Anywho. I never understood all the hype for the iPhone.
Let's have a lesson!
Guys, remember the Apple II? Remember when Macintosh was totally bitchin'? Alright, now throw in several years of total stagnation. Then throw in the best MP3 player you can think of. That's what Apple has now. Their computers? Eh, they're alright. I like my laptop, but I digress. The design of it all is absolutely flawless. The iPod did so well BECAUSE of the interface, and BECAUSE of how friggen shiny and easy to use it is. Thus Apple has gained a reputation for all the cool shit they can make devices like that do.
Thus, cell phones. Quite a good percentage of the population kinda hate their phone. I'm sure 30 people are now gonna quote me and yell at me telling me they love their RAZR, but anyways. Apple created the first phone to work entirely off a touch screen, and it's by the same people that made the iPod, meaning its got a gorgeous interface, is fairly sturdy, and fits seamlessly with iTunes.
That's why there was hype for the iPhone, or anything else Apple makes. They're a giant computer corporation with millions of fans, if something remotely cool gets made by them, there's gonna be hype.
Though yes, lack of 3G support is still sorta mindblowing.
So, what are the odds on an unlocked, 3G iPhone for Europe and everywhere else?
Can't see a locked 2G iPhone selling brilliantly for £400+ here. Can't even see it selling at all beyond the first few days of idiots buying it. Might as well just buy a Nano and some cheap mobile for 1/3 the price, or any other top-range mobile on the market for less and with far more features. Apple would probably get away with selling it locked to one network, but that'd just be silly as it would seriously limit their customer base.
Anywho. I never understood all the hype for the iPhone.
Let's have a lesson!
Guys, remember the Apple II? Remember when Macintosh was totally bitchin'? Alright, now throw in several years of total stagnation. Then throw in the best MP3 player you can think of. That's what Apple has now. Their computers? Eh, they're alright. I like my laptop, but I digress. The design of it all is absolutely flawless. The iPod did so well BECAUSE of the interface, and BECAUSE of how friggen shiny and easy to use it is. Thus Apple has gained a reputation for all the cool shit they can make devices like that do.
Thus, cell phones. Quite a good percentage of the population kinda hate their phone. I'm sure 30 people are now gonna quote me and yell at me telling me they love their RAZR, but anyways. Apple created the first phone to work entirely off a touch screen, and it's by the same people that made the iPod, meaning its got a gorgeous interface, is fairly sturdy, and fits seamlessly with iTunes.
That's why there was hype for the iPhone, or anything else Apple makes. They're a giant computer corporation with millions of fans, if something remotely cool gets made by them, there's gonna be hype.
Though yes, lack of 3G support is still sorta mindblowing.
The interface is exactly why I'm interested in the iPhone. I have a Windows Mobile smartphone right now, and it's pretty good, but I was blown away by the demonstration of the interface, and especially web browsing. I think, given some time, the iPhone will be fantastic.
Why not just get a PDA phone if smartphones are so expensive? Seems about the same price and even more features.
I like the iPhone because it gives me access to the internet anywhere. And it's not some stupid proprietary internet, but rather the real internet. I can get on the PA forums and post from anywhere that has either WiFi access or access to AT&T's network.
Why not just get a PDA phone if smartphones are so expensive? Seems about the same price and even more features.
I like the iPhone because it gives me access to the internet anywhere. And it's not some stupid proprietary internet, but rather the real internet. I can get on the PA forums and post from anywhere that has either WiFi access or access to AT&T's network.
Is this really that uncommon? I can do this with my phone too.
So, what are the odds on an unlocked, 3G iPhone for Europe and everywhere else?
Can't see a locked 2G iPhone selling brilliantly for £400+ here. Can't even see it selling at all beyond the first few days of idiots buying it. Might as well just buy a Nano and some cheap mobile for 1/3 the price, or any other top-range mobile on the market for less and with far more features. Apple would probably get away with selling it locked to one network, but that'd just be silly as it would seriously limit their customer base.
Approximately 0%.
I fully expect the first iPhone to hit Europe to be 3G, because it would be dumb of Apple for it not to be, but there's no way it will be unlocked.
I'm waiting for them to try to release it in Hong Kong. It's actually illegal to sim-lock your phones there (which is why it's the only place my father and I buy our phones)... and I'm wondering how they plan to try to get around that.
