Gaming is definitely a big deal because of this annoying thing called "HUD and UI elements"--just like if you rely on a particular news channel, a particular app (Netflix is a well-known culprit), if you play a lot of particular game you will risk OLED burn-in. Whether it's better or worse than a news ticker depends on your own habits.
Alright, thanks guys. I went to actually look at TVs and now I need to get an OLED. Maybe it was just the stores setup but the LGs were so pretty. Like I found them noticeably better than the other UHD screens.
In the case of OLEDs, is LG basically the only name in town? From what I saw there, the only model that fits 55" (max size I can go with my wall), is the C9 basically it?
Either the LG or the Sony A9F or A9G. The only difference between the two models is the A9F has a dumb stand that also makes the TV a bit thicker when trying to wall mount it, the A9G has a regular disc shaped thingy as a mount so the TV doesn't lean back. Yes, the A9F leans back. It's dumb and bad.
I personally really like the Sony version and I have the A8F at home. But both TVs look fantastic, and the LG is usually on a much deeper sale. Between the two, the Sony has a faster processor so some of the things you watch might look better, but you probably won't see a difference. They both use the same LG panels.
Two cautions with OLED TVs, though. If you watch a lot of news I would not get one. Burn in is a real thing, I've junked out more than a few TVs after months of MSNBC/Fox News watching from people who didn't know better. Gaming might not be as big a deal, but I'm honestly not sure about that. The other caution is that they don't do well in bright rooms at all. If you can't make the room pretty dark, go a different route because you won't really be able to see the TV.
Model bullshit:
I said the stand was dumb but still like the stand? Yeah, they changed how the model numbers work between 2018-2019.
A1E - 2018 model year OLED with the dumb kickstand that is bad.
A8F - 2018 model without the dumb kickstand and is therefore good.
A9F - 2019, Has the dumb kickstand, TV model numbers are confusing.
A9G - 2019, No kickstand, yay!
How do you feel it compares to plasma burn-in? About the same? Not as bad? For example, I have a 2010 Panasonic Viera that I never had any burn-in issues with so I'm curious.
I got a C8 65" LG and I fucking love it. It's so above any other tv I have I feel like a crazy person gushing about it so much.
The burn-in I don't think is as bad as people say, there are a lot of features to mitigate it and reading the Rtings testing of burn-in it doesn't seem bad.
EDIT: It just looks soooo god damn good. Playing Anthem on it was amazing, the games colors really pop. My SO who doesn't play any games would walk by the tv, stop and say just how beautiful it was. I was kinda shocked.
The one downside, is the blacks are so black in some games it is hard to see stuff, but Windows 10 has a setting for SDR content which helps with that. I actually find it more immersive but to each there own. GTA 5 at night was hilarious as I would actually use the high beams on the cars and Destiny 2 looks amazing on it but they have a lot of dark spaces.
Alright, thanks guys. I went to actually look at TVs and now I need to get an OLED. Maybe it was just the stores setup but the LGs were so pretty. Like I found them noticeably better than the other UHD screens.
You went and looked at the OLEDs right next to Sony/Samsung LCDs in the Magnolia room, didn't you? Been there, done that. Crossed the Sony X900F/X950G off the list of TVs to consider as a result.
I did eventually buy an LCD, because 10" bigger and 30%+ less, but I made sure to get one with truly GOOD blacks, albeit not quite up to OLED. I do enough gaming and keep my TVs long enough that the burn-in scared me away.
In the case of OLEDs, is LG basically the only name in town? From what I saw there, the only model that fits 55" (max size I can go with my wall), is the C9 basically it?
Sony options have already been covered. In LG land, there's also last year's sets, the B8/C8/E8, which are probably going to be much more reasonable than the C9 right now, and don't give up much in picture quality.
I did eventually buy an LCD, because 10" bigger and 30%+ less, but I made sure to get one with truly GOOD blacks, albeit not quite up to OLED. I do enough gaming and keep my TVs long enough that the burn-in scared me away.
My Samsung QLED has blacks that are, after calibration, genuinely indistinguishable from from the TV being off in my rather dark living room (and I have actually gotten confused by the two because of my damnable power cycling issue).
On that note, my last two Geek Squad appointments replaced the main board and changed the serial numbers respectively, which led to problems turning on from a long period of rest before reintroducing the power cycling issues again. At this point, Geek Squad is increasingly suggesting that I'm going to have to replace the one part of the TV that hasn't been swapped, the actual panel (in other words, replacing the whole TV). Huh.
Still, the picture is gorgeous and it has Freesync with Xbox One X. So there's that.
Synthesis on
0
ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
I did eventually buy an LCD, because 10" bigger and 30%+ less, but I made sure to get one with truly GOOD blacks, albeit not quite up to OLED. I do enough gaming and keep my TVs long enough that the burn-in scared me away.
My Samsung QLED has blacks that are, after calibration, genuinely indistinguishable from from the TV being off in my rather dark living room (and I have actually gotten confused by the two because of my damnable power cycling issue).
On that note, my last two Geek Squad appointments replaced the main board and changed the serial numbers respectively, which led to problems turning on from a long period of rest before reintroducing the power cycling issues again. At this point, Geek Squad is increasingly suggesting that I'm going to have to replace the one part of the TV that hasn't been swapped, the actual panel (in other words, replacing the whole TV). Huh.
Still, the picture is gorgeous and it has Freesync with Xbox One X. So there's that.
:bigfrown:
I think I mentioned it before but I was worried about a short in the panel. What a pain in the ass.
I did eventually buy an LCD, because 10" bigger and 30%+ less, but I made sure to get one with truly GOOD blacks, albeit not quite up to OLED. I do enough gaming and keep my TVs long enough that the burn-in scared me away.
My Samsung QLED has blacks that are, after calibration, genuinely indistinguishable from from the TV being off in my rather dark living room (and I have actually gotten confused by the two because of my damnable power cycling issue).
On that note, my last two Geek Squad appointments replaced the main board and changed the serial numbers respectively, which led to problems turning on from a long period of rest before reintroducing the power cycling issues again. At this point, Geek Squad is increasingly suggesting that I'm going to have to replace the one part of the TV that hasn't been swapped, the actual panel (in other words, replacing the whole TV). Huh.
