There are several parallels between the Bantustan or "tribal lands" under Apartheid, and the administration of the West Bank and Gaza.
Who Opposes this and why?
The Israeli government, various settler groups, businesses that operate out of the occupied territory, basically any group that has a vested interest in stealing Palestinian land and exploiting Palestinian labor. Additionally anti BDS laws are on the books in 26 US states and have a wide cross-section of support by US politicians thanks to the strong Israeli lobbying apparatuses(AIPAC, J Street), along with bat shit end of the world evangelical beliefs, the bog standard fuck brown people and of course Islamophobia.
These groups generally conflate the illegal Israeli occupation and settlement construction, with Israel itself; seeking to portray BDS as a movement that seeks to delegitimize Israel. Or with Jews in general to cast it as an antisemitic movement.
Why is this topical now?
The US just elected its first 2 Muslim women representatives(Ilhan Omar and Rashidia Tlaib) to congress both of whom support the BDS movement, and Rep Tlaib is planning to lead the first ever congressional delegation to the occupied West Bank in lieu of the annual AIPAC funded trip to Israel. Which could get interesting, as Israel has previously banned the entry of people who expressed support for the BDS movement. Recently refused entry to a US student with a valid visa on the grounds of her involvement with BDS, for 2 weeks before being forced to acquiesse by the Israeli Supreme Court.
Also, Combating BDS Act written by Marco Rubio(boo, hiss) also stalled in the US Senate this week. The act would have "allowed"(it was probably unconstitutional as fuck) states and cities to blacklist businesses who boycott Israel.
Links:
BDS's What is BDS
https://bdsmovement.net/what-is-bds
AIPAC's "What is BDS" - complete with recommended talking points
https://www.aipac.org/learn/issues/issue-display/the-bds-movement
JStreets BDS page
https://jstreet.org/policy/boycott-divestment-and-sanctions-bds/#.XDZxKlVKiUk
Coverage of anti-BDS law
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2019/01/anti-bds-measure-stalled-senate-190109150723359.html
Great History of the BDS movement
https://www.theguardian.com/news/2018/aug/14/bds-boycott-divestment-sanctions-movement-transformed-israeli-palestinian-debate
Graphs of Israeli Settlement activity
https://www.vox.com/world/2016/12/30/14088842/israeli-settlements-explained-in-5-charts
If anyone has any recommended links/back ground reading I'll be glad to add it to the OP. I'm not the MENA history/policy gurus that some on this forum are.
What is this thread for?
Discussing pushes for BDS actions, the companies engaging in BDS, companies that should be targeted for BDS actions, news about various anti-BDS legislation, the merits of BDS generally, What I'm sure will be an interesting upcoming trip for Rep Tlaib.
I'd prefer this not become the running Israel-Palestine current event thread( maybe it can sprawl out into the current peace process, I don't know if that will stay focused or not), but people looking for background information on the current situation should be feel free to ask, and people much more knowledgeable than I am can answer. If its really good, I'll take it and make it part of the OP. If you complain just know that a draft of this OP from long ago had that exact content in it. So really, it was always mine.
The Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions is a non-violent global campaign to encourage companies, universities, and governments to boycott Israeli companies, Divest from Israel(not make investments in Israel or Israeli companies), and encourage their governments to sanction Israel. It was started in 2005, on the 1 year anniversary of the International Court of Justices's ruling that the Israeli separation wall, which annexed 10% of the West Bank was illegal, that Israel had to dismantle it “forthwith” and offer reparations to those it had harmed, and that every signatory to the fourth Geneva convention – meaning nearly every state in the world – was under an obligation to ensure Israel complied with international humanitarian law.
None of which had occurred, the wall still stands to this day. An even greater part of the land beyond the wall is settled.
What are the goals of BDS?
The goal of BDS is to apply non-violent pressure to Israel in order to force it to end its illegal occupation and settlement of Palestinian lands; grant full equality to Arab-Palestinian citizens of Israel; and respect the rights of Palestinian refugees to return to their homes and properties.
Why should we care about these things?
The West bank and Gaza are essentially large open air prisons. Under constant blockade by the Israeli military. With extremely high poverty, limited running water and electricity, and a general shortage of means and opportunity. To the point that one should care about injustice anywhere, we should care about this.
That is a map of the West Bank, nominally part of Palestine, and the pink and purple areas are regions where Palestinians are not granted freedom of movement.
