That's unbelievably cool. Your new name is cool guy. Let's have sex.
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AthenorBattle Hardened OptimistThe Skies of HiigaraRegistered Userregular
edited January 2020
Yay Finally! Wooo!
Edit: Ooh, interesting mechanics!
Pete must complete 4 goals, befitting of him being in multiple shorts. (Also of note, I think this is the first time Mickey's gonna be a hero card? Maybe?)
Cruella appears to need to collect 99 Dalmatians, with tokens in denominations of 11 and 22.
Mother Gothel is aiming to collect either 20 or 30 resources, very much like Prince John.
If you get viticulture get the expansion too, I don't think it's worth playing without it. And free money is a good way to buy that stuff so it doesn't seem like you're getting totally gouged to get a playable light worker placement game when the base game is expensive and then you have to buy the required expansion too.
Didn't Viticulture Essential solve this by including the necessary bits of Tuscany?
How is Villainous? Obviously the theme is something I think the kids/wife could get into.
It's good! The art is beautiful, the theme is obviously great, and each character feels very well expressed through their own unique mechanics. Honestly that's probably the thing I'm most impressed with in the game. It also just feels different. I wouldn't be able to point out another game in my collection that feels mechanically similar. It does everything it can to pull in a wide variety of players, and get them all on the same page, too. I find it can be a good time with just about any group of folks who are halfway interested in playing Disney villains.
For cons, it can run a bit too long with higher playercounts. Some of the newer characters are actually quite complicated, which can discourage new players when they get in over their head (although the game's character-specific player aids are really nice), and there are definitely balance issues where some characters will just struggle to get all their shit together for a win by the end of the game. How much that bothers you may vary; for me, sometimes a game having a "hard mode" character or team can be a good thing.
Edit: Aannnnd Jonbob said everything more succinctly
Damn it. I am not going to be able to cram 3 more villains in that box. They're gonna need to Sentinels this shit.
I learned after the second standalone expansion came out that it was a mistake for me to try to keep them in the base box. I can't regain the one that I threw away, but going forward they're just all going to be in separate boxes. It's a pain for my storage space, but the boxes and inserts are all really nice.
BloodySloth on
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KetarCome on upstairswe're having a partyRegistered Userregular
Got a look at Oath being demoed at PAX South.
Looks like I'm going to be breaking my self-imposed kickstarter hiatus.
Damn it. I am not going to be able to cram 3 more villains in that box. They're gonna need to Sentinels this shit.
I learned after the second standalone expansion came out that it was a mistake for me to try to keep them in the base box. I can't regain the one that I threw away, but going forward they're just all going to be in separate boxes. It's a pain for my storage space, but the boxes and inserts are all really nice.
I have the first 12 villains in there comfortably (had to toss the Power Bowl but no great loss). I do not have room for 3 more.
Viticulture is one of my favorite worker placement games almost entirely on the back of the sumo worker mechanic letting you force your way into an already claimed space but it kicks the worker on that space back to the owners hand letting them reuse it.
Isn't it a different worker placement game that has that bumping mechanic? The grande worker in Viticulture only allows it to be placed at a full location (in addition to being able to be played as a regular worker).
In any case, Viticulture is still one of my top introductory games into the mid-weight level of game complexity. The theme makes it fairly easy to teach, and it feels like it has the right balance of luck via card draws to overarching strategy to keep players interested.
Viticulture is one of my favorite worker placement games almost entirely on the back of the sumo worker mechanic letting you force your way into an already claimed space but it kicks the worker on that space back to the owners hand letting them reuse it.
Isn't it a different worker placement game that has that bumping mechanic? The grande worker in Viticulture only allows it to be placed at a full location (in addition to being able to be played as a regular worker).
In any case, Viticulture is still one of my top introductory games into the mid-weight level of game complexity. The theme makes it fairly easy to teach, and it feels like it has the right balance of luck via card draws to overarching strategy to keep players interested.
I've only played Viticulture once but I do know that Euphoria (also) uses the "worker bump" mechanic for some spaces.
Viticulture is one of my favorite worker placement games almost entirely on the back of the sumo worker mechanic letting you force your way into an already claimed space but it kicks the worker on that space back to the owners hand letting them reuse it.
Isn't it a different worker placement game that has that bumping mechanic? The grande worker in Viticulture only allows it to be placed at a full location (in addition to being able to be played as a regular worker).
In any case, Viticulture is still one of my top introductory games into the mid-weight level of game complexity. The theme makes it fairly easy to teach, and it feels like it has the right balance of luck via card draws to overarching strategy to keep players interested.
Yeah, every time I've played V:E it just shared the space, it didn't bump a worker out. So either I've been playing that wrong or it doesn't bump in that game.
Edit: Looked it up, yeah it doesn't bump. Just shares the spot. Nothing indicates it returns a worker to another player.
"The grande worker follows the rules for regular workers but also has a special ability: The grande worker may be placed
on a fully occupied action on the board to perform that action. Multiple players may place their grande workers in this
way. A grande worker placed on a bonus action space will give you the bonus (just like a regular worker); otherwise it does not
give you a bonus."
I got On Mars to the table today. It's really great, but I would say not perfect. Or at least, I need a few more plays to really get into the nitty gritty. The downside is that it's an incredibly heavy and complex game, but on my first playthrough I'm not 100% convinced it needed that level of complexity to be good. I don't think anything was needlessly complex, but there were so many different moving parts and systems and I'm not completely convinced it couldn't have been trimmed down a bit.
On the plus side though, it's a worker placement game with direct interaction, which is really damn cool. Unlike other worker placement games like Caverna, Anachrony, Feast for Odin, etc. where they sometimes get the reputation as being multiplayer solitaire, in On Mars, you're all building on the same place, and really you're all working onthe same colony, and it's kind of a race to exploit the limited space that you have. So you can block other players, and if you see someone setting up a big move, you can really step on their toes.
Also, unlike many other worker placement games, you don't simply get to place all of your workers each turn/round. You get one main action and one executive action per round no matter how many workers you have access to, and they only make their way back into your home (and become available to place) under certain conditions. This means turns at the end of the game don't get absurdly long when one player is taking 7 actions or something like that.