Internet access has been common on even average cell phones for years - my last two phones had it, i just never bothered to use it - its just been a matter of shit interface, horrible data costs, and data speeds - so barely anyone used it unless they were super keen, or had a real need for it.
That seems to be finally changing, i have a well designed phone, with very reasonable data costs and now I use data all the time, far more than non data uses in fact.
Internet access has been common on even average cell phones for years - my last two phones had it, i just never bothered to use it - its just been a matter of shit interface, horrible data costs, and data speeds - so barely anyone used it unless they were super keen, or had a real need for it.
That seems to be finally changing, i have a well designed phone, with very reasonable data costs and now I use data all the time, far more than non data uses in fact.
I was talking about wifi access in addition to cell network internet though.
Ahh, well wifi is still sort of rare on phones from what i can see. I'm not convinced a phone can carry a good enough battery to justify having wifi yet myself, not unless you are cool with charging up daily
I'll be the 'coward' here and say what needs said, Sniperguy:
The iphone is not even close to a $600 phone. It's maybe a $300 phone. The T-Mobile Wing is a 500 dollar (sans contract) phone with every feature and more. You can get it on a one-year contract for 100 bucks, which is a fair better deal too. I guess you can't use the bloated, memory-whore that is itunes, but I guess that's a sacrifice I'm willing to make :roll:. And like it or not, Windows Mobile 5.0 is a pretty damn good interface. If you want a good business-type phone, you don't buy an iphone. Personal preferences and consumer choice aside, it is not worth its price.
In before "Things are always worth what people will pay"
Why not just get a PDA phone if smartphones are so expensive? Seems about the same price and even more features.
I like the iPhone because it gives me access to the internet anywhere. And it's not some stupid proprietary internet, but rather the real internet. I can get on the PA forums and post from anywhere that has either WiFi access or access to AT&T's network.
Is this really that uncommon? I can do this with my phone too.
The Wing is the biggest piece of shit I have ever used. It is too SLOW to do anything of value.
The Wing is a newer version of the same type of phone that I have. It looks like they put a slower processor in to help extend battery life though.
I had one, I ditched it after a few weeks of use. So did an entire company. It was a pain in the ass to make calls, yet alone anything else. I think Cingular and Verizon have the real HTC Wing, which is 400 mhz vs the T-mobile 200 mhz Wing.
So for the above poster thinking that it is a better deal than the iphone, have fun. If you really want to "stick it to apple" pick up a Blackberry Curve.
Why not just get a PDA phone if smartphones are so expensive? Seems about the same price and even more features.
I like the iPhone because it gives me access to the internet anywhere. And it's not some stupid proprietary internet, but rather the real internet. I can get on the PA forums and post from anywhere that has either WiFi access or access to AT&T's network.
Is this really that uncommon? I can do this with my phone too.
Why not just get a PDA phone if smartphones are so expensive? Seems about the same price and even more features.
I like the iPhone because it gives me access to the internet anywhere. And it's not some stupid proprietary internet, but rather the real internet. I can get on the PA forums and post from anywhere that has either WiFi access or access to AT&T's network.
Is this really that uncommon? I can do this with my phone too.
You can get on the PA forums via WiFi and post?
Yes. I'm posting this on wifi right now.
I am as well but I'm using my HTC Wizard (Cingular 8125). I love this little thing because of its Wi-Fi capabilities. I don't even use the phone on it all that much. The full QWERTY keyboard on it makes makes it wonderful to use. I guess my point is that the iPhone, while nice, isn't the greatest thing ever. I wouldn't mind owning one but I wouldn't pay the price they want for it.
I'm glad that they unlocked the phone. I like, and prefer GSM, but I don't like AT&T.
Any "good" browser should let you have access to "most" websites, assuming that you're not visiting one that requires anything special that browser can't handle. Complicated syntax aside, I am very impatient in the development of a more mobile internet. We are still years and years from anything that I would value what the market price is sure to be set at, which is expensive. Eh, but what can you do.
The way the iPhone uses the Internet made me very sad. For the price, I expected much much more.
The connectivity aspect of it is buggy. Phone calls and such are fine, but medium/moderate (more than 10 min) usage of the internet causes the connection to pause/disconnect for a while. This just locks up the browser for a second while the phone is figuring out what is going on.
