Illegally imprisoning metas is a questionable but absolutely understandable choice.
Imprisoning perfectly normal people is out. That is wrong, full stop. If Flash cares so much he should follow the jail van next time. Not declare himself judge and jury for the entirety of Central City.
Well,
cold clearly isn't normal. He doesn't give a damn about money, and his own safety is just a means to an end. He has fun being the bad guy and he wants to be the bad guy. He's also the guy with a plan. Not quite batman levels, but he has knack for the xanatos gambit. And we all know prisons don't hold xanatos.
Does anyone else think they've got a brainstorming board of puns for Captain Cold, alongside a list of Mr Freeze puns from Batman & Robin?
If anything appears on both lists, it's out.
I kinda hope Captain Cold eventually, like some takes of his comic version, starts to hate cold puns.
"Your an absolute zero Cold!."
"Man, I stopped doing that stupid shit years ago."
The day Captain Cold takes his job seriously is the day he stops working as a supervillain.
Illegally imprisoning metas is a questionable but absolutely understandable choice.
Imprisoning perfectly normal people is out. That is wrong, full stop. If Flash cares so much he should follow the jail van next time. Not declare himself judge and jury for the entirety of Central City.
Well,
cold clearly isn't normal. He doesn't give a damn about money, and his own safety is just a means to an end. He has fun being the bad guy and he wants to be the bad guy. He's also the guy with a plan. Not quite batman levels, but he has knack for the xanatos gambit. And we all know prisons don't hold xanatos.
at most, they're useful
"Oh no, you see, he's evil so it's okay."
Yeah no problems there!
It's not that it's no problem, it's just that this city can't even manage to deal with a "regular" crime boss.
Illegally imprisoning metas is a questionable but absolutely understandable choice.
Imprisoning perfectly normal people is out. That is wrong, full stop. If Flash cares so much he should follow the jail van next time. Not declare himself judge and jury for the entirety of Central City.
Well,
cold clearly isn't normal. He doesn't give a damn about money, and his own safety is just a means to an end. He has fun being the bad guy and he wants to be the bad guy. He's also the guy with a plan. Not quite batman levels, but he has knack for the xanatos gambit. And we all know prisons don't hold xanatos.
at most, they're useful
"Oh no, you see, he's evil so it's okay."
Yeah no problems there!
It's not that it's no problem, it's just that this city can't even manage to deal with a "regular" crime boss.
Most cities can't deal with regular crime bosses.
Secret vigilante prisons ain't the answer.
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minor incidentexpert in a dying fieldnjRegistered Userregular
Illegally imprisoning metas is a questionable but absolutely understandable choice.
Imprisoning perfectly normal people is out. That is wrong, full stop. If Flash cares so much he should follow the jail van next time. Not declare himself judge and jury for the entirety of Central City.
Well,
cold clearly isn't normal. He doesn't give a damn about money, and his own safety is just a means to an end. He has fun being the bad guy and he wants to be the bad guy. He's also the guy with a plan. Not quite batman levels, but he has knack for the xanatos gambit. And we all know prisons don't hold xanatos.
at most, they're useful
"Oh no, you see, he's evil so it's okay."
Yeah no problems there!
It's not that it's no problem, it's just that this city can't even manage to deal with a "regular" crime boss.
Most cities can't deal with regular crime bosses.
Secret vigilante prisons ain't the answer.
Of course they are.
How else would you have an awesome super powered prison break episode?
Ah, it stinks, it sucks, it's anthropologically unjust
Illegally imprisoning metas is a questionable but absolutely understandable choice.
Imprisoning perfectly normal people is out. That is wrong, full stop. If Flash cares so much he should follow the jail van next time. Not declare himself judge and jury for the entirety of Central City.
Then why's Piped Piper imprisoned? He has no super powers.
Cold has a super power. He's super good at crime, and also crazy, so he just likes doing crime not hurting people. But put in normal prison, everyone is aware he can just break out. So if he murders people, he goes to the prison he can't break out of. They imprison meta humans there because there's no other way to imprison them yet for their crimes. Cold can't be normally contained in a regular prison, so he gets the special restraints.
Cold has a super power. He's super good at crime, and also crazy, so he just likes doing crime not hurting people. But put in normal prison, everyone is aware he can just break out. So if he murders people, he goes to the prison he can't break out of. They imprison meta humans there because there's no other way to imprison them yet for their crimes. Cold can't be normally contained in a regular prison, so he gets the special restraints.
Cold has a super power. He's super good at crime, and also crazy, so he just likes doing crime not hurting people. But put in normal prison, everyone is aware he can just break out. So if he murders people, he goes to the prison he can't break out of. They imprison meta humans there because there's no other way to imprison them yet for their crimes. Cold can't be normally contained in a regular prison, so he gets the special restraints.
