How intensive is the training for Judo? If I decided to take it, could I substitute my Judo classes for my work outs at the gym, or would I need to do a mix of the two? Keep in mind I would be aiming to still shed some pounds and build at least some muscle.
It's more up to the individual school than the style/art.
So if we wanted to focus solely on fighting (or self-defense if that's a term you feel more comfortable with) Judo is the way to go? What about kick boxing?
I live in Philadelphia where crime is high and I'd like to be able to kick some ass because avoiding a mugging in the first place is basically all I do. But if some crazy crackhead comes out of no where, I'd like to be able to teach Mr./Ms. Crackhead to not attack the skinny people.
So if we wanted to focus solely on fighting (or self-defense if that's a term you feel more comfortable with) Judo is the way to go? What about kick boxing?
I live in Philadelphia where crime is high and I'd like to be able to kick some ass because avoiding a mugging in the first place is basically all I do. But if some crazy crackhead comes out of no where, I'd like to be able to teach Mr./Ms. Crackhead to not attack the skinny people.
Yay for Philly! There are alot of awesome martial arts options in philly. I'd like to think that Judo is a really good self defense art. Smashing someone onto concrete if they attack you will often teach them not to do that again.
Maxercise down on 7th and chestnut is the home of Philly judo. Great bunch of guys there. I used to train there alot. Also, Balance studios just south of chestnut street right around 23rd is incredible. Balance is jiu-jitsu but there is also a basics program that teaches self defense and they do boxing classes as well I believe. I'm trying to get over to Balance once a month so I can do jiu-jitsu with some different folks every once in a while.
Yeah, look at more than one style. Judo is great, but it totally lacks striking. If can find a place that has something like a partnership with another school or gym of a different style, that's a good setup.
So if we wanted to focus solely on fighting (or self-defense if that's a term you feel more comfortable with) Judo is the way to go? What about kick boxing?
I live in Philadelphia where crime is high and I'd like to be able to kick some ass because avoiding a mugging in the first place is basically all I do. But if some crazy crackhead comes out of no where, I'd like to be able to teach Mr./Ms. Crackhead to not attack the skinny people.
When I was a boy I practiced Karate, and a form of Aikido that focus on hitting the vital points of the human body, not exactly the art taught in formal schools, I am talking about the one taught to cause trauma and or kill someone.
I never went to a formal school, I adquired books, built my own Makiwara, practice with other people, etc.
If you want to defend yourself, Judo is not the way to go. Karate requires physical exercises, hardening your fists and feet, the use of combat techniques, evasion, all this will make you forget about fear and resist and control pain. You must also understand that no matter how good you become, there will always be situations when you will not come out victorious.
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Hear my warnings, unbelievers. We have raised altars in this land so that we may sacrifice you to our gods. There is no hope in opposing the inevitable. Put down your arms, unbelievers, and bow before the forces of Chaos!
If you want to defend yourself, Judo is not the way to go. Karate requires physical exercises, hardening your fists and feet, the use of combat techniques, evasion, all this will make you forget about fear and resist and control pain.
Judo only falls short if you have multiple opponents, wrestling and being on the ground isn't conducive to multiple opponents at all-- but 1v1 it would work just as well at self defense. Choking someone out is just as effective as breaking their nose.
If you want to defend yourself, Judo is not the way to go. Karate requires physical exercises, hardening your fists and feet, the use of combat techniques, evasion, all this will make you forget about fear and resist and control pain.
Judo only falls short if you have multiple opponents, wrestling and being on the ground isn't conducive to multiple opponents at all-- but 1v1 it would work just as well at self defense. Choking someone out is just as effective as breaking their nose.
Why waste time choking someone when you can put him to sleep with just a fast kick in the Stomach or Jaw?
Fantasma on
Hear my warnings, unbelievers. We have raised altars in this land so that we may sacrifice you to our gods. There is no hope in opposing the inevitable. Put down your arms, unbelievers, and bow before the forces of Chaos!
If you want to defend yourself, Judo is not the way to go. Karate requires physical exercises, hardening your fists and feet, the use of combat techniques, evasion, all this will make you forget about fear and resist and control pain.
