Kingpin works because he operates as a legitimate businessman. The heroes know he is a criminal but they can't prove it and they can't act against him until they do because they operate within the law and he doesn't.
Kingpin works because he operates as a legitimate businessman. The heroes know he is a criminal but they can't prove it and they can't act against him until they do because they operate within the law and he doesn't.
Most heroes, if not all opeate outside the law, since they are mostly vigilantes. I think the difference is in their moral compass and not in the legality of their actions. Like, its probably illegal to just fly around massive cities without permits, or swing from building to building in downtown NY. (or hunting and assaulting criminals)
Yes, with a quick verbal "boom." You take a man's peko, you deny him his dab, all that is left is to rise up and tear down the walls of Jericho with a ".....not!" -TexiKen
Kingpin works because he operates as a legitimate businessman. The heroes know he is a criminal but they can't prove it and they can't act against him until they do because they operate within the law and he doesn't.
Most heroes, if not all opeate outside the law, since they are mostly vigilantes. I think the difference is in their moral compass and not in the legality of their actions. Like, its probably illegal to just fly around massive cities without permits, or swing from building to building in downtown NY. (or hunting and assaulting criminals)
You know, flying around probably falls into a blind spot in the law if you have no machines involved, though web swinging can be caught under vandalism.
Kingpin works because he operates as a legitimate businessman. The heroes know he is a criminal but they can't prove it and they can't act against him until they do because they operate within the law and he doesn't.
Most heroes, if not all opeate outside the law, since they are mostly vigilantes. I think the difference is in their moral compass and not in the legality of their actions. Like, its probably illegal to just fly around massive cities without permits, or swing from building to building in downtown NY. (or hunting and assaulting criminals)
You know, flying around probably falls into a blind spot in the law if you have no machines involved, though web swinging can be caught under vandalism.
Spidey's webbing dissolves in a couple hours, so it would be about the same as charging kids with vandalism for using chalk on the sidewalk. Even more ridiculous, really, since the webbing doesn't even need rain or snow or something to wash it away.
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That_GuyI don't wanna be that guyRegistered Userregular
Kingpin works because he operates as a legitimate businessman. The heroes know he is a criminal but they can't prove it and they can't act against him until they do because they operate within the law and he doesn't.
Most heroes, if not all opeate outside the law, since they are mostly vigilantes. I think the difference is in their moral compass and not in the legality of their actions. Like, its probably illegal to just fly around massive cities without permits, or swing from building to building in downtown NY. (or hunting and assaulting criminals)
You know, flying around probably falls into a blind spot in the law if you have no machines involved, though web swinging can be caught under vandalism.
Spidey's webbing dissolves in a couple hours, so it would be about the same as charging kids with vandalism for using chalk on the sidewalk. Even more ridiculous, really, since the webbing doesn't even need rain or snow or something to wash it away.
Oh and we're just going to take his word for it? How do we know that this so-called Super HERO isn't just leaving his webbing for the police to clean up later? How toxic is that freak's webbing anyway? How many cases of cancer can be attributed to Spiderman? He's a menace, I tell you. Not to be trusted.
Yeah. Kingpin has been semi-super powered for a long time now but I've always thought it stupid and playing to the worst aspects of comic books. Kingpin is not the sort of villain you defeat with a punch. Similarly, you don't really care if he's across the table from you, because physical harm is the very least of his tools. His threat is in the scope of his ability to change your world and undermine the everyday life that anchors you.
Reducing him to a guy that needs to be punched harder than normal is missing the point entirely.
This was the biggest weakness of the Netflix shows in general. Luke Cage in particular had a pretty large dissonance because of their need to have a "big bad" that could physically go toe-to-toe with the hero, but all of the shows suffered from this to some degree. Iron Fist was also pretty bad, but Iron Fist was just bad all around, so in that case it's like pointing out that my dog's pubic hairs are brown when he's brown all over.
Kingpin works because he operates as a legitimate businessman. The heroes know he is a criminal but they can't prove it and they can't act against him until they do because they operate within the law and he doesn't.
Most heroes, if not all opeate outside the law, since they are mostly vigilantes. I think the difference is in their moral compass and not in the legality of their actions. Like, its probably illegal to just fly around massive cities without permits, or swing from building to building in downtown NY. (or hunting and assaulting criminals)
The difference with a "legitimate" villain like Kingpin is that he won't stay arrested. The heroes can go vigilante and bust up his operations, but they have no power over Kingpin if the police won't arrest him or the courts won't convict him.
Yup, what makes him a huge threat is he knows how to cover his tracks and buys/ blackmail off who he has has to.
