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The [Labor] Thread is entitled to everything it creates

HacksawHacksaw J. Duggan Esq.Wrestler at LawRegistered User regular
edited January 19 in Debate and/or Discourse
I'm shamelessly copying and pasting my old OP onto the new one.

This is a thread for talking about breaking news and current issues in the world of labor, both organized and unorganized. Feel free to post articles about the ongoing struggles of workers across the world, be they in big union shops or little mom and pop outfits. As well, matters pertaining to labor like anti-worker practices by governments and workplaces are also welcome.

I'm going to do a bit of a break from the norm in DnD threads and use the OP for links to resources my fellow workers can use to coordinate things like organizing campaigns in the workplace, filing unfair labor practice complaints, or just straight up reporting someone to OSHA for safety violations. I'll edit them in as time goes on.

In the words of countless workers before me: "Workers of the world, unite! All you have to lose are your chains!"

A handy site for workers: The Occupational Safety and Health Administration. Click through to get info on your rights as a worker, where and how to file a complaint against a treacherous employer, report a serious or fatal accident on a work site, and a link for submitting an occupational injury and illness report for 2020 (and soon, 2021!). There are also handy guides for finding out what safety equipment and tools your employer is legally obligated to provide to you as a worker if you don't already know.

A handy site for labor organizers: The National Labor Relations Board. In the same vein as OSHA, this is where you go to file info, links, forms, and decisions about employer vs. employee decisions handed down by the NLRB. You can register a complaint and file relevant paperwork through the site, access and file documents, view your own cases in their handy online portal, and just generally ensure your rights as an employee not to be fucked with so easily by greedy capitalist dogfuckers.

And last but not least: The American Federation of Labor/Congress of Industrial Organizations. This is the landing page for the biggest labor coordination organization outside of the federal government. On this page you'll find links to strike maps, locations for union chapter headquarters in your area (should you feel the desire to perhaps unionize your place of employment 8-) ), guides on organizing your workplace in multiple languages, and links to the websites of unions which may cover labor jurisdictions directly related to your type of work. Give 'em a look and see about maybe injecting some solidarity into your day-to-day life whydonchya.

Oh, and before I forget...

WORKERS OF THE WORLD, UNITE! ALL YOU HAVE TO LOSE ARE YOUR CHAINS!

Hacksaw on
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Posts

  • TefTef Registered User regular
    Don’t scab for the bosses
    Don’t listen to their lies
    Us poor folks haven’t got a chance
    Unless we organise!

    help a fellow forumer meet their mental health care needs because USA healthcare sucks!

    Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better

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  • KaputaKaputa Registered User regular
    Starbucks Unionization Efforts Spread
    The second unionized store also was in Buffalo. Establishing a second unionized store in the same market could provide a significant boost to the union, Starbucks Workers United, which is an affiliate of the Service Employees International Union. Workers at several other Starbucks stores throughout the country have filed for union elections, including in Boston, Chicago, Seattle and Knoxville, Tenn. Starbucks has 10 business days to request an appeal of the unionization decision announced Jan. 10.

    Several isn't a lot in the context of ~15,000 Starbucks locations in the US, but this news stirs my heart nonetheless. The success of the first seems to have inspired a minor wave of revolt, and more victories could spur more organization.

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  • HacksawHacksaw J. Duggan Esq. Wrestler at LawRegistered User regular
    Fucking hell yes! If more Starbucks unionize, I might actually buy from Starbucks!

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  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    edited January 19
    Two unionized Starbucks is infinity more than there was a couple years ago.

    It's going to be a case study in why corporations are terrified of unions, watching Starbucks after Starbucks unionize while the parent company wails about the injustice of having to pay fair wages and earning somewhat less of it's usual ultra-billions.

    I look forward to 20-30 years from now when somebody puts together an animated infographic showing the gradual growth and then sudden explosion of union Starbucks until they're all union.

    Ninja Snarl P on
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  • HefflingHeffling No Pic EverRegistered User regular
    From the previous thread, but I don't want this left behind:
    All of the debates about where the cutoff for being poor is in relation to the poverty line and middle class is just a distraction from our need to eat the rich and uplift everyone to a better standard of living.

    HacksawPolaritieMatevMan in the MistsThawmusMoridin889TynnanShadowfireStabbity StyleCalicaEtiowsaAbsoluteZeroMosatiFoolOnTheHillKristmas KthulhuNyysjan
  • LanzLanz Registered User regular
    So G/O Media is forcing the staff of the AV Club to move to LA if they want to keep their jobs.

