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[Book] Thread 20XXAD

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Posts

  • Mojo_JojoMojo_Jojo But do you really believe him? Registered User regular
    knitdan wrote: »
    Sequel? I didn’t get any indication there would be a sequel. It pretty much definitively ended without much in the way of future story hooks IMO.

    I'm sure it's being marketed as the first in a series

    Homogeneous distribution of your varieties of amuse-gueule
  • knitdanknitdan Oh no Too much hunnyRegistered User regular
    edited April 14
    Ok I was curious because like I said as far as I’m concerned the story is over

    This is from an interview the author gave to the San Diego Truibune
    The way the trilogy works is that it’s not a part one, part two, or part three. But each novel is the different eyewitness account. So, it’s as if you have three movies, instead of three sections in the movie. Each person’s testimony is going to be a whole novel.

    This could be interesting in theory, but the first one was so unrelentingly bleak and miserable I’m gonna pass on any “sequels”.

    knitdan on
    “I was quick when I came in here, I’m twice as quick now”
    -Indiana Solo, runner of blades
    skippydumptruck
  • skippydumptruckskippydumptruck and yet it moves Registered User regular
    knitdan wrote: »
    Sequel? I didn’t get any indication there would be a sequel. It pretty much definitively ended without much in the way of future story hooks IMO.

    it's the first part of a trilogy

    it seemed clear to me from the ending that the next book will be
    the same story, with probably an additional 300+ years of backstory, from the moon witch's perspective

  • VanguardVanguard regular A wretched country of duskRegistered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    edited April 14
    knitdan wrote: »
    Started Black Leopard, Red Wolf. It feels almost Gene Wolfian in the way it combines the familiar and the unfamiliar. In the way it makes me feel like I’m missing something, like there’s a grand allegory below the surface that I’m too stupid to understand.

    Or maybe it’s just that it’s set in a culture I’m wholly unfamiliar with.

    just finished the first section and it's totally reminding me of gene wolf too

    hmm I am not sure what to think about this book

    setting it in a fantasy world based on african myths instead of european ones is waaaaaaay up my alley

    the writing style is very interesting, also pretty mythic I think (more of a, this event took place and now this one) and hazy like gene wolf's books that I've read

    there's a lot of graphic sexual violence and slavery and mutilation and assorted other terrible shit going down though, I don't know if I'll be up for the sequel

    it's crazy polarizing in the goodreads reviews, a bunch of people saying they didn't finish it

    I stopped at 250ish and am diving back in

    There a lot more bestiality and general mutilation than I’m generally willing to tolerate

    The writing is, however, very pretty

    “Truth eats lies like an alligator eats the moon” as an example of the surreal, mythical prose

    Vanguard on
    wandering
  • Jealous DevaJealous Deva regular Registered User regular
    edited April 15
    Bogart wrote: »
    Apropos of nothing I am reminded that it's been twenty five years since Clive Barker wrote the second Book of the Art with no conclusion in sight, twenty since the first part of Galilee with no end in sight and half a dozen years since the third of a projected five books of the Abarat. His last book was apparently quite bad and possibly ghostwritten, and honestly it feels like those three stories will never be completed.

    What I'm saying is, GRRM fans: you could have it so much worse.

    I’ve always wondered what it must be like for authors in this situation, because I assume these content droughts are due to them being involved in other projects or just losing interest entirely.

    I had a heavily greenstuffed warhammer orc army I was working on 10 years ago, built out and sculpted everything but only painted 4 or 5 before losing interest due to a variety of other factors. It would be really weird if people were constantly calling/emailing asking when orc 6 was going to be done, or whatever happened to the two headed ogre lord ally I had posted greenstuffs of, or whatever.

    Edit: though it would obviously be a bit different if someone had commissioned the set and had paid me for the first few under the assumption they would be eventually getting a full army which is more the expectation when someone buys a book sold as the first of a trilogy or whatever and the story is unfinished.

    Jealous Deva on
  • BogartBogart Streetwise Hercules Fighting The Rising Odds Registered User, Moderator mod
    With Barker I think it's a mixture of health issues, new projects taking his interest, a wide array of avenues into which he creates stuff (movies, TV, books, paintings, etc) and waning powers, judging from his more recent output. No one wants to write the crappy sequel to a great novel, not even the guy who wrote the great novel.

    V1mBurnage
  • VanguardVanguard regular A wretched country of duskRegistered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    edited April 15
    I personally find it difficult to be creative when I know exactly what's going to happen. I wonder if GRRM is feeling something similar now that he needs to wrap it up (doubly so now that it's one of the most valuable properties in the world).