Judo only falls short if you have multiple opponents, wrestling and being on the ground isn't conducive to multiple opponents at all-- but 1v1 it would work just as well at self defense. Choking someone out is just as effective as breaking their nose.
It's also worth noting that, regardless of style, you'd have to be exceptional to win a fight against two average guys, let alone people who know what they're doing. A striker will be less limited than a grappler, but either one should probably be running if outnumbered.
What about kick boxing? Is that totally useless as a fighting martial art? Is there a class on street fighting?
Nonono!! Not useless! Kickboxing is the shit! I'd reccomend Muay Thai or san shou. I do San Shou, but I cant find any good schools for it in philly atm. I'll look around a bit for you.
Also, any place that emphisizes the "street fighting" stuff real heavy should be taken with a grain of salt.
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If the president had any real power, he'd be able to live wherever the fuck he wanted.
Also, the shouting isn't just there because it's some cultural thing; it serves a pretty legitimate purpose as muscle conditioning.
Although I'm currently taking private lessons from a guy in Fencing. Hes also a blackbelt in Karate and mentioned this, something along the lines the "Kyah" and breathing - I didn't get the exact science.
Do a good hard one in the bathroom or something. Notice what it does to your diaphragm and your stomach muscles.
The idea isn't really to yell when you're actually fighting, it's to train you to maintain muscle tension that will help you keep breathing steadily when you're getting hit.
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it was the smallest on the list but
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
If you want to defend yourself, Judo is not the way to go. Karate requires physical exercises, hardening your fists and feet, the use of combat techniques, evasion, all this will make you forget about fear and resist and control pain.
Judo only falls short if you have multiple opponents, wrestling and being on the ground isn't conducive to multiple opponents at all-- but 1v1 it would work just as well at self defense. Choking someone out is just as effective as breaking their nose.
Why waste time choking someone when you can put him to sleep with just a fast kick in the Stomach or Jaw?
Ever seen a real fight? It's a lot more chaotic than you make it sound, and it gets to grappling range FAST, even if one person knows how to fight.
If you want to defend yourself, Judo is not the way to go. Karate requires physical exercises, hardening your fists and feet, the use of combat techniques, evasion, all this will make you forget about fear and resist and control pain.
Judo only falls short if you have multiple opponents, wrestling and being on the ground isn't conducive to multiple opponents at all-- but 1v1 it would work just as well at self defense. Choking someone out is just as effective as breaking their nose.
Why waste time choking someone when you can put him to sleep with just a fast kick in the Stomach or Jaw?
seriously?
Eat it You Nasty Pig. on
it was the smallest on the list but
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
You may believe what you want, but I was involved in many fights in my youth; at high school, on the street, or just outside a movie theater.
Sometimes a fight can be decided with just one punch in the right place, or just my knee in the middle of the legs of some dude. Of course, I never had to worry about being bullied or anything like that, I have always being a very tall guy with long arms and legs.
As I said before, I practiced Karate when I was a boy, kicking, punching, hitting with my elbows became natural movements with time.
By the way, the "Kyah" the OP has been complaining is mostly used in two ways: To try to distract the opponent just before you attack him, or just part of the Ki concept of energy liberation when you hit. At least this is the main theory behind the shout.
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Hear my warnings, unbelievers. We have raised altars in this land so that we may sacrifice you to our gods. There is no hope in opposing the inevitable. Put down your arms, unbelievers, and bow before the forces of Chaos!
You're in Chicago? I've heard there are several good places to study Wing Chun there. The internet might not be the best resource for some of the more traditional places. Physically checking around Chinatown might be a better option.
Question, what about Akido? My mom isn't willing to sign me up for kick boxing till I've started at the lower levels and worked my way up. Akido apparently is non-combative (what does this mean?) so she thinks it'd be a good start. I think it's just another way to shout at my attacker "DON'T HIT ME, I'M UN-PREPARED".
I am not sure if you are talking about what we call Aikido.
Aikido requires a lot of training, you basically use the force of the opponent against him, if he pushes you, you pull him. If he pulls you, you push him.
Now, Aikido, which I used to practice, was taught differently in my youth, you learn the location of the weak points of the human body, this way you know where to hit and cause the most damage.
But I am not qualified to talk about schools, because as I said, I learned by myself using books and instruments.