Also the build quality of the game is top notch. All the pieces look and feel excellent, they fit together perfectly, and they look really really good.
Can't say I'm a fan. We played with a random map and number layout, which led to some very poor availability of wheat and wood. Cities and Kights just emphasized the core issues I have with Catan. Despite the probability that 6/8 would be one of the most often results, 9 and 5 came up the most, and 2 and 11 came up as often as 6 or 8. I went 6 turns (4 player game) without getting any resources at the start of the game. Despite sitting on a stone/wheat/sheep intersection, my main resource for half the game was brick. I lost half my hand twice to the robber, due to having card combinations that I couldn't build, and no one wanting my resources. Fortunately, we never suffered a city burning down (mostly from feeling bad my son would have been the one to lose his city). Game took about 2.5 hours.
Can't say I'm too eager to play again, perhaps without any of my kids. My wife definitely wouldn't care for it. I had hoped it would improve the game, but losing a resource to commodities just slowed everything down.
Anyone have suggestions? My brother-in-law was pretty excited about this expansion and I feel it will get played again, but would love a suggestion to make it faster or more even.
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CaptainPeacockBoard Game HoarderTop o' the LakeRegistered Userregular
Can't say I'm a fan. We played with a random map and number layout, which led to some very poor availability of wheat and wood. Cities and Kights just emphasized the core issues I have with Catan. Despite the probability that 6/8 would be one of the most often results, 9 and 5 came up the most, and 2 and 11 came up as often as 6 or 8. I went 6 turns (4 player game) without getting any resources at the start of the game. Despite sitting on a stone/wheat/sheep intersection, my main resource for half the game was brick. I lost half my hand twice to the robber, due to having card combinations that I couldn't build, and no one wanting my resources. Fortunately, we never suffered a city burning down (mostly from feeling bad my son would have been the one to lose his city). Game took about 2.5 hours.
Can't say I'm too eager to play again, perhaps without any of my kids. My wife definitely wouldn't care for it. I had hoped it would improve the game, but losing a resource to commodities just slowed everything down.
Anyone have suggestions? My brother-in-law was pretty excited about this expansion and I feel it will get played again, but would love a suggestion to make it faster or more even.
Playing Catan with the card deck helps smooth out the randomness of the die, but it still doesnt make it a very good game IMO.
Cluck cluck, gibber gibber, my old man's a mushroom, etc.
You mean the deck of cards for 2d6? I tried that and no one liked that there wasn't the hope of getting a long shot like 2,3,11,12 once they came up already.
I think the dice that come with the game are weighted poorly. Feels like they never roll right. I use my level up pax D6 normally, but with Cities and Knights you have to know which is the red one.
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CaptainPeacockBoard Game HoarderTop o' the LakeRegistered Userregular
I mean the deck that comes in the Traders & Barbariand expansion. They have numbers as well as additional effects, if memory serves.
Cluck cluck, gibber gibber, my old man's a mushroom, etc.
Powerpuppiesdrinking coffee in themountain cabinRegistered Userregular
On Mars is a game i would love to own but it's extremely complicated and I've had 18xx players not enjoy it so there's another necessary filter i can't identify. The game i won Friday had the victory conditions basically break down so nobody could trigger game end without tanking their chances. Also the two friends who own it have never played it through a single time without front rules wrong or forgetting to pay for something or forgetting to take a reward for something
I wanted to back on Mars buti haven't even gotten escape plan to the table once so it turns out my available pool of strategy game friends is less deep than I hoped
I got On Mars to the table today. It's really great, but I would say not perfect. Or at least, I need a few more plays to really get into the nitty gritty. The downside is that it's an incredibly heavy and complex game, but on my first playthrough I'm not 100% convinced it needed that level of complexity to be good. I don't think anything was needlessly complex, but there were so many different moving parts and systems and I'm not completely convinced it couldn't have been trimmed down a bit.
I got On Mars to the table today. It's really great, but I would say not perfect. Or at least, I need a few more plays to really get into the nitty gritty. The downside is that it's an incredibly heavy and complex game, but on my first playthrough I'm not 100% convinced it needed that level of complexity to be good. I don't think anything was needlessly complex, but there were so many different moving parts and systems and I'm not completely convinced it couldn't have been trimmed down a bit.
So you're saying it's a vital lacerda game huh
I still really liked it, and my group have all messaged me to ask me to play again soon.
I'm really curious to see how strategies unfold as you play.
I got On Mars to the table today. It's really great, but I would say not perfect. Or at least, I need a few more plays to really get into the nitty gritty. The downside is that it's an incredibly heavy and complex game, but on my first playthrough I'm not 100% convinced it needed that level of complexity to be good. I don't think anything was needlessly complex, but there were so many different moving parts and systems and I'm not completely convinced it couldn't have been trimmed down a bit.
So you're saying it's a vital lacerda game huh
I still really liked it, and my group have all messaged me to ask me to play again soon.
I'm really curious to see how strategies unfold as you play.
I think maybe the right strategies depend a lot on the end conditions so it will be volatile
I got On Mars to the table today. It's really great, but I would say not perfect. Or at least, I need a few more plays to really get into the nitty gritty. The downside is that it's an incredibly heavy and complex game, but on my first playthrough I'm not 100% convinced it needed that level of complexity to be good. I don't think anything was needlessly complex, but there were so many different moving parts and systems and I'm not completely convinced it couldn't have been trimmed down a bit.
So you're saying it's a vital lacerda game huh
I still really liked it, and my group have all messaged me to ask me to play again soon.
I'm really curious to see how strategies unfold as you play.
I think maybe the right strategies depend a lot on the end conditions so it will be volatile
I'm not sure what you mean, the end conditions don't change from game to game. Or do you mean the mission cards?
I got On Mars to the table today. It's really great, but I would say not perfect. Or at least, I need a few more plays to really get into the nitty gritty. The downside is that it's an incredibly heavy and complex game, but on my first playthrough I'm not 100% convinced it needed that level of complexity to be good. I don't think anything was needlessly complex, but there were so many different moving parts and systems and I'm not completely convinced it couldn't have been trimmed down a bit.