    The union has announced that the workers will not do so and instead take their severance, offering a public statement on the matter:


    UPDATE: The seven A.V. Club workers in Chicago have decided to take their union-contract-protected severances rather than move to L.A. without a cost-of-living adjustment. A statement from the union (1/X):


    People are undoubtedly confused at why any of this shit is going down; as it stands work from
    Home is becoming more common, there doesn’t seem to be a particularly need as to why exactly the AV Club staff need to relocate, on their own expense, from Chicago to LA.


    Well, Scottish author Charlie Stross has a suggestion: union busting on G/O’s part


    Hypothesis: they pushed "move to LA at your own expense, no cost of living rise" as constructive dismissal, to ditch a unionized office. Replacements will be work-from-home and casualized, ideally geographically isolated. In other words, it's union-busting.

    waNkm4k.jpg?1
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  • Martini_PhilosopherMartini_Philosopher Registered User regular
    The NYT owners continue to carve away at their face without regards to their overall appearance.
    Southpaw wrote:
    Just in - An email from the Times Guild. "The Times has turned important days of remembrance and celebration into bargaining chips in their anti-union campaign."
    Embedded in the tweet is the following image.
    oqo6on2chgsn.jpg

    In short, the NYT owners want to bust one of the unions working for them through illegally denying membership federally & state recognized holidays. Somehow believing this will not result in any blowback, further consolidation of union solidarity, or them giving in like last year when negotiations led to them giving even more time for parental leave to union members over what was promised to rank and file.

    All opinions are my own and in no way reflect that of my employer.
  • GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    edited January 19
    It’s scummy but not illegal to take holidays away/not grant them. Federal/state holidays are not mandates to businesses but only to (certain) government agencies. What the NYT is doing is giving benefits to non-unionized employees as a way to split the union (such that if enough people leave/the union is busted suddenly those benefits will go away).

    Edit: to be clear hopefully the union stays strong.

    Goumindong on
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  • HacksawHacksaw J. Duggan Esq. Wrestler at LawRegistered User regular
    The paper of record continues to be abject shit, I see. Some things never change. They championed the Iraq War and the Vietnan War, downplayed the seriousness of Hitler (including printing excerpts of Mein Kampf without promoting), and poo-poo'd the Civil War because they believed we should leave the South to sort out its own issues and not bother with "non-citizen slaves". They're a wretched institution that deserves to rot and crumble like the heap of festering trash that they are, if for no other reason than their editorial standards are laughably bad compared to anyone else who has to actually consider their writing so as not to lose market distribution.

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  • HefflingHeffling No Pic EverRegistered User regular
    Goumindong wrote: »
    It’s scummy but not illegal to take holidays away/not grant them. Federal/state holidays are not mandates to businesses but only to (certain) government agencies. What the NYT is doing is giving benefits to non-unionized employees as a way to split the union (such that if enough people leave/the union is busted suddenly those benefits will go away).

    Edit: to be clear hopefully the union stays strong.

    The ultra rich are very good at getting the middle class and poor to fight each other.

    DoodmannMan in the MistsMayabirdAbsoluteZero
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited January 19
    moniker wrote: »
    moniker wrote: »
    Magell wrote: »
    moniker wrote: »
    Hacksaw wrote: »
    That chart tells me the Dems need to work harder to earn the votes of workers, who have been quite underserved by them in at least my entire lifetime.

    What hard work did Republicans do serving Union households to earn those votes?

    Say they were going to get rid of NAFTA and brings jobs back from Canada and Mexico

    And then they didn't. The only benefits to Unions in NAFTA-2 that I'm aware of were instigated by Canada. It was also passed 385-41 and 89-10

    Cant believe lying turned out to be an effective political strategy

    It's effectiveness sure doesn't seem like a good omen for the premise of a worker led democratic uprising ushering in broadly beneficial leftwing outcomes.

    @moniker

    Republicans lying about goals is of course only part of it, Democrats got pretty shitty at talking to labor too. Maybe related to consultant capture.

    Lot easier to get away with lying when the other side forgets how to play.

