it's great if you're a small character and not relying on weapon dice via smite, or sneak attack (except rogues need to take a feat for it)
I just want to make a Blood Hunter Belmot with whip and sword is that so much to ask, WotC?
Blood hunter actually has the ability to make the whip way more useful with crimson rite.
You're also gonna need throwing axes, a cross boomerang, and to carry some alchemist fires.
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Zonugal(He/Him) The Holiday ArmadilloI'm Santa's representative for all the southern states. And Mexico!Registered Userregular
While whips are at a middling d4 for damage, they are the only weapon with reach that has finesse (which means they are the only reach weapon viable for sneak attacks).
For a Rogue, you'll still need to pick up proficiency in it (so either a feat or the far more optimal choice of multiclassing), but it's a solid secondary/back-up weapon for them.
it does seem kinda neat to try playing a whip blood hunter
you get reach for 2d4 damage with the whip, and you if take duelling you get a flat +2 bonus to damage as long as it's your only weapon equipped. seems fun if your party has a front-line fighter or two already
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Metzger MeisterIt Gets Worsebefore it gets any better.Registered Userregular
one of the players in an old campaign of mine played as a spellsword who used a spiked chain!
i didn't think about the implications of this until combat started! because i was like "oh shit that sounds like ghostrider fuck yeah mark good character bud."
then shit got wild.
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Zonugal(He/Him) The Holiday ArmadilloI'm Santa's representative for all the southern states. And Mexico!Registered Userregular
it does seem kinda neat to try playing a whip blood hunter
you get reach for 2d4 damage with the whip, and you if take duelling you get a flat +2 bonus to damage as long as it's your only weapon equipped. seems fun if your party has a front-line fighter or two already
I always thought whips would be a lot of fun with the different combat cantrips like Booming Blade and/or Green-Flame Blade.
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Tynnanseldom correct, never unsureRegistered Userregular
I'm early in designing a one-shot 5e module to run for a group of my friends who haven't played D&D before. They're a bunch of fun, spontaneous folks and I know they'd have a good time with the game. Because originality is dead and nothing new exists, ever, this event is heavily inspired by the Newfoundland mission in X-COM. I've lent out my sourcebooks to a friend so I can't get too specific on enemy monsters and encounter design until I get those back, but I've started fleshing out the basic structure, setting, points of evidence, and so forth.
Setting: maritime district of a decently-large coastal city. I want this to support fishing industry, shipbuilding, wharves, and associated markets and amenities.
Players: 4-5 new-to-D&D players of 2nd level. To save time I'll be making ~6 precons for them to choose from.
Hook: While sitting down to dinner at a dockside tavern (because where else does a good adventure start?), the PCs' meal is interrupted when another patron begins violently retching and gets chest-burstered. The infested patron will in turn infest 1-2 other patrons and turn them with its first actions, before the party reaches them and the other patrons are able to flee. After they defeat the infested patrons, a Watch Official intent on suppressing spread of this news will admonish them.
Sleuthing: after the initial encounter, PCs will have the opportunity to gather evidence in a variety of ways. I want to come up with at least 4-5 different threads of evidence that could lead them to the infestation's source, a recently-returned ship with a 50-foot long whale in its hold that is incubating a massive host of the responsible creatures. I want to give them a lot of freedom to decide where to seek out evidence. They will notice a larval creature in the fish stew they were *just about* to start eating before the commotion erupted, implicating the maritime marketplace. They could investigate the market and question fishmongers about strange occurrences, where they can learn that similar things have been happening in the past few days and that the news hasn't been spreading widely due to suppression by the City Watch. One vendor might recognize the party from the Hook Event and take them back to show them an infested fish. The party might wander the docks and become barred from passage by dead-eyed longshoremen, conspicuously near a certain set of docks housing the Whaling Vessel. There may also be evidence threads at the harbormaster (Whaling Vessel was a week late on its most recent arrival) and Watch House but I haven't developed what those might be yet.
