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Black Lives Matter Thread 4

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    HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    Oghulk wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    Oghulk wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    Oghulk wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    Solar wrote: »
    -Tal wrote: »
    there is an alternative to both electoral politics and selfish libertarianism; it is to read lenin

    Lenin's analysis is very outdated though
    I wouldn't doubt it but it's still probably worth the read to extrapolate on after.

    I actually want to read Marx's writings now. Not any of the "well here's a summary" shit that people have written, I mean a direct translation version.

    If you do read Marx I recommend reading all three volumes of Capital. He's kind of famously contradictory as his writings went on.
    I'll keep that in mind.

    I have conversations about it a lot, but it's kind of the main reason economists generally don't engage discussions on the labor theory of value. Later work contradicts earlier work and makes it hard to fully examine because "what did Marx really mean" becomes the inherent question a lot of the time.
    If it's consistently "later work contradicts earlier work," then it means the concept is evolving. Which seems fine and normal to me. Nothing should stay cemented in original writing or concept. Look at where we are with the Constitution of the USA, for example.

    True, but I should say that most of the time when things like LTV come up people refer to volume 1 Marx of it even though the idea evolved well past that.
    There's a podcast I listen to that thankfully is mindful of that when they recommended it.

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    OghulkOghulk Tinychat Janitor TinychatRegistered User regular
    Henroid wrote: »
    Oghulk wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    Oghulk wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    Oghulk wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    Solar wrote: »
    -Tal wrote: »
    there is an alternative to both electoral politics and selfish libertarianism; it is to read lenin

    Lenin's analysis is very outdated though
    I wouldn't doubt it but it's still probably worth the read to extrapolate on after.

    I actually want to read Marx's writings now. Not any of the "well here's a summary" shit that people have written, I mean a direct translation version.

    If you do read Marx I recommend reading all three volumes of Capital. He's kind of famously contradictory as his writings went on.
    I'll keep that in mind.

    I have conversations about it a lot, but it's kind of the main reason economists generally don't engage discussions on the labor theory of value. Later work contradicts earlier work and makes it hard to fully examine because "what did Marx really mean" becomes the inherent question a lot of the time.
    If it's consistently "later work contradicts earlier work," then it means the concept is evolving. Which seems fine and normal to me. Nothing should stay cemented in original writing or concept. Look at where we are with the Constitution of the USA, for example.

    True, but I should say that most of the time when things like LTV come up people refer to volume 1 Marx of it even though the idea evolved well past that.
    There's a podcast I listen to that thankfully is mindful of that when they recommended it.

    Yeah and that's just why I recommended going all the way through.

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    OghulkOghulk Tinychat Janitor TinychatRegistered User regular
    Also if you're reading for the labor theory of value I'd say read Smith and Ricardo as well because they also extensively engage with the idea.

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    DoodmannDoodmann Registered User regular
    Henroid wrote: »
    Oghulk wrote: »
    Conservatives think fascism and imperialism are rad as hell and want to do it as much as possible

    Liberals are uncomfortable with fascism but like the benefits of it too much to fight it all that hard, and pretty much also think imperialism is rad as hell

    What are the benefits of fascism that liberals like?

    $$$
    Unironically, and academically speaking, fascism is the end result of capitalism when it reaches its inevitable failure. By being pro-capitalism, people are inherently pro-fascism.

    Well that's only if your capitalist system is being fueled by one or many ethnic second classes that can be scapegoated for that failure.

    Which they all are, but it's not technically a necessary element of a capitalist society.

    Whippy wrote: »
    nope nope nope nope abort abort talk about anime
    I like to ART
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    Donovan PuppyfuckerDonovan Puppyfucker A dagger in the dark is worth a thousand swords in the morningRegistered User regular
    ♩♪♬♫♩♪♬♫♩♪♬♫ Engels is better than Marx so just read him instead ♩♪♬♫♩♪♬♫♩♪♬♫

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    LanzLanz ...Za?Registered User regular
    Capitalism is feudalism evolved to adapt around the changes in society and industry.


    But every chance it gets it tries to pull out the support structures of those changes so It doesn’t have to bother with the adaptations any longer.

    waNkm4k.jpg?1
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    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    edited July 2020
    I don't actually think from a purely political philosophy point of view that capitalism leads to fascism (fascism being quite a specific thing) but I do think that conservatism forms the soft foundations for the specific phenomenon of fascism (fascism needs anti-intellectualism, nationalism, traditionalism etc and conservatism provides all those things) and outside of certain very specific circumstances, conservatism and capitalism are intrinsically entwined. It is very rare to see non-free market espousing conservatives in almost any political culture.