So you're saying it's a vital lacerda game huh
I still really liked it, and my group have all messaged me to ask me to play again soon.
I'm really curious to see how strategies unfold as you play.
I think maybe the right strategies depend a lot on the end conditions so it will be volatile
I'm not sure what you mean, the end conditions don't change from game to game. Or do you mean the mission cards?
Yes! That's the word. The mission cards. Both which mission cards and how many players you have seem to totally upend the game. You really have to learn the game deeply in order to get any better at the game itself and not just at 2player with easy missions or 4player with contracts and research tiles, or whatever
I got On Mars to the table today. It's really great, but I would say not perfect. Or at least, I need a few more plays to really get into the nitty gritty. The downside is that it's an incredibly heavy and complex game, but on my first playthrough I'm not 100% convinced it needed that level of complexity to be good. I don't think anything was needlessly complex, but there were so many different moving parts and systems and I'm not completely convinced it couldn't have been trimmed down a bit.
So you're saying it's a vital lacerda game huh
I still really liked it, and my group have all messaged me to ask me to play again soon.
I'm really curious to see how strategies unfold as you play.
I think maybe the right strategies depend a lot on the end conditions so it will be volatile
I'm not sure what you mean, the end conditions don't change from game to game. Or do you mean the mission cards?
Yes! That's the word. The mission cards. Both which mission cards and how many players you have seem to totally upend the game. You really have to learn the game deeply in order to get any better at the game itself and not just at 2player with easy missions or 4player with contracts and research tiles, or whatever
You don't need to complete the mission cards to end the game though. You only have to move the big red cube 3 times to trigger the end game. It moves when you either complete a mission, or when the LSS upgrades to levels 3 4 or 5. So any combination of those things can trigger end game. In our game, we finished 2 missions, and leveled the LSS to level 3 which ended the game.
Powerpuppiesdrinking coffee in themountain cabinRegistered Userregular
I won a marathon game of Twilight Imperium last night. Somebody tried to pick up speed slingshotting a baby death star past a gravity rift and the whole thing fell in and was lost.
I played the trader race, The Emirates of Hacan. On the first turn we were moving fast and nobody could trade due to being locked away near their homeworlds and not having any neighbors yet. That rule didn't apply to me. I negotiated two transactions when my turn began and the host was visibly disgusted.
I was throwing trade goods left and right like tips in the early game, and had a permanent alliance with the space nerds Jol-Nar player to my left. I originally intended to then overwhelm and conquer the space bullies Mentak to my right, but that player built up big fleets and mostly didn't use them. I didn't really end up fighting anyone.
I had a complicated win shot but drew into a secretive objective that I'd already finished and so had a simple win at the end of the turn.
I bought a racial tech that allows me at great cost to guarantee a strategy card, and was maneuvering to guarantee Imperial and score trade goods first action of the final turn. Someone jumped from 5 points of 10 to 9, which let me draw a secret objective as part of the Imperial secondary. The card I topdecked related to racial techs, so I had already finished it and could just score it for the win at round's end. . I was very committed to the slow roll and so nobody thought I had it this round. One person even commented in an offhand way "I mean he could have the secret objective. He could just be being stealthy." It didn't matter, none of them remembered that in hours past they'd elected me Minister of Peace and I had authorization to end an inconvenient adventure if it threatened me.
At one point I built 5 dreadnoughts for a secret objective, and just before I scored it drew a new secret objective.
It said end the round occupying the Galactic Senate with three ships in orbit. I moved all five into the senate and the previous occupier immediately fled, playing a Skilled Retreat card. He couldn't carry all his ground forces off the planet with him, so the one remaining ground force, shot from orbit by 5 dreadnoughts, became the only thing I shot all game. There was a public objective I hadn't scored for having six non-home planets occupied, and I only had 5 in my little corner, so the center of the universe became the sixth and scored me both that round's public objective and my secret objective.
As part of stalling long enough to invade the senate after everyone else had passed, I blew up the third space dock of the space bullies with an action card, reasoning that it wasn't good for much and maybe they had a secret objective to have all their space docks on the board. That was the player's secret objective, and he got mad, saying he was going to absolutely push my shit in next turn. I finished the turn for twenty minutes, and then as the cleanup happened discussed that I would have to leave the Senate and not score any senate points, and also take the first-action strategy card i didn't really need, in order to prevent his successful retaliation.
When he heard that his threatening response to my space dock sabotage had already cost me at least one point, and that I would be leaving the senate up for grabs, and that I was going to attack his power-projection forces first action with the fleet currently at the galactic senate, he lost a little bit of interest in the war. When I established that if he was willing to return to a detente, I was willing to take neither first-mover strategy nor senate-scoring strategy and move all of my ships and troops out of the senate first action, he agreed. It totally worked out for him, and he got the senate, and scored 4 points in one turn eventually, but I was able to just hang out peacefully in a defensive crouch and buy the win.
The wheeling and dealing at our table is great, and maybe why our games always go like twelve fucking hours. We had a single council vote that twisted like 5 times. Very strong "are you fucking kidding me!" energy.
It involved someone getting free technology for the rest of the game. Three of six players immediately made a deal involving the election of the Yssaril and a Political Rider card (cost: no Ghost votes cast) so that if the Yssaril won as predicted then the Space Ghosts became first actor and drew 3 action cards, leaving the Space Bullies second to act in exchange for their votes. The Space Ghosts brokered the deal and assassinated my representatives, so the Yssaril and Space Bullies only had to outvote 2 players. Since I couldn't cast votes anyway, I put a Construction Rider on the Yssaril win. Seeing that the Yssaril had enough votes to win without them, the Space Bullies added an Imperial rider for a point and a Tech rider for a free tech, all if the Yssaril won.
