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The US Congress

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Posts

  • Dark_SideDark_Side Registered User regular
    moniker wrote: »
    Prohass wrote: »
    I just don’t get this desire to underspend. This obsessions with shaving off edges and scaling down. Is america the greates country on earth or a fucking pauper who has to count coins? Just fucking spend the nonsense tokens and make the world better and less people suffer. The argument for spending less is always just spend less for its own sake, out of responsibility. To what? There’s never a concern that we won’t spend enough, that time and people will be wasted while the planet dies with half measures and not enough. What’s the price tag of missing last chance opportunities on the environment, on the welfare of living citizens and their children?

    I’m looking forward to having a balanced budget while the country and world crumbles and is irrevocably ruined for future generations

    The fear is that if we spend money on people who aren't rich then eventually we are going to have to raise taxes to prevent a fiscal crisis. We'll probably have to do the same eventually after giving rich people all the money, but they'll have managed to make investment returns on it by then so meh.

    I'm not even sure that's the actual fear anymore. I think the GOP has spent so much time now not governing that they're scared shitless of what's going to happen when its shown that in fact the government can improve things, and bills out of Congress can improve people's lives. The weak kneed, vague gestures at spending as some boogeyman are indeed starting to fall incredibly flat. Especially after it hasn't even been 5 years since the GOP engineered a massive transfer of wealth to the top percent of earners in this country.

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  • MillMill Registered User regular
    Lastweek Tonight did a segment on the national debt last weekend, so I'm going to drop here since it's pretty relevant to Congress stuff.



    Basic gist is that most assumptions about it are pretty fucking wrong and that republicans are being absolute hypocritical lying assholes about it.

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  • nexuscrawlernexuscrawler Registered User regular
    The way to put pressure on Manchin is make it extremely clear if the Dems get more seats in 2022 he's going to be left out in the cold when they DO kill the filibuster without him

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  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Democrats have no leverage over Manchin other than I guess just going out of their way to fuck West Virginia. Which they would never do and should never do. If any national Democrat campaigned against him for example, he would do better.

    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
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  • 38thDoe38thDoe lets never be stupid again wait lets always be stupid foreverRegistered User regular
    Wouldn't that just make him work to make sure that Dems don't get more seats in 2022?

  • GaddezGaddez Registered User regular
    Mill wrote: »
    Lastweek Tonight did a segment on the national debt last weekend, so I'm going to drop here since it's pretty relevant to Congress stuff.



    Basic gist is that most assumptions about it are pretty fucking wrong and that republicans are being absolute hypocritical lying assholes about it.

    I mean, we've known for ages and that Reaganomics is fucking horseshit particularly since there isn't really anything preventing companies from opening factories in countries with cheaper labor and less standards.

    Richy wrote: »
    But I think the resistance I’m getting more has to do with “rawr! Loklar said it! Rage!” than anything else.

    No, it has to do with the fact that you're done nothing but throw lies, blatant flasehoods, and downright dumb statements at us so far.
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  • NobeardNobeard North Carolina: Failed StateRegistered User regular
    I am so tired of West Virginia Democrats being the deciding factor of whether or not I get to have a country.

    I'm not saying we are going to have an autocratic dystopia, but things keep happening that look like they come from an autocratic dystopia.
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  • Captain InertiaCaptain Inertia Registered User regular
    edited April 8
    I’d look at Cal Cunningham costing us 51 before I worry about WVA “Dems”

    Or Arkansas Dems not even running anyone

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  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Wisconsin swing voters liking Ron fucking Johnson would be high on my list, personally. Or like, Florida.

    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
    Warren 2020
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  • BlackDragon480BlackDragon480 Bluster Kerfuffle Master of Windy ImportRegistered User regular
    Gaddez wrote: »

    I mean, we've known for ages and that Reaganomics is fucking horseshit particularly since there isn't really anything preventing companies from opening factories in countries with cheaper labor and less standards.

