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Cat still peeing on capert
Rhino
TheRhinLOLRegistered User regular
TheRhinLOLRegistered User regular
UPDATE AND RESOLVE:
http://forums.penny-arcade.com/showthread.php?p=8146234#post8146234
thanks everyone.
http://forums.penny-arcade.com/showthread.php?p=8146234#post8146234
thanks everyone.
I had a thread a few months ago... but in short: we have 3 cats.
2 lived here before, both female, 1 year old - un spayed
1 new cat, male, 3-4 years old, neutered.
The male cat ussually stays down stairs, that is were the peeing is occurring.
We've seen him do it and have recordings. The two smaller female cats haven't peed outside the litter box in the last 9 months (that we know of... we see the male cat peeing every day or so, one of us catches him or the camera does)
For the male cat, we've tried cleaning the carpet with an emeyze cleaner, oxyclean, and about 4 other "pet carpet cleaners". In fact, I've bought a $200 wet carpet cleaner. None of these really help the smell. That the first question, how to get the carpet clean?
For the second question, how to make him stop?
When we've seen him, we've sprayed him with water bottle, rubbed his noes in it, yelled at him, locked him in the bathroom (with his litter box), kindly and gentle put him in his litter box, used noise makers, etc. These ussually chase him off or deter him from that spot. We've also put in new litter pans (all over the fucking house now) and keep them clean. These pans are super clean.
We've also tried putting his food/water near, by the spots. I'm not sure what else to do. My girlfriend says we have to get rid of him if he keeps doing it (it's technically her cat, the two female ones are mine).
We've also taken him to a vet (at $250). They say he's fine and his urinary tract is healthy. So don't think this is a physical problem, but as the vet said an emotional or mental problem.
thoughts? How to stop him?
Money wise this is starting to kill us. $250 for the vet, about $200 for the steam/wet vac - we spend a TON of litter (keeping the pans clean) and tons on carpet cleaners and other "magic potions" that claim to remove the smell. We can't do this for much longer. :x
Rhino on
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yep. different brands and different sizes/types
anyways, what mts has recommended is a good idea. in presence of two female cats, he is just trying to show them that he is the boss and this is his layer.
also, when did you move in with your girlfriend and how long has the male cat been with the females? one thing i know for sure, cats dont like change.
also, ask your vet about prozac for cats. i kid you not. my aunt's cat was depressed and peeing all over the place when they moved into a new home. guess what the vet prescribed? prozacat and these things dont happen immediately after change. my aunt's cat began peeing around 6 months after they moved. but prozac or whatever the heck vet prescribed helped and he is a happy cat now.
edit: what about food? did you change it recently or have you tried changing to a new brand? what about your cat's pH levels?
yea, he's neutered. He squats down and lets it all out and then tries to cover it up. (like they do when they are urinating).
When they are "marking", they ussually 'spray' it, right? He's not doing that.
??
no, he's full grown, he's not a kitten. He was litter trained before this.
He's also a "mutt" cat, we didn't breed him. He was a stray kitten she found 3-4 years ago in a barn.
He has no breeding records. He's not "ours" in that sense, if that is what you mean.
We don't want to get rid of him, but we can't be rearranging our lives to steam vacuum the carpet every day.... nor is spending all this money helping us [specially in this economy]. The down stairs were he stays is our library/study and were we do all our research. It's very difficult & unpleasant to do our reading down there when it smells [very strongly, I might add] of cat urine.
My girlfriend moved in with me 3-4 months ago. The cat moved in same time as her.
I don't think we'll do that. We'd soon get rid of him then pump him full of drugs. We'd like something "natural".
....people 20 years ago didn't have "kitten prozac" and were able to keep them litter trained without, right?
We've keep it the same for about 2 months at a time (we buy those 30-40 lb bags). He's been eating and drinking water fine.
how do you tell that? We've took him to the vet awhile ago and they said they gave him a "basic check up" and focuses on any thing that might cause urination (tact infection, etc) - they said everything came back "normal". pH levels of what? I'll check the sheet for it.