That's not a super power, that's being a clever criminal. Is Raoul Silva a super villain?
How about the villains in the Dark Knight trilogy?
Cold has a super power. He's super good at crime, and also crazy, so he just likes doing crime not hurting people. But put in normal prison, everyone is aware he can just break out. So if he murders people, he goes to the prison he can't break out of. They imprison meta humans there because there's no other way to imprison them yet for their crimes. Cold can't be normally contained in a regular prison, so he gets the special restraints.
That's not a super power, that's being a clever criminal. Is Raoul Silva a super villain?
How about the villains in the Dark Knight trilogy?
Barry offering to throw Cold in the secret prison is practically the heart of an angel, since Barry has almost no reason to even make Cold aware he's in a bit of trouble before being splatted through 15 trees and quite a few reason to get with the splatting.
In fact, Heatweave should kill Iris and then we get an awesome scene where Cold says he stuck to bargain, Barry gets a nice conundrum the next time he relies on the honor of murdering nutcases and no more Iris. Win-win-win!
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Inquisitor772 x Penny Arcade Fight Club ChampionA fixed point in space and timeRegistered Userregular
Illegally imprisoning metas is a questionable but absolutely understandable choice.
Imprisoning perfectly normal people is out. That is wrong, full stop. If Flash cares so much he should follow the jail van next time. Not declare himself judge and jury for the entirety of Central City.
Well,
cold clearly isn't normal. He doesn't give a damn about money, and his own safety is just a means to an end. He has fun being the bad guy and he wants to be the bad guy. He's also the guy with a plan. Not quite batman levels, but he has knack for the xanatos gambit. And we all know prisons don't hold xanatos.
at most, they're useful
"Oh no, you see, he's evil so it's okay."
Yeah no problems there!
It's not that it's no problem, it's just that this city can't even manage to deal with a "regular" crime boss.
Barry offering to throw Cold in the secret prison is practically the heart of an angel, since Barry has almost no reason to even make Cold aware he's in a bit of trouble before being splatted through 15 trees and quite a few reason to get with the splatting.
In fact, Heatweave should kill Iris and then we get an awesome scene where Cold says he stuck to bargain, Barry gets a nice conundrum the next time he relies on the honor of murdering nutcases and no more Iris. Win-win-win!
That's not how Cold operates. You follow his rules or he "let's you go" Heatwave is definitely replaceable to him .
I have a podcast now. It's about video games and anime!Find it here.
this is the kind of thing that happens when superhero stories have the 'rubber meets the road' moment w/r/t correctional systems; it's why there always winds up being some kind of 'prison' that's basically a magic vault outside traditional society
I actually wonder if the superconductor being kind of flagrantly unethical is a plot point that's going to come up later
it was the smallest on the list but
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
Cold has a super power. He's super good at crime, and also crazy, so he just likes doing crime not hurting people. But put in normal prison, everyone is aware he can just break out. So if he murders people, he goes to the prison he can't break out of. They imprison meta humans there because there's no other way to imprison them yet for their crimes. Cold can't be normally contained in a regular prison, so he gets the special restraints.
That's not a super power, that's being a clever criminal. Is Raoul Silva a super villain?
How about the villains in the Dark Knight trilogy?
That guy might as well have been a super villain.
But that movie was also incredibly stupid.
He hasn't got any super-powers, though. Which is meant to be why Team Flash has the prison.
Barry offering to throw Cold in the secret prison is practically the heart of an angel, since Barry has almost no reason to even make Cold aware he's in a bit of trouble before being splatted through 15 trees and quite a few reason to get with the splatting.
In fact, Heatweave should kill Iris and then we get an awesome scene where Cold says he stuck to bargain, Barry gets a nice conundrum the next time he relies on the honor of murdering nutcases and no more Iris. Win-win-win!
That's not how Cold operates. You follow his rules or he "let's you go" Heatwave is definitely replaceable to him .
His rules are pliable. He'll kidnap people and hold them for random if he thinks it'll benefit him, he's done that to Team Flash twice. And he's murdered people in cold blood to test Flash's speed. Maybe Flash's (temporary) rules will prevent him from being so in the future.
Barry offering to throw Cold in the secret prison is practically the heart of an angel, since Barry has almost no reason to even make Cold aware he's in a bit of trouble before being splatted through 15 trees and quite a few reason to get with the splatting.
Except Barry isn't like that. He'd incapacitate him, not kill him. Reverse Flash, however.