    Styrofoam Sammich on
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  • LanzLanz Registered User regular
    Political commentator and co-host of the politics and news podcast Citations Needed Adam Johnson writes on the push to let 18-year-old do long haul trucking

    Short version: it’s an attempt to break labor, not solve a shortage of personnel


    I wrote about US media parroting trucking trade group talking points about "labor shortages" while celebrating a new "pilot" program letting teenagers drive semi-trucks

    Left unmentioned: a reduction in unionization, safety standards & 30-50% cut in wages

    https://t.co/P7WWMK0ou5


    I'm just gonna keep tapping the sign

    [Excerpt from cited article in Johnson’s article: “ You can’t solve a problem starting with the wrong diagnosis. If I can’t buy a Porsche for $1.98, that doesn’t mean there’s an automobile shortage. If I can’t get a fine dining meal for a buck, that doesn’t mean there’s a food shortage. And if appropriately skilled humans don’t want to work for me under the conditions I’ve set, that doesn’t mean there’s a human shortage.”]

    waNkm4k.jpg?1
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  • TefTef Registered User regular
    Lanz wrote: »
    Political commentator and co-host of the politics and news podcast Citations Needed Adam Johnson writes on the push to let 18-year-old do long haul trucking

    Short version: it’s an attempt to break labor, not solve a shortage of personnel


    I wrote about US media parroting trucking trade group talking points about "labor shortages" while celebrating a new "pilot" program letting teenagers drive semi-trucks

    Left unmentioned: a reduction in unionization, safety standards & 30-50% cut in wages

    https://t.co/P7WWMK0ou5


    I'm just gonna keep tapping the sign

    [Excerpt from cited article in Johnson’s article: “ You can’t solve a problem starting with the wrong diagnosis. If I can’t buy a Porsche for $1.98, that doesn’t mean there’s an automobile shortage. If I can’t get a fine dining meal for a buck, that doesn’t mean there’s a food shortage. And if appropriately skilled humans don’t want to work for me under the conditions I’ve set, that doesn’t mean there’s a human shortage.”]

    Yes, I saw this first hand. The local fruit growers, one of the richest and therefore most powerful groups in the region, went on a months-long campaign about there being no local people to pick the fruit. Media reports centered on people being lazy. I attempted to place nearly 50 young folks, at minimum wage (this was not a profit making exercise, so there was no requirement to build in a margin), and the growing groups refused to even talk to me. Only two companies that did were large multinationals, and they made it clear that unless we held multiple certifications from self regulatory groups they controlled (non-mandatory certifications), they just simply couldn't work with us.

    Turns out what they were actually doing was maneuvering themselves to force international borders open so that they could go back to bringing in their workers from poor pacific islands nations.

    help a fellow forumer meet their mental health care needs because USA healthcare sucks!

    Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better

    bit.ly/2XQM1ke
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  • Dark_SideDark_Side Registered User regular
    edited January 20
    Multiple people have been testing this "worker shortage" theory and posting their results on social media. It's been a consistent trend that they send out 100 resumes. Get 5 responses. And 1 interview, where inevitably they get bait and switched, or the business has insane expectations and requirements. I'm pulling those numbers out of my ass just to be clear, but the signal to noise ratio on resume hits is comically low for industries supposedly desperate for people.

    Dark_Side on
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  • LanzLanz Registered User regular
    edited January 20
    Dark_Side wrote: »
    Multiple people have been testing this "worker shortage" theory and posting their results on social media. It's been a consistent trend that they send out 100 resumes. Get 5 responses. And 1 interview, where inevitably they get bait and switched, or the business has insane expectations and requirements. I'm pulling those numbers out of my ass just to be clear, but the signal to noise ratio on resume hits is comically low for industries supposedly desperate for people.

    Yeah, its pretty clear they’re basically using the pressures of the pandemic to extract more out of the labor force than before using the chaos and uncertainty, plus working a pliant media and political class to keep the pressure going.

    I need to find it in one of Johnson’s replies, but I saw someone post an article that found apparently the trucking industry or some industry connected had been posting record profits despite the supposed “shortage;” lemme go see if I can find it in a bit

    EDIT: nice, he actually retweeted it after it got sent to him:

    https://www.businessinsider.com/largest-shipping-company-maersk-most-profitable-quarter-supply-chain-crisis-2021-11
    - Maersk announced its most profitable quarter in its 117-year history on Tuesday.
    - The shipping company benefited from record shipping rates as port delays snarled the supply chain.
    - Maersk CEO Soren Skou said he sees no end in sight for the shipping crisis.


    Maersk, the world's largest shipping company, posted its most profitable quarter in its 117-year history on Tuesday.

    Shipping companies have been one of few players in the supply chain to benefit from the shipping crisis, as hundreds of ships wait weeks to dock and unload at key ports across the world.

    "The whole system has become one gigantic bottleneck," Maersk CEO Soren Skou told reporters.

