This is unrelated to the Rose talk and should not be interpreted as a defense of her very poor treatment of Spinel but I found it interesting how...
Well, ok Spinel is kinda an extremely toxic person. I find it interesting that an insistent chunk of the fan base is of treating her completely the victim. Her desperate appeals to force Steven to fight her were extremely...
This is unrelated to the Rose talk and should not be interpreted as a defense of her very poor treatment of Spinel but I found it interesting how...
Well, ok Spinel is kinda an extremely toxic person. I find interesting insistent a chunk of the fan base is on treating her completely the victim. Her desperate appeals to force Steven to fight her were extremely...
Well, they gave me some flashbacks is all.
Most of the show is toxic, abusive relationships.
At the start if the series, Pearl and Amethyst abused each other constantly, and both lived in constant fear if Garnet, while everyone hid things from Steven, and Lars treated Steven and Sadie like garbage, and Sadie allowed the treatment of Steven. And then it gets worse.
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FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
It's worth keeping in mind the song at the end of the show, which is likely Rose singing about Greg and how she recognizes her deep flaws.
There's also Rose's essentially offing herself to create Steven, which could be rather easily read in a dark, dark way.
As for the movie, Spinel is arguably less abused than Lapis, who was outright enslaved, and multiple gems *knew about her*, while Rose may have forgotten Spinel due to war.
The song is basically almost every relationship in the series, some make it positive, some make it negative.
Jasper was a loyal soldier deceived by her own Diamond, was kept prisoner in an abusive relationship by Lapis, and tried to fulfill her mission afterward, falling into bad relationships and contracting a fusion STD.
Yeah, she treated Amethyst like garbage, and that's not okay, but she's not irredeemable.
That read involving lapis only works if you ignore all of the implied power that Jasper had over Lapis in that scene. The metaphor is of the way that people in abusive relationships will turn their abuser towards them rather than let their abuser hurt others.
I'm being slightly facetious for effect. Like most things in SU, it's complicated.
Like, Alone at Sea has Lapis admitting that she took out her anger on Jasper and abused her, and it was unhealthy, while also having Jasper acting like a bully and doing the "I've changed!" thing to try and get her back. Lapis and Jasper were awful for and to one another, as Lapis straight up admits in that scene. The abuse wasn't a one-way street.
I'm disappointed that there was no Jasper in the movie. Was she in a background shot anywhere? Her character arc is, like, one of the only things I'd still like to see concluded if another season happens.
It's worth keeping in mind the song at the end of the show, which is likely Rose singing about Greg and how she recognizes her deep flaws.
There's also Rose's essentially offing herself to create Steven, which could be rather easily read in a dark, dark way.
As for the movie, Spinel is arguably less abused than Lapis, who was outright enslaved, and multiple gems *knew about her*, while Rose may have forgotten Spinel due to war.
Honestly I doubt rose even grasped how literally spinel would take her orders until it was far too late. She takes a very long time to realize pearl can never really love her in an equal way.
Gems are pretty consistently shown to be incredibly slow to learn or comprehend without Steven.
Which makes sense, they live for thousands and thousands of years and are from a rigid, hierarchical society.
It's human beings that really throw a wrench in the works when it comes to that, being organic and able to grow and change and etc.
Which is, of course, why I believe that Greg is secretly the most important character in the show.
Golden YakBurnished BovineThe sunny beaches of CanadaRegistered Userregular
It would be neat for further seasons to also expand on the universe of the show a bit more too.
I mean, if all gems are artificial, who created the first ones? Do they all spring ultimately from White Diamond? Is she a naturally occurring being, or was she created also? And by who, for what reason?
I mean, I guess the time skip in the movie probably makes it less likely that there's some creators behind the gems though, since I'm sure in 2 years of establishing galactic peace it would have come up. But it's always been in the back of my mind since the first season. The gems were producing massive amounts of soldiers and powerful weapons - was it always to subdue other worlds and expand the empire, or was there something else?
This is unrelated to the Rose talk and should not be interpreted as a defense of her very poor treatment of Spinel but I found it interesting how...
Well, ok Spinel is kinda an extremely toxic person. I find it interesting that an insistent chunk of the fan base is of treating her completely the victim. Her desperate appeals to force Steven to fight her were extremely...
Well, they gave me some flashbacks is all.
Rebecca says as much in an interview. Spinal is meant to be a toxic influence on everyone. Herself included
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Did any of the characters ever go to a therapist, given every single one of them is in desperate need of one?