So now the situation was either the Yssaril won, and got free tech for the rest of the game, and I got a space dock, and the ghosts got 3 action cards and first actor, and the bullies got a point and a tech, or somebody else won and got free tech for the rest of the game. Not wanting the bullies to get a point and a tech, I revealed that I was going to repeal this law second action next turn, so the winner would only get free tech once. The Yssaril looked at me with revulsion and said they were now going to vote against themselves. The bullies and the ghosts gave them massive bribes to vote for themselves after all. They agreed. I asked the terms of the deal, did the Yssaril really get all that shit just for voting for themselves. The bribers said yes they did. The Yssaril voted for themselves, and the Space Nerds played a bribery card and paid enough trade goods to win the vote outright. I tried to repeal it later and they sabotaged the repeal.
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Powerpuppiesdrinking coffee in themountain cabinRegistered Userregular
I got On Mars to the table today. It's really great, but I would say not perfect. Or at least, I need a few more plays to really get into the nitty gritty. The downside is that it's an incredibly heavy and complex game, but on my first playthrough I'm not 100% convinced it needed that level of complexity to be good. I don't think anything was needlessly complex, but there were so many different moving parts and systems and I'm not completely convinced it couldn't have been trimmed down a bit.
So you're saying it's a vital lacerda game huh
I still really liked it, and my group have all messaged me to ask me to play again soon.
I'm really curious to see how strategies unfold as you play.
I think maybe the right strategies depend a lot on the end conditions so it will be volatile
I'm not sure what you mean, the end conditions don't change from game to game. Or do you mean the mission cards?
Yes! That's the word. The mission cards. Both which mission cards and how many players you have seem to totally upend the game. You really have to learn the game deeply in order to get any better at the game itself and not just at 2player with easy missions or 4player with contracts and research tiles, or whatever
You don't need to complete the mission cards to end the game though. You only have to move the big red cube 3 times to trigger the end game. It moves when you either complete a mission, or when the LSS upgrades to levels 3 4 or 5. So any combination of those things can trigger end game. In our game, we finished 2 missions, and leveled the LSS to level 3 which ended the game.
Sure, but it's usually easy for one player to prevent triggering the level 3 upgrade, if they decide to do so early enough. They'll be the only one with a particular tech until the level one upgrade, and if they finish that complex for the level 2 upgrade, or if they don't move the tech when somebody else does, the level 3 can't happen until the same player spends 3 space actions buying and moving a duplicate copy of the tech. Maybe they can get the tech research tile and then rover around the board finding tech mover upgrades, but it's a huge, obnoxious investment and risks handing the game to somebody else. If you really want to prevent level 3, you can also stomp on relevant research tiles with a robot.
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AstaerethIn the belly of the beastRegistered Userregular
I won a marathon game of Twilight Imperium last night. Somebody tried to pick up speed slingshotting a baby death star past a gravity rift and the whole thing fell in and was lost.
I played the trader race, The Emirates of Hacan. On the first turn we were moving fast and nobody could trade due to being locked away near their homeworlds and not having any neighbors yet. That rule didn't apply to me. I negotiated two transactions when my turn began and the host was visibly disgusted.
I was throwing trade goods left and right like tips in the early game, and had a permanent alliance with the space nerds Jol-Nar player to my left. I originally intended to then overwhelm and conquer the space bullies Mentak to my right, but that player built up big fleets and mostly didn't use them. I didn't really end up fighting anyone.
I had a complicated win shot but drew into a secretive objective that I'd already finished and so had a simple win at the end of the turn.
I bought a racial tech that allows me at great cost to guarantee a strategy card, and was maneuvering to guarantee Imperial and score trade goods first action of the final turn. Someone jumped from 5 points of 10 to 9, which let me draw a secret objective as part of the Imperial secondary. The card I topdecked related to racial techs, so I had already finished it and could just score it for the win at round's end. . I was very committed to the slow roll and so nobody thought I had it this round. One person even commented in an offhand way "I mean he could have the secret objective. He could just be being stealthy." It didn't matter, none of them remembered that in hours past they'd elected me Minister of Peace and I had authorization to end an inconvenient adventure if it threatened me.
At one point I built 5 dreadnoughts for a secret objective, and just before I scored it drew a new secret objective.
It said end the round occupying the Galactic Senate with three ships in orbit. I moved all five into the senate and the previous occupier immediately fled, playing a Skilled Retreat card. He couldn't carry all his ground forces off the planet with him, so the one remaining ground force, shot from orbit by 5 dreadnoughts, became the only thing I shot all game. There was a public objective I hadn't scored for having six non-home planets occupied, and I only had 5 in my little corner, so the center of the universe became the sixth and scored me both that round's public objective and my secret objective.
As part of stalling long enough to invade the senate after everyone else had passed, I blew up the third space dock of the space bullies with an action card, reasoning that it wasn't good for much and maybe they had a secret objective to have all their space docks on the board. That was the player's secret objective, and he got mad, saying he was going to absolutely push my shit in next turn. I finished the turn for twenty minutes, and then as the cleanup happened discussed that I would have to leave the Senate and not score any senate points, and also take the first-action strategy card i didn't really need, in order to prevent his successful retaliation.
When he heard that his threatening response to my space dock sabotage had already cost me at least one point, and that I would be leaving the senate up for grabs, and that I was going to attack his power-projection forces first action with the fleet currently at the galactic senate, he lost a little bit of interest in the war. When I established that if he was willing to return to a detente, I was willing to take neither first-mover strategy nor senate-scoring strategy and move all of my ships and troops out of the senate first action, he agreed. It totally worked out for him, and he got the senate, and scored 4 points in one turn eventually, but I was able to just hang out peacefully in a defensive crouch and buy the win.
The wheeling and dealing at our table is great, and maybe why our games always go like twelve fucking hours. We had a single council vote that twisted like 5 times. Very strong "are you fucking kidding me!" energy.
It involved someone getting free technology for the rest of the game. Three of six players immediately made a deal involving the election of the Yssaril and a Political Rider card (cost: no Ghost votes cast) so that if the Yssaril won as predicted then the Space Ghosts became first actor and drew 3 action cards, leaving the Space Bullies second to act in exchange for their votes. The Space Ghosts brokered the deal and assassinated my representatives, so the Yssaril and Space Bullies only had to outvote 2 players. Since I couldn't cast votes anyway, I put a Construction Rider on the Yssaril win. Seeing that the Yssaril had enough votes to win without them, the Space Bullies added an Imperial rider for a point and a Tech rider for a free tech, all if the Yssaril won.