Still, the picture is gorgeous and it has Freesync with Xbox One X. So there's that.
:bigfrown:
I think I mentioned it before but I was worried about a short in the panel. What a pain in the ass.
It is, though perhaps not as bad as that. I'm fairly certain that once they authorize the replacement, as Geek Squad is increasingly certain needs to be the case, they will be obligated to actually collect the unit and move the replacement (installing it on my third floor apartment with the help of a friend wasn't easy, but it was easier than my previous 65" Vizio-M).
Mostly, if it comes to that (which is probably the best I can hope for), I'm worried about dead pixels. I went through 3 Vizio-M sets because I got one without any dead pixel spots (basically a tiny dark patch that wouldn't light up). UHD panels improved since then, and on top of that Samsung's LED panels were built to more exacting specifications than Vizio's, which is pretty reasonable--my first QLED had zero such pixels on delivery, to be sure I looked for them. The panel just went bad half a year later, unlike the Vizio.
Not looking forward to buying a new protection plan for the replacement.
0
ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
How long ago did you get the TV? If the agents are dealing with Samsung, you should still be under manufacturer warranty, which means they replace the panel. Like.. the screen. It's a pain in the ass, but it's doable. The only company we don't do panel replacements for is Sony.
What I'm saying is you shouldn't expend your plan for this. You should still be under coverage. But don't quote me, I don't have all the details obviously.
How long ago did you get the TV? If the agents are dealing with Samsung, you should still be under manufacturer warranty, which means they replace the panel. Like.. the screen. It's a pain in the ass, but it's doable. The only company we don't do panel replacements for is Sony.
What I'm saying is you shouldn't expend your plan for this. You should still be under coverage. But don't quote me, I don't have all the details obviously.
I guess I haven't shared that. I took delivery of it in January--and I had 3 Samsung Care visits before I gave up when they announced they wouldn't move further without me actually capturing the power cycling on video, so then I went to Geek Squad. I don't care what anyone says, I'll buy the protection plan on every large TV I ever purchase, because I've used every one of them.
That being said, I'd like you to be right. Geek Squad, by their own explanation, is following Samsung protocols (and their replacement parts came from Samsung, shipped to me and not them)--so even if the new panel (i.e. new TV) comes from Best Buy, it should be under Samsung's replacement plans. The situation is convoluted enough that I might not have to buy a new protection plan (itself a couple hundred bucks), but I might have to. When I first contacted Geek Squad, they noted that it might be possible to get a replacement immediately without following the Samsung-defined replacement policies, but I'd definitely need to buy a new protection plan then (unless I declined protection, which would sound unwise). Maybe not now.
As exasperating as this whole thing is, Geek Squad's been sympathetic (and I've been sympathetic to them). The TV is usable in the meantime, something is just wrong, so I just needed to wait it out. Last visit, it seems like I might've out-waited Geek Squad at this point, since they were now talking about total replacement.
(And imperfections in the panel itself would be immediately noticeable, and terms for rejection of the replacement, I assume.)
0
ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
How long ago did you get the TV? If the agents are dealing with Samsung, you should still be under manufacturer warranty, which means they replace the panel. Like.. the screen. It's a pain in the ass, but it's doable. The only company we don't do panel replacements for is Sony.
What I'm saying is you shouldn't expend your plan for this. You should still be under coverage. But don't quote me, I don't have all the details obviously.
I guess I haven't shared that. I took delivery of it in January--and I had 3 Samsung Care visits before I gave up when they announced they wouldn't move further without me actually capturing the power cycling on video, so then I went to Geek Squad. I don't care what anyone says, I'll buy the protection plan on every large TV I ever purchase, because I've used every one of them.
That being said, I'd like you to be right. Geek Squad, by their own explanation, is following Samsung protocols (and their replacement parts came from Samsung, shipped to me and not them)--so even if the new panel (i.e. new TV) comes from Best Buy, it should be under Samsung's replacement plans. The situation is convoluted enough that I might not have to buy a new protection plan (itself a couple hundred bucks), but I might have to. When I first contacted Geek Squad, they noted that it might be possible to get a replacement immediately without following the Samsung-defined replacement policies, but I'd definitely need to buy a new protection plan then (unless I declined protection, which would sound unwise). Maybe not now.
As exasperating as this whole thing is, Geek Squad's been sympathetic (and I've been sympathetic to them). The TV is usable in the meantime, something is just wrong, so I just needed to wait it out. Last visit, it seems like I might've out-waited Geek Squad at this point, since they were now talking about total replacement.
(And imperfections in the panel itself would be immediately noticeable, and terms for rejection of the replacement, I assume.)
They would. Dead pixels are rare these days, but take a good look at the image after replacement. Sometimes QLED sets have a more pronounced ghosting problem with uniform images.
Yeah, on top of that, I sort of assume it'll be a refurbished set (though I suppose as long as it's newer than January, I'll be coming out ahead) rather than a new one. I'm a little more comfortable with the concept of a "used" LED TV then a used OLED TV for obvious reasons, but still...well, what can you do. Eternal vigilance means always having a protection plan, etc.
0
ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
Yeah, on top of that, I sort of assume it'll be a refurbished set (though I suppose as long as it's newer than January, I'll be coming out ahead) rather than a new one. I'm a little more comfortable with the concept of a "used" LED TV then a used OLED TV for obvious reasons, but still...well, what can you do. Eternal vigilance means always having a protection plan, etc.
Again though, unless they just wash their hands of the TV, you'd likely be getting a new panel. That's literally just the glass, bezel, backlights, and TCON. The other parts get removed from your old TV and put in the new panel, and even the back cover moves over. It's a ridiculous waste of time but lol Samsung.
Yeah, on top of that, I sort of assume it'll be a refurbished set (though I suppose as long as it's newer than January, I'll be coming out ahead) rather than a new one. I'm a little more comfortable with the concept of a "used" LED TV then a used OLED TV for obvious reasons, but still...well, what can you do. Eternal vigilance means always having a protection plan, etc.
