Another nitpicky thing about Catelyn which annoys me is that she looks much too old. Fairley is nearly 50. She looks older than my mother, and I'm 26. Her eldest son is what, 16? in a time when people got married younger and had kids at a younger age. I won't go into waaah books mode, but suffice it to say she was 34 at the beginning of the series, which makes a lot more sense given the age of her children. Even if you want to follow the +5 rule, that would still be ~40, not 50.
It's not really a huge deal, and Fairley is a fine actress, I just don't think she was the right choice for the role for multiple reasons.
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Another nitpicky thing about Catelyn which annoys me is that she looks much too old. Fairley is nearly 50. She looks older than my mother, and I'm 26. Her eldest son is what, 16? in a time when people got married younger and had kids at a younger age. I won't go into waaah books mode, but suffice it to say she was 34 at the beginning of the series, which makes a lot more sense given the age of her children. Even if you want to follow the +5 rule, that would still be ~40, not 50.
It's not really a huge deal, and Fairley is a fine actress, I just don't think she was the right choice for the role for multiple reasons.
I like to think that living in a goddamned frozen wasteland tends to age you prematurely.
Catelyn and Cersei would do anything for their children. To the point that it's a character flaw, rather than the positive trait that it should be. They have blind spots when it comes to their kids.
Catelyn and Cersei would do anything for their children. To the point that it's a character flaw, rather than the positive trait that it should be. They have blind spots when it comes to their kids.
To a point.
Catelyn still recognizes her duty enough that she'll listen to Robb when he says "Go placate Renly and the Tyrells so we all don't die" and she's not above telling her kids when they're being dicks. Meanwhile, the only time Cersei disciplines Joffrey is when he accuses her of banging his uncle. Killing every third baby in the capital, though, that's fine...
Oh, the flaw definitely manifests itself differently in those two.
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syndalisGetting ClassyOn the WallRegistered User, Loves Apple Productsregular
Catelyn doesn't look 50, dammit. She looks late 30s to me.
Yes, she does not look like god used photoshop on them like some of the other people on this show do, but she looks perfectly fine, and if she told me she was 38 or 40 I would believe it.
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Let's play Mario Kart or something...
I didn't really get the "snooty" assertion. For a noblewoman of that social stratification she seemed personable, charitable, and politically savvy. At least when she was just talking to people.
For the other three? yeah...
Cat is this character who is sharp as a tack when it comes to all sorts of things, but will suddenly reach out and grab the idiot ball at the absolute worst times. She'll show the acumen of a wizened veteran at politics for days then suddenly do the dumbest thing in the world, usually in the same vein of "emotional female hysteria" you expect from sexist books of the 1800s. Thus, she hates on Jon when he's the most trustworthy person she could have; she "starts a shootin' war" with the Lannisters when politics still had a few days to play, and while her son Robb is the growing success story who seems destined for greatness (until you realize he's "too cool to live") her daughter Sansa wavers back and forth between "Cooing Twilight Fan" and "Feminist Studies Major." Another example: her relationship with Littlefinger, where she should understand that he is in love with her and is her ally because he loves her and DOESN'T love her husband, but instead she just blithely ignores it because, I guess, she doesn't want to think about that.
This segues into Lord Baelish and how I find him interesting. He is a ruthless little bastard, no doubt, but I think people sell him short. He learned early in life that the world sucks and if you want anything but abuse and exploitation you have to fight and exploit to get it. He makes plenty of selfish, villainous decisions but he does have a softer side and he will be charitable if he can afford it, but as a self-made man he doesn't have the luxury of a particularly strong conscience. He did have a strong conscience once upon a time, it almost cost him his life. In many ways, despite being a lord he exemplifies the plight of the commoner; that good and evil don't matter much when you are mostly in a struggle to simply keep your head above the water.
And in terms of motivations, I think that's always how he sees himself. He'll do plenty villainous, but he seems like he doesn't want to see himself as villainous, just a man, "doing what is necessary." He tries to play nice with Ned, but when Stark's sense of Honor proves to dangerous he betrays the man. He did hate his romantic rival on some level, but he would only act against the man when it was clear that any other course would be worse.
Is Petyr Baelish still a dirty ruthless rat-bastard? Yes. But he's so much more than JUST a dirty ruthless rat-bastard.
