It's not a moral victory, it's a counter-advertising campaign to fix the damage done by literal decades of tobacco-lobby-backed pro-smoking imagery. "Wolverine should not be emulated" doesn't actually translate to kids not emulating him because he's fuckin' cool and kids will gladly do things that are bad for them if they think it makes them look cool.
Smoking basically shouldn't exist and I'm perfectly fine with media representing that ideal reality.
+20
DepressperadoI just wanted to see you laughingin the pizza rainRegistered Userregular
I can't argue that Logan isn't an incredibly popular, beloved character
But also literally every piece of popular X-Men media goes out of its way to show how much being Wolverine fucking sucks
You get claws and can't die, sure, but you have no memories, everyone you love dies, you're in constant pain and can't wash the blood off your hands no matter how hard you try
And that's just the movie version
That doesn't change the fact that folks still think he is cool, but at that point it is because they are actively ignoring huge chunks of his story and the media itself shouldn't be held accountable for that
I can't argue that Logan isn't an incredibly popular, beloved character
But also literally every piece of popular X-Men media goes out of its way to show how much being Wolverine fucking sucks
You get claws and can't die, sure, but you have no memories, everyone you love dies, you're in constant pain and can't wash the blood off your hands no matter how hard you try
And that's just the movie version
That doesn't change the fact that folks still think he is cool, but at that point it is because they are actively ignoring huge chunks of his story and the media itself shouldn't be held accountable for that
disagree
this is that whole eric cartman argument again
its still south parks fault if people quote his hateful shit at people even though the show says hes bad
instead of Wolverines smoking habit disappearing it might have been better someone had to talk him in to stopping when he started the school. Like no the cigars arnt hurting you Logan but youre gonna be around kids all the time and people have started looking up to you.
+1
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
instead of Wolverines smoking habit disappearing it might have been better someone had to talk him in to stopping when he started the school. Like no the cigars arnt hurting you Logan but youre gonna be around kids all the time and people have started looking up to you.
That is literally th in universe reason for why he stopped smoking.
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
I can't argue that Logan isn't an incredibly popular, beloved character
But also literally every piece of popular X-Men media goes out of its way to show how much being Wolverine fucking sucks
You get claws and can't die, sure, but you have no memories, everyone you love dies, you're in constant pain and can't wash the blood off your hands no matter how hard you try
And that's just the movie version
That doesn't change the fact that folks still think he is cool, but at that point it is because they are actively ignoring huge chunks of his story and the media itself shouldn't be held accountable for that
disagree
this is that whole eric cartman argument again
its still south parks fault if people quote his hateful shit at people even though the show says hes bad
I would say there is a pretty huge difference between a character being a horrible racist, homophobic goblin in a show that is literally all about horrible offensive shit versus Wolverine having a consistently traumatic, painful life that colors every part of his existence and prevents him from being truly happy
instead of Wolverines smoking habit disappearing it might have been better someone had to talk him in to stopping when he started the school. Like no the cigars arnt hurting you Logan but youre gonna be around kids all the time and people have started looking up to you.
That is literally th in universe reason for why he stopped smoking.
I was not aware there was a reason! Nevermind then.
0
Forever Zefirocloaked in the midnight glory of an event horizonRegistered Userregular
instead of Wolverines smoking habit disappearing it might have been better someone had to talk him in to stopping when he started the school. Like no the cigars arnt hurting you Logan but youre gonna be around kids all the time and people have started looking up to you.
That is literally th in universe reason for why he stopped smoking.
Then I don't see what the problem is
I don't see why it's so bad that an incredibly popular and loved character by all ages stopped smoking, especially if it's presented for that reason
I mean, is it such an important character trait that Wolverine is lesser as a character for not smoking? Was it just not handled well?
