As was foretold, we've added advertisements to the forums! If you have questions, or if you encounter any bugs, please visit this thread: https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/240191/forum-advertisement-faq-and-reports-thread/
Options
Study: Gays not at fault for the Catholic Church's priest sex abuse scandal
Melkster
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
Link.
It's been a very, very common notion among conservatives in the Church that gays were the reason for the priest pedophile abuse scandal. If they could just weed out all the gay priests, then the scandal would have never happened. Thus the announcement earlier this decade by the Bishops that they would for real this time ban all individuals from joining the priesthood who have had any homosexual inclinations for the last three years. Of course, that struck the rest of the western world as scapegoating. The study demonstrates what we already know, but hey. It's still interesting.
BALTIMORE -- For much of the past decade it has been an article of faith for many, bolstered by the testimony of thousands of victims, that the Catholic priesthood is a haven for child molesters and that the Catholic bishops have been particularly guilty of covering up for those abusers.
But preliminary results from a sweeping study of sexual abuse in the priesthood show that the Catholic Church has been much like the rest of society in terms of the incidence of abuse and the response by its institutional leaders.
The data, which was presented to the U.S. hierarchy on the second day of their annual meeting here, also appears to contradict the widely held view that homosexuals in the priesthood were largely responsible for the abuse.
"What we are suggesting is that the idea of sexual identity be separated from the problem of sexual abuse," said Margaret Smith, a researcher from the John Jay College of Criminal Justice in New York, which is conducting an independent study of sexual abuse in the priesthood from 1950 up to 2002. "At this point, we do not find a connection between homosexual identity and an increased likelihood of sexual abuse."
It's been a very, very common notion among conservatives in the Church that gays were the reason for the priest pedophile abuse scandal. If they could just weed out all the gay priests, then the scandal would have never happened. Thus the announcement earlier this decade by the Bishops that they would for real this time ban all individuals from joining the priesthood who have had any homosexual inclinations for the last three years. Of course, that struck the rest of the western world as scapegoating. The study demonstrates what we already know, but hey. It's still interesting.
Melkster on
0
Posts
When what he's saying is, "Of course we wouldn't exclude someone from the seminary because we though gays are more likely to molest, we'd exclude them simply for being gay!"
Maybe that's their way of striking back against their deriders and critics - making them redundant by always surpassing any expectations of sniveling self-righteousness and bigotry.
And apparently, from what my personal friends in the Catholic Church clergy have told me, it wasn't enforced then, and it certainly isn't enforced now.
But yeah, the Church's position will still be that being homosexual, though not a sin, is a grave disorder. Like alcoholism. Or schizophrenia. Or antisocial personality disorder. Or some other psychological/personality disorder. This study, in my opinion, undermines that notion a bit.
It does, but it's going to take quite a bit of time for any changes to make it's way up. American Catholics make up a very small percentage of the church and our influence tends to be somewhat limited.
But you used to be a spy!
3DS: 1521-4165-5907
PS3: KayleSolo
Live: Kayle Solo
WiiU: KayleSolo
Hey, what are you doing in here?
Aren't you supposed to be partying it up in a club?
On topic: I agree with Capt Howdy here. They might think they're treating the disease when really they're just using preconceived notions to miss the point entirely.
What are homosexual inclinations? Placing Judy Garland on the same footing as Jesus seems to be the only real tipoff.
Really, thats how it works? Thank you, Church of Catholics, for pointing out how fucked I am for not wanting to have straight sex with little girls. What the fuck is next, the Church of Scientology will weed out all non born rich people because they secretly want to be poor again?
3DS: 1521-4165-5907
PS3: KayleSolo
Live: Kayle Solo
WiiU: KayleSolo
And am I the only one who finds jokes like that offensive? I mean, I'm gay. I have quite a few gay friends. And most of us probably don't even know who Judy Garland is, other than someone mentioned for the sake of a gay joke. It's annoying and, frankly, a bit derogatory.