Dungeoneering: I'll treat the Whaling Vessel and the nearby wharves as a dungeon, with patrolling longshoremen to evade/trick/defeat as they make their way about their investigation. If they scout the (large) ship itself they can search the captain's quarters and navigation table, to discover that the most recent voyage had a different return route than other trips back from the fishing grounds. They might encounter some traps (illusory gangplank, rotten floorboards, loudly-crunching shells strewn under a threshold). As they descend deeper into the Whaling Vessel it will become progressively more infested with a creepy seafloor/cavernous/fungal vibe. Light from luminescent mushrooms will faintly illuminate the lower decks. The 50-foot-long whale (16-20 tons) will be on the lowest deck on a long table, its skin subtly writhing with incubating larvae. The events in town have occurred from individual larvae migrating from this source and infesting fish in the market. Deep in the vessel they may encounter less-humanoid enemies, infested mutated sea life or somesuch.
Nearby the Whaling Vessel, two sources of fuel will be located: a nearby shipyard is sealing a nearly-completed ship with pitch and there are numerous heavy barrels available to be stolen. A whale-oil rendering plant in the district will have barrels of whale oil to steal. The party could steal those fuel barrels and plant them about the whale to burn away the infestation source. Transporting these without attracting attention could be a puzzle for the PCs. I want at least 1-2 more ways of destroying the whale but haven't figured those out yet.
There will be a few things for the PCs to loot on the ship, perhaps bounty in the captain's cabin or below decks as well as a stash of barnacle-encrusted weapons and armor (nonmagical but adds small extra slashing damage). I have a few ideas for broader motives and intrigue but that will depend on how long the session goes, and how interested the PCs are in investigating widely.
one of the players in an old campaign of mine played as a spellsword who used a spiked chain!
i didn't think about the implications of this until combat started! because i was like "oh shit that sounds like ghostrider fuck yeah mark good character bud."
then shit got wild.
wait wait was this in 5e? where the heck is the spiked chain
it does seem kinda neat to try playing a whip blood hunter
you get reach for 2d4 damage with the whip, and you if take duelling you get a flat +2 bonus to damage as long as it's your only weapon equipped. seems fun if your party has a front-line fighter or two already
it does seem kinda neat to try playing a whip blood hunter
you get reach for 2d4 damage with the whip, and you if take duelling you get a flat +2 bonus to damage as long as it's your only weapon equipped. seems fun if your party has a front-line fighter or two already
And at 5th level that becomes 1d4+1d6 damage
definitely feels like you want to stick with 1 weapon or take toughness, that's for sure
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Metzger MeisterIt Gets Worsebefore it gets any better.Registered Userregular
one of the players in an old campaign of mine played as a spellsword who used a spiked chain!
i didn't think about the implications of this until combat started! because i was like "oh shit that sounds like ghostrider fuck yeah mark good character bud."
then shit got wild.
wait wait was this in 5e? where the heck is the spiked chain
oh no, this was 3.5
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Zonugal(He/Him) The Holiday ArmadilloI'm Santa's representative for all the southern states. And Mexico!Registered Userregular
edited January 2019
@Anzekay, if you wanted a spiked chain in fifth edition, I'd just copy the stats for either the glaive or halberd.
Or rather, he had a magic rapier that could turn into a serrated whip, which was badass
Reach finesse weapons are really strong, literally the only downside is the damage. That whip function came in handy a lot, you never know when reach will come in handy, and D8+7 to D4+7 damage isn't a big deal when really it's smiting that's doing the heavy lifting.
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webguy20I spend too much time on the InternetRegistered Userregular
Or rather, he had a magic rapier that could turn into a serrated whip, which was badass
Reach finesse weapons are really strong, literally the only downside is the damage. That whip function came in handy a lot, you never know when reach will come in handy, and D8+7 to D4+7 damage isn't a big deal when really it's smiting that's doing the heavy lifting.
I might have to give the whip a try on a swashbuckler build. With sneak attack the low core damage die would be somewhat mitigated. And I love the concept thematically.
