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The [Bread] Thread! A Thread all about Bread!

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  • schussschuss Registered User regular
    I am now sad because I have new rye flour to bake with but gashed my finger open so no working dough for a few days...

  • tynictynic PICNIC BADASS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    Have you considered kneading with your elbows

    Tynnan
  • KalTorakKalTorak One way or another, they all end up in the Undercity.Registered User regular
    or that foot-kneading thing that potters do

  • lonelyahavalonelyahava Call me Ahava ~~She/Her~~ Move to New ZealandRegistered User regular
    the towel trick kind of worked?

    I mean it still stuck to the towel and by the time i got it unstuck the shape kind of deflated anyways and looked like the same amorphous blob that I've been getting when I just oil the bowl instead.

    Should I try to reshape the boule after I take it out of the bowl? or would that overwork it and deflate it too much?

  • SilverWindSilverWind Registered User regular
    #pipe wrote: »
    Hey what do you bread heads do with starter that's not bread? I don't wanna just chuck it after every feed

    Literally as Uriel surmised, toss some salt and random spices in and mix (right now I've got some generic "pizza spice" blend but I've also done paprika, sumac, etc), stir, dump it into a hot oiled pan. Flip once when the bubbles start to form! You get a great sour chewy savoury pancake.

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  • #pipe#pipe Cocky Stride, Musky odours Pope of Chili TownRegistered User regular
    SilverWind wrote: »
    #pipe wrote: »
    Hey what do you bread heads do with starter that's not bread? I don't wanna just chuck it after every feed

    Literally as Uriel surmised, toss some salt and random spices in and mix (right now I've got some generic "pizza spice" blend but I've also done paprika, sumac, etc), stir, dump it into a hot oiled pan. Flip once when the bubbles start to form! You get a great sour chewy savoury pancake.

    Neat! I will try that! I actually found a recipe that was just that only it also added grated cheddar and some green onions. That sounds delicious.

    As for this time, I made that King Arthur cinnamon raisin bread. It is extremely soft and quite delicious, but it collapsed like crazy. There is zero structure and it just squishes when you cut it. But still, very tasty.

    V1mtynicPeen
  • lonelyahavalonelyahava Call me Ahava ~~She/Her~~ Move to New ZealandRegistered User regular
    Not quite the xpected shape, but it tastes pretty great

    2ro4dmpbyz74.jpg

    14q104uyvfbw.jpg

    tynic3clips3webguy20XaquinV1mFrylockHolmes
  • schussschuss Registered User regular
    edited May 2020
    the towel trick kind of worked?

    I mean it still stuck to the towel and by the time i got it unstuck the shape kind of deflated anyways and looked like the same amorphous blob that I've been getting when I just oil the bowl instead.

    Should I try to reshape the boule after I take it out of the bowl? or would that overwork it and deflate it too much?

    Gently shape it. I shape mine 2-3 times depending on the dough. Also if it's that sticky, bulk fermentation may not be done, don't be afraid to give it more time than the book if you don't have constant 75-80 temps in your house (or just put in the oven with just the oven light on). You should be able to dust the top, then flip and shape to make a relatively non sticky dough ball (top becomes bottom then you stretch it around the other dough). Also, don't be afraid of reflouring your surface.
    My last set:
    7cbk4l3ht31n.jpg

    schuss on
    lonelyahavatynic
  • XaquinXaquin Right behind you!Registered User regular
    anyone have a tried and true gluten free bread recipe?

    I have had little success with the "cup for cup" doughs

  • webguy20webguy20 I spend too much time on the Internet Registered User regular
    edited May 2020
    Xaquin wrote: »
    anyone have a tried and true gluten free bread recipe?

    I have had little success with the "cup for cup" doughs

    Good luck. The few folks I know who've tried didn't have much success. There was much mucking about with Xanthum gum and other things. At least if your trying to emulate a traditional wheat flour based bread.

    webguy20 on
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    Xaquin
  • tynictynic PICNIC BADASS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    Is rice flour sufficiently gluten free? I’ve never done western style gluten free bread but steamed buns /bao aren’t too difficult to get right. (You can freeze em to keep em)

  • webguy20webguy20 I spend too much time on the Internet Registered User regular
    tynic wrote: »
    Is rice flour sufficiently gluten free? I’ve never done western style gluten free bread but steamed buns /bao aren’t too difficult to get right. (You can freeze em to keep em)

    I imagine it would all come down to if it was processed in facilities that also deal in wheat flour, or just dedicated to rice flour. I bet any western rice flour is going to be contaminated, but maybe rice flour out of Asia could be good.

