So you have stated that Taskmaster would know a fairly good ammount abotu Nimrod due to the fact that they both are members of the villan underworld. But now apparently, Nimrod would know nothing about the criminal activities of Taskmaster. Im afraid this is a two way street.
A killer for hire is still a killer. Nimrod has no problem with killing because that is what he was made for. It's his purpose for his exsistance.
Taskmaster is an active member of the criminal community and, thanks to photographic memory, can swiftly spot anything about Nimrod's design, armament, and actions that is recognizable and refer that to his own perfect memories. Since Nimrod is an offshoot of the Sentinels, he'll see the similarities between him and modern Sentinels and make the connection. Since Nimrod's tech reflects modern theoretical weapons and other future tech that has made it to the past (and Taskmaster has likely had to steal, at one point or another), Taskmaster will deduce that he comes from somewhere in the future. That or he'll just see that a lot of what Nimrod is doing is impossible and won't have to refer to any of his memories, knowing that the guy is from the future because he very clearly is.
Nimrod, meanwhile, hasn't been shown to have an entire database of criminal histories or even historical records within his memory. I seriously doubt he'd have data about Taskmaster in there since Taskmaster is both an unremarkable historical figure, a low-profile criminal (the government would want to keep him out of the news so they won't look bad when they employ him, in fact, which they have done many times, and his main selling point as a merc is that he doesn't get noticed anyway), and completely human and therefore not part of Nimrod's overarching plans.
And as I said before, Nimrod could easily be convinced of Taskmaster's worth in the fight against mutants. Taskmaster is, after all, a very talented man and of far more value to anyone alive than dead.
The guy has photographic reflexes, that's it. How would he know all of this shit? He didn't even know jack dick about Moon Knight, the New Committee and the Profile had to provide him with all the info.
Also, to quote Taskmaster himself, "Personal combat isn't my thing." Against a teleporting, regenerating, super-durable robot, with no evident weakness to this paradox bullshit, he's pretty much boned 99/100 times.
The guy has photographic reflexes, that's it. How would he know all of this shit? He didn't even know jack dick about Moon Knight, the New Committee and the Profile had to provide him with all the info.
Also, to quote Taskmaster himself, "Personal combat isn't my thing." Against a teleporting, regenerating, super-durable robot, with no evident weakness to this paradox bullshit, he's pretty much boned 99/100 times.
He has exceptional photographic memory too (How else can he remember all the moves he employs with his photographic reflexes?), meaning he can remember every news story and broadcast in addition to every single second of his entire life all the way to childhood. This has been proven in his mini.
I'm not saying he knows everything about Nimrod. All he needs to do is recognize the obvious Sentinel influences (Everyone in the Marvel universe has seen a Sentinel, at least on tv, and knows what their purpose is.) and recognize that what Nimrod can do is beyond modern tech (also something a mercenary who constantly encounters the cutting edge of technology, either in his own equipment, visiting AIM and stealing stuff for them, and fighting alongside or with guys like MODOK and Iron Man). Merely recognizing the most noticeable elements of Nimrod isn't like knowing everything about Moon Knight (He had to be given a complete file on Moon Knight for that.), but more like looking at Moon Knight and recognizing that he's a human and that his fighting style greatly suggest military training.
He has exceptional photographic memory too (How else can he remember all the moves he employs with his photographic reflexes?), meaning he can remember every news story and broadcast in addition to every single second of his entire life all the way to childhood. This has been proven in his mini.
He can remember all those moves because he has photographic reflexes. Thats what it means, jesus christ!
He sees moves performed and his body isntantly remembers them and how to reproduce them. It has nothing to do with his memory for data and information like that. Unless he has seen someone talking about Nimrod and his weaknesses in sign language it does not fall under the same category.
He has exceptional photographic memory too (How else can he remember all the moves he employs with his photographic reflexes?), meaning he can remember every news story and broadcast in addition to every single second of his entire life all the way to childhood. This has been proven in his mini.
He can remember all those moves because he has photographic reflexes. Thats what it means, jesus christ!
He sees moves performed and his body isntantly remembers them and how to reproduce them. It has nothing to do with his memory for data and information like that. Unless he has seen someone talking about Nimrod and his weaknesses in sign language it does not fall under the same category.
Photographic reflexes are worthless without exceptional photographic memory. How else would he catalogue all the movements in his head and access them the instant he needs them? And just as he can instantly remember how to dodge to the left like Spider-Man at the exact moment somebody slashes at him, he could just as easily remember something less useful like the opening scene to "Into the Woods". He remembers everything.
So basically, it seems like everyone who's been arguing with me about what Taskmaster can and cannot do has only the most basic understanding of what he can do, and I can't help but wonder why you'd be so quick to dismiss my own claims about the character's basic capabilities when this is clearly a character you know less about than I do. If you had doubts, why not ask me to justify my claim instead of puffing yourself up and acting as though I was pulling things out of my ass when you had no reason to suspect that that was the case?
Is anyone even reading this horrific thread, or is this just being seen as a mindless hissy fit between eccentric fanboys?
All I'm suggesting is that he doesn't have the means to beat Nimrod in this setting. Maybe if he was expecting the confrontation and had time to prepare those means it would be more likely for him to come out on top. Unfortunately, that's not the case here, and even though he's a great character, he shouldn't move on.
All I'm suggesting is that he doesn't have the means to beat Nimrod in this setting. Maybe if he was expecting the confrontation and had time to prepare those means it would be more likely for him to come out on top. Unfortunately, that's not the case here, and even though he's a great character, he shouldn't move on.
And I'm suggesting that the means to beat Nimrod lie in knowledge, not firepower, and Taskmasters unique photographic memory and lifestyle place that very knowledge at hand at a moment's notice. There seems to be a pretty strong inclination, however, to see this fight and all these fights as simple brawls and haphazard comparisons of wikipedia entries with no regard for anything less obvious than somebody getting blown up.
Not to say Taskmaster has the fight in the bag, of course, but just that there's enough to justify a Taskmaster vote if someone should be inclined to do so and more than enough to warrant giving the character respect beyond calling him a pussy.
So you have stated that Taskmaster would know a fairly good ammount abotu Nimrod due to the fact that they both are members of the villan underworld. But now apparently, Nimrod would know nothing about the criminal activities of Taskmaster. Im afraid this is a two way street.
A killer for hire is still a killer. Nimrod has no problem with killing because that is what he was made for. It's his purpose for his exsistance.
True. Its like WWE, where they shove all factors towards one guy winning, while ignoring that the whole "win by knowledge" means squat against a supercomputer.
Nimrod can also access ANY computer database, he did it when he just arrived in New York. And again when forge put him online. Nimrod would just find out that Taskmaster runs away from Iron Man, Ant Man and Hawkeye. And set his blasts on stun.
Taskmaster is a man with a damn good memory. But that cant beat the most advanced computer. Nimrod wins, but feels pity and lets Tasky live.
So you have stated that Taskmaster would know a fairly good ammount abotu Nimrod due to the fact that they both are members of the villan underworld. But now apparently, Nimrod would know nothing about the criminal activities of Taskmaster. Im afraid this is a two way street.
A killer for hire is still a killer. Nimrod has no problem with killing because that is what he was made for. It's his purpose for his exsistance.
True. Its like WWE, where they shove all factors towards one guy winning, while ignoring that the whole "win by knowledge" means squat against a supercomputer.
Nimrod can also access ANY computer database, he did it when he just arrived in New York. And again when forge put him online. Nimrod would just find out that Taskmaster runs away from Iron Man, Ant Man and Hawkeye. And set his blasts on stun.
Taskmaster is a man with a damn good memory. But that cant beat the most advanced computer. Nimrod wins, but feels pity and lets Tasky live.
Actually, Taskmaster's is faster than Nimrod, both physically and in terms of their speed of thought. If you look at Nimrod's appearances, you'll see that he often announces his thought processes out loud. Whereas Taskmaster reacts instantaneously and is very proactive, Nimrod often limits his actions to responses to the world around him and, when there's nothing else to do, following his prime objective.
Nimrod never dodges attacks. I don't think he wants to. Rather, he reacts to the world around him so that, when he is attacked, he compensates and responds in kind.
If he were a human, he'd have entered with his forcefield already up and would have zapped all the mutants within the first few moments, as people are suggesting. Instead, it's only after X-23 (Who he knows nothing about, despite her being in the Avengers computer just like Taskmaster is supposed to be and several other computers and despite his ability to access any computer which, I'd say, he doesn't automatically use.) causes massive damage to him that he thinks to raise his guard and attempt to incinerate her.
Given the evidence, I'd say he'd only blow Taskmaster up if Taskmaster tried to blow him up. If Taskmaster tried to kick Nimrod, Nimrod might just punch him. If Taskmaster did nothing at all, however, would Nimrod even attack him? What if Taskmaster employed the methods I've been suggesting this entire time by exploiting Nimrod's flaws through conversation, namely the fact that he's a robot who's been enslaved to a single goal?
Also,
Notice that Nimrod kills a man because human life has been threatened. If Nimrod is programmed to protect human life, then how can he kill Taskmaster if Taskmaster refuses to be a physical threat to Nimrod or a threat to Nimrod's goals?
Granted Taskmaster is technically a criminal, but how is that a factor if he isn't committing a crime in front of Nimrod. Did Nimrod run a scan to see if the guy he just saved was a criminal and worthy of death too? Did he run a scan to see if the guy he just killed might have been attacking that man for a good reason?