Aww, I missed all the titty talk.
Just a quick one. Best looking female on the show: Margeary. Not a big fan of Dany.
Best looking male: Jon Snow. Even as a straight guy I gotta admit, he is dreamy 8->
Also, people without modern technology and living in Winterfell being more weathered looking seems pretty natural.
If I lived in Winterfell I'd look like Sean Bean too.
"How do you know that's Ned Stark?"
"He's the only one who doesn't have shit on him."
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MrMisterJesus dying on the cross in pain? Morally better than us. One has to go "all in".Registered Userregular
The titty talk leaves me feeling a little gross; I wonder how it feels to be a regular lookin' girl and come in here reading people calling Margaery a fish-face. Talk about unrealistic standards.
That being said: Robb Stark is dreamy (Jon Snow is okay); Vicerys was actually pretty cute while he lasted, although being a total bastard detracted; but overall MVP in the hot department is Renly. I don't know when I like him better--when he's wearing his little crown and his foppish armor, or when Loras is taking them off. Either way, yes please. I'd let him be king for a night.
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ShadowenSnores in the morningLoserdomRegistered Userregular
edited April 2012
Did no one else find it fascinating how Margaery is perhaps the best possible wife ever for a feudal lord?
Think about it. She's loyal to her family, rather fierce and open in her opinions, and yet at the same time if you're not into her because, say, you're not into women, is willing to bring her own damn brother (also not into women) into the mix if that's what it takes for you to get her pregnant with your heir. She's, like, Cersei-ruthless, but in a good way. She's not brutal or vicious or cold; she just knows what needs to be done. She's like the happy medium between Cersei, Catelyn, and Sansa.
And that's without her being very attractive, fuck all you fishface haters.
On the show Margaery is suddenly like in my top 5 of still-living characters.
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HonkHonk is this poster.Registered User, __BANNED USERSregular
Aww, I missed all the titty talk.
Just a quick one. Best looking female on the show: Margeary. Not a big fan of Dany. Best looking male: Jon Snow. Even as a straight guy I gotta admit, he is dreamy 8->
For what it's worth, my fiance (who knows motherhood) said, and I quote "What a bitch"
Well, that settles it, then. Catelyn Stark is worse than Eva Braun's crusty old tampon.
That's just gross. My point was, I think it can be quite understandable that someone would find Catelyn to be a super bitch. Doesn't mean she's evil, or even bad... just bitchy. Since we're discussing characters we dislike, I get that people would not like someone like that.
For me, I don't dislike her, I just don't like her. OremLK called it: She's severe. It's not an appealing trait.
If people found her severe, or stern, or a bunch of other things, it'd be cool. If someone just plain didn't like her, hey, whatevs.
But they didn't. Because she's a "SUPER bitch" who needs to "suffer horribly." (Apparently having your family torn asunder, husband murdered, etc. isn't horrible enough.)
And to feel that way you've got to be projecting, confusing book Cat with show Cat or some combo thereof because every attack against her has been a misrepresentation of what she's done or taken her actions completely out of context and all have lacked any sort of empathy for her. At all.
It's too bad she doesn't carry a sword and/or have some rude tittays hanging out. Since she doesn't, I guess that Super bitch should suffer horribly.
She looks at him with disdain and commands him to leave the room when she is sitting vigil for a son she thought would die. Like, do you have no understanding of motherhood? Of the bond a woman who loves her children feels for them? Of the bond that is created just by the act of having another human being exit your vagina whom you then raise and then is nearly snatched away from you?
's true, if you're a mom it's incredibly hard to tolerate someone who loves him wanting to say goodbye because...
Margaery Tyrell is a goddess and I will fight you if you disagree.
Yara has her redeeming qualities though she's not insanely hot.
Speaking of Yara (technically a book thing so I'll spoiler it:
Anyone know why she was renamed from Asha?
I'm really interested about Arya's storyline now though seeing as someone's taken Needle and the Bull-head helm - I assume they're going to fight tooth-and-nail to get those back and I wanna see Arya give that dude a couple of extra breathing holes
The titty talk leaves me feeling a little gross; I wonder how it feels to be a regular lookin' girl and come in here reading people calling Margaery a fish-face. Talk about unrealistic standards.
