What if it was the clones that were arrested and executed and they only want us to think it was the real thing?
Obama! :angryfist:
You're asking the wrong the question, friend:
What if there is no "real" one? What if he wasn't born in Hawaii or Kenya, because he was never "born" at all!
I submit that the real Barack died from complication before leaving the hospital, prior to the filing of his long term birth certificate, and the distraught mother never filed an obituary. It was the perfect gap into which their replicant could be inserted.
Birtherism, the suggestion that he was born in Kenya, was just a second line of defense crafted to keep those who questioned the official story focused on the question of "where" instead of "when" and ultimately "how?"
What on earth could that be meant for? "This ad knows too much about my personal information", I guess?
Yes, that was my assumption. An ad that knows too much about the user implies underhanded data gathering on the part of the advertiser.
Of course the idea of striking down an ad that "knows too much" is still delightfully eldritch. Like a new life form is being spawned, it knows too much but it doesn't have the capacity to deal with what it knows! It has no mouth yet it must scream! Kill it quickly, put it out of it's misery, Facebook!!
Worse still: These buttons are all helping train it! Three are essentially "you got me" and one is "dig deeper"
The only way to fight back is to dismiss accurately targeted ads as "irrelevant," random ads as "knows too much," and hedge against the inevitability of our robot overlords by dismissing ads for donations to the AI Benevolence Society as "already purchased"
I always saw Facebook ads (and ads on other social media) as a mild annoyance, with a side of despair that my information was being used to help awful people get into power.
Then a friend of mine gave birth to a daughter who died within hours of her birth.
Every time she went online she was bombarded with advertisements for everything from cradles to baby forumula. They had been tracking every stage of her pregnancy, but there was nothing to call a halt to the process when she left the hospital without a child. Every time she went online she kept getting reminders of what she should have been buying for her little Hannah at this stage of her life, had she only lived. Baby’s first Christmas bibs. Specially made baby food for weaning children. Halloween costumes for toddlers. Interactive games for pre schoolers.
It’s STILL going on.
I love advertising, particularly the reach of online advertising. It allows content creators to earn money for themselves while providing content free to the public and it gives the smallest of startups a chance to reach far more people than would ever have been possible just a few decades ago. But dear. Fucking. Christ. Between the data farming, the intrusion, the constant viruses and the sheer pig headed thoughtlessness am I ever ready to take a match to the whole rotten, sorry mess and start over.
*deep breath*
Anyway, fuck that.
We’ve mentioned all the Q stuff a few times on this forum before, and I’ll keep it vague lest we bring down the hordes upon us, but I expect it will amuse people to know that there is one particular branch of Q that believes that the Clintons, Obama, the Bidens etc actually have been arrested and are currently being held in Guantanamo Bay. With their incarceration being kept secret. Because reasons.
Anyway, this branch is now convinced that Obama has been executed and the Obama seen in public is a clone.
I’m not kidding. This is an actual thing. I won’t post it here cuz descriptions of real word figures being executed and all, but you can look up the brief description of Obama’s trial and execution and everything. It reads like some really awful fan fiction I stumbled across in the very early 90s.
Sounds like someone greatly misunderstood the Gemini Man trailer
The week before two European guys got arrested trying to fly a drone over Area 51 and were just sent home sans drone.
The event itself went fantastically well if you compare it to other "viral internet signup" events where thousands or millions sign up and somehow a negative number of people actually attend (i.e. nobody shows up and a few extra people stay home just in case).
Like 150 people showed up (some articles said 1500, but that seems to go back to a typo made in an early article and the internet's tendency to just copy itself eternally instead of rechecking facts a second time), about 10-20% of which were food vendors. The rest were mostly mid-tier streamers and their buddies (apparently the event was more of a Fortnite meet-and-greet than anything, everybody spent most of the day photobombing each other with the Naruto run). Like one reporter actually showed up, everyone else just pulled pictures off Twitter.
