I mean the US doesn't have accurate numbers because people still aren't being tested, either by lack of tests or criteria requirements that are dumb as f.
bear in mind the dumb as fuck criteria are because there aren't enough tests so it needs to be rationed somehow
Yeah one problem leads to the other, but this far into the crisis that we still don't have tests is insulting. Like there is no good god damn reason we shouldn't have an abundance of tests.
I was under the impression that the tests were dependent upon chemicals produced by only one or two companies and that were in globally unprecedentedly high demand.
Yes, that's the reason, but it's not a good reason. If our tests have this dependency, we need a different test. We need enough tests that we can properly contact trace infections and stop spread.
RT-PCR is a fairly cumbersome procedure to run and requires lots of hands-on time from the operator. And I'd also assume prepping the tests are time consuming since it's non-standardized yet.
This is not your CSI swab-goes-into-magic-box kind of test.
Though there are a shit load RT-PCR machines available around the world, not least in research, which could be drafted into use if someone was willing to train some lab techs in bioassay protocols I guess.
But I've also heard the (unconfirmed?) thing about the reagents being proprietary to Roche. But that is something which could obviously be overridden by government legislation. If it is patented the constituents are not even a secret.
I mean the US doesn't have accurate numbers because people still aren't being tested, either by lack of tests or criteria requirements that are dumb as f.
bear in mind the dumb as fuck criteria are because there aren't enough tests so it needs to be rationed somehow
Yeah one problem leads to the other, but this far into the crisis that we still don't have tests is insulting. Like there is no good god damn reason we shouldn't have an abundance of tests.
I was under the impression that the tests were dependent upon chemicals produced by only one or two companies and that were in globally unprecedentedly high demand.
They're only produced by them because it's a trade secret or something iirc. At that point I feel it's justifiable to seize the formula so it can be produced in sufficient quantities.
CNN is reporting that there is a backlog of 160,000 tests at just ONE lab. Not all of them, just one has a backlog of 160,000 tests. That is ridiculous .
Watching CNN again, the ticket said 100 sailors on aboard the Roosevelt have tested positive and 1,000 out of 4,000 has been tested. I'm a former sailor and was on an aircraft carrier, there's no way to enforce a mass quarantine, they need to get people off the ship.
The fact basically nothing has been done pisses me off and I feel for those sailors aboard.
Gov Newsom just announced K-12 school buildings will remain closed through the rest of the year.
Edit: also the UC system is suspending the SAT requirement for students looking to start in Fall 21 and is also dropping the minimum grade requirements for classes taken during 2020
Watching CNN again, the ticket said 100 sailors on aboard the Roosevelt have tested positive and 1,000 out of 4,000 has been tested. I'm a former sailor and was on an aircraft carrier, there's no way to enforce a mass quarantine, they need to get people off the ship.
The fact basically nothing has been done pisses me off and I feel for those sailors aboard.
How the fuck are they caring for the sailors that need ICU treatment???
Holy fuck there’s going to be hundreds of dead service people here if they don’t do something
+25
TetraNitroCubaneThe DjinneratorAt the bottom of a bottleRegistered Userregular
I'd also be wary of California trending down and appearing low. Remember that the testing ceiling and testing criteria continue to confound these numbers in a way that makes them suspect. CA is still extremely short on tests, and basically not testing anyone who isn't already WAY sick.
Yeah, unfortunately we're at the point where deaths are the only reliable statistic and you can project things based on that.
fair to point out even deaths aren't reliable because many places are only counting those who die in hospital from the virus
It's worse than this because not even all hospital deaths due to COVID are being reported as such. The only way we're going to get an idea is in looking back at deaths now vs prior year Q1-Q2 deaths, and those numbers won't be available for some time. "How many people died today in Kansas" is not a number you can find out today, or even this week.
I'm not sure if people really understand what's going on here. Let me see if I can recontextualize in different terms, because I watch this happen in my own job right now.
My IT support team does (let's say) a thousand support tickets a month. You'd think that would be a good measure of how much work they're doing, but it's not - it's a good measure of how much reporting they're doing. Part of my job is trying to bring the reporting in line with the work as much as I can, so that we can accurately forecast and prepare for future work. The reasons for this are myriad, but the two key ones are:
- sometimes, people do work and don't report because it appears trivial. "Hey, can I get a couple batteries? My mouse died..." is work, but it's frequently not recorded.