No, because he isn't proactive. He's reactive. He reacts to the world around him and, so long as Taskmaster refuses to stupidly turn this into an exchange of blows Nimrod will have nothing to react to.
You know, if Taskmaster ever saw the news from when Nimrod was pretending to be a hero in NY and killing criminals he could just tell Nimrod that he's a threat to humanity. Nimrod was justified in killing those criminals, true, but in killing them he also changed the future he came from. Among those changes? Innocent humans who would have been born if those criminals had propagated were not born.
Taskmaster just points out that Nimrod has killed those innocent people and, in doing so, become a threat to humanity himself and worthy of termination.
In the past, at least one Sentinel has chosen to self-destruct after finding that he was himself a threat to his own primary objectives (in this case, protecting humanity).
He would because his task in this round is to defeat Taskmaster. I'm sorry, but "he wouldn't attack him because that is not in his programming" is slightly ludicrous given the conditions of this battle.
He would because his task in this round is to defeat Taskmaster. I'm sorry, but "he wouldn't attack him because that is not in his programming" is slightly ludicrous given the conditions of this battle.
Even if that's his task, his primary goals are still the elimination of mutants and protection of humans and he will choose to lose if something related to either objective arises over the course of the fight.
The part about Taskmaster not getting attacked because he's a human is a tangent that's been going on and has never been the crux of any argument. It doesn't really matter if he gets attacked because he's fast enough to dodge and talk, especially against a robot who never employs excessive force.
He would because his task in this round is to defeat Taskmaster. I'm sorry, but "he wouldn't attack him because that is not in his programming" is slightly ludicrous given the conditions of this battle.
Even if that's his task, his primary goals are still the elimination of mutants and protection of humans and he will choose to lose if something related to either objective arises over the course of the fight.
The part about Taskmaster not getting attacked because he's a human is a tangent that's been going on and has never been the crux of any argument. It doesn't really matter if he gets attacked because he's fast enough to dodge and talk, especially against a robot who never employs excessive force.
Ive already posted, he has hunted criminals before. Taskmaster has trained many of them, so taking Tasmaster out would be great for humanity.
Nimrod can access any database in the world. Its stupid for you to go all fanboy saying that Taskmaster would have all info on him by a miracle, and that Nimrod for some strange reasons, wouldnt be able to download Taskamster´s bio in a second. Not to mention Nimrod has bio-scanners too.
Youre showing a scan of Nimro fighting a group? Wheres the speed arguement in that? Hes shooting someone, someone else takes the chance and jumps in front of him. Nothing to do with speed, especially seeing that Taskmaster´s speed meant squat against a parapalegic and a tied-up mercenary. Taskmaster would choked to death on Dust´s sand, for pete´s sake.
And once again, Nimrod can teleport. Nimrod can regenerate. Nimrod can activate shields. Nimrod can neutralize powers. Youve shown us only that Taskmasters escapes too often, and probably would run away to fight another day. Thats it.
He would because his task in this round is to defeat Taskmaster. I'm sorry, but "he wouldn't attack him because that is not in his programming" is slightly ludicrous given the conditions of this battle.
Even if that's his task, his primary goals are still the elimination of mutants and protection of humans and he will choose to lose if something related to either objective arises over the course of the fight.
The part about Taskmaster not getting attacked because he's a human is a tangent that's been going on and has never been the crux of any argument. It doesn't really matter if he gets attacked because he's fast enough to dodge and talk, especially against a robot who never employs excessive force.
Ive already posted, he has hunted criminals before. Taskmaster has trained many of them, and Nimrod can access any database in the wrold. Its stupid for you to go all fanboy saying that TAskmaster would have all info on him, and that Nimord for some strange reasons, wouldnt.
Youre showing a scan fighting a group. Wheres the speed in that? Hes shooting someone, someone else takes the chance and jumps in front of him. Nothing to do with speed, especially seeing that Taskmaster´s speed meant squat against a parapalegic and a tied-up mercenary.
And once again, Nimrod can teleport. Nimrod can regenerate. Nimrod can activate shields. Nimrod can neutralize powers. Youve shown us only that Taskmasters escapes too often, and probably would run away to fight another day. Thats it.
Taskmaster can't help but remember everything that's happened in his life including Nimrod's appearances in public as a hero, conversations he's had, footage and news of Sentinels, and experiences with future tech.
For Nimrod to know anything about Taskmaster, he'd have to look for it. Unfortunately, he doesn't automatically scan every computer at his disposal for information on his opponents. If he did, he'd have known who X-23 was. Instead, he'll scan only when necessary and only to the extent that is necessary. Without Taskmaster giving him a reason, he won't.
Once again, I'm saying Taskmaster can win as long as he doesn't attack Nimrod and force Nimrod to escalate his own attacks, instead opting to convince Nimrod to destroy himself. In a situation like this, teleportation, regeneration, shields, and the ability to neutralize the powers Taskmaster doesn't have don't come into play.
it was just the crux of your argument one post ago
Why? Why do I have to show you an exact example of this simply to gain your consideration when every event in comic book history has, at one point or another, been unprecedented just as the scenario I'm now presenting currently is?
How about you show an instance of Nimrod attacking a baseline human?
Actually, now that I think about it, Nimrod didn't attack Prodigy in the most recent New Mutants because the boy was human.
How about that? He won't attack Taskmaster.
If you look at the original post, you'll see that it was an offhand comment made out of exasperation in response to what I saw as an unreasonable demand for proof about what would happen in an unprecedented fight (if it's unprecedented, then it's impossible to prove any of what would happen in the fight and we must rely solely on hypotheticals).
Other people chose to pursue it and it has become a sub-discussion (at least on my part). Since people think it's part of my main argument, though, I'll stop referencing it.
Have you noticed how he´s also stopped claiming the paradox thingy and that TM beat Iron Man after its been debunked too?
I never said Taskmaster beat Iron Man until you started claiming that accomplishing a mission without getting caught didn't count as a win. In fact, I'm the one who "debunked" TM beating Iron Man in the sense of nearly killing Tony Stark (the only kind of victory you seem willing to accept as genuine).
I also haven't stopped referencing beating Nimrod through paradox. I simply have more than one imagined way for Taskmaster to beat Nimrod and am constantly switching between them.
Youre showing a scan of Nimro fighting a group? Wheres the speed arguement in that? Hes shooting someone, someone else takes the chance and jumps in front of him. Nothing to do with speed, especially seeing that Taskmaster´s speed meant squat against a parapalegic and a tied-up mercenary. Taskmaster would choked to death on Dust´s sand, for pete´s sake.
Youre showing a scan of Nimro fighting a group? Wheres the speed arguement in that? Hes shooting someone, someone else takes the chance and jumps in front of him. Nothing to do with speed, especially seeing that Taskmaster´s speed meant squat against a parapalegic and a tied-up mercenary. Taskmaster would choked to death on Dust´s sand, for pete´s sake.
Did you not read the comic?
The entire fight is him standing there.
Exactly!
Nimrod had the ability to kill a clone of Wolverine through the entire fight, and he only chose to unleash it when he suffered a serious blow and even then only against one opponent. He could've killed the New X-Men as soon as he saw them, but he didn't even though his most immediate goal at that point was simply to kill them all.
Much has been made of how strong Nimrod is, but he won't fight at full strength unless you yourself are at that power level. I imagine it's because of a protocol designed both to keep his greater abilities secret until they're needed so he can still surprise people and to limit property damage.
As long as Taskmaster doesn't escalate the conflict, Nimrod will stay within Taskmaster's abilities until he can figure something out.
If you were an uber-powerful robot that teleports and heals fast, would you even bother scratching your own ass. The Xmen cartoon showed us that he doesnt even walk, instead floats around.
Nimrod had the ability to kill a clone of Wolverine through the entire fight, and he only chose to unleash it when he suffered a serious blow and even then only against one opponent. He could've killed the New X-Men as soon as he saw them, but he didn't even though his most immediate goal at that point was simply to kill them all.
An entire Xteam mate. Taskmaster wouldve become a skeleton at Dust´s sand attack. And Nimrod doesnt mind getting hit remember? He recuperates from even being cut into small pieces.
Taskmaster can't help but remember everything that's happened in his life including Nimrod's appearances in public as a hero, conversations he's had, footage and news of Sentinels, and experiences with future tech.
Assumptions again? Has he even seen Nimrod at all? No. Has he ever been quoted taking about Nimrod? No. What issue was he in contact with Sentinels? How about Future Sentinels from 100+ years in an alternate future?
Tell me, can Taskmaster look at the Wright Flyer and use that knowledge to fight an F16?
If he looks at the first Ford, he suddenly knows enough to take down the most modern McLaren F1? Nuff said. :roll:
For Nimrod to know anything about Taskmaster, he'd have to look for it. Unfortunately, he doesn't automatically scan every computer at his disposal for information on his opponents. If he did, he'd have known who X-23 was.
X23 is a top-secret project that even Forge, with years of experience, couldnt find anything on. Taskmaster has been on headlines for too many times, and has quite a reputation. I´d bet that Nimrod wouldnt have to go further than a google search. Another wishful comparision.
Once again, I'm saying Taskmaster can win as long as he doesn't attack Nimrod and force Nimrod to escalate his own attacks, instead opting to convince Nimrod to destroy himself. In a situation like this, teleportation, regeneration, shields, and the ability to neutralize the powers Taskmaster doesn't have don't come into play.