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  • SilverWindSilverWind Registered User regular
    edited May 2020
    Xaquin wrote: »
    anyone have a tried and true gluten free bread recipe?

    I have had little success with the "cup for cup" doughs

    @Xaquin

    This was my go-to recipe for years when Wyborn thought gluten was an issue. You can't really shape the dough in the same way (you have to just kinda prod/coax it into the rough shape) and you definitely need to weigh all the flours, so get a scale. The outside is nice and crusty and the insides nice and fluffy.


    Baguettes

    Ingredients
    []316 g white rice flour
    []125 g tapioca flour
    []1 rounded tablespoon xanthan gum
    []1.5 teaspoons salt
    []2 tablespoons sugar
    []1.5 cups hot water (110 F - ~40 seconds)
    []2 tablespoons yeast
    []30 g melted butter (2 tablespoons)
    []4 egg whites, beaten slightly
    []1 teaspoon apple cider vinegar
    []some melted butter for brushing

    Directions
    1. In the bowl of a heavy-duty mixer, place flours, xanthan gum and salt. Blend with mixer on low.
    2. In a small bowl dissolve the sugar in the water, and add yeast.
    3. Wait until the mixture foams slightly, then blend into the dry ingredients.
    4. Add the butter, egg whites, and vinegar. Beat on high for 3 minutes.
    5. To form loaves, spoon dough onto greased and cornmeal-dusted cookie sheets in two long French-loaf shapes or spoon into special French-bread pans.
    6. Cover the dough and let rise in a warm place until doubled in bulk, 20 to 25 minutes.
    7. Slash diagonally every few inches. Brush with melted butter.
    8. Preheat oven to 400 degrees. Bake for 35-40 minutes.
    9. Remove from pan to cool.


    I do recommend getting a baguette pan as it bakes much more nicely that way


    edit: Oh, and I had noted down a sandwich bread recipe, though I don't recall using it too many times, I generally didn't record things if they weren't at least half decent

    Sandwich Bread
    Ingredients

    []420 g flour mix
    []105 g brown rice flour
    []130 g white rice flour
    []75 g tapioca flour
    []105 g sweet glutinous rice flour
    []5 g xanthan gum
    []2 tsp xanthan gum (this is in addition to the xanthan gum in the flour mix)
    []4 tsp baking powder
    []1 tsp salt
    []4 tablespoons granulated sugar
    []2 tablespoons active dry yeast
    []1 1/2 cups warm milk (about 110 degrees F)
    []2 teaspoons apple cider vinegar
    []1/4 cup olive oil or butter
    []2 extra large eggs, room temperature

    Directions
    1. Preheat oven to 375 degrees F.
    2. Oil and flour a 9 x 5 x 3 loaf pan.
    3. Place warm milk into a small bowl. Whisk in 1 tablespoon of sugar until dissolved. Whisk in yeast until dissolved. Set aside to proof.
    4. In a medium bowl, mix together the flour, xanthan gum, baking powder, salt, and the remaining 3 tablespoons sugar.
    5. In the bowl of a stand mixer fitted with the paddle attachment, place eggs, olive oil / butter, and vinegar. Beat for a few seconds to combine. Add the yeast mixture. Beat a few seconds more to combine. Add the flour mixture. Beat on medium high for 3 minutes.
    6. Scrape mixture into the prepared loaf pan and smooth the top.
    7. Heat wet washcloth in microwave. Then, place loaf pan into microwave, resting hot dishcloth on top of loaf pan, and closing the microwave door.
    8. Let dough rise until just over the pan.
    9. Bake at 375 degrees for 30 - 40 minutes.
    10. Remove from oven and let cool in pan for 5 minutes. Then carefully turn out onto rack to cool completely.

    This second recipe was a tweaked version of this - not sure where the first one came from

    SilverWind on
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    Xaquin
  • lonelyahavalonelyahava Call me Ahava ~~She/Her~~ Move to New ZealandRegistered User regular
    Chef John has a recipe for a Brazilian cheese bread that uses tapioca flour.