- sometimes people do work and don't report because they're too busy to take the time. "The printer broke and 5 people reported it" is 6 units of work, but maybe only one gets reported.
The result of this is that a graph of support tickets is counter-intuitive. When work is heavy and complex, reporting falls instead of increasing because in times of crisis, the record of the work is seen as less important than the work itself, and the volume doesn't decrease below baseline after the work is done so the reporting never catches up. We might report 900 tickets when in reality we did more like 1750. In times of slowness, reporting increases instead of falling because there's time to focus on the records of the work - we might report 1400 tickets because that's actually closer to our true baseline average of 1500, a number we are only dimly aware of.
Knowing the true baseline is challenging because of the first problem, and knowing the trendline is challenging because of the second. Right now we're in exactly the same kind of situation with the pandemic. We don't know the baseline because we're not doing a good job of setting it (we're not testing effectively anywhere - often we're doing it in paces where we already know the answer, and not doing it in places where we're most blind) and we don't know the trendline because the work is heavy and complex so our record of the work is an inaccurate measurement to a degree we do not know. We don't even have a previous event to look back on and say "in times like these, we fail to report at about a 20% rate" - we literally have no idea how off base our trendline is.
We don't know how much work there is, and we don't know how much the work is increasing.
But we likely won’t have an estimate of how many Americans have died as a result of the pandemic for a very long time—maybe months, maybe a year. We will almost certainly never know the exact number.
...
People who already had conditions—heart conditions, respiratory conditions—[their] deaths could result from the exacerbation of those existing conditions. How do you count somebody who died of a heart attack during a natural disaster? Do you call it a disaster death or a heart-attack death? There’s no rules. None. And particularly from country to country.
... What you’ll hear about disaster deaths from the CDC is only those that can be absolutely verified as being directly related to that disaster. Then they’ll list all the heart-attack victims. They might call them indirect, but they won’t call them directly related to the disaster.
...
People who have chronic heart conditions, nothing to do with coronavirus, are crowded out of the emergency rooms because there's no space for them. So the death rate will rise with people like that. Do you count them?
Given that we are having problems with testing we might even have people who would have tested positive and died but don't get counted as a COVID19 death if the test was never done.
CommunistCow on
No, I am not really communist. Yes, it is weird that I use this name.
Gov Newsom just announced K-12 school buildings will remain closed through the rest of the year.
Edit: also the UC system is suspending the SAT requirement for students looking to start in Fall 21 and is also dropping the minimum grade requirements for classes taken during 2020
Breaking: 47 long-term care facilities in Georgia have COVID-19 outbreaks that the state is investigating, Georgia Health Commissioner Kathleen Toomey said today.
State of georgia has not provided a list of 47 facilities with #coronavirus outbreaks.
This particular quote from the article stood out to me
Asked Wednesday whether he was receiving security protection, Fauci told reporters, “I would have to refer you to HHS [inspector general] on that. I wouldn’t comment.”
The president interjected, saying, “He doesn’t need security. Everybody loves him.”
So the US ventilator stockpile is worse than it could be because the administration let the contract with the company in charge of maintaining the stockpile expire and some of those being shipped are being shipped broken.
A Ventilator Stockpile, With One Hitch: Thousands Do Not Work
While President Trump has assured states that thousands of ventilators remain at the ready, thousands more are in storage, unmaintained or otherwise unusable.
WASHINGTON — President Trump has repeatedly assured Americans that the federal government is holding 10,000 ventilators in reserve to ship to the hardest-hit hospitals around the nation as they struggle to keep the most critically ill patients alive.
But what federal officials have neglected to mention is that an additional 2,109 lifesaving devices are unavailable after the contract to maintain the government’s stockpile lapsed late last summer, and a contracting dispute meant that a new firm did not begin its work until late January. By then, the coronavirus crisis was already underway.
The revelation came in response to inquiries to the Department of Health and Human Services after state officials reported that some of the ventilators they received were not operational, stoking speculation that the administration had not kept up with the task of maintaining the stockpile.