Also, disciplining him when he does it will be completely ineffective and possibly damaging. He doesn't understand that he's doing something he shouldn't be (like scratching the furniture or licking the butter) he just thinks he's taking a leak.
Oh, hey I'm making a game! Check it out: Dr. Weirdo!
Here's your problem. As I said, cats hate change. Do a little research online about how to make him feel better about the move.
Also, when you say "getting rid of him", you mean like post him up for adoption for someone with a yard, right? Don't just let him out on the street...
I feel sad for the poor kitty.
We've also taken him to a vet (at $250). They say he's fine and his urinary tract is healthy. So don't think this is a physical problem, but as the vet said an emotional or mental problem.
I searched the internets to the best of my googling, that is why I came here
in all likely hood, to a pound/shelter..
I won't feel right giving my friend (or stranger) a cat that pisses all over everything. It's like giving them a car that you know is going to break on them.
Why haven't you spayed the two females yet? If they're a year old, they're probably going into heat on a regular basis, which is extremely uncomfortable for them. Spaying reduces the risk of certain health problems later in life, like mammary cancer, reproductive tract infections, and uterine tumours. It might also help with the male cat's problems - he may be neutered, but if they're still prancing around in heat, his pissing everywhere might be a response to that.
That was our "dead line", if he was still doing it by then we were going to drop him off while we were there. I'll talk to my girlfriend and maybe give him another week or so, after they've been here spayed. Even if not in heat, maybe he can smell their sex hormones or something?
He was pissing "once in awhile" at her place. Not as much as this, she says once or twice a month if that. They had another male cat netured (not related) that "grew up" with him and a big huge mutt dog (half German Shepard, have mutt)
My idea was to 'separate' them some how... put a border between the basement and the upstairs (there is no door). They don't get a long anyways... so maybe if we just block them off from each other they'll be happier and less pissy? haha... oh. Sorry.
It's a door way, but don't want to install a "full door" and they could jump over those child protection screens. Any ideas on what would be strong enough to keep them out, but cheap and easy to put up?
EDIT:
> The cat is pissing on the carpet because he has been brought into a new, hostile environment with two unspayed females, and he's just trying to lay claim to a small patch of territory.
I just checked, my girlfriend says it'll be 6 months on Christmas... so, he has had plenty of time to adjust, yes?
Secondly, he is twice as big as one and 3 times as big as the runt. They both know that the basement is his (they are very cautious when they go down there and only go down there when an adult is with them (ie. I'm down there reading).). The video tapes don't show them going down without me or here down there first. If the big male cat runs at them, they run away quick. One tries to hiss sometimes, but in the end she retreats pretty quick. The runt is deathly afraid of the male cat (it's 3 times the size)... sometimes the male cat just looks at it and it scurries away in a panic.
The male cat comes up stairs into their area (to eat their food, chase the little one for "fun") more then they go down there.
Get your female cats fixed immediately and THEN see how he does. It's not fair to have two rampantly hormonal girl cats around and then get mad at your boy cat for possibly reacting to them.
Look at it from the cat's point of view: he had a home with another cat who liked him, his territory decided without any fuss, etc.. Now your girlfriend has brought him to a new place with people he doesn't know, cats who won't play with him, and this big stressful environment. When he gets too stressed out, he pees on things, and then people yell at him, make loud noises, and force his delicate nose into the pee.
You don't want to do Prozac because it's unnatural, huh? That's... really not a good reason. You know what's going to happen if you take him to a shelter? He's almost certainly going to get euthanized; how "natural" is that? People 20 years ago didn't use cat Prozac because it wasn't available, they usually just abandoned the cats or shot them, so don't get all faux-nostalgic. You owe it to your cat to get over this "waaah unnatural" business and try anything you can to help him.