    Instead of T-Bills and Treasury Bonds we need to shift public debt to a more appreciating resource, one that John Oliver highlighted on Last Week Tonight:

    30127gr4sk0e.jpg

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  • monikermoniker Registered User regular
    Nobeard wrote: »
    I am so tired of West Virginia Democrats being the deciding factor of whether or not I get to have a country.

    You won't have to after 2024. He is the sole Democrat from the West Virginia delegation to Congress and the sole Democrat holding any statewide office in West Virginia.

    I'm not so confident about what the factor will have decided about whether or not we have a country afterwards.

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  • SoggybiscuitSoggybiscuit 4.5 MV of POWER! Registered User regular
    moniker wrote: »
    Nobeard wrote: »
    I am so tired of West Virginia Democrats being the deciding factor of whether or not I get to have a country.

    You won't have to after 2024. He is the sole Democrat from the West Virginia delegation to Congress and the sole Democrat holding any statewide office in West Virginia.

    I'm not so confident about what the factor will have decided about whether or not we have a country afterwards.

    At this point his only chance is to stop being an obstructionist asshole and do some good for the people of WV even against their short sited wishes.

    After the year that shall not be named he is screwed as the level of anti-Democrat sentiment in the state has done nothing but increase. Every time I go to my childhood home in WV to visit my dad or MiL its worse than it was before.

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  • Mild ConfusionMild Confusion Smash All Things Registered User regular
    Trying to get rid of Manchin is a huge risk. The Dems can try to primary him, but if they succeed, they’ll be running against whatever meat sack the GOP puts up in freaking West Virginia. A state Trump won by nearly a 40 point margin.

    I mean, it’s not impossible considering 2018 and 2020, but I seriously doubt the DNC will fund a primary against their 50th vote after finally retaking the Senate anyhow.

    Manchin has a shit load of power, but he has to know he’s gonna lose that power if the Dems lose the Senate. In order for him to stay in the position he’s in, a new Voting Rights Act needs to pass. Filibuster reform is absolutely the key to that, and Manchin (and Sinema) is key to that. They have to know this and it’s possible they are posturing against the filibuster to get concessions.

    At least, that’s what I hope the game is. Cause if 2022 rolls around and the GOP’s election fuckery doesn’t get countered, things are gonna start looking like 2010 again.

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  • CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    What would the chances of primarying him even be given he is also relatively popular among WV Democrats?

  • iTunesIsEviliTunesIsEvil Registered User regular
    edited April 8
    Couscous wrote: »
    What would the chances of primarying him even be given he is also relatively popular among WV Democrats?

    Not sure. He won the WV 2012 general 60-35, then the WV 2018 general was a lot closer at 49.6-46. So I'd read that as "probably not great".

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  • Mild ConfusionMild Confusion Smash All Things Registered User regular
    Couscous wrote: »
    What would the chances of primarying him even be given he is also relatively popular among WV Democrats?

    Close enough to zero that I seriously doubt it would ever happen. I believe he’s up in 2024, which will probably be astruggle to keep his seat in such a red state. On the other hand, he’s the incumbent so who knows. There’s a lot of time between now and then to accurately predict. Running a primary won’t make him any less obstructionist though.

    Probably best to focus on 2022. The Dems can hopefully pick up more Senate seats next year, thereby making Manchin irrelevant to the calculus. I say just offer him and Sinema some massive concessions in whatever reconciliation bill to secure filibuster reform and the Voting Rights Act, then worry about 2024 later.

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  • GONG-00GONG-00 Registered User regular
    Effort would be better spent on DC Statehood or securing wins in purple states than mucking around with Manchin's seat.

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  • ElkiElki get busy Moderator, ClubPA mod
    Gaetz’s friend is expected to plead guilty. Which means he’ll be cooperating in other crimes has knowledge of. So says the NYT.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/08/us/politics/matt-gaetz-investigation.html

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  • nexuscrawlernexuscrawler Registered User regular
    38thDoe wrote: »
    Wouldn't that just make him work to make sure that Dems don't get more seats in 2022?

    You mean thats not what he's doing now?