Again though, unless they just wash their hands of the TV, you'd likely be getting a new panel. That's literally just the glass, bezel, backlights, and TCON. The other parts get removed from your old TV and put in the new panel, and even the back cover moves over. It's a ridiculous waste of time but lol Samsung.
According to Geek Squad, they don't do that (and it would be Geek Squad handling it, even if they follow Samsung protocol). In their words, it's +90% of the television, and thus more labor than it's worth.
(Though that's just what they've said so far.)
0
ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
Yeah, on top of that, I sort of assume it'll be a refurbished set (though I suppose as long as it's newer than January, I'll be coming out ahead) rather than a new one. I'm a little more comfortable with the concept of a "used" LED TV then a used OLED TV for obvious reasons, but still...well, what can you do. Eternal vigilance means always having a protection plan, etc.
Again though, unless they just wash their hands of the TV, you'd likely be getting a new panel. That's literally just the glass, bezel, backlights, and TCON. The other parts get removed from your old TV and put in the new panel, and even the back cover moves over. It's a ridiculous waste of time but lol Samsung.
According to Geek Squad, they don't do that (and it would be Geek Squad handling it, even if they follow Samsung protocol). In their words, it's +90% of the television, and thus more labor than it's worth.
(Though that's just what they've said so far.)
Yeah, for the TVs under the Geek Squad Protection that's true (but also about to change, fuck fuck fuck). But under manufacturer (which even with GSP, we're collecting from the manufacturer) we still replace panels on LG and Samsung TVs.
Yeah, on top of that, I sort of assume it'll be a refurbished set (though I suppose as long as it's newer than January, I'll be coming out ahead) rather than a new one. I'm a little more comfortable with the concept of a "used" LED TV then a used OLED TV for obvious reasons, but still...well, what can you do. Eternal vigilance means always having a protection plan, etc.
Again though, unless they just wash their hands of the TV, you'd likely be getting a new panel. That's literally just the glass, bezel, backlights, and TCON. The other parts get removed from your old TV and put in the new panel, and even the back cover moves over. It's a ridiculous waste of time but lol Samsung.
According to Geek Squad, they don't do that (and it would be Geek Squad handling it, even if they follow Samsung protocol). In their words, it's +90% of the television, and thus more labor than it's worth.
(Though that's just what they've said so far.)
Yeah, for the TVs under the Geek Squad Protection that's true (but also about to change, fuck fuck fuck). But under manufacturer (which even with GSP, we're collecting from the manufacturer) we still replace panels on LG and Samsung TVs.
Yeah, I gotta stay on top of policy at this rate. Considering I've had to fix an LG TV, and a Vizo TV, that's not going to change. But for this one, I'll be getting a full swap....so here's hoping the other unit's good.
We're looking to upgrade or TV in the living room (currently have a 50in plasma from....2011; I actually thought it was older...) and I'd like a big bump in size for various reasons.
My hesitation, besides some reports of screen quality with bad banding on some sets, is because of a few issues where the TV will be.
First is I'm terrified of burn-in. I got burnin on the TV we currently have almost immediately despite doing everything I could find to "baby" the set and prep it to avoid it. Panasonic was less than helpful, refused to even look at it, and made me swear them off as a company on any future purchases. There's rarely things going on the TV that would cause burn-in (though, that didn't stop my old TV from getting it, nothing was ever left on the screen staticly, it was clearly a bad set), it'll mostly used for playing games and streaming shows, but we don't ever leave our TV on if we're not actively using it.
The second thing is that just due to the way our living room is set up, the TV will be facing a large set of windows. I've already come to grips with needing to close the blinds if we ever use our TV during the day (we typically don't; but if I'm upgrading to a 4k TV I might gift myself a PS4 pro or something, and I'm home during the day), but the less reflective the better. Alternately, and I'm not sure how possible this is because I haven't really kept up on TV tech in the last decade; but are modern TV's powerful enough to be viewable even if they have a semi-decent amount of light coming on them? I'm thinking about my cellphone; my phone a few years ago if I tried to look at it in direct sunlight...nope, but my new phone (pixel 3 xl) is viewable even in direct sunlight. It's not ideal, but it is perfectly usable, whereas in the past phones were absolutely not. Has this carried over to TV's at all?
The third thing is I'm fairly picky. I've been pretty impressed with a lot of 4k screens, up and down the price range, when I see them at costco or wherever. I know that the settings they have for them in the stores are not ideal (let alone if someone has a non-4k feed going to them :rotate: ), but at home and over time, I'm concerned that little things are going to bother me. For example, if the backlighting isn't uniform and has light bleeding from the edges that'll bug me. If there's significant banding it'll bug me. Fortunately my wife and kids couldn't possibly care less, and fortunately, most of the screens I've looked at in stores don't seem to have these issues, but again, I know their settings aren't typical, and little things might pop out in home use.
Aside from that, unless the screen is a super high end oled ultra mega, it seems on passing glance that the range of quality is pretty narrow (and high), even if the price ranges are pretty large.
So I'm wondering if anyone has a better suggestion than that TCL within something resembling the same price. It seems like it's hard to beat, but I'm willing to pay a bit more if it's worth it. Or if they have better anti-glare stuff or more reliable panels.
Also I suppose any suggestions for a blu-ray/ultra hd player to go with it.
ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
You're not going to find a better TV in the 75" range unless you're spending a ton more money. TCL makes a great TV. When you get it home and set it up, check it over to make sure the panel is good. Don't watch those goofy screen uniformity test videos because you will find something wrong even on the best panels.
Modern LED TVs will never get burn in. It's just not a thing on LED. OLED is a problem, but that's way out of the budget you're talking about here. Don't sweat it, you'll be fine.
As for the windows, yeah, most TVs are bright enough for the windows to not be a big deal. Again, OLED are problematic because they're so much darker, so you really need to black out those windows while you're watching TV. Probably no worries with most LEDs though. I would wall mount the TV on a good tilt mount, though, if only because you can tilt the screen down toward you and eliminate a huge portion of the glare that might be present. Don't buy shitty mounts!
If you're looking for a UHDBD player, it's going to depend on your needs. I almost always point to Sony for these. For most people, I'd go with the UBPX700 since it supports Dolby Vision and is pretty affordable as UHD players go. If, at some point in the future, you're planning on doing an Atmos setup, you should step up to the X800M2. That has the separate HDMI output for audio which is necessary since Atmos can't be passed over optical or ARC.
