Most likely it checks if it can disembark into water from the starting city and then path it's way to the international city through the tradepost network.
Going to have to test out this situation, where city one is land locked but has this micro lake harbor and city 2 is bordering it (for fresh water) but has a harbor with maritime access. Would the trader be able to disembark in the harbor then happily embark at the city center, walk over to the harbor, disembark again and then go on its merry international way?
Edit:
Unfortunately that doesn't work.
Think it would work if both cities were moved 1 tile south west? The route originates in the city tile, not the harbor, so if the cities are on the water, it might go.
Think it would work if both cities were moved 1 tile south west? The route originates in the city tile, not the harbor, so if the cities are on the water, it might go.
Definitely something to try out.
Actually I know from another game that if I had placed Evora on the sand tile then it would have been acted as a canal even before the tech is researched, so Guarda would have been able to trade with Buenos Aires early on.
What I was hoping for though was that harbor and city trade route shenanigans would have allowed international trade. I guess this answers the question of the landlocked lake harbor. Better connect it with a series of canals to the ocean or learn to live with domestic trading.
At ;least adding the canal works, as expected, but the trader doesn't bother going through the city for the trade route bonus.
Talith on
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Mr_Rose83 Blue Ridge Protects the HolyRegistered Userregular
Have Hercules build a canal and see if that changes anything?
Guarda here has a harbor with maritime access, and the trade route goes THROUGH two international stops traveling half way around the world just to trade domestically
Was bored with emperor, so bumped it up to immortal...and rolled Bolivar. So did I really increase the difficulty level at all? (I'm rolling after crushing Portugal and all their beautiful campuses they built for me).
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
Guarda here has a harbor with maritime access, and the trade route goes THROUGH two international stops traveling half way around the world just to trade domestically
What I'm assuming is happening here is that you don't have a trading post in Canal City or Porto, so the trader wouldn't refresh it's movement to be able to reach Ponta Delgada. Thus it has to go all the way up to wherever the heck is is off the screen, to get to the movement refresh. If I'm counting right, it's ~20 or so tiles from whatever city it's looping through, and ~24 going "straight" from Guarda.
Guarda here has a harbor with maritime access, and the trade route goes THROUGH two international stops traveling half way around the world just to trade domestically
What I'm assuming is happening here is that you don't have a trading post in Canal City or Porto, so the trader wouldn't refresh it's movement to be able to reach Ponta Delgada. Thus it has to go all the way up to wherever the heck is is off the screen, to get to the movement refresh. If I'm counting right, it's ~20 or so tiles from whatever city it's looping through, and ~24 going "straight" from Guarda.
Considering the amount of hills, jungles, and forests involved it's also a lot faster too I'm sure. But it's going through two foreign cities to refresh the route, disembarking on one of them to travel by foot to the other...all for a 1/1 domestic route. Just let me trade with those cities game Canal city has 6 feitorias and its right there waiting to make me more money.
I closed out that game making 6000 gold a turn. I donated 50K to my korean teammate to get them a science win easier, but around turn 140 I also decided hey why not race him with a culture victory and what felt like almost overnight I had a fully upgraded theater district in every city with archeologists scouring the world for their ancient artifacts. I was also just buying everyone elses great works because sure I'll take them all for 1K each who cares. I was 2 turns away from a culture win around 220~ but my teammate managed to finish the science win first. The power of endless money is really impressive, even against deity.
I found a ridiculous city site, maybe I'll post a screenshot later. Took a small gamble to make it great, but pulled it off. So it's on a desert river and every tile in the first ring is a desert flood plain with three sugar and a rice. Got that pantheon, which then pumped out Etemenanki. So now those tiles are obscene. And then every other tile except one in range of this city is a desert with maybe a dozen desert hills. Obviously Petra time.
No idea how I got both on Immortal in my third city, but sure. Now it's just an absolute beast of a city.
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
I found a ridiculous city site, maybe I'll post a screenshot later. Took a small gamble to make it great, but pulled it off. So it's on a desert river and every tile in the first ring is a desert flood plain with three sugar and a rice. Got that pantheon, which then pumped out Etemenanki. So now those tiles are obscene. And then every other tile except one in range of this city is a desert with maybe a dozen desert hills. Obviously Petra time.
No idea how I got both on Immortal in my third city, but sure. Now it's just an absolute beast of a city.
Do you have any coast to build a Mausoleum for the fabled Triple Petra city?
I've been flailing hard this weekend trying for a Culture victory on Diety. Feels like RNG is just hammering me, my continents always have insane amounts of a few luxuries, then I see each AI has like 3/3 of others for a full monopoly. 3 games run through and just winding up like 20 turns short pumping out insane amounts of Tourism (1200+), while I watch my spies fail over and over to disrupt rocketry and lose to Science victories.