TOGSolid on
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That_GuyI don't wanna be that guyRegistered Userregular
How dare you besmirch the name of Wilson Fisk. He is a philanthropist and community leader. You can't believe the lies the masked CRIMINAL vigilantes tell about this fine upstanding citizen. You guys should read the Daily Bugle instead of the BIG HERO propaganda.
If this is where they are heading with Phase 4, I'm onboard 110%. But I agree, it sucks that stupid sexism prevented this from being a P3 movie.
I think Phase Two would have been a better spot for it. Put it after Winter Soldier to take advantage of Widow's pretty major role in that movie. Phase Three was pretty crowded (ten movies vs. six in Phase Two, though two of those are IW and Endgame) and a good chunk of them were setting things up for Infinity War, so I think a Black Widow prequel/origin movie would have been a little out of place there.
Then have a Phase Four movie where Gamora and Widow team up to deal with whatever weirdness happens to people who sacrifice themselves to get the Soul Stone, because continuity be damned I think those two characters working together would make for an entertaining movie.
Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
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FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
If this is where they are heading with Phase 4, I'm onboard 110%. But I agree, it sucks that stupid sexism prevented this from being a P3 movie.
I think Phase Two would have been a better spot for it. Put it after Winter Soldier to take advantage of Widow's pretty major role in that movie. Phase Three was pretty crowded (ten movies vs. six in Phase Two, though two of those are IW and Endgame) and a good chunk of them were setting things up for Infinity War, so I think a Black Widow prequel/origin movie would have been a little out of place there.
Then have a Phase Four movie where Gamora and Widow team up to deal with whatever weirdness happens to people who sacrifice themselves to get the Soul Stone, because continuity be damned I think those two characters working together would make for an entertaining movie.
It should absolutely been made right after Winter Soldier.
If this is where they are heading with Phase 4, I'm onboard 110%. But I agree, it sucks that stupid sexism prevented this from being a P3 movie.
I think Phase Two would have been a better spot for it. Put it after Winter Soldier to take advantage of Widow's pretty major role in that movie. Phase Three was pretty crowded (ten movies vs. six in Phase Two, though two of those are IW and Endgame) and a good chunk of them were setting things up for Infinity War, so I think a Black Widow prequel/origin movie would have been a little out of place there.
Then have a Phase Four movie where Gamora and Widow team up to deal with whatever weirdness happens to people who sacrifice themselves to get the Soul Stone, because continuity be damned I think those two characters working together would make for an entertaining movie.
They're the same character. It would be dull as fuuuuuuuuck.
You need someone to offset the grimdark seriousness both those characters exude.
Also that trailer did nothing for me.
tip.. tip.. TALLY.. HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
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daveNYCWhy universe hate Waspinator?Registered Userregular
If this is where they are heading with Phase 4, I'm onboard 110%. But I agree, it sucks that stupid sexism prevented this from being a P3 movie.
I think Phase Two would have been a better spot for it. Put it after Winter Soldier to take advantage of Widow's pretty major role in that movie. Phase Three was pretty crowded (ten movies vs. six in Phase Two, though two of those are IW and Endgame) and a good chunk of them were setting things up for Infinity War, so I think a Black Widow prequel/origin movie would have been a little out of place there.
Then have a Phase Four movie where Gamora and Widow team up to deal with whatever weirdness happens to people who sacrifice themselves to get the Soul Stone, because continuity be damned I think those two characters working together would make for an entertaining movie.
They're the same character. It would be dull as fuuuuuuuuck.
You need someone to offset the grimdark seriousness both those characters exude.
Also that trailer did nothing for me.
Same rough origin, a shitty upbringing that trained them as weapons. There's still more than enough difference between them to mine for some good interactions. Widow is a sneaky spy with soft skills, whose never gone off planet, and is burned out from spending five years holding the Earth together, while Gamora is a galactic traveler, punch things in the face warrior, who is still going to be raw at the idea that Thanos can 'love' her while still lobbing her off a cliff.
Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
I’m assuming this is an MCU prequel, as in before Iron Man 1, back when Natasha was still an assassin.
There’s a masked bow and arrow guy that’s gotta be Clint. If it is him, then the movie can’t take place between Ultron and Endgame, since he was either retired, jailed, house arrested, or a vigilante during that period.
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reVerseAttack and Dethrone GodRegistered Userregular
Pretty sure this takes places after Civil War.
The masked guy is Taskmaster.
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
I am gonna be severely disappointed if Taskmaster doesn't do weird shit like copy Spider-man's agility or move in fast-forward time.
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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Dark Raven XLaugh hard, run fast,be kindRegistered Userregular
I assume he's already fought Hawkguy, and is using that against Nat for laughs.
Oh brilliant
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ChaosHatHop, hop, hop, HA!Trick of the lightRegistered Userregular
If this is where they are heading with Phase 4, I'm onboard 110%. But I agree, it sucks that stupid sexism prevented this from being a P3 movie.