    Vanguard on
  • BogartBogart Streetwise Hercules Fighting The Rising Odds Registered User, Moderator mod
    I think the slowing down is probably due to lots of things. Age, the increasing complexity of the story that needs to be wrangled, other projects, the freedom to do whatever he wants that all that delicious money would have given him, the TV show outstripping him and blowing some surprises, a very real and relatable desire to frustrate people who treat him like a Game of Thrones content machine, etc.

    Every writer does things a little differently. Some don't send book 1 off to the publisher until they've got book 4 in first draft, some will JJ Abrams it and not think past the end of whatever bit they're currently doing and trust to luck to tie things up later.

  • nexuscrawlernexuscrawler regular Registered User regular
    Finished the Raven tower

    it was interesting but felt like alot of setup for something else

  • nexuscrawlernexuscrawler regular Registered User regular
    Bogart wrote: »
    I think the slowing down is probably due to lots of things. Age, the increasing complexity of the story that needs to be wrangled, other projects, the freedom to do whatever he wants that all that delicious money would have given him, the TV show outstripping him and blowing some surprises, a very real and relatable desire to frustrate people who treat him like a Game of Thrones content machine, etc.

    Every writer does things a little differently. Some don't send book 1 off to the publisher until they've got book 4 in first draft, some will JJ Abrams it and not think past the end of whatever bit they're currently doing and trust to luck to tie things up later.

    He's entitled to write his books however he likes

    I'm also entitled to stop caring after a certain point

    Descendant X
  • BogartBogart Streetwise Hercules Fighting The Rising Odds Registered User, Moderator mod
    He's entitled to write his books however he likes

    Absolutely.

  • BogartBogart Streetwise Hercules Fighting The Rising Odds Registered User, Moderator mod
  • Jealous DevaJealous Deva regular Registered User regular
    1982 says hello, asks if you would please credit when using ideas.

  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Bogart wrote: »
    I think the slowing down is probably due to lots of things. Age, the increasing complexity of the story that needs to be wrangled, other projects, the freedom to do whatever he wants that all that delicious money would have given him, the TV show outstripping him and blowing some surprises, a very real and relatable desire to frustrate people who treat him like a Game of Thrones content machine, etc.

    Every writer does things a little differently. Some don't send book 1 off to the publisher until they've got book 4 in first draft, some will JJ Abrams it and not think past the end of whatever bit they're currently doing and trust to luck to tie things up later.

    Judging from his comments on getting the last two ones out, he at least initially seemed to be having issues with structure within the novel format. Which is actually pretty common for a lot of long-running series of that sort. (Robert Jordan had similar issues)

    As of now, who knows. Maybe he's just gotten frustrated, maybe the hype is so big he thinks he needs to get it perfect, maybe something else. We might even find out eventually.

  • BogartBogart Streetwise Hercules Fighting The Rising Odds Registered User, Moderator mod


    I was kind of expecting it, but that's still a crushing blow. My favourite writer.

    chrono_travellerMahnmutBlackDragon480KanaDizzy D
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Bogart wrote: »


    I was kind of expecting it, but that's still a crushing blow. My favourite writer.

    Well shit.

    Was he sick or something? Or was this just a terminal case of the olds?

  • BlackDragon480BlackDragon480 Bluster Kerfuffle Master of Windy ImportRegistered User regular
    shryke wrote: »
    Bogart wrote: »


    I was kind of expecting it, but that's still a crushing blow. My favourite writer.

    Well shit.

    Was he sick or something? Or was this just a terminal case of the olds?

    The latter.

    He'd been having heart and pulmonary issues the last 3-4 years, but nothing acute or rapid onset, and they finally lost the fight.

    He will be missed, Book of the New Sun was such a revelation for me in high school. Having come off reading Joyce and Dostoyevsky in honors classes, I stumbled upon something in the sci-fi/fantasy space with that depth and gravitas, so rewarding.

    Umberto Eco and now Wolfe, my favorite writers of prose dense enough to be lethal weapons are starting to shuffle off this mortal coil.

    Although with all the allegorical symbolism in Wolfe's oeuvre, I'd love to hear what kinda roundtable him, Tolkein, Lewis, and St. Paul could get into.