So now the situation was either the Yssaril won, and got free tech for the rest of the game, and I got a space dock, and the ghosts got 3 action cards and first actor, and the bullies got a point and a tech, or somebody else won and got free tech for the rest of the game. Not wanting the bullies to get a point and a tech, I revealed that I was going to repeal this law second action next turn, so the winner would only get free tech once. The Yssaril looked at me with revulsion and said they were now going to vote against themselves. The bullies and the ghosts gave them massive bribes to vote for themselves after all. They agreed. I asked the terms of the deal, did the Yssaril really get all that shit just for voting for themselves. The bribers said yes they did. The Yssaril voted for themselves, and the Space Nerds played a bribery card and paid enough trade goods to win the vote outright. I tried to repeal it later and they sabotaged the repeal.
I’m convinced that the best strategy for TI is to do exactly what you did—quietly accumulate points, stay friends with pretty much everybody, avoid fighting, and then suddenly reveal you’ve shot ahead of the pack in points to claim victory.
I got On Mars to the table today. It's really great, but I would say not perfect. Or at least, I need a few more plays to really get into the nitty gritty. The downside is that it's an incredibly heavy and complex game, but on my first playthrough I'm not 100% convinced it needed that level of complexity to be good. I don't think anything was needlessly complex, but there were so many different moving parts and systems and I'm not completely convinced it couldn't have been trimmed down a bit.
So you're saying it's a vital lacerda game huh
I still really liked it, and my group have all messaged me to ask me to play again soon.
I'm really curious to see how strategies unfold as you play.
I think maybe the right strategies depend a lot on the end conditions so it will be volatile
I'm not sure what you mean, the end conditions don't change from game to game. Or do you mean the mission cards?
Yes! That's the word. The mission cards. Both which mission cards and how many players you have seem to totally upend the game. You really have to learn the game deeply in order to get any better at the game itself and not just at 2player with easy missions or 4player with contracts and research tiles, or whatever
You don't need to complete the mission cards to end the game though. You only have to move the big red cube 3 times to trigger the end game. It moves when you either complete a mission, or when the LSS upgrades to levels 3 4 or 5. So any combination of those things can trigger end game. In our game, we finished 2 missions, and leveled the LSS to level 3 which ended the game.
Sure, but it's usually easy for one player to prevent triggering the level 3 upgrade, if they decide to do so early enough. They'll be the only one with a particular tech until the level one upgrade, and if they finish that complex for the level 2 upgrade, or if they don't move the tech when somebody else does, the level 3 can't happen until the same player spends 3 space actions buying and moving a duplicate copy of the tech. Maybe they can get the tech research tile and then rover around the board finding tech mover upgrades, but it's a huge, obnoxious investment and risks handing the game to somebody else. If you really want to prevent level 3, you can also stomp on relevant research tiles with a robot.
But you only need the upgrade tech for complexes, if someone really wanted to end the game, they could just build standalone buildings without making it a complex. The only downside to building standalone vs building a complex is you don't get as many units of that particular resource once you build it, and you don't get to put your marker on the complex box below the LSS, but if you've already built one complex in that column anyways, it doesn't make much of a difference.
I got On Mars to the table today. It's really great, but I would say not perfect. Or at least, I need a few more plays to really get into the nitty gritty. The downside is that it's an incredibly heavy and complex game, but on my first playthrough I'm not 100% convinced it needed that level of complexity to be good. I don't think anything was needlessly complex, but there were so many different moving parts and systems and I'm not completely convinced it couldn't have been trimmed down a bit.
So you're saying it's a vital lacerda game huh
I still really liked it, and my group have all messaged me to ask me to play again soon.
I'm really curious to see how strategies unfold as you play.
I think maybe the right strategies depend a lot on the end conditions so it will be volatile
I'm not sure what you mean, the end conditions don't change from game to game. Or do you mean the mission cards?
Yes! That's the word. The mission cards. Both which mission cards and how many players you have seem to totally upend the game. You really have to learn the game deeply in order to get any better at the game itself and not just at 2player with easy missions or 4player with contracts and research tiles, or whatever
You don't need to complete the mission cards to end the game though. You only have to move the big red cube 3 times to trigger the end game. It moves when you either complete a mission, or when the LSS upgrades to levels 3 4 or 5. So any combination of those things can trigger end game. In our game, we finished 2 missions, and leveled the LSS to level 3 which ended the game.
Sure, but it's usually easy for one player to prevent triggering the level 3 upgrade, if they decide to do so early enough. They'll be the only one with a particular tech until the level one upgrade, and if they finish that complex for the level 2 upgrade, or if they don't move the tech when somebody else does, the level 3 can't happen until the same player spends 3 space actions buying and moving a duplicate copy of the tech. Maybe they can get the tech research tile and then rover around the board finding tech mover upgrades, but it's a huge, obnoxious investment and risks handing the game to somebody else. If you really want to prevent level 3, you can also stomp on relevant research tiles with a robot.
But you only need the upgrade tech for complexes, if someone really wanted to end the game, they could just build standalone buildings without making it a complex. The only downside to building standalone vs building a complex is you don't get as many units of that particular resource once you build it, and you don't get to put your marker on the complex box below the LSS, but if you've already built one complex in that column anyways, it doesn't make much of a difference.
Hmmmm, I was taught that it doesn't jump the marker for colony upgrades unless you build a complex of size (target upgrade level +1). So in order to have the upgrade level help end the game, somebody must build a size 3 complex of water, batteries, oxygen, and plants.
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Powerpuppiesdrinking coffee in themountain cabinRegistered Userregular
I won a marathon game of Twilight Imperium last night. Somebody tried to pick up speed slingshotting a baby death star past a gravity rift and the whole thing fell in and was lost.