    I also don't think classic liberalism is actually a precursor to fascism, or that they are pro-fascism (they are definitely pro-capital though) but I do think that it is unable to combat it effectively and neoliberalism is especially so, and that by facilitating capitalism they essentially facilitate strains of conservatism which then form the soft foundations etc etc etc. Like I don't believe that Pelosi is pro-fascist I just think she's entirely incapable of formulating a way to deal with fascism within her political philosophy and that the political philosophy she does have supports the economic system beloved by those who are pro-fascist or are proto-fascist. I also think that the shared interest in promoting capitalism that liberals and conservatives have will mean that they will fundamentally always ally against anti-capitalistic strains of political thought

    Solar on
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    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    This is the part of Solar's day when he remembers how the Conservatives always present Conservatism as not being an ideology but rather simply being at the confluence of "common sense," "individualism" and "opportunism" and how convincing anyone ever that Conservatism is anything other than hugely based in irrational ideological belief was 100% the greatest trick they ever played. The bastards. God I hate them.

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    Typhoid MannyTyphoid Manny Registered User regular
    .
    Solar wrote: »
    I don't actually think from a purely political philosophy point of view that capitalism leads to fascism (fascism being quite a specific thing) but I do think that conservatism forms the soft foundations for the specific phenomenon of fascism and outside of certain very specific circumstances, conservatism and capitalism are intrinsically entwined. It is very rare to see non-free market espousing conservatives in almost any political culture.

    I also don't think classic liberalism is actually a precursor to fascism, or that they are pro-fascism (they are definitely pro-capital though) but I do think that it is unable to combat it effectively and neoliberalism is especially so, and that by facilitating capitalism they essentially facilitate strains of conservatism which then form the soft foundations etc etc etc. Like I don't believe that Pelosi is pro-fascist I just think she's entirely incapable of formulating a way to deal with fascism within her political philosophy and that the political philosophy she does have supports the economic system beloved by those who are pro-fascist or are proto-fascist. I also think that the shared interest in promoting capitalism that liberals and conservatives have will mean that they will fundamentally always ally against anti-capitalistic strains of political thought

    pelosi probably isn't wholeheartedly in favor of fascism, but she absolutely 100% is more okay with rubber stamping the current admin's fascist priorities than she is with the most milquetoast of social democratic policies like sanders and ocasio-cortez and omar and tlaib are pushing for. i think that goes beyond just not having the ability to fight fascism, it reads much more like she considers the left wing of her own party to be a greater threat than the overtly fascistic shit the GOP is pushing for

    this is probably pretty uncharitable on my part, but she and the rest of the party leadership don't get the benefit of the doubt anymore. it seems clear to me at this point they know exactly what they're doing

    from each according to his ability, to each according to his need
    hitting hot metal with hammers
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    OghulkOghulk Tinychat Janitor TinychatRegistered User regular
    .
    Solar wrote: »
    I don't actually think from a purely political philosophy point of view that capitalism leads to fascism (fascism being quite a specific thing) but I do think that conservatism forms the soft foundations for the specific phenomenon of fascism and outside of certain very specific circumstances, conservatism and capitalism are intrinsically entwined. It is very rare to see non-free market espousing conservatives in almost any political culture.

    I also don't think classic liberalism is actually a precursor to fascism, or that they are pro-fascism (they are definitely pro-capital though) but I do think that it is unable to combat it effectively and neoliberalism is especially so, and that by facilitating capitalism they essentially facilitate strains of conservatism which then form the soft foundations etc etc etc. Like I don't believe that Pelosi is pro-fascist I just think she's entirely incapable of formulating a way to deal with fascism within her political philosophy and that the political philosophy she does have supports the economic system beloved by those who are pro-fascist or are proto-fascist. I also think that the shared interest in promoting capitalism that liberals and conservatives have will mean that they will fundamentally always ally against anti-capitalistic strains of political thought

    pelosi probably isn't wholeheartedly in favor of fascism, but she absolutely 100% is more okay with rubber stamping the current admin's fascist priorities than she is with the most milquetoast of social democratic policies like sanders and ocasio-cortez and omar and tlaib are pushing for. i think that goes beyond just not having the ability to fight fascism, it reads much more like she considers the left wing of her own party to be a greater threat than the overtly fascistic shit the GOP is pushing for

    this is probably pretty uncharitable on my part, but she and the rest of the party leadership don't get the benefit of the doubt anymore. it seems clear to me at this point they know exactly what they're doing

    See I don't read the things she's done or said as 100% more in favor of Trump et al. than Sanders et al. She might not support the social democratic wing of her party wholeheartedly, but would still support them before Trump and friends.