Thanks for the thoughts and recommendation for player.
And yeah, I'd go by sight on the banding. The reviews are so overwhelmingly good that the ones that even have pictures of the banding, I've got to figure, are likely outliers still. Normal bias in that sort of thing where people inclined to review are either super satisfied, do it rotely, or are (sometimes legitimately) angry. How obvious some of the pictures banding are is what concerned me, but I've got to keep in mind that even if the banding is bad on their sets, poor photography/lighting can amplify that sort of thing well past even what the average viewer would even notice in normal conditions.
We've just got to decide if we think there's a chance that it'll have a discount enough to warrant a wait, till black friday, or to just go ahead now. We got a notice from Amazon that they're not supporting our blu-ray player anymore after the end of Sept, with the Prime Video app, and we use that constantly. Between that and the kids wanting to play Minecraft on the Switch with us and trying to do splitscreen at 50in gives me too much of a headache to play with them, we've been kind of pushed into upgrading, when we might have otherwise just kept on with our old burned-in plasma for some time.
And we'd definitely wall mount it. Where it'd be located is an awkward spot where one corner will be "floating" over a staircase, but it's where it'd have to be; it'd still do that even if it wasn't mounted, and with kids running up and down the stairs, if there's even a small risk that it'd accidentally be tipped over...yeah, no. this is the mount I was looking at. Does that seem good enough?
EDIT: What do most folks do with their players/consoles when they mount their screens? Do you still keep the stands and use them for that, or do people have more compact solutions? If I mounted the TV I'd just assume mount our soundbar under it to get it out of the way, but we'd still need somewhere to put the player and Switch, but I don't think we need the big stand we currently have. EDIT2: And yeah, at some point when we finish our basement, TV and everything is going to go down there and a real sound setup is going to be installed; we want our upstairs living room to eventually be TV-less and it isn't set up at all, layout wise, for an actual surround setup. I just don't know that it'll be soon-ish enough to bother getting the better player now when it'd likely be minimum a few years before it'd be an issue. EDIT3: Since the TV has all the "smart" functions, I don't need a player with them. Our current TV does have apps, but it doesn't have wifi, so it never gets used for that. We use chromecast, but it's a hassle for Prime Video (in fact frequently doesn't work, which is obnoxious).
ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
That mount would be fine. I don't love it, but because of my job I'm partial to Sanus mounts. On the plus side with that mount, it accommodates 16-24" stud bays which a lot of the inexpensive mounts don't do. So ultimately, yeah it'll work fine.
I kept all of my components in the cabinet below the TV. The SNES classic, PS4, Blu-ray, and switch are all down there, as is the soundbar. If you want to make it look clean, get some in wall rated HDMI cables to run inside the wall down to the components.
Every player is a smart player, just like the TVs are. When you look at doing an Atmos setup you'll be using your BD player as your streaming device because the TV won't send that Atmos signal over ARC.
I agree with most everything Shadowfire has said, it's good advice. The only difference of opinion I have is that you may want to seriously consider using the TV as your main streaming device, since the TCLs have basically a Roku Ultra built-in. They're very good at that. The Atmos available over streaming is limited to the lossy DD+ version of it, which will pass over ARC as long as your AVR/soundbar can decode DD+.
Real disc-based Atmos (or even the non-Atmos lossless surround formats) will not pass over ARC, so you'll want some provision to directly connect the UHD player and your sound system by HDMI for those.
+1
ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
I meant to mention, if you have a soundbar and are mounting the TV on a full motion mount, using a soundbar mount that attaches to the TV mount is a nice bonus. Then when you point the TV in a different direction, the soundbar travels with it.
AbsoluteZeroThe new film by Quentin KoopantinoRegistered Userregular
Owning an OLED (LG C7 65") for over a year now had kindof un-sold me on OLED. It was a great TV at first and I haven't had any burn-in issues. That said, the HDR just isn't nearly as bright as newer LCD/LED sets. It pops, sure, but not nearly as much as it should. The big issue though is panel uniformity. There was a very slight gradient when the set was new, but you couldn't see it while viewing content. But it has gotten more and more pronounced as the panel has aged. There is now a line straight down the center of the screen that is visible at all times, the screen is brighter to the left of it and dimmer to the right. The pixel refresher function does not affect it. I'm now wishing I had held off on OLED for a few years to let the tech mature a bit more. It is really a crapshoot if you are going to get a good panel that lasts you a long time. I would say if you buy a new OLED and see any uniformity issues whatsoever, no matter how slight, return that sucker and get a new panel.
0
Donovan PuppyfuckerA dagger in the dark isworth a thousand swords in the morningRegistered Userregular
How long is the warranty on that tv? Because that sounds very much like something that should get a new tv mailed out to you.
+3
ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
LG won't touch it, I'll bet. But if you have an extended warranty I would consider that a bad panel and get a replacement.
Yeah, I've had the B7 in the 55" for about a year and a half now, and I still find myself marveling at the picture at times. Yours sounds flat out faulty.
Edit: I also don't understand the lack of brightness people talk about, because during some scenes I've found myself having to squint at the screen.
McFodder on
Switch Friend Code: SW-3944-9431-0318
PSN / Xbox / NNID: Fodder185
0
ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
Yeah, I've had the B7 in the 55" for about a year and a half now, and I still find myself marveling at the picture at times. Yours sounds flat out faulty.
Edit: I also don't understand the lack of brightness people talk about, because during some scenes I've found myself having to squint at the screen.
OLED TVs can get difficult to see darker images on, especially if the room is too bright. They just aren't as bright as other LED panels. Though I will say that you should turn off the light sensor in the TV. Any TV. All of them. They're garbage.
Yeah, I've had the B7 in the 55" for about a year and a half now, and I still find myself marveling at the picture at times. Yours sounds flat out faulty.
Edit: I also don't understand the lack of brightness people talk about, because during some scenes I've found myself having to squint at the screen.