Many times it just fucking closes the browser for no fucking reason and returns to the main menu in the middle of anything. I note: There is no restore feature that I have seen.
The widescreen-tilt is way sensitive and the "coolness" of this feature quickly turns to annoyance.
It feels sluggish and slow. I realize it isn't a networked via lan, but the interface and the browsing itself just feels sluggish.
No flash at launch.
One of the biggest shitters of them all is the inability to send text messages with pictures. What the fuck. I have a 20.00 shit phone that can do that. Come on Apple...
It feels sluggish and slow. I realize it isn't a networked via lan, but the interface and the browsing itself just feels sluggish.
I'm pretty sure that this is the same for most smart phones right now. Mine is the same way.
One of the biggest shitters of them all is the inability to send text messages with pictures. What the fuck. I have a 20.00 shit phone that can do that. Come on Apple...
But then they wouldn't be text messages, now would they? :-P
The way the iPhone uses the Internet made me very sad. For the price, I expected much much more.
Can you elaborate on this? All I've seen is the official release demonstration, and that looked really nice.
The lack of 3G. Even the cheapo flip phones at AT&T now have 3G. For something that relies on internet for almost everything, not having 3G is simply unforgivable.
do you even live in an area with 3g cause I know I don't so its not a huge problem that there's not a 3g chip in there sucking the battery life on it. Seriously att's 3g network is a joke at the moment. Maybe when it is more fleshes out this can be used against the iPhone.
The way the iPhone uses the Internet made me very sad. For the price, I expected much much more.
Can you elaborate on this? All I've seen is the official release demonstration, and that looked really nice.
The lack of 3G. Even the cheapo flip phones at AT&T now have 3G. For something that relies on internet for almost everything, not having 3G is simply unforgivable.
It's pretty easy for me to forgive, since there is no 3G coverage where I live.
I think the smartphone market in general has 5-10 years before it will really start shaping up. I origionally started with a kyocera 7135->Treo 650->VX6700 all were decent phones but each had their issues. In addition the data plans for some providers can be outrageous.
I'm finally using a sidekick 3 and I think I'll be happy for a long while. It's excellent a being a real phone and with apps limited to stuff approved by danger I've yet to see the thing crash or misbehave once. That's something I never could have boasted with my other smartphone.
The way the iPhone uses the Internet made me very sad. For the price, I expected much much more.
Can you elaborate on this? All I've seen is the official release demonstration, and that looked really nice.
The lack of 3G. Even the cheapo flip phones at AT&T now have 3G. For something that relies on internet for almost everything, not having 3G is simply unforgivable.
It's pretty easy for me to forgive, since there is no 3G coverage where I live.
AT&T's 3G implementation is HSDPA, which is not available in most markets and most handets sold by AT&T do not have it.
Edit: I did a quick scan of the phones AT&T lists on its site as currently offered. Less than half the smartphones listed have 3G, and some of the flip phones do but they're not exactly the ones they're giving away for free.
Just the fact that our 3G is different than the rest of the world's 3G implementation makes me angry. My Nokia E61 has 3G, but it will never work in the US since it was made for Europe.
Guys, the iPhone is 500 bucks. Yes, it can be worth it. No, it's not a ridiculous price. It's a fucking smartphone. Look up some other smartphones. I personally wouldn't buy it without 3g and a customizable interface, but smartphones are goddam expensive. Saying "oh man, 600 bucks for a phone? Fuck that!" is unreasonable.
The issue is those other smartphones can do all the iPhone can and more, for a much more reasonable price. The iPhone has a touchscreen and iTunes, but still. All that money and you can't do something as simple as use your own sounds as ring tones or have voice recognition for dialing, and you can't carry your shit on a memory card since the iPhone doesn't have a memory card slot (which is nice if you want to listen to music but you don't want to buy it on iTunes), and no phone as modem support (which isn't a huge deal since mobile broadband cards aren't as expensive now as they used to be but still), is pretty damn lame. Especially considering that my shitty SLVR can do all of that, and it's not a smart phone.
