Of course, there are still ways this could turn into a conflict, but it would take out the human element. However, the whole Shockwave thing, though contrived, really explains why earth is important.
It's not overly contrived, really. Shockwave saw pretty early on in the war (Like, before it left Cybertron IIRC) that it'd end up turning into a war of attrition, so he set up his secret plan to ensure he would be in control of his own supply of energon.
Then the Dinobots happened to him. Whooooops.
Well, that sounds better. I haven't read the Shockwave issue, so I didn't know his motivations.
See what I did there? I changed my mind and agreed, itstead of starting a staggeringly pointless debate over a comic about fictional gigantic robots. Cool fictional gigantic robots, but fictional gigantic robots anyway.
Internet tradition says I should disagree with you just to stubbornly hold on to the notion that I am right and know alll things. I'm not one for tradition.
EDIT: Though on second thought, it still seems a little awkward to me. Not the why, but the how. We have to "seed" a planet with a PLOT DEVICE, which ensures that the robots will be brought here millions of years to do battle.
Granted, any plot device that would cause a group of robots to travel millions of years and light years to our planet would be a little forced. I wasn't too big on the 2007 movie's mcguffin either. <IT"S A BIG CUBE AND IT GIVES US LIFE LOL.>
Still I shouldn't fall into the fallacy of over analyzing this. We're talking about a story about robots who turn into cars and things and fight. I'm not saying it's stupid; I think it's great. I love it. I just have to lay off the brain thinky stuff. Getting picky over plot details ruins the fun.
So see, I'm agreeing and disagreeing. Internet tradition is slightly upheld. I'm a little disappointed in myself.
Of course, there are still ways this could turn into a conflict, but it would take out the human element. However, the whole Shockwave thing, though contrived, really explains why earth is important.
It's not overly contrived, really. Shockwave saw pretty early on in the war (Like, before it left Cybertron IIRC) that it'd end up turning into a war of attrition, so he set up his secret plan to ensure he would be in control of his own supply of energon.
Then the Dinobots happened to him. Whooooops.
EDIT: Though on second thought, it still seems a little awkward to me. Not the why, but the how. We have to "seed" a planet with a PLOT DEVICE, which ensures that the robots will be brought here millions of years to do battle.
Granted, any plot device that would cause a group of robots to travel millions of years and light years to our planet would be a little forced. I wasn't too big on the 2007 movie's mcguffin either. <IT"S A BIG CUBE AND IT GIVES US LIFE LOL.>
Still I shouldn't fall into the fallacy of over analyzing this. We're talking about a story about robots who turn into cars and things and fight. I'm not saying it's stupid; I think it's great. I love it. I just have to lay off the brain thinky stuff. Getting picky over plot details ruins the fun.
So see, I'm agreeing and disagreeing. Internet tradition is slightly upheld. I'm a little disappointed in myself.
Earth was only one of the planets that was seeded with the experimental energon. I'd agree with you if it had been the only planet Shockwave had decided to pay a visit.
And he wasn't doing it so he could twirl his villinous moustache while laughing to himself. He did it because Cybertron was being destroyed by the war, unable to sustain itself, and he knew the Transformer race would need other planets with viable energy sources to call home.
So Mr. Logic did what he thought would be best to ensure survival of the Transformer race and set off by himself to create a longterm contingency plan.
Then the Dynobots decided to wreck his shit because Grimlock doesn't like Shockwave.
Here's a synopsis of the issue I found:
"Synopsis: Millions of years ago: Shockwave, realising the war on Cybertron will soon devastate the planet, sets in a motion a plan that sees him seeding Energon on several uninhabited planets, including prehistoric Earth. Arriving there to collect samples he is unknowingly tracked by the Dynobots; a crack team under the command of Grimlock out for revenge after Shockwave showed them up when they attempted to steal Energon from him previously. The high Energon build-up on the planet forces them to adopt alternate modes with an organic covering, with Grimlock deciding the fossils of long extinct Dinosaurs are the perfect choice.
Announcing their presence by destroying his ship the Dynobots initially have the upper hand in battle, until Shockwave examines their attack and decides to create a "synthetic" rage to counter the extreme anger they exhibit. After beating the Dynobots into Stasis Lock Shockwave attempts to leave the planet in their ship, but learns Grimlock leaves nothing to chance as the ship attacks him, burying them all in lava.
At some point thereafter, on Cybertron, Megatron has Bludgeon launch an investigation into Shockwave's disappearance. Flash forward to 2006 on Earth and an archaeological dig in Eureka, Nevada uncovers a large purple hand..."
Cliffjumper on
The Transformers Fandom: Consistantly bitching about something or another since 1984.