OLED TVs can get difficult to see darker images on, especially if the room is too bright. They just aren't as bright as other LED panels. Though I will say that you should turn off the light sensor in the TV. Any TV. All of them. They're garbage.
This affects HDR implementation, if you give a shit about that sort of thing (or for that matter, actually have devices that display HDR, like current generation video game consoles or a UHD player), aside from the built-in playing software. HDR10/Dolby HDR will be much more potent, with a much higher peak nit brightness.
Of course, not all HDR implementation is actually good (as I've been saying for years)--it's not like high resolutions, but more like color direction.
Yeah, I've had the B7 in the 55" for about a year and a half now, and I still find myself marveling at the picture at times. Yours sounds flat out faulty.
Edit: I also don't understand the lack of brightness people talk about, because during some scenes I've found myself having to squint at the screen.
It is so very dependent on viewing environment and ambient room lighting, that's why. The amount of light that makes you wince and squint in a dark room is a small fraction of what it takes to do so in a fully lit room, or even worse one bathed in daylight.
In a dark room, 400 nits is literally painful. Hell, 200 nits will probably dazzle you. Yet those light outputs are barely adequate and disappointingly low, respectively, by today's HDR standards.
I have an LCD that can hit 600 nits, max (like most OLEDS) and its HDR is spectacular. In the room where I watch such things, mostly at night, without lots of lights turned on.
On that topic, a few weeks ago Amazon had a discount on cheap but surprisingly well-rated (+4.5/5) ambient lighting strips with Bluetooth compatibility.
I thought, for $8, even if I was disappointing throwing it away wouldn't mean much. In the meantime, my Samsung QLED's panel got replaced (yes, the panel, which amounts to more than 80% of the television and accordingly came new in a box the same size as the television's original box) as part of my troubleshooting. In retrospect, I paid nothing and unnecessary labor aside, Samsung and others are apparently more diligent about inspecting replacement panels than random completed units off the assembly line, so there's that
In any case, I used the sticking backing and plastic fasteners to stick it to the back (along the top, left and right--it's not long enough to reach the bottom, but that's a nonissue) and plugged it into my nearby modem's USB port.
For $8, the affect is surprisingly pleasant, if you're watching an LED panel in complete darkness (assuming I remember to turn it on). The Samsung QLEDs are known for their eye-burning HDR capabilities, even at the Q6-class, and once properly calibrated it's pretty stunning stuff. It's less of an issue with console gaming, but I host a few viewing parties for watching old anime back when Sunrise and other companies weren't afraid of exposing their viewers seizure-induces flashes of light, so I think the lighting strip helps.
It also has a bunch of absurd color options, but I ignore those.
+1
ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
In the meantime, my Samsung QLED's panel got replaced (yes, the panel, which amounts to more than 80% of the television and accordingly came new in a box the same size as the television's original box) as part of my troubleshooting. In retrospect, I paid nothing and unnecessary labor aside, Samsung and others are apparently more diligent about inspecting replacement panels than random completed units off the assembly line, so there's that
Yeah I hate swapping panels. It's not hard, take the boards, cables, and speakers out of the old TV, throw them on the new one, put the back panel on, log into the service menu, change the serial number of the panel...
None of it is hard, but it's time consuming and it costs so much money! Just swap out the TV and harvest the good parts at the warehouse!
In the meantime, my Samsung QLED's panel got replaced (yes, the panel, which amounts to more than 80% of the television and accordingly came new in a box the same size as the television's original box) as part of my troubleshooting. In retrospect, I paid nothing and unnecessary labor aside, Samsung and others are apparently more diligent about inspecting replacement panels than random completed units off the assembly line, so there's that
Yeah I hate swapping panels. It's not hard, take the boards, cables, and speakers out of the old TV, throw them on the new one, put the back panel on, log into the service menu, change the serial number of the panel...
None of it is hard, but it's time consuming and it costs so much money! Just swap out the TV and harvest the good parts at the warehouse!
Funny enough, if we're taking Geek Squad at their word, the panel has basically failed Best Buy's quality checks and will be junked. To their credit, they were notably less careful with it than they were with the replacement panel. Now I'm just watching to see what happens with it, if anything.
Yeah I have a 65 C8 and im surprised to hear about the HDR thing...mine actually hurts my eyes sometimes
Technically, HDR implementation can still be unpleasant even if it isn't "super bright"....that just means it isn't done...well? Or perhaps you have a particularly dark viewing environment, or your eyes are possibly sensitive to this? It's not an exact science.
0
ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
In the meantime, my Samsung QLED's panel got replaced (yes, the panel, which amounts to more than 80% of the television and accordingly came new in a box the same size as the television's original box) as part of my troubleshooting. In retrospect, I paid nothing and unnecessary labor aside, Samsung and others are apparently more diligent about inspecting replacement panels than random completed units off the assembly line, so there's that
Yeah I hate swapping panels. It's not hard, take the boards, cables, and speakers out of the old TV, throw them on the new one, put the back panel on, log into the service menu, change the serial number of the panel...
None of it is hard, but it's time consuming and it costs so much money! Just swap out the TV and harvest the good parts at the warehouse!
Funny enough, if we're taking Geek Squad at their word, the panel has basically failed Best Buy's quality checks and will be junked. To their credit, they were notably less careful with it than they were with the replacement panel. Now I'm just watching to see what happens with it, if anything.
We don't repair panels. If it fails usually there's a short in the wiring somewhere and tracing every lead to find the short then repairing it is so time consuming that it's just not worth doing.
Shadowfire Do you have a wall mount that you'd suggest? Still thinking about the LG OLED C9 if the type of tv matters. Thanks!
I will never not sing the praises of Sanus mounts. They have a tilt mount that works very well and keeps the TV pretty close to the wall. If you want just a little side to side play, the advanced tilt is perfect and it's only like $20 more. That's the one I have, mostly because it is easy to pull the TV out like 3-4 inches to plug stuff in. They also make a full motion mount that is pretty expensive ($250-300 depending on sales at the time) that is also fantastic and, unlike a lot of full motion mounts, it moves really easily.