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    ShortyShorty touching the meat Intergalactic Cool CourtRegistered User regular
    Oghulk wrote: »
    .
    Solar wrote: »
    I don't actually think from a purely political philosophy point of view that capitalism leads to fascism (fascism being quite a specific thing) but I do think that conservatism forms the soft foundations for the specific phenomenon of fascism and outside of certain very specific circumstances, conservatism and capitalism are intrinsically entwined. It is very rare to see non-free market espousing conservatives in almost any political culture.

    I also don't think classic liberalism is actually a precursor to fascism, or that they are pro-fascism (they are definitely pro-capital though) but I do think that it is unable to combat it effectively and neoliberalism is especially so, and that by facilitating capitalism they essentially facilitate strains of conservatism which then form the soft foundations etc etc etc. Like I don't believe that Pelosi is pro-fascist I just think she's entirely incapable of formulating a way to deal with fascism within her political philosophy and that the political philosophy she does have supports the economic system beloved by those who are pro-fascist or are proto-fascist. I also think that the shared interest in promoting capitalism that liberals and conservatives have will mean that they will fundamentally always ally against anti-capitalistic strains of political thought

    pelosi probably isn't wholeheartedly in favor of fascism, but she absolutely 100% is more okay with rubber stamping the current admin's fascist priorities than she is with the most milquetoast of social democratic policies like sanders and ocasio-cortez and omar and tlaib are pushing for. i think that goes beyond just not having the ability to fight fascism, it reads much more like she considers the left wing of her own party to be a greater threat than the overtly fascistic shit the GOP is pushing for

    this is probably pretty uncharitable on my part, but she and the rest of the party leadership don't get the benefit of the doubt anymore. it seems clear to me at this point they know exactly what they're doing

    See I don't read the things she's done or said as 100% more in favor of Trump et al. than Sanders et al. She might not support the social democratic wing of her party wholeheartedly, but would still support them before Trump and friends.

    she just helped the republicans vote down an amendment originating from AOC which would have prevented the military from trying to recruit 13-year-olds

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    OghulkOghulk Tinychat Janitor TinychatRegistered User regular
    Shorty wrote: »
    Oghulk wrote: »
    .
    Solar wrote: »
    I don't actually think from a purely political philosophy point of view that capitalism leads to fascism (fascism being quite a specific thing) but I do think that conservatism forms the soft foundations for the specific phenomenon of fascism and outside of certain very specific circumstances, conservatism and capitalism are intrinsically entwined. It is very rare to see non-free market espousing conservatives in almost any political culture.

    I also don't think classic liberalism is actually a precursor to fascism, or that they are pro-fascism (they are definitely pro-capital though) but I do think that it is unable to combat it effectively and neoliberalism is especially so, and that by facilitating capitalism they essentially facilitate strains of conservatism which then form the soft foundations etc etc etc. Like I don't believe that Pelosi is pro-fascist I just think she's entirely incapable of formulating a way to deal with fascism within her political philosophy and that the political philosophy she does have supports the economic system beloved by those who are pro-fascist or are proto-fascist. I also think that the shared interest in promoting capitalism that liberals and conservatives have will mean that they will fundamentally always ally against anti-capitalistic strains of political thought

    pelosi probably isn't wholeheartedly in favor of fascism, but she absolutely 100% is more okay with rubber stamping the current admin's fascist priorities than she is with the most milquetoast of social democratic policies like sanders and ocasio-cortez and omar and tlaib are pushing for. i think that goes beyond just not having the ability to fight fascism, it reads much more like she considers the left wing of her own party to be a greater threat than the overtly fascistic shit the GOP is pushing for

    this is probably pretty uncharitable on my part, but she and the rest of the party leadership don't get the benefit of the doubt anymore. it seems clear to me at this point they know exactly what they're doing