Not sure what I need to do to optimize and bring down my culture victory time (though I know the "correct" answer is to swap to a tech victory if I notice the AI getting to the Moon landing and not being in a position to stop them with Spies or military).
I've been flailing hard this weekend trying for a Culture victory on Diety. Feels like RNG is just hammering me, my continents always have insane amounts of a few luxuries, then I see each AI has like 3/3 of others for a full monopoly. 3 games run through and just winding up like 20 turns short pumping out insane amounts of Tourism (1200+), while I watch my spies fail over and over to disrupt rocketry and lose to Science victories.
Not sure what I need to do to optimize and bring down my culture victory time (though I know the "correct" answer is to swap to a tech victory if I notice the AI getting to the Moon landing and not being in a position to stop them with Spies or military).
Culture kind of sucks as a victory type (along with religion) because one really strong AI at high difficulty can really fuck you and basically make it impossible. Unlike diplomacy or science where you can have several strong contenders but one can squeak over the line and win or conquest which pushes you towards decisive showdowns.
I've been flailing hard this weekend trying for a Culture victory on Diety. Feels like RNG is just hammering me, my continents always have insane amounts of a few luxuries, then I see each AI has like 3/3 of others for a full monopoly. 3 games run through and just winding up like 20 turns short pumping out insane amounts of Tourism (1200+), while I watch my spies fail over and over to disrupt rocketry and lose to Science victories.
Not sure what I need to do to optimize and bring down my culture victory time (though I know the "correct" answer is to swap to a tech victory if I notice the AI getting to the Moon landing and not being in a position to stop them with Spies or military).
Culture kind of sucks as a victory type (along with religion) because one really strong AI at high difficulty can really fuck you and basically make it impossible. Unlike diplomacy or science where you can have several strong contenders but one can squeak over the line and win or conquest which pushes you towards decisive showdowns.
And as a result those victories sometimes ask you to break the economic power, or take their best producing cities with war. Now I don't play at those difficulties, so I don't really know the optimal timing.....
I've been flailing hard this weekend trying for a Culture victory on Diety. Feels like RNG is just hammering me, my continents always have insane amounts of a few luxuries, then I see each AI has like 3/3 of others for a full monopoly. 3 games run through and just winding up like 20 turns short pumping out insane amounts of Tourism (1200+), while I watch my spies fail over and over to disrupt rocketry and lose to Science victories.
Not sure what I need to do to optimize and bring down my culture victory time (though I know the "correct" answer is to swap to a tech victory if I notice the AI getting to the Moon landing and not being in a position to stop them with Spies or military).
Culture kind of sucks as a victory type (along with religion) because one really strong AI at high difficulty can really fuck you and basically make it impossible. Unlike diplomacy or science where you can have several strong contenders but one can squeak over the line and win or conquest which pushes you towards decisive showdowns.
And as a result those victories sometimes ask you to break the economic power, or take their best producing cities with war. Now I don't play at those difficulties, so I don't really know the optimal timing.....
Yeah I have never done a diety culture win, but most of the ones people write about on reddit or civfanatics involve reaching dominance over the non-cultural focused civs by doing the usual culture things and also shivving the main cultural competitors with early wars or late game nukes.
They are bad in the sense that they are a new player trap, if you know how to prepare and mitigate the penalties they can actually be really beneficial, but if you are new and don’t know the game they can just screw you over without the solutions being obvious.
Edit: unless on Dramatic Age mode, which just turns them into a cluster.
So far I'm leaving Apocalypse mode and Dramatic Ages off. I like the barriers and traps but zombies are super god damn annoying as they currently are, so I'm probably turning it off going forward. The way they just randomly spawn and then immediately attack is probably the biggest reason. If there was some kind of warning or way of knowing approximately where they are coming from and then just have more of them come more often it would be better. I've never had to use the zombie related projects, even in a domination game which presumably produces more zombies. The anti-zombie tools have never actually been used against zombies themselves either, just against two deity AI that decided at the same time I look like a free meal.
As a mostly peaceful player who's good at keeping the A.I. placated through diplomacy, I appreciate how Dramatic Ages mode and Zombie Defense mode punish me for being complacent with my military. It's a few extra speedbumps on my road to creating an unstoppably efficient infrastructure, as I inevitably do every game.
So, I completely revamped what I was doing, and have gotten a trio of culture victories since my last post.
Weirdly, delaying my culture push has seemed to really help. I'll grab a theater square if I wind up with a really good one, but otherwise just focusing on getting trade routes, and at least one solid production center, and mass expanding like mad. I have had some insanely bad luck with luxuries and monopolies, but this latest game I fixed that by making sure I grabbed Anansi right away, and just ran him around nuking all my neighbors copies of a pair of resources. First resummon went to my other neighbor and eat theirs. 3 monopolies headed into the mid to late game made my less modest tourism counts do the heavy lifting, and I won via culture just after the first moon landing project went off.