Fantasma on
Hear my warnings, unbelievers. We have raised altars in this land so that we may sacrifice you to our gods. There is no hope in opposing the inevitable. Put down your arms, unbelievers, and bow before the forces of Chaos!
Question, what about Aikido? My mom isn't willing to sign me up for kick boxing till I've started at the lower levels and worked my way up. Akido apparently is non-combative (what does this mean?) so she thinks it'd be a good start. I think it's just another way to shout at my attacker "DON'T HIT ME, I'M UN-PREPARED".
Aikido is a non-confrontational martial art, not a non-combative one. Almost all of its techniques are defensive-based.
It's an effective art that utilizes parts of aikijutsu and Chinese chin-na, but as an internal art, it takes a lot of practice and years of dedication. You'll learn a lot of principles about maintaining and controlling balance, and you'll learn how to take a fall while minimizing the risk of injury.
The other "basic" stuff that works in a relatively short amount of time are the joint locks that utilizes small joint manipulation, and control of your opponent's balance via pressure point holds and throwing techniques.
It's hard to find a decent dojo that emphasizes lots of randori/sparring though in the US. Stop by a dojo and take a look at how their black belts train to get an idea of what awaits.
You may believe what you want, but I was involved in many fights in my youth; at high school, on the street, or just outside a movie theater.
Sometimes a fight can be decided with just one punch in the right place, or just my knee in the middle of the legs of some dude. Of course, I never had to worry about being bullied or anything like that, I have always being a very tall guy with long arms and legs.
Of course it can. It's just not reliable, and you made it sound like it was, whether that was your intention or not.
Egos, look for a boxing gym, a judo club, and a Muay Thai gym. Watch a session at each, or participate in one if you can, and choose one. There isn't really anything left to gain in this thread.
You may believe what you want, but I was involved in many fights in my youth; at high school, on the street, or just outside a movie theater.
Sometimes a fight can be decided with just one punch in the right place, or just my knee in the middle of the legs of some dude. Of course, I never had to worry about being bullied or anything like that, I have always being a very tall guy with long arms and legs.
Of course it can. It's just not reliable, and you made it sound like it was, whether that was your intention or not.
Some people when hit in the face stay standing, concious and fighting back, no-one who has the artery to their brain closed off remains standing.
Question, what about Akido? My mom isn't willing to sign me up for kick boxing till I've started at the lower levels and worked my way up. Akido apparently is non-combative (what does this mean?) so she thinks it'd be a good start. I think it's just another way to shout at my attacker "DON'T HIT ME, I'M UN-PREPARED".
I've done Aikido - here's how it breaks down.
Its origins are with the samurai - which you'd notice with a lot of the moves. These guys wore Armour - so a punch wasnt going to do a great deal. Aikido is all about wrist locks and throws. Technically, its fascinating - but almost all the techniques are defensive in nature as they require you to use an opponents momentum, or trap their limbs etc.
This is why lots of people will say that Aikido is "useless" when you could go to a gym, learn to punch and then walk out on the street and hurt someone. The moves in Aikdo are very intricate and take a long time to master - and in this respect, its not an great option for people wanting to learn how to fight. It will teach you how to defend, and is actually very good at teaching awareness of multiple attackers.
I enjoyed it because it was a fit with my personal ethos. A lot of the techniques are non-damaging to the opponent (unless you want to...). Ultimately - an art that does this is going to be much harder to learn. But I considered it a slightly more noble endeavour.
But in a messy situation it teaches you things about how people's bodies work that I've found to be really very useful in times when I've been in wrestling with people.
Oh, also - the weapon work (of which the empty hand techniques are derivative) is awesome fun.
I have a friend who used to practice Chi Kung (he may still do).
He's a freerunner and he claims it helped him be much more aware of his body - he would walk along the street in a more centred stance, for example, and a couple of times when I was walking with him through a crowd you would notice the crowd around him wouldn't be jostling him at all - if anyone walked into him accidentally he'd automatically rebalance himself effortlessly. I don't even think he was aware he was doing it.
If reducing stress is what you're looking for I'd definitely research it.
I've heard amazing things about Tai Chi, but keep in mind that it isn't really a combat martial art.