    First they came for the Muslims and we said...NOT TODAY MOTHERFUCKERS!
  • BogartBogart Streetwise Hercules Fighting The Rising Odds Registered User, Moderator mod
    I guess I’ll have to re-read this whole pile.

    kyrlddh7iu9z.jpeg

    BlackDragon480chrono_travellershrykewanderingskippydumptruckDizzy Dcredeikiwebguy20Descendant XAresProphetJacobkosh
  • BlackDragon480BlackDragon480 Bluster Kerfuffle Master of Windy ImportRegistered User regular
    Bogart wrote: »
    I guess I’ll have to re-read this whole pile.

    kyrlddh7iu9z.jpeg

    Now that is a tower of power.

    First they came for the Muslims and we said...NOT TODAY MOTHERFUCKERS!
  • BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    Bogart wrote: »

    I want there to just be a page I can go to where its a bunch of quotes from serious literature people explaining how their book isn't dirty sci-fi, just a novel (wasn't even intended as a pun, sorry) look at where the future could go, and how we might deal with it.

    "I will write your name in the ruin of them. I will paint you across history in the color of their blood."

    The Monster Baru Cormorant - Seth Dickinson
  • VanguardVanguard regular A wretched country of duskRegistered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    i have never read gene wolf

    perhaps i should?

    V1mAresProphet
  • DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic regular Registered User regular
    Brody wrote: »
    Bogart wrote: »

    I want there to just be a page I can go to where its a bunch of quotes from serious literature people explaining how their book isn't dirty sci-fi, just a novel (wasn't even intended as a pun, sorry) look at where the future could go, and how we might deal with it.

    Best response to that stupid quote was to point out Mary Shelley's Frankenstein, arguably the very first SF, is all about the responsibilities and rights of a new kind of person. It's not even something the genre has grown into, it is what the genre began with.

    V1mN1tSt4lkerMoridin889webguy20AresProphetJacobkoshA Kobold's Kobold
  • nexuscrawlernexuscrawler regular Registered User regular
    Vanguard wrote: »
    i have never read gene wolf

    perhaps i should?

    He's a tough read but his prose is undeniably some of the best out there. His style is very reminiscent of Joyce.

    BlackDragon480
  • VanguardVanguard regular A wretched country of duskRegistered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    edited April 16
    Vanguard wrote: »
    i have never read gene wolf

    perhaps i should?

    He's a tough read but his prose is undeniably some of the best out there. His style is very reminiscent of Joyce.

    This is probably up my alley then

    One of my most common complaints about fantasy and sci fi is the quality of the writing

    It’s either completely invisible, in which case forgettable

    Or is just plain bad

    Vanguard on
  • BogartBogart Streetwise Hercules Fighting The Rising Odds Registered User, Moderator mod
    If you were going to start reading Wolfe I'd recommend starting with The Fifth Head of Cerberus, Soldier In The Mist or one of his short story collections, probably The Island of Doctor Death and Other Stories and Other Stories.

    The Fifth Head is a science fiction story and a tricksy book about identity.

    Soldier in the Mist is a story about a soldier in ancient Greece with only a short term memory who writes the events of the day on a scroll, reading it anew every morning. The head injury that caused this memory loss also seems to let him see supernatural beings, though he doesn't seem to realise it, and instead casually mentions seeing a man with a club others seem to ignore, etc. This memory loss makes for a nice contrast with the eidetic memory of Severian, the protagonist of the Book of the New Sun. There are two sequels.

    The Book of the New Sun is his most celebrated series, four books and a pendant written later, though the Long Sun and Short Sun series are linked as well. They're fabulous, rich, strange, confusing, complex stories that deepen with every re-reading.

    The Wizard Knight is a duology about lots of stale fantasy ideas (magic swords, ogres, talking animals, dragons) that seem strange and new in his hands.

    Castleview packs the entire Arthurian mythos into a small American town. Pandora, By Holly Hollander is a murder mystery. Free Live Free is a strange tale about losers coming together to answer a mysterious ad. The Castle In The Forest is a bleak fantasy story. There Are Doors is a love story about alternate realities. Peace is maybe his most opaque novel, though I've only read it once, and is about an old man remembering things. He might be dead.

    His later novels are lesser but still labyrinthine in their mysteries, and his short story collections contain magnificent, perfectly polished jewels like The War Beneath The Tree.

    BlackDragon480Tamin
  • Mojo_JojoMojo_Jojo But do you really believe him? Registered User regular
    edited April 16
    Wrong thread.