As others have said:
* behave consistently -- if you catch him peeing, tell him off. If you don't *quietly clean it up*! There is a strong likelihood that he cannot associate the physical act of peeing with getting his face rubbed in old pee!
* pay attention to him! He's stressed, in a weird place that doesn't smell like him. Pat him, play with him. Make him feel safe and loved.
Also: have you thought about Feliway? I bought some, and whenever my older cat marked the wall, I'd spray it daily with feliway (after cleaning the heck out of it first). It's not an instant fix, but with consistency it will help! And after a couple of pee-free months, you can start spraying every other day and generally taper off the feliway.
With all due respect, it's my choice (actucally my girlfriend's since it's her cat), not yours. We don't want to sedate our cat or get him dependent on a foreign substances. Nor do we want to pay for his drugs.
What I'm saying, is my parents had cats (lots of cats) 10-20, even 30 years ago. They were able to fix them without the use of medication and drugs. Drugs are just masking the problem, not fixing it.
It's better then letting him go in the wild (it's winter here). The vet said he would take him, and put a notice up for 2 months. If no one took him, they would send him to the local shelter. He says, the keep them anywhere from 2 weeks to 2 months depending on how many cats are there. Eventually, yes - they would put him down. No one wants a semi-"wild" cat that ruins everything and refuses very basic training, like that of going into a litter box.
Anyways, technically this isn't my choice - it's my girlfriend cat and she wanted to get rid of him a few months ago... right now, I'm just trying to stall for a bit of time, hoping something works - but I'm not very optimistic at this point.
As I said, we've tried everything we can think of. If you have any constructive suggestions that don't involve pumping him full of drugs, we will try it. If it doesn't work, eventually we will have to get rid of him.
We can't continue throw TONS of money at this problem. Nor can we live with urine smell. We're not going to pay for or give him drugs. What do you suggest?
see my update post right above yours. We are going to try that.
Thanks. I will try that.
Yeah, it's your choice (or technically, your girlfriend's). It's still dumb reasoning. If your cat had an infection, would you withhold antibiotics because they're unnatural and you don't want to "get him dependent on a foreign substance"? And 10-30 years ago, people weren't always able to fix their cats' behavior without the use of medication and drugs. They frequently "fixed" the problem by abandoning or shooting their cats.
Anyway, generally cats are on antidepressants like humans are: for a short period of time to help them get adjusted, not forever and ever.
Feliway is a good suggestion. Prozac is a good suggestion. Getting your female cats fixed is a good suggestion. Sending him back to his old home where, apparently, he wasn't as stressed is a good suggestion.
You don't want to do anything else that costs money. Guess what? You take responsibility for an animal, sometimes it costs money to do the right thing. You have the right to get him euthanized, yeah, or abandon him at a shelter, or abandon him in the wild (seriously, this was an option for you???). I have the right to tell you that doing those things is wrong, and that you should just man up and spend the money to get him treated medically if necessary.
we are not trying prozac or any other drugs.
We are trying Feliway, icky-poo-be gone and something else from that site (she just ordered it)
We are going to get the female cats fixed.
We can't send him back to the home were he is "from".
We are going to try to find a way to physically separate the upstairs and down stairs (if possible, suggestions welcome). We can't afford to put in a full door, but still need something strong enough that they can't get though (a sheet won't work for example).
Technically it's my girlfriend's responsibility, not mine. I'm just trying to help her.
She (we) have a limit on the money we can spend. She has spent 3 pay checks on this already and has gotten behind on her bills. There is a physical [monetary] limit on how much she can do. She can either pay her bills and feed her self or try to fix this cat. She just spend about $100 on Feliway, icky-poo-begone and something else from that site. She only has $116 in her bank account. You see the problem? She has about $16 (give or take) till Dec 15th for her to eat, bus, bills and whatever obligations she has. She's not going to starve herself so her cat can piss were every he wants.