    The Danish company more than quadrupled its operating profits to $5.9 billion in its third quarter. The high profits were in part driven by bottlenecks at key ports, as well as surging demand which has led to record container freight rates. Over the past year, the cost to ship a 20-foot container from Asia to the US has climbed to over $20,000, according to the Drewry World Container Index.

    Skou told the Financial Times that the company does not see an end in sight to the shipping crisis.

    Lanz on
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  • HamHamJHamHamJ Registered User regular
    There is an actual labor shortage currently. The pandemic has resulted in about 2m early retirees and another 2m fewer legal immigrants. Even if labor participation for everyone else goes back to pre-pandemic levels there is likely to be an effective labor shortage for a long time.

    While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
    shryketinwhiskers
  • MatevMatev Cero Miedo Registered User regular
    Well then, employers need to be prepared to pay more to get the labor they need or keep bleeding business/burning themselves out trying to cover the gaps.

    If you can't afford the going rate for labor, that's not labor's problem.

    "Go down, kick ass, and set yourselves up as gods, that's our Prime Directive!"
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  • OghulkOghulk Registered User regular
    Turns out a pandemic will raise the reservation wage. Shocker!

  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    Oghulk wrote: »
    Turns out a pandemic will raise the reservation wage. Shocker!

    Employers don't want to pay more because they aren't going to be able to walk it back later and cut everyone's pay without a lot of uproar

    Which is why, for example, traveling nurses are getting paid like 5x their normal rate to cover at hospitals where they "can't maintain adequate staffing," because they would rather pay a temp contractor more short-term than have full-time staff paid more and have to keep paying them that rate after the pandemic.

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  • MeeqeMeeqe Lord of the pants most fancy Someplace amazingRegistered User regular
    Crazy how capital isn't so keen on markets when market forces push wages up. Curious that.

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  • HamHamJHamHamJ Registered User regular
    Matev wrote: »
    Well then, employers need to be prepared to pay more to get the labor they need or keep bleeding business/burning themselves out trying to cover the gaps.

    If you can't afford the going rate for labor, that's not labor's problem.

    But at the macro level all that does is take labor from some other company who now has to pay more etc etc. A better solution would be to find ways to make do with less workers through automation or getting rid of jobs that aren't really useful.

    And if we end up with spiraling inflation it is going to be everyone's problem.

    While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
  • LanzLanz Registered User regular
    HamHamJ wrote: »
    Matev wrote: »
    Well then, employers need to be prepared to pay more to get the labor they need or keep bleeding business/burning themselves out trying to cover the gaps.

    If you can't afford the going rate for labor, that's not labor's problem.

    But at the macro level all that does is take labor from some other company who now has to pay more etc etc. A better solution would be to find ways to make do with less workers through automation or getting rid of jobs that aren't really useful.

    And if we end up with spiraling inflation it is going to be everyone's problem.

    Given that everyone and their capitalist mother is making out like fucking bandits despite the pandemic with record profits, I’m gonna say the actual answer is the thing that’s always been the answer:

    “Fuck you, pay me.”

    waNkm4k.jpg?1
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  • MayabirdMayabird Pecking at the keyboardRegistered User regular
    Lanz wrote: »
    Political commentator and co-host of the politics and news podcast Citations Needed Adam Johnson writes on the push to let 18-year-old do long haul trucking

    Short version: it’s an attempt to break labor, not solve a shortage of personnel


    I wrote about US media parroting trucking trade group talking points about "labor shortages" while celebrating a new "pilot" program letting teenagers drive semi-trucks

    Left unmentioned: a reduction in unionization, safety standards & 30-50% cut in wages

    https://t.co/P7WWMK0ou5


    I'm just gonna keep tapping the sign

    [Excerpt from cited article in Johnson’s article: “ You can’t solve a problem starting with the wrong diagnosis. If I can’t buy a Porsche for $1.98, that doesn’t mean there’s an automobile shortage. If I can’t get a fine dining meal for a buck, that doesn’t mean there’s a food shortage. And if appropriately skilled humans don’t want to work for me under the conditions I’ve set, that doesn’t mean there’s a human shortage.”]

    5b3bc01d1335b81d008b471e?width=700&format=jpeg&auto=webp

    Pay for truck drivers has dropped as much as 50% since 1980. One driver makes less per hour now than when he started in the 70s. According to this inflation calculator, prices have increased 360% in that time. So you have truckers making possibly half of what they once did during a span when prices more than tripled.