For $600 you could get a better smartphone, and have enough cash left over for your first couple of bills.
not to pick apart everything, but you do know that you don't actually have to buy music from the iTunes store online to use iTunes right? I have 1800 songs in iTunes, not one purchased from the store. every one is ripped from a CD.
And other smartphones have reasonable prices because they are subsidieze at time of purchase. Just taking a quick look here, a Blackberry 8830 bought un subsidized goes for $700 CAD, so probably $650 US.
so ya, it's not like it's actually that off on price, Apple just chose to not let AT&T subsidize it.
But when people complain about the price, I think they know that.
Most cell phones cost more than "free" but we all understand that when signing up for a two-year contract you can pretty much get one no cost.
The connectivity aspect of it is buggy. Phone calls and such are fine, but medium/moderate (more than 10 min) usage of the internet causes the connection to pause/disconnect for a while. This just locks up the browser for a second while the phone is figuring out what is going on.
Many times it just fucking closes the browser for no fucking reason and returns to the main menu in the middle of anything. I note: There is no restore feature that I have seen.
The widescreen-tilt is way sensitive and the "coolness" of this feature quickly turns to annoyance.
It feels sluggish and slow. I realize it isn't a networked via lan, but the interface and the browsing itself just feels sluggish.
No flash at launch.
Apart from Flash, I'm somewhat confused as to how you go from these problems to:
Any "good" browser should let you have access to "most" websites, assuming that you're not visiting one that requires anything special that browser can't handle. Complicated syntax aside, I am very impatient in the development of a more mobile internet.
given that it's running a mobile version of Safari, which every review I've seen unanimously agrees allows it to finally view the web as the web, not mobile-web-lite, including the "complicated" syntax you even apparently thought was okay to ditch...?
Just wondering...
Mathew Burrack on
"Let's take a look at the scores! The girls are at the square root of Pi, while the boys are still at a crudely drawn picture of a duck. Clearly, it's anybody's game!"
Guys, remember the Apple II? Remember when Macintosh was totally bitchin'? Alright, now throw in several years of total stagnation. Then throw in the best MP3 player you can think of. That's what Apple has now.
Soooo the Apple II had a 600 Mhz processor, 16 million color support, 128 MB of RAM, and a multitouch interface? Wow, I need to find one of those...unless that's what the "several years of total stagnation" would do to an Apple II....
But I do agree with you re. Apple's designs
Mathew Burrack on
"Let's take a look at the scores! The girls are at the square root of Pi, while the boys are still at a crudely drawn picture of a duck. Clearly, it's anybody's game!"
Yeah, I'll stick with my Helio Ocean piggybacking on Sprint's 3G network. I've held one of the iPhones in my own two hands, and after the first five minutes of playing around with it I would get annoyed. It's good that the phone is unlocked, but unless 3G opens up for it, the prospect of moving to some other cell provider isn't that great. They'll all be just as slow.
Guys, remember the Apple II? Remember when Macintosh was totally bitchin'? Alright, now throw in several years of total stagnation. Then throw in the best MP3 player you can think of. That's what Apple has now.
Soooo the Apple II had a 600 Mhz processor, 16 million color support, 128 MB of RAM, and a multitouch interface? Wow, I need to find one of those...unless that's what the "several years of total stagnation" would do to an Apple II....
But I do agree with you re. Apple's designs
I..what?
For quite a while Apple was sorta falling into a slump. Then the iPod came out, and Apple went WHOOSH. It's probably more detailed than that, but that's the basic gist I think.
Apparently the iPhone is going to be £300/£400 in the UK.
Yeah, nice try, I can get the N95 for free with a shorter contract, or pay towards the phone for a cheaper contract. I hope it's all a joke to be honest, it's hard to fathom how they can look at the UK market, where almost every phone is free with a contract, and think "yup, £300 sounds about right".
Apparently the iPhone is going to be £300/£400 in the UK.
Yeah, nice try, I can get the N95 for free with a shorter contract, or pay towards the phone for a cheaper contract. I hope it's all a joke to be honest, it's hard to fathom how they can look at the UK market, where almost every phone is free with a contract, and think "yup, £300 sounds about right".
For quite a while Apple was sorta falling into a slump. Then the iPod came out, and Apple went WHOOSH. It's probably more detailed than that, but that's the basic gist I think.