That’s kind of the subtext of the whole show? There are no psychiatrists for gems, so they have to learn healthier ways of dealing with themselves and their feelings. The show itself is like gem therapy.
Though it would’ve been at least cute to have an episode where Steven convinces the crystal gems to go see an actual therapist together.
Did any of the characters ever go to a therapist, given every single one of them is in desperate need of one?
That’s kind of the subtext of the whole show? There are no psychiatrists for gems, so they have to learn healthier ways of dealing with themselves and their feelings. The show itself is like gem therapy.
Though it would’ve been at least cute to have an episode where Steven convinces the crystal gems to go see an actual therapist together.
That would be a hilarious episode.
Just got to watch through the movie, and loved it. The music was great. As was Steg.
Did any of the characters ever go to a therapist, given every single one of them is in desperate need of one?
That’s kind of the subtext of the whole show? There are no psychiatrists for gems, so they have to learn healthier ways of dealing with themselves and their feelings. The show itself is like gem therapy.
Though it would’ve been at least cute to have an episode where Steven convinces the crystal gems to go see an actual therapist together.
It kind of feels like it would be the responsible way to end the show, honestly. Nobody, rock or no, should go through all of those traumas without talking to a professional - tearful children should not bear the emotional labor burden of a pack of abused and abusive adults.
Did any of the characters ever go to a therapist, given every single one of them is in desperate need of one?
That’s kind of the subtext of the whole show? There are no psychiatrists for gems, so they have to learn healthier ways of dealing with themselves and their feelings. The show itself is like gem therapy.
Though it would’ve been at least cute to have an episode where Steven convinces the crystal gems to go see an actual therapist together.
It kind of feels like it would be the responsible way to end the show, honestly. Nobody, rock or no, should go through all of those traumas without talking to a professional - tearful children should not bear the emotional labor burden of a pack of abused and abusive adults.
Agreed, I think explicitly addressing in some manner that it’s good to seek the help of a professional for these sorts of problems would be a good message.
Did any of the characters ever go to a therapist, given every single one of them is in desperate need of one?
That’s kind of the subtext of the whole show? There are no psychiatrists for gems, so they have to learn healthier ways of dealing with themselves and their feelings. The show itself is like gem therapy.
Though it would’ve been at least cute to have an episode where Steven convinces the crystal gems to go see an actual therapist together.
It kind of feels like it would be the responsible way to end the show, honestly. Nobody, rock or no, should go through all of those traumas without talking to a professional - tearful children should not bear the emotional labor burden of a pack of abused and abusive adults.
I dont think ethically a psychologist could treat a gem. Theyre minds are similar to humans but their culture is not. Steven is the closest thing they have right now.
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ApogeeLancks In Every Game EverRegistered Userregular
Blah, hard pass. I've never cared for WWE or the like and all the wrestling episodes were pretty 'blah' to me.
That said, Laser Light Canon is IMO a great intro - it's near the start, so you don't miss much, introduces a lot of the characters, and firmly establishes the 'there is a lot going on you don't understand' motif the show does so well.
Blah, hard pass. I've never cared for WWE or the like and all the wrestling episodes were pretty 'blah' to me.
That said, Laser Light Canon is IMO a great intro - it's near the start, so you don't miss much, introduces a lot of the characters, and firmly establishes the 'there is a lot going on you don't understand' motif the show does so well.
I can't stand that one either, but honestly it captures the feeling of most of the show very very well.
That's kind of why Amethyst gets pissed off later on, because he really shouldn't have to be.
When I think about it, Steven is probably one of my favorite characters in media. Which is saying a lot, because at the start of the show I couldn't stand him, and was watching it for the gems. Dude goes through so much development.
That's kind of why Amethyst gets pissed off later on, because he really shouldn't have to be.
When I think about it, Steven is probably one of my favorite characters in media. Which is saying a lot, because at the start of the show I couldn't stand him, and was watching it for the gems. Dude goes through so much development.
Yeah, and I love that the whole plot of the movie is just to highlight that. He starts out as completely dependent on the other gems and then grows to become the thing holding all of them together, proving them right to have had faith in him.
Steven is a traumatized child. It's really gross to imply that it's a child's role to fix things for all the adults.
The gems aren't really adults. They're aliens brought up in a dystopian society with limited human contact and no real pressure to emotionally grow, given that they're basically immortal. I haven't watched the movie, but I do know that humans and gems with the most human contact quickly realize the unfair situation that Steven is in.
Marty: The future, it's where you're going? Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
Steven is a traumatized child. It's really gross to imply that it's a child's role to fix things for all the adults.