Or rather, he had a magic rapier that could turn into a serrated whip, which was badass
Reach finesse weapons are really strong, literally the only downside is the damage. That whip function came in handy a lot, you never know when reach will come in handy, and D8+7 to D4+7 damage isn't a big deal when really it's smiting that's doing the heavy lifting.
there isn't enough of a finesse weapon variety, the trident is straight-up garbage, are there are a couple instances where it's basically the same weapon twice
which are things that are easy to houserule
but I think it really shows on rogues
they REALLY don't want strength rogues to be a thing and it seems like they go out of their way to enforce it (ranged weapons count, thrown weapons don't unless they have finesse as well RIP axe throwing dwarf rogue)
yet they still get longsword proficiency, which can't even be used for sneak attack! it would make more sense if they started with a different martial weapon proficiency like, say, a goddamn whip
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it does seem kinda neat to try playing a whip blood hunter
you get reach for 2d4 damage with the whip, and you if take duelling you get a flat +2 bonus to damage as long as it's your only weapon equipped. seems fun if your party has a front-line fighter or two already
I always thought whips would be a lot of fun with the different combat cantrips like Booming Blade and/or Green-Flame Blade.
so here's a thought: do Vampires in D&D have blood in them still? Or, at any rate, do they count as having enough blood that the Blood Hunter curses can affect them
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Zonugal(He/Him) The Holiday ArmadilloI'm Santa's representative for all the southern states. And Mexico!Registered Userregular
Whip-wielders (like Rogues or even spellcasters with combat-cantrips & whip proficiency) are really good when they can hide behind a tank, because with their reach they can just attack around them at the same enemy.
so here's a thought: do Vampires in D&D have blood in them still? Or, at any rate, do they count as having enough blood that the Blood Hunter curses can affect them
i seem to recall their abilities work on undead, so it should work on vampires.
it does seem kinda neat to try playing a whip blood hunter
you get reach for 2d4 damage with the whip, and you if take duelling you get a flat +2 bonus to damage as long as it's your only weapon equipped. seems fun if your party has a front-line fighter or two already
And at 5th level that becomes 1d4+1d6 damage
definitely feels like you want to stick with 1 weapon or take toughness, that's for sure
Dual wielding is really where the class takes off damage wise.
The ghost hunter in particular is really good for the Belmont sword and whip combo because your self inflicted rite damage is cut in half and does radiant damage and eventually your blood rites work against undead. As well at 7th level all your attacks with even double whip would be 1d4+2d6+dex mod +wis mod damage.
it does seem kinda neat to try playing a whip blood hunter
you get reach for 2d4 damage with the whip, and you if take duelling you get a flat +2 bonus to damage as long as it's your only weapon equipped. seems fun if your party has a front-line fighter or two already
And at 5th level that becomes 1d4+1d6 damage
definitely feels like you want to stick with 1 weapon or take toughness, that's for sure
Dual wielding is really where the class takes off damage wise.
The ghost hunter in particular is really good for the Belmont sword and whip combo because your self inflicted rite damage is cut in half and does radiant damage and eventually your blood rites work against undead. As well at 7th level all your attacks with even double whip would be 1d4+2d6+dex mod +wis mod damage.
alright now I just have to convince @Blake T to let me play a Blood Hunter for the CoS campaign and I'll be happy
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tzeentchlingDoctor of RocksOaklandRegistered Userregular
Are kusarigamas still in 5e? Or similar "length of chain with a weight on one end" weapons? Honestly the flail whip is basically a meteor hammer.
Nope, they pared way back on the number of different weapons in 5e, though like doobh said there's still some weird exceptions. The trident has the same exact stats as a spear but is classified as martial, weighs more and costs waaaay more than the spear.
There's a couple third party supplements that expand on weapons but I'm not too familiar with them.
so here's a thought: do Vampires in D&D have blood in them still? Or, at any rate, do they count as having enough blood that the Blood Hunter curses can affect them
Another thought: could you set up a trap wherein you curse of binding a teammate who is just about to about to get bit by a dracula, which they could willingly fail (under most DMs), and then, since the blood is already cursed, it would incapacitate the vampire without allowing it to make a save. Then you just lug it's stupid, overdressed ass out into the town square and wait for dawn to finish off the job.
regarding weapon proficiencies: taking a feat to get proficiency with the whole martial weapons category or whatever seems like overkill when you just want proficiency with a single weapon type. GM permitting, can't you just train them by finding a teacher and getting them to train you in it between adventures or whatever, like with tool proficiencies?