It depends on what specific form of Tai Chi you're doing, but it's fairly difficult to find the more combat-oriented forms in the U.S.
Tai Chi and Qi Gong (which is probably what Willeth is talking about, though I've never seen that particular spelling of it) are probably the best stress-reducers and balance-builders you can find. But there's no real martial application of either (unless you manage to find one of the rare Tai Chi schools that focuses on martial applications in the U.S.).
I'm outside the US so I can't speak for availability, but a combat oriented Tai Chi club may be exactly what you are looking for. I had similar motivations to you, did it for a few years, loved every minute of it. It is as relaxed or as intense as you make it, and has a real practical focus. You can also do as much of the stress relief/meditation/internal conditioning as you like.
You may believe what you want, but I was involved in many fights in my youth; at high school, on the street, or just outside a movie theater.
Sometimes a fight can be decided with just one punch in the right place, or just my knee in the middle of the legs of some dude. Of course, I never had to worry about being bullied or anything like that, I have always being a very tall guy with long arms and legs.
Of course it can. It's just not reliable, and you made it sound like it was, whether that was your intention or not.
Some people when hit in the face stay standing, concious and fighting back, no-one who has the artery to their brain closed off remains standing.
I didn't say I would hit the face, normally you hit the Jaw, and in certain situations the neck (but it is very dangerous because you can kill someone). It is also possible to cause a lot of trauma or kill when you hit your opponent, who is on the floor, with your elbow between the eyebrows.
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Hear my warnings, unbelievers. We have raised altars in this land so that we may sacrifice you to our gods. There is no hope in opposing the inevitable. Put down your arms, unbelievers, and bow before the forces of Chaos!
I think the point is that its not easy or anything you can count on. Otherwise Boxing matches or other tournaments would be pretty quick affairs. (Ignoring the latest Khan fight!)
Anyone seen any of the empty hand Kali stuff? I'd love to see some.
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ArminasStudent of LifeSF, CARegistered Userregular
I'm in a pretty big metropolitan area (Chicago),, so I'm guessing there are a lot of resources..not sure how reliable (in terms of info though)
I studied a self-defense focused martial art in my university for four years and learned a lot. I liked the crowd a lot because it wasn't a testosterone contest and people there came from a lot of walks of life. People who were there to get in shape, those who were already in shape and rounding out their expertise, and those who were focused on self defense. We did taekwondo rounds, groundwork, throwing rounds and open-free sparring (competitively and not). Above all, I liked the attitude, they were concerned with your safety (but wouldn't baby you) and really wanted you to learn something instead of showing you could kick someone's ass.
Now in Chicago, I'm also looking for a martial art. I'm trying out the One Point Aikido Center for now. I like its philosophies, but I miss some of the competitive spirit (it's not really here). Before that, I also tried out traditional Japanese Jiu-Jitsu in downtown Chicago and the guys there all outweighed me by at least 75lbs and I was constantly manhandled. The people I worked with didn't really teach me much and I found a lot of the technique sloppy with lots of muscling. Though, their lack of concern for my own safety did freak me out a little bit. a number of them came from MMA backgrounds and were all too happy to show how tough and awesome they were and how easily they could break my elbow with their extra weight. (I left the JJ place)
Though, i did hear about one of the YMCAs in downtown Chicago that has an awesome BJJ/Judo group, lots of really skilled people, but I haven't gotten around to trying it yet. And maybe I'm still annoyed by the first jiu-jitsu place I went to. (Skill is one thing, but using fast sloppy technique and flexing your muscles is different... especially when you want to be an asshole about not explaining it)
Well, I am going to stay out of the debate, but I seriously doubt you have been in many fights if you believe you can close someone's carotid's arteries with a swift kick to the neck.
Moving on, I believe this is what everyone should do. Train Judo or boxing first. After a few months, move on to whatever you like. it's hard to find a bad club with these, whereas its very easy to find a bad one with aikido/ninjitsu/etc. At the very least, you'll develop a taste for sparring, which should help you make your choice later on.