A dozen people lined up to rush the gate and they all chickened out. One guy got arrested for peeing on a sidewalk, and another was briefly detained and questioned after they worked up the nerve to cross the outer perimeter line.
Local ranchers had organized an armed posse to shoot any attendees who tried to camp on private property, but nobody got shot (by ranchers or MPs) because there weren't enough people to fill up the available public RV parking. Nobody even spent enough time in jail to miss their flight home.
The week before two European guys got arrested trying to fly a drone over Area 51 and were just sent home sans drone.
The event itself went fantastically well if you compare it to other "viral internet signup" events where thousands or millions sign up and somehow a negative number of people actually attend (i.e. nobody shows up and a few extra people stay home just in case).
Like 150 people showed up (some articles said 1500, but that seems to go back to a typo made in an early article and the internet's tendency to just copy itself eternally instead of rechecking facts a second time), about 10-20% of which were food vendors. The rest were mostly mid-tier streamers and their buddies (apparently the event was more of a Fortnite meet-and-greet than anything, everybody spent most of the day photobombing each other with the Naruto run). Like one reporter actually showed up, everyone else just pulled pictures off Twitter.
A dozen people lined up to rush the gate and they all chickened out. One guy got arrested for peeing on a sidewalk, and another was briefly detained and questioned after they worked up the nerve to cross the outer perimeter line.
Local ranchers had organized an armed posse to shoot any attendees who tried to camp on private property, but nobody got shot (by ranchers or MPs) because there weren't enough people to fill up the available public RV parking. Nobody even spent enough time in jail to miss their flight home.
Im amazed no one coopted the movement to profit from it.
Yes, with a quick verbal "boom." You take a man's peko, you deny him his dab, all that is left is to rise up and tear down the walls of Jericho with a ".....not!" -TexiKen
What if it was the clones that were arrested and executed and they only want us to think it was the real thing?
Obama! :angryfist:
You're asking the wrong the question, friend:
What if there is no "real" one? What if he wasn't born in Hawaii or Kenya, because he was never "born" at all!
I submit that the real Barack died from complication before leaving the hospital, prior to the filing of his long term birth certificate, and the distraught mother never filed an obituary. It was the perfect gap into which their replicant could be inserted.
Birtherism, the suggestion that he was born in Kenya, was just a second line of defense crafted to keep those who questioned the official story focused on the question of "where" instead of "when" and ultimately "how?"
Reminds me of part of the plot of Final Final Tactics.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
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ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
The week before two European guys got arrested trying to fly a drone over Area 51 and were just sent home sans drone.
The event itself went fantastically well if you compare it to other "viral internet signup" events where thousands or millions sign up and somehow a negative number of people actually attend (i.e. nobody shows up and a few extra people stay home just in case).
Like 150 people showed up (some articles said 1500, but that seems to go back to a typo made in an early article and the internet's tendency to just copy itself eternally instead of rechecking facts a second time), about 10-20% of which were food vendors. The rest were mostly mid-tier streamers and their buddies (apparently the event was more of a Fortnite meet-and-greet than anything, everybody spent most of the day photobombing each other with the Naruto run). Like one reporter actually showed up, everyone else just pulled pictures off Twitter.
A dozen people lined up to rush the gate and they all chickened out. One guy got arrested for peeing on a sidewalk, and another was briefly detained and questioned after they worked up the nerve to cross the outer perimeter line.
Local ranchers had organized an armed posse to shoot any attendees who tried to camp on private property, but nobody got shot (by ranchers or MPs) because there weren't enough people to fill up the available public RV parking. Nobody even spent enough time in jail to miss their flight home.
Im amazed no one coopted the movement to profit from it.
The week before two European guys got arrested trying to fly a drone over Area 51 and were just sent home sans drone.
The event itself went fantastically well if you compare it to other "viral internet signup" events where thousands or millions sign up and somehow a negative number of people actually attend (i.e. nobody shows up and a few extra people stay home just in case).