Which is like saying Gentleman Ghost can win by engaging Dr Doom in a conversation over tea. Taskmaster knows squat about time streams, and is no Cable.
And I already foresaw hoe the "conversation would happen-
Nimrod: ENEMY FIRE ADAPTED, SCANNING *first shot hits him, second is absorved and neutralized*
Taskmaster: Damn!! Try this then for size!! *activates huge bomb*
Nimrod: EXPLOSIVE DETECTED, EVASION! *teleports*
Taskmaster: Sh******************t!!! *runs off to avoid bomb blast*
Nimrod: ANALYZING HOSTILE *appears beside TM*
Taskmaster: Take that you robot freak! I beat Iron Man once! *materializes katana and cuts off limb*
Nimrod: ANALYSIS COMPLETE, POWER DEPENDS ON SIGHT *grows back arm and shoots the power supply*
*Room goes dark*
*TaskMaster thinks*
Taskmaster: Say robot-guy, did you know that your existence here would err screw up the time travel thingy... I mean Connor is running away... err... Skynet wont be made and the Delorean... I mean the future wont exis-TAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARGH!
*Huge blast fries Taskmaster*
Nimrod: HOSTILE KILLED, MUST HUNT CONNOR AND SCAN FOR XGENE...
*Deadpool enters room*
Deadpool: Hey talkie boy! Wanted to apologize for whooping your ass earlier today... hmm, whats that smell, barbecue!!!
Taskmaster can't help but remember everything that's happened in his life including Nimrod's appearances in public as a hero, conversations he's had, footage and news of Sentinels, and experiences with future tech.
Assumptions again? Has he even seen Nimrod at all? No. Has he ever been quoted taking about Nimrod? No. What issue was he in contact with Sentinels? How about Future Sentinels from 100+ years in an alternate future?
Tell me, can Taskmaster look at the Wright Flyer and use that knowledge to fight an F16?
If he looks at the first Ford, he suddenly knows enough to take down the most modern McLaren F1? Nuff said. :roll:
For Nimrod to know anything about Taskmaster, he'd have to look for it. Unfortunately, he doesn't automatically scan every computer at his disposal for information on his opponents. If he did, he'd have known who X-23 was.
X23 is a top-secret project that even Forge, with years of experience, couldnt find anything on. Taskmaster has been on headlines for too many times, and has quite a reputation. I´d bet that Nimrod wouldnt have to go further than a google search. Another wishful comparision.
Once again, I'm saying Taskmaster can win as long as he doesn't attack Nimrod and force Nimrod to escalate his own attacks, instead opting to convince Nimrod to destroy himself. In a situation like this, teleportation, regeneration, shields, and the ability to neutralize the powers Taskmaster doesn't have don't come into play.
Which is like saying Gentleman Ghost can win by engaging Dr Doom in a conversation over tea. Taskmaster knows squat about time streams, and is no Cable.
And I already foresaw hoe the "conversation would happen-
Nimrod: ENEMY FIRE ADAPTED, SCANNING *first shot hits him, second is absorved and neutralized*
Taskmaster: Damn!! Try this then for size!! *activates huge bomb*
Nimrod: EXPLOSIVE DETECTED, EVASION! *teleports*
Taskmaster: Sh******************t!!! *runs off to avoid bomb blast*
Nimrod: ANALYZING HOSTILE *appears beside TM*
Taskmaster: Take that you robot freak! I beat Iron Man once! *materializes katana and cuts off limb*
Nimrod: ANALYSIS COMPLETE, POWER DEPENDS ON SIGHT *grows back arm and shoots the power supply*
*Room goes dark*
*TaskMaster thinks*
Taskmaster: Say robot-guy, did you know that your existence here would err screw up the time travel thingy... I mean Connor is running away... err... Skynet wont be made and the Delorean... I mean the future wont exis-TAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARGH!
*Huge blast fries Taskmaster*
Nimrod: HOSTILE KILLED, MUST HUNT CONNOR AND SCAN FOR XGENE...
*Deadpool enters room*
Deadpool: Hey talkie boy! Wanted to apologize for whooping your ass earlier today... hmm, whats that smell, barbecue!!!
Deadpool: I wasnt invited?
All Taskmaster needs is to have seen a Sentinel before (everyone in the Marvel universe has, at least on tv) and to have knowledge of where weapons technology is right now (he's a weapons expert, given the fact that he's able to use a cutting edge AIM prototype with expert ability and regularly steals weapons technology for his charges). He's LIKELY to have seen Nimrod on the news incinerating criminals because a new hero in NYC is a big news story, especially when he's a killer.
It's not required, though.
The Ford is actually a perfect example. If you were from the past and drove a Ford and saw a McLaren F1, you'd know the McLaren was from the future. Same goes for living in the modern age, seeing Sentinels, and then being able to tell Nimrod is from the future.
Knowing how to take Nimrod down only requires you know he's a Sentinel from the future, and nothing else.
X-23 met Captain America after killing around 100 people. He met her again later. She'd be in the Avengers computer, if not the computers at the X-Men Academy along with all the other people in the New X-Men. And Nimrod doesn't automatically look up information on anyone who isn't a mutant anyway.
Taskmaster knows the basics about time travel (everyone does, because it's a much discussed topic), and that's enough. He doesn't need to be Cable. I'm not Cable, and I came up with how to defeat Nimrod.
Dr. Doom isn't Nimrod and doesn't follow the same rules.
Also, nobody laughed at your joke script the first time you posted it. Not even the people you think are agreeing with you. I don't think it'll get a better reaction the second time around.
All Taskmaster needs is to have seen a Sentinel before (everyone in the Marvel universe has, at least on tv) and to have knowledge of where weapons technology is right now (he's a weapons expert, given the fact that he's able to use a cutting edge AIM prototype with expert ability and regularly steals weapons technology for his charges). He's LIKELY to have seen Nimrod on the news incinerating criminals because a new hero in NYC is a big news story, especially when he's a killer.
:?
The Ford is actually a perfect example. If you were from the past and drove a Ford and saw a McLaren F1, you'd know the McLaren was from the future. Same goes for living in the modern age, seeing Sentinels, and then being able to tell Nimrod is from the future.
Knowing how to take Nimrod down only requires you know he's a Sentinel from the future, and nothing else.
I'm not Cable, and I came up with how to defeat Nimrod.
Because nobody in the Marvel MU is stupid enough to follow you plan?
Also, nobody laughed at your joke script the first time you posted it. .
Its a joke? Its the script to what would happen. Period. Especillay the dumb plan to use sci-fi movies to outhink a super computer from the future.
Dude, cant you imagine a better arguement? Jesus, had you said that Taskmaster used his connection with Deadpool to get info on Nimrod from Cable, instead of "maybe he knows this and maybe e knows that" I´d give him the upper hand.
If you had said he´d have surrendered, then when Nimrod´s taking him in he´s use his weapon generator to use sipedy´s web to get to hurt Nimrod, I´d have agreed.
The guy has a weapons replicator. The guy has Spidey´s webs, Thor´s hammer, Cap´s shield, voice replication, Bullseye´s aim, a mercenary organization, and what do you come up with?
Oousmart a computer from the future using sci-fi flicks? Taskmaster looses just to the retarded arguement, with all due apologies.
Oh and people I think are agreeing with?
Unlike you I dont need to post THANKS!! whenever somebody tosses Taskmaster a bone. Look at the votes, everyone knows Nimrod is pink robot, that can tell you that his popularity s near-zero, nobody here likes Nimrod, yet Tasky looses, and I can bet the "sci-fi film future" argument helped Nimrod win some votes, and some of us who initially thought he was cool to actually reconsider him as a 3rd-stringer.
The Ford is actually a perfect example. If you were from the past and drove a Ford and saw a McLaren F1, you'd know the McLaren was from the future. Same goes for living in the modern age, seeing Sentinels, and then being able to tell Nimrod is from the future.
how the fuck do you reason that
when the military has a battle and someone rolls out a new version of a tank, do you think the commanders go 'oh shit, they've got a portal to the future! everyone surrender!'
no, because assuming something you've never seen before must be from the future is retarded
All Taskmaster needs is to have seen a Sentinel before (everyone in the Marvel universe has, at least on tv) and to have knowledge of where weapons technology is right now (he's a weapons expert, given the fact that he's able to use a cutting edge AIM prototype with expert ability and regularly steals weapons technology for his charges). He's LIKELY to have seen Nimrod on the news incinerating criminals because a new hero in NYC is a big news story, especially when he's a killer.
:?
The Ford is actually a perfect example. If you were from the past and drove a Ford and saw a McLaren F1, you'd know the McLaren was from the future. Same goes for living in the modern age, seeing Sentinels, and then being able to tell Nimrod is from the future.
Knowing how to take Nimrod down only requires you know he's a Sentinel from the future, and nothing else.
I'm not Cable, and I came up with how to defeat Nimrod.
Because nobody in the Marvel MU is stupid enough to follow you plan?
Also, nobody laughed at your joke script the first time you posted it. Not even the people you think are agreeing with you. I don't think it'll get a better reaction the second time around.
Its a joke? Its the script to what would happen. Period. Especillay the dumb plan to use sci-fi movies to outhink a super computer from the future.
Dude, cant you imagine a better arguement? Jesus, had you said that Tasskmaster used his connection with Deadpool to get info on Nimrod from Cable, I´d give him the upper hand.
If you had said he´d have surrendered, then when Nimrod´s taking him in he´s use his weapon generator to get kill Nimrod, I´d have agreed.