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StraightziHere we may reign secure, and in my choice,To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered Userregular
edited January 2019
I think D&D would greatly benefit from each class getting X weapon proficiencies, which the player gets to choose
If you really want to you can restrict them, either banning certain classes of weapon outright or making the various levels of weapons cost more or whatever
But just saying like
"The ranger has six weapons that they are proficient in. While these greatly vary between rangers, the most common weapons chosen are the Longbow, the Shortbow, the One-handed Axe, the Hatchet, the Longsword and the Dagger."
I'd much rather drop weapon proficiencies completely and either go with a Dungeon World style "if you're a paladin any weapon in your hands does X damage" or a Gamma World style matrix of basic weapon categories, and you just fit whatever esoteric thing you want to wield into one of those categories.
Also this is probably an appropriate time for that one poster to describe how they made a flamethrower in that one RPG that uses weapon tags or whatever, I can't remember what system it is.
StraightziHere we may reign secure, and in my choice,To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered Userregular
I also think that the way D&D just throws out simple weapons as a category is dismissive of how difficult it can be to actually use a spear or a knife well. Let alone something like a sling, which 90% of us would immediately bonk ourselves in the head with if we were to try to pick one up today.
Simple vs martial vs exotic should refer to their commonality in the world, not how easy they are to use.
I would be inclined to just fudge it and let people take proficiency on whatever implement they have in their vision during character creation, since that's more fun, maybe with caveat of having to come up with some sort of decent backstory hook for why they know how to use this katana or whatever if it's something not commonly used in the local setting.
I think the simple/martial/exotic division is actually more about social class access. Simple weapons are things fantasy medieval european peasants have access to, martial weapons are things fantasy medieval european nobles have access to, exotic weapons are things that neither fantasy medieval european peasants nor nobles would have experience with. Mechanically that's not really how they're used in the game but I think that's the seed of where that system comes from.
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StraightziHere we may reign secure, and in my choice,To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered Userregular
If D&D was a game interested in dealing with the social structure of medieval fantasy, they might still make a lot of sense, but as is, even a second level character is wealthier than half of the merchant class.
And yeah, money doesn't buy everything in a system where we still have aristocrats.
But it buys a fuckin' lot.
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Metzger MeisterIt Gets Worsebefore it gets any better.Registered Userregular
i dislike that i've become this cynical, but they are probably planning on releasing some "armory" type supplement books that flesh that stuff out.
also, one of my Orcs-Named-Ordo was a strength rogue in 3.5! he was called Ordo Leg-Breaker, because that's what he did for the local thieves guild. sometimes, usually the name got him by honestly. big scary orc, big scary name, opens a lot of doors.
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webguy20I spend too much time on the InternetRegistered Userregular
I'd much rather drop weapon proficiencies completely and either go with a Dungeon World style "if you're a paladin any weapon in your hands does X damage" or a Gamma World style matrix of basic weapon categories, and you just fit whatever esoteric thing you want to wield into one of those categories.
Also this is probably an appropriate time for that one poster to describe how they made a flamethrower in that one RPG that uses weapon tags or whatever, I can't remember what system it is.
That was me. It's the defunct Legend system by Rule of Cool. They did make a 1.0 pdf release though and its still downloadable. It's build off to OGL for 3.5.
Weapons do a base 1d6 then you add mods. So the flamethrower gets elemental fire, reach and scything (attack at -4 to adjacent enemies to target) bam flamethrower.
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it's great if you're a small character and not relying on weapon dice via smite, or sneak attack (except rogues need to take a feat for it)
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but at d4? ugh
I just want to make a Blood Hunter Belmot with whip and sword is that so much to ask, WotC?
Blood hunter actually has the ability to make the whip way more useful with crimson rite.
You're also gonna need throwing axes, a cross boomerang, and to carry some alchemist fires.