Now you'll see that Sanus mounts are quite a bit more expensive than most brands. The reason I prefer them is that they have a 30" wall bracket that the TV hangs on. This means that whether your studs are 16" or 24" you'll still be able to safely mount the TV. And, because the TV hangs from the bracket, centering the TV exactly where you want it is easy. A lot of the time the cheap mounts end up leaving your TV a couple inches away from where you really want it. Don't cheap out on a mount.
In the meantime, my Samsung QLED's panel got replaced (yes, the panel, which amounts to more than 80% of the television and accordingly came new in a box the same size as the television's original box) as part of my troubleshooting. In retrospect, I paid nothing and unnecessary labor aside, Samsung and others are apparently more diligent about inspecting replacement panels than random completed units off the assembly line, so there's that
Yeah I hate swapping panels. It's not hard, take the boards, cables, and speakers out of the old TV, throw them on the new one, put the back panel on, log into the service menu, change the serial number of the panel...
None of it is hard, but it's time consuming and it costs so much money! Just swap out the TV and harvest the good parts at the warehouse!
Funny enough, if we're taking Geek Squad at their word, the panel has basically failed Best Buy's quality checks and will be junked. To their credit, they were notably less careful with it than they were with the replacement panel. Now I'm just watching to see what happens with it, if anything.
We don't repair panels. If it fails usually there's a short in the wiring somewhere and tracing every lead to find the short then repairing it is so time consuming that it's just not worth doing.
Well, the TV's power cycled at least twice (possibly three times) since the panel replacement on Saturday. Ouch. I'd be worried about the outlet, if nothing else connected to that same surge protector was ever power cycling.
Looks like this story isn't over.
0
ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
You get used to this sort of thing, it's going to happen to someone after all. Maybe it's the cable.
0
ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
At this point, what's left? Did they swap the WiFi board? That part I don't remember. Otherwise the little interface button, the speakers, LVDS cable...
There is no wifi board separate of the main board. Funny you mention that--earlier this week I had a power cycle, but since it was reproducible (tied to trying to connect to Wifi caused a freeze and restart--hiding my SSID for my 2.4ghz network which shares a name with my 5ghz network solved it) I wasn't worried.
Then it just happened out of no where, which is the long-term issue.
No idea what happens now. I don't think Geek Squad necessary knows either--we were all hoping replacing the panel would be it. Probably replace some smaller components not attache to the big three? Rule out the actual power cable? Unlike Samsung, they've never asked me to connect it directly to the wall or otherwise bypass my APS.
Posts
The same cautionary measures apply.
How do you feel it compares to plasma burn-in? About the same? Not as bad? For example, I have a 2010 Panasonic Viera that I never had any burn-in issues with so I'm curious.
I got a C8 65" LG and I fucking love it. It's so above any other tv I have I feel like a crazy person gushing about it so much.
The burn-in I don't think is as bad as people say, there are a lot of features to mitigate it and reading the Rtings testing of burn-in it doesn't seem bad.
https://www.rtings.com/tv/learn/real-life-oled-burn-in-test
EDIT: It just looks soooo god damn good. Playing Anthem on it was amazing, the games colors really pop. My SO who doesn't play any games would walk by the tv, stop and say just how beautiful it was. I was kinda shocked.
The one downside, is the blacks are so black in some games it is hard to see stuff, but Windows 10 has a setting for SDR content which helps with that. I actually find it more immersive but to each there own. GTA 5 at night was hilarious as I would actually use the high beams on the cars and Destiny 2 looks amazing on it but they have a lot of dark spaces.
I did eventually buy an LCD, because 10" bigger and 30%+ less, but I made sure to get one with truly GOOD blacks, albeit not quite up to OLED. I do enough gaming and keep my TVs long enough that the burn-in scared me away.
Sony options have already been covered. In LG land, there's also last year's sets, the B8/C8/E8, which are probably going to be much more reasonable than the C9 right now, and don't give up much in picture quality.
My Samsung QLED has blacks that are, after calibration, genuinely indistinguishable from from the TV being off in my rather dark living room (and I have actually gotten confused by the two because of my damnable power cycling issue).
On that note, my last two Geek Squad appointments replaced the main board and changed the serial numbers respectively, which led to problems turning on from a long period of rest before reintroducing the power cycling issues again. At this point, Geek Squad is increasingly suggesting that I'm going to have to replace the one part of the TV that hasn't been swapped, the actual panel (in other words, replacing the whole TV). Huh.
Still, the picture is gorgeous and it has Freesync with Xbox One X. So there's that.
:bigfrown:
I think I mentioned it before but I was worried about a short in the panel. What a pain in the ass.
It is, though perhaps not as bad as that. I'm fairly certain that once they authorize the replacement, as Geek Squad is increasingly certain needs to be the case, they will be obligated to actually collect the unit and move the replacement (installing it on my third floor apartment with the help of a friend wasn't easy, but it was easier than my previous 65" Vizio-M).
Mostly, if it comes to that (which is probably the best I can hope for), I'm worried about dead pixels. I went through 3 Vizio-M sets because I got one without any dead pixel spots (basically a tiny dark patch that wouldn't light up). UHD panels improved since then, and on top of that Samsung's LED panels were built to more exacting specifications than Vizio's, which is pretty reasonable--my first QLED had zero such pixels on delivery, to be sure I looked for them. The panel just went bad half a year later, unlike the Vizio.
Not looking forward to buying a new protection plan for the replacement.
What I'm saying is you shouldn't expend your plan for this. You should still be under coverage. But don't quote me, I don't have all the details obviously.
I guess I haven't shared that. I took delivery of it in January--and I had 3 Samsung Care visits before I gave up when they announced they wouldn't move further without me actually capturing the power cycling on video, so then I went to Geek Squad. I don't care what anyone says, I'll buy the protection plan on every large TV I ever purchase, because I've used every one of them.
That being said, I'd like you to be right. Geek Squad, by their own explanation, is following Samsung protocols (and their replacement parts came from Samsung, shipped to me and not them)--so even if the new panel (i.e. new TV) comes from Best Buy, it should be under Samsung's replacement plans. The situation is convoluted enough that I might not have to buy a new protection plan (itself a couple hundred bucks), but I might have to. When I first contacted Geek Squad, they noted that it might be possible to get a replacement immediately without following the Samsung-defined replacement policies, but I'd definitely need to buy a new protection plan then (unless I declined protection, which would sound unwise). Maybe not now.