The lyrics in the first song of the movie state Steven is "always putting others first". He's always going out of his way to try and help people, both Gem and human.
In the case of Spinel he's even trying to help someone who wants to murder him, which he can only do thanks to his powers completely negating her attacks.
Steven is a traumatized child. It's really gross to imply that it's a child's role to fix things for all the adults.
The lyrics in the first song of the movie state Steven is "always putting others first". He's always going out of his way to try and help people, both Gem and human.
In the case of Spinel he's even trying to help someone who wants to murder him, which he can only do thanks to his powers completely negating her attacks.
Yeah. He never gets to be his own person, despite barely having started puberty. At this point he's everyone's parent. He gets less choice about his future than some of the gems.
Steven is a traumatized child. It's really gross to imply that it's a child's role to fix things for all the adults.
It's not his role. That's why Amethyst was right to get pissed.
I can't find the interview right now, but Rebecca Sugar commented on how Steven chooses to try and get through to Spinel instead of fighting back against her. According to Sugar, Steven's way of doing things isn't necessarily good, but it's his way.
I found that interesting and wished it was more elaborated upon, because the idea that Steven's way of doing things isn't necessarily right isn't well-represented in the show. For the most part Steven goes out of his way to help people, rarely seems to have second thoughts about it, and the show usually treats it as a good thing. Amethyst's refusal to let him help her is an exception rather than the rule.
Steven is a traumatized child. It's really gross to imply that it's a child's role to fix things for all the adults.
It's not his role. That's why Amethyst was right to get pissed.
I can't find the interview right now, but Rebecca Sugar commented on how Steven chooses to try and get through to Spinel instead of fighting back against her. According to Sugar, Steven's way of doing things isn't necessarily good, but it's his way.
I found that interesting and wished it was more elaborated upon, because the idea that Steven's way of doing things isn't necessarily right isn't well-represented in the show. For the most part Steven goes out of his way to help people, rarely seems to have second thoughts about it, and the show usually treats it as a good thing. Amethyst's refusal to let him help her is an exception rather than the rule.
His reaction to Connie's silence after returning from the whole trial/Lars thing is a pretty good showcase of Steven's flaw. He instantly wants to talk about everything and fix everything immediately, to the point of not respecting the personal space of others. She made her stance clear, and he just kept texting her and pushing her and pressuring her into talking on his terms, and couldn't handle being told 'I don't want to talk to you right now'
This, combined with his insistence that Amethyst tells him how she feels about Rose/Pink, despite her insistence that he drop it, does indicate an innate distrust in people to work through their own shit. That he has so embraced fixing everyones problems that he refuses to back off, even when asked.
On the whole, though, I'd rather Steven be a selfless character. He's one of, if not the most powerful being in the galaxy, as far as we know, and he inherited that power. I'd rather he make the conscious decision to wield that power more as a tool for the collective, and he its user, than to use it primarily to make his own life better.
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Well, ok Spinel is kinda an extremely toxic person. I find it interesting that an insistent chunk of the fan base is of treating her completely the victim. Her desperate appeals to force Steven to fight her were extremely...
Well, they gave me some flashbacks is all.
Most of the show is toxic, abusive relationships.
At the start if the series, Pearl and Amethyst abused each other constantly, and both lived in constant fear if Garnet, while everyone hid things from Steven, and Lars treated Steven and Sadie like garbage, and Sadie allowed the treatment of Steven. And then it gets worse.
The song is basically almost every relationship in the series, some make it positive, some make it negative.
I'm being slightly facetious for effect. Like most things in SU, it's complicated.
Like, Alone at Sea has Lapis admitting that she took out her anger on Jasper and abused her, and it was unhealthy, while also having Jasper acting like a bully and doing the "I've changed!" thing to try and get her back. Lapis and Jasper were awful for and to one another, as Lapis straight up admits in that scene. The abuse wasn't a one-way street.
I'm disappointed that there was no Jasper in the movie. Was she in a background shot anywhere? Her character arc is, like, one of the only things I'd still like to see concluded if another season happens.
PSN: ShogunGunshow
Origin: ShogunGunshow
Which makes sense, they live for thousands and thousands of years and are from a rigid, hierarchical society.
It's human beings that really throw a wrench in the works when it comes to that, being organic and able to grow and change and etc.
Which is, of course, why I believe that Greg is secretly the most important character in the show.
I mean, if all gems are artificial, who created the first ones? Do they all spring ultimately from White Diamond? Is she a naturally occurring being, or was she created also? And by who, for what reason?