For a Rogue, you'll still need to pick up proficiency in it (so either a feat or the far more optimal choice of multiclassing), but it's a solid secondary/back-up weapon for them.
would just be cool if they did slightly more damage
I think the only way to improve their damage die is with the Kensai subclass for Monks.
But that is a three-level investment to kick it up to a d6.
Using a whip grants them a reach of fifteen feat in combat.
you get reach for 2d4 damage with the whip, and you if take duelling you get a flat +2 bonus to damage as long as it's your only weapon equipped. seems fun if your party has a front-line fighter or two already
i didn't think about the implications of this until combat started! because i was like "oh shit that sounds like ghostrider fuck yeah mark good character bud."
then shit got wild.
I always thought whips would be a lot of fun with the different combat cantrips like Booming Blade and/or Green-Flame Blade.
Setting: maritime district of a decently-large coastal city. I want this to support fishing industry, shipbuilding, wharves, and associated markets and amenities.
Players: 4-5 new-to-D&D players of 2nd level. To save time I'll be making ~6 precons for them to choose from.
Hook: While sitting down to dinner at a dockside tavern (because where else does a good adventure start?), the PCs' meal is interrupted when another patron begins violently retching and gets chest-burstered. The infested patron will in turn infest 1-2 other patrons and turn them with its first actions, before the party reaches them and the other patrons are able to flee. After they defeat the infested patrons, a Watch Official intent on suppressing spread of this news will admonish them.
Sleuthing: after the initial encounter, PCs will have the opportunity to gather evidence in a variety of ways. I want to come up with at least 4-5 different threads of evidence that could lead them to the infestation's source, a recently-returned ship with a 50-foot long whale in its hold that is incubating a massive host of the responsible creatures. I want to give them a lot of freedom to decide where to seek out evidence. They will notice a larval creature in the fish stew they were *just about* to start eating before the commotion erupted, implicating the maritime marketplace. They could investigate the market and question fishmongers about strange occurrences, where they can learn that similar things have been happening in the past few days and that the news hasn't been spreading widely due to suppression by the City Watch. One vendor might recognize the party from the Hook Event and take them back to show them an infested fish. The party might wander the docks and become barred from passage by dead-eyed longshoremen, conspicuously near a certain set of docks housing the Whaling Vessel. There may also be evidence threads at the harbormaster (Whaling Vessel was a week late on its most recent arrival) and Watch House but I haven't developed what those might be yet.
Dungeoneering: I'll treat the Whaling Vessel and the nearby wharves as a dungeon, with patrolling longshoremen to evade/trick/defeat as they make their way about their investigation. If they scout the (large) ship itself they can search the captain's quarters and navigation table, to discover that the most recent voyage had a different return route than other trips back from the fishing grounds. They might encounter some traps (illusory gangplank, rotten floorboards, loudly-crunching shells strewn under a threshold). As they descend deeper into the Whaling Vessel it will become progressively more infested with a creepy seafloor/cavernous/fungal vibe. Light from luminescent mushrooms will faintly illuminate the lower decks. The 50-foot-long whale (16-20 tons) will be on the lowest deck on a long table, its skin subtly writhing with incubating larvae. The events in town have occurred from individual larvae migrating from this source and infesting fish in the market. Deep in the vessel they may encounter less-humanoid enemies, infested mutated sea life or somesuch.
Nearby the Whaling Vessel, two sources of fuel will be located: a nearby shipyard is sealing a nearly-completed ship with pitch and there are numerous heavy barrels available to be stolen. A whale-oil rendering plant in the district will have barrels of whale oil to steal. The party could steal those fuel barrels and plant them about the whale to burn away the infestation source. Transporting these without attracting attention could be a puzzle for the PCs. I want at least 1-2 more ways of destroying the whale but haven't figured those out yet.