    See I don't read the things she's done or said as 100% more in favor of Trump et al. than Sanders et al. She might not support the social democratic wing of her party wholeheartedly, but would still support them before Trump and friends.

    she just helped the republicans vote down an amendment originating from AOC which would have prevented the military from trying to recruit 13-year-olds

    Yeah idk I could be wrong

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    TheySlashThemTheySlashThem Registered User regular
    edited July 2020
    I'm sorry but reading Pelosi and Co.'s actions that charitably at this point strikes me as, at absolute best, utterly foolish

    TheySlashThem on
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    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    edited July 2020
    Edit: tbh this is just rambling

    The coherent thought I would say is that I don't think that the DNC (Pelosi and Biden and so on being emblemic of them) is actively pro-fascism but I do think they have some pretty abhorrent views in of themselves (they're cool with billionaires, and capitalist exploitation, and the CIA abducting people, and drone strikes, and authoritarian police violence etc), I think that they're utterly fucking out of touch, and I think that they have no coherent way to deal with fascism in America right now.

    Solar on
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    turtleantturtleant Gunpla Dad is the best.Registered User regular
    Found out today that third shift is being cut at the Harrisburg mail sorting plant starting on the 8th. I have to assume it's not just us.

    So uh, yeah, don't expect mail to get any better.

    X22wmuF.jpg
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    Donovan PuppyfuckerDonovan Puppyfucker A dagger in the dark is worth a thousand swords in the morningRegistered User regular
    I'm sorry but reading Pelosi and Co.'s actions that charitably at this point strikes me as, at absolute best, utterly foolish

    Yeah I'm not trying to pile on you here Oghulk, but Pelosi (and Schumer, and honestly? a LOT of the DNC seniority) have repeatedly proven themselves unreliable at best by this point.

    They'll make stupid actions like sarcastically clapping the POTUS or reading a speech that achieves literally nothing, but they'll also fall into lockstep with the GOP votes when it comes time to oppress minorities or even just do a bunch of fascism because hey, why not?

    Sure, they got rid of Debbie Wasserman Schultz after 2016.

    Didn't change a single fucking thing about the rest of the party, though.

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    Typhoid MannyTyphoid Manny Registered User regular
    Oghulk wrote: »
    .
    Solar wrote: »
    I don't actually think from a purely political philosophy point of view that capitalism leads to fascism (fascism being quite a specific thing) but I do think that conservatism forms the soft foundations for the specific phenomenon of fascism and outside of certain very specific circumstances, conservatism and capitalism are intrinsically entwined. It is very rare to see non-free market espousing conservatives in almost any political culture.

    I also don't think classic liberalism is actually a precursor to fascism, or that they are pro-fascism (they are definitely pro-capital though) but I do think that it is unable to combat it effectively and neoliberalism is especially so, and that by facilitating capitalism they essentially facilitate strains of conservatism which then form the soft foundations etc etc etc. Like I don't believe that Pelosi is pro-fascist I just think she's entirely incapable of formulating a way to deal with fascism within her political philosophy and that the political philosophy she does have supports the economic system beloved by those who are pro-fascist or are proto-fascist. I also think that the shared interest in promoting capitalism that liberals and conservatives have will mean that they will fundamentally always ally against anti-capitalistic strains of political thought

    pelosi probably isn't wholeheartedly in favor of fascism, but she absolutely 100% is more okay with rubber stamping the current admin's fascist priorities than she is with the most milquetoast of social democratic policies like sanders and ocasio-cortez and omar and tlaib are pushing for. i think that goes beyond just not having the ability to fight fascism, it reads much more like she considers the left wing of her own party to be a greater threat than the overtly fascistic shit the GOP is pushing for

    this is probably pretty uncharitable on my part, but she and the rest of the party leadership don't get the benefit of the doubt anymore. it seems clear to me at this point they know exactly what they're doing

    See I don't read the things she's done or said as 100% more in favor of Trump et al. than Sanders et al. She might not support the social democratic wing of her party wholeheartedly, but would still support them before Trump and friends.

    i think the democratic leadership are concerned with appearing to resist the president's shit without actually doing anything meaningful. shit like that kneeling stunt they did the other month, or pelosi ripping up the copy of the state of the union while also uncritically okaying the new DOD budget, all the while being actively hostile to people in their own party because they actually want to improve poor folks' lot at the expense of taxing billionaires marginally more. i don't see any way around the idea that the mainline democrats agree with the GOP on a lot more than they agree on with extremely modest socialism-type stuff

    from each according to his ability, to each according to his need
    hitting hot metal with hammers
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    DouglasDangerDouglasDanger PennsylvaniaRegistered User regular
    Will the Democrats come to the defense of the mail in any meaningful way?