I think that Cold was definitely intrigued by this "no killing" idea. It's unorthodox, to be sure, but there are definitely advantages, and it's a true test of skill to commit crimes without resorting to such crude measures. Plus, and this is the best part, the victims remain alive with the knowledge that Cold took their stuff. You could say that they've got a little Captain in 'em.
I think that Cold was definitely intrigued by this "no killing" idea. It's unorthodox, to be sure, but there are definitely advantages, and it's a true test of skill to commit crimes without resorting to such crude measures. Plus, and this is the best part, the victims remain alive with the knowledge that Cold took their stuff. You could say that they've got a little Captain in 'em.
I love how Flash is using modern story telling to give legitimate reasons for how characters are like in the comics. So great.
I think that Cold was definitely intrigued by this "no killing" idea. It's unorthodox, to be sure, but there are definitely advantages, and it's a true test of skill to commit crimes without resorting to such crude measures. Plus, and this is the best part, the victims remain alive with the knowledge that Cold took their stuff. You could say that they've got a little Captain in 'em.
I love how Flash is using modern story telling to give legitimate reasons for how characters are like in the comics. So great.
Yeah, and I foresee Flash and Cold's "gentlemen's agreement" as potentially the first of many over the lifetime of the show.
It also sets up a potential team ups for bigger threats.
I will love the DRAMA if Cold ends up having to kill another villain that was about to reveal the Flash's identity, and then has to make sure that Barry never finds out that it was him.
It also sets up a potential team ups for bigger threats.
I will love the DRAMA if Cold ends up having to kill another villain that was about to reveal the Flash's identity, and then has to make sure that Barry never finds out that it was him.
AManFromEarthLet's get to twerk!The King in the SwampRegistered Userregular
Did someone ask if the bad guys in the Batman movie were super villians?
Cause, yeah. And so is Captain Cold. The super villain prison is a problem, one that I feel will absolutely be addressed at some point cause it's a dangling participle here.
I know we've all seen "evil Superman" like, a billion times; has there ever been a "Flash goes Dark" story? How do you stop a guy that can kill the entire CCPD in the blink of an eye?
(And I mean more than just the episode where he fights Arrow.)
The teleporter who got locked up while not being that bad of a person in the first place is way less a super villain then cold. I am going to laugh when Cold is revealed to have meta powers that are a: not impressive b: an afterthought even to cold . or even better : he secretly has firestorm like flame powers but they bore him as too easy so he uses his cold gun instead.
I know we've all seen "evil Superman" like, a billion times; has there ever been a "Flash goes Dark" story? How do you stop a guy that can kill the entire CCPD in the blink of an eye?
(And I mean more than just the episode where he fights Arrow.)
About the closest you'll get is the JLU episode where he and Luthor switch brains
Did someone ask if the bad guys in the Batman movie were super villians?
Cause, yeah. And so is Captain Cold. The super villain prison is a problem, one that I feel will absolutely be addressed at some point cause it's a dangling participle here.
It's not Cold being a super-villain (technically he is), it's that without his fancy gadgets he's a normal man with no super powers. Which the prison is meant to be for.
The teleporter who got locked up while not being that bad of a person in the first place is way less a super villain then cold. I am going to laugh when Cold is revealed to have meta powers that are a: not impressive b: an afterthought even to cold . or even better : he secretly has firestorm like flame powers but they bore him as too easy so he uses his cold gun instead.
She's a teleporter, in her first appearance she breaks into a prison and out in seconds with it. Cold is a normal human being, without technology he's simply a man. A dangerous man, but a man. Being a bad person isn't the sole condition for the locking criminals up in their prison, it's being a criminal with super-powers.
I know we've all seen "evil Superman" like, a billion times; has there ever been a "Flash goes Dark" story? How do you stop a guy that can kill the entire CCPD in the blink of an eye?
(And I mean more than just the episode where he fights Arrow.)
About the closest you'll get is the JLU episode where he and Luthor switch brains
Yeah, it's pretty much only with the Reverse Flash/Zoom/Inertia where you get the "Horrible unstoppable Speedster." type of stories.
This episode was great. Except maybe the glitter gun.
The Bargain:
The Rogues not killing is so critical and it was so satisfying to actually see the bargain made on screen between Flash and Cold. I geeked out so much.
The alternate Cisco/Wells conversation:
Playing that same moment in time in such a different but similar way? Absolutely brilliant.
Theories on Wells and the future:
The discussions on time travel... I think they are going full on Flashpoint. Like, we'll get multiple episodes, or even a season, in an alternate reality. The Flash replacing himself when he time travels sets this up perfectly because he can stop himself just by traveling back in time again.
And I think Wells is the Reverse Flash from AFTER the Paradox is resolved. I think he knows what's coming for Barry.