I played the trader race, The Emirates of Hacan. On the first turn we were moving fast and nobody could trade due to being locked away near their homeworlds and not having any neighbors yet. That rule didn't apply to me. I negotiated two transactions when my turn began and the host was visibly disgusted.
I was throwing trade goods left and right like tips in the early game, and had a permanent alliance with the space nerds Jol-Nar player to my left. I originally intended to then overwhelm and conquer the space bullies Mentak to my right, but that player built up big fleets and mostly didn't use them. I didn't really end up fighting anyone.
I had a complicated win shot but drew into a secretive objective that I'd already finished and so had a simple win at the end of the turn.
I bought a racial tech that allows me at great cost to guarantee a strategy card, and was maneuvering to guarantee Imperial and score trade goods first action of the final turn. Someone jumped from 5 points of 10 to 9, which let me draw a secret objective as part of the Imperial secondary. The card I topdecked related to racial techs, so I had already finished it and could just score it for the win at round's end. . I was very committed to the slow roll and so nobody thought I had it this round. One person even commented in an offhand way "I mean he could have the secret objective. He could just be being stealthy." It didn't matter, none of them remembered that in hours past they'd elected me Minister of Peace and I had authorization to end an inconvenient adventure if it threatened me.
At one point I built 5 dreadnoughts for a secret objective, and just before I scored it drew a new secret objective.
It said end the round occupying the Galactic Senate with three ships in orbit. I moved all five into the senate and the previous occupier immediately fled, playing a Skilled Retreat card. He couldn't carry all his ground forces off the planet with him, so the one remaining ground force, shot from orbit by 5 dreadnoughts, became the only thing I shot all game. There was a public objective I hadn't scored for having six non-home planets occupied, and I only had 5 in my little corner, so the center of the universe became the sixth and scored me both that round's public objective and my secret objective.
As part of stalling long enough to invade the senate after everyone else had passed, I blew up the third space dock of the space bullies with an action card, reasoning that it wasn't good for much and maybe they had a secret objective to have all their space docks on the board. That was the player's secret objective, and he got mad, saying he was going to absolutely push my shit in next turn. I finished the turn for twenty minutes, and then as the cleanup happened discussed that I would have to leave the Senate and not score any senate points, and also take the first-action strategy card i didn't really need, in order to prevent his successful retaliation.
When he heard that his threatening response to my space dock sabotage had already cost me at least one point, and that I would be leaving the senate up for grabs, and that I was going to attack his power-projection forces first action with the fleet currently at the galactic senate, he lost a little bit of interest in the war. When I established that if he was willing to return to a detente, I was willing to take neither first-mover strategy nor senate-scoring strategy and move all of my ships and troops out of the senate first action, he agreed. It totally worked out for him, and he got the senate, and scored 4 points in one turn eventually, but I was able to just hang out peacefully in a defensive crouch and buy the win.
The wheeling and dealing at our table is great, and maybe why our games always go like twelve fucking hours. We had a single council vote that twisted like 5 times. Very strong "are you fucking kidding me!" energy.
It involved someone getting free technology for the rest of the game. Three of six players immediately made a deal involving the election of the Yssaril and a Political Rider card (cost: no Ghost votes cast) so that if the Yssaril won as predicted then the Space Ghosts became first actor and drew 3 action cards, leaving the Space Bullies second to act in exchange for their votes. The Space Ghosts brokered the deal and assassinated my representatives, so the Yssaril and Space Bullies only had to outvote 2 players. Since I couldn't cast votes anyway, I put a Construction Rider on the Yssaril win. Seeing that the Yssaril had enough votes to win without them, the Space Bullies added an Imperial rider for a point and a Tech rider for a free tech, all if the Yssaril won.
So now the situation was either the Yssaril won, and got free tech for the rest of the game, and I got a space dock, and the ghosts got 3 action cards and first actor, and the bullies got a point and a tech, or somebody else won and got free tech for the rest of the game. Not wanting the bullies to get a point and a tech, I revealed that I was going to repeal this law second action next turn, so the winner would only get free tech once. The Yssaril looked at me with revulsion and said they were now going to vote against themselves. The bullies and the ghosts gave them massive bribes to vote for themselves after all. They agreed. I asked the terms of the deal, did the Yssaril really get all that shit just for voting for themselves. The bribers said yes they did. The Yssaril voted for themselves, and the Space Nerds played a bribery card and paid enough trade goods to win the vote outright. I tried to repeal it later and they sabotaged the repeal.
I’m convinced that the best strategy for TI is to do exactly what you did—quietly accumulate points, stay friends with pretty much everybody, avoid fighting, and then suddenly reveal you’ve shot ahead of the pack in points to claim victory.
normally i am much more of a bully and shit-stirrer. This game was off-brand for me. It worked great. Support for the throne is an interesting mechanic - I might embrace a binding "you lose a point if you activate each other's systems" alliance even without the initial point gain.
Powerpuppies on
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tzeentchlingDoctor of RocksOaklandRegistered Userregular
Played Scythe this weekend for only the second time ever, with my friend who had never played it and a friend who had also only played it once. Managed to win the game as well! I don't think my engine was as fully efficient as it could have been, but it did enough. Helped that I was able to get a factory card that let me pay two gold to Enlist and bump mil, because I never would have been able to consistently get the food to Enlist otherwise. Still, we all enjoyed and will probably try to work the game into our rotation more often.
I got On Mars to the table today. It's really great, but I would say not perfect. Or at least, I need a few more plays to really get into the nitty gritty. The downside is that it's an incredibly heavy and complex game, but on my first playthrough I'm not 100% convinced it needed that level of complexity to be good. I don't think anything was needlessly complex, but there were so many different moving parts and systems and I'm not completely convinced it couldn't have been trimmed down a bit.
So you're saying it's a vital lacerda game huh
I still really liked it, and my group have all messaged me to ask me to play again soon.
I'm really curious to see how strategies unfold as you play.
I think maybe the right strategies depend a lot on the end conditions so it will be volatile
I'm not sure what you mean, the end conditions don't change from game to game. Or do you mean the mission cards?