The guy has a weapons replicator. The guy has Spidey´s webs, Thor´s hammer, voice replication, Bullseye´s aim, and what do you come up with?
Oousmart a computer from the future using sci-fi flicks? Taskmaster looses just to the retarded arguement.
Right after the highlighted LIKELY, I say that the part that isn't certain isn't required. I only brought it up to add another layer.
And why don't you explain how my argument is wrong, not how it's "retarded"? Or is that the best response you can give?
Go on, explain how proving to Nimrod that he's been killing innocent humans from his time by killing their ancestors before they can reproduce won't cause Nimrod to see himself as a threat to humanity and destroy himself.
And explain how Nimrod killing Taskmaster, who probably impregnated somebody at some point in the timeline that existed before Nimrod traveled backwards, won't work in the same way and kill all of the descendants of Taskmaster who existed in Nimrod's future.
And explain how Taskmaster can't prove to Nimrod that rampaging through Los Alamos and displaying autonomy won't dissuade the American government from pursuing the Sentinel program, effectively hurting the fight against mutants irreparably.
And explain why Taskmaster can't convince Nimrod that, through his ability to perfectly replicate the actions and mannerisms of all of history's most beloved, trusted, and powerful leaders, he is worth preserving so he can be put to work as an anti-mutant activist who ultimately reaches the government and brings about even stronger anti-mutant legislation, doing more damage than Nimrod ever could.
And explain why Nimrod, who was presumably designed by Sentinels, can be immune to logical paradoxes even though his creators would have been unable to think of logical paradoxes themselves (a requirement when programming a creation to be immune to them).
And explain why anyone who know the basic ideas of time travel wouldn't know that changing the past is likely to damage the time stream, and that you can probably convince someone to stop changing the past by warning them of that danger.
And don't explain these things by responding with a list of Nimrod's powers, the word retarded, or a reference to the time Taskmaster was beaten by Ant-Man and a butler.
Go on, explain how proving to Nimrod that he's been killing innocent humans from his time by killing their ancestors before they can reproduce won't cause Nimrod to see himself as a threat to humanity and destroy himself.
And explain how Nimrod killing Taskmaster, who probably impregnated somebody at some point in the timeline that existed before Nimrod traveled backwards, won't work in the same way and kill all of the descendants of Taskmaster who existed in Nimrod's future.
And explain how Taskmaster can't prove to Nimrod that rampaging through Los Alamos and displaying autonomy won't dissuade the American government from pursuing the Sentinel program, effectively hurting the fight against mutants irreparably.
1) Because Taskmaster knows squat about Nimrod. Nor about his future.. And Nimrod doesnt care about today, only about his alternate future.
And explain why Taskmaster can't convince Nimrod that, through his ability to perfectly replicate the actions and mannerisms of all of history's most beloved, trusted, and powerful leaders, he is worth preserving so he can be put to work as an anti-mutant activist who ultimately reaches the government and brings about even stronger anti-mutant legislation, doing more damage than Nimrod ever could.
See 1)
And explain why Nimrod, who was presumably designed by Sentinels, can be immune to logical paradoxes even though his creators would have been unable to think of logical paradoxes themselves (a requirement when programming a creation to be immune to them).
See 1)
And explain why Nimrod, who was presumably designed by Sentinels, can be immune to logical paradoxes even though his creators would have been unable to think of logical paradoxes themselves (a requirement when programming a creation to be immune to them).
Ah, this one is different. Show me where in the Marvel U the Nimrod-class sentinels are requirement when programming a creation to be immune to them. Stop making shit up.
And explain why anyone who know the basic ideas of time travel wouldn't know that changing the past is likely to damage the time stream, and that you can probably convince someone to stop changing the past by warning them of that danger.
See 1)
Taskmaster has good memory. Thats it. He´s not Sherlock Holms or Longshot.
And explain why Nimrod, who was presumably designed by Sentinels, can be immune to logical paradoxes even though his creators would have been unable to think of logical paradoxes themselves (a requirement when programming a creation to be immune to them).
i don't even know you're trying to say there
And explain why anyone who know the basic ideas of time travel wouldn't know that changing the past is likely to damage the time stream, and that you can probably convince someone to stop changing the past by warning them of that danger.
unfortunately, that's not how time travel works in the marvel universe
how do i know this?
this is how-
bishop came back in time specifically to prevent his future from happening and he did, yet he still exists!
thus, nimrod likewise exists in a divergent timeline and his actions do not affect the likelihood of his being created in the future
All Taskmaster needs is to have seen a Sentinel before (everyone in the Marvel universe has, at least on tv)
even though nimrod isn't purple and fifty feet tall like all sentinels in this time, huh?
that is an impressive piece of deductive reasoning
The first sentinels weren't fifty feet tall either, so that height isn't a given with them.
Even though Nimrod doesn't share the physical shape of Sentinels, his speech is near identical and his weapons systems are clearly descended from them. Beyond that, there's the fact that he's obsessed with mutants which is generally considered a straight give away.
And like I said, Taskmaster knows a lot about weapons and would likely see the similarities between Nimrod's concussive blasts and a Sentinel's. Remember, he extremely attuned to his memories. The moment a single aspect of Nimrod rings familiar (and when Nimrod scans for mutants, which is the first thing he announces himself as doing when he enters an unfamiliar location, Taskmaster will be reminded of Sentinels) his mind will go directly to every memory Sentinels he has.
how the fuck do you reason that
when the military has a battle and someone rolls out a new version of a tank, do you think the commanders go 'oh shit, they've got a portal to the future! everyone surrender!'
no, because assuming something you've never seen before must be from the future is retarded
I reason that because, while modern F1s are clearly cars, they're so advanced compared to the original Model Ts that anyone from that era would know that the car was from the future (at least if, like Taskmaster, they lived in a world where Time Travel is a both a possibility and a common occurrence).
And Taskmaster knows a lot about weapons technology, so it's more like someone who knows a lot about the Model T looking at an F1 perform and knowing that nothing it does is possible within his era.
And explain why Nimrod, who was presumably designed by Sentinels, can be immune to logical paradoxes even though his creators would have been unable to think of logical paradoxes themselves (a requirement when programming a creation to be immune to them).
i don't even know you're trying to say there
And explain why anyone who know the basic ideas of time travel wouldn't know that changing the past is likely to damage the time stream, and that you can probably convince someone to stop changing the past by warning them of that danger.
unfortunately, that's not how time travel works in the marvel universe
how do i know this?
this is how-
bishop came back in time specifically to prevent his future from happening and he did, yet he still exists!
thus, nimrod likewise exists in a divergent timeline and his actions do not affect the likelihood of his being created in the future
anyway, i have to go for a bit
Wasn't it said that Cable beat Nimrod by warning him of the dangers inherent in damaging the time stream? That may not be how time travel works in the Marvel Universe, but most people within the Marvel Universe (including Nimrod, apparently) don't realize that changing the past creates an alternate future instead of destroying the current one.
After all, if you can't change the present by changing the past, then there would have been no reason to send Nimrod into the past in the first place since none of his actions in the past have affected the present in the least. He'd have been better off staying in his present, fighting the mutants there.
But nobody in Nimrod's time seems to have been privy to that knowledge, so he went back in time anyway.
1) Because Taskmaster knows squat about Nimrod. Nor about his future.. And Nimrod doesnt care about today, only about his alternate future.
If Nimrod doesn't care about the present, then why did he save that man's life by vaporizing his attacker?
Nimrod wasn't programmed to "not care" about the modern age. Instead, he was programmed to protect human life and obliterate all mutants (and in this case, we can grant that Doom has given him the secondary objective of beating Taskmaster). The desire to save human lives and kill mutants, regardless of what era it is, is evidenced by the fact that those are the first thing he does and the first thing he intends to do (respectively) at the end of his most recent appearance. The fact that it's the past doesn't affect him in the least.
And like I said, I think Taskmaster knows enough.
Ah, this one is different. Show me where in the Marvel U the Nimrod-class sentinels are requirement when programming a creation to be immune to them. Stop making shit up.
OK, even IF taskmaster could persuade Nimrod to spare his life... how the HELL is he going to damage Nimrod faster than he can repair himself?
I mean, there's really no doubt that Nimrod could vaporize the living shit out of Tasky. OK, so theres nuclear bombs at los alamos, but do you REALLY think that Nimrod(who's powers clearly state that he can not only understand but ABSORB technology) would be stupid enough to just fucking stand there and take it?
I love Taskmaster and despise Nimrod but come the fuck on... there's NO WAY IN HELL tasky is taking down nimrod. He MAY find a way to escape with his life, but there's no way he's coming out of this fight with the big W.
...and I'm usually the type of person that will give the character I like more the benefit of the doubt in a tough match-up. Claiming tasky would win this one is just rediculous, though
GoodCitizen on
Benjamin Franklin used foil covered window glass to create a capacitor. He then attempted to kill a turkey with the stored charge. Instead, he knocked himself out. Franklin later wrote, "I tried to kill a turkey but nearly succeeded in killing a goose."
OK, even IF taskmaster could persuade Nimrod to spare his life... how the HELL is he going to damage Nimrod faster than he can repair himself?
I mean, there's really no doubt that Nimrod could vaporize the living shit out of Tasky. OK, so theres nuclear bombs at los alamos, but do you REALLY think that Nimrod(who's powers clearly state that he can not only understand but ABSORB technology) would be stupid enough to just fucking stand there and take it?
