DarkPrimus actually claimed to be a patriot (can protect someone, but dies in their place). It's possible he modified his role out of misplaced suspicion.
Even then, why not contact the other specials? And assuming he really is the guardian, and simply modified his role, why did he protect you that night you were targeted by Smasher, rather than himself? It's possible, and I suppose would answer a few questions, but it still seems a little confusing to me.
Tonight is probably the one night where participation matters most, so that everyone can discuss such matters and we can come to a conclusion about the best course of action.
Having a rogue guardian seems like it would be counter-productive. Once the vigilante was in contact with the real guardian he'd know that anyone he attacked that was protected is a rogue immediately, or at least a likely rogue. Why would you want to draw that suspicion on yourself?
Alternatively in a game where we seem to have 6 rogues in a group of 17, giving the rogues a way to block one of our 2 weapons is tilting things way too far in their favor.
DarkPrimus actually claimed to be a patriot (can protect someone, but dies in their place). It's possible he modified his role out of misplaced suspicion.
Even then, why not contact the other specials? And assuming he really is the guardian, and simply modified his role, why did he protect you that night you were targeted by Smasher, rather than himself? It's possible, and I suppose would answer a few questions, but it still seems a little confusing to me.
I was told to "use it or lose it", essentially, and I chose him at random.
SmasherStarting to get dizzyRegistered Userregular
edited February 2007
DarkPrimus came forward to me as a full fledged guardian earlier today. I'm going to attack him tonight. If he's legit he won't die, leaving us with an odd number of people (good). If he's evil an even number of people will be left, but one of them will be a rogue, so it won't end the game.
I was told to "use it or lose it", essentially, and I chose him at random.
What do you mean by the first part, if you don't mind my asking? And you seriously chose RBB at random, on the same day that he was chosen by the vigilante? I'm assuming you are just a normal guardian, then? Wouldn't that mean you could protect yourself?
Sorry about all the questions, I'm just trying to better understand this. Also, assuming you are the guardian then, why didn't you get in contact with the, basically openly confirmed, other specials?
So as I understand it we have a 2nd guardian who didn't come forward after the vigilante came forward? And after the existence of a good guy network was fully revealed with a name to contact to get involved? Ugh.
This also means that by Smasher and Cantide's plan I'm the one you guys feel like killing. I don't know how I can defend myself more than I have to. I guess ask grimmy or to a lesser extent smasher if I ever pressed especially hard for anyone to die. In all cases I admitted I was going off gut feelings and that they should be cautious. I only wants what's best for everyone.
I was told to "use it or lose it", essentially, and I chose him at random.
What do you mean by the first part, if you don't mind my asking? And you seriously chose RBB at random, on the same day that he was chosen by the vigilante? I'm assuming you are just a normal guardian, then? Wouldn't that mean you could protect yourself?
Because of my absence from participating in much of the debate here, due to work and such, I have been 'encouraged' to participate more- by using my powers. Protecting myself isn't much in the way of participating, so that why I chose someone else.
I am protecting myself tonight, though, since, as Smasher said, he's going to attack me tonight. This is the best way to prove myself.
SmasherStarting to get dizzyRegistered Userregular
edited February 2007
Alright, I've been thinking about this more. I'm attacking DarkPrimus tonight, so if he's alive tomorrow that's one more person we can trust (a rogue guardian would be hideously overpowered in a game like this, so I'm ignoring that possibility). I don't buy both cantide and navoc being thrall. Assuming two thrall (again, overpowered if there are more), the chance of RBB seering both of them with only three visions is less than 5% at worst. So if both DP and RBB are innocent that means there's pretty damn good odds that either there's only one bad guy left, or psycholarry is one and one of cantide and navoc is the other. Tomorrow we stake larry and I'll vig one of cantide and navoc, and then if we're still going by that point the last rogue will be obvious.
Keep in mind that the worst case scenarios also assume the rogues still get a kill every night, which we don't know for sure.
Keep in mind that the worst case scenarios also assume the rogues still get a kill every night, which we don't know for sure.