There will be a few things for the PCs to loot on the ship, perhaps bounty in the captain's cabin or below decks as well as a stash of barnacle-encrusted weapons and armor (nonmagical but adds small extra slashing damage). I have a few ideas for broader motives and intrigue but that will depend on how long the session goes, and how interested the PCs are in investigating widely.
wait wait was this in 5e? where the heck is the spiked chain
And at 5th level that becomes 1d4+1d6 damage
definitely feels like you want to stick with 1 weapon or take toughness, that's for sure
oh no, this was 3.5
Martial Weapon
1d10 slashing; heavy, reach, two-handed
Or rather, he had a magic rapier that could turn into a serrated whip, which was badass
Reach finesse weapons are really strong, literally the only downside is the damage. That whip function came in handy a lot, you never know when reach will come in handy, and D8+7 to D4+7 damage isn't a big deal when really it's smiting that's doing the heavy lifting.
I might have to give the whip a try on a swashbuckler build. With sneak attack the low core damage die would be somewhat mitigated. And I love the concept thematically.
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
Untappd ID: Discgolfer1981
more like Guy-vy, mirite?
cuz... Ivy from the Soul Calibur series....
but it still just makes me a bit sad, and makes them really unoptimal for classes without such features
there isn't enough of a finesse weapon variety, the trident is straight-up garbage, are there are a couple instances where it's basically the same weapon twice
which are things that are easy to houserule
but I think it really shows on rogues
they REALLY don't want strength rogues to be a thing and it seems like they go out of their way to enforce it (ranged weapons count, thrown weapons don't unless they have finesse as well RIP axe throwing dwarf rogue)
yet they still get longsword proficiency, which can't even be used for sneak attack! it would make more sense if they started with a different martial weapon proficiency like, say, a goddamn whip
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pretty much what I want is the Morning Star like it is in the Castlevania netflix series
so basically a whip that is actually a chain with a big spiky bit on the end
GREEN FLAME
Teamwork!
i seem to recall their abilities work on undead, so it should work on vampires.
Dual wielding is really where the class takes off damage wise.
The ghost hunter in particular is really good for the Belmont sword and whip combo because your self inflicted rite damage is cut in half and does radiant damage and eventually your blood rites work against undead. As well at 7th level all your attacks with even double whip would be 1d4+2d6+dex mod +wis mod damage.
alright now I just have to convince @Blake T to let me play a Blood Hunter for the CoS campaign and I'll be happy
There's a couple third party supplements that expand on weapons but I'm not too familiar with them.
Another thought: could you set up a trap wherein you curse of binding a teammate who is just about to about to get bit by a dracula, which they could willingly fail (under most DMs), and then, since the blood is already cursed, it would incapacitate the vampire without allowing it to make a save. Then you just lug it's stupid, overdressed ass out into the town square and wait for dawn to finish off the job.
If you really want to you can restrict them, either banning certain classes of weapon outright or making the various levels of weapons cost more or whatever
But just saying like
"The ranger has six weapons that they are proficient in. While these greatly vary between rangers, the most common weapons chosen are the Longbow, the Shortbow, the One-handed Axe, the Hatchet, the Longsword and the Dagger."
Also this is probably an appropriate time for that one poster to describe how they made a flamethrower in that one RPG that uses weapon tags or whatever, I can't remember what system it is.
Simple vs martial vs exotic should refer to their commonality in the world, not how easy they are to use.
I think the simple/martial/exotic division is actually more about social class access. Simple weapons are things fantasy medieval european peasants have access to, martial weapons are things fantasy medieval european nobles have access to, exotic weapons are things that neither fantasy medieval european peasants nor nobles would have experience with. Mechanically that's not really how they're used in the game but I think that's the seed of where that system comes from.
And yeah, money doesn't buy everything in a system where we still have aristocrats.
But it buys a fuckin' lot.
also, one of my Orcs-Named-Ordo was a strength rogue in 3.5! he was called Ordo Leg-Breaker, because that's what he did for the local thieves guild. sometimes, usually the name got him by honestly. big scary orc, big scary name, opens a lot of doors.
That was me. It's the defunct Legend system by Rule of Cool. They did make a 1.0 pdf release though and its still downloadable. It's build off to OGL for 3.5.
Weapons do a base 1d6 then you add mods. So the flamethrower gets elemental fire, reach and scything (attack at -4 to adjacent enemies to target) bam flamethrower.
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
Untappd ID: Discgolfer1981