I can't wait for this. It'll be interesting to see what Megatron is like as a ruler and not just as the leader of an army. Personally, I think the day-to-day management of an empire would quickly bore him, he'd tire of it, maybe pawn it off onto Soundwave.
Without conflict, without Prime specifically, I don't know how driven Megs would really be. His time as a ruler begins to fall apart, maybe Starscream launches his successful coup.
Well Earth isn't the only planet the IDW version of the Decepticons are interested in. I think it's just the first planet (so far) they've found Ultra-Energon/Ore-13 on. It's pretty much been the single reason why things have altered more or less from the mutually agreed upon rules of conflict the Autobots and Decepticons follow, the Tyrest Accord. Still, what we'll be seeing here in the new mini-series will probably be Phase Six of the Decepticons' Infiltration Protocol.
So, Shockwave tries to ensure the survival of the Transformers as a species (are giant transforming robots a species?) by making sure they will have raw resources in the future, and the Dinobots track him down and wreck his shit because previously, when the Dinobots were trying to steal energon from him, Shockwave bested them in combat?
Wow. I didn't realize that Dinobots were such assholes.
So, Shockwave tries to ensure the survival of the Transformers as a species (are giant transforming robots a species?) by making sure they will have raw resources in the future, and the Dinobots track him down and wreck his shit because previously, when the Dinobots were trying to steal energon from him, Shockwave bested them in combat?
Wow. I didn't realize that Dinobots were such assholes.
GRIMLOCK NOT ASSHOLE! GRIMLOCK IS KING!
It's a bit confusing reading this stuff after the Dreamwave relaunch. The War Within flashback series was great and I associate the older Dinobots with that now. Reading this synopsis makes them sound like giant tools. Probably reads better than the summary does. I'm sure there was more to it than just "stealing some energon" from Shockwave.
I bought the Dreamwave ones on nostolgia and they were pretty decent and looked great, but the story didn't really evolve with the times. It was still very much a Saturday morning cartoon, even with new publishers, style book that no one died in, giant robots fought, retreated, fought again, over and over.
Are you sure those were Dreamwave comics you're talking about?
I bought the Dreamwave out of nostalgia too, but they were pretty bad and looked terrible. People and robots died, you saw a guy taking a leak on the first page of issue one, trying desperately to be "grown up" but coming off like a that kid who uses swearwords he doesn't understand to look cool in front of his friends.
Pretty much the exact opposite of what you described.
Yes, there's killing. No more missing or running away from fights screaming they'll be back. A very much "grown up" Transformers story, or as grown up as giant talking robots from the 80's can be.
Again, statements like this just end up making it sound silly. Don't get me wrong, those preview pages looked pretty cool, but your post does come off sounding a little like this guy:
So, Shockwave tries to ensure the survival of the Transformers as a species (are giant transforming robots a species?) by making sure they will have raw resources in the future, and the Dinobots track him down and wreck his shit because previously, when the Dinobots were trying to steal energon from him, Shockwave bested them in combat?
Wow. I didn't realize that Dinobots were such assholes.
GRIMLOCK NOT ASSHOLE! GRIMLOCK IS KING!
It's a bit confusing reading this stuff after the Dreamwave relaunch. The War Within flashback series was great and I associate the older Dinobots with that now. Reading this synopsis makes them sound like giant tools. Probably reads better than the summary does. I'm sure there was more to it than just "stealing some energon" from Shockwave.
I'm pretty sure IDW has their own continuity, ignoring the Dreamwave and Marvel comics.
So, Shockwave tries to ensure the survival of the Transformers as a species (are giant transforming robots a species?) by making sure they will have raw resources in the future, and the Dinobots track him down and wreck his shit because previously, when the Dinobots were trying to steal energon from him, Shockwave bested them in combat?
Wow. I didn't realize that Dinobots were such assholes.
I think Grimlock is a bit Bi-polar and the rest of the Dinobots just go along with it becasue he could wreck their shit. From what i remember from my nostalgia tinted memory of the old tv show Grimlock tried repeatedly to overthrow Prime and seize control, or would go mental and attack the autobots or get exiled to a far away island because of these actions. Maybe this was just Par the course with him for a long time.
I bought the Dreamwave ones on nostolgia and they were pretty decent and looked great, but the story didn't really evolve with the times. It was still very much a Saturday morning cartoon, even with new publishers, style book that no one died in, giant robots fought, retreated, fought again, over and over.
Are you sure those were Dreamwave comics you're talking about?