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sportzboytjwsqueeeeeezzeeeesome more tax breaks outRegistered Userregular
edited September 2008
As an alternate suggestion to Munacra's path, I might recommend trying wrestling (if you're in middle school or highschool). A lot of the point-based stuff (exposing the back and whatnot) aren't going to be a big help in a fight, but the abilty to take someone down without getting punched or kicked in the head, and then subdue them on the ground is pretty useful. You can build on your base of fightning skills from there.
Either path would probably get you where you want to be.
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I think the point is that its not easy or anything you can count on. Otherwise Boxing matches or other tournaments would be pretty quick affairs. (Ignoring the latest Khan fight!)
Anyone seen any of the empty hand Kali stuff? I'd love to see some.
I did that for two years, along with Muay Thai and mixed grappling. I didn't like it as much as the other two, but it was pretty fun.
As an alternate suggestion to Munacra's path, I might recommend trying wrestling (if you're in middle school or highschool). A lot of the point-based stuff (exposing the back and whatnot) aren't going to be a big help in a fight, but the abilty to take someone down without getting punched or kicked in the head, and then subdue them on the ground is pretty useful. You can build on your base of fightning skills from there.
Either path would probably get you where you want to be.
Just add wrestling to my list so that it looks like this: Judo/Boxing/Wrestling (if you are in high school)
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sportzboytjwsqueeeeeezzeeeesome more tax breaks outRegistered Userregular
edited September 2008
That works too. It's pretty much free (or freer than lessons from a given club) and you have sparring partners for months. Pretty good deal.
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ArminasStudent of LifeSF, CARegistered Userregular
edited September 2008
BTW
If you do decide on a place in Chicago, let us know where, I'm still looking as I haven't totally bound myself to my current aikido dojo. Or if you want another mostly-total stranger to possibly try a martial art out with, I'm down.
I also tried out traditional Japanese Jiu-Jitsu in downtown Chicago and the guys there all outweighed me by at least 75lbs and I was constantly manhandled.
There is no such thing as "traditional Japanese jiu-jitsu" There's no Japanese jujitsu or ninjitsu. There is Japanese jujutsu. There is ninjutsu. Jiu-jitsu is a mispelling created by the the Brazil based styles and jujitsu is by English speakers who massacre Japanese. No traditional Japanese martial arts place would call itself jujitsu or even worse, jiu-jitsu. If they use those, they're Brazil based styles or Americans that can't spell.
1) Striking vital points:
Yes, you can poke a man in the eyes, it will probably hurt him. If you are that accurate. Try punching a resisting dude in the face. Any part of it. Kinda hard? Now try poking him in his small eyes. If it works, he will be slightly annoyed because you're probably not gonna have too much power in it. If it doesnt work you either have missed, or jammed your fingers on your cheek. Goodjob. You want to keep dirty fighting in mind? Great. Dont rely on it though. Thats like saying you dont need to learn how to cook a steak because you have a great steak sauce. Get some fundamentals.
2)Aikido
I have tried, very hard, to find real aikido videos of two aikidoka sparring, of them trying their techniques out on a FULLY RESISTING opponet. If you ever find something like this, it usually looks like really bad Judo.
3)The grappling myth
Grappling doesnt mean falling onto your back and going for an armbar. It can involve submissions on the ground, standing (although rarely) it can mean throws, or just working from a clinch. You'll be hard pressed to find a smart Brazilian Jiujitsu fighter who falls on his back in a fight instead of going for a double leg takedown, or some sort of hip/shoulder throw. Also, fights go to the ground all the time not every time, but a lot of the time. Even if neither fighter wants it to. If fighter A) is trained in takedowns, the fight is gonna go to the ground, unless fighter has trained heavily in takedown defense now this means a sprawl, not the "Oh ill just kick him when he tackles me, or elbow him in the back paralyzing him" Both of those are as reliable as a back alley surgeon.
4) The 2v1 Myth
"Oh, well I train aikido/karate/systema/krav maga because we train to fight 2/3/4 guys at once. You cant do that grappling"
Son, you cant do that period. If you have 2/3 guys coming at you, theres only 2 ways you're gonna survive that fight. 1) You get a massiveley lucky hit, or throw. or 2) They are scared. Take the mike valley vid for example. 3 guys try to get in his face, he throws off his shirt, gets pissed, and starts swinging. They back off. Had they bum rushed him, he wouldve been in for a world of hurt.