Oh, and I just made sure that I built mines, mines, and more mines. I chopped anywhere and everywhere I possibly good, placed a million mines down and everything ramped real, real hard. My last major flaw I have to work on is I consistently neglect getting a diplomatic quarter. I can never seem to find the right timing to get it down in my capital.
Yes, hammers are the key to this version of Civ and enable every other victory type. Culture victories come from having lots of hammers, not lots of culture.
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
Yes, hammers are the key to this version of Civ and enable every other victory type. Culture victories come from having lots of hammers, not lots of culture.
My last two starts have been coastal capitals with Sinbad by turn 25. He's such a stupid fucking hero. Here's like 3400 gold, 4 era score, and probably some eurekas. Also if you feel like taking a coastal city go ahead.
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
heroes & legends just seems like a bad mode, between sinbad and hercules being pants-on-head busted and anansi just being super annoying game design
It will be interesting to see how the buffs work out... I would have thought Columbia and Babylon were straight out broken OP but they ended up still being weaker than Russia or some other top tier civs.
All the Heroes are kinda busted in combat. IMO it's not fun to have one unit that can solo a whole army from the same era.
The only two modes I would play with 24/7 are Secret Societies and Corporations and Monopolies.
I say would cause Monopolies make Cultural victories easy and the AI has no idea how to combat them.
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The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
edited April 2021
but the Monopolies mode taught me is that
1) the global resources tab exists
2) with that tab, you can realize the AI just doesn't improve any of their luxuries even at emperor-diety level
3) that explains why they're always so willing to pay 20gpt for a single luxury, I guess
I think the most curious thing for me is, apparently the Man-at-Arms and the Line Infantry are both regular melee units, which means the Atomic age is the only era that the Melee combat unit doesn't get an upgrade.
knitdanIn ur baseKillin ur guysRegistered Userregular
Religious Emergency- Japan converted Sumeria’s capital to their religion, drive them out!
Me, killing an apostle from Japan in Sumeria, to prevent them from converting the city like the emergency fucking says
Sumeria: How dare you convert my cities! Denounce!
Motherfucker I didn’t convert shit, I just killed the guy who was trying to convert you
Sometimes I think the grievance system is designed to hide that the AI are just a bunch of illogical warlords who will fight wars with each other and stay on good terms but if you are a player civilization and you have something they want (land, money, artifacts, great people, etc) they will hate you forever
“I was quick when I came in here, I’m twice as quick now”
-Indiana Solo, runner of blades
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Mr_Rose83 Blue Ridge Protects the HolyRegistered Userregular
When you kill a religious unit, it’s faith gets a debuff within X tiles (maybe 9? I dunno) which counts as a conversion attempt. And one or more of their cities was already converted to the Japanese religion I guess?
Yeah, they really need to think through some of the circumstances and consequences of their own in-game events sometimes.
I’m not good enough to really judge off of reading patch notes but Khmer, Mapuche, and Spain get overhauls pretty much.
Minor nerfs for Russia, Nubia, Persia.
Lots of minor changes and tweaks to civs.
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KetarCome on upstairswe're having a partyRegistered Userregular
The most important part of the new patch is clearly that the scout can now pet his dog. There's a Pet button mixed in with the other commands for Scouts now.
I didn't even realize the game had patched, so that was really confusing me for a minute when I jumped back into a game a few hours ago.
My favorite Civ is one of the few that didn't get buffed or nerfed, aside from having its unique unit brought up to the new standard for its type and straightening out it's upgrade path. :?
Posts
Think it would work if both cities were moved 1 tile south west? The route originates in the city tile, not the harbor, so if the cities are on the water, it might go.
Definitely something to try out.
Actually I know from another game that if I had placed Evora on the sand tile then it would have been acted as a canal even before the tech is researched, so Guarda would have been able to trade with Buenos Aires early on.
What I was hoping for though was that harbor and city trade route shenanigans would have allowed international trade. I guess this answers the question of the landlocked lake harbor. Better connect it with a series of canals to the ocean or learn to live with domestic trading.
At ;least adding the canal works, as expected, but the trader doesn't bother going through the city for the trade route bonus.
Nintendo Network ID: AzraelRose
DropBox invite link - get 500MB extra free.
Guarda here has a harbor with maritime access, and the trade route goes THROUGH two international stops traveling half way around the world just to trade domestically
What I'm assuming is happening here is that you don't have a trading post in Canal City or Porto, so the trader wouldn't refresh it's movement to be able to reach Ponta Delgada. Thus it has to go all the way up to wherever the heck is is off the screen, to get to the movement refresh. If I'm counting right, it's ~20 or so tiles from whatever city it's looping through, and ~24 going "straight" from Guarda.