In fact, the contract with a company that was maintaining the machines expired at the end of last summer, and a contract protest delayed handing the job to Agiliti, a Minneapolis-based provider of medical equipment services and maintenance. Agiliti was not given the $38 million task until late January, when the scope of the global coronavirus crisis was first becoming clear.
California recently discovered that 170 of its ventilators arrived broken, disputing the claim from the Department of Health and Human Services that all of the ventilators shipped by the Federal Emergency Management Agency were ready to use. The agency said in a statement that problems with some ventilators were limited to the devices’ external batteries, and that federal officials were quick to assist the states with any technical issues.
As White House officials have for the first time looked at a supply they had not thought about, they have discovered it is not only far smaller than what they need — it is also in constant need of maintenance.
Aric Vacchiano, the vice president of U.S. sales and services at Vyaire Medical in Chicago, which produces the LTV 1200, one of the ventilators in the federal stockpile, said the company had been fielding calls from all over the country as hospital officials rushed to get the machines in working order.
“They’re reaching out in every direction,” Mr. Vacchiano said.
Vyaire was responsible for maintaining some of the ventilators in the federal stockpile until that contract ran out in late August. The company protested when a broader contract to keep the stockpile up-to-date was granted to Agiliti instead. The dispute was not resolved until January, when Agiliti again prevailed.
It then received thousands of ventilators — it would not say how many — for restoration, and that work is still underway.
Officials in Illinois say they asked for 4,000 and got 450. New Jersey sought 2,300 and got 300. New Mexico has only 370. Virginia requested 350 ventilators but has not received any. The governor of Illinois asked Vice President Mike Pence for 4,000 ventilators this week and was told the state would not need that many.
Illinois is now going to need far more than that.
Couscous on
+32
lonelyahavaCall me Ahava ~~She/Her~~Move to New ZealandRegistered Userregular
NZ updates:
There have been 89 new confirmed and probable cases of Covid-19 reported in New Zealand, bringing the total number of cases to 797.
Director-General of Health Dr Ashley Bloomfield said 92 people had now recovered from the coronavirus. Thirteen people are in hospital, two are in ICU in Wellington and Nelson. All patients are stable and there have been no further deaths.
Dr Bloomfield said 51 percent of cases still have a strong link to travel and 31 percent are links to confirmed cases. Only 1 percent are being classed as community transmission, but 17 percent are still being contact traced.
He said the country was not at the turnaround point yet - with the biggest number of cases and tests done in one day.
He said 2563 tests were done yesterday. More than 26,000 tests now conducted.
California recently discovered that 170 of its ventilators arrived broken, disputing the claim from the Department of Health and Human Services that all of the ventilators shipped by the Federal Emergency Management Agency were ready to use. The agency said in a statement that problems with some ventilators were limited to the devices’ external batteries, and that federal officials were quick to assist the states with any technical issues.
It looks like a California company had been working on them over the weekend, though I haven't kept up with it since seeing this article on Sunday.
Newsom said that the stockpile of ventilators had been sent to Los Angeles County by the Department of Health and Human Services (HHS). He noted that a company called Bloom Energy was fixing the equipment.
“Rather than lamenting about it, rather than complaining about it, rather than pointing fingers, rather than generating headlines in order to generate more stress and anxiety, we got a car and a truck,” Newsom said after touring Bloom Energy's ventilator refurbishing site in Sunnyvale, Calif.
The governor's office said in a statement Saturday that California had 7,500 ventilators throughout its hospital systems before the COVID-19 outbreak. The state has added more than 4,200 since, though about 1,000 have required repair.
Bloom Energy was expected to refurbish approximately 200 ventilators by Saturday, and the defective ventilators Los Angeles County received are set to be returned by Monday, Newsom added.
There have been 89 new confirmed and probable cases of Covid-19 reported in New Zealand, bringing the total number of cases to 797.
Director-General of Health Dr Ashley Bloomfield said 92 people had now recovered from the coronavirus. Thirteen people are in hospital, two are in ICU in Wellington and Nelson. All patients are stable and there have been no further deaths.
Dr Bloomfield said 51 percent of cases still have a strong link to travel and 31 percent are links to confirmed cases. Only 1 percent are being classed as community transmission, but 17 percent are still being contact traced.
He said the country was not at the turnaround point yet - with the biggest number of cases and tests done in one day.