    The article about truck drivers interviews people who opine that truck drivers being bled dry is good actually because it makes stuff cheaper, except all those "savings" ended up going to big box store owners. Wal-Mart thrived, and 90% or more of new truck drivers now burn out bankrupt within six months.


    There isn't a labor shortage. There is a wages shortage.

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  • HacksawHacksaw J. Duggan Esq. Wrestler at LawRegistered User regular
    "Fuck you, pay me" has been my go-to phrase for stingy employers for a while now. And I gotta tell ya folks, it feels good to say it. Works pretty decently when they don't have alternative labor sources, too!

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  • HamHamJHamHamJ Registered User regular
    Mayabird wrote: »
    Lanz wrote: »
    Political commentator and co-host of the politics and news podcast Citations Needed Adam Johnson writes on the push to let 18-year-old do long haul trucking

    Short version: it’s an attempt to break labor, not solve a shortage of personnel


    I wrote about US media parroting trucking trade group talking points about "labor shortages" while celebrating a new "pilot" program letting teenagers drive semi-trucks

    Left unmentioned: a reduction in unionization, safety standards & 30-50% cut in wages

    https://t.co/P7WWMK0ou5


    I'm just gonna keep tapping the sign

    [Excerpt from cited article in Johnson’s article: “ You can’t solve a problem starting with the wrong diagnosis. If I can’t buy a Porsche for $1.98, that doesn’t mean there’s an automobile shortage. If I can’t get a fine dining meal for a buck, that doesn’t mean there’s a food shortage. And if appropriately skilled humans don’t want to work for me under the conditions I’ve set, that doesn’t mean there’s a human shortage.”]

    5b3bc01d1335b81d008b471e?width=700&format=jpeg&auto=webp

    Pay for truck drivers has dropped as much as 50% since 1980. One driver makes less per hour now than when he started in the 70s. According to this inflation calculator, prices have increased 360% in that time. So you have truckers making possibly half of what they once did during a span when prices more than tripled.

    The article about truck drivers interviews people who opine that truck drivers being bled dry is good actually because it makes stuff cheaper, except all those "savings" ended up going to big box store owners. Wal-Mart thrived, and 90% or more of new truck drivers now burn out bankrupt within six months.


    There isn't a labor shortage. There is a wages shortage.

    Those savings went to the vast majority of Americans. "Regulatory capture and an effective monopoly were good actually" is a hell of a take.

    While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    HamHamJ wrote: »
    Mayabird wrote: »
    Lanz wrote: »
    Political commentator and co-host of the politics and news podcast Citations Needed Adam Johnson writes on the push to let 18-year-old do long haul trucking

    Short version: it’s an attempt to break labor, not solve a shortage of personnel


    I wrote about US media parroting trucking trade group talking points about "labor shortages" while celebrating a new "pilot" program letting teenagers drive semi-trucks

    Left unmentioned: a reduction in unionization, safety standards & 30-50% cut in wages

    https://t.co/P7WWMK0ou5


    I'm just gonna keep tapping the sign

    [Excerpt from cited article in Johnson’s article: “ You can’t solve a problem starting with the wrong diagnosis. If I can’t buy a Porsche for $1.98, that doesn’t mean there’s an automobile shortage. If I can’t get a fine dining meal for a buck, that doesn’t mean there’s a food shortage. And if appropriately skilled humans don’t want to work for me under the conditions I’ve set, that doesn’t mean there’s a human shortage.”]

    5b3bc01d1335b81d008b471e?width=700&format=jpeg&auto=webp

    Pay for truck drivers has dropped as much as 50% since 1980. One driver makes less per hour now than when he started in the 70s. According to this inflation calculator, prices have increased 360% in that time. So you have truckers making possibly half of what they once did during a span when prices more than tripled.

    The article about truck drivers interviews people who opine that truck drivers being bled dry is good actually because it makes stuff cheaper, except all those "savings" ended up going to big box store owners. Wal-Mart thrived, and 90% or more of new truck drivers now burn out bankrupt within six months.


    There isn't a labor shortage. There is a wages shortage.

    Those savings went to the vast majority of Americans. "Regulatory capture and an effective monopoly were good actually" is a hell of a take.

    Is there any evidence of this?

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  • LanzLanz Registered User regular
    edited January 21
    Video game dev person posting a very… interesting take they found on Video Game Industry unionization and game dev in general for the State of the Game Industry Survey that GDC put out:


    A totally normal and healthy answer to the question "What are your thoughts about unionization in the gaming industry?" in the GDC State of the Game Industry survey

    v35r2wpksnbj.png


    Some folks really, really need to talk with a therapist at least once in their life rather than going “our art should be suffering.”