Now, there is a no-cage cat sanctuary called "Cat House on the Kings" that will basically permanently "board" your cat for $30 a month for the life of the cat (up to a maximum of $2000.) From what I've heard and seen, this place is sanitary and safe, not just some hoarder's house.
It's website: http://www.cathouseonthekings.com/index.php
A video of it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwM6f0liHpo
:^:
I know this offlimits for H&A forum but I cannot help and wonder how easy it can be for you to part with a living creature that has shown you (or your girlfriend) affection and been a good cat prior to moving.
I know you don't care and shouldn't either but someone who really loves and cares about their cat would seek and find a solution regardless of the circumstances. And getting rid of him is not a solution.
:v: (i don't care if I get jailed for not contributing to the topic with this post, even though I tried previously).
Look for a baby gate/child gate--my parents had one lying around the house from when I was a little kid that they used to separate the upstairs from the downstairs when my cat had urinary problems and wasn't allowed to climb stairs after his operation (would've tore out stitches). It's a gate that expands outwards (sort of like a load bar for a truck) to block off an area...they're about 2-3 feet tall. (Your mileage may vary, however, as the cat in question wasn't, and still isn't, a "jumper".)
"That sounds like one pissed off cat."
Separating the areas is a good start. I'd do what I could to pay more attention to him and also see about getting some (more) toys for him. Make it (overly)obvious to him that you're there to spend time with him. I imagine since the females are younger they're probably a little more fun to play with so the big guy gets not as much attention as he might want to be used to. It sounds like he very well could be expressing his frustrations from not being the top cat anymore.
You can also try switching his food. When I switched one of my cats to Innova it actually bothered his bladder. Spoke to the vet about it and he said it can occur with certain foods in certain cats.
Another possible option; Get a cat harness and take him for walks. With a longish lead you can take him around (probably want to do it when it's quiet outside) and he can take out any cat type aggressions on plants and things.
Lastly, I would seriously reconsider your stance on mood stabilizers. There are many different types, and many different options. It's not "drugging up the cat". There are things from generic versions of Paxil to things like hormone injections or blockers. Some male cats actually end up with too much testosterone which can make them more aggressive than average, especially when things change around them. Giving them a couple of injections can sometimes remedy the situation permanently.
Currently I actually am giving one of my cats a mood stabilizer because if his aggressive behavior, peeing/spraying, and willingness to throw shit off of any elevated surface., also because he's high strung and we were moving apartments. He's not peeing on things now and doesn't throw shit around. And he's handled moving apartments better than the other two cats I have. Will I keep him on the pills forever? No, of course not. But they damn sure helped out with a difficult situation.
People 20 years ago let their cats outside a lot more.
Edit: Hollow core doors can be around $20 at somewhere like Home Depot or Lowe's. Also, depending on your area you may be able to find a door (or half a door) at a scrapyard for even less. Barring that, if a baby gate ends up being too short, you can always get a cheap piece of 1/4" plywood and screw a couple of hinges onto it.
The two little ones would easily climb or jump anything that didn't enclose off the entire area.
We tried those blind things, but they would just run, jump and scale them without even slowing them down.
http://lh6.ggpht.com/_PTqB6r-sLas/SAoLhM2LiYI/AAAAAAAAAVI/h4rMCN5DhJs/331_3170_r1.jpg
That was bad because they could get into the male cats "room", but he couldn't get out.
We tried different food and litter and have had him checked out by the vet. He says he is perfectly health, nothing wrong with his urinary tract or bladder.
I talked to my vet about drugs, he highly recommended against it. He said he would only suggest it for battered or abused cats (which this cat isn't, he's just really shy). He says there is a lot of downsides and side effects to most medications and that most of these newer medications haven't been reasonable tested to the standards he would expect. He said he's "treated" at least 4 cats with kidney/liver failure/bleeding that was probably due to these new fancy medication. He said there insides were a mess Also it costs more then we can afford.