I bought the Dreamwave out of nostalgia too, but they were pretty bad and looked terrible. People and robots died, you saw a guy taking a leak on the first page of issue one, trying desperately to be "grown up" but coming off like a that kid who uses swearwords he doesn't understand to look cool in front of his friends.
Pretty much the exact opposite of what you described.
Yes, there's killing. No more missing or running away from fights screaming they'll be back. A very much "grown up" Transformers story, or as grown up as giant talking robots from the 80's can be.
Again, statements like this just end up making it sound silly. Don't get me wrong, those preview pages looked pretty cool, but your post does come off sounding a little like this guy:
I don't know what you're talking about, but the Dreamwave comics didn't look terrible to me. It has some problems, but it's a definite step up from the old Marvel comic version.
And that's a funny comic you're comparing me to, but I specifically go on to say that the killing doesn't make it grown up. Most TF comics are the equivilent of a Silver Age story. Would you like Silver Age DC and Marvel comics for your favourite character instead of something like Brubaker's Captain America? That's the distinction I was trying to make.
In your second post, I'm not sure what your trying to say. I state I associate the Dinobots with the Dreamwave War Within series for the past events and found it hard to picture the new IDW take on them. It's pretty obvious I know it's not the same thing or I wouldn't have said that.
I bought the Dreamwave ones on nostolgia and they were pretty decent and looked great, but the story didn't really evolve with the times. It was still very much a Saturday morning cartoon, even with new publishers, style book that no one died in, giant robots fought, retreated, fought again, over and over.
Are you sure those were Dreamwave comics you're talking about?
I bought the Dreamwave out of nostalgia too, but they were pretty bad and looked terrible. People and robots died, you saw a guy taking a leak on the first page of issue one, trying desperately to be "grown up" but coming off like a that kid who uses swearwords he doesn't understand to look cool in front of his friends.
Pretty much the exact opposite of what you described.
Yes, there's killing. No more missing or running away from fights screaming they'll be back. A very much "grown up" Transformers story, or as grown up as giant talking robots from the 80's can be.
Again, statements like this just end up making it sound silly. Don't get me wrong, those preview pages looked pretty cool, but your post does come off sounding a little like this guy:
I don't know what you're talking about, but the Dreamwave comics didn't look terrible to me. It has some problems, but it's a definite step up from the old Marvel comic version.
Aside from colouring and printing technology, I'd say quite a lot of Dreamwave's art was a definite step down from the Marvel version. I guess the quality varies a bit from book to book. I was thinking mostly of the Transformers G1 comic drawn by Pat Lee, which looked like complete ass. Mostly I think it was Lee's inflatable robots and inexpressive faces that ruined it for me. You've mentioned th War Within comic a few times, which was much better, with Don Figueroa doing the art and not really being constrained by the "house style" Lee had come up with for the G1 characters. A couple of the Armada issues I picked up didn't look too bad, either. I think what I was mostly getting at was how there was killing and consequences in that G1 series, but it didn't make it seem any more grown up.
And that's a funny comic you're comparing me to, but I specifically go on to say that the killing doesn't make it grown up. Most TF comics are the equivilent of a Silver Age story. Would you like Silver Age DC and Marvel comics for your favourite character instead of something like Brubaker's Captain America? That's the distinction I was trying to make.
I don't know anything about Brubaker's Captain America, so I couldn't really say.
I'm sorry, I guess I have a knee-jerk reaction to this kind of thing. I think something broke in my brain after walking out of the new TMNT movie and complaining that it was "too kiddy, and not enough like the original cartoon."
In your second post, I'm not sure what your trying to say. I state I associate the Dinobots with the Dreamwave War Within series for the past events and found it hard to picture the new IDW take on them. It's pretty obvious I know it's not the same thing or I wouldn't have said that.
Ah, okay I get it now. I had to re-read your post a couple of times. I think it's a sign I should lay off posting for the night and go to bed.
Jandaru on
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Golden YakBurnished BovineThe sunny beaches of CanadaRegistered Userregular
edited April 2008
Ah, Shortpacked. Is there any Transformers-related situation they don't have a comic for?
'Megatron Wins' is a neat idea of course, but I'm not sure how they'll manage to get 12 issues out of it. I don't see humanity lasting more than #2. I like the look of the art though. Maybe I'll wait until it comes out in trade and pick it up then.
I grew up in the '80s. As such, I was raised on Transformers, from toys to cartoons to crying like a baby over Optimus Prime dying (zomg spoilers!) in the movie. However, the comics never really held any weight for me. I bought the Dreamwave ones on nostolgia and they were pretty decent and looked great, but the story didn't really evolve with the times. It was still very much a Saturday morning cartoon, even with new publishers, style book that no one died in, giant robots fought, retreated, fought again, over and over.