I mean, I guess the time skip in the movie probably makes it less likely that there's some creators behind the gems though, since I'm sure in 2 years of establishing galactic peace it would have come up. But it's always been in the back of my mind since the first season. The gems were producing massive amounts of soldiers and powerful weapons - was it always to subdue other worlds and expand the empire, or was there something else?
Not Pink, though. She's a later addition.
Perhaps they were bored and needed a young 'equal'? They took to Spinel rather instantly.
White described Pink as a part of herself, I always imagined that White created the other three.
Oh goodness. We're going to get a "Steven goes to the planet that was sucked dry to create Pink" episode, aren't we?
https://steven-universe.fandom.com/wiki/Crystal_Shrimp
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Rebecca says as much in an interview. Spinal is meant to be a toxic influence on everyone. Herself included
That’s kind of the subtext of the whole show? There are no psychiatrists for gems, so they have to learn healthier ways of dealing with themselves and their feelings. The show itself is like gem therapy.
Though it would’ve been at least cute to have an episode where Steven convinces the crystal gems to go see an actual therapist together.
Just got to watch through the movie, and loved it. The music was great. As was Steg.
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Switch: 0293 6817 9891
It kind of feels like it would be the responsible way to end the show, honestly. Nobody, rock or no, should go through all of those traumas without talking to a professional - tearful children should not bear the emotional labor burden of a pack of abused and abusive adults.
Agreed, I think explicitly addressing in some manner that it’s good to seek the help of a professional for these sorts of problems would be a good message.
I dont think ethically a psychologist could treat a gem. Theyre minds are similar to humans but their culture is not. Steven is the closest thing they have right now.
Blah, hard pass. I've never cared for WWE or the like and all the wrestling episodes were pretty 'blah' to me.
That said, Laser Light Canon is IMO a great intro - it's near the start, so you don't miss much, introduces a lot of the characters, and firmly establishes the 'there is a lot going on you don't understand' motif the show does so well.
I can't stand that one either, but honestly it captures the feeling of most of the show very very well.
That's kind of why Amethyst gets pissed off later on, because he really shouldn't have to be.
When I think about it, Steven is probably one of my favorite characters in media. Which is saying a lot, because at the start of the show I couldn't stand him, and was watching it for the gems. Dude goes through so much development.
PSN: ShogunGunshow
Origin: ShogunGunshow
Yeah, and I love that the whole plot of the movie is just to highlight that. He starts out as completely dependent on the other gems and then grows to become the thing holding all of them together, proving them right to have had faith in him.
The gems aren't really adults. They're aliens brought up in a dystopian society with limited human contact and no real pressure to emotionally grow, given that they're basically immortal. I haven't watched the movie, but I do know that humans and gems with the most human contact quickly realize the unfair situation that Steven is in.
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
The lyrics in the first song of the movie state Steven is "always putting others first". He's always going out of his way to try and help people, both Gem and human.
In the case of Spinel he's even trying to help someone who wants to murder him, which he can only do thanks to his powers completely negating her attacks.
Yeah. He never gets to be his own person, despite barely having started puberty. At this point he's everyone's parent. He gets less choice about his future than some of the gems.
It's not his responsibility. That's why Amethyst was right to get pissed.
PSN: ShogunGunshow
Origin: ShogunGunshow
I can't find the interview right now, but Rebecca Sugar commented on how Steven chooses to try and get through to Spinel instead of fighting back against her. According to Sugar, Steven's way of doing things isn't necessarily good, but it's his way.
I found that interesting and wished it was more elaborated upon, because the idea that Steven's way of doing things isn't necessarily right isn't well-represented in the show. For the most part Steven goes out of his way to help people, rarely seems to have second thoughts about it, and the show usually treats it as a good thing. Amethyst's refusal to let him help her is an exception rather than the rule.
His reaction to Connie's silence after returning from the whole trial/Lars thing is a pretty good showcase of Steven's flaw. He instantly wants to talk about everything and fix everything immediately, to the point of not respecting the personal space of others. She made her stance clear, and he just kept texting her and pushing her and pressuring her into talking on his terms, and couldn't handle being told 'I don't want to talk to you right now'
This, combined with his insistence that Amethyst tells him how she feels about Rose/Pink, despite her insistence that he drop it, does indicate an innate distrust in people to work through their own shit. That he has so embraced fixing everyones problems that he refuses to back off, even when asked.
On the whole, though, I'd rather Steven be a selfless character. He's one of, if not the most powerful being in the galaxy, as far as we know, and he inherited that power. I'd rather he make the conscious decision to wield that power more as a tool for the collective, and he its user, than to use it primarily to make his own life better.