As exasperating as this whole thing is, Geek Squad's been sympathetic (and I've been sympathetic to them). The TV is usable in the meantime, something is just wrong, so I just needed to wait it out. Last visit, it seems like I might've out-waited Geek Squad at this point, since they were now talking about total replacement.
(And imperfections in the panel itself would be immediately noticeable, and terms for rejection of the replacement, I assume.)
They would. Dead pixels are rare these days, but take a good look at the image after replacement. Sometimes QLED sets have a more pronounced ghosting problem with uniform images.
Again though, unless they just wash their hands of the TV, you'd likely be getting a new panel. That's literally just the glass, bezel, backlights, and TCON. The other parts get removed from your old TV and put in the new panel, and even the back cover moves over. It's a ridiculous waste of time but lol Samsung.
According to Geek Squad, they don't do that (and it would be Geek Squad handling it, even if they follow Samsung protocol). In their words, it's +90% of the television, and thus more labor than it's worth.
(Though that's just what they've said so far.)
Yeah, for the TVs under the Geek Squad Protection that's true (but also about to change, fuck fuck fuck). But under manufacturer (which even with GSP, we're collecting from the manufacturer) we still replace panels on LG and Samsung TVs.
Yeah, I gotta stay on top of policy at this rate. Considering I've had to fix an LG TV, and a Vizo TV, that's not going to change. But for this one, I'll be getting a full swap....so here's hoping the other unit's good.
I've been looking at https://smile.amazon.com/TCL-75R617-75-Inch-Ultra-Smart/dp/B07M8D8JDK as it generally has good reviews and for the size and features, the price is pretty good.
My hesitation, besides some reports of screen quality with bad banding on some sets, is because of a few issues where the TV will be.
First is I'm terrified of burn-in. I got burnin on the TV we currently have almost immediately despite doing everything I could find to "baby" the set and prep it to avoid it. Panasonic was less than helpful, refused to even look at it, and made me swear them off as a company on any future purchases. There's rarely things going on the TV that would cause burn-in (though, that didn't stop my old TV from getting it, nothing was ever left on the screen staticly, it was clearly a bad set), it'll mostly used for playing games and streaming shows, but we don't ever leave our TV on if we're not actively using it.
The second thing is that just due to the way our living room is set up, the TV will be facing a large set of windows. I've already come to grips with needing to close the blinds if we ever use our TV during the day (we typically don't; but if I'm upgrading to a 4k TV I might gift myself a PS4 pro or something, and I'm home during the day), but the less reflective the better. Alternately, and I'm not sure how possible this is because I haven't really kept up on TV tech in the last decade; but are modern TV's powerful enough to be viewable even if they have a semi-decent amount of light coming on them? I'm thinking about my cellphone; my phone a few years ago if I tried to look at it in direct sunlight...nope, but my new phone (pixel 3 xl) is viewable even in direct sunlight. It's not ideal, but it is perfectly usable, whereas in the past phones were absolutely not. Has this carried over to TV's at all?
The third thing is I'm fairly picky. I've been pretty impressed with a lot of 4k screens, up and down the price range, when I see them at costco or wherever. I know that the settings they have for them in the stores are not ideal (let alone if someone has a non-4k feed going to them :rotate: ), but at home and over time, I'm concerned that little things are going to bother me. For example, if the backlighting isn't uniform and has light bleeding from the edges that'll bug me. If there's significant banding it'll bug me. Fortunately my wife and kids couldn't possibly care less, and fortunately, most of the screens I've looked at in stores don't seem to have these issues, but again, I know their settings aren't typical, and little things might pop out in home use.
Aside from that, unless the screen is a super high end oled ultra mega, it seems on passing glance that the range of quality is pretty narrow (and high), even if the price ranges are pretty large.
So I'm wondering if anyone has a better suggestion than that TCL within something resembling the same price. It seems like it's hard to beat, but I'm willing to pay a bit more if it's worth it. Or if they have better anti-glare stuff or more reliable panels.
Also I suppose any suggestions for a blu-ray/ultra hd player to go with it.
Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand
Modern LED TVs will never get burn in. It's just not a thing on LED. OLED is a problem, but that's way out of the budget you're talking about here. Don't sweat it, you'll be fine.
As for the windows, yeah, most TVs are bright enough for the windows to not be a big deal. Again, OLED are problematic because they're so much darker, so you really need to black out those windows while you're watching TV. Probably no worries with most LEDs though. I would wall mount the TV on a good tilt mount, though, if only because you can tilt the screen down toward you and eliminate a huge portion of the glare that might be present. Don't buy shitty mounts!
If you're looking for a UHDBD player, it's going to depend on your needs. I almost always point to Sony for these. For most people, I'd go with the UBPX700 since it supports Dolby Vision and is pretty affordable as UHD players go. If, at some point in the future, you're planning on doing an Atmos setup, you should step up to the X800M2. That has the separate HDMI output for audio which is necessary since Atmos can't be passed over optical or ARC.
And yeah, I'd go by sight on the banding. The reviews are so overwhelmingly good that the ones that even have pictures of the banding, I've got to figure, are likely outliers still. Normal bias in that sort of thing where people inclined to review are either super satisfied, do it rotely, or are (sometimes legitimately) angry. How obvious some of the pictures banding are is what concerned me, but I've got to keep in mind that even if the banding is bad on their sets, poor photography/lighting can amplify that sort of thing well past even what the average viewer would even notice in normal conditions.
We've just got to decide if we think there's a chance that it'll have a discount enough to warrant a wait, till black friday, or to just go ahead now. We got a notice from Amazon that they're not supporting our blu-ray player anymore after the end of Sept, with the Prime Video app, and we use that constantly. Between that and the kids wanting to play Minecraft on the Switch with us and trying to do splitscreen at 50in gives me too much of a headache to play with them, we've been kind of pushed into upgrading, when we might have otherwise just kept on with our old burned-in plasma for some time.