Like 150 people showed up (some articles said 1500, but that seems to go back to a typo made in an early article and the internet's tendency to just copy itself eternally instead of rechecking facts a second time), about 10-20% of which were food vendors. The rest were mostly mid-tier streamers and their buddies (apparently the event was more of a Fortnite meet-and-greet than anything, everybody spent most of the day photobombing each other with the Naruto run). Like one reporter actually showed up, everyone else just pulled pictures off Twitter.
A dozen people lined up to rush the gate and they all chickened out. One guy got arrested for peeing on a sidewalk, and another was briefly detained and questioned after they worked up the nerve to cross the outer perimeter line.
Local ranchers had organized an armed posse to shoot any attendees who tried to camp on private property, but nobody got shot (by ranchers or MPs) because there weren't enough people to fill up the available public RV parking. Nobody even spent enough time in jail to miss their flight home.
Im amazed no one coopted the movement to profit from it.
Someone will figure out how to annualize it.
Fyre Fest Redux: Nevada on Fyre!
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Zilla36021st Century. |She/Her|Trans* Woman In Aviators Firing A Bazooka. ⚛️Registered Userregular
How was everyone's 3rd of November? Anything interesting happen?
Nothing happened? Ok.
(conspiracy nuts were thinking that MOSSAD would do a false flag nuclear attack on Seattle on 11/3, needless to say, Seattle did not got up in a fiery holocaust)
That seems oddly specific, what sort of twisted reasoning is involved with this one? You can't just mention a fantastical conspiracy theory without giving any details!
How was everyone's 3rd of November? Anything interesting happen?
Nothing happened? Ok.
(conspiracy nuts were thinking that MOSSAD would do a false flag nuclear attack on Seattle on 11/3, needless to say, Seattle did not got up in a fiery holocaust)
Don't you mean that the operation was canceled after a heroic person leaked the details to the public? Obviously, if they went ahead after that, it would be linked back to MOSSAD.
(They actually rescheduled to Monday because one of the agents was out sick.)
That seems oddly specific, what sort of twisted reasoning is involved with this one? You can't just mention a fantastical conspiracy theory without giving any details!
It doesn't seem that interesting. The internet hive mind got fixated on a date, something to do with 9/11, because the Germans warned the US about 9/11 before it happened, and the Germans have warned the US about something recently, so something is obviously going to happen. On 11/3, because I guess it sounds kinda like 9/11? The nuke comes from various bits and pieces, I'm not sure where the MOSSAD bits come in. Most of this info is in half hour long videos in which a conspiracy theorist rambles on and I don't have the time or patience for that. And I didn't want to link one without watching it because who knows if it contains something infractable or not. Not me, I haven't watched them.
It's just one of those flash in a pans that happens to conspiracy theorists form time to time. Like that, uhh, military exercise down in Texas? I forget the snappy code name it had. But theorists believed that a army training exercise was actually OBAMA launching a coup against the South and that various Walmarts would be the concentration camps.
I remember that as I would get asked what is going on in back. I would say it's messy you don't want to go back there {freight was everywhere it was hard to move around a certain bottleneck in the backroom}
The Walmart near by was next to a shopping area that was falling on hard times {it's never recovered} So as the company that owns that retail space put up black plastic so you could not look instead the empty spots with a sign stating contact info
So it looked bad
That seems oddly specific, what sort of twisted reasoning is involved with this one? You can't just mention a fantastical conspiracy theory without giving any details!
It doesn't seem that interesting. The internet hive mind got fixated on a date, something to do with 9/11, because the Germans warned the US about 9/11 before it happened, and the Germans have warned the US about something recently, so something is obviously going to happen. On 11/3, because I guess it sounds kinda like 9/11? The nuke comes from various bits and pieces, I'm not sure where the MOSSAD bits come in. Most of this info is in half hour long videos in which a conspiracy theorist rambles on and I don't have the time or patience for that. And I didn't want to link one without watching it because who knows if it contains something infractable or not. Not me, I haven't watched them.