I think Phase Two would have been a better spot for it. Put it after Winter Soldier to take advantage of Widow's pretty major role in that movie. Phase Three was pretty crowded (ten movies vs. six in Phase Two, though two of those are IW and Endgame) and a good chunk of them were setting things up for Infinity War, so I think a Black Widow prequel/origin movie would have been a little out of place there.
Then have a Phase Four movie where Gamora and Widow team up to deal with whatever weirdness happens to people who sacrifice themselves to get the Soul Stone, because continuity be damned I think those two characters working together would make for an entertaining movie.
They're the same character. It would be dull as fuuuuuuuuck.
You need someone to offset the grimdark seriousness both those characters exude.
Also that trailer did nothing for me.
Same rough origin, a shitty upbringing that trained them as weapons. There's still more than enough difference between them to mine for some good interactions. Widow is a sneaky spy with soft skills, whose never gone off planet, and is burned out from spending five years holding the Earth together, while Gamora is a galactic traveler, punch things in the face warrior, who is still going to be raw at the idea that Thanos can 'love' her while still lobbing her off a cliff.
The problem isn't what their skillset is, it's how their personalities are. They're super straight forward no nonsense characters. It'd be like saying the perfect compliment to your vanilla ice cream is vanilla bean ice cream.
I mean Widow is a little more jokey and you could play with that some but overall they fulfill similar character niches.
I’m assuming this is an MCU prequel, as in before Iron Man 1, back when Natasha was still an assassin.
There’s a masked bow and arrow guy that’s gotta be Clint. If it is him, then the movie can’t take place between Ultron and Endgame, since he was either retired, jailed, house arrested, or a vigilante during that period.
I'm assuming it takes place either after Winter Soldier or Civil War. The masked guy is Taskmaster and I really cannot wait to see how they do his photographic reflexes ability.
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
I’m assuming this is an MCU prequel, as in before Iron Man 1, back when Natasha was still an assassin.
There’s a masked bow and arrow guy that’s gotta be Clint. If it is him, then the movie can’t take place between Ultron and Endgame, since he was either retired, jailed, house arrested, or a vigilante during that period.
I'm assuming it takes place either after Winter Soldier or Civil War. The masked guy is Taskmaster and I really cannot wait to see how they do his photographic reflexes ability.
I......
Actually wasnt super jazzed at that trailer.
Which sucks, because ScarJo is my fave, and i genuinely love Black Widow and the spy genre. So I was really really hoping this would be a slam dunk for me.
It felt a little contrived and I'm curious as to why you'd open with "Before this I had nothing" (speaking about the Avengers) and then proceed to show a sister! and a Dad figure! and is that a Mom?! Wacky super hero costumes! Fun sky dives! Weeeeeeee
Which.....just isnt what i want from my Black Widow trailer. I want intrigue and spy craft and assassination and twists and i want to see why the Avengers fam is so important to her, and i want to see the red in that ledger.
Instead it just looked like an action movie.
I mean, MCU has my faith thus far, and I'll be there opening night with bells on regardless. But i was hoping for more.
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ChaosHatHop, hop, hop, HA!Trick of the lightRegistered Userregular
The timing of it in the continuity is a little weird. I would have expected it to be the "before I got picked up by SHIELD" story instead of where they did slot it.
Co worker brought up that all of this could occur in a different reality. Where she has to put her "family" back together.
I don't think they're going there in the movies. I expect them to maintain a coherent timeline for moviegoers. Alternate universe silliness is what they're doing in D+.
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AthenorBattle Hardened OptimistThe Skies of HiigaraRegistered Userregular
Co worker brought up that all of this could occur in a different reality. Where she has to put her "family" back together.
I don't think they're going there in the movies. I expect them to maintain a coherent timeline for moviegoers. Alternate universe silliness is what they're doing in D+.
You mean until the Dr. Strange in the Multiverse of madness (or whatever the title was) confirms that Mysterio's cover story was actually accurate, right?
Co worker brought up that all of this could occur in a different reality. Where she has to put her "family" back together.
I don't think they're going there in the movies. I expect them to maintain a coherent timeline for moviegoers. Alternate universe silliness is what they're doing in D+.
I agree.
Interesting premise though. Being trapped in the Soul Stone and having to right wrongs to get out.
Co worker brought up that all of this could occur in a different reality. Where she has to put her "family" back together.
I don't think they're going there in the movies. I expect them to maintain a coherent timeline for moviegoers. Alternate universe silliness is what they're doing in D+.
I agree.
Interesting premise though. Being trapped in the Soul Stone and having to right wrongs to get out.make the leap home.