I love Taskmaster and despise Nimrod but come the fuck on... there's NO WAY IN HELL tasky is taking down nimrod. He MAY find a way to escape with his life, but there's no way he's coming out of this fight with the big W.
...and I'm usually the type of person that will give the character I like more the benefit of the doubt in a tough match-up. Claiming tasky would win this one is just rediculous, though
By the rules of the fight someone has to lose and someone has to win. If Taskmaster's going to be spared, Nimrod has to kill himself so Taskmaster can move on. Otherwise, they hang out in Los Alamos forever and Taskmaster eventually dies from being a feeble human.
All the scenarios that don't have Taskmaster convincing Nimrod to spare his life (the majority of them) have Nimrod destroying himself or suffering a fatal error.
And by his design, Nimrod won't vaporize anybody unless they're shown to be enough of a threat to warrant vaporization (either by being an immediate threat to human life or by seriously damaging Nimrod in the first place, like X-23 did). If Taskmaster can't damage Nimrod, like everyone has been saying, then Nimrod will actually hold back against him.
Ah, this one is different. Show me where in the Marvel U the Nimrod-class sentinels, have the paradox BS which you sayare requirement when programming a creation to be immune to them. Stop making shit up.
I have no idea what you're saying here.
Got cut that part.
Show me where in Marvel U your made up programming paradox into creations to be immune to them exists or even applies to Sentinels. Because now youre assuming that -
A) Theres even that paradox programming in sentinels
That that programming carried over to the FUTURE Nimrod sentinels and
C) That Taskmaster has any access to classified info on the Sentinel program, if the mythical programming even exists
All 3 are far-fetched, without any basis on Marvel canon.
Show me one page in ANY Marvel comic where it says that a Sentinel has your logical paradoxes and how its a requirement when programming a creation to be immune to them.
Because all I see is you inventing acts about Nimrod out of some robot B-movies, and saldy that aint gonna same Tasky.
If Nimrod doesn't care about the present, then why did he save that man's life by vaporizing his attacker?
He needed a guide. And quickly changed his directive from "hunt mutants" to "hunt criminals", the key to understanding Nimrod is that he always adapts, to qhatever is covenient to him.
OK, even IF taskmaster could persuade Nimrod to spare his life... how the HELL is he going to damage Nimrod faster than he can repair himself?
I mean, there's really no doubt that Nimrod could vaporize the living shit out of Tasky. OK, so theres nuclear bombs at los alamos, but do you REALLY think that Nimrod(who's powers clearly state that he can not only understand but ABSORB technology) would be stupid enough to just fucking stand there and take it?
I love Taskmaster and despise Nimrod but come the fuck on... there's NO WAY IN HELL tasky is taking down nimrod. He MAY find a way to escape with his life, but there's no way he's coming out of this fight with the big W.
...and I'm usually the type of person that will give the character I like more the benefit of the doubt in a tough match-up. Claiming tasky would win this one is just rediculous, though
By the rules of the fight someone has to lose and someone has to win. If Taskmaster's going to be spared, Nimrod has to kill himself so Taskmaster can move on. Otherwise, they hang out in Los Alamos forever and Taskmaster eventually dies from being a feeble human.
All the scenarios that don't have Taskmaster convincing Nimrod to spare his life (the majority of them) have Nimrod destroying himself or suffering a fatal error.
And by his design, Nimrod won't vaporize anybody unless they're shown to be enough of a threat to warrant vaporization (either by being an immediate threat to human life or by seriously damaging Nimrod in the first place, like X-23 did). If Taskmaster can't damage Nimrod, like everyone has been saying, then Nimrod will actually hold back against him.
Next time you reach that hard, make sure you stretch first.
I wouldn't want you to sprain something trying to pull an explanation out of your ass.
GoodCitizen on
Benjamin Franklin used foil covered window glass to create a capacitor. He then attempted to kill a turkey with the stored charge. Instead, he knocked himself out. Franklin later wrote, "I tried to kill a turkey but nearly succeeded in killing a goose."
I should say I'm talking about Nimrod's final appearance, not the first one.
Got cut that part. Show me where in Marvel U your made up BS of programming paradox into creations to be immune to them exists or even applies to Sentinels
You misunderstood what I was saying (understandable since it was apparently worded in a confusing way). I'll try again.
Machines can't handle paradoxes unless they're programmed to be immune to them. This is evidenced by Victor Mancha shorting out over the burrito paradox.
People, however, have been saying that Nimrod wouldn't be allowed into the field with such a vulnerability. If Nimrod was designed by other Sentinels, though (it's my understanding that Sentinels rather than humans rule the Days of the Future Past), then how could he be programmed to be immune to paradoxes? The Sentinels would have to know what a paradox was to safeguard Nimrod against them, but if paradoxes destroy robots then how could a robot know about a paradox?
It's still pretty confusing and it's not all that convincing in the first place, but I thought I'd just throw it out there.
He needed a guide.And quickly changed his directive from "hunt mutants" to "hunt criminals", the key to understanding Nimrod is that he always adapts.
I'm using Nimrod's most recent appearance. All that's indicated is that Nimrod says "CRIME IN PROGRESS. HUMAN LIFE THREATENED. APPROPRIATE ACTION INITIATED."
There's no mention of a need for a guide or a subsequent desire to hunt criminals. And why would you hunt criminals in the present if you didn't care about the present? Why would you need a guide if you didn't care about the presesnt?
Why do anything in the present aside from trying to leave the present as soon as possible if you didn't care about the present?
OK, even IF taskmaster could persuade Nimrod to spare his life... how the HELL is he going to damage Nimrod faster than he can repair himself?
I mean, there's really no doubt that Nimrod could vaporize the living shit out of Tasky. OK, so theres nuclear bombs at los alamos, but do you REALLY think that Nimrod(who's powers clearly state that he can not only understand but ABSORB technology) would be stupid enough to just fucking stand there and take it?
I love Taskmaster and despise Nimrod but come the fuck on... there's NO WAY IN HELL tasky is taking down nimrod. He MAY find a way to escape with his life, but there's no way he's coming out of this fight with the big W.
...and I'm usually the type of person that will give the character I like more the benefit of the doubt in a tough match-up. Claiming tasky would win this one is just rediculous, though
By the rules of the fight someone has to lose and someone has to win. If Taskmaster's going to be spared, Nimrod has to kill himself so Taskmaster can move on. Otherwise, they hang out in Los Alamos forever and Taskmaster eventually dies from being a feeble human.
All the scenarios that don't have Taskmaster convincing Nimrod to spare his life (the majority of them) have Nimrod destroying himself or suffering a fatal error.
And by his design, Nimrod won't vaporize anybody unless they're shown to be enough of a threat to warrant vaporization (either by being an immediate threat to human life or by seriously damaging Nimrod in the first place, like X-23 did). If Taskmaster can't damage Nimrod, like everyone has been saying, then Nimrod will actually hold back against him.
Next time you reach that hard, make sure you stretch first.
I wouldn't want you to sprain something trying to pull an explanation out of your ass.
So at what point would Nimrod object, then, considering that he has no instinct for self-preservation except for when it comes to shielding himself from physical attacks?
It's a stretch, but so was the logic behind Cable's defeat of Nimrod. Unfortunately, that's what you have to resort to when you're talking about a self-repairing robot who is functionally invulnerable and immortal.
I should say I'm talking about Nimrod's final appearance, not the first one.
Got cut that part. Show me where in Marvel U your made up BS of programming paradox into creations to be immune to them exists or even applies to Sentinels
You misunderstood what I was saying (understandable since it was apparently worded in a confusing way). I'll try again.
Machines can't handle paradoxes unless they're programmed to be immune to them. This is evidenced by Victor Mancha shorting out over the burrito paradox.
People, however, have been saying that Nimrod wouldn't be allowed into the field with such a vulnerability. ?
No, people have been saying that youre making up that vulnerability so that Taskmaster will get a slimmer of hope. Cable just told a present-day Nimrod the truth, what woul happen in the future. Nimrod´s calcuations showed he was right. So he turned himself off. Youre saying that Tasskmaster can BS his way in with popular sci-fi and create imaginary paradoxes.
So at what point would Nimrod object, then, considering that he has no instinct for self-preservation except for when it comes to shielding himself from physical attacks?
It's a stretch, but so was the logic behind Cable's defeat of Nimrod.
No it was not. The present-day Nimord WASNT supposed to exist. Cable just pointed that out, and gave a detaled info on the future where Nimrod does exist. Simple.
Dont be surprised that none believe when you mix that upo with B-movie robot paradoxes.
Cable: Nimrod, your primary goal is to protect human life. Your war against the mutants would, however, result in human casualties. Don't you see that you and your proposed war are, themselves, threats to human life?
Nimrod: Calculating...
I'm a menace to human life. I can't go against my programming and kill humans. Well, better shut of.
Is that really any more plausible than...
Taskmaster: You're supposed to protect humans, but here you are trying to kill me! And what's going to happen when the government sees an advanced Sentinel from the future acting with autonomy, killing a human, and destroying Los Alamos in the process? They'll cancel all Sentinel programs for fear of what you become and never win the war on mutants.
Nimrod: Calculating effects of own actions...
End to Sentinel program is certainty. Unit must cease activities and depart.
or
Taskmaster: Doom has corrupted you! You're not supposed to kill humans for no reason!