    Mojo_Jojo on
    Homogeneous distribution of your varieties of amuse-gueule
  • BlackDragon480BlackDragon480 Bluster Kerfuffle Master of Windy ImportRegistered User regular
    Yeah, I normally recommend Solider In the Mist as an intro to Wolfe, it's probably the best distillation of his style without diving into the deep end of the symbolism and reference pool, but still has the depth and felling of fulfillment when you finish.

    First they came for the Muslims and we said...NOT TODAY MOTHERFUCKERS!
    V1m
  • V1mV1m regular Registered User regular
    1982 says hello, asks if you would please credit when using ideas.

    That last sentence tho. I, Robot anyone...?

  • credeikicredeiki regular Registered User regular
    Knowing that I bounced off Book of the New Sun hard, but did not realize that Gene Wolfe had written anything else, what other book of his would you recommend? Would you still say Soldier in the Mist?

    I read the first two books (bundled into one volume, but I think it was two books). I do not remember it well, but what I liked most was the use of language and some of the vivid imagery, like a duel with petals(?) And I believe I most liked the beginning part, before they go on the road.

    I think I did not like the plot, characters, or plot obfuscation. I probably least liked the part that takes place in a prison with a person that maybe comes from some other reality(?)

    I think I should try him again though, since he's so well regarded and does have this reputation of being intensely literary, which seems like it should be my jam.

    Steam, LoL: credeiki
    air-photos.tumblr.com
  • BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    I just finished reading Accelerando and man that was a weird book. Normally I find all the deep space super interesting, but with it being set as sort of tangential to the rest of what the book was exploring, the few times the author dropped big space words I had a really hard time figuring out what was going on. Otherwise I thought it was a really interesting book, and an interesting new look at the existential threats to baseline humans.

    "I will write your name in the ruin of them. I will paint you across history in the color of their blood."

    The Monster Baru Cormorant - Seth Dickinson
    credeikiskippydumptruck
  • BogartBogart Streetwise Hercules Fighting The Rising Odds Registered User, Moderator mod
    credeiki wrote: »
    Knowing that I bounced off Book of the New Sun hard, but did not realize that Gene Wolfe had written anything else, what other book of his would you recommend? Would you still say Soldier in the Mist?

    I read the first two books (bundled into one volume, but I think it was two books). I do not remember it well, but what I liked most was the use of language and some of the vivid imagery, like a duel with petals(?) And I believe I most liked the beginning part, before they go on the road.

    I think I did not like the plot, characters, or plot obfuscation. I probably least liked the part that takes place in a prison with a person that maybe comes from some other reality(?)

    I think I should try him again though, since he's so well regarded and does have this reputation of being intensely literary, which seems like it should be my jam.

    He's written at least three dozen novels and short story collections. The complex plots never really go away no matter what the book is. Some things are there to be seen on a re-read or puzzled out via clues.

    The most accessible Wolfe stories are probably the Fifth Head (though it's still complex and has one of his very best hidden twists) and the Soldier in the Mist (though again it's not simple and a smattering of classical/mythological knowldege is a help).

    credeikiBlackDragon480
  • Jealous DevaJealous Deva regular Registered User regular
    edited April 16
    V1m wrote: »
    1982 says hello, asks if you would please credit when using ideas.

    That last sentence tho. I, Robot anyone...?

    Yeah, I was thinking Blade Runner as a big pop culture example (because he basically just summarized the main plot and it is a huge pop cultural touchstone), but there are works on basically the same theme dating back literal hundreds of years at this point.

    Jealous Deva on
    V1m
  • V1mV1m regular Registered User regular
    Bogart wrote: »
    credeiki wrote: »
    Knowing that I bounced off Book of the New Sun hard, but did not realize that Gene Wolfe had written anything else, what other book of his would you recommend? Would you still say Soldier in the Mist?

    I read the first two books (bundled into one volume, but I think it was two books). I do not remember it well, but what I liked most was the use of language and some of the vivid imagery, like a duel with petals(?) And I believe I most liked the beginning part, before they go on the road.

    I think I did not like the plot, characters, or plot obfuscation. I probably least liked the part that takes place in a prison with a person that maybe comes from some other reality(?)

    I think I should try him again though, since he's so well regarded and does have this reputation of being intensely literary, which seems like it should be my jam.

    He's written at least three dozen novels and short story collections. The complex plots never really go away no matter what the book is. Some things are there to be seen on a re-read or puzzled out via clues.

    The most accessible Wolfe stories are probably the Fifth Head (though it's still complex and has one of his very best hidden twists) and the Soldier in the Mist (though again it's not simple and a smattering of classical/mythological knowldege is a help).

    to clarify: Fifth Head is about 30% hidden twists by weight, but ofc they can't all be the best.