    Xaquin
  • tynictynic PICNIC BADASS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited May 2020
    Oh yeah, pao de queijo is legit and gluten free. Love that shit.

    tynic on
    Xaquin3clips3
  • SolventSolvent Econ-artist กรุงเทพมหานครRegistered User regular
    I wanted to get in on the bread baking during isolation but my oven is total shit. Anyway, to sate the urge I made pan-fried garlic and rosemary flatbread.

    ewicrygky9y4.jpg

    Warm out of the pan it tasted brilliant. After cooling - still good, but the texture changes a little for the worse.

    I ate with spinach sauteed in garlic and soy sauce, some tuna and a fried egg.

    I don't know where he got the scorpions, or how he got them into my mattress.

    http://newnations.bandcamp.com
    honovereBahamutZEROlonelyahavaTallahasseerielJedocwebguy20
  • PinfeldorfPinfeldorf Realtor Santa ClaritaRegistered User regular
    Can you make bread out of buckwheat flour? My understanding is it's gluten free.

  • GrisloGrislo Registered User regular
    I thiiiink many buckwheat products are a mixture of that and something else (like many noodles that are thought of as buckwheat also contain plain wheat flour), but I've seen like buckwheat/quinoa stuff. It's often not super classically bread-y, though.

    I'm sure there are many breads, and other products, that use just buckwheat, but I feel like there's a reason (texture, taste, etc) that it's often mixed with something else.

    This post was sponsored by Goop.

    'Get your fucking finger on the wookie'
    Xaquin
  • XaquinXaquin Right behind you!Registered User regular
  • SilverWindSilverWind Registered User regular
    Ah yes, Brazillian cheese bread is fantastic and deadly and by default gluten free (it uses just tapioca if I recall correctly--I have a recipe stashed away for that too if you can't find a satisfactory one. :D

    Also I dunno if I've recommended it before but it bears repeating that Alton Brown's The Chewy chocolate chip cookie's gluten free version is wonderous and glutenated people have loved it just as much as the regular stuff. https://www.foodnetwork.com/recipes/alton-brown/the-chewy-gluten-free-recipe-1947962

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  • lonelyahavalonelyahava Call me Ahava ~~She/Her~~ Move to New ZealandRegistered User regular
    I have another loaf of sourdough going.

    I'm trying a counter proof instead of fridge. And I added some black pepper into the mix along with the salt.

    I've had to switch to a bigger bowl already, so I have a feeling this is going to be a large loaf.

    It's so fluffy.

  • Lost SalientLost Salient blink twice if you'd like me to mercy kill youRegistered User regular
    KalTorak wrote: »
    or that foot-kneading thing that potters do


    RUVCwyu.jpg
    "Sandra has a good solid anti-murderer vibe. My skin felt very secure and sufficiently attached to my body when I met her. Also my organs." HAIL SATAN
  • honoverehonovere Registered User regular
    Is it okay to replace some of the bread flour in a recipe with whole wheat flour? 1-1 by weight or some other ratio?

  • 3clips33clips3 I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    honovere wrote: »
    Is it okay to replace some of the bread flour in a recipe with whole wheat flour? 1-1 by weight or some other ratio?

    Tentative yes, but you can't do 1-1. Bread flour has more protein, so you'll need to do more work than the recipe indicates for adequate gluten development, and whole wheat flour tends to suck up more water than bread flour or AP flour, so you may also need to up the hydration.

    tynichonoverewebguy20Tynnan
  • honoverehonovere Registered User regular
    edited May 2020
    Thanks. Then I will try the original recipe first before making any adjustment.

    Edit: well, it looks nothing like in the recipe and kinda misshapen, but it tastes amazing with some strong olive oil, salt, and pepper.
    8kosjqjgtpjh.jpg
    2zhxaayo0s3y.jpg

    More edits: probably used the wrong flour. It's the King Arthur Flour recipe for French country bread and it calls for bread flour. German flour labeling is completely different so I probably used some that's more like all purpose flour by mistake.

    honovere on
  • tynictynic PICNIC BADASS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    Crust looks great! but yeah the crumb seems a little tight.
    My (very ancient) memory of baking in germany is that you want flour type 812 (8 something anyway) - I don't recall if they list gluten content anywhere, it probably depends on the brand, but ideally you'd want to look for something over 10%.

    that said, I've made perfectly good bread with all purpose flour and pastry flour, it just requires more working.

    honovere
  • honoverehonovere Registered User regular
    King Arthur bread flourlour is apparently very high in protein.
    Flour variety ist still not back to normal here, sadly.