And we'd definitely wall mount it. Where it'd be located is an awkward spot where one corner will be "floating" over a staircase, but it's where it'd have to be; it'd still do that even if it wasn't mounted, and with kids running up and down the stairs, if there's even a small risk that it'd accidentally be tipped over...yeah, no. this is the mount I was looking at. Does that seem good enough?
EDIT: What do most folks do with their players/consoles when they mount their screens? Do you still keep the stands and use them for that, or do people have more compact solutions? If I mounted the TV I'd just assume mount our soundbar under it to get it out of the way, but we'd still need somewhere to put the player and Switch, but I don't think we need the big stand we currently have. EDIT2: And yeah, at some point when we finish our basement, TV and everything is going to go down there and a real sound setup is going to be installed; we want our upstairs living room to eventually be TV-less and it isn't set up at all, layout wise, for an actual surround setup. I just don't know that it'll be soon-ish enough to bother getting the better player now when it'd likely be minimum a few years before it'd be an issue. EDIT3: Since the TV has all the "smart" functions, I don't need a player with them. Our current TV does have apps, but it doesn't have wifi, so it never gets used for that. We use chromecast, but it's a hassle for Prime Video (in fact frequently doesn't work, which is obnoxious).
Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand
I kept all of my components in the cabinet below the TV. The SNES classic, PS4, Blu-ray, and switch are all down there, as is the soundbar. If you want to make it look clean, get some in wall rated HDMI cables to run inside the wall down to the components.
Every player is a smart player, just like the TVs are. When you look at doing an Atmos setup you'll be using your BD player as your streaming device because the TV won't send that Atmos signal over ARC.
Real disc-based Atmos (or even the non-Atmos lossless surround formats) will not pass over ARC, so you'll want some provision to directly connect the UHD player and your sound system by HDMI for those.
Edit: I also don't understand the lack of brightness people talk about, because during some scenes I've found myself having to squint at the screen.
PSN / Xbox / NNID: Fodder185
OLED TVs can get difficult to see darker images on, especially if the room is too bright. They just aren't as bright as other LED panels. Though I will say that you should turn off the light sensor in the TV. Any TV. All of them. They're garbage.
This affects HDR implementation, if you give a shit about that sort of thing (or for that matter, actually have devices that display HDR, like current generation video game consoles or a UHD player), aside from the built-in playing software. HDR10/Dolby HDR will be much more potent, with a much higher peak nit brightness.
Of course, not all HDR implementation is actually good (as I've been saying for years)--it's not like high resolutions, but more like color direction.
In a dark room, 400 nits is literally painful. Hell, 200 nits will probably dazzle you. Yet those light outputs are barely adequate and disappointingly low, respectively, by today's HDR standards.
I have an LCD that can hit 600 nits, max (like most OLEDS) and its HDR is spectacular. In the room where I watch such things, mostly at night, without lots of lights turned on.
I thought, for $8, even if I was disappointing throwing it away wouldn't mean much. In the meantime, my Samsung QLED's panel got replaced (yes, the panel, which amounts to more than 80% of the television and accordingly came new in a box the same size as the television's original box) as part of my troubleshooting. In retrospect, I paid nothing and unnecessary labor aside, Samsung and others are apparently more diligent about inspecting replacement panels than random completed units off the assembly line, so there's that
In any case, I used the sticking backing and plastic fasteners to stick it to the back (along the top, left and right--it's not long enough to reach the bottom, but that's a nonissue) and plugged it into my nearby modem's USB port.
For $8, the affect is surprisingly pleasant, if you're watching an LED panel in complete darkness (assuming I remember to turn it on). The Samsung QLEDs are known for their eye-burning HDR capabilities, even at the Q6-class, and once properly calibrated it's pretty stunning stuff. It's less of an issue with console gaming, but I host a few viewing parties for watching old anime back when Sunrise and other companies weren't afraid of exposing their viewers seizure-induces flashes of light, so I think the lighting strip helps.
It also has a bunch of absurd color options, but I ignore those.
Yeah I hate swapping panels. It's not hard, take the boards, cables, and speakers out of the old TV, throw them on the new one, put the back panel on, log into the service menu, change the serial number of the panel...
None of it is hard, but it's time consuming and it costs so much money! Just swap out the TV and harvest the good parts at the warehouse!
Funny enough, if we're taking Geek Squad at their word, the panel has basically failed Best Buy's quality checks and will be junked. To their credit, they were notably less careful with it than they were with the replacement panel. Now I'm just watching to see what happens with it, if anything.
Technically, HDR implementation can still be unpleasant even if it isn't "super bright"....that just means it isn't done...well? Or perhaps you have a particularly dark viewing environment, or your eyes are possibly sensitive to this? It's not an exact science.
We don't repair panels. If it fails usually there's a short in the wiring somewhere and tracing every lead to find the short then repairing it is so time consuming that it's just not worth doing.
I will never not sing the praises of Sanus mounts. They have a tilt mount that works very well and keeps the TV pretty close to the wall. If you want just a little side to side play, the advanced tilt is perfect and it's only like $20 more. That's the one I have, mostly because it is easy to pull the TV out like 3-4 inches to plug stuff in. They also make a full motion mount that is pretty expensive ($250-300 depending on sales at the time) that is also fantastic and, unlike a lot of full motion mounts, it moves really easily.
Now you'll see that Sanus mounts are quite a bit more expensive than most brands. The reason I prefer them is that they have a 30" wall bracket that the TV hangs on. This means that whether your studs are 16" or 24" you'll still be able to safely mount the TV. And, because the TV hangs from the bracket, centering the TV exactly where you want it is easy. A lot of the time the cheap mounts end up leaving your TV a couple inches away from where you really want it. Don't cheap out on a mount.
Well, the TV's power cycled at least twice (possibly three times) since the panel replacement on Saturday. Ouch. I'd be worried about the outlet, if nothing else connected to that same surge protector was ever power cycling.
Looks like this story isn't over.
What a shitshow, sorry you're dealing with it.
Then it just happened out of no where, which is the long-term issue.
No idea what happens now. I don't think Geek Squad necessary knows either--we were all hoping replacing the panel would be it. Probably replace some smaller components not attache to the big three? Rule out the actual power cable? Unlike Samsung, they've never asked me to connect it directly to the wall or otherwise bypass my APS.