That being said: Robb Stark is dreamy (Jon Snow is okay); Vicerys was actually pretty cute while he lasted, although being a total bastard detracted; but overall MVP in the hot department is Renly. I don't know when I like him better--when he's wearing his little crown and his foppish armor, or when Loras is taking them off. Either way, yes please. I'd let him be king for a night.
Heh I dunno, whenever I watch TV with my sister and her friends they're 5x as brutal about other women's looks then any guys I know.
Not that it's still not stupid, just y'know. Being harsh on women's looks is not just a male->female thing.
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
The titty talk leaves me feeling a little gross; I wonder how it feels to be a regular lookin' girl and come in here reading people calling Margaery a fish-face. Talk about unrealistic standards.
That being said: Robb Stark is dreamy (Jon Snow is okay); Vicerys was actually pretty cute while he lasted, although being a total bastard detracted; but overall MVP in the hot department is Renly. I don't know when I like him better--when he's wearing his little crown and his foppish armor, or when Loras is taking them off. Either way, yes please. I'd let him be king for a night.
Heh I dunno, whenever I watch TV with my sister and her friends they're 5x as brutal about other women's looks then any guys I know.
Not that it's still not stupid, just y'know. Being harsh on women's looks is not just a male->female thing.
I can attest to that as well, the things my wife says about women's looks who I think are attractive... LOL
I'm utterly confused that there are people who don't think Margaery is hot. She's the best looking actress on a show with a number of gorgeous cast members, and is a badass to boot.
Speaking of badassery -- "Never did like crossbows. Take too long to load."
Margaery Tyrell is a goddess and I will fight you if you disagree.
Yara has her redeeming qualities though she's not insanely hot.
Speaking of Yara (technically a book thing so I'll spoiler it:
Anyone know why she was renamed from Asha?
Apparently there's a character named Osha who's more important or came first or something.
And I was honestly surprised nobody made a joke about that kid at the end. I mean, he could've been an adventurer...
Margaery Tyrell is a goddess and I will fight you if you disagree.
Yara has her redeeming qualities though she's not insanely hot.
Speaking of Yara (technically a book thing so I'll spoiler it:
Anyone know why she was renamed from Asha?
Apparently there's a character named Osha who's more important or came first or something.
And I was honestly surprised nobody made a joke about that kid at the end. I mean, he could've been an adventurer...
Yeah there are several characters with similar names, so they swapped 'em up for different things.
As someone who has read the books, I have but one word to say.
HODOR
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ShadowenSnores in the morningLoserdomRegistered Userregular
Hee. What with all the nicknames, I had a stupid little thought.
Future generations will remember him as King Joffrey I Baratheon, the Slapped.
I would support this only if "Slapped" was pronounced using two distinct syllables. "Slap" - "ed".
There might be issue with this in Britain where "slaphead" (meaning bald) is often pronounced as "slap-ed".
Also, haven't seen these in a while:
So shall it be!
All hail King Joffrey I Baratheon, the First of His Name, King of the Andals and the Rhoynar and the First Men, and Lord of the Seven Kingdoms! All hail King Joffrey the Slappéd!
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AstaerethIn the belly of the beastRegistered Userregular
Jon Snow is too broody and serious to be truly attractive. Definitely gotta go with Renly here, although special shout-out to Littlefinger, now that I think about it. He has the handsome Mayor-face of his Wire days, plus a goatee, plus a smirking cleverness that's much more appealing than the rest of dickish men on the show.
For the women... hell, I don't know. They're all interchangeable with their tops off. I like Yara, though--style, humor, confidence.
Margaery is my new favorite character in the show, from one of my least favorite in the books. Her whole scene with just Renly was brilliant, and it makes the previous scene at the melee even smarter on a second watch. There are a lot of knowing looks being dispensed.
Margaery Tyrell is a goddess and I will fight you if you disagree.
Yara has her redeeming qualities though she's not insanely hot.
Speaking of Yara (technically a book thing so I'll spoiler it:
Anyone know why she was renamed from Asha?
Apparently there's a character named Osha who's more important or came first or something.
And I was honestly surprised nobody made a joke about that kid at the end. I mean, he could've been an adventurer...