    Have they ramped up the attack on McConnell and started delivering truckloads of cash to his Democrat challengers?

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    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    I think that they probably think the only way to win elections is to get small-c swing voters to appeal to them, AOC and so on never will, therefore they will shut them down for those reasons and also because these people are capitalists with aforementioned abhorrent views.

    I don't think they're sitting there thinking "we'd prefer Trump to AOC, that crazy socialist!" I think they're sitting there thinking "AOC is wrong, neoliberalism is good, we can make capitalism work, billionaires and the police (outside some bad apples we can deal with using good legislation) are fine anyway what is she complaining about, and also her policies are not electable and neoliberalism is anyway so whatever she needs to shut up and learn her place as a callow inexperienced youth, we will adopt these policies instead and that'll mean we'll defeat Trumpism," in a nutshell.

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    PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    Solar wrote: »
    I think that they probably think the only way to win elections is to get small-c swing voters to appeal to them, AOC and so on never will, therefore they will shut them down for those reasons and also because these people are capitalists with aforementioned abhorrent views.

    I don't think they're sitting there thinking "we'd prefer Trump to AOC, that crazy socialist!" I think they're sitting there thinking "AOC is wrong, neoliberalism is good, we can make capitalism work, billionaires and the police (outside some bad apples we can deal with using good legislation) are fine anyway what is she complaining about, and also her policies are not electable and neoliberalism is anyway so whatever she needs to shut up and learn her place as a callow inexperienced youth, we will adopt these policies instead and that'll mean we'll defeat Trumpism," in a nutshell.

    Gonna hire more female gestapo

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    KetBraKetBra Dressed Ridiculously Registered User regular
    Henroid wrote: »
    Solar wrote: »
    -Tal wrote: »
    there is an alternative to both electoral politics and selfish libertarianism; it is to read lenin

    Lenin's analysis is very outdated though
    I wouldn't doubt it but it's still probably worth the read to extrapolate on after.

    I actually want to read Marx's writings now. Not any of the "well here's a summary" shit that people have written, I mean a direct translation version.

    I totally forgot that I bought this bad boy back in undergrad (along with a similar vintage electrical engineering textbook)
    21Xi41R.jpg
    c98WsxR.jpg
    e6UA2du.jpg

    It's kind of a fun catch-all of selected Marx and Engels, with some stuff by Lenin and Stalin at the beginning. Obviously not an unbiased source, but an interesting historical document

    Now that I think of it, I wonder if my ultraconservative relatives saw it the times they've visited my apartment

    KGMvDLc.jpg?1
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    Typhoid MannyTyphoid Manny Registered User regular
    the most succinct way i can think of to describe what i'm trying to get at is the democrats (and liberals in general) want to sustain a status quo that is very quickly becoming not possible to sustain, and full-on unapologetic fascism is a lot closer to our status quo than socialism would be

    from each according to his ability, to each according to his need
    hitting hot metal with hammers
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    painfulPleasancepainfulPleasance The First RepublicRegistered User regular
    I'm sorry but reading Pelosi and Co.'s actions that charitably at this point strikes me as, at absolute best, utterly foolish

    Yeah I'm not trying to pile on you here Oghulk, but Pelosi (and Schumer, and honestly? a LOT of the DNC seniority) have repeatedly proven themselves unreliable at best by this point.

    They'll make stupid actions like sarcastically clapping the POTUS or reading a speech that achieves literally nothing, but they'll also fall into lockstep with the GOP votes when it comes time to oppress minorities or even just do a bunch of fascism because hey, why not?

    Sure, they got rid of Debbie Wasserman Schultz after 2016.

    Didn't change a single fucking thing about the rest of the party, though.

    They falsely accused a black man of rape to ensure her replacement would be loyal.

