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Safari 4: for realz.

wunderbarwunderbar What Have I Done?Registered User regular
Safari 4

No, we're not talking about Africa somewhere. This is Apple's web browser, based on Webkit. IT was in beta for a few months, and on June 6, 2009 came out of beta. Safari is basically Chrome+, even using some of the same icons. IT uses cover flow for history, and while pretty, is horribly inefficent. The beta had the tabs up on the title bar, like Chrome, but somehow managed to fuck it up so bad that they went back to the more traditional position for the final release.

You can download it for OS X and Windows now, but don't bother if you're on Windows.

Original OP Below
So Apple this morning released the beta of Safari 4 for Mac and Windows. Now, because it is the way I am, I immediately downloaded it to try.

Now, I'm running Windows, I think it's safe to say that Safari 3 was one of the worst windows browsers I've ever tried. The main reason for this is that, like iTunes, Safari loaded up in a custom UI meant to look as much like the OS X version as possible. In 4, they decided to go to a *mostly* native UI. Still doesnt' look exactly like a windows app, but it's really close. The result is that it take a lot less time to load, and is a lot more responsive.

Overall I really like it. It has a "Top Sites" screen like Speed dial in Opera or the new tab page in chrome. it has the tabs in the address bar like chrome. It has spotlight-like search for your history.

The UI actually reminds me a lot of Chrome, which I like.

First impressions are that it's pretty good, and fixes a lot of the annoyances of Safari I had, even in OS X. I'm not a fan of the tab bar, as instead of having a max width for the tabs, if you have 1 tab it goes across the entire tab bar.

I'm actually going to set this as my default browser for a bit and give it a fair shake.

XBL: thewunderbar PSN: thewunderbar NNID: thewunderbar Steam: wunderbar87 Twitter: wunderbar
wunderbar on
«134

Posts

  • mastmanmastman Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    All I want is mouse gestures. Why can't they give me some mouse gestures.

    mastman on
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  • mastmanmastman Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    It is really nice though. I wish it had an active plug-in development community like firefox. There are a few things I'll always have to open firefox for like firebug to debug javascript.

    I run it on a mac though, so I can't speak for the windows version.

    mastman on
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  • Big Red TieBig Red Tie beautiful clydesdale style feet too hot to trotRegistered User regular
    edited February 2009
    thank you wunderbar for alerting me to this

    Big Red Tie on
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  • ArcSynArcSyn Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Firefox has really spoiled me with plugins, which is generally why every time I try a new browser I end up switching back to it. Safari 4 Beta is causing me to actually try it (I avoided it like the plague before because of the UI) and also redownloading Opera at the same time.

    EDIT: Apple, STOP TRYING TO INSTALL YOUR STUPID JUNK.. Oi. You would think the backlash from the Safari "update" thing would have clued them in on this, but Safari Beta tries to install Bonjour by default. So annoying.

    ArcSyn on
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  • wunderbarwunderbar What Have I Done? Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    See, I used to use FireFox with a lot of extensions, but I found that the more you load it down with extentions, the worse it gets. It got to the point where I was running no extensions at all, simiply because that was the only way I could keep firefox stable. And if you're not running extensions, there's really no point to firefox.

    I have every browser installed on my machine, and always check out the updates. Had been using Chrome simply because it was fast, and webkit is fast. Safari is 90% as fast, looks to have some better features, and uses webkit. That may win. We'll see. Gonna try it for a week.

    wunderbar on
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  • Nimble CatNimble Cat Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    It won't run on my Mac. It crashes immediately. Lame.

    Nimble Cat on
  • ArcSynArcSyn Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    I never used too many extensions, and I never had too much trouble with stability, so it was perfect.

    So far, going by UI/pretty, Safari is pretty nice. Having the tabs using the glass in Win7 somewhat kills the text on them though, so we'll see how that goes throughout the week. I have made Safari default for now to really give it a fair shake.
    Nimble Cat wrote: »
    It won't run on my Mac. It crashes immediately. Lame.

    Obligatory "it just works" joke.