Thanks.. We tried locking him in the bathroom with food/water and literbox (that is were we ussually keep it), but that didn't make him too happy.
You could try playing with him more. I have two cats, one started peeing in various corners, the other started after that. They're both fixed, not stressed, blahblahblah. Anyway, I hadn't been playing with them as much as I used to, and after I started giving them more attention they stopped.
Let us know how it goes after the other two get fixed. I'm interested to see if that was part (or all) of the problem.
She started peeing everywhere. Anything cloth, she'd pee on it. Couch, futon, chairs, laundry, my bed...
We did what we could to keep everything picked up and made the bedroom off limits but she'd often sneak into the bedroom, either by slinking around our feet or pushing the door open(sometimes it wouldn't latch right) and would piss all over the bed and blankets. It got expensive and annoying cleaning up pee and I tried many many things just like you did.
She wanted outside so badly that I eventually just let her start going out...since then she hasn't peed on anything. I used to be one of those people who'd never let their cat outside blah blah blah yada yada. I was pretty adamant about it and thought anyone who'd just let their cat roam around must not care about it. I do still have one cat that stays indoors only(she's a bit slow and freaks out if we even take her on a walk), but my other cat that's now indoor-outdoor is SO much more well behaved. She was never extremely people oriented to begin with, probably because she was living outdoors as a stray(but with human interaction) for 6 months. I don't know if your cat is like that, but if you have an area where he can go outside it might make him happier.
I've also read in various places that keeping the food too close to the litter box can make them stop using them.
this cat hates the outdoors. He gets really scared and 'hunches' the ground... he'll start growling if there is loud noises. the other two female cats love it though. We have to tie them to a leash though and not let them run free because we live in the city.
We've tried igloo and open litter boxes. He seems to favor the open ones the most.
the food is kept away from his liter. In fact, we tried putting his food dish next to the spot he was peeing in, in hopes that would deter him... he just found another spot
I can has cheezburger, yes?
My girlfriend gives him a lot of attention. He sits on my lap and I pet him when I read down there (and lately I've been down there A LOT. I probably read at least 5-6 hours a day).
He's not to playful. the two smaller ones play all the time, but the male cat likes to sleep a lot. Once in awhile he gets in the mood to play, but it's rare. I think he might be older then 3-4 years.
He does chase the smallest one a lot, but he ussually ends up hurting her so we try to stop him from doing that too (she is a 3rd of his size). He tries chasing the other one, but she'll stand her ground and hiss till he backs down.
The 2 female cats were spayed. One is having problems, but for most part they are doing well.
We blocked off the upstairs and downstairs. The male cat is living down stairs.
We used some cat nip extract and other junk that is suppose to relax them.
We also used enzyme cleaner on the carpet, cleaned it AGAIN and used some pheromone junk in those spots (that claim to keep them from peeing again).
We did not give them drugs.
The male cat has finally stopped peeing. My theory is that he didn't like the 2 female cats using "his" litter box. By blocking the area off, they can't get to it now. (orignally we blocked it off, because they were pretty out of it after their surgery). My girlfriend has other theories on why he stopped.
Regardless, they have stopped and they all seem a lot happier (and we are too now that he isn't peeing on everything).
Eventually we are going to install a door to keep them separate. Both the male cat and the 2 female cats seems EXTREMELY happy since we blocked it off. The male cat prances around and purrs when I go down there to read (he never used to do that).... he used to sit on my lap when I read, but now he seems more lively and happy about his sisuation and a lot more friendly. The 2 female cats like it, because they don't have to "hide" all the time (the male cat used to chase them... they didn't like that much.)
think its middle cat syndrome from bringing in a foster, but hes going to the vet tomorrow since it has stepped up in frequency
for some reason we have a plastic coated mattress pad that is apparently made for bedwetters. my wife accidently bought it back when. so that went on it so that should keep the urine out of the mattress