Considering the amount of hills, jungles, and forests involved it's also a lot faster too I'm sure. But it's going through two foreign cities to refresh the route, disembarking on one of them to travel by foot to the other...all for a 1/1 domestic route. Just let me trade with those cities game
I closed out that game making 6000 gold a turn. I donated 50K to my korean teammate to get them a science win easier, but around turn 140 I also decided hey why not race him with a culture victory and what felt like almost overnight I had a fully upgraded theater district in every city with archeologists scouring the world for their ancient artifacts. I was also just buying everyone elses great works because sure I'll take them all for 1K each who cares. I was 2 turns away from a culture win around 220~ but my teammate managed to finish the science win first. The power of endless money is really impressive, even against deity.
No idea how I got both on Immortal in my third city, but sure. Now it's just an absolute beast of a city.
Do you have any coast to build a Mausoleum for the fabled Triple Petra city?
Not sure what I need to do to optimize and bring down my culture victory time (though I know the "correct" answer is to swap to a tech victory if I notice the AI getting to the Moon landing and not being in a position to stop them with Spies or military).
Culture kind of sucks as a victory type (along with religion) because one really strong AI at high difficulty can really fuck you and basically make it impossible. Unlike diplomacy or science where you can have several strong contenders but one can squeak over the line and win or conquest which pushes you towards decisive showdowns.
And as a result those victories sometimes ask you to break the economic power, or take their best producing cities with war. Now I don't play at those difficulties, so I don't really know the optimal timing.....
Yeah I have never done a diety culture win, but most of the ones people write about on reddit or civfanatics involve reaching dominance over the non-cultural focused civs by doing the usual culture things and also shivving the main cultural competitors with early wars or late game nukes.
Mostly because it is impossible to keep cities by force, even with overwhelming numbers.
Edit: unless on Dramatic Age mode, which just turns them into a cluster.
Weirdly, delaying my culture push has seemed to really help. I'll grab a theater square if I wind up with a really good one, but otherwise just focusing on getting trade routes, and at least one solid production center, and mass expanding like mad. I have had some insanely bad luck with luxuries and monopolies, but this latest game I fixed that by making sure I grabbed Anansi right away, and just ran him around nuking all my neighbors copies of a pair of resources. First resummon went to my other neighbor and eat theirs. 3 monopolies headed into the mid to late game made my less modest tourism counts do the heavy lifting, and I won via culture just after the first moon landing project went off.
Oh, and I just made sure that I built mines, mines, and more mines. I chopped anywhere and everywhere I possibly good, placed a million mines down and everything ramped real, real hard. My last major flaw I have to work on is I consistently neglect getting a diplomatic quarter. I can never seem to find the right timing to get it down in my capital.
Like the Potato says "Production is king".
True Start Earth, trebuckets! buffs!
D3 Steam #TeamTangent STO
It will be interesting to see how the buffs work out... I would have thought Columbia and Babylon were straight out broken OP but they ended up still being weaker than Russia or some other top tier civs.
The only two modes I would play with 24/7 are Secret Societies and Corporations and Monopolies.
I say would cause Monopolies make Cultural victories easy and the AI has no idea how to combat them.
1) the global resources tab exists
2) with that tab, you can realize the AI just doesn't improve any of their luxuries even at emperor-diety level
3) that explains why they're always so willing to pay 20gpt for a single luxury, I guess
TONS of desync and disconnects early in both games (first was very bad and the had to cut it early as well).
Round 1, April 10:
Round 2, April 17 (yesterday):
Watching it, I learned a lot that I might not have realized otherwise (mostly things like optimizing citizen tile placement and the like)
Me, killing an apostle from Japan in Sumeria, to prevent them from converting the city like the emergency fucking says
Sumeria: How dare you convert my cities! Denounce!
Motherfucker I didn’t convert shit, I just killed the guy who was trying to convert you
Sometimes I think the grievance system is designed to hide that the AI are just a bunch of illogical warlords who will fight wars with each other and stay on good terms but if you are a player civilization and you have something they want (land, money, artifacts, great people, etc) they will hate you forever
-Indiana Solo, runner of blades
Yeah, they really need to think through some of the circumstances and consequences of their own in-game events sometimes.
Nintendo Network ID: AzraelRose
DropBox invite link - get 500MB extra free.
General combat rework.
I’m not good enough to really judge off of reading patch notes but Khmer, Mapuche, and Spain get overhauls pretty much.
Minor nerfs for Russia, Nubia, Persia.
Lots of minor changes and tweaks to civs.
I didn't even realize the game had patched, so that was really confusing me for a minute when I jumped back into a game a few hours ago.