    Made another bread. Different recipe. This time I reduced the water content to deal with the reduced protein content. Also mixed in some whole wheat.

    r0gw53tg2mc8.jpg

    A bit closer to what the recipe shows, but the boules still don't keep their shape as well and the slashes didn't come out so nice. Not enough rise while baking, I guess.
    50aaweogpmcr.jpg

    Blake TlonelyahavaJedocbowenwebguy20tynicPeensomething a million times dumber
  • something a million times dumbersomething a million times dumber JUDGE BROSEF Registered User regular
    et7hji8b95mg.jpg

    basic white sandwich bread. it's shaped a little weird because I did it bad, but the taste and texture are probably the best I've ever made. the recipe is from the great bitish bake off cookbook.

    webguy20tynicJedochonovereTynnanbowenlonelyahavaV1mPeenSilverWind
  • Ashaman42Ashaman42 Registered User regular
    I made two loaves worth of sourdough Saturday, one all white and one part white part wholemeal. Then I went for a bike ride and by the time I got back they'd both risen well more than a doubling in size. And I just could not be arsed to bake them. So I knocked them both back and shaped them and stuck the wholemeal in the freezer and the white in the fridge. Didn't do anything yesterday as I was having a lazy day but I've got the fridge loaf out coming up to room temperature then I'll sling it in the oven.

    We shall see how it comes out. At least even if it doesn't come out perfect it'll still most likely be tasty. Unless I make a complete brick.

  • ThegreatcowThegreatcow Lord of All Bacons Washington State - It's Wet up here innit? Registered User regular
    Oh lordy I have converted to the alter of the Cast Iron dutch oven for bread making and it is GLORIOUS. Used KJLA's no kneed recipe again. Let it ferment about 16 hours before forming it into a shape for the final rise I heated up the oven to 450 with a lodge cast iron dutch oven inside. Right as I put the loaf in I sprinkled a bunch of parmesan/romano cheese I had leftover from a Carbonara prep from a week ago and sprinkled some garlic powder and shallot pepper as well. Freaking GLORIOUS. The crust was the perfect blend of chewy/crunchy and that cheese on top oh man, I didn't even need butter with that crust it was so good. 22 Minutes covered and another 22 uncovered. Perfect.

    g2kxgdy7pe18.jpg
    r9amrszjbszr.jpg

    XaquinTynnanAshaman42LaOsbowenwebguy20JedochonoveretynicPeen
  • Ashaman42Ashaman42 Registered User regular
    Twasn't a brick. I went for a lower temperature than I have been following and it worked, less of a done crust than I've been getting but I was slightly premature getting it out of the oven, the very middle wasn't quite done but, with some butter and scrambled egg on top it was a fantastic lunch. Pictures to follow.

    Got a much better rise in the oven and the top looked great but the bottom split a bit, you'll see what I mean.

  • ProlegomenaProlegomena Frictionless Spinning The VoidRegistered User regular
    What's the opinion of assembled bread wisdom regarding:

    mix dough in the evening, let rise for a couple of hours, shape and then prove in the fridge overnight before baking in the morning

    vs

    mix dough in the evening, let rise in the fridge overnight; shape, prove and bake in the morning

    yeasted rather than sourdough if that makes any difference

  • DepressperadoDepressperado I just wanted to see you laughing in the pizza rainRegistered User regular
    ya'll makin' cheese bread in here? should be making cheese bread.

    Xaquinsomething a million times dumberPeen
  • TynnanTynnan seldom correct, never unsure Registered User regular
    edited June 2020
    I've been doing overnight proof on the countertop (it's still slightly cool in the evenings here so it doesn't seem to be going too fast), turn once about 10-12 hours after mixing and second proof on countertop for about an hour. Then shape it on either my pizza peel or a sheet of parchment inside a cast iron pan, let that stand covered while the oven peheats, and then in it goes after about an hour of that. I haven't tried it the other way so I can't really compare the methods, but what I've been doing is working well.