Apparently either I'm not sure what your point was, or you're not :~) You talked about the Apple II, as if the iPhone was the Apple II miniaturized, which is why I pointed out how it was actually far more powerful.
As for Apple's slump in general, if that's what you were referring to instead, I think that can be summed up in one word: Jobs.
Granted, the iPod helped boost them into the stratosphere (metaphorically and stock price-wise), but their turnaround came before that. The iPod was just a stellar example of it
If I misread your post as being overly critical of the iPhone, I apologize. The near-venomous levels of hatred towards the iPhone in this thread must've skewed me. Not that I have a problem with hatred towards the iPhone, so long as it is for the actual iPhone and not some mythical device people think the iPhone really is (or isn't).
Mathew Burrack on
"Let's take a look at the scores! The girls are at the square root of Pi, while the boys are still at a crudely drawn picture of a duck. Clearly, it's anybody's game!"
Posts
Let's have a lesson!
Guys, remember the Apple II? Remember when Macintosh was totally bitchin'? Alright, now throw in several years of total stagnation. Then throw in the best MP3 player you can think of. That's what Apple has now. Their computers? Eh, they're alright. I like my laptop, but I digress. The design of it all is absolutely flawless. The iPod did so well BECAUSE of the interface, and BECAUSE of how friggen shiny and easy to use it is. Thus Apple has gained a reputation for all the cool shit they can make devices like that do.
Thus, cell phones. Quite a good percentage of the population kinda hate their phone. I'm sure 30 people are now gonna quote me and yell at me telling me they love their RAZR, but anyways. Apple created the first phone to work entirely off a touch screen, and it's by the same people that made the iPod, meaning its got a gorgeous interface, is fairly sturdy, and fits seamlessly with iTunes.
That's why there was hype for the iPhone, or anything else Apple makes. They're a giant computer corporation with millions of fans, if something remotely cool gets made by them, there's gonna be hype.
Though yes, lack of 3G support is still sorta mindblowing.
Can't see a locked 2G iPhone selling brilliantly for £400+ here. Can't even see it selling at all beyond the first few days of idiots buying it. Might as well just buy a Nano and some cheap mobile for 1/3 the price, or any other top-range mobile on the market for less and with far more features. Apple would probably get away with selling it locked to one network, but that'd just be silly as it would seriously limit their customer base.
Because dude. It can browse the webz, and you can listen to musicz, and get this, call someone on the phone!
I like the iPhone because it gives me access to the internet anywhere. And it's not some stupid proprietary internet, but rather the real internet. I can get on the PA forums and post from anywhere that has either WiFi access or access to AT&T's network.
Is this really that uncommon? I can do this with my phone too.
Approximately 0%.
I fully expect the first iPhone to hit Europe to be 3G, because it would be dumb of Apple for it not to be, but there's no way it will be unlocked.
I'm waiting for them to try to release it in Hong Kong. It's actually illegal to sim-lock your phones there (which is why it's the only place my father and I buy our phones)... and I'm wondering how they plan to try to get around that.
or Brawl. 4854.6102.3895 Name: NU..
That seems to be finally changing, i have a well designed phone, with very reasonable data costs and now I use data all the time, far more than non data uses in fact.
The iphone is not even close to a $600 phone. It's maybe a $300 phone. The T-Mobile Wing is a 500 dollar (sans contract) phone with every feature and more. You can get it on a one-year contract for 100 bucks, which is a fair better deal too. I guess you can't use the bloated, memory-whore that is itunes, but I guess that's a sacrifice I'm willing to make :roll:. And like it or not, Windows Mobile 5.0 is a pretty damn good interface. If you want a good business-type phone, you don't buy an iphone. Personal preferences and consumer choice aside, it is not worth its price.
You can get on the PA forums via WiFi and post?
I had one, I ditched it after a few weeks of use. So did an entire company. It was a pain in the ass to make calls, yet alone anything else. I think Cingular and Verizon have the real HTC Wing, which is 400 mhz vs the T-mobile 200 mhz Wing.
So for the above poster thinking that it is a better deal than the iphone, have fun. If you really want to "stick it to apple" pick up a Blackberry Curve.
Yes. I'm posting this on wifi right now.