It's just one of those flash in a pans that happens to conspiracy theorists form time to time. Like that, uhh, military exercise down in Texas? I forget the snappy code name it had. But theorists believed that a army training exercise was actually OBAMA launching a coup against the South and that various Walmarts would be the concentration camps.
Activists with The Satanic Temple say a now-former therapist in Canada has been pushing conspiracies about globe-spanning, mind-controlling cults for years. And after they exposed some of her professional talks to her licensing board, she voluntarily gave up her psychology licence.
In June, a representative of The Satanic Temple sent a complaint about retired therapist Alison Miller to the College of Psychologists of British Columbia, the organisation responsible for licensing psychologists in the province. Though Miller retired from practicing therapy in 2018, the complaint accused her of causing harm by spreading “the dangerous notion that satanic cults engage in ritual abuse of children” in her public speeches and published books.
The presentations highlighted in the complaint—including one titled “Working Through Your Traumatic Memories and Destroying the Mind Control”—were given by Miller at a 2017 conference hosted by Survivorship, an organisation billed as a support group for victims of ritual abuse. The president of Survivorship, a Massachusetts-based licensed mental health counsellor named Neil Brick, claims he is a ritual abuse survivor who was “programmed” by the Illuminati into becoming a killer and spy.
In Miller’s presentations, she passes along tales of her patients being abused by cult members who dressed up as Satan, red tail and all. At another point, she describes trying to steer a patient away from her belief that she had been abducted by aliens; instead, she said, it was more likely that a cult had implanted the memory of aliens in the patient in order to make her seem “crazy.”
Gvzbgul on
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Caulk Bite 6One of the multitude of Dans infesting this placeRegistered Userregular
Well all that (her going all in on cults) seems counterproductive, in so much as they appear to be her “lizard people” stand in.
I think the satanic panic might be one of the worst conspiracy theories outside of like the Jews control the world one in terms of lives ruined and how many people, and people in authority, believed it
Question I thought of the other day, does believing that Epstein didn't kill himself count as a conspiracy theory? We were talking about flat earthers at work and I said I didn't believe in any conspiracy theories. After giving it some thought though I realized I don't think that Epstein killed himself. Personally the circumstances are so blatant that I don't think it counts but I may be wrong.
I suppose it depends on how much speculation and additional information you attach to the initial premise.
The fact is there is no evidence that he was murdered, and an overwhelming amount of evidence that he killed himself.
I’d say it’s not a full blown conspiracy theory but could be a starting point for one
Someone greased the hands of the right guards. Remember that people used to think that a network of sex traffickers among the rich and powerful was a conspiracy theory. And yet.
I suppose it depends on how much speculation and additional information you attach to the initial premise.
The fact is there is no evidence that he was murdered, and an overwhelming amount of evidence that he killed himself.
I’d say it’s not a full blown conspiracy theory but could be a starting point for one
Someone greased the hands of the right guards. Remember that people used to think that a network of sex traffickers among the rich and powerful was a conspiracy theory. And yet.
Again there is no evidence for this. The existence of a sex trafficking ring amongst some rich elites is not evidence of a seperate and specific murder conspiracy, just evidence that generally sometimes the broad idea of a conspiracy might have some truth to it somewhere. Saying that because there was a sex trafficking ring amongst protected elites turned out to be true in one case does not make other related conspiracies true. Ie, it doesn’t suddenly prove pizza gate.
Where are the bank records showing this? The conspirator would be risking an awful lot of exposure if the guards turned witness themselves, or were sloppy with their windfall and attracted attention.
The conspiracy also just straight up accuses guards, who as far as we know are completely innocent individuals, of being murderers.
Physical evidence suggests suicide, witnesses, ie the guards, say it was a suicide, and there are no specific suspects or specific motivations for a murder conspiracy outside of a vague “them, the elites” etc
I’m not saying it’s a crazy conspiracy theory, it’s plausible! but it still fits the basic definition of a conspiracy theory. the motivations and perpetrators are vague and unspecified so as to be essentially unfalsifiable, and it has zero supporting evidence
However it cannot empirically be ruled out that he wasn't murdered and his circumstances definitely are such that his death was highly convenient.