Here's is the growth and expansion of the Israeli settlements over time. There has been no slow down in recent years, and the population of these settlements and outposts continue to grow.
link to giant UN made map of the situation, with some key facts.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/fd/West_Bank_Access_Restrictions.pdf
Has this ever worked before?
Yes, The boycott of Apartheid era South Africa was one of the factors that lead to the end of South African Apartheid. There are several parallels between the Bantustan or "tribal lands" under Apartheid, and the administration of the West Bank and Gaza.
Who Opposes this and why?
The Israeli government, various settler groups, businesses that operate out of the occupied territory, basically any group that has a vested interest in stealing Palestinian land and exploiting Palestinian labor. Additionally anti BDS laws are on the books in 26 US states and have a wide cross-section of support by US politicians thanks to the strong Israeli lobbying apparatuses(AIPAC, J Street), along with bat shit end of the world evangelical beliefs, the bog standard fuck brown people and of course Islamophobia.
These groups generally conflate the illegal Israeli occupation and settlement construction, with Israel itself; seeking to portray BDS as a movement that seeks to delegitimize Israel. Or with Jews in general to cast it as an antisemitic movement.
Why is this topical now?
The US just elected its first 2 Muslim women representatives(Ilhan Omar and Rashidia Tlaib) to congress both of whom support the BDS movement, and Rep Tlaib is planning to lead the first ever congressional delegation to the occupied West Bank in lieu of the annual AIPAC funded trip to Israel. Which could get interesting, as Israel has previously banned the entry of people who expressed support for the BDS movement. Recently refused entry to a US student with a valid visa on the grounds of her involvement with BDS, for 2 weeks before being forced to acquiesse by the Israeli Supreme Court.
Also, Combating BDS Act written by Marco Rubio(boo, hiss) also stalled in the US Senate this week. The act would have "allowed"(it was probably unconstitutional as fuck) states and cities to blacklist businesses who boycott Israel.
Links:
BDS's What is BDS
https://bdsmovement.net/what-is-bds
AIPAC's "What is BDS" - complete with recommended talking points
https://www.aipac.org/learn/issues/issue-display/the-bds-movement
JStreets BDS page
https://jstreet.org/policy/boycott-divestment-and-sanctions-bds/#.XDZxKlVKiUk
Coverage of anti-BDS law
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2019/01/anti-bds-measure-stalled-senate-190109150723359.html
Great History of the BDS movement
https://www.theguardian.com/news/2018/aug/14/bds-boycott-divestment-sanctions-movement-transformed-israeli-palestinian-debate
Graphs of Israeli Settlement activity
https://www.vox.com/world/2016/12/30/14088842/israeli-settlements-explained-in-5-charts
If anyone has any recommended links/back ground reading I'll be glad to add it to the OP. I'm not the MENA history/policy gurus that some on this forum are.
What is this thread for?
Discussing pushes for BDS actions, the companies engaging in BDS, companies that should be targeted for BDS actions, news about various anti-BDS legislation, the merits of BDS generally, What I'm sure will be an interesting upcoming trip for Rep Tlaib.
I'd prefer this not become the running Israel-Palestine current event thread( maybe it can sprawl out into the current peace process, I don't know if that will stay focused or not), but people looking for background information on the current situation should be feel free to ask, and people much more knowledgeable than I am can answer. If its really good, I'll take it and make it part of the OP. If you complain just know that a draft of this OP from long ago had that exact content in it. So really, it was always mine.
tinwhiskers on
+7
This discussion has been closed.
Posts
The telling part was that the Institute couldn't be open about why they pulled the award.
Like they are straight up the government banning political speech...
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
They probably aren't. The arguments that get used are either, its an anti-discrimination law or more hilariously that its basically the same thing as all the other sanction trade restriction laws that have been passed.
If they can ban you from doing business with Iran, then they can ban you for banning yourself from doing business with Israel? IDK, again Marc Rubio wrote that shit. Though in the context of US politics, this is one of those bipartisan bits of stupid, that is present in both red and blue areas and governments.
A lot of these laws are new, and the test cases are just starting to make its way through the courts. Like Texas just fired a speech pathologist over her refusal to sign a statement saying she does not and will not boycott Israel. https://theintercept.com/2018/12/17/israel-texas-anti-bds-law/
e: The narrow argument some advocates try to make is that boycotting Israel is not speech, it's an economic activity. So they can't ban her from supporting BDS, just from engaging in a boycott. Which is sure special from a state that blew a gasket over "how is not buying health insurance an economic activity", not that long a go.