    BigJoeM
  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    Elki wrote: »
    Gaetz’s friend is expected to plead guilty. Which means he’ll be cooperating in other crimes has knowledge of. So says the NYT.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/08/us/politics/matt-gaetz-investigation.html

    I still remain pessimistic on anything happening to Gaetz. Hell he's fundraising on this "witchhunt" just like Trump taught them.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

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  • jmcdonaldjmcdonald I voted, did you? DC(ish)Registered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    Elki wrote: »
    Gaetz’s friend is expected to plead guilty. Which means he’ll be cooperating in other crimes has knowledge of. So says the NYT.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/08/us/politics/matt-gaetz-investigation.html

    I still remain pessimistic on anything happening to Gaetz. Hell he's fundraising on this "witchhunt" just like Trump taught them.

    i think he's toast.

    he's a zombie right now - dead and doesn't know it.

    shryke wrote: »
    ...Barack "charisma isn't a dump stat, nerds" Obama...
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  • NobeardNobeard North Carolina: Failed StateRegistered User regular
    Trying to get rid of Manchin is a huge risk. The Dems can try to primary him, but if they succeed, they’ll be running against whatever meat sack the GOP puts up in freaking West Virginia. A state Trump won by nearly a 40 point margin.

    I mean, it’s not impossible considering 2018 and 2020, but I seriously doubt the DNC will fund a primary against their 50th vote after finally retaking the Senate anyhow.

    Manchin has a shit load of power, but he has to know he’s gonna lose that power if the Dems lose the Senate. In order for him to stay in the position he’s in, a new Voting Rights Act needs to pass. Filibuster reform is absolutely the key to that, and Manchin (and Sinema) is key to that. They have to know this and it’s possible they are posturing against the filibuster to get concessions.

    At least, that’s what I hope the game is. Cause if 2022 rolls around and the GOP’s election fuckery doesn’t get countered, things are gonna start looking like 2010 again.

    But if he votes for a new VRA or to kill the filibuster his constituency will vote him out.

    I'm not saying we are going to have an autocratic dystopia, but things keep happening that look like they come from an autocratic dystopia.
  • JavenJaven Registered User regular
    Nobeard wrote: »
    Trying to get rid of Manchin is a huge risk. The Dems can try to primary him, but if they succeed, they’ll be running against whatever meat sack the GOP puts up in freaking West Virginia. A state Trump won by nearly a 40 point margin.

    I mean, it’s not impossible considering 2018 and 2020, but I seriously doubt the DNC will fund a primary against their 50th vote after finally retaking the Senate anyhow.

    Manchin has a shit load of power, but he has to know he’s gonna lose that power if the Dems lose the Senate. In order for him to stay in the position he’s in, a new Voting Rights Act needs to pass. Filibuster reform is absolutely the key to that, and Manchin (and Sinema) is key to that. They have to know this and it’s possible they are posturing against the filibuster to get concessions.

    At least, that’s what I hope the game is. Cause if 2022 rolls around and the GOP’s election fuckery doesn’t get countered, things are gonna start looking like 2010 again.

    But if he votes for a new VRA or to kill the filibuster his constituency will vote him out.

    I doubt it.

    There's zero evidence to suggest that his reluctance to remove or reform the filibuster is in any way linked to electoral calculus of any kind.

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  • MarathonMarathon Registered User regular
    Nobeard wrote: »
    Trying to get rid of Manchin is a huge risk. The Dems can try to primary him, but if they succeed, they’ll be running against whatever meat sack the GOP puts up in freaking West Virginia. A state Trump won by nearly a 40 point margin.

    I mean, it’s not impossible considering 2018 and 2020, but I seriously doubt the DNC will fund a primary against their 50th vote after finally retaking the Senate anyhow.

    Manchin has a shit load of power, but he has to know he’s gonna lose that power if the Dems lose the Senate. In order for him to stay in the position he’s in, a new Voting Rights Act needs to pass. Filibuster reform is absolutely the key to that, and Manchin (and Sinema) is key to that. They have to know this and it’s possible they are posturing against the filibuster to get concessions.