Yes! That's the word. The mission cards. Both which mission cards and how many players you have seem to totally upend the game. You really have to learn the game deeply in order to get any better at the game itself and not just at 2player with easy missions or 4player with contracts and research tiles, or whatever
You don't need to complete the mission cards to end the game though. You only have to move the big red cube 3 times to trigger the end game. It moves when you either complete a mission, or when the LSS upgrades to levels 3 4 or 5. So any combination of those things can trigger end game. In our game, we finished 2 missions, and leveled the LSS to level 3 which ended the game.
Sure, but it's usually easy for one player to prevent triggering the level 3 upgrade, if they decide to do so early enough. They'll be the only one with a particular tech until the level one upgrade, and if they finish that complex for the level 2 upgrade, or if they don't move the tech when somebody else does, the level 3 can't happen until the same player spends 3 space actions buying and moving a duplicate copy of the tech. Maybe they can get the tech research tile and then rover around the board finding tech mover upgrades, but it's a huge, obnoxious investment and risks handing the game to somebody else. If you really want to prevent level 3, you can also stomp on relevant research tiles with a robot.
But you only need the upgrade tech for complexes, if someone really wanted to end the game, they could just build standalone buildings without making it a complex. The only downside to building standalone vs building a complex is you don't get as many units of that particular resource once you build it, and you don't get to put your marker on the complex box below the LSS, but if you've already built one complex in that column anyways, it doesn't make much of a difference.
Hmmmm, I was taught that it doesn't jump the marker for colony upgrades unless you build a complex of size (target upgrade level +1). So in order to have the upgrade level help end the game, somebody must build a size 3 complex of water, batteries, oxygen, and plants.
Nope, just a building. According to the rules: "Each time a Building tile is placed on the board, move the marker in its column 1 space up, unless it is already at the top of the column."
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Edit: Ooh, interesting mechanics!
Pete must complete 4 goals, befitting of him being in multiple shorts. (Also of note, I think this is the first time Mickey's gonna be a hero card? Maybe?)
Cruella appears to need to collect 99 Dalmatians, with tokens in denominations of 11 and 22.
Mother Gothel is aiming to collect either 20 or 30 resources, very much like Prince John.
No, it doesn't have the board for example
Damn it. I am not going to be able to cram 3 more villains in that box. They're gonna need to Sentinels this shit.
It is:
- Fun
- Thematic
- Beautiful
- Accommodates a variety of play styles across the different characters
But also:
- Not particularly balanced
- Has a lot of downtime at high player counts
- Can lead to hard feelings due to how the Fate mechanism works
It's good! The art is beautiful, the theme is obviously great, and each character feels very well expressed through their own unique mechanics. Honestly that's probably the thing I'm most impressed with in the game. It also just feels different. I wouldn't be able to point out another game in my collection that feels mechanically similar. It does everything it can to pull in a wide variety of players, and get them all on the same page, too. I find it can be a good time with just about any group of folks who are halfway interested in playing Disney villains.
For cons, it can run a bit too long with higher playercounts. Some of the newer characters are actually quite complicated, which can discourage new players when they get in over their head (although the game's character-specific player aids are really nice), and there are definitely balance issues where some characters will just struggle to get all their shit together for a win by the end of the game. How much that bothers you may vary; for me, sometimes a game having a "hard mode" character or team can be a good thing.
Edit: Aannnnd Jonbob said everything more succinctly
I learned after the second standalone expansion came out that it was a mistake for me to try to keep them in the base box. I can't regain the one that I threw away, but going forward they're just all going to be in separate boxes. It's a pain for my storage space, but the boxes and inserts are all really nice.
Looks like I'm going to be breaking my self-imposed kickstarter hiatus.
I have the first 12 villains in there comfortably (had to toss the Power Bowl but no great loss). I do not have room for 3 more.
Isn't it a different worker placement game that has that bumping mechanic? The grande worker in Viticulture only allows it to be placed at a full location (in addition to being able to be played as a regular worker).
In any case, Viticulture is still one of my top introductory games into the mid-weight level of game complexity. The theme makes it fairly easy to teach, and it feels like it has the right balance of luck via card draws to overarching strategy to keep players interested.
I've only played Viticulture once but I do know that Euphoria (also) uses the "worker bump" mechanic for some spaces.
Let's get us a Xehanort up in here.
COME FORTH, AMATERASU! - Switch Friend Code SW-5465-2458-5696 - Twitch
Yeah, every time I've played V:E it just shared the space, it didn't bump a worker out. So either I've been playing that wrong or it doesn't bump in that game.
Edit: Looked it up, yeah it doesn't bump. Just shares the spot. Nothing indicates it returns a worker to another player.
"The grande worker follows the rules for regular workers but also has a special ability: The grande worker may be placed
on a fully occupied action on the board to perform that action. Multiple players may place their grande workers in this
way. A grande worker placed on a bonus action space will give you the bonus (just like a regular worker); otherwise it does not
give you a bonus."
Steam ID
On the plus side though, it's a worker placement game with direct interaction, which is really damn cool. Unlike other worker placement games like Caverna, Anachrony, Feast for Odin, etc. where they sometimes get the reputation as being multiplayer solitaire, in On Mars, you're all building on the same place, and really you're all working onthe same colony, and it's kind of a race to exploit the limited space that you have. So you can block other players, and if you see someone setting up a big move, you can really step on their toes.
Also, unlike many other worker placement games, you don't simply get to place all of your workers each turn/round. You get one main action and one executive action per round no matter how many workers you have access to, and they only make their way back into your home (and become available to place) under certain conditions. This means turns at the end of the game don't get absurdly long when one player is taking 7 actions or something like that.
Also the build quality of the game is top notch. All the pieces look and feel excellent, they fit together perfectly, and they look really really good.