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I can't argue that Logan isn't an incredibly popular, beloved character
But also literally every piece of popular X-Men media goes out of its way to show how much being Wolverine fucking sucks
You get claws and can't die, sure, but you have no memories, everyone you love dies, you're in constant pain and can't wash the blood off your hands no matter how hard you try
And that's just the movie version
That doesn't change the fact that folks still think he is cool, but at that point it is because they are actively ignoring huge chunks of his story and the media itself shouldn't be held accountable for that
disagree
this is that whole eric cartman argument again
its still south parks fault if people quote his hateful shit at people even though the show says hes bad
I can't argue that Logan isn't an incredibly popular, beloved character
But also literally every piece of popular X-Men media goes out of its way to show how much being Wolverine fucking sucks
You get claws and can't die, sure, but you have no memories, everyone you love dies, you're in constant pain and can't wash the blood off your hands no matter how hard you try
And that's just the movie version
That doesn't change the fact that folks still think he is cool, but at that point it is because they are actively ignoring huge chunks of his story and the media itself shouldn't be held accountable for that
disagree
this is that whole eric cartman argument again
its still south parks fault if people quote his hateful shit at people even though the show says hes bad
I would say there is a pretty huge difference between a character being a horrible racist, homophobic goblin in a show that is literally all about horrible offensive shit versus Wolverine having a consistently traumatic, painful life that colors every part of his existence and prevents him from being truly happy
Not in terms of emulation
Wolverine is cool, so people want to be like him
It doesn't matter that the text of the films is that he's lonely. People still want to be him, because he's extremely appealing
Like, its still a power fantasy. Wolverine hurts, but he cant actually BE hurt and he solves all of his problems by being a super cool badass who stabs bad people to death
Unless you completely change everything about the character until people pity wolverine instead of wanting to be him, people are still gonna want to act like him, including smoking
instead of Wolverines smoking habit disappearing it might have been better someone had to talk him in to stopping when he started the school. Like no the cigars arnt hurting you Logan but youre gonna be around kids all the time and people have started looking up to you.
That is literally th in universe reason for why he stopped smoking.
Then I don't see what the problem is
I don't see why it's so bad that an incredibly popular and loved character by all ages stopped smoking, especially if it's presented for that reason
I mean, is it such an important character trait that Wolverine is lesser as a character for not smoking? Was it just not handled well?
I do not remember there being a reason given at all?
I remember when the decision was made there was a scene where Aunt May threw his cigar in a drink but nothing else
0
Kane Red RobeMaster of MagicArcanusRegistered Userregular
I'm just baffled as to why Wolverine being able to smoke is such an important aspect of his character that it's worth drafting a bunch of arguments against a fairly well-proven anti-smoking campaign strategy.
+6
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
I'm just baffled as to why Wolverine being able to smoke is such an important aspect of his character that it's worth drafting a bunch of arguments against a fairly well-proven anti-smoking campaign strategy.
There are stories where you could argue that it’s important to show Logan’s disdain for living and his desire to just die.
Like in Logan!
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Honestly, even if there wasn't the moral implication, Wolverine is supposed to be cool and smoking ain't cool anymore. My parents were heavy smokers for decades and even they quit over a decade ago.
I remember some sort of article to the effect that while smoking advertising is basically dead the occurrence of diegetic smoking in media is way up and man as someone who flirts with stopping smoking there is a lot of fuckin delicious sensual smoking getting done in media, like I was watching True Detective and Mahershala Ali lit a smoke and cupped it just so and had a toke and leaned back in his chair real slow like he was gettin sucked off it was wild god I want a cigarette
Broke as fuck in the style of the times. Gratitude is all that can return on your generosity.
I can't argue that Logan isn't an incredibly popular, beloved character
But also literally every piece of popular X-Men media goes out of its way to show how much being Wolverine fucking sucks
You get claws and can't die, sure, but you have no memories, everyone you love dies, you're in constant pain and can't wash the blood off your hands no matter how hard you try
And that's just the movie version
That doesn't change the fact that folks still think he is cool, but at that point it is because they are actively ignoring huge chunks of his story and the media itself shouldn't be held accountable for that
disagree
this is that whole eric cartman argument again
its still south parks fault if people quote his hateful shit at people even though the show says hes bad
I would say there is a pretty huge difference between a character being a horrible racist, homophobic goblin in a show that is literally all about horrible offensive shit versus Wolverine having a consistently traumatic, painful life that colors every part of his existence and prevents him from being truly happy
I agree that Wolverine has had a rough life and that his physical, mental, and emotional state is not one that people would want to be in - but I think that recognizing this last bit takes a certain degree of emotional and intellectual maturity, life experience, and introspection that the younger kids might simply not have access to. To me age 34, Wolverine is someone who sees loved ones die by droves, forgets people who were important to him, and so on. To me age 12, he was a bomb-ass action hero who could never get sick (relevant to me as I can catch a cold in a hermetically-sealed room) and never had to hold back when fighting evil because he'd never truly get hurt.
I never thought "Oh man, let's fukken light up because Wolverine does it", but I've had the firm idea that smoking is bad since I was pretty young; I have certainly emulated fictional characters in other respects when I was younger, though.
I'm just baffled as to why Wolverine being able to smoke is such an important aspect of his character that it's worth drafting a bunch of arguments against a fairly well-proven anti-smoking campaign strategy.
There are stories where you could argue that it’s important to show Logan’s disdain for living and his desire to just die.
Like in Logan!
i mean then have him shoot heroin
there are a million ways to portray that that both make being Logan less desirable and also arent as easily emulatable by most kids
I kind of cant believe people are arguing this hard that an avenger needs to smoke
do yall not remember how bad it was when James Bond smoked? How many kids picked it up to look cool?