I think acknowledging that isn't conspiracy theory but alleging that the Clintons or Buckingham Palace had him murdered is.
It really comes down to the gap between the literal definition of a conspiracy theory, ie a theory about a conspiracy, and the kind of cultural understanding of a conspiracy theory, ie something where there are specific actors and motivations assumed and asserted without evidence.
I would argue on a personal level that while it can’t be ruled out, it is dangerous to promote the idea that because it can’t be ruled out it is therefore in any way likely. It undermines the genuine issues at the heart of the Epstein case, ie the structural and systemic problems with how our society protects the rich and elite, and how people who have less power and clout are disbelieved and exploited by those in power. That is much more crucial to moving forward and getting justice, and murder conspiracy theories distract from and minimise that effort
Epstein’s elite pedophile ring is a real-life conspiracy that just happened to be true. Then he dies in suspicious circumstances and the investigation into his crimes (which were very much not just him) gets dropped like a hot potato. I’m suspicious. I guess none of us are immune to conspiratorial thinking, even if we don’t go for the more florid stuff involving the supernatural.
Epstein’s elite pedophile ring is a real-life conspiracy that just happened to be true. Then he dies in suspicious circumstances and the investigation into his crimes (which were very much not just him) gets dropped like a hot potato. I’m suspicious. I guess none of us are immune to conspiratorial thinking, even if we don’t go for the more florid stuff involving the supernatural.
I agree, like it’s suspicious and we don’t respond well to not knowing these things for sure on just a basic ape brain level.
However I disagree with the characterisation of investigations being “dropped” as a result. It’s less that they were actively stopped and more just a consequence of how criminal investigations of this nature are structured to require agents and parties to push the issue. I’m sure his victims will still be able to file suits, but unfortunately it is genuinely difficult within our legal system to make a case under these circumstances, even when rich and powerful people aren’t involved.
This is not excusing things btw, it’s still an injustice and a systemic problem, just in a different much more structurally widespread way. It’s more the inherent issues, biases and failures of the system than powers from above actively trying to stop the system from working
Wait, when did the investigation get dropped? The news about it stopped, but that's how things go with police - they don't tell you stuff until they're done, for the most part.
Wait, when did the investigation get dropped? The news about it stopped, but that's how things go with police - they don't tell you stuff until they're done, for the most part.
Basically it hasn’t been dropped, it’s ongoing and complex and unsatisfying, and that’s a consequence of many things, not necessarily pressure from higher powers
The doctor didn't examine the body, he just examined the report from the doctor who did. So right away we're in the same ethical gray area as the doctors who were "diagnosing" Clinton or Trump with this-or-that disease or disorder, it's not technically a violation unless they're prescribing medicine or treatment based on this sight unseen diagnosis and with the patient dead it's moot.
His argument is that fracturing the hyoid bone or thyroid cartilage is "very unusual" in anything except homicidal strangulation.
Actual statistics: Thyroid cartilage damage occurs in the majority cases of both because it's closely linked to the ability to collapse of the airway. Hyoid fractures occur in approximately 50% of strangulations and 27% of hangings, both statistics are highly skewed, however, because in both cases fractures are almost ten times more likely in men than women.
There are signs that actually are used to distinguish strangulation from hanging, several of which were noted to be absent in the report.
TL;DR: Epstein has one injury that occurs in basically all hangings and another that occurs in around half of hangings with a male victim, therefore he was murdered.
Apparently that pathologist was dismissed for gross incompetence at some point in his career so I'm not putting a lot of stock in his second-hand analysis anyway.
I didn't even look into his background, his claims don't seem to hold water.
Some other debunk factors showing up on skeptic websites: Like all fractures, hyoid fractures become more likely and more severe with age, and Epstein was a good decade and change on the downslope of bone density. Also, the figures I had above aren't controlled for the style of the hanging. Epstein was leaning forward into a ligature rather than suspended from the ceiling, which causes more likely and more severe cartilage injuries.