    At least, that’s what I hope the game is. Cause if 2022 rolls around and the GOP’s election fuckery doesn’t get countered, things are gonna start looking like 2010 again.

    But if he votes for a new VRA or to kill the filibuster his constituency will vote him out.

    If I remember right his victory margins keep shrinking. They might vote him out soon anyway.

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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Javen wrote: »
    Nobeard wrote: »
    Trying to get rid of Manchin is a huge risk. The Dems can try to primary him, but if they succeed, they’ll be running against whatever meat sack the GOP puts up in freaking West Virginia. A state Trump won by nearly a 40 point margin.

    I mean, it’s not impossible considering 2018 and 2020, but I seriously doubt the DNC will fund a primary against their 50th vote after finally retaking the Senate anyhow.

    Manchin has a shit load of power, but he has to know he’s gonna lose that power if the Dems lose the Senate. In order for him to stay in the position he’s in, a new Voting Rights Act needs to pass. Filibuster reform is absolutely the key to that, and Manchin (and Sinema) is key to that. They have to know this and it’s possible they are posturing against the filibuster to get concessions.

    At least, that’s what I hope the game is. Cause if 2022 rolls around and the GOP’s election fuckery doesn’t get countered, things are gonna start looking like 2010 again.

    But if he votes for a new VRA or to kill the filibuster his constituency will vote him out.

    I doubt it.

    There's zero evidence to suggest that his reluctance to remove or reform the filibuster is in any way linked to electoral calculus of any kind.

    I think it's linked because he thinks it gets him bipartisan cred.

  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    He's going to get voted out regardless.

    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
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  • StarZapperStarZapper Vermont, Bizzaro world.Registered User regular
    People have been predicting the demise of Joe Manchin for literally a decade at this point. I'll believe it when I see it, people hate change. Especially conservatives. I'm much more worried about the rest of the rust belt then WV.

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  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    StarZapper wrote: »
    People have been predicting the demise of Joe Manchin for literally a decade at this point. I'll believe it when I see it, people hate change. Especially conservatives. I'm much more worried about the rest of the rust belt then WV.

    He already voted for the radical biden budget, he's done in WV like his margins and other shit have tanked him.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

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  • TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    StarZapper wrote: »
    People have been predicting the demise of Joe Manchin for literally a decade at this point. I'll believe it when I see it, people hate change. Especially conservatives. I'm much more worried about the rest of the rust belt then WV.

    He already voted for the radical biden budget, he's done in WV like his margins and other shit have tanked him.

    Eeeeeh. "Radical socialism" cries are background noise at this point, and I strongly suspect that nobody outside Congress cares about the tax cuts (and Congress cares because a)Is what their paymasters want and b)They kissed a lot of orange ass to get them). Meanwhile, Manchin manages his "own the libs" cred like a hawk, so he knows how to play the game enough to keep his seat.

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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    StarZapper wrote: »
    People have been predicting the demise of Joe Manchin for literally a decade at this point. I'll believe it when I see it, people hate change. Especially conservatives. I'm much more worried about the rest of the rust belt then WV.

    His margins have been getting slimmer every time. And not at a slow pace either. There's no reasonable reason right now to assume there's going to be a drastic reversal of that trend.

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  • monikermoniker Registered User regular
    Manchin is the flip side to Collins. She is also literally the only Republican in Congress from all of New England. There is a chance that incumbency bias will let them hold onto the seat narrowly, but that's about all there is. Either next election or possibly until their retirement and then it's lost to the Party pretty much for good. Or at least until the next Party System reshuffles things again.

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  • RedTideRedTide Registered User regular
    StarZapper wrote: »
    People have been predicting the demise of Joe Manchin for literally a decade at this point. I'll believe it when I see it, people hate change. Especially conservatives. I'm much more worried about the rest of the rust belt then WV.