    EDIT: The close button being on the left side of the tab is going to drive me nuts until I change my habitual movement.
    EDIT2: Is Ctrl-Tab/Ctrl-Shift-Tab the new standard for navigating tabs? I'm so used to Ctrl-PgUp/PgDn from Firefox, but IE8 and Safari 4 use Tab, which I guess "makes sense" and is easier for one-handed navigation while using the mouse. I just need to retrain.

    ArcSyn on
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  • mastmanmastman Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    It is super fast though.

    mastman on
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  • VulpineVulpine Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    So far no bugs that I've noticed, and the Cover Flow-esque Top Sites is remarkably smooth on this MacBook. However, I hate - hate - hate - tabs in the title bar.

    Vulpine on
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  • ArcSynArcSyn Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    I appreciate them trying create some extra space, but I do prefer having a title bar. How does one move a tab without moving the entire window? Or does Safari not support moving tabs around?

    I have found my first incompatible site. 1&1's website builder doesn't recognize it and won't let me use it. Is there any spoofing in Safari?

    ArcSyn on
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  • VulpineVulpine Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    ArcSyn: It still supports moving tabs - there's a small icon in the top-right of every tab that you can grab and drag around (it looks like a resize control). As for spoofing, if you turn on the Develop menu (Safari Preferences > Advanced, tick it there), there's an option within there to change the user agent.

    Something definitely missing seems to be the progress bar - it no longer appears in the address bar, and seems to have vanished altogether.

    On the positive side, Safari 4 is scarily fast. No pinwheels at all on opening pages, whereas before it used to choke on more complex sites.

    Vulpine on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • ArcSynArcSyn Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    There we go. Spoofing FF3, ironically enough, worked. The IE spoof didn't bypass for some reason.

    ArcSyn on
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  • wunderbarwunderbar What Have I Done? Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    hmmm, seems to crash for me every time I try to load up a streaming video I'm trying to watch. Uses flash, I will have to investigate.

    wunderbar on
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  • DigDug2000DigDug2000 Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    ArcSyn wrote: »
    I never used too many extensions, and I never had too much trouble with stability, so it was perfect.

    So far, going by UI/pretty, Safari is pretty nice. Having the tabs using the glass in Win7 somewhat kills the text on them though, so we'll see how that goes throughout the week. I have made Safari default for now to really give it a fair shake.
    Nimble Cat wrote: »
    It won't run on my Mac. It crashes immediately. Lame.

    Obligatory "it just works" joke.


    EDIT: The close button being on the left side of the tab is going to drive me nuts until I change my habitual movement.
    EDIT2: Is Ctrl-Tab/Ctrl-Shift-Tab the new standard for navigating tabs? I'm so used to Ctrl-PgUp/PgDn from Firefox, but IE8 and Safari 4 use Tab, which I guess "makes sense" and is easier for one-handed navigation while using the mouse. I just need to retrain.
    Not being able to close tabs by middle clicking is driving me nuts. The other keyboard shortcuts are pretty standard I think though. At least the newer Firefox betas use them (and I think did before).

    I kinda like the tabs. And having it look like it at least sort of belongs on Windows is a plus. I'm going to try running it for a few days too.

    DigDug2000 on
  • wunderbarwunderbar What Have I Done? Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    yea close on the left side of the tab is driving me nuts, as is the fact that I have to click on the top right to re-order/drag out to new window. But that's just a "use it for a couple days and it'll be fine" type of thing.

    wunderbar on
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  • thegloamingthegloaming Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Am I the only person who thinks Coverflow is really, really dumb? I can't believe they keep putting it in their products.

    thegloaming on
  • wunderbarwunderbar What Have I Done? Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Am I the only person who thinks Coverflow is really, really dumb? I can't believe they keep putting it in their products.

    Yea other than the "ooo shiny" effect, I could do without.

    wunderbar on
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  • Nimble CatNimble Cat Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Am I the only person who thinks Coverflow is really, really dumb? I can't believe they keep putting it in their products.

    I like it for iTunes, but I don't use it for anything else.

    Nimble Cat on
  • thegloamingthegloaming Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Nimble Cat wrote: »
    It won't run on my Mac. It crashes immediately. Lame.