  • BogartBogart Streetwise Hercules Fighting The Rising Odds Registered User, Moderator mod
    Well I guess now I have something to talk to Patton Oswalt about.

    chrono_travellerBlackDragon480tapeslinger
  • descdesc the '87 stick up kids Registered User regular
    So I am not a big sci fi guy really l, but I got the audiobook version of the Area X trilogy to listen to while commuting.

    I don’t really have any brilliant insights into it, but I liked it overall, especially the first book. It actually reminded me a bit of 2001, in that you have these emotionally reserved scientist types encountering this mind-altering situation. I’m also a sucker for weird and mysterious settings that are allowed to stay a bit nebulous.

    I was surprised at how negative the reviews were on goodreads and amazon — people really can’t figure out the characters’ personalities?

    Anyway, as a palate cleanser that requires less attention while driving i’m now letting down the entire book thread by listening to schlocky tough guy Steven Konoly books.

    Meanwhile my pile of nonfiction hard copy books looms ...

  • BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    desc wrote: »
    So I am not a big sci fi guy really l, but I got the audiobook version of the Area X trilogy to listen to while commuting.

    I don’t really have any brilliant insights into it, but I liked it overall, especially the first book. It actually reminded me a bit of 2001, in that you have these emotionally reserved scientist types encountering this mind-altering situation. I’m also a sucker for weird and mysterious settings that are allowed to stay a bit nebulous.

    I was surprised at how negative the reviews were on goodreads and amazon — people really can’t figure out the characters’ personalities?

    Anyway, as a palate cleanser that requires less attention while driving i’m now letting down the entire book thread by listening to schlocky tough guy Steven Konoly books.

    Meanwhile my pile of nonfiction hard copy books looms ...

    If you liked that bit, you should try The City and The City.

    "I will write your name in the ruin of them. I will paint you across history in the color of their blood."

    The Monster Baru Cormorant - Seth Dickinson
    m!ttensSummaryJudgmentAresProphetV1mQuid
  • Mojo_JojoMojo_Jojo But do you really believe him? Registered User regular
    desc wrote: »
    So I am not a big sci fi guy really l, but I got the audiobook version of the Area X trilogy to listen to while commuting.

    I don’t really have any brilliant insights into it, but I liked it overall, especially the first book. It actually reminded me a bit of 2001, in that you have these emotionally reserved scientist types encountering this mind-altering situation. I’m also a sucker for weird and mysterious settings that are allowed to stay a bit nebulous.

    I was surprised at how negative the reviews were on goodreads and amazon — people really can’t figure out the characters’ personalities?

    Anyway, as a palate cleanser that requires less attention while driving i’m now letting down the entire book thread by listening to schlocky tough guy Steven Konoly books.

    Meanwhile my pile of nonfiction hard copy books looms ...

    You might get on okay with The Vorrh then. It does something similar, but far less competently.

    Homogeneous distribution of your varieties of amuse-gueule
  • SummaryJudgmentSummaryJudgment Today we will paint a mountain that owes us nothing. Registered User regular
    Brody wrote: »
    desc wrote: »
    So I am not a big sci fi guy really l, but I got the audiobook version of the Area X trilogy to listen to while commuting.

    I don’t really have any brilliant insights into it, but I liked it overall, especially the first book. It actually reminded me a bit of 2001, in that you have these emotionally reserved scientist types encountering this mind-altering situation. I’m also a sucker for weird and mysterious settings that are allowed to stay a bit nebulous.

    I was surprised at how negative the reviews were on goodreads and amazon — people really can’t figure out the characters’ personalities?

    Anyway, as a palate cleanser that requires less attention while driving i’m now letting down the entire book thread by listening to schlocky tough guy Steven Konoly books.

    Meanwhile my pile of nonfiction hard copy books looms ...

    If you liked that bit, you should try The City and The City.

    Awww yes

    Desc you may like that

    tERiPJd.jpg
  • knitdanknitdan Oh no Too much hunnyRegistered User regular
    Mojo I am giggling at “hey you might like this other book that does the same thing but badly”

    “I was quick when I came in here, I’m twice as quick now”
    -Indiana Solo, runner of blades
    credeiki
  • BogartBogart Streetwise Hercules Fighting The Rising Odds Registered User, Moderator mod
    Robert Irwin’s history of the Alhambra. He is entertainingly rude about other writers and critics and makes a decent fist of things.

This discussion has been closed.