    Lanz on
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  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    Lanz wrote: »
    Video game dev person posting a very… interesting take they found on Video Game Industry unionization and game dev in general for the State of the Game Industry Survey that GDC put out:


    A totally normal and healthy answer to the question "What are your thoughts about unionization in the gaming industry?" in the GDC State of the Game Industry survey

    v35r2wpksnbj.png


    Wait until this guy finds out about factories

    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
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  • PhyphorPhyphor Building Planet Busters Tasting FruitRegistered User regular
    edited January 21
    Mayabird wrote: »
    Lanz wrote: »
    Political commentator and co-host of the politics and news podcast Citations Needed Adam Johnson writes on the push to let 18-year-old do long haul trucking

    Short version: it’s an attempt to break labor, not solve a shortage of personnel


    I wrote about US media parroting trucking trade group talking points about "labor shortages" while celebrating a new "pilot" program letting teenagers drive semi-trucks

    Left unmentioned: a reduction in unionization, safety standards & 30-50% cut in wages

    https://t.co/P7WWMK0ou5


    I'm just gonna keep tapping the sign

    [Excerpt from cited article in Johnson’s article: “ You can’t solve a problem starting with the wrong diagnosis. If I can’t buy a Porsche for $1.98, that doesn’t mean there’s an automobile shortage. If I can’t get a fine dining meal for a buck, that doesn’t mean there’s a food shortage. And if appropriately skilled humans don’t want to work for me under the conditions I’ve set, that doesn’t mean there’s a human shortage.”]

    5b3bc01d1335b81d008b471e?width=700&format=jpeg&auto=webp

    Pay for truck drivers has dropped as much as 50% since 1980. One driver makes less per hour now than when he started in the 70s. According to this inflation calculator, prices have increased 360% in that time. So you have truckers making possibly half of what they once did during a span when prices more than tripled.

    The article about truck drivers interviews people who opine that truck drivers being bled dry is good actually because it makes stuff cheaper, except all those "savings" ended up going to big box store owners. Wal-Mart thrived, and 90% or more of new truck drivers now burn out bankrupt within six months.


    There isn't a labor shortage. There is a wages shortage.

    Those wage numbers have already been inflation-adjusted and it's "paid $30 an hour in today's dollars" to "earns around $25 an hour after taxes" which is very unusual wording. Comparing pre to post tax wages?

    Phyphor on
    shryke
  • HacksawHacksaw J. Duggan Esq. Wrestler at LawRegistered User regular
    Lanz wrote: »
    Video game dev person posting a very… interesting take they found on Video Game Industry unionization and game dev in general for the State of the Game Industry Survey that GDC put out:


    A totally normal and healthy answer to the question "What are your thoughts about unionization in the gaming industry?" in the GDC State of the Game Industry survey

    v35r2wpksnbj.png


    Some folks really, really need to talk with a therapist at least once in their life rather than going “our art should be suffering.”

    I wonder if this guy realizes that Hollywood is a creative industry which is unionized nearly all the way through and functions relatively fine for it. It's not ideal by any means, but having worked entertainment in both union and non-union capacities, my ability to get paid and collect benefits as a worker was vastly easier on the union side, and we manage to churn out some pretty amazing art in the process.

    There's plenty of blood, sweat, and tears during tech week and some of the assembly periods, but you can be damn sure we get paid for it like we ought to.

    Man in the MistsDoodmannSleepGnome-InterruptusTicaldfjamAbsoluteZeroMatevMoridin889MayabirdIncenjucarMosatiKristmas Kthulhujimb213
  • Lord_AsmodeusLord_Asmodeus goeticSobriquet: Here is your magical cryptic riddle-tumour: I AM A TIME MACHINERegistered User regular
    I mean it seems like pretty boilerplate protestant work ethic bullshit combined with the "I had to suffer, so you have to suffer" mentality. Hard work is it's own reward and I had a tough time when I started out so why should these lazy soft new people get a better deal than I got when I got into the industry.

    Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if Labor had not first existed. Labor is superior to capital, and deserves much the higher consideration. - Lincoln
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  • OghulkOghulk Registered User regular
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Oghulk wrote: »
    Turns out a pandemic will raise the reservation wage. Shocker!