What? People died in Dreamwave's run. Hell, the latter half of the original marvel comics run was notorious for killing off tons and tons of characters.
EDIT: Incidentally, I'm sort of surprised to see the Constructicons in there, since the Gestalt mojo isn't in general circulation in IDW continuity. Odd.
Doesn't mean they weren't a team before they became a Gestalt.
Additionally, the series takes place a about a year after the Decepticons got ahold of hte first prototype gestalt; Monstructor.
Wait, so there's no opposition whatsoever to try and stop his tyranny? My mind is blown.
I secretly hope Shockwave will try to overthrow him at the very least. That would be a neat throwback to the original comic.
The Autobots were on Earth fighting against the Decepticons, but more important matters pulled them away, which gave megatron free reign on Earth.
From what I've heard, the problem that pulls the Autobots away is the breakout at Garrus-9, an Autobot prison set up for those who break the general rules of planetary conflict set up between the two sides. The breakout was covered in Arcee's Spotlight issue, which paints the pink Autobot fem slightly more vicious then her original G1 self.
Posts
Well, that sounds better. I haven't read the Shockwave issue, so I didn't know his motivations.
See what I did there? I changed my mind and agreed, itstead of starting a staggeringly pointless debate over a comic about fictional gigantic robots. Cool fictional gigantic robots, but fictional gigantic robots anyway.
Internet tradition says I should disagree with you just to stubbornly hold on to the notion that I am right and know alll things. I'm not one for tradition.
EDIT: Though on second thought, it still seems a little awkward to me. Not the why, but the how. We have to "seed" a planet with a PLOT DEVICE, which ensures that the robots will be brought here millions of years to do battle.
Granted, any plot device that would cause a group of robots to travel millions of years and light years to our planet would be a little forced. I wasn't too big on the 2007 movie's mcguffin either. <IT"S A BIG CUBE AND IT GIVES US LIFE LOL.>
Still I shouldn't fall into the fallacy of over analyzing this. We're talking about a story about robots who turn into cars and things and fight. I'm not saying it's stupid; I think it's great. I love it. I just have to lay off the brain thinky stuff. Getting picky over plot details ruins the fun.
So see, I'm agreeing and disagreeing. Internet tradition is slightly upheld. I'm a little disappointed in myself.
Earth was only one of the planets that was seeded with the experimental energon. I'd agree with you if it had been the only planet Shockwave had decided to pay a visit.
And he wasn't doing it so he could twirl his villinous moustache while laughing to himself. He did it because Cybertron was being destroyed by the war, unable to sustain itself, and he knew the Transformer race would need other planets with viable energy sources to call home.
So Mr. Logic did what he thought would be best to ensure survival of the Transformer race and set off by himself to create a longterm contingency plan.
Then the Dynobots decided to wreck his shit because Grimlock doesn't like Shockwave.
Here's a synopsis of the issue I found:
"Synopsis: Millions of years ago: Shockwave, realising the war on Cybertron will soon devastate the planet, sets in a motion a plan that sees him seeding Energon on several uninhabited planets, including prehistoric Earth. Arriving there to collect samples he is unknowingly tracked by the Dynobots; a crack team under the command of Grimlock out for revenge after Shockwave showed them up when they attempted to steal Energon from him previously. The high Energon build-up on the planet forces them to adopt alternate modes with an organic covering, with Grimlock deciding the fossils of long extinct Dinosaurs are the perfect choice.
Announcing their presence by destroying his ship the Dynobots initially have the upper hand in battle, until Shockwave examines their attack and decides to create a "synthetic" rage to counter the extreme anger they exhibit. After beating the Dynobots into Stasis Lock Shockwave attempts to leave the planet in their ship, but learns Grimlock leaves nothing to chance as the ship attacks him, burying them all in lava.
At some point thereafter, on Cybertron, Megatron has Bludgeon launch an investigation into Shockwave's disappearance. Flash forward to 2006 on Earth and an archaeological dig in Eureka, Nevada uncovers a large purple hand..."
The Transformers Fandom: Consistantly bitching about something or another since 1984.
http://www.nuklearpower.com/2009/03/28/warbot_001/ - "WARBOT In Accounting"
Well Earth isn't the only planet the IDW version of the Decepticons are interested in. I think it's just the first planet (so far) they've found Ultra-Energon/Ore-13 on. It's pretty much been the single reason why things have altered more or less from the mutually agreed upon rules of conflict the Autobots and Decepticons follow, the Tyrest Accord. Still, what we'll be seeing here in the new mini-series will probably be Phase Six of the Decepticons' Infiltration Protocol.
http://transformers.wikia.com/wiki/Code_of_Interplanetary_Conflict
http://transformers.wikia.com/wiki/Siege_mode
Let's Play Final Fantasy 'II' (Ch10 - 5/17/10)
Wow. I didn't realize that Dinobots were such assholes.