Law is just what people are willing to enforce or allow
Its not explicitly so, but like anything involving, well, anything, but Israel in particular, it certainly can attract anti-Semites. This is convenient for people who oppose BDS because they support the right wing government in Israel. Its easier to attack BDS because you saw a bigot at a rally once than it is to defend settlements in the West Bank.
The rhetorical link between "anti-Semite and terrorist" is pretty obvious in context.
The standard-issue pro-Israel argument is that Israel needs to go to extreme measures to defend themselves against the existential threats posted by (choose one or more) terrorists, Palestinian terrorists, Palestinians in general, Islamic terrorists, Islam in general, or antisemitism.
So, yes, pick any anti-Israel program or position, and somebody out there will argue that it supports terrorists.
Meanwhile there's going to be the unescapable problem that for any political movement of sufficient size, some of your fellow travelers are going to be assholes. Some of the people who support BDS are going to be bona fide antisemites.
Example: I oppose sexism. TERFs also oppose sexism. Does that mean that anti-sexism supports TERFs? No, but it does mean that I need to be careful of which organizations I donate to / partner with in my quest.
There's also a galaxy-brain version of the argument which I do think has credence. Economic sanctions often hurt the poor and middle class harder than they hurt leadership. In the case of an occupied country like Palestine, economic sanctions against the occupier can end up deepening poverty among the colonized people. If BDS worsens economic conditions among poor Palestinians and Israelis, that alone can foment violence.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
Because this thread looks very "call to action" and I wouldn't want anyone getting caught up in something terrible.
I've seen discussion about people who even support Israel worried the really extreme blowback to BDS or anything that even looks like it will ultimately backfire on the anti-BDS side as it makes enemies of too many.
Polling in places like the US continues to be strong in it's support for Israel though, so I'm not sure how much this is actually effecting anything.
I think a core problem is that vehemently pro-Israel factions have captured the US Senate and foreign policy establishment to such an extent that there has been no way to effectively change US policy towards Israel. Those who feel solidarity with Palestinians and oppose the Israeli occupation are at a loss for ways to act. If we can't express opposition through the state*, individual economic boycotts are pretty much all we have. It's a nonviolent way to oppose oppression/violence and an attempt to influence the behavior of the Israeli state and the country's rich.
Overall I am hesitantly supportive of BDS. I think there are better ways to influence the Israeli state's behavior but all of them seem to require getting the AIPAC types out of Washington, and ideally getting the Likud and its even farther right allies out of power in Israel. In the meantime BDS still seems like a lesser evil than doing nothing to me.
*This isn't a given, though; see current trends on how Americans view the topic and how public/elite perceptions of the Saudi Arabian government has shifted.
edit - also, I'm appalled that these anti-boycott laws keep coming up. Glad that today's was voted down but come on, this thing where Senators want the state to force you to buy foreign products against your will is insane. Is there any precedent for such a law?
To what degree should we tolerate crimes against humanity for the sake of economic performance? Doesnt moral responsibility fall squarely with the government that renders its nation a pariah?
I mean you can certainly take it too far and I think we have with other nations before but Im not sure any but the most strident BDS supporters would favor cutting off Israel to the point of making malnutrition a serious concern.
Rather than an abstract notion of moral responsibility, I think the question should be addressed from a pragmatic standpoint: What is the action meant to achieve, and is it likely to succeed? What possible suffering could be caused by the action? Does the potential good outweigh the potential pitfalls?
Yeah, this is basically my view on this. I'm not sure BDS is the best movement and boy howdy does it attract some shitty people because antisemitism but it's also basically the only thing anyone has come up with. Because the Israeli lobby has a stranglehold on US policy as it pertains to Israel and so basically nothing else is happening.
You can just look at the crazy ass seems-to-me blatantly unconstitutional anti-BDS laws and just like, goddamn that's a crazy overreaction.
I added another paragraph with some nuance. Like I said earlier though, I think BDS is more useful as a narrative mover in the US than as an actual foreign policy. If a candidate came out and said "I think BDS is too broad but I fully support targeting sanctions against Israeli leaders and relevant businesses" I can get behind that.
Also, we should completely disregard any input from Palestinian forumers.
There are ways to disagree with someone without immediately mashing the big red asshole button. I suggest investigating them.
Geth, close the thread.