    Same here. MBP running 10.5.6.

    thegloaming on
  • Nimble CatNimble Cat Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Nimble Cat wrote: »
    It won't run on my Mac. It crashes immediately. Lame.

    Same here. MBP running 10.5.6.

    I uninstalled Glims and now it runs perfectly. It was a plugin compatibility issue, at least for me.

    Nimble Cat on
  • thegloamingthegloaming Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Nimble Cat wrote: »
    Nimble Cat wrote: »
    It won't run on my Mac. It crashes immediately. Lame.

    Same here. MBP running 10.5.6.

    I uninstalled Glims and now it runs perfectly. It was a plugin compatibility issue, at least for me.

    that works. thanks.

    thegloaming on
  • dodosdodos Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    I'm using AdBlock if that helps the ad-aware.

    I'm loving this - was just thinking of migrating from Firefox for it's clunkyness.

    dodos on
  • Nimble CatNimble Cat Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Now Gmail doesn't seem to want to load.

    Nimble Cat on
  • xzzyxzzy Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    What's the delay on stuff getting into software update? Cause it ain't showing up for me.

    xzzy on
  • wunderbarwunderbar What Have I Done? Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    xzzy wrote: »
    What's the delay on stuff getting into software update? Cause it ain't showing up for me.

    It's a beta, so 4 wont' show up in software update. You have to download and install manually for now.

    wunderbar on
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  • iTunesIsEviliTunesIsEvil Cornfield? Cornfield.Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    xzzy wrote: »
    What's the delay on stuff getting into software update? Cause it ain't showing up for me.
    I wouldnt think this would show in a Software Update. It's still in Beta, so they probably dont want to ship it out unless you go to the website and manually do it.

    [ed] Curse you, Wunderbar!

    iTunesIsEvil on
  • contrabandcontraband Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    the only cool thing i've heard about safari 4 is that it'll properly render css animations.

    http://www.macrumors.com/2009/02/06/css-animation-coming-to-safari-already-in-iphone-less-dependence-on-flash/

    hooray standards

    contraband on
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  • maximumzeromaximumzero I...wait, what? New Orleans, LARegistered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Oh my god, did my web browser just have in intro video? lol

    maximumzero on
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  • iTunesIsEviliTunesIsEvil Cornfield? Cornfield.Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Yay, Netflix works if I change the User Agent. Sweet!

    Next issue (it's a biggie!): In Safari on OS X to get it to just open a new tab (i.e. never open a new Window), you have to run
    defaults write com.apple.Safari TargetedClicksCreateTabs -bool true
    
    from the Terminal. I assume this writes to a Safari *.plist settings file somewhere. Any idea how I might get the same behavior on Windows?

    iTunesIsEvil on
  • ZackSchillingZackSchilling Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    ArcSyn wrote: »
    Firefox has really spoiled me with plugins, which is generally why every time I try a new browser I end up switching back to it. Safari 4 Beta is causing me to actually try it (I avoided it like the plague before because of the UI) and also redownloading Opera at the same time.

    EDIT: Apple, STOP TRYING TO INSTALL YOUR STUPID JUNK.. Oi. You would think the backlash from the Safari "update" thing would have clued them in on this, but Safari Beta tries to install Bonjour by default. So annoying.

    Bonjour is actually a very cool thing to have. I don't know what would hook into it by default under Windows, but it's a great networking feature. You should have let it install. It's not something that junks up your computer, slows it down, or has some kind of tray icon.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeroconf

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeroconf#Apple_Bonjour

    ZackSchilling on
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  • wunderbarwunderbar What Have I Done? Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    yea bonjour is actually quite useful, especially if you interoperate with macs.

    So the beta is looking a bit buggy. first of all I'm not all that pleased with ram usage. Already up to 375MB on my machine and I've only had it running for a couple hours, and right now Google reader and Facebook are refusing to load. I'm guessing it's because they're both quite ajax-y. Going to see if restarting the browser works.

    EDIT: yea, it's working now after restarting the browser, closing the tab didn't work.

    wunderbar on
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  • Nimble CatNimble Cat Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    I'm disappointed it doesn't seem to be working with Gmail. I love it aside from that.