    Employers don't want to pay more because they aren't going to be able to walk it back later and cut everyone's pay without a lot of uproar

    Which is why, for example, traveling nurses are getting paid like 5x their normal rate to cover at hospitals where they "can't maintain adequate staffing," because they would rather pay a temp contractor more short-term than have full-time staff paid more and have to keep paying them that rate after the pandemic.

    I don't understand why you quoted me on this.

    enc0reiTunesIsEvil
  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    edited January 21
    Oghulk wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Oghulk wrote: »
    Turns out a pandemic will raise the reservation wage. Shocker!

    Employers don't want to pay more because they aren't going to be able to walk it back later and cut everyone's pay without a lot of uproar

    Which is why, for example, traveling nurses are getting paid like 5x their normal rate to cover at hospitals where they "can't maintain adequate staffing," because they would rather pay a temp contractor more short-term than have full-time staff paid more and have to keep paying them that rate after the pandemic.

    I don't understand why you quoted me on this.

    ...Because what you said is relevant to what I said? I was building off your post?

    DarkPrimus on
    usnTyq4.jpg
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  • OghulkOghulk Registered User regular
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Oghulk wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Oghulk wrote: »
    Turns out a pandemic will raise the reservation wage. Shocker!

    Employers don't want to pay more because they aren't going to be able to walk it back later and cut everyone's pay without a lot of uproar

    Which is why, for example, traveling nurses are getting paid like 5x their normal rate to cover at hospitals where they "can't maintain adequate staffing," because they would rather pay a temp contractor more short-term than have full-time staff paid more and have to keep paying them that rate after the pandemic.

    I don't understand why you quoted me on this.

    ...Because what you said is relevant to what I said? I was building off your post?

    Okay see that's why I figured but I'm not seeing the connection. Reservation wage is a labor supply (employees) factor, but you're referring to labor demand (employer) factors. So I just didn't see the connection.

    I mean, you're right! Wages are sticky! But that's a bit separate from higher reservation wages.

    shrykeenc0re
  • TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    So, since the railroad supply line is actually critical, the orders already came from above: Go to work or go to jail:
    OMAHA, Neb. — BNSF Railway is asking a federal judge to block a potential strike by two unions began polling workers about a possible strike over the railroad’s new attendance policies, the Associated Press reports.

    BNSF filed suit against the Brotherhood of Locomotive Engineers and Trainmen and International Association of Sheet Metal, Air, Rail, and Transportation Workers-Transportation Division (SMART-TD), arguing that the issue is a minor dispute, which would not be a reason to strike under federal law. The railroad also said in its suit that a strike could cause “devastating and irreparable harm” and in this case would “strain an already overburdened supply chain.”

    Reading around, the ruling is on Monday, but everybody agrees that the fix is in. Neither the Biden admin or Business America will tolerate any further disruptions to the supply chains, and will destroy anybody that tries.

    ThawmusGnome-InterruptusStarZapperAbsoluteZeroMan in the MistsIncenjucar
  • AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    Lanz wrote: »
    Video game dev person posting a very… interesting take they found on Video Game Industry unionization and game dev in general for the State of the Game Industry Survey that GDC put out:


    A totally normal and healthy answer to the question "What are your thoughts about unionization in the gaming industry?" in the GDC State of the Game Industry survey

    v35r2wpksnbj.png


    Some folks really, really need to talk with a therapist at least once in their life rather than going “our art should be suffering.”

    We, as a society, valorize harm. There is this idea that growth is impossible without suffering - we've all heard "no pain, no gain" (which is actually a very dangerous belief that gets people hurt in the gym) before, as well as "suffering is good for the soul," among others. The idea that one can grow without having to suffer is genuinely alien thought for a lot of people.

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  • AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    Hacksaw wrote: »
    Lanz wrote: »
    Video game dev person posting a very… interesting take they found on Video Game Industry unionization and game dev in general for the State of the Game Industry Survey that GDC put out:


    A totally normal and healthy answer to the question "What are your thoughts about unionization in the gaming industry?" in the GDC State of the Game Industry survey

    v35r2wpksnbj.png


    Some folks really, really need to talk with a therapist at least once in their life rather than going “our art should be suffering.”

    I wonder if this guy realizes that Hollywood is a creative industry which is unionized nearly all the way through and functions relatively fine for it. It's not ideal by any means, but having worked entertainment in both union and non-union capacities, my ability to get paid and collect benefits as a worker was vastly easier on the union side, and we manage to churn out some pretty amazing art in the process.

    There's plenty of blood, sweat, and tears during tech week and some of the assembly periods, but you can be damn sure we get paid for it like we ought to.