A good martial art is one that is realistic, and spars against a full resisting opponet. Punching a bag all day is great, but bags dont dodge, they dont have footwork, they dont evade. People do. Some schools try to train fully alive, fully resisting, but kinda fail. For example, the Wing Chun guys who think they can stop takedowns with an elbow to the back. This can actually work against someone who doesnt know how to do a takedown. But when their opponet in the school attempts a takedown, its slow, sloppy, and the guy bends at the waist. A good grappler wont ever do a takedown like that, and defending it is a lot different.
Also, if you're brave check out Bullshido.net for some decent info on martial arts, what sucks, what doesnt, etc.
A lot of info. Sorry that I haven't been able to keep up, especially since you guys were considerate enough to answer (quite in depth too) Though yeah, obviously a lot of differing opinions (still appreciate it none-the-less); variety is the spice of life, yeah?
Busy with rl stuff. I'll try and digest all this info over the weekend. But just wanted to let you know it was appreciated.
If you do decide on a place in Chicago, let us know where, I'm still looking as I haven't totally bound myself to my current aikido dojo. Or if you want another mostly-total stranger to possibly try a martial art out with, I'm down.
ITT I would be up for it. I'll let you know some stuff that I find in the following week (weeks) or so.
I'm gonna stay out of this argument of practicality, because I don't really know or care much about that, and throw in the fact that Brazilian Jiu-jitsu is one of the funnest things I've ever done. I haven't done most martial arts, but with things like striking martial arts, you can't spar until a long while. With BJJ you can roll from the start... which is fun.
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It's more up to the individual school than the style/art.
I live in Philadelphia where crime is high and I'd like to be able to kick some ass because avoiding a mugging in the first place is basically all I do. But if some crazy crackhead comes out of no where, I'd like to be able to teach Mr./Ms. Crackhead to not attack the skinny people.
Maxercise down on 7th and chestnut is the home of Philly judo. Great bunch of guys there. I used to train there alot. Also, Balance studios just south of chestnut street right around 23rd is incredible. Balance is jiu-jitsu but there is also a basics program that teaches self defense and they do boxing classes as well I believe. I'm trying to get over to Balance once a month so I can do jiu-jitsu with some different folks every once in a while.
When I was a boy I practiced Karate, and a form of Aikido that focus on hitting the vital points of the human body, not exactly the art taught in formal schools, I am talking about the one taught to cause trauma and or kill someone.
I never went to a formal school, I adquired books, built my own Makiwara, practice with other people, etc.
If you want to defend yourself, Judo is not the way to go. Karate requires physical exercises, hardening your fists and feet, the use of combat techniques, evasion, all this will make you forget about fear and resist and control pain. You must also understand that no matter how good you become, there will always be situations when you will not come out victorious.
Judo only falls short if you have multiple opponents, wrestling and being on the ground isn't conducive to multiple opponents at all-- but 1v1 it would work just as well at self defense. Choking someone out is just as effective as breaking their nose.
B.net: Kusanku
Why waste time choking someone when you can put him to sleep with just a fast kick in the Stomach or Jaw?
B.net: Kusanku
It's also worth noting that, regardless of style, you'd have to be exceptional to win a fight against two average guys, let alone people who know what they're doing. A striker will be less limited than a grappler, but either one should probably be running if outnumbered.
Nonono!! Not useless! Kickboxing is the shit! I'd reccomend Muay Thai or san shou. I do San Shou, but I cant find any good schools for it in philly atm. I'll look around a bit for you.
Also, any place that emphisizes the "street fighting" stuff real heavy should be taken with a grain of salt.
If the president had any real power, he'd be able to live wherever the fuck he wanted.
Do a good hard one in the bathroom or something. Notice what it does to your diaphragm and your stomach muscles.
The idea isn't really to yell when you're actually fighting, it's to train you to maintain muscle tension that will help you keep breathing steadily when you're getting hit.
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
Ever seen a real fight? It's a lot more chaotic than you make it sound, and it gets to grappling range FAST, even if one person knows how to fight.
seriously?
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
You may believe what you want, but I was involved in many fights in my youth; at high school, on the street, or just outside a movie theater.