Are the guardians informed when they block a kill? If so, we should be able to find this out just by asking Grimmy and DarkPrimus if they blocked anyone last night. Assuming that Primus is legit, that is.
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SmasherStarting to get dizzyRegistered Userregular
edited February 2007
Normally they're not, but Grimmy was informed last night that someone tried to attack me since we didn't get a narration.
However, note that Abysmal Lynx died last night, and he could potentially have been the last of his group.
Are the guardians informed when they block a kill? If so, we should be able to find this out just by asking Grimmy and DarkPrimus if they blocked anyone last night. Assuming that Primus is legit, that is.
Smasher said earlier he was attacked last night, and Grimmy blocked it.
Obviously there's no way for me to prove that I'm not a thrall, so here's what I propose. We go with the plan I suggested earlier.
If our target is guilty, target both myself and the remaining unseered person tomorrow. Whether I'm a thrall or not, that should take of the remaining monsters.
If our target is not guilty, then there's an excellent chance either me or you are bad guys, so we'll target the both of us. How's that sound?
Hmm. Since Smasher is targeting DarkPrimus he either won't be killing anyone or will be killing a rogue, which ensures that the rogues won't gain a majority next turn, so this could work, in theory.
If DarkPrimus is really the guardian, that only leaves room for one rogue. Which means either that there are only five rogues, that there is a thrall, or that someone isn't really the special we think they are.
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SmasherStarting to get dizzyRegistered Userregular
edited February 2007
If RBB is legit, Grimmy is legit since RBB seered him, and also he's been in a perfect position to kill me and instead saved my ass twice. I've told Grimmy all of my kills ahead of time, and they all went through except the one on RBB, which got blocked by the other guardian. We don't have any proof that DP is the other guardian, but that's why I'm attacking him tonight. The only claimed special without concrete proof backing him up (after tonight in DP's case) is RBB.
If RBB is legit, Grimmy is legit since RBB seered him, and also he's been in a perfect position to kill me and instead saved my ass twice. I've told Grimmy all of my kills ahead of time, and they all went through except the one on RBB, which got blocked by the other guardian. We don't have any proof that DP is the other guardian, but that's why I'm attacking him tonight. The only claimed special without concrete proof backing him up (after tonight in DP's case) is RBB.
I have some proof - namely, I was in a perfect position to kill Grimmy based on what you told me. I could have done so as soon as I found out about him, and then killed you, but I didn't. I don't really know how I could offer any more proof.
I'm in an awkward position of being the only guy that no one will vouch for. I'm not voting for myself because it doesn't really prove anything.
Since I know about smasher and grimmy, and primus will dealt with anyway, I have to go against RBB or his seerings. All three can't be rogues, and killing a seer seems like a bad first move. So I'm flipping a coin between cantide and navoc.
Heads: I !vote for Cantide
Hmm. Since Smasher is targeting DarkPrimus he either won't be killing anyone or will be killing a rogue, which ensures that the rogues won't gain a majority next turn, so this could work, in theory.
Well, Cantide is being a real sport about this -- I think it's a good sign when someone's willing to die for the village.
Abysmal lynx did the same thing though, and he was chock full of Evil
Very true. I should qualify my remarks by saying that I don't trust him (or really anyone in this game except Smasher) farther than I could spit a rat. :P
He's either being selfless or manipulative. The former is admirable, the latter futile. I guess we'll figure out which it was in a couple of hours.
I suppose I !vote for Cantide. I can't see any other way that increases our chances of finding the rogues, so this is as good a vote as any.
Though there are a few things that interest me. First, how the whole rogue kill/guardian blockage deal will be handled. Second, assuming there are six rogues, and that we don't kill one tonight, how we decide which two of the likely three suspects are the most suspicious. Tomorrow shall be an interesting day indeed.
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SmasherStarting to get dizzyRegistered Userregular
edited February 2007
I have a bad feeling about everyone going along with this, but I !retract for ArrBeeBee and I !vote for Cantide.
Well, it's past 10, so I'm unofficially dead until the narration confirms it. Before that happens I just want to wish my fellow councillors luck. Give 'em hell.