    A new VRA keeps Senate seats from being legislated away in places like Ohio (already Republican) and Wisconsin/Michigan/Pennsylvania (Plausibly Republican in the near future)

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  • AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    Elki wrote: »
    Gaetz’s friend is expected to plead guilty. Which means he’ll be cooperating in other crimes has knowledge of. So says the NYT.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/08/us/politics/matt-gaetz-investigation.html

    I still remain pessimistic on anything happening to Gaetz. Hell he's fundraising on this "witchhunt" just like Trump taught them.

    That's because we just have allegations. If his buddy has turned state's evidence, there are receipts, and that will change the dynamics.

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  • Captain InertiaCaptain Inertia Registered User regular
    edited April 8
    I thought there were literal receipts though

    Well of payments....need some work to prove what the payments were for I guess

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  • GaddezGaddez Registered User regular
    jmcdonald wrote: »
    Preacher wrote: »
    Elki wrote: »
    Gaetz’s friend is expected to plead guilty. Which means he’ll be cooperating in other crimes has knowledge of. So says the NYT.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/08/us/politics/matt-gaetz-investigation.html

    I still remain pessimistic on anything happening to Gaetz. Hell he's fundraising on this "witchhunt" just like Trump taught them.

    i think he's toast.

    he's a zombie right now - dead and doesn't know it.

    Gaetz is a 38 year old frat boy who is most famous for embarrasing sexual antics, DUIs, getting dunked on by anyone with half a brain and toadying up to trump. He brings nothing to the table that the republicans don't already have in fucking spades and I don't see his daddy being able to throw around enough dosh to make it go away.

    Richy wrote: »
    But I think the resistance I’m getting more has to do with “rawr! Loklar said it! Rage!” than anything else.

    No, it has to do with the fact that you're done nothing but throw lies, blatant flasehoods, and downright dumb statements at us so far.
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  • MonwynMonwyn Registered User regular
    moniker wrote: »
    Manchin is the flip side to Collins. She is also literally the only Republican in Congress from all of New England. There is a chance that incumbency bias will let them hold onto the seat narrowly, but that's about all there is. Either next election or possibly until their retirement and then it's lost to the Party pretty much for good. Or at least until the next Party System reshuffles things again.

    Well, no, because Collins, for all her vaunted centrism, always always always did what she was told

    Whereas Manchin has told Schumer (and, IIRC, Reid) they can kiss his ass, he's going to do what he wants, publicly

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  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    Elki wrote: »
    Gaetz’s friend is expected to plead guilty. Which means he’ll be cooperating in other crimes has knowledge of. So says the NYT.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/08/us/politics/matt-gaetz-investigation.html

    I still remain pessimistic on anything happening to Gaetz. Hell he's fundraising on this "witchhunt" just like Trump taught them.

    That's because we just have allegations. If his buddy has turned state's evidence, there are receipts, and that will change the dynamics.

    I remain unconvinced that this time for sure a republican will face consequences for their actions.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

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  • monikermoniker Registered User regular
    Monwyn wrote: »
    moniker wrote: »
    Manchin is the flip side to Collins. She is also literally the only Republican in Congress from all of New England. There is a chance that incumbency bias will let them hold onto the seat narrowly, but that's about all there is. Either next election or possibly until their retirement and then it's lost to the Party pretty much for good. Or at least until the next Party System reshuffles things again.

    Well, no, because Collins, for all her vaunted centrism, always always always did what she was told

    Whereas Manchin has told Schumer (and, IIRC, Reid) they can kiss his ass, he's going to do what he wants, publicly

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  • something a million times dumbersomething a million times dumber JUDGE BROSEF Registered User regular
    I think it's possible, maybe even probable, that gaetz will face some legal repercussions

    I do think he won't flip on anyone else, and that this won't become the first in a cascade of revelations as to the endemic criminality of the DC elite class, much like it didn't with Dennis Hastert

    Butters
  • ButtersButters A glass of some milks Registered User regular
    If Gaetz hangs it's because he was too dumb to keep his mouth shut. Had he let someone whose daddy didn't buy him a law degree at the store do the talking, I'm guessing that attorney wouldn't have gone on national television to confirm he likes buying things for 17-year-old "women"

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