Obviously, being inclined towards homosexuality means being sexually attracted to someone of the same gender. I would assume seminary officials expect candidates to the priesthood to be honest when questioned about it, and then those officials would tell the candidates about the policy and deny them admission. Of course, in the real world, I've heard that seminary officials don't ask, and candidates to the priesthood don't tell, even though they are supposed to. To me, lying about it seems counter-intuitive to the whole vow that they take to be obedient to the Church, but that's just me.
That's a great point. One issue is that Catholicism is not just "what the Vatican says" but also includes a lot of Catholic folk cultures, and certain Catholic folk cultures have long made it a practice to send "unusual" men to either the priesthood or the monastery. The idea is that the Church will both nurture their gifts and curb (or cure) their sinful inclinations. This can take the form of young gay men who specifically seek to enter the priesthood as a way of not being gay anymore. Obviously, it doesn't work out that way. The Church winds up being like any large bureaucracy, struggling with institutional inertia and filled with people who are trying to piece together conflicting orders and policies in an effort to do the right thing.
Also on Steam and PSN: twobadcats
"What we are suggesting is that the idea of sexual identity be separated from the problem of sexual abuse," said Margaret Smith, a researcher from the John Jay College of Criminal Justice in New York, which is conducting an independent study of sexual abuse in the priesthood from 1950 up to 2002. "At this point, we do not find a connection between homosexual identity and an increased likelihood of sexual abuse."
3DS: 1521-4165-5907
PS3: KayleSolo
Live: Kayle Solo
WiiU: KayleSolo
Well, I'm not sure about that, for the following reasons:
First, just to be clear, the rule says the following: "In light of this teaching [that homosexuality is a grave disorder and that homosexual relations are sinful], this department, in agreement with the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments, holds it necessary clearly to affirm that the Church, while profoundly respecting the persons in question, may not admit to the seminary and Holy Orders those who practice homosexuality, show profoundly deep-rooted homosexual tendencies, or support the so-called gay culture." It goes on to say, "If, however, one is dealing with homosexual tendencies that may be simply the expression of a transitory problem, such as for example an adolescence not yet complete, such tendencies must be overcome at least three years before ordination to the diaconate."
The Catholic Church clearly bars candidates to the priesthood who have claimed a homosexual identity, even those who have committed to celibacy in accordance with the Church's teaching on sexuality generally. But it also bans anyone who has homosexual tendencies, which obviously means sexual attraction towards other men.
I find it highly unlikely that someone can so repress their sexuality that they are fully and wholly unaware of their sexual attraction. That seems rather preposterous. The oppression in the Catholic Church is brutal towards gays, that's for sure, but it's not a level of abuse so horrible that it would cause a person's homosexual desires to retreat to an unconscious level. Speaking as a victim of that oppression - and for other victims - it's not quite that bad.
I have heard of people who have been the victims of severe sexual or physical abuse never developing or losing their sexual desire (or becoming consciously unaware of them). But, as I said, the oppression the Church inflicts is not that bad.
It's obvious. Whenever something isn't perfect it's because he's testing our faith. Always.
Um, obviously you're not hanging around with old gay people like a few of my neighbors. The fact you don't know gay history is more offensive than me alluding to her place as an icon in gay culture that predates you. Do you even know what Stonewall was?
That's going to exclude a shitload of people. If you voted "Yes" to an Allow Gay Marriage bill, bam, you're excluded for "supporting gay culture." Have a rainbow on your car? Banned. Five-starred a Queen song on Rock Band? Banned.
Can trade TF2 items or whatever else you're interested in. PM me.
Must report for awesome...how do I do this?
Which alludes to my question; What exactly is gay in the eye of the Catholic Church that will tip them off? If it isn't stereotypical stuff, which no one in the closet trying to be a priest would exhibit out of fear and guilt, then how exactly do you root them out? Just hire angry Irish alcoholics to badger people in the confessional?
homosexuality and pedophilia are not the same thing
DUH
Figure there has to be one or two with all the recent uncovering of alike relationships between regular teachers and students.
And nuns and priests pairings.
And nun and nuns....
...I'll be in my bunk.
-- (Terry Pratchett, alt.fan.pratchett)
Eh, it's better than Galileo's turnaround.
~100 years before his books are removed from the forbidden index
~300 years for someone to say convicting him of heresy was a regrettable error