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SmasherStarting to get dizzyRegistered Userregular
edited February 2007
Visiblehowl isn't online, so it'll be a while before we get an update.
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Hi I'm Vee!Formerly VH; She/Her; Is an E X P E R I E N C ERegistered Userregular
edited February 2007
Sorry guys, I was almost positive I'd be back by 7:00. Then my work ID got confiscated by the moron at the parking lot, and 1 1/2 hours later, here I am late with narration.
Since I've had absolutely no time to write anything, I'll provide a summary, followed by a combination narration.
Summary:
Cantide: executed; innocent
The vigilante's assassin was deflected by bodyguards.
The rogue councillor's assassin was deflected by bodyguards.
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SmasherStarting to get dizzyRegistered Userregular
edited February 2007
YES! I told you Grimmy :P
Alright, so that confirms DP beyond any reasonable doubt. Since on reflection RBB seems to be the least likely to be the assassin, I !vote for navoc and I'll vig Larry tonight.
Unless I'm missing something, the rogues have lost no matter what happens. I know myself to be innocent, but it really doesn't matter if I die today, so I figure I might as well speed up the process and avoid attempting to defend myself. It's clear by now that PsychoLarry1 and RBB are the rogues (assuming there are indeed six rogues), which would have allowed RBB to conveniently "seer" the guardian. Once again, unless there is massive deception at play, we've effectively won at this point.
Also, nice job on protecting against the rogue kill, I wasn't certain how that was going to turn out. That single event changed today from being utter chaos to victory for the council.
A good point was just raised in the Castle Phalla thread: Tonight's scheduled forum downtime's likely to hit right about the time when the turn would be changing. Is there an official plan?
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thorgotthere is special providencein the fall of a sparrowRegistered Userregular
edited February 2007
Squashua, I don't think you understand how this "being dead" thing works.
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Hi I'm Vee!Formerly VH; She/Her; Is an E X P E R I E N C ERegistered Userregular
edited February 2007
Fucking christ, Squashua, do you not understand what "Don't post in the fucking thread" means? Stealth edit that shit NOW.
Ahhh, never mind. I assume that we'll get a post-game recap once the game's over.
A little meta-commentary here -- in the two current Phallas we've had two instances of very chatty people giving away massive amounts of information on the first day, with rather extraordinary impact. One of them ended up helping out the village (here) and the other ended up nearly crippling it (Castle). There's a moral in there somewhere.
Anyway, back to the regularly scheduled game.
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Hi I'm Vee!Formerly VH; She/Her; Is an E X P E R I E N C ERegistered Userregular
Ahhh, never mind. I assume that we'll get a post-game recap once the game's over.
A little meta-commentary here -- in the two current Phallas we've had two instances of very chatty people giving away massive amounts of information on the first day, with rather extraordinary impact. One of them ended up helping out the village (here) and the other ended up nearly crippling it (Castle). There's a moral in there somewhere.
Anyway, back to the regularly scheduled game.
Actually, both ended up hurting their faction. Rygar was a villager; the villagers got hurt in the Castle game. Squashua was a rogue; the rogues got hurt in this game.
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Even then, why not contact the other specials? And assuming he really is the guardian, and simply modified his role, why did he protect you that night you were targeted by Smasher, rather than himself? It's possible, and I suppose would answer a few questions, but it still seems a little confusing to me.
Tonight is probably the one night where participation matters most, so that everyone can discuss such matters and we can come to a conclusion about the best course of action.
Alternatively in a game where we seem to have 6 rogues in a group of 17, giving the rogues a way to block one of our 2 weapons is tilting things way too far in their favor.
I was told to "use it or lose it", essentially, and I chose him at random.
Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
What do you mean by the first part, if you don't mind my asking? And you seriously chose RBB at random, on the same day that he was chosen by the vigilante? I'm assuming you are just a normal guardian, then? Wouldn't that mean you could protect yourself?
Sorry about all the questions, I'm just trying to better understand this. Also, assuming you are the guardian then, why didn't you get in contact with the, basically openly confirmed, other specials?