Nimrod: Unit is running contrary to primary programming. Shutdown.
or
Taskmaster: If you kill me, then you'll remove my descendants from the future you come from, effectively killing them.
Nimrod: Calculating virility of designate Taskmaster...
Extremely high.
Cease actions for protection of humanity. Unit has killed humans in the past, however. Unit is defective, must shut down.
Whatever. The point is that Nimrod's main concern is protecting humanity and killing mutants, not beating Taskmaster. If Taskmaster can convince Nimrod that his actions have run contrary to his primary goals or that killing Taskmaster would run contrary to his primary goals, Taskmaster wins.
I mean, a Nimrod who's time traveled to the past is still a Nimrod in the past, just like the one shown above. All he needs to be told is that a Nimrod being in the past is harmful to human life, and he'll consider the idea and eventually prove it to himself after brief calculations.
Cable didn't need any special knowledge of the future or time travel, contrary to what has been said. All he needed, like I've been saying, is common sense. Hell, how could he have known for sure that a Nimrod wouldn't be able to kill all the mutants without murdering millions of humans in the process? It was an educated guess!
1) Again, for the 100th time, that Nimrod is a modern-day Nimrod. Made in the present time. Old technology. An anonamility. You keep on missing that point.
THIS IS THE REAL NIMROD.
So we´re to ignore all of Taskmaster´s past and present, except for one Udon-drawn mini-seres, and then keep insisting that this Nimrod that got built out of present-day parts is the same as the Future Nimrod-class sentinel. But then a car can go faster than an F16 because the Wright flier was slow right?
2) Taskmaster isnt Cable, nor knows a quarter of Cable just said. Show me one page where he speaks something on the mutant cause...
60 years before the original?
Programming?
25 years of killing?
Full-mutant-scale warfere (THAT DID HAPPEN IN NIMROD`s FUTURE TIMELINE).
All these are facts. Cable knows it all, from past to future. You´d have to think us stupid to make us believe that Taskmaster knows that. As I said before, Cable DIDNT LIE. Cable to him THE TRUTH about his future. Not popcorn movie BS that FUTURE Nimrod would laugh at before blowing TAsky away.
3) That Nimrod´s programming was written by who?
In X-Force #35, a modern-day version of Nimrod appeared. This Nimrod was created by anti-mutant survivalist groups, and was based on the technology derived from the Nimrod from the future. It deactivated itself when Cable convinced it that its existence could cause a paradox and damage the timestream.
So thats why the Xforce version doesnt kill humans. Apologies, but that doesnt apply to the real thing. Nice scans, I so think Shatterstar vs Taskmaster vs Deadpool would be a good match to watch. And if I could vote again I´d vote Taskmaster just for the loyalty his fans have, that Udon series mustve been great stuff.
But based on your arguement alone, he fails. Badly.
Posts
Taskmaster is an active member of the criminal community and, thanks to photographic memory, can swiftly spot anything about Nimrod's design, armament, and actions that is recognizable and refer that to his own perfect memories. Since Nimrod is an offshoot of the Sentinels, he'll see the similarities between him and modern Sentinels and make the connection. Since Nimrod's tech reflects modern theoretical weapons and other future tech that has made it to the past (and Taskmaster has likely had to steal, at one point or another), Taskmaster will deduce that he comes from somewhere in the future. That or he'll just see that a lot of what Nimrod is doing is impossible and won't have to refer to any of his memories, knowing that the guy is from the future because he very clearly is.
Nimrod, meanwhile, hasn't been shown to have an entire database of criminal histories or even historical records within his memory. I seriously doubt he'd have data about Taskmaster in there since Taskmaster is both an unremarkable historical figure, a low-profile criminal (the government would want to keep him out of the news so they won't look bad when they employ him, in fact, which they have done many times, and his main selling point as a merc is that he doesn't get noticed anyway), and completely human and therefore not part of Nimrod's overarching plans.
And as I said before, Nimrod could easily be convinced of Taskmaster's worth in the fight against mutants. Taskmaster is, after all, a very talented man and of far more value to anyone alive than dead.
Also, to quote Taskmaster himself, "Personal combat isn't my thing." Against a teleporting, regenerating, super-durable robot, with no evident weakness to this paradox bullshit, he's pretty much boned 99/100 times.
I'm not saying he knows everything about Nimrod. All he needs to do is recognize the obvious Sentinel influences (Everyone in the Marvel universe has seen a Sentinel, at least on tv, and knows what their purpose is.) and recognize that what Nimrod can do is beyond modern tech (also something a mercenary who constantly encounters the cutting edge of technology, either in his own equipment, visiting AIM and stealing stuff for them, and fighting alongside or with guys like MODOK and Iron Man). Merely recognizing the most noticeable elements of Nimrod isn't like knowing everything about Moon Knight (He had to be given a complete file on Moon Knight for that.), but more like looking at Moon Knight and recognizing that he's a human and that his fighting style greatly suggest military training.
He can remember all those moves because he has photographic reflexes. Thats what it means, jesus christ!
He sees moves performed and his body isntantly remembers them and how to reproduce them. It has nothing to do with his memory for data and information like that. Unless he has seen someone talking about Nimrod and his weaknesses in sign language it does not fall under the same category.
Photographic reflexes are worthless without exceptional photographic memory. How else would he catalogue all the movements in his head and access them the instant he needs them? And just as he can instantly remember how to dodge to the left like Spider-Man at the exact moment somebody slashes at him, he could just as easily remember something less useful like the opening scene to "Into the Woods". He remembers everything.
So basically, it seems like everyone who's been arguing with me about what Taskmaster can and cannot do has only the most basic understanding of what he can do, and I can't help but wonder why you'd be so quick to dismiss my own claims about the character's basic capabilities when this is clearly a character you know less about than I do. If you had doubts, why not ask me to justify my claim instead of puffing yourself up and acting as though I was pulling things out of my ass when you had no reason to suspect that that was the case?
Is anyone even reading this horrific thread, or is this just being seen as a mindless hissy fit between eccentric fanboys?
And I'm suggesting that the means to beat Nimrod lie in knowledge, not firepower, and Taskmasters unique photographic memory and lifestyle place that very knowledge at hand at a moment's notice. There seems to be a pretty strong inclination, however, to see this fight and all these fights as simple brawls and haphazard comparisons of wikipedia entries with no regard for anything less obvious than somebody getting blown up.
Not to say Taskmaster has the fight in the bag, of course, but just that there's enough to justify a Taskmaster vote if someone should be inclined to do so and more than enough to warrant giving the character respect beyond calling him a pussy.
True. Its like WWE, where they shove all factors towards one guy winning, while ignoring that the whole "win by knowledge" means squat against a supercomputer.
Nimrod can also access ANY computer database, he did it when he just arrived in New York. And again when forge put him online. Nimrod would just find out that Taskmaster runs away from Iron Man, Ant Man and Hawkeye. And set his blasts on stun.
Taskmaster is a man with a damn good memory. But that cant beat the most advanced computer. Nimrod wins, but feels pity and lets Tasky live.
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Actually, Taskmaster's is faster than Nimrod, both physically and in terms of their speed of thought. If you look at Nimrod's appearances, you'll see that he often announces his thought processes out loud. Whereas Taskmaster reacts instantaneously and is very proactive, Nimrod often limits his actions to responses to the world around him and, when there's nothing else to do, following his prime objective.
Nimrod never dodges attacks. I don't think he wants to. Rather, he reacts to the world around him so that, when he is attacked, he compensates and responds in kind.
If he were a human, he'd have entered with his forcefield already up and would have zapped all the mutants within the first few moments, as people are suggesting. Instead, it's only after X-23 (Who he knows nothing about, despite her being in the Avengers computer just like Taskmaster is supposed to be and several other computers and despite his ability to access any computer which, I'd say, he doesn't automatically use.) causes massive damage to him that he thinks to raise his guard and attempt to incinerate her.
Given the evidence, I'd say he'd only blow Taskmaster up if Taskmaster tried to blow him up. If Taskmaster tried to kick Nimrod, Nimrod might just punch him. If Taskmaster did nothing at all, however, would Nimrod even attack him? What if Taskmaster employed the methods I've been suggesting this entire time by exploiting Nimrod's flaws through conversation, namely the fact that he's a robot who's been enslaved to a single goal?
Also,
Notice that Nimrod kills a man because human life has been threatened. If Nimrod is programmed to protect human life, then how can he kill Taskmaster if Taskmaster refuses to be a physical threat to Nimrod or a threat to Nimrod's goals?
Granted Taskmaster is technically a criminal, but how is that a factor if he isn't committing a crime in front of Nimrod. Did Nimrod run a scan to see if the guy he just saved was a criminal and worthy of death too? Did he run a scan to see if the guy he just killed might have been attacking that man for a good reason?
No, because he isn't proactive. He's reactive. He reacts to the world around him and, so long as Taskmaster refuses to stupidly turn this into an exchange of blows Nimrod will have nothing to react to.
You know, if Taskmaster ever saw the news from when Nimrod was pretending to be a hero in NY and killing criminals he could just tell Nimrod that he's a threat to humanity. Nimrod was justified in killing those criminals, true, but in killing them he also changed the future he came from. Among those changes? Innocent humans who would have been born if those criminals had propagated were not born.
Taskmaster just points out that Nimrod has killed those innocent people and, in doing so, become a threat to humanity himself and worthy of termination.
In the past, at least one Sentinel has chosen to self-destruct after finding that he was himself a threat to his own primary objectives (in this case, protecting humanity).