He said 2563 tests were done yesterday. More than 26,000 tests now conducted.
Dr Bloomfield should really be shortlisted for a knighthood, based on his performance in this crisis. Looking at his communication with the country at large, I struggle to see how he could be clearer, or more reassuring
+9
daveNYCWhy universe hate Waspinator?Registered Userregular
3,589 in the Czech Republic as of yesterday. That's an 8% increase from the day before and the previous few days were all 10% or lower increases, so hopefully things are marginally under control. Testing is at about 5000 or so a day. Death numbers are starting to hit now, so it's going to be ugly for a bit.
Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
There have been 89 new confirmed and probable cases of Covid-19 reported in New Zealand, bringing the total number of cases to 797.
Director-General of Health Dr Ashley Bloomfield said 92 people had now recovered from the coronavirus. Thirteen people are in hospital, two are in ICU in Wellington and Nelson. All patients are stable and there have been no further deaths.
Dr Bloomfield said 51 percent of cases still have a strong link to travel and 31 percent are links to confirmed cases. Only 1 percent are being classed as community transmission, but 17 percent are still being contact traced.
He said the country was not at the turnaround point yet - with the biggest number of cases and tests done in one day.
He said 2563 tests were done yesterday. More than 26,000 tests now conducted.
Dr Bloomfield should really be shortlisted for a knighthood, based on his performance in this crisis. Looking at his communication with the country at large, I struggle to see how he could be clearer, or more reassuring
There have been 89 new confirmed and probable cases of Covid-19 reported in New Zealand, bringing the total number of cases to 797.
Director-General of Health Dr Ashley Bloomfield said 92 people had now recovered from the coronavirus. Thirteen people are in hospital, two are in ICU in Wellington and Nelson. All patients are stable and there have been no further deaths.
Dr Bloomfield said 51 percent of cases still have a strong link to travel and 31 percent are links to confirmed cases. Only 1 percent are being classed as community transmission, but 17 percent are still being contact traced.
He said the country was not at the turnaround point yet - with the biggest number of cases and tests done in one day.
He said 2563 tests were done yesterday. More than 26,000 tests now conducted.
Dr Bloomfield should really be shortlisted for a knighthood, based on his performance in this crisis. Looking at his communication with the country at large, I struggle to see how he could be clearer, or more reassuring
New Zealand has knighthoods?
It's a member of the Commonwealth of Nations, which I believe qualifies you for knighthood from the Queen of England.
There have been 89 new confirmed and probable cases of Covid-19 reported in New Zealand, bringing the total number of cases to 797.
Director-General of Health Dr Ashley Bloomfield said 92 people had now recovered from the coronavirus. Thirteen people are in hospital, two are in ICU in Wellington and Nelson. All patients are stable and there have been no further deaths.
Dr Bloomfield said 51 percent of cases still have a strong link to travel and 31 percent are links to confirmed cases. Only 1 percent are being classed as community transmission, but 17 percent are still being contact traced.
He said the country was not at the turnaround point yet - with the biggest number of cases and tests done in one day.
He said 2563 tests were done yesterday. More than 26,000 tests now conducted.
Dr Bloomfield should really be shortlisted for a knighthood, based on his performance in this crisis. Looking at his communication with the country at large, I struggle to see how he could be clearer, or more reassuring
New Zealand has knighthoods?
It's a member of the Commonwealth of Nations, which I believe qualifies you for knighthood from the Queen of England.
Yes, I know. I'm Canadian. I've even been to a Commonwealth Games. I was wondering if it was something more local. For honours in Canada we have "The Order of Canada"
You only get an Knighthood from the Queen of England if someone in Westminster who can add names to the list adds your name.
In the context of being a New Zealander, she's the Queen of New Zealand so you get your knighthoods from her in that position as advised through her Ministers i.e at the discretion of whatever system of honours the nation uses. So yeah eligible for a Knighthood.
Same with all the other Dominions and Kingdoms. I think even in Canada you are a "Knight of the Order of Canada" which is an obscure Paladin Prestige Class that lets you choose a Dire Beaver as your mount
I dont know what a second great depression looks like in 2020 but this is looking like it will be one.