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Most heroes, if not all opeate outside the law, since they are mostly vigilantes. I think the difference is in their moral compass and not in the legality of their actions. Like, its probably illegal to just fly around massive cities without permits, or swing from building to building in downtown NY. (or hunting and assaulting criminals)
You know, flying around probably falls into a blind spot in the law if you have no machines involved, though web swinging can be caught under vandalism.
3DS: 0473-8507-2652
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Spidey's webbing dissolves in a couple hours, so it would be about the same as charging kids with vandalism for using chalk on the sidewalk. Even more ridiculous, really, since the webbing doesn't even need rain or snow or something to wash it away.
Oh and we're just going to take his word for it? How do we know that this so-called Super HERO isn't just leaving his webbing for the police to clean up later? How toxic is that freak's webbing anyway? How many cases of cancer can be attributed to Spiderman? He's a menace, I tell you. Not to be trusted.
This was the biggest weakness of the Netflix shows in general. Luke Cage in particular had a pretty large dissonance because of their need to have a "big bad" that could physically go toe-to-toe with the hero, but all of the shows suffered from this to some degree. Iron Fist was also pretty bad, but Iron Fist was just bad all around, so in that case it's like pointing out that my dog's pubic hairs are brown when he's brown all over.
PSN / Xbox / NNID: Fodder185
The difference with a "legitimate" villain like Kingpin is that he won't stay arrested. The heroes can go vigilante and bust up his operations, but they have no power over Kingpin if the police won't arrest him or the courts won't convict him.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxAtuMu_ph4
That skydiving sequence, oof, I dunno man. Was expecting this one to be a little more grounded.
Hueh.
Red Guardian looks p.dumb, in a fun way.
Oh Snap
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Looks great.
Definitely going to see it.
Should have been made three years ago.
I think Phase Two would have been a better spot for it. Put it after Winter Soldier to take advantage of Widow's pretty major role in that movie. Phase Three was pretty crowded (ten movies vs. six in Phase Two, though two of those are IW and Endgame) and a good chunk of them were setting things up for Infinity War, so I think a Black Widow prequel/origin movie would have been a little out of place there.
Then have a Phase Four movie where Gamora and Widow team up to deal with whatever weirdness happens to people who sacrifice themselves to get the Soul Stone, because continuity be damned I think those two characters working together would make for an entertaining movie.
It should absolutely been made right after Winter Soldier.
They're the same character. It would be dull as fuuuuuuuuck.
You need someone to offset the grimdark seriousness both those characters exude.
Also that trailer did nothing for me.
Same rough origin, a shitty upbringing that trained them as weapons. There's still more than enough difference between them to mine for some good interactions. Widow is a sneaky spy with soft skills, whose never gone off planet, and is burned out from spending five years holding the Earth together, while Gamora is a galactic traveler, punch things in the face warrior, who is still going to be raw at the idea that Thanos can 'love' her while still lobbing her off a cliff.
There’s a masked bow and arrow guy that’s gotta be Clint. If it is him, then the movie can’t take place between Ultron and Endgame, since he was either retired, jailed, house arrested, or a vigilante during that period.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
The masked guy is Taskmaster.
The problem isn't what their skillset is, it's how their personalities are. They're super straight forward no nonsense characters. It'd be like saying the perfect compliment to your vanilla ice cream is vanilla bean ice cream.
I mean Widow is a little more jokey and you could play with that some but overall they fulfill similar character niches.
I'm assuming it takes place either after Winter Soldier or Civil War. The masked guy is Taskmaster and I really cannot wait to see how they do his photographic reflexes ability.
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If they don't do something like this scene: http://images.flyingstove.com/galleries/munkusmegamayhem/badass.jpg
Then the movie has failed me.
Actually wasnt super jazzed at that trailer.
Which sucks, because ScarJo is my fave, and i genuinely love Black Widow and the spy genre. So I was really really hoping this would be a slam dunk for me.
It felt a little contrived and I'm curious as to why you'd open with "Before this I had nothing" (speaking about the Avengers) and then proceed to show a sister! and a Dad figure! and is that a Mom?! Wacky super hero costumes! Fun sky dives! Weeeeeeee
Which.....just isnt what i want from my Black Widow trailer. I want intrigue and spy craft and assassination and twists and i want to see why the Avengers fam is so important to her, and i want to see the red in that ledger.
Instead it just looked like an action movie.
I mean, MCU has my faith thus far, and I'll be there opening night with bells on regardless. But i was hoping for more.
I don't think they're going there in the movies. I expect them to maintain a coherent timeline for moviegoers. Alternate universe silliness is what they're doing in D+.
You mean until the Dr. Strange in the Multiverse of madness (or whatever the title was) confirms that Mysterio's cover story was actually accurate, right?
I agree.
Interesting premise though. Being trapped in the Soul Stone and having to right wrongs to get out.