This also means that by Smasher and Cantide's plan I'm the one you guys feel like killing. I don't know how I can defend myself more than I have to. I guess ask grimmy or to a lesser extent smasher if I ever pressed especially hard for anyone to die. In all cases I admitted I was going off gut feelings and that they should be cautious. I only wants what's best for everyone.
Because of my absence from participating in much of the debate here, due to work and such, I have been 'encouraged' to participate more- by using my powers. Protecting myself isn't much in the way of participating, so that why I chose someone else.
I am protecting myself tonight, though, since, as Smasher said, he's going to attack me tonight. This is the best way to prove myself.
Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
Keep in mind that the worst case scenarios also assume the rogues still get a kill every night, which we don't know for sure.
So.... who are we staking tonight? Did I miss that?
Are the guardians informed when they block a kill? If so, we should be able to find this out just by asking Grimmy and DarkPrimus if they blocked anyone last night. Assuming that Primus is legit, that is.
However, note that Abysmal Lynx died last night, and he could potentially have been the last of his group.
Smasher said earlier he was attacked last night, and Grimmy blocked it.
Hmm. Since Smasher is targeting DarkPrimus he either won't be killing anyone or will be killing a rogue, which ensures that the rogues won't gain a majority next turn, so this could work, in theory.
I !retract Cantide, for now.
So.
Who dies?
I would prefer that we kill someone who is not a special.
Since I know about smasher and grimmy, and primus will dealt with anyway, I have to go against RBB or his seerings. All three can't be rogues, and killing a seer seems like a bad first move. So I'm flipping a coin between cantide and navoc.
Heads: I !vote for Cantide
This is a good point.
Also a good point. With these in mind, and Smasher's plan to kill Larry by vigilante next turn, that only leaves me one real option.
I !vote for Cantide.
Next turn you guys can kill Navoc and Larry, and everything should be finished.
Edit: And Larry beats me to the punch!
I !vote for Cantide.
Good show.
Very true. I should qualify my remarks by saying that I don't trust him (or really anyone in this game except Smasher) farther than I could spit a rat. :P
He's either being selfless or manipulative. The former is admirable, the latter futile. I guess we'll figure out which it was in a couple of hours.
Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
Though there are a few things that interest me. First, how the whole rogue kill/guardian blockage deal will be handled. Second, assuming there are six rogues, and that we don't kill one tonight, how we decide which two of the likely three suspects are the most suspicious. Tomorrow shall be an interesting day indeed.
Since I've had absolutely no time to write anything, I'll provide a summary, followed by a combination narration.
Summary:
Cantide: executed; innocent
The vigilante's assassin was deflected by bodyguards.
The rogue councillor's assassin was deflected by bodyguards.
Alright, so that confirms DP beyond any reasonable doubt. Since on reflection RBB seems to be the least likely to be the assassin, I !vote for navoc and I'll vig Larry tonight.
Kidding. It was a good call.
I !vote for Navoc
Unless I'm missing something, the rogues have lost no matter what happens. I know myself to be innocent, but it really doesn't matter if I die today, so I figure I might as well speed up the process and avoid attempting to defend myself. It's clear by now that PsychoLarry1 and RBB are the rogues (assuming there are indeed six rogues), which would have allowed RBB to conveniently "seer" the guardian. Once again, unless there is massive deception at play, we've effectively won at this point.
Also, nice job on protecting against the rogue kill, I wasn't certain how that was going to turn out. That single event changed today from being utter chaos to victory for the council.
I !vote Navoc
As for the game, I'm debating even voting at all, seems like I'm dead either way and damned in your eyes no matter what I say.
Ahhh, never mind. I assume that we'll get a post-game recap once the game's over.
A little meta-commentary here -- in the two current Phallas we've had two instances of very chatty people giving away massive amounts of information on the first day, with rather extraordinary impact. One of them ended up helping out the village (here) and the other ended up nearly crippling it (Castle). There's a moral in there somewhere.
Anyway, back to the regularly scheduled game.
Actually, both ended up hurting their faction. Rygar was a villager; the villagers got hurt in the Castle game. Squashua was a rogue; the rogues got hurt in this game.
I think the moral is pretty clear.