Can't say I'm a fan. We played with a random map and number layout, which led to some very poor availability of wheat and wood. Cities and Kights just emphasized the core issues I have with Catan. Despite the probability that 6/8 would be one of the most often results, 9 and 5 came up the most, and 2 and 11 came up as often as 6 or 8. I went 6 turns (4 player game) without getting any resources at the start of the game. Despite sitting on a stone/wheat/sheep intersection, my main resource for half the game was brick. I lost half my hand twice to the robber, due to having card combinations that I couldn't build, and no one wanting my resources. Fortunately, we never suffered a city burning down (mostly from feeling bad my son would have been the one to lose his city). Game took about 2.5 hours.
Can't say I'm too eager to play again, perhaps without any of my kids. My wife definitely wouldn't care for it. I had hoped it would improve the game, but losing a resource to commodities just slowed everything down.
Anyone have suggestions? My brother-in-law was pretty excited about this expansion and I feel it will get played again, but would love a suggestion to make it faster or more even.
Playing Catan with the card deck helps smooth out the randomness of the die, but it still doesnt make it a very good game IMO.
I think the dice that come with the game are weighted poorly. Feels like they never roll right. I use my level up pax D6 normally, but with Cities and Knights you have to know which is the red one.
I didn't know that was a thing. Will have to look.
My group's literal reaction after "finishing" Seafall.
So you're saying it's a vital lacerda game huh
I still really liked it, and my group have all messaged me to ask me to play again soon.
I'm really curious to see how strategies unfold as you play.
I think maybe the right strategies depend a lot on the end conditions so it will be volatile
I'm not sure what you mean, the end conditions don't change from game to game. Or do you mean the mission cards?
Yes! That's the word. The mission cards. Both which mission cards and how many players you have seem to totally upend the game. You really have to learn the game deeply in order to get any better at the game itself and not just at 2player with easy missions or 4player with contracts and research tiles, or whatever
You don't need to complete the mission cards to end the game though. You only have to move the big red cube 3 times to trigger the end game. It moves when you either complete a mission, or when the LSS upgrades to levels 3 4 or 5. So any combination of those things can trigger end game. In our game, we finished 2 missions, and leveled the LSS to level 3 which ended the game.
One specialist worker does let you do that if they're in the game. The grande can just always take an action at base power.
I was throwing trade goods left and right like tips in the early game, and had a permanent alliance with the space nerds Jol-Nar player to my left. I originally intended to then overwhelm and conquer the space bullies Mentak to my right, but that player built up big fleets and mostly didn't use them. I didn't really end up fighting anyone.
I had a complicated win shot but drew into a secretive objective that I'd already finished and so had a simple win at the end of the turn.
As part of stalling long enough to invade the senate after everyone else had passed, I blew up the third space dock of the space bullies with an action card, reasoning that it wasn't good for much and maybe they had a secret objective to have all their space docks on the board. That was the player's secret objective, and he got mad, saying he was going to absolutely push my shit in next turn. I finished the turn for twenty minutes, and then as the cleanup happened discussed that I would have to leave the Senate and not score any senate points, and also take the first-action strategy card i didn't really need, in order to prevent his successful retaliation.
When he heard that his threatening response to my space dock sabotage had already cost me at least one point, and that I would be leaving the senate up for grabs, and that I was going to attack his power-projection forces first action with the fleet currently at the galactic senate, he lost a little bit of interest in the war. When I established that if he was willing to return to a detente, I was willing to take neither first-mover strategy nor senate-scoring strategy and move all of my ships and troops out of the senate first action, he agreed. It totally worked out for him, and he got the senate, and scored 4 points in one turn eventually, but I was able to just hang out peacefully in a defensive crouch and buy the win.
The wheeling and dealing at our table is great, and maybe why our games always go like twelve fucking hours. We had a single council vote that twisted like 5 times. Very strong "are you fucking kidding me!" energy.
So now the situation was either the Yssaril won, and got free tech for the rest of the game, and I got a space dock, and the ghosts got 3 action cards and first actor, and the bullies got a point and a tech, or somebody else won and got free tech for the rest of the game. Not wanting the bullies to get a point and a tech, I revealed that I was going to repeal this law second action next turn, so the winner would only get free tech once. The Yssaril looked at me with revulsion and said they were now going to vote against themselves. The bullies and the ghosts gave them massive bribes to vote for themselves after all. They agreed. I asked the terms of the deal, did the Yssaril really get all that shit just for voting for themselves. The bribers said yes they did. The Yssaril voted for themselves, and the Space Nerds played a bribery card and paid enough trade goods to win the vote outright. I tried to repeal it later and they sabotaged the repeal.
Sure, but it's usually easy for one player to prevent triggering the level 3 upgrade, if they decide to do so early enough. They'll be the only one with a particular tech until the level one upgrade, and if they finish that complex for the level 2 upgrade, or if they don't move the tech when somebody else does, the level 3 can't happen until the same player spends 3 space actions buying and moving a duplicate copy of the tech. Maybe they can get the tech research tile and then rover around the board finding tech mover upgrades, but it's a huge, obnoxious investment and risks handing the game to somebody else. If you really want to prevent level 3, you can also stomp on relevant research tiles with a robot.
I’m convinced that the best strategy for TI is to do exactly what you did—quietly accumulate points, stay friends with pretty much everybody, avoid fighting, and then suddenly reveal you’ve shot ahead of the pack in points to claim victory.
But you only need the upgrade tech for complexes, if someone really wanted to end the game, they could just build standalone buildings without making it a complex. The only downside to building standalone vs building a complex is you don't get as many units of that particular resource once you build it, and you don't get to put your marker on the complex box below the LSS, but if you've already built one complex in that column anyways, it doesn't make much of a difference.
Hmmmm, I was taught that it doesn't jump the marker for colony upgrades unless you build a complex of size (target upgrade level +1). So in order to have the upgrade level help end the game, somebody must build a size 3 complex of water, batteries, oxygen, and plants.
normally i am much more of a bully and shit-stirrer. This game was off-brand for me. It worked great. Support for the throne is an interesting mechanic - I might embrace a binding "you lose a point if you activate each other's systems" alliance even without the initial point gain.
Nope, just a building. According to the rules: "Each time a Building tile is placed on the board, move the marker in its column 1 space up, unless it is already at the top of the column."