Basically, despite what his family's hired pathologist says, his autopsy was consistent with suicide (injuries fairly common for a male of his age) and inconsistent with murder by strangulation (lack of body or facial injuries, no defensive wounds or restraint marks).
The suicide breaks the facility's streak, but doesn't actually put it up to the median for similar facilities. Maintenance of the cameras was a pre documented issue, as was short guard staffing and ignoring of protocols. The only anomaly is him being prematurely removed from suicide watch, but he wasn't being watched before that either.
Not accepting the official story is what makes anything a conspiracy theory. Sometimes they turn out to be true, other times they are bugfuck crazy, but as long as the basis is "The authorities on the matter are lying" then it is a conspiracy theory.
However it cannot empirically be ruled out that he wasn't murdered and his circumstances definitely are such that his death was highly convenient.
I think acknowledging that isn't conspiracy theory but alleging that the Clintons or Buckingham Palace had him murdered is.
It really comes down to the gap between the literal definition of a conspiracy theory, ie a theory about a conspiracy, and the kind of cultural understanding of a conspiracy theory, ie something where there are specific actors and motivations assumed and asserted without evidence.
I would argue on a personal level that while it can’t be ruled out, it is dangerous to promote the idea that because it can’t be ruled out it is therefore in any way likely. It undermines the genuine issues at the heart of the Epstein case, ie the structural and systemic problems with how our society protects the rich and elite, and how people who have less power and clout are disbelieved and exploited by those in power. That is much more crucial to moving forward and getting justice, and murder conspiracy theories distract from and minimise that effort
I think it's a problem to say "Epstein couldn't have died in any way in custody he must have been murdered" cause that's untrue and betrays ignorance of the situation of people in prisons. I think it's also a problem to say he definitely was murdered cos there's no way they would have let him live; that does ascribe conspiracy theory like thinking to Epstein's enemies in high places.
But saying "we cannot firmly rule out that he was not murdered even if it appears likely he wasn't" is... Well. Factually just correct.
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21stCenturyCall me Pixel, or Pix for short![They/Them]Registered Userregular
I really hate that the Epstein thing became such a meme. The whole thing makes extremely uncomfortable for too many reasons.
I think it is much, much more likely Epstein's guards were told to leave him alone long enough he was free to commit suicide
It's not a conspiracy theory at all that the US prison system is grotesque and inhumane at all levels, and that most guards are bad people in bad situations
I think it is much, much more likely Epstein's guards were told to leave him alone long enough he was free to commit suicide
It's not a conspiracy theory at all that the US prison system is grotesque and inhumane at all levels, and that most guards are bad people in bad situations
I don't even think you needed such active neglect.
Well after reading all that I feel better, I guess. I don't think it was some grand conspiracy to kill him, I just think circumstances were arranged to make it likely he was able to do it himself.
There’s two conspiracies when talking about Epstein; the one that’s proven (the child rape) and the one that’s not (the murder). Which makes it difficult for people to differentiate between the two, because obviously if there’s a group of rich and powerful people that will buy child sex slaves to molest from Epstein, then when he’s caught the first time, they’ll use their might to get him off. But when caught the second time, is it really so far fetched that such a mighty cabal of child rapists that let Epstein off the hook wouldn’t murder one person to cover it up? They already did it once, after all!
That’s their reasoning and it’s hard not to see where they are coming from, because covering for Epstein the first time was a conspiracy. But it’s also a logical fallacy; one being true doesn’t prove the other is true.
I’m more than sure Epstein was under intense pressure from all the people he sold children to. I don’t know if they just wanted him dead or to just not talk or anything in between, but I imagine they are happy that he killed himself and I also imagine the pressure they put on him didn’t help anything. It doesn’t have to be a conspiracy for a multitude of child molesters to individually gang up on Epstein and for that pressure, on top of everything else, be enough to push him over the edge.