Even if that's his task, his primary goals are still the elimination of mutants and protection of humans and he will choose to lose if something related to either objective arises over the course of the fight.
The part about Taskmaster not getting attacked because he's a human is a tangent that's been going on and has never been the crux of any argument. It doesn't really matter if he gets attacked because he's fast enough to dodge and talk, especially against a robot who never employs excessive force.
Ive already posted, he has hunted criminals before. Taskmaster has trained many of them, so taking Tasmaster out would be great for humanity.
Nimrod can access any database in the world. Its stupid for you to go all fanboy saying that Taskmaster would have all info on him by a miracle, and that Nimrod for some strange reasons, wouldnt be able to download Taskamster´s bio in a second. Not to mention Nimrod has bio-scanners too.
Youre showing a scan of Nimro fighting a group? Wheres the speed arguement in that? Hes shooting someone, someone else takes the chance and jumps in front of him. Nothing to do with speed, especially seeing that Taskmaster´s speed meant squat against a parapalegic and a tied-up mercenary. Taskmaster would choked to death on Dust´s sand, for pete´s sake.
And once again, Nimrod can teleport. Nimrod can regenerate. Nimrod can activate shields. Nimrod can neutralize powers. Youve shown us only that Taskmasters escapes too often, and probably would run away to fight another day. Thats it.
Have you noticed how he´s also stopped claiming the paradox thingy and that TM beat Iron Man after its been debunked too?
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Taskmaster can't help but remember everything that's happened in his life including Nimrod's appearances in public as a hero, conversations he's had, footage and news of Sentinels, and experiences with future tech.
For Nimrod to know anything about Taskmaster, he'd have to look for it. Unfortunately, he doesn't automatically scan every computer at his disposal for information on his opponents. If he did, he'd have known who X-23 was. Instead, he'll scan only when necessary and only to the extent that is necessary. Without Taskmaster giving him a reason, he won't.
Once again, I'm saying Taskmaster can win as long as he doesn't attack Nimrod and force Nimrod to escalate his own attacks, instead opting to convince Nimrod to destroy himself. In a situation like this, teleportation, regeneration, shields, and the ability to neutralize the powers Taskmaster doesn't have don't come into play.
If you look at the original post, you'll see that it was an offhand comment made out of exasperation in response to what I saw as an unreasonable demand for proof about what would happen in an unprecedented fight (if it's unprecedented, then it's impossible to prove any of what would happen in the fight and we must rely solely on hypotheticals).
Other people chose to pursue it and it has become a sub-discussion (at least on my part). Since people think it's part of my main argument, though, I'll stop referencing it.
I never said Taskmaster beat Iron Man until you started claiming that accomplishing a mission without getting caught didn't count as a win. In fact, I'm the one who "debunked" TM beating Iron Man in the sense of nearly killing Tony Stark (the only kind of victory you seem willing to accept as genuine).
I also haven't stopped referencing beating Nimrod through paradox. I simply have more than one imagined way for Taskmaster to beat Nimrod and am constantly switching between them.
The entire fight is him standing there.
Nimrod had the ability to kill a clone of Wolverine through the entire fight, and he only chose to unleash it when he suffered a serious blow and even then only against one opponent. He could've killed the New X-Men as soon as he saw them, but he didn't even though his most immediate goal at that point was simply to kill them all.
Much has been made of how strong Nimrod is, but he won't fight at full strength unless you yourself are at that power level. I imagine it's because of a protocol designed both to keep his greater abilities secret until they're needed so he can still surprise people and to limit property damage.
As long as Taskmaster doesn't escalate the conflict, Nimrod will stay within Taskmaster's abilities until he can figure something out.
If you were an uber-powerful robot that teleports and heals fast, would you even bother scratching your own ass. The Xmen cartoon showed us that he doesnt even walk, instead floats around.
An entire Xteam mate. Taskmaster wouldve become a skeleton at Dust´s sand attack. And Nimrod doesnt mind getting hit remember? He recuperates from even being cut into small pieces.
Assumptions again? Has he even seen Nimrod at all? No. Has he ever been quoted taking about Nimrod? No. What issue was he in contact with Sentinels? How about Future Sentinels from 100+ years in an alternate future?
Tell me, can Taskmaster look at the Wright Flyer and use that knowledge to fight an F16?
If he looks at the first Ford, he suddenly knows enough to take down the most modern McLaren F1? Nuff said. :roll:
X23 is a top-secret project that even Forge, with years of experience, couldnt find anything on. Taskmaster has been on headlines for too many times, and has quite a reputation. I´d bet that Nimrod wouldnt have to go further than a google search. Another wishful comparision.
Which is like saying Gentleman Ghost can win by engaging Dr Doom in a conversation over tea. Taskmaster knows squat about time streams, and is no Cable.
And I already foresaw hoe the "conversation would happen-
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All Taskmaster needs is to have seen a Sentinel before (everyone in the Marvel universe has, at least on tv) and to have knowledge of where weapons technology is right now (he's a weapons expert, given the fact that he's able to use a cutting edge AIM prototype with expert ability and regularly steals weapons technology for his charges). He's LIKELY to have seen Nimrod on the news incinerating criminals because a new hero in NYC is a big news story, especially when he's a killer.
It's not required, though.
The Ford is actually a perfect example. If you were from the past and drove a Ford and saw a McLaren F1, you'd know the McLaren was from the future. Same goes for living in the modern age, seeing Sentinels, and then being able to tell Nimrod is from the future.
Knowing how to take Nimrod down only requires you know he's a Sentinel from the future, and nothing else.
X-23 met Captain America after killing around 100 people. He met her again later. She'd be in the Avengers computer, if not the computers at the X-Men Academy along with all the other people in the New X-Men. And Nimrod doesn't automatically look up information on anyone who isn't a mutant anyway.
Taskmaster knows the basics about time travel (everyone does, because it's a much discussed topic), and that's enough. He doesn't need to be Cable. I'm not Cable, and I came up with how to defeat Nimrod.
Dr. Doom isn't Nimrod and doesn't follow the same rules.
Also, nobody laughed at your joke script the first time you posted it. Not even the people you think are agreeing with you. I don't think it'll get a better reaction the second time around.
:?
Because nobody in the Marvel MU is stupid enough to follow you plan?
Its a joke? Its the script to what would happen. Period. Especillay the dumb plan to use sci-fi movies to outhink a super computer from the future.
Dude, cant you imagine a better arguement? Jesus, had you said that Taskmaster used his connection with Deadpool to get info on Nimrod from Cable, instead of "maybe he knows this and maybe e knows that" I´d give him the upper hand.
If you had said he´d have surrendered, then when Nimrod´s taking him in he´s use his weapon generator to use sipedy´s web to get to hurt Nimrod, I´d have agreed.
The guy has a weapons replicator. The guy has Spidey´s webs, Thor´s hammer, Cap´s shield, voice replication, Bullseye´s aim, a mercenary organization, and what do you come up with?
Oousmart a computer from the future using sci-fi flicks? Taskmaster looses just to the retarded arguement, with all due apologies.
Oh and people I think are agreeing with?
Unlike you I dont need to post THANKS!! whenever somebody tosses Taskmaster a bone. Look at the votes, everyone knows Nimrod is pink robot, that can tell you that his popularity s near-zero, nobody here likes Nimrod, yet Tasky looses, and I can bet the "sci-fi film future" argument helped Nimrod win some votes, and some of us who initially thought he was cool to actually reconsider him as a 3rd-stringer.
Deadpool´s awesome though.
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even though nimrod isn't purple and fifty feet tall like all sentinels in this time, huh?
that is an impressive piece of deductive reasoning
how the fuck do you reason that
when the military has a battle and someone rolls out a new version of a tank, do you think the commanders go 'oh shit, they've got a portal to the future! everyone surrender!'
no, because assuming something you've never seen before must be from the future is retarded
Right after the highlighted LIKELY, I say that the part that isn't certain isn't required. I only brought it up to add another layer.
And why don't you explain how my argument is wrong, not how it's "retarded"? Or is that the best response you can give?
Go on, explain how proving to Nimrod that he's been killing innocent humans from his time by killing their ancestors before they can reproduce won't cause Nimrod to see himself as a threat to humanity and destroy himself.
And explain how Nimrod killing Taskmaster, who probably impregnated somebody at some point in the timeline that existed before Nimrod traveled backwards, won't work in the same way and kill all of the descendants of Taskmaster who existed in Nimrod's future.
And explain how Taskmaster can't prove to Nimrod that rampaging through Los Alamos and displaying autonomy won't dissuade the American government from pursuing the Sentinel program, effectively hurting the fight against mutants irreparably.
And explain why Taskmaster can't convince Nimrod that, through his ability to perfectly replicate the actions and mannerisms of all of history's most beloved, trusted, and powerful leaders, he is worth preserving so he can be put to work as an anti-mutant activist who ultimately reaches the government and brings about even stronger anti-mutant legislation, doing more damage than Nimrod ever could.
And explain why Nimrod, who was presumably designed by Sentinels, can be immune to logical paradoxes even though his creators would have been unable to think of logical paradoxes themselves (a requirement when programming a creation to be immune to them).
And explain why anyone who know the basic ideas of time travel wouldn't know that changing the past is likely to damage the time stream, and that you can probably convince someone to stop changing the past by warning them of that danger.
And don't explain these things by responding with a list of Nimrod's powers, the word retarded, or a reference to the time Taskmaster was beaten by Ant-Man and a butler.