I am as well but I'm using my HTC Wizard (Cingular 8125). I love this little thing because of its Wi-Fi capabilities. I don't even use the phone on it all that much. The full QWERTY keyboard on it makes makes it wonderful to use. I guess my point is that the iPhone, while nice, isn't the greatest thing ever. I wouldn't mind owning one but I wouldn't pay the price they want for it.
I'm glad that they unlocked the phone. I like, and prefer GSM, but I don't like AT&T.
The way the iPhone uses the Internet made me very sad.
The connectivity aspect of it is buggy. Phone calls and such are fine, but medium/moderate (more than 10 min) usage of the internet causes the connection to pause/disconnect for a while. This just locks up the browser for a second while the phone is figuring out what is going on.
Many times it just fucking closes the browser for no fucking reason and returns to the main menu in the middle of anything. I note: There is no restore feature that I have seen.
The widescreen-tilt is way sensitive and the "coolness" of this feature quickly turns to annoyance.
It feels sluggish and slow. I realize it isn't a networked via lan, but the interface and the browsing itself just feels sluggish.
No flash at launch.
One of the biggest shitters of them all is the inability to send text messages with pictures. What the fuck. I have a 20.00 shit phone that can do that. Come on Apple...
But then they wouldn't be text messages, now would they? :-P
I remember when I was like eight, we called them "Macintrashes'
The lack of 3G. Even the cheapo flip phones at AT&T now have 3G. For something that relies on internet for almost everything, not having 3G is simply unforgivable.
I'm finally using a sidekick 3 and I think I'll be happy for a long while. It's excellent a being a real phone and with apps limited to stuff approved by danger I've yet to see the thing crash or misbehave once. That's something I never could have boasted with my other smartphone.
AT&T's 3G implementation is HSDPA, which is not available in most markets and most handets sold by AT&T do not have it.
Edit: I did a quick scan of the phones AT&T lists on its site as currently offered. Less than half the smartphones listed have 3G, and some of the flip phones do but they're not exactly the ones they're giving away for free.
Just the fact that our 3G is different than the rest of the world's 3G implementation makes me angry. My Nokia E61 has 3G, but it will never work in the US since it was made for Europe.
or Brawl. 4854.6102.3895 Name: NU..
But when people complain about the price, I think they know that.
Most cell phones cost more than "free" but we all understand that when signing up for a two-year contract you can pretty much get one no cost.
http://www.engadget.com/2007/08/06/us-prez-upholds-qualcomm-chip-ban-verizon-snickers/
Apart from Flash, I'm somewhat confused as to how you go from these problems to:
given that it's running a mobile version of Safari, which every review I've seen unanimously agrees allows it to finally view the web as the web, not mobile-web-lite, including the "complicated" syntax you even apparently thought was okay to ditch...?
Just wondering...
Soooo the Apple II had a 600 Mhz processor, 16 million color support, 128 MB of RAM, and a multitouch interface? Wow, I need to find one of those...unless that's what the "several years of total stagnation" would do to an Apple II....
But I do agree with you re. Apple's designs
Wii Code: 1040-1320-0724-3613 :!!:
I..what?
For quite a while Apple was sorta falling into a slump. Then the iPod came out, and Apple went WHOOSH. It's probably more detailed than that, but that's the basic gist I think.
Yeah, nice try, I can get the N95 for free with a shorter contract, or pay towards the phone for a cheaper contract. I hope it's all a joke to be honest, it's hard to fathom how they can look at the UK market, where almost every phone is free with a contract, and think "yup, £300 sounds about right".
this is false.
I hate you and your continent.
or Brawl. 4854.6102.3895 Name: NU..
Apparently either I'm not sure what your point was, or you're not :~) You talked about the Apple II, as if the iPhone was the Apple II miniaturized, which is why I pointed out how it was actually far more powerful.
As for Apple's slump in general, if that's what you were referring to instead, I think that can be summed up in one word: Jobs.
Granted, the iPod helped boost them into the stratosphere (metaphorically and stock price-wise), but their turnaround came before that. The iPod was just a stellar example of it
If I misread your post as being overly critical of the iPhone, I apologize. The near-venomous levels of hatred towards the iPhone in this thread must've skewed me. Not that I have a problem with hatred towards the iPhone, so long as it is for the actual iPhone and not some mythical device people think the iPhone really is (or isn't).