I'm really not so sure. This isn't a natural collapse, it's an imposed one by the government. Once the quarantine is lifted there will be months of pent up demand. Thanks to the Relief Bill keeping people whole until June. All those people filing for unemployment are now going to get $2,400/month from Uncle Sam on top of whatever their State provides.
Premier Legault is asking the police to be ''less tolerant'' with those who break the rules.
"You won't destroy us, You won't destroy our democracy. We are a small but proud nation. No one can bomb us to silence. No one can scare us from being Norway. This evening and tonight, we'll take care of each other. That's what we do best when attacked'' - Jens Stoltenberg
"The U.S. Tried to Build a New Fleet of Ventilators. The Mission Failed." New York Times, 2020-03-29
In 2007 a new division of the DHHS, Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority, estimated that we needed an additional 70,000 ventilators. Design and production of a new generation of mobile, easy-to-use ventilators was contracted out to Newport Medical Instruments in 2008. They were to cost about 1/4th of the ventilators on the market at the time. However in 2012 Newport was bought by Covidien (ironic name), they demanded additional funding and a higher sales price. By 2014 they wanted out of the contract, the government agreed to cancel the contract. The division started over with a new contract with Philips. The new ventilator is to be delivered this year.
Essentially there was a 6 year delay on these ventilator because the original contract holders were bought by another company that wanted more profit.
"The U.S. Tried to Build a New Fleet of Ventilators. The Mission Failed." New York Times, 2020-03-29
In 2007 a new division of the DHHS, Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority, estimated that we needed an additional 70,000 ventilators. Design and production of a new generation of mobile, easy-to-use ventilators was contracted out to Newport Medical Instruments in 2008. They were to cost about 1/4th of the ventilators on the market at the time. However in 2012 Newport was bought by Covidien (ironic name), they demanded additional funding and a higher sales price. By 2014 they wanted out of the contract, the government agreed to cancel the contract. The division started over with a new contract with Philips. The new ventilator is to be delivered this year.
Essentially there was a 6 year delay on these ventilator because the original contract holders were bought by another company that wanted more profit.
Alternatively, that "1/4 cost" was a low bid to get the contract that turned out to be unrealistic.
"The U.S. Tried to Build a New Fleet of Ventilators. The Mission Failed." New York Times, 2020-03-29
In 2007 a new division of the DHHS, Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority, estimated that we needed an additional 70,000 ventilators. Design and production of a new generation of mobile, easy-to-use ventilators was contracted out to Newport Medical Instruments in 2008. They were to cost about 1/4th of the ventilators on the market at the time. However in 2012 Newport was bought by Covidien (ironic name), they demanded additional funding and a higher sales price. By 2014 they wanted out of the contract, the government agreed to cancel the contract. The division started over with a new contract with Philips. The new ventilator is to be delivered this year.
Essentially there was a 6 year delay on these ventilator because the original contract holders were bought by another company that wanted more profit.
Alternatively, that "1/4 cost" was a low bid to get the contract that turned out to be unrealistic.
It's medical equipment on a government procurement contract so I assume that was still 10x what they actually cost to make.
Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
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RT-PCR is a fairly cumbersome procedure to run and requires lots of hands-on time from the operator. And I'd also assume prepping the tests are time consuming since it's non-standardized yet.
This is not your CSI swab-goes-into-magic-box kind of test.
Though there are a shit load RT-PCR machines available around the world, not least in research, which could be drafted into use if someone was willing to train some lab techs in bioassay protocols I guess.
But I've also heard the (unconfirmed?) thing about the reagents being proprietary to Roche. But that is something which could obviously be overridden by government legislation. If it is patented the constituents are not even a secret.
They're only produced by them because it's a trade secret or something iirc. At that point I feel it's justifiable to seize the formula so it can be produced in sufficient quantities.
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The fact basically nothing has been done pisses me off and I feel for those sailors aboard.
Edit: also the UC system is suspending the SAT requirement for students looking to start in Fall 21 and is also dropping the minimum grade requirements for classes taken during 2020
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/amp/UC-schools-to-temporarily-suspend-SAT-scores-15172141.php
How the fuck are they caring for the sailors that need ICU treatment???