Sometimes a fight can be decided with just one punch in the right place, or just my knee in the middle of the legs of some dude. Of course, I never had to worry about being bullied or anything like that, I have always being a very tall guy with long arms and legs.
As I said before, I practiced Karate when I was a boy, kicking, punching, hitting with my elbows became natural movements with time.
By the way, the "Kyah" the OP has been complaining is mostly used in two ways: To try to distract the opponent just before you attack him, or just part of the Ki concept of energy liberation when you hit. At least this is the main theory behind the shout.
Aikido requires a lot of training, you basically use the force of the opponent against him, if he pushes you, you pull him. If he pulls you, you push him.
Now, Aikido, which I used to practice, was taught differently in my youth, you learn the location of the weak points of the human body, this way you know where to hit and cause the most damage.
But I am not qualified to talk about schools, because as I said, I learned by myself using books and instruments.
Aikido is a non-confrontational martial art, not a non-combative one. Almost all of its techniques are defensive-based.
It's an effective art that utilizes parts of aikijutsu and Chinese chin-na, but as an internal art, it takes a lot of practice and years of dedication. You'll learn a lot of principles about maintaining and controlling balance, and you'll learn how to take a fall while minimizing the risk of injury.
The other "basic" stuff that works in a relatively short amount of time are the joint locks that utilizes small joint manipulation, and control of your opponent's balance via pressure point holds and throwing techniques.
It's hard to find a decent dojo that emphasizes lots of randori/sparring though in the US. Stop by a dojo and take a look at how their black belts train to get an idea of what awaits.
Of course it can. It's just not reliable, and you made it sound like it was, whether that was your intention or not.
Some people when hit in the face stay standing, concious and fighting back, no-one who has the artery to their brain closed off remains standing.
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Currently Ebaying Nothing at all but I might do in the future.
I've done Aikido - here's how it breaks down.
Its origins are with the samurai - which you'd notice with a lot of the moves. These guys wore Armour - so a punch wasnt going to do a great deal. Aikido is all about wrist locks and throws. Technically, its fascinating - but almost all the techniques are defensive in nature as they require you to use an opponents momentum, or trap their limbs etc.
This is why lots of people will say that Aikido is "useless" when you could go to a gym, learn to punch and then walk out on the street and hurt someone. The moves in Aikdo are very intricate and take a long time to master - and in this respect, its not an great option for people wanting to learn how to fight. It will teach you how to defend, and is actually very good at teaching awareness of multiple attackers.
I enjoyed it because it was a fit with my personal ethos. A lot of the techniques are non-damaging to the opponent (unless you want to...). Ultimately - an art that does this is going to be much harder to learn. But I considered it a slightly more noble endeavour.
But in a messy situation it teaches you things about how people's bodies work that I've found to be really very useful in times when I've been in wrestling with people.
Oh, also - the weapon work (of which the empty hand techniques are derivative) is awesome fun.
I'm outside the US so I can't speak for availability, but a combat oriented Tai Chi club may be exactly what you are looking for. I had similar motivations to you, did it for a few years, loved every minute of it. It is as relaxed or as intense as you make it, and has a real practical focus. You can also do as much of the stress relief/meditation/internal conditioning as you like.
I didn't say I would hit the face, normally you hit the Jaw, and in certain situations the neck (but it is very dangerous because you can kill someone). It is also possible to cause a lot of trauma or kill when you hit your opponent, who is on the floor, with your elbow between the eyebrows.
Anyone seen any of the empty hand Kali stuff? I'd love to see some.
I studied a self-defense focused martial art in my university for four years and learned a lot. I liked the crowd a lot because it wasn't a testosterone contest and people there came from a lot of walks of life. People who were there to get in shape, those who were already in shape and rounding out their expertise, and those who were focused on self defense. We did taekwondo rounds, groundwork, throwing rounds and open-free sparring (competitively and not). Above all, I liked the attitude, they were concerned with your safety (but wouldn't baby you) and really wanted you to learn something instead of showing you could kick someone's ass.