    Nimble Cat on
  • wunderbarwunderbar What Have I Done? Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Nimble Cat wrote: »
    I'm disappointed it doesn't seem to be working with Gmail. I love it aside from that.

    I'm having no trouble with gmail, although after having the browser open for a while ajax-y pages seem to not want to load. try restarting the browser and see if that works for you.

    wunderbar on
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  • ArcSynArcSyn Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Yay, Netflix works if I change the User Agent. Sweet!

    Next issue (it's a biggie!): In Safari on OS X to get it to just open a new tab (i.e. never open a new Window), you have to run
    defaults write com.apple.Safari TargetedClicksCreateTabs -bool true
    
    from the Terminal. I assume this writes to a Safari *.plist settings file somewhere. Any idea how I might get the same behavior on Windows?

    THIS. Please. I hate telling browsers to ONLY open new tabs and never windows, only to have a site open a new window anyway.. It's archaic.

    ArcSyn wrote: »
    Firefox has really spoiled me with plugins, which is generally why every time I try a new browser I end up switching back to it. Safari 4 Beta is causing me to actually try it (I avoided it like the plague before because of the UI) and also redownloading Opera at the same time.

    EDIT: Apple, STOP TRYING TO INSTALL YOUR STUPID JUNK.. Oi. You would think the backlash from the Safari "update" thing would have clued them in on this, but Safari Beta tries to install Bonjour by default. So annoying.

    Bonjour is actually a very cool thing to have. I don't know what would hook into it by default under Windows, but it's a great networking feature. You should have let it install. It's not something that junks up your computer, slows it down, or has some kind of tray icon.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeroconf

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeroconf#Apple_Bonjour

    Perhaps I'm just an archaic minimalist, but if I don't need it, I don't want it installed. If I don't want it for a specific purpose, then I don't want it installed. You said it yourself that we don't know what would exactly work on it by default, so why bother installing something that I don't know what I can use it for?

    GMail is working fine for me, and so far Safari has been meeting my needs in a web browser. I will probably never see or use the coverflow option.

    Does Safari do the process/tab thing? I'm only seeing 1 process with 10 tabs open, and I'm at ~235MB of usage.

    ArcSyn on
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  • SaarSaar Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    After installing the beta, Mail would crash when attempting to get new messages. Uninstalled beta, Mail works fine.

    Saar on
  • iTunesIsEviliTunesIsEvil Cornfield? Cornfield.Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    ArcSyn wrote: »
    Yay, Netflix works if I change the User Agent. Sweet!

    Next issue (it's a biggie!): In Safari on OS X to get it to just open a new tab (i.e. never open a new Window), you have to run
    defaults write com.apple.Safari TargetedClicksCreateTabs -bool true
    
    from the Terminal. I assume this writes to a Safari *.plist settings file somewhere. Any idea how I might get the same behavior on Windows?

    THIS. Please. I hate telling browsers to ONLY open new tabs and never windows, only to have a site open a new window anyway.. It's archaic.
    I found the com.apple.Safari.plist file on Windows, and added the setting but the browser won't honor it. :x

    iTunesIsEvil on
  • xzzyxzzy Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    wunderbar wrote: »
    xzzy wrote: »
    What's the delay on stuff getting into software update? Cause it ain't showing up for me.

    It's a beta, so 4 wont' show up in software update. You have to download and install manually for now.

    Doh, I was under the impression it was a normal release.

    xzzy on
  • areaarea Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Saar wrote: »
    After installing the beta, Mail would crash when attempting to get new messages. Uninstalled beta, Mail works fine.

    The problem here is probably GrowlMail. For the moment, you have to choose between it and Safari 4.

    area on
  • SaarSaar Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    area wrote: »
    Saar wrote: »
    After installing the beta, Mail would crash when attempting to get new messages. Uninstalled beta, Mail works fine.

    The problem here is probably GrowlMail. For the moment, you have to choose between it and Safari 4.

    I'll take my growlmail.

    I also noticed that 1Password wasn't installing on the beta browser.

    I guess I'll stick with FF3 for now and check out Safari 4 when it's officially launched.

    Saar on
  • ThreepioThreepio New Westminster, BCRegistered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Integrated database browser?

    Alright.

    Threepio on
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