Holy fuck there’s going to be hundreds of dead service people here if they don’t do something
Just saw this article covering specific counting issues related to COVID19 deaths:
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2020/04/how-many-americans-will-die-coronavirus/609175/
Highlights:
Given that we are having problems with testing we might even have people who would have tested positive and died but don't get counted as a COVID19 death if the test was never done.
You missed the word academic in front of year.
Meanwhile, a reporter with the Atlanta Journal Constitution broke this story this evening.
Philip is the White House bureau chief for the Washington Post
MAGA twitter and the Trump side of things have been attacking him online for weeks. I have been worrying about his life for a while.
McCormick Place right now. A month ago it was C2E2
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/01/us/politics/coronavirus-ventilators.html Well, that sounds like murderous incompetence.
There have been 89 new confirmed and probable cases of Covid-19 reported in New Zealand, bringing the total number of cases to 797.
Director-General of Health Dr Ashley Bloomfield said 92 people had now recovered from the coronavirus. Thirteen people are in hospital, two are in ICU in Wellington and Nelson. All patients are stable and there have been no further deaths.
Dr Bloomfield said 51 percent of cases still have a strong link to travel and 31 percent are links to confirmed cases. Only 1 percent are being classed as community transmission, but 17 percent are still being contact traced.
He said the country was not at the turnaround point yet - with the biggest number of cases and tests done in one day.
He said 2563 tests were done yesterday. More than 26,000 tests now conducted.
Source Article
Democrats Abroad! || Vote From Abroad
It looks like a California company had been working on them over the weekend, though I haven't kept up with it since seeing this article on Sunday.
Dr Bloomfield should really be shortlisted for a knighthood, based on his performance in this crisis. Looking at his communication with the country at large, I struggle to see how he could be clearer, or more reassuring
So the jobless claims numbers have doubled in a week..
Which is amazing, considering the previous week was like 6x the previous all time record.
New Zealand has knighthoods?
It's a member of the Commonwealth of Nations, which I believe qualifies you for knighthood from the Queen of England.
I dont know what a second great depression looks like in 2020 but this is looking like it will be one.
Yes, I know. I'm Canadian. I've even been to a Commonwealth Games. I was wondering if it was something more local. For honours in Canada we have "The Order of Canada"
In the context of being a New Zealander, she's the Queen of New Zealand so you get your knighthoods from her in that position as advised through her Ministers i.e at the discretion of whatever system of honours the nation uses. So yeah eligible for a Knighthood.
Same with all the other Dominions and Kingdoms. I think even in Canada you are a "Knight of the Order of Canada" which is an obscure Paladin Prestige Class that lets you choose a Dire Beaver as your mount
Looks bad guys. Actually incidentally my company said today we have 14 confirmed cases amongst our employees! Happy days
I'm really not so sure. This isn't a natural collapse, it's an imposed one by the government. Once the quarantine is lifted there will be months of pent up demand. Thanks to the Relief Bill keeping people whole until June. All those people filing for unemployment are now going to get $2,400/month from Uncle Sam on top of whatever their State provides.
I am not surprised and probably a good choice. Republicans have not moved theirs as far as I have heard.
Trump finally got his wall
Confirmed cases : 5,518 (+907!!!)
Deaths : 36 (+3)
Patients in ICU : 96 (+14)
Under investigation : 4,871 (-899)
Negtive tests : 69,024 (+3,942)
Premier Legault is asking the police to be ''less tolerant'' with those who break the rules.
But... but the DOW Jones went UP last week!
(Which means the stock market actually fucking sucks and shouldn't be used as a barometer to measure the health of our economy)
Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
In 2007 a new division of the DHHS, Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority, estimated that we needed an additional 70,000 ventilators. Design and production of a new generation of mobile, easy-to-use ventilators was contracted out to Newport Medical Instruments in 2008. They were to cost about 1/4th of the ventilators on the market at the time. However in 2012 Newport was bought by Covidien (ironic name), they demanded additional funding and a higher sales price. By 2014 they wanted out of the contract, the government agreed to cancel the contract. The division started over with a new contract with Philips. The new ventilator is to be delivered this year.
Essentially there was a 6 year delay on these ventilator because the original contract holders were bought by another company that wanted more profit.
Alternatively, that "1/4 cost" was a low bid to get the contract that turned out to be unrealistic.
It's medical equipment on a government procurement contract so I assume that was still 10x what they actually cost to make.