And explain how Nimrod killing Taskmaster, who probably impregnated somebody at some point in the timeline that existed before Nimrod traveled backwards, won't work in the same way and kill all of the descendants of Taskmaster who existed in Nimrod's future.
1) Because Taskmaster knows squat about Nimrod. Nor about his future.. And Nimrod doesnt care about today, only about his alternate future.
See 1)
See 1)
Ah, this one is different. Show me where in the Marvel U the Nimrod-class sentinels are requirement when programming a creation to be immune to them. Stop making shit up.
See 1)
Taskmaster has good memory. Thats it. He´s not Sherlock Holms or Longshot.
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i don't even know you're trying to say there unfortunately, that's not how time travel works in the marvel universe
how do i know this?
this is how-
bishop came back in time specifically to prevent his future from happening and he did, yet he still exists!
thus, nimrod likewise exists in a divergent timeline and his actions do not affect the likelihood of his being created in the future
anyway, i have to go for a bit
The first sentinels weren't fifty feet tall either, so that height isn't a given with them.
Even though Nimrod doesn't share the physical shape of Sentinels, his speech is near identical and his weapons systems are clearly descended from them. Beyond that, there's the fact that he's obsessed with mutants which is generally considered a straight give away.
And like I said, Taskmaster knows a lot about weapons and would likely see the similarities between Nimrod's concussive blasts and a Sentinel's. Remember, he extremely attuned to his memories. The moment a single aspect of Nimrod rings familiar (and when Nimrod scans for mutants, which is the first thing he announces himself as doing when he enters an unfamiliar location, Taskmaster will be reminded of Sentinels) his mind will go directly to every memory Sentinels he has.
I reason that because, while modern F1s are clearly cars, they're so advanced compared to the original Model Ts that anyone from that era would know that the car was from the future (at least if, like Taskmaster, they lived in a world where Time Travel is a both a possibility and a common occurrence).
And Taskmaster knows a lot about weapons technology, so it's more like someone who knows a lot about the Model T looking at an F1 perform and knowing that nothing it does is possible within his era.
Wasn't it said that Cable beat Nimrod by warning him of the dangers inherent in damaging the time stream? That may not be how time travel works in the Marvel Universe, but most people within the Marvel Universe (including Nimrod, apparently) don't realize that changing the past creates an alternate future instead of destroying the current one.
After all, if you can't change the present by changing the past, then there would have been no reason to send Nimrod into the past in the first place since none of his actions in the past have affected the present in the least. He'd have been better off staying in his present, fighting the mutants there.
But nobody in Nimrod's time seems to have been privy to that knowledge, so he went back in time anyway.
Nimrod wasn't programmed to "not care" about the modern age. Instead, he was programmed to protect human life and obliterate all mutants (and in this case, we can grant that Doom has given him the secondary objective of beating Taskmaster). The desire to save human lives and kill mutants, regardless of what era it is, is evidenced by the fact that those are the first thing he does and the first thing he intends to do (respectively) at the end of his most recent appearance. The fact that it's the past doesn't affect him in the least.
And like I said, I think Taskmaster knows enough.
I have no idea what you're saying here.
I mean, there's really no doubt that Nimrod could vaporize the living shit out of Tasky. OK, so theres nuclear bombs at los alamos, but do you REALLY think that Nimrod(who's powers clearly state that he can not only understand but ABSORB technology) would be stupid enough to just fucking stand there and take it?
I love Taskmaster and despise Nimrod but come the fuck on... there's NO WAY IN HELL tasky is taking down nimrod. He MAY find a way to escape with his life, but there's no way he's coming out of this fight with the big W.
...and I'm usually the type of person that will give the character I like more the benefit of the doubt in a tough match-up. Claiming tasky would win this one is just rediculous, though
By the rules of the fight someone has to lose and someone has to win. If Taskmaster's going to be spared, Nimrod has to kill himself so Taskmaster can move on. Otherwise, they hang out in Los Alamos forever and Taskmaster eventually dies from being a feeble human.
All the scenarios that don't have Taskmaster convincing Nimrod to spare his life (the majority of them) have Nimrod destroying himself or suffering a fatal error.
And by his design, Nimrod won't vaporize anybody unless they're shown to be enough of a threat to warrant vaporization (either by being an immediate threat to human life or by seriously damaging Nimrod in the first place, like X-23 did). If Taskmaster can't damage Nimrod, like everyone has been saying, then Nimrod will actually hold back against him.
Got cut that part.
Show me where in Marvel U your made up programming paradox into creations to be immune to them exists or even applies to Sentinels. Because now youre assuming that -
A) Theres even that paradox programming in sentinels
C) That Taskmaster has any access to classified info on the Sentinel program, if the mythical programming even exists
All 3 are far-fetched, without any basis on Marvel canon.
Show me one page in ANY Marvel comic where it says that a Sentinel has your logical paradoxes and how its a requirement when programming a creation to be immune to them.
Because all I see is you inventing acts about Nimrod out of some robot B-movies, and saldy that aint gonna same Tasky.
He needed a guide. And quickly changed his directive from "hunt mutants" to "hunt criminals", the key to understanding Nimrod is that he always adapts, to qhatever is covenient to him.
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Next time you reach that hard, make sure you stretch first.
I wouldn't want you to sprain something trying to pull an explanation out of your ass.
You misunderstood what I was saying (understandable since it was apparently worded in a confusing way). I'll try again.
Machines can't handle paradoxes unless they're programmed to be immune to them. This is evidenced by Victor Mancha shorting out over the burrito paradox.
People, however, have been saying that Nimrod wouldn't be allowed into the field with such a vulnerability. If Nimrod was designed by other Sentinels, though (it's my understanding that Sentinels rather than humans rule the Days of the Future Past), then how could he be programmed to be immune to paradoxes? The Sentinels would have to know what a paradox was to safeguard Nimrod against them, but if paradoxes destroy robots then how could a robot know about a paradox?
It's still pretty confusing and it's not all that convincing in the first place, but I thought I'd just throw it out there.
I'm using Nimrod's most recent appearance. All that's indicated is that Nimrod says "CRIME IN PROGRESS. HUMAN LIFE THREATENED. APPROPRIATE ACTION INITIATED."
There's no mention of a need for a guide or a subsequent desire to hunt criminals. And why would you hunt criminals in the present if you didn't care about the present? Why would you need a guide if you didn't care about the presesnt?
Why do anything in the present aside from trying to leave the present as soon as possible if you didn't care about the present?
So at what point would Nimrod object, then, considering that he has no instinct for self-preservation except for when it comes to shielding himself from physical attacks?
It's a stretch, but so was the logic behind Cable's defeat of Nimrod. Unfortunately, that's what you have to resort to when you're talking about a self-repairing robot who is functionally invulnerable and immortal.
No, people have been saying that youre making up that vulnerability so that Taskmaster will get a slimmer of hope. Cable just told a present-day Nimrod the truth, what woul happen in the future. Nimrod´s calcuations showed he was right. So he turned himself off. Youre saying that Tasskmaster can BS his way in with popular sci-fi and create imaginary paradoxes.
No it was not. The present-day Nimord WASNT supposed to exist. Cable just pointed that out, and gave a detaled info on the future where Nimrod does exist. Simple.
Dont be surprised that none believe when you mix that upo with B-movie robot paradoxes.
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Is that really any more plausible than...
or
or
Whatever. The point is that Nimrod's main concern is protecting humanity and killing mutants, not beating Taskmaster. If Taskmaster can convince Nimrod that his actions have run contrary to his primary goals or that killing Taskmaster would run contrary to his primary goals, Taskmaster wins.
I mean, a Nimrod who's time traveled to the past is still a Nimrod in the past, just like the one shown above. All he needs to be told is that a Nimrod being in the past is harmful to human life, and he'll consider the idea and eventually prove it to himself after brief calculations.
Cable didn't need any special knowledge of the future or time travel, contrary to what has been said. All he needed, like I've been saying, is common sense. Hell, how could he have known for sure that a Nimrod wouldn't be able to kill all the mutants without murdering millions of humans in the process? It was an educated guess!
White FC: 0819 3350 1787
THIS IS THE REAL NIMROD.
So we´re to ignore all of Taskmaster´s past and present, except for one Udon-drawn mini-seres, and then keep insisting that this Nimrod that got built out of present-day parts is the same as the Future Nimrod-class sentinel. But then a car can go faster than an F16 because the Wright flier was slow right?
2) Taskmaster isnt Cable, nor knows a quarter of Cable just said. Show me one page where he speaks something on the mutant cause...
60 years before the original?
Programming?
25 years of killing?
Full-mutant-scale warfere (THAT DID HAPPEN IN NIMROD`s FUTURE TIMELINE).
All these are facts. Cable knows it all, from past to future. You´d have to think us stupid to make us believe that Taskmaster knows that. As I said before, Cable DIDNT LIE. Cable to him THE TRUTH about his future. Not popcorn movie BS that FUTURE Nimrod would laugh at before blowing TAsky away.
3) That Nimrod´s programming was written by who?
So thats why the Xforce version doesnt kill humans. Apologies, but that doesnt apply to the real thing. Nice scans, I so think Shatterstar vs Taskmaster vs Deadpool would be a good match to watch. And if I could vote again I´d vote Taskmaster just for the loyalty his fans have, that Udon series mustve been great stuff.
But based on your arguement alone, he fails. Badly.
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