Maybe no one pressured him at all or it was irrelevant if they did and he still would have committed suicide anyhow, but I have serious reservations that not a single person didn’t want him silenced and is unhappy he killed himself, conspiracy or not.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
Posts
I’ll admit, I didn’t see that one
Saw the layout and my eyes started glazing
You're asking the wrong the question, friend:
What if there is no "real" one? What if he wasn't born in Hawaii or Kenya, because he was never "born" at all!
I submit that the real Barack died from complication before leaving the hospital, prior to the filing of his long term birth certificate, and the distraught mother never filed an obituary. It was the perfect gap into which their replicant could be inserted.
Birtherism, the suggestion that he was born in Kenya, was just a second line of defense crafted to keep those who questioned the official story focused on the question of "where" instead of "when" and ultimately "how?"
Sounds like someone greatly misunderstood the Gemini Man trailer
The event itself went fantastically well if you compare it to other "viral internet signup" events where thousands or millions sign up and somehow a negative number of people actually attend (i.e. nobody shows up and a few extra people stay home just in case).
Like 150 people showed up (some articles said 1500, but that seems to go back to a typo made in an early article and the internet's tendency to just copy itself eternally instead of rechecking facts a second time), about 10-20% of which were food vendors. The rest were mostly mid-tier streamers and their buddies (apparently the event was more of a Fortnite meet-and-greet than anything, everybody spent most of the day photobombing each other with the Naruto run). Like one reporter actually showed up, everyone else just pulled pictures off Twitter.
A dozen people lined up to rush the gate and they all chickened out. One guy got arrested for peeing on a sidewalk, and another was briefly detained and questioned after they worked up the nerve to cross the outer perimeter line.
Local ranchers had organized an armed posse to shoot any attendees who tried to camp on private property, but nobody got shot (by ranchers or MPs) because there weren't enough people to fill up the available public RV parking. Nobody even spent enough time in jail to miss their flight home.
Im amazed no one coopted the movement to profit from it.
Reminds me of part of the plot of Final Final Tactics.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
Someone will figure out how to annualize it.
Fyre Fest Redux: Nevada on Fyre!
Nothing happened? Ok.
(conspiracy nuts were thinking that MOSSAD would do a false flag nuclear attack on Seattle on 11/3, needless to say, Seattle did not got up in a fiery holocaust)
Don't you mean that the operation was canceled after a heroic person leaked the details to the public? Obviously, if they went ahead after that, it would be linked back to MOSSAD.
(They actually rescheduled to Monday because one of the agents was out sick.)
It's just one of those flash in a pans that happens to conspiracy theorists form time to time. Like that, uhh, military exercise down in Texas? I forget the snappy code name it had. But theorists believed that a army training exercise was actually OBAMA launching a coup against the South and that various Walmarts would be the concentration camps.
The Walmart near by was next to a shopping area that was falling on hard times {it's never recovered} So as the company that owns that retail space put up black plastic so you could not look instead the empty spots with a sign stating contact info
So it looked bad
The why Mossad part is obvious: Jews.
PSN:Furlion
The fact is there is no evidence that he was murdered, and an overwhelming amount of evidence that he killed himself.
I’d say it’s not a full blown conspiracy theory but could be a starting point for one
Someone greased the hands of the right guards. Remember that people used to think that a network of sex traffickers among the rich and powerful was a conspiracy theory. And yet.
Again there is no evidence for this. The existence of a sex trafficking ring amongst some rich elites is not evidence of a seperate and specific murder conspiracy, just evidence that generally sometimes the broad idea of a conspiracy might have some truth to it somewhere. Saying that because there was a sex trafficking ring amongst protected elites turned out to be true in one case does not make other related conspiracies true. Ie, it doesn’t suddenly prove pizza gate.
Where are the bank records showing this? The conspirator would be risking an awful lot of exposure if the guards turned witness themselves, or were sloppy with their windfall and attracted attention.
The conspiracy also just straight up accuses guards, who as far as we know are completely innocent individuals, of being murderers.