GRIMLOCK NOT ASSHOLE! GRIMLOCK IS KING!
It's a bit confusing reading this stuff after the Dreamwave relaunch. The War Within flashback series was great and I associate the older Dinobots with that now. Reading this synopsis makes them sound like giant tools. Probably reads better than the summary does. I'm sure there was more to it than just "stealing some energon" from Shockwave.
Are you sure those were Dreamwave comics you're talking about?
I bought the Dreamwave out of nostalgia too, but they were pretty bad and looked terrible. People and robots died, you saw a guy taking a leak on the first page of issue one, trying desperately to be "grown up" but coming off like a that kid who uses swearwords he doesn't understand to look cool in front of his friends.
Pretty much the exact opposite of what you described.
Again, statements like this just end up making it sound silly. Don't get me wrong, those preview pages looked pretty cool, but your post does come off sounding a little like this guy:
I'm pretty sure IDW has their own continuity, ignoring the Dreamwave and Marvel comics.
I think Grimlock is a bit Bi-polar and the rest of the Dinobots just go along with it becasue he could wreck their shit. From what i remember from my nostalgia tinted memory of the old tv show Grimlock tried repeatedly to overthrow Prime and seize control, or would go mental and attack the autobots or get exiled to a far away island because of these actions. Maybe this was just Par the course with him for a long time.
I don't know what you're talking about, but the Dreamwave comics didn't look terrible to me. It has some problems, but it's a definite step up from the old Marvel comic version.
And that's a funny comic you're comparing me to, but I specifically go on to say that the killing doesn't make it grown up. Most TF comics are the equivilent of a Silver Age story. Would you like Silver Age DC and Marvel comics for your favourite character instead of something like Brubaker's Captain America? That's the distinction I was trying to make.
In your second post, I'm not sure what your trying to say. I state I associate the Dinobots with the Dreamwave War Within series for the past events and found it hard to picture the new IDW take on them. It's pretty obvious I know it's not the same thing or I wouldn't have said that.
Oh man, I want a robot named Fuck now.
Which one has the curse name?
https://twitter.com/Hooraydiation
Aside from colouring and printing technology, I'd say quite a lot of Dreamwave's art was a definite step down from the Marvel version. I guess the quality varies a bit from book to book. I was thinking mostly of the Transformers G1 comic drawn by Pat Lee, which looked like complete ass. Mostly I think it was Lee's inflatable robots and inexpressive faces that ruined it for me. You've mentioned th War Within comic a few times, which was much better, with Don Figueroa doing the art and not really being constrained by the "house style" Lee had come up with for the G1 characters. A couple of the Armada issues I picked up didn't look too bad, either. I think what I was mostly getting at was how there was killing and consequences in that G1 series, but it didn't make it seem any more grown up.
I don't know anything about Brubaker's Captain America, so I couldn't really say.
I'm sorry, I guess I have a knee-jerk reaction to this kind of thing. I think something broke in my brain after walking out of the new TMNT movie and complaining that it was "too kiddy, and not enough like the original cartoon."
Ah, okay I get it now. I had to re-read your post a couple of times. I think it's a sign I should lay off posting for the night and go to bed.
'Megatron Wins' is a neat idea of course, but I'm not sure how they'll manage to get 12 issues out of it. I don't see humanity lasting more than #2. I like the look of the art though. Maybe I'll wait until it comes out in trade and pick it up then.
Slag, the triceratops.
https://twitter.com/Hooraydiation
Such as this: http://transformers.wikia.com/wiki/Ruined_FOREVER
Because the Shortpacked guy pretty much runs the place.
edit: also, the wiki makes my firefox freeze
Not... really?
But unlike most of the Internet, the TF Wiki doesn't take itself seriously.
Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
Don't look at them if you think the FBI is monitoring you for kiddie porn.
Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
What? People died in Dreamwave's run. Hell, the latter half of the original marvel comics run was notorious for killing off tons and tons of characters.
Doesn't mean they weren't a team before they became a Gestalt.
Let's Play Final Fantasy 'II' (Ch10 - 5/17/10)
Oh.
Oh my.
I just threw up a bit in my mouth.
Spoilered for creepy.
*shudders*
The Transformers Fandom: Consistantly bitching about something or another since 1984.
http://www.nuklearpower.com/2009/03/28/warbot_001/ - "WARBOT In Accounting"