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    PlatyPlaty Registered User regular
    ♩♪♬♫♩♪♬♫♩♪♬♫ Engels is better than Marx so just read him instead ♩♪♬♫♩♪♬♫♩♪♬♫

    Both have super-fucked-up attitudes towards the poorest and most disadvantaged groups in society

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    tynictynic PICNIC BADASS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited July 2020
    The idea of Dirty cops existing is so acknowledg'd in American society that is practically a film genre

    That's not just the US mind
    I'd say it's a whole genre in Australia, UK, Hong Kong and Italy, to name but four
    in fact if there is a country that has failed to establish a strong cinematographic convention that cops are inherently corrupt and filthy then I would probably be giving a sharp eye to its state run censorship bureau.

    edit: if anything I'd say the thing I associate as being more 'american' than anywhere else is the convention that cops are the good guys.

    tynic on
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    ph blakeph blake Registered User regular
    edited July 2020
    In less BLM but still "our politicians are scumbags" news, they released the supposed to be redacted documents of Ghislaine Maxwell's court records today (Jeffery Epstein's assistant who scouted/trafficked underage girls for him).

    I say "supposed" because they completely fucked up, and you can read everything that is blacked out by just copy pasting the entire document into wordpad.

    ph blake on
    7h8wnycre6vs.png
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    StraightziStraightzi Here we may reign secure, and in my choice, To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered User regular
    Being bad at technology or intentionally trying to fuck up evidence?

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    H0b0manH0b0man Registered User regular
    It's also seems to be kinda inconsistent with when they do redact names and when they just kinda don't.

    FFXIV: Agran Trask
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    WeaverWeaver Who are you? What do you want?Registered User regular
    We're gonna have to burn RomeD.C.

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    Librarian's ghostLibrarian's ghost Librarian, Ghostbuster, and TimSpork Registered User regular
    edited July 2020
    Weaver wrote: »
    We're gonna have to burn RomeD.C.


    Instead of burning DC can we just burn rich people's houses?

    Librarian's ghost on
    (Switch Friend Code) SW-4910-9735-6014(PSN) timspork (Steam) timspork (XBox) Timspork


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    TubeTube Registered User admin
    Public forum

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    WeaverWeaver Who are you? What do you want?Registered User regular
    I say burn, but in my mindscape, it's more just seizing. Don't burn the rich houses, get some contractors in, divide that shit up into multi-unit housing.

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    tynictynic PICNIC BADASS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    That’s how you get a bathroom in the hallway and a ‘kitchen’ that’s just a gas ring and a powerpoint. Bring back multigenerational communal living, I say.

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    The Cow KingThe Cow King a island Registered User regular
    edited July 2020
    Will the Democrats come to the defense of the mail in any meaningful way?

    Have they ramped up the attack on McConnell and started delivering truckloads of cash to his Democrat challengers?

    Amy McGrath raised 41 millions dollars and barely beat Booker's like 4 million and largely suspiciously Kentucky was where they closed polling stations

    The Dems aren't interested in beating McConnell hell probs win while the Dems get rich off him just as they want

    The Cow King on
    icGJy2C.png
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    ToxTox I kill threads he/himRegistered User regular
    Pinfeldorf wrote: »
    Zonugal wrote: »
    Zonugal wrote: »
    My experience with middle schoolers and politics is their opinions appear largely molded by their environments.

    Like, back in 2016 I worked with 7th graders who passionately liked Bernie Sanders. They couldn't tell me why they liked him or what policies they agreed with, but they wanted him to win.

    Which, there are adults like that as well, so...?

    I’d say most adults are like that. It’s important to remember that the majority of users of this forum are much more tied into politics than the average person.

    Oh yeah.

    My best friend admitted to me in 2016 that he didn't know the difference between liberal or conservatives, as well as democrats or republicans.

    I also do not know the difference between republicans and democrats, and at this point, I don't think anyone does.

    Which body parts cops shoot people and whether or not the vans are marked

    Twitter! | Dilige, et quod vis fac
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    TNTrooperTNTrooper Registered User regular
    Weaver wrote: »
    I say burn, but in my mindscape, it's more just seizing. Don't burn the rich houses, get some contractors in, divide that shit up into multi-unit housing.

    Tearing down the crappy McMansions would make more room for multi-unit houses.

    steam_sig.png
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    WeaverWeaver Who are you? What do you want?Registered User regular
    tynic wrote: »
    That’s how you get a bathroom in the hallway and a ‘kitchen’ that’s just a gas ring and a powerpoint. Bring back multigenerational communal living, I say.

    Affordable rent is worth having your cabinetry making no sense.

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    Ms DapperMs Dapper Yuri Librarian Registered User regular
This discussion has been closed.