    Hollywood isn't without its own sins here (see: the Rust fiasco), but it is a damn sight better than the video game industry - and the expectations the industry had regarding voice actors made that abundantly clear.

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    HacksawMan in the MistsNobeardKristmas Kthulhu
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited January 21
    HamHamJ wrote: »
    Mayabird wrote: »
    Lanz wrote: »
    Political commentator and co-host of the politics and news podcast Citations Needed Adam Johnson writes on the push to let 18-year-old do long haul trucking

    Short version: it’s an attempt to break labor, not solve a shortage of personnel


    I wrote about US media parroting trucking trade group talking points about "labor shortages" while celebrating a new "pilot" program letting teenagers drive semi-trucks

    Left unmentioned: a reduction in unionization, safety standards & 30-50% cut in wages

    https://t.co/P7WWMK0ou5


    I'm just gonna keep tapping the sign

    [Excerpt from cited article in Johnson’s article: “ You can’t solve a problem starting with the wrong diagnosis. If I can’t buy a Porsche for $1.98, that doesn’t mean there’s an automobile shortage. If I can’t get a fine dining meal for a buck, that doesn’t mean there’s a food shortage. And if appropriately skilled humans don’t want to work for me under the conditions I’ve set, that doesn’t mean there’s a human shortage.”]

    5b3bc01d1335b81d008b471e?width=700&format=jpeg&auto=webp

    Pay for truck drivers has dropped as much as 50% since 1980. One driver makes less per hour now than when he started in the 70s. According to this inflation calculator, prices have increased 360% in that time. So you have truckers making possibly half of what they once did during a span when prices more than tripled.

    The article about truck drivers interviews people who opine that truck drivers being bled dry is good actually because it makes stuff cheaper, except all those "savings" ended up going to big box store owners. Wal-Mart thrived, and 90% or more of new truck drivers now burn out bankrupt within six months.


    There isn't a labor shortage. There is a wages shortage.

    Those savings went to the vast majority of Americans. "Regulatory capture and an effective monopoly were good actually" is a hell of a take.

    Is there any evidence of this?

    The cheaper prices people pay for a ton of staples. Clothing as an example has had if not a negative inflation rate, an almost negligible one. Wal-Mart is shit and is keeping a good chunk of the savings for a lot of changes we've seen in markets in the past like 40 years but a lot of those savings are also going to consumers as well. Wal-Mart having it's jeans made by children in Bangladesh and then shipped to the US saves them money, yes, but it also saves the person buying said jeans money as well. A lot of the changes we talk about and/or complain about do actually save consumers money. They just do so in ways that are often invisible to us because we don't think about what those prices could have been.

    I'm not sure if trucker wages are connected to these changes in the economy but it's not out of the realm of possibility.

    And of course, these changes aren't necessarily a net good because the price of products is not the whole of the story. eg - you used to make bikes for a living but then the bike factory moved to China and the factory became a Wal-Mart. So now you work at Wal-Mart and when you buy a bike it's cheaper but that's not necessarily better for you, even if your reduced wages and/or benefits and/or quality of living is balanced out by lower prices on the goods you purchase.

    shryke on
    StarZapper
  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    Oghulk wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Oghulk wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Oghulk wrote: »
    Turns out a pandemic will raise the reservation wage. Shocker!

    Employers don't want to pay more because they aren't going to be able to walk it back later and cut everyone's pay without a lot of uproar

    Which is why, for example, traveling nurses are getting paid like 5x their normal rate to cover at hospitals where they "can't maintain adequate staffing," because they would rather pay a temp contractor more short-term than have full-time staff paid more and have to keep paying them that rate after the pandemic.

    I don't understand why you quoted me on this.

    ...Because what you said is relevant to what I said? I was building off your post?

    Okay see that's why I figured but I'm not seeing the connection. Reservation wage is a labor supply (employees) factor, but you're referring to labor demand (employer) factors. So I just didn't see the connection.

    I mean, you're right! Wages are sticky! But that's a bit separate from higher reservation wages.

    You're talking about supply/demand between wages/job demand from the clean, theoretical model assuming rational economic actors.

    I'm talking about the practical reality of the supply/demand that actually exists right now, where one side has disproportionate control of the scales and will act against their (theoretical, objective) "self-interest" because the economic model that our world operates in isn't about "and therefore, both parties achieve maximum benefit" but "how little benefit can we get away with giving the other side, because we can weather the harm longer than they can"

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