How many random onions are going to post a thread about this comic. It's not even out yet. My shop says it will ship in January.
Rey,
Danger's Dozen #2 ships in January.
Issue ONE is shipping this Wednesday - December 5th.
Mask - we will have digital comics - already coming on WOWIO. But we support our local retailers. All these web comics, it hurts the direct market retailers. We want readers to see the books, we will do so with WOWIO and our own free comics right on our site.
But the retailers are suffering out there and need everyone's support. We can't do it alone, we ask everyone to help out.
No offense, but this is the sort of attitude that more or less ensures that a small group of creators and only a couple of publishers get the most of the market share in comics. If you're new and unproven, you need a lot of eyes on your work, and lowering the cost of entry is one of the ways to do that. The comic shops aren't going to all die because you offer another way for readers to get access to your comic. And even still, is it really your job or the job of comic fans to try to prop up their business? More to the point, I'd like to think you guys could figure out a healthy balance between satisfying the consumer and the retailer, not just one or the other.
No offense, but this is the sort of attitude that more or less ensures that a small group of creators and only a couple of publishers get the most of the market share in comics. If you're new and unproven, you need a lot of eyes on your work, and lowering the cost of entry is one of the ways to do that. The comic shops aren't going to all die because you offer another way for readers to get access to your comic. And even still, is it really your job or the job of comic fans to try to prop up their business? More to the point, I'd like to think you guys could figure out a healthy balance between satisfying the consumer and the retailer, not just one or the other.
Yes.
Supporting both is very important. A First Salvo supports our retailers. Our readers hopefully support retailers.
Not ours to judge. Do as you like, of course.
We will offer books online but not at the same time they would be in stores. That would be a grave injustice to our retailers, who spent out their cash ordering copies of our books. We won't do that to them.
Once Danger's Dozen #1 has been out, we will provide a download version of Danger's Dozen not meant solely for reviewers. We are going to do this with our online partners.
We print books, we have to sell them. If we anger the retailers, readers will only be able to get out books through the mail from us.
I have to say... the attitude of the creator and his friends of this product has really left a bad taste in my mouth. I hate to be this guy... but frankly, your behavior has made it so that I am incredibly unlikely to buy anything you guys publish. You may want to work on how you interact with us "lowly" fans... because so far, your customer interaction sucks.
Sentry on
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
wrote:
When I was a little kid, I always pretended I was the hero,' Skip said.
'Fuck yeah, me too. What little kid ever pretended to be part of the lynch-mob?'
Hey, I understand your commitment to your retailers. I understand you have relationships you have to maintain there, since they sell your product. You don't want to piss them off, sure. But you also want to cater to your fans, who, let's face it, determine whether the retailers even stock your book. The customers have now and continue to speak: we want real digital distribution. What's more, we can sorta put up with a 6 month gap from DC and Marvel, but we're not content to just gamble on new publishers and books without some extensive previews first, and even then not really. You smaller guys just need to bite the bullet and start doing zero day digital distribution, because the scan groups are already doing it. At least if you have the alternative, people who are willing to pay can have the opportunity to do so.
I guess what I'm trying to get at is that publishers need to get with the program and learn how to work with digital distribution. Guys in your position especially need to learn how to take advantage of it and stop relying solely on the way Marvel or Dark Horse or DC does business. If you make a book available through Diamond and also make it available simultaneously online, you're not gonna get blackballed by comic shops. I've yet to go to a comic shop that is doing so well that they can just refuse to put in an order for a customer, no matter how they feel about the publisher. And if they do, so what? We're better off without those businesses. The entire industry needs to get back around to the bottom line, and that's giving the customer what they want. What retailers want is sorta secondary if you don't do that part first.
Also, just from a business standpoint, digital distribution is more cost effective than printing books. The first company that does an iTunes type store selling digital copies for no more than $1 an issue is going to get my money.
Finally, I'm all for what you guys are trying to do, but you really need to learn how to address your audience. We're fans; naturally we care about cost and story and previews and digital distribution, and how they will benefit us. You guys are sorta touching on those issues, but you're also talking about them as if you're talking to comic shop owners as well. As much as I like the guy who owns the shop I go to, in the end I'm more interested in my own bottom line, not his. You need to talk to your fans like you care about their bottom line and not the guy who will ultimately sell your product to them.
Thank you man.
Those were some great points. The digital stuff specifically. We have been developing separate digital material by our collaborators like John Royle and more set for Yvel Guichet, but it is important for readers to see Norm's art on the main story - the main arc of Danger's Dozen so that they can choose whether they want to go to their local retailer or even online stores.
Balancing between the retailers and the readers is hard and harsh. Stan Lee always said the readers are the real editors. This sort of speaks to what you are saying also. It is also like having two mistresses.
LOL
We've been addressing what readers have wanted in the past, with webcomic development in previous years. Here, today, with the printed comics - you do wonder about "respect" with digital distribution, while wanting to harness all the potential and yes, cost-effectiveness of digital distribution. You will be able to find A First Salvo material on the web, and find out more on our website.
We won't post about it here, because as Publisher, I have taken heed to everyone's concern about shilling and it was not my intent or the intent of any Salvo Partner in any malicious way.
In fact, Penny Arcade has been very vocal and very informative. Very helpful.
NogsCrap, crap, mega crap.Crap, crap, mega crap.Registered Userregular
edited December 2007
read Danger's Dozen today. Must say the art is really quite good. The writing seemed a bit off, though it is only the first book and there was a lot of need to set up the characters, so that can be written off as it were. I look forward to seeing where this is going.
Yes, my name is "Thad Branco" and I was in "New Hope" in the corner of the Cantina.
LOL, that's my name.