Osha is the wildling that's staying with Bran at Winterfell, FWIW.
And Mad King George: I haven't read the books and I find Catelyn haughty, severe and occasionally unreasonable. People react to characters differently. It doesn't mean they're "projecting" anything.
And Mad King George: I haven't read the books and I find Catelyn haughty, severe and occasionally unreasonable. People react to characters differently. It doesn't mean they're "projecting" anything.
Did you read the whole discourse? Or did you read this page?
Margary is crazy hot, second to only "dat ass" Dany. Cersei gets third place. And I like how Natalie dormer moves her mouth. Little imperfections like that make people feel more unique and real, especially in a medieval era where say if she had a crossbite or some dental issue that makes her talk like that, it would be impossible to fix. Unless they do have dentists in Westeros...
I agree with this 1-3 ranking. Actually, maybe melisandre in 3?
And Mad King George: I haven't read the books and I find Catelyn haughty, severe and occasionally unreasonable. People react to characters differently. It doesn't mean they're "projecting" anything.
Did you read the whole discourse? Or did you read this page?
I read the whole discourse.
Right from the beginning, where you baselessly assumed someone had to be conflating the book with the show, to this post, where you baselessly assumed I hadn't read the whole conversation.
Really, this whole Catelyn talk has been you casting baseless aspersions whenever someone disagrees with you.
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It's not really a huge deal, and Fairley is a fine actress, I just don't think she was the right choice for the role for multiple reasons.
I like to think that living in a goddamned frozen wasteland tends to age you prematurely.
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@TaramoorPlays
Taramoor on Youtube
To a point.
Catelyn still recognizes her duty enough that she'll listen to Robb when he says "Go placate Renly and the Tyrells so we all don't die" and she's not above telling her kids when they're being dicks. Meanwhile, the only time Cersei disciplines Joffrey is when he accuses her of banging his uncle. Killing every third baby in the capital, though, that's fine...
twitch.tv/Taramoor
@TaramoorPlays
Taramoor on Youtube
Yes, she does not look like god used photoshop on them like some of the other people on this show do, but she looks perfectly fine, and if she told me she was 38 or 40 I would believe it.
Let's play Mario Kart or something...
If I lived in Winterfell I'd look like Sean Bean too.
twitch.tv/Taramoor
@TaramoorPlays
Taramoor on Youtube
For the other three? yeah...
Cat is this character who is sharp as a tack when it comes to all sorts of things, but will suddenly reach out and grab the idiot ball at the absolute worst times. She'll show the acumen of a wizened veteran at politics for days then suddenly do the dumbest thing in the world, usually in the same vein of "emotional female hysteria" you expect from sexist books of the 1800s. Thus, she hates on Jon when he's the most trustworthy person she could have; she "starts a shootin' war" with the Lannisters when politics still had a few days to play, and while her son Robb is the growing success story who seems destined for greatness (until you realize he's "too cool to live") her daughter Sansa wavers back and forth between "Cooing Twilight Fan" and "Feminist Studies Major." Another example: her relationship with Littlefinger, where she should understand that he is in love with her and is her ally because he loves her and DOESN'T love her husband, but instead she just blithely ignores it because, I guess, she doesn't want to think about that.
This segues into Lord Baelish and how I find him interesting. He is a ruthless little bastard, no doubt, but I think people sell him short. He learned early in life that the world sucks and if you want anything but abuse and exploitation you have to fight and exploit to get it. He makes plenty of selfish, villainous decisions but he does have a softer side and he will be charitable if he can afford it, but as a self-made man he doesn't have the luxury of a particularly strong conscience. He did have a strong conscience once upon a time, it almost cost him his life. In many ways, despite being a lord he exemplifies the plight of the commoner; that good and evil don't matter much when you are mostly in a struggle to simply keep your head above the water.
And in terms of motivations, I think that's always how he sees himself. He'll do plenty villainous, but he seems like he doesn't want to see himself as villainous, just a man, "doing what is necessary." He tries to play nice with Ned, but when Stark's sense of Honor proves to dangerous he betrays the man. He did hate his romantic rival on some level, but he would only act against the man when it was clear that any other course would be worse.
Is Petyr Baelish still a dirty ruthless rat-bastard? Yes. But he's so much more than JUST a dirty ruthless rat-bastard.