I'm just baffled as to why Wolverine being able to smoke is such an important aspect of his character that it's worth drafting a bunch of arguments against a fairly well-proven anti-smoking campaign strategy.
There are stories where you could argue that it’s important to show Logan’s disdain for living and his desire to just die.
I knew my entire life that smoking was bad and I always maintained (and sorta still do) that it does look cool though
so it's probably just best to not show it
+4
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
You are never gonna say”oh man, light up because Wolverine does it”
It’s more the culmination of a certain image that you are repeatedly peppered with that hey, this is actually cool. You wanna be cool, right?
It’s the same reason why Coke and Pepsi still advertise in specific ways. So you associate their brand with certain things,not because they need to remind you to drink Coke.
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
You know that's a good point why doesn't Wolverine just fuckin shoot bad brown heroin all the time, an invincible man not shooting heroin is kind of an insult in a way
Broke as fuck in the style of the times. Gratitude is all that can return on your generosity.
Posts
Quentin Quire?
http://lexiconmegatherium.tumblr.com/
Smoking basically shouldn't exist and I'm perfectly fine with media representing that ideal reality.
Quentin uses his psychic abilities to enhance his vape tricks
Second-hand smoke is still a thing.
Which is why Marvel put in him charge of a school full of impressionable young children.
Wolverine is absolutely presented as a heroic standard
He is The Cool Good Guy
hes the coolest good guy
But fucking EVERYONE wants to be wolverine
Every single kid has put three knives between their fingers and pretended to be wolverine
maybe one of the characters that literally everyone wants to be shouldn't be exibiting an easily emulatable habit that kills you
My boyfriend can attest I do this with french fries to this day.
Wolverine is an avenger and he is the coolest and one of the biggest heroes and children love him
He is NOT john constantine
That is a bad comparison
Shatterstar
Make Logan look more like John Constantine instead of getting rid of one of his many bad habits (and ignoring/tacitly approving the rest)
Honestly him binge drinking isn't great either for similar reasons. But unlike smoking, drinking can be fine in moderation if done responsibly.
Jason Todd absolutely vapes, for instance
Vaping feels very in-line with DC's whole tech oeuvre, honestly.
But also literally every piece of popular X-Men media goes out of its way to show how much being Wolverine fucking sucks
You get claws and can't die, sure, but you have no memories, everyone you love dies, you're in constant pain and can't wash the blood off your hands no matter how hard you try
And that's just the movie version
That doesn't change the fact that folks still think he is cool, but at that point it is because they are actively ignoring huge chunks of his story and the media itself shouldn't be held accountable for that
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disagree
this is that whole eric cartman argument again
its still south parks fault if people quote his hateful shit at people even though the show says hes bad
That is literally th in universe reason for why he stopped smoking.
I was not aware there was a reason! Nevermind then.
Then I don't see what the problem is
I don't see why it's so bad that an incredibly popular and loved character by all ages stopped smoking, especially if it's presented for that reason
I mean, is it such an important character trait that Wolverine is lesser as a character for not smoking? Was it just not handled well?
XBL - Foreverender | 3DS FC - 1418 6696 1012 | Steam ID | LoL
Not in terms of emulation
Wolverine is cool, so people want to be like him
It doesn't matter that the text of the films is that he's lonely. People still want to be him, because he's extremely appealing
Like, its still a power fantasy. Wolverine hurts, but he cant actually BE hurt and he solves all of his problems by being a super cool badass who stabs bad people to death
Unless you completely change everything about the character until people pity wolverine instead of wanting to be him, people are still gonna want to act like him, including smoking
I remember when the decision was made there was a scene where Aunt May threw his cigar in a drink but nothing else
I almost put "other than Quentin Quire" in the original post because that fruit was so low hanging
There are stories where you could argue that it’s important to show Logan’s disdain for living and his desire to just die.
Like in Logan!
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I never thought "Oh man, let's fukken light up because Wolverine does it", but I've had the firm idea that smoking is bad since I was pretty young; I have certainly emulated fictional characters in other respects when I was younger, though.
i mean then have him shoot heroin
there are a million ways to portray that that both make being Logan less desirable and also arent as easily emulatable by most kids
I kind of cant believe people are arguing this hard that an avenger needs to smoke
do yall not remember how bad it was when James Bond smoked? How many kids picked it up to look cool?
You can do that without hin smoking.
so it's probably just best to not show it
It’s more the culmination of a certain image that you are repeatedly peppered with that hey, this is actually cool. You wanna be cool, right?
It’s the same reason why Coke and Pepsi still advertise in specific ways. So you associate their brand with certain things,not because they need to remind you to drink Coke.
Please.
This is important.
Do not try to retract the fries back into your hand.
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