;-)
Danger's Dozen is a larger story that we tell in shorter segments - Chapters and arcs of the tale of the Danger's Dozen and of the main character, Aman. Danger's Dozen is the group he leads.
We appreciate the comments on DD#1, I'm guilty of adjusting to the dialogue of the period while being torn by the desire to keep it contemporary to then and now. We can't do both, I suppose it will be more fun to take it a little less seriously as regards the time period.
It's a lot of fun to work on and we will keep at it.
Did many people manage to check out Issue 1? Number 2 will be out in the next couple weeks (we want to make sure we are on time!) and I'd like to hear some comments. On both the first and second issue.
I'm still hard at work on Contract as we want to make sure that shipping is prompt and on time. We will also be attending the New York Comic Con in April and will have Contract series artist Kevin Sharpe at the table. So if you are going to the Con please stop by.
Posts
Rey,
Danger's Dozen #2 ships in January.
Issue ONE is shipping this Wednesday - December 5th.
Mask - we will have digital comics - already coming on WOWIO. But we support our local retailers. All these web comics, it hurts the direct market retailers. We want readers to see the books, we will do so with WOWIO and our own free comics right on our site.
But the retailers are suffering out there and need everyone's support. We can't do it alone, we ask everyone to help out.
Publisher
www.firstsalvo.com
Yes.
Supporting both is very important. A First Salvo supports our retailers. Our readers hopefully support retailers.
Not ours to judge. Do as you like, of course.
We will offer books online but not at the same time they would be in stores. That would be a grave injustice to our retailers, who spent out their cash ordering copies of our books. We won't do that to them.
Once Danger's Dozen #1 has been out, we will provide a download version of Danger's Dozen not meant solely for reviewers. We are going to do this with our online partners.
We print books, we have to sell them. If we anger the retailers, readers will only be able to get out books through the mail from us.
You know what I am saying. Cool, dude.
Publisher
www.firstsalvo.com
It's not like people don't buy other books from them.
I'm glad you'll continue to be purchasing Danger's Dozen. Awesome. Would you like a signed copy?
Publisher
www.firstsalvo.com
I guess what I'm trying to get at is that publishers need to get with the program and learn how to work with digital distribution. Guys in your position especially need to learn how to take advantage of it and stop relying solely on the way Marvel or Dark Horse or DC does business. If you make a book available through Diamond and also make it available simultaneously online, you're not gonna get blackballed by comic shops. I've yet to go to a comic shop that is doing so well that they can just refuse to put in an order for a customer, no matter how they feel about the publisher. And if they do, so what? We're better off without those businesses. The entire industry needs to get back around to the bottom line, and that's giving the customer what they want. What retailers want is sorta secondary if you don't do that part first.
Also, just from a business standpoint, digital distribution is more cost effective than printing books. The first company that does an iTunes type store selling digital copies for no more than $1 an issue is going to get my money.
Finally, I'm all for what you guys are trying to do, but you really need to learn how to address your audience. We're fans; naturally we care about cost and story and previews and digital distribution, and how they will benefit us. You guys are sorta touching on those issues, but you're also talking about them as if you're talking to comic shop owners as well. As much as I like the guy who owns the shop I go to, in the end I'm more interested in my own bottom line, not his. You need to talk to your fans like you care about their bottom line and not the guy who will ultimately sell your product to them.
Thank you man.
Those were some great points. The digital stuff specifically. We have been developing separate digital material by our collaborators like John Royle and more set for Yvel Guichet, but it is important for readers to see Norm's art on the main story - the main arc of Danger's Dozen so that they can choose whether they want to go to their local retailer or even online stores.
Balancing between the retailers and the readers is hard and harsh. Stan Lee always said the readers are the real editors. This sort of speaks to what you are saying also. It is also like having two mistresses.
LOL
We've been addressing what readers have wanted in the past, with webcomic development in previous years. Here, today, with the printed comics - you do wonder about "respect" with digital distribution, while wanting to harness all the potential and yes, cost-effectiveness of digital distribution. You will be able to find A First Salvo material on the web, and find out more on our website.
We won't post about it here, because as Publisher, I have taken heed to everyone's concern about shilling and it was not my intent or the intent of any Salvo Partner in any malicious way.
In fact, Penny Arcade has been very vocal and very informative. Very helpful.
Regards and Happy Holidays - three weeks out.
Publisher
www.firstsalvo.com
PREVIEW HERE: http://firstsalvo.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=160
It is his real name.
PREVIEW HERE: http://firstsalvo.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=160
PARKER, YOU'RE FIRED! <-- My comic book podcast! Satan look here!
LOL, that's my name.
;-)
Danger's Dozen is a larger story that we tell in shorter segments - Chapters and arcs of the tale of the Danger's Dozen and of the main character, Aman. Danger's Dozen is the group he leads.
We appreciate the comments on DD#1, I'm guilty of adjusting to the dialogue of the period while being torn by the desire to keep it contemporary to then and now. We can't do both, I suppose it will be more fun to take it a little less seriously as regards the time period.
It's a lot of fun to work on and we will keep at it.
Publisher
www.firstsalvo.com
Did anyone else grab a copy at their local stores?
PREVIEW HERE: http://firstsalvo.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=160
WEBCOMICS: UPDATED EVERY FRIDAY!!!
PREVIEW HERE: http://firstsalvo.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=160
http://www.comicon.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=36;t=006944
PREVIEW HERE: http://firstsalvo.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=160
http://www.brokenfrontier.com/reviews/details.php?id=1646
PREVIEW HERE: http://firstsalvo.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=160
Kevins an awesome artist, check out his work here:
http://members.aol.com/horsecrazie68/
PREVIEW HERE: http://firstsalvo.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=160
http://www.brokenfrontier.com/reviews/details.php?id=1697
PREVIEW HERE: http://firstsalvo.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=160