    *This gives me an afternoon bake, but that's mostly because I'm setting up the dough at about midnight most times I do it. If I set it up in the late afternoon it could be a morning bake just fine.

    Tynnan on
  • KalTorakKalTorak One way or another, they all end up in the Undercity.Registered User regular
    My most recent loaf was following the Basics w/ Babish video, a pretty basic no-knead formula with bread flour, overnight countertop rise, shape, second proof for a couple hours. It came out tasty but the crumb is a lot more open than my preference; pretty chewy with lots of big bubbly holes. My question is, if I want a finer crumb, should I scrap the bread flour and just stick with AP, or could I fix it by kneading it a bit more thoroughly before shaping it? After the overnight rise, I handled it pretty delicately to get it into the loaf shape, and I noticed a lot of big bubbles from the rise were still in it. I figure if I punch/flatten it down more evenly then I might end up with a more even crumb.

    I don't mind the idea of going back to AP flour, I just figured I should try using bread flour since I already had some. I like doing an overnight rise though; I haven't been sleeping well so I end up wide awake late at night and putting bread dough together feels nice and productive.

  • lonelyahavalonelyahava Call me Ahava ~~She/Her~~ Move to New ZealandRegistered User regular
    Bread is out of the oven and she's looking so good.

    did the normal Mittens loaf, but I used the 50g Rye flour this time instead of all white bread flour.

    did a counter rest until bedtime and then into the fridge overnight. used the linen towel imbedded with a ton of flour inside my bowl.

    It came out of the bowl and towel amazingly, lovely woven texture on the loaf, got some good slashes in it. It's a tad darker than I like, but not burnt. and the linen/flour marks on the top look reallllllyyyyyy neat (for somebody that also weaves cloth as well)

    I want it to hurry up and cool down. I want some.

    webguy20ProlegomenaV1m
  • TynnanTynnan seldom correct, never unsure Registered User regular
    edited June 2020
    Ran out of KAF bread flour over the weekend and had to switch to Gold Medal bread flour. It’s so different. It’s like it’s just not developing gluten the same way, like it’s got substantially lower protein content. Still makes tasty bread, it’s just really difficult to work with. Comes out more like ciabatta than a regular loaf using the same recipe.

    Tynnan on
  • schussschuss Registered User regular
    What's the opinion of assembled bread wisdom regarding:

    mix dough in the evening, let rise for a couple of hours, shape and then prove in the fridge overnight before baking in the morning

    vs

    mix dough in the evening, let rise in the fridge overnight; shape, prove and bake in the morning

    yeasted rather than sourdough if that makes any difference

    They're both fine? For yeasted, I'd rather just bulk ferm overnight.

    Tonight's sourdough...
    4n4u23ajng2l.jpg
    b6nnpieupmof.jpg

    webguy20SilverWindBahamutZERO
  • tynictynic PICNIC BADASS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    KalTorak wrote: »
    My most recent loaf was following the Basics w/ Babish video, a pretty basic no-knead formula with bread flour, overnight countertop rise, shape, second proof for a couple hours. It came out tasty but the crumb is a lot more open than my preference; pretty chewy with lots of big bubbly holes. My question is, if I want a finer crumb, should I scrap the bread flour and just stick with AP, or could I fix it by kneading it a bit more thoroughly before shaping it? After the overnight rise, I handled it pretty delicately to get it into the loaf shape, and I noticed a lot of big bubbles from the rise were still in it. I figure if I punch/flatten it down more evenly then I might end up with a more even crumb.

    I don't mind the idea of going back to AP flour, I just figured I should try using bread flour since I already had some. I like doing an overnight rise though; I haven't been sleeping well so I end up wide awake late at night and putting bread dough together feels nice and productive.

    If you want a tight crumb then you want to avoid no-knead altogether, those use high hydration to allow the gluten development to occur without kneading and will always lead to large air bubbles and a chewier texture. If you want to do an evening make with a morning bake you can keep the bread flour but do a kneaded dough, and rise it in the fridge overnight to avoid over-proofing.

    3clips3
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