Just a quick one. Best looking female on the show: Margeary. Not a big fan of Dany.
Best looking male: Jon Snow. Even as a straight guy I gotta admit, he is dreamy 8->
"How do you know that's Ned Stark?"
"He's the only one who doesn't have shit on him."
That being said: Robb Stark is dreamy (Jon Snow is okay); Vicerys was actually pretty cute while he lasted, although being a total bastard detracted; but overall MVP in the hot department is Renly. I don't know when I like him better--when he's wearing his little crown and his foppish armor, or when Loras is taking them off. Either way, yes please. I'd let him be king for a night.
And that's without her being very attractive, fuck all you fishface haters.
On the show Margaery is suddenly like in my top 5 of still-living characters.
This is accurate.
If people found her severe, or stern, or a bunch of other things, it'd be cool. If someone just plain didn't like her, hey, whatevs.
But they didn't. Because she's a "SUPER bitch" who needs to "suffer horribly." (Apparently having your family torn asunder, husband murdered, etc. isn't horrible enough.)
And to feel that way you've got to be projecting, confusing book Cat with show Cat or some combo thereof because every attack against her has been a misrepresentation of what she's done or taken her actions completely out of context and all have lacked any sort of empathy for her. At all.
It's too bad she doesn't carry a sword and/or have some rude tittays hanging out. Since she doesn't, I guess that Super bitch should suffer horribly.
's true, if you're a mom it's incredibly hard to tolerate someone who loves him wanting to say goodbye because...
wait.
Yara has her redeeming qualities though she's not insanely hot.
Speaking of Yara (technically a book thing so I'll spoiler it:
I'm really interested about Arya's storyline now though seeing as someone's taken Needle and the Bull-head helm - I assume they're going to fight tooth-and-nail to get those back and I wanna see Arya give that dude a couple of extra breathing holes
Heh I dunno, whenever I watch TV with my sister and her friends they're 5x as brutal about other women's looks then any guys I know.
Not that it's still not stupid, just y'know. Being harsh on women's looks is not just a male->female thing.
I can attest to that as well, the things my wife says about women's looks who I think are attractive... LOL
Speaking of badassery -- "Never did like crossbows. Take too long to load."
Apparently there's a character named Osha who's more important or came first or something.
And I was honestly surprised nobody made a joke about that kid at the end. I mean, he could've been an adventurer...
twitch.tv/Taramoor
@TaramoorPlays
Taramoor on Youtube
I would support this only if "Slapped" was pronounced using two distinct syllables. "Slap" - "ed"
Kind of like "learned" pronounced as "ler" - "ned."
Make it happen, Game of Thrones.
Totally forgot about that line. Possibly my favourite battle opener so far.
There might be issue with this in Britain where "slaphead" (meaning bald) is often pronounced as "slap-ed".
Also, haven't seen these in a while:
Yeah there are several characters with similar names, so they swapped 'em up for different things.
As someone who has read the books, I have but one word to say.
So shall it be!
All hail King Joffrey I Baratheon, the First of His Name, King of the Andals and the Rhoynar and the First Men, and Lord of the Seven Kingdoms! All hail King Joffrey the Slappéd!
For the women... hell, I don't know. They're all interchangeable with their tops off. I like Yara, though--style, humor, confidence.
Well, I'm talking about her actions IN THE SHOW. So yeah, pretty much.
Also, her weird lips are fuckin' hot.
Ed: I have no idea who does/does not discover his sexual preference in the books - this is purely from s02e03.
Osha is the wildling that's staying with Bran at Winterfell, FWIW.
And Mad King George: I haven't read the books and I find Catelyn haughty, severe and occasionally unreasonable. People react to characters differently. It doesn't mean they're "projecting" anything.
Did you read the whole discourse? Or did you read this page?
So true. Cracks me up, like anyone would throw "Fish face" Tyrell out of bed for eating crackers.
I agree with this 1-3 ranking. Actually, maybe melisandre in 3?
I read the whole discourse.
Right from the beginning, where you baselessly assumed someone had to be conflating the book with the show, to this post, where you baselessly assumed I hadn't read the whole conversation.
Really, this whole Catelyn talk has been you casting baseless aspersions whenever someone disagrees with you.