Physical evidence suggests suicide, witnesses, ie the guards, say it was a suicide, and there are no specific suspects or specific motivations for a murder conspiracy outside of a vague “them, the elites” etc
I’m not saying it’s a crazy conspiracy theory, it’s plausible! but it still fits the basic definition of a conspiracy theory. the motivations and perpetrators are vague and unspecified so as to be essentially unfalsifiable, and it has zero supporting evidence
However it cannot empirically be ruled out that he wasn't murdered and his circumstances definitely are such that his death was highly convenient.
I think acknowledging that isn't conspiracy theory but alleging that the Clintons or Buckingham Palace had him murdered is.
It really comes down to the gap between the literal definition of a conspiracy theory, ie a theory about a conspiracy, and the kind of cultural understanding of a conspiracy theory, ie something where there are specific actors and motivations assumed and asserted without evidence.
I would argue on a personal level that while it can’t be ruled out, it is dangerous to promote the idea that because it can’t be ruled out it is therefore in any way likely. It undermines the genuine issues at the heart of the Epstein case, ie the structural and systemic problems with how our society protects the rich and elite, and how people who have less power and clout are disbelieved and exploited by those in power. That is much more crucial to moving forward and getting justice, and murder conspiracy theories distract from and minimise that effort
I agree, like it’s suspicious and we don’t respond well to not knowing these things for sure on just a basic ape brain level.
However I disagree with the characterisation of investigations being “dropped” as a result. It’s less that they were actively stopped and more just a consequence of how criminal investigations of this nature are structured to require agents and parties to push the issue. I’m sure his victims will still be able to file suits, but unfortunately it is genuinely difficult within our legal system to make a case under these circumstances, even when rich and powerful people aren’t involved.
This is not excusing things btw, it’s still an injustice and a systemic problem, just in a different much more structurally widespread way. It’s more the inherent issues, biases and failures of the system than powers from above actively trying to stop the system from working
Basically it hasn’t been dropped, it’s ongoing and complex and unsatisfying, and that’s a consequence of many things, not necessarily pressure from higher powers
Basically, despite what his family's hired pathologist says, his autopsy was consistent with suicide (injuries fairly common for a male of his age) and inconsistent with murder by strangulation (lack of body or facial injuries, no defensive wounds or restraint marks).
The suicide breaks the facility's streak, but doesn't actually put it up to the median for similar facilities. Maintenance of the cameras was a pre documented issue, as was short guard staffing and ignoring of protocols. The only anomaly is him being prematurely removed from suicide watch, but he wasn't being watched before that either.
I think it's a problem to say "Epstein couldn't have died in any way in custody he must have been murdered" cause that's untrue and betrays ignorance of the situation of people in prisons. I think it's also a problem to say he definitely was murdered cos there's no way they would have let him live; that does ascribe conspiracy theory like thinking to Epstein's enemies in high places.
But saying "we cannot firmly rule out that he was not murdered even if it appears likely he wasn't" is... Well. Factually just correct.
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It's not a conspiracy theory at all that the US prison system is grotesque and inhumane at all levels, and that most guards are bad people in bad situations
I don't even think you needed such active neglect.
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That’s their reasoning and it’s hard not to see where they are coming from, because covering for Epstein the first time was a conspiracy. But it’s also a logical fallacy; one being true doesn’t prove the other is true.
I’m more than sure Epstein was under intense pressure from all the people he sold children to. I don’t know if they just wanted him dead or to just not talk or anything in between, but I imagine they are happy that he killed himself and I also imagine the pressure they put on him didn’t help anything. It doesn’t have to be a conspiracy for a multitude of child molesters to individually gang up on Epstein and for that pressure, on top of everything else, be enough to push him over the edge.
Maybe no one pressured him at all or it was irrelevant if they did and he still would have committed suicide anyhow, but I have serious reservations that not a single person didn’t want him silenced and is unhappy he killed himself, conspiracy or not.
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