Now in Chicago, I'm also looking for a martial art. I'm trying out the One Point Aikido Center for now. I like its philosophies, but I miss some of the competitive spirit (it's not really here). Before that, I also tried out traditional Japanese Jiu-Jitsu in downtown Chicago and the guys there all outweighed me by at least 75lbs and I was constantly manhandled. The people I worked with didn't really teach me much and I found a lot of the technique sloppy with lots of muscling. Though, their lack of concern for my own safety did freak me out a little bit. a number of them came from MMA backgrounds and were all too happy to show how tough and awesome they were and how easily they could break my elbow with their extra weight. (I left the JJ place)
Though, i did hear about one of the YMCAs in downtown Chicago that has an awesome BJJ/Judo group, lots of really skilled people, but I haven't gotten around to trying it yet. And maybe I'm still annoyed by the first jiu-jitsu place I went to. (Skill is one thing, but using fast sloppy technique and flexing your muscles is different... especially when you want to be an asshole about not explaining it)
Moving on, I believe this is what everyone should do. Train Judo or boxing first. After a few months, move on to whatever you like. it's hard to find a bad club with these, whereas its very easy to find a bad one with aikido/ninjitsu/etc. At the very least, you'll develop a taste for sparring, which should help you make your choice later on.
Either path would probably get you where you want to be.
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
I did that for two years, along with Muay Thai and mixed grappling. I didn't like it as much as the other two, but it was pretty fun.
Just add wrestling to my list so that it looks like this: Judo/Boxing/Wrestling (if you are in high school)
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
http://www.wonderhowto.com/how-to/video/how-to-strike-vital-points-for-self-defense-175926/
If you do decide on a place in Chicago, let us know where, I'm still looking as I haven't totally bound myself to my current aikido dojo. Or if you want another mostly-total stranger to possibly try a martial art out with, I'm down.
a few things
1) Striking vital points:
Yes, you can poke a man in the eyes, it will probably hurt him. If you are that accurate. Try punching a resisting dude in the face. Any part of it. Kinda hard? Now try poking him in his small eyes. If it works, he will be slightly annoyed because you're probably not gonna have too much power in it. If it doesnt work you either have missed, or jammed your fingers on your cheek. Goodjob. You want to keep dirty fighting in mind? Great. Dont rely on it though. Thats like saying you dont need to learn how to cook a steak because you have a great steak sauce. Get some fundamentals.
2)Aikido
I have tried, very hard, to find real aikido videos of two aikidoka sparring, of them trying their techniques out on a FULLY RESISTING opponet. If you ever find something like this, it usually looks like really bad Judo.
3)The grappling myth
Grappling doesnt mean falling onto your back and going for an armbar. It can involve submissions on the ground, standing (although rarely) it can mean throws, or just working from a clinch. You'll be hard pressed to find a smart Brazilian Jiujitsu fighter who falls on his back in a fight instead of going for a double leg takedown, or some sort of hip/shoulder throw. Also, fights go to the ground all the time not every time, but a lot of the time. Even if neither fighter wants it to. If fighter A) is trained in takedowns, the fight is gonna go to the ground, unless fighter
4) The 2v1 Myth
"Oh, well I train aikido/karate/systema/krav maga because we train to fight 2/3/4 guys at once. You cant do that grappling"
Son, you cant do that period. If you have 2/3 guys coming at you, theres only 2 ways you're gonna survive that fight. 1) You get a massiveley lucky hit, or throw. or 2) They are scared. Take the mike valley vid for example. 3 guys try to get in his face, he throws off his shirt, gets pissed, and starts swinging. They back off. Had they bum rushed him, he wouldve been in for a world of hurt.
A good martial art is one that is realistic, and spars against a full resisting opponet. Punching a bag all day is great, but bags dont dodge, they dont have footwork, they dont evade. People do. Some schools try to train fully alive, fully resisting, but kinda fail. For example, the Wing Chun guys who think they can stop takedowns with an elbow to the back. This can actually work against someone who doesnt know how to do a takedown. But when their opponet in the school attempts a takedown, its slow, sloppy, and the guy bends at the waist. A good grappler wont ever do a takedown like that, and defending it is a lot different.
Also, if you're brave check out Bullshido.net for some decent info on martial arts, what sucks, what doesnt, etc.
Busy with rl stuff. I'll try and digest all this info over the weekend. But just wanted to let you know it was appreciated.
ITT I would be up for it. I'll let you know some stuff that I find in the following week (weeks) or so.