The one problem with doing Flashpoint this soon. They haven't introduced Batman. The ending just... isn't as powerful without Flash giving Bruce the letter from his father. So... I dunno how I feel about that.
And, finally. It was discussed earlier in the thread, but a certain photo leaked. I am going to place a link to it in spoilers. ABSOLUTELY DO NOT OPEN THIS SPOILER IF YOU DON'T WANT TO SEE A REAL DOOZY OF A SPOILER.
@MuddBudd I haven't read Flashpoint, but (Arrow season 2 spoilers)
Ollie seems to be the Arrowverse's Batman, and happens to have two dead parents.
Not quite the same, to me anyway.
Not the same, but it still works, thematically.
Barry giving Ollie a message from his mom would be particularly poignant, first because he already got a recorded message from his dad in a flashback, but also because Ollie still blames himself for his mom's death at Slade's hand. Having an Evilverse Ollie with a living mom, who Barry tells about the Goodverse Ollie, and gives him a message to pass to her otherwhere son, could dispense many feels.
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Did I say threaten I mean kill, Oliver would have killed him.
pleasepaypreacher.net
Yeah no problems there!
The day Captain Cold takes his job seriously is the day he stops working as a supervillain.
It's not that it's no problem, it's just that this city can't even manage to deal with a "regular" crime boss.
Most cities can't deal with regular crime bosses.
Secret vigilante prisons ain't the answer.
Of course they are.
How else would you have an awesome super powered prison break episode?
I wouldn't want him in the meta prison either.
He's an expert at... prison break 8)
That's not a super power, that's being a clever criminal. Is Raoul Silva a super villain?
How about the villains in the Dark Knight trilogy?
That guy might as well have been a super villain.
But that movie was also incredibly stupid.
In fact, Heatweave should kill Iris and then we get an awesome scene where Cold says he stuck to bargain, Barry gets a nice conundrum the next time he relies on the honor of murdering nutcases and no more Iris. Win-win-win!
Yeah, that's why they call in the big guns.
The IRS.
That's not how Cold operates. You follow his rules or he "let's you go" Heatwave is definitely replaceable to him .
I actually wonder if the superconductor being kind of flagrantly unethical is a plot point that's going to come up later
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
He hasn't got any super-powers, though. Which is meant to be why Team Flash has the prison.
His rules are pliable. He'll kidnap people and hold them for random if he thinks it'll benefit him, he's done that to Team Flash twice. And he's murdered people in cold blood to test Flash's speed. Maybe Flash's (temporary) rules will prevent him from being so in the future.
Except Barry isn't like that. He'd incapacitate him, not kill him. Reverse Flash, however.
I love how Flash is using modern story telling to give legitimate reasons for how characters are like in the comics. So great.
Yeah, and I foresee Flash and Cold's "gentlemen's agreement" as potentially the first of many over the lifetime of the show.
he gets to continue matching wits with barry et al, and the main actual threat to him (i.e. being thrown in the super-gulag) is removed
it also sets up a potential future conflict between the villains, because Cold doesn't actually want to reveal barry's identity
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
It also sets up a potential team ups for bigger threats.
I will love the DRAMA if Cold ends up having to kill another villain that was about to reveal the Flash's identity, and then has to make sure that Barry never finds out that it was him.
"Now this is a quandary." /deadpan
dear god I want this to happen
it is assumed
Cause, yeah. And so is Captain Cold. The super villain prison is a problem, one that I feel will absolutely be addressed at some point cause it's a dangling participle here.
I know we've all seen "evil Superman" like, a billion times; has there ever been a "Flash goes Dark" story? How do you stop a guy that can kill the entire CCPD in the blink of an eye?
(And I mean more than just the episode where he fights Arrow.)
About the closest you'll get is the JLU episode where he and Luthor switch brains
It's not Cold being a super-villain (technically he is), it's that without his fancy gadgets he's a normal man with no super powers. Which the prison is meant to be for.
She's a teleporter, in her first appearance she breaks into a prison and out in seconds with it. Cold is a normal human being, without technology he's simply a man. A dangerous man, but a man. Being a bad person isn't the sole condition for the locking criminals up in their prison, it's being a criminal with super-powers.
Yeah, it's pretty much only with the Reverse Flash/Zoom/Inertia where you get the "Horrible unstoppable Speedster." type of stories.
that seems unclear to me.
They did, he had none. It was technology.
The Bargain:
The alternate Cisco/Wells conversation:
Theories on Wells and the future:
And I think Wells is the Reverse Flash from AFTER the Paradox is resolved. I think he knows what's coming for Barry.
The one problem with doing Flashpoint this soon. They haven't introduced Batman. The ending just... isn't as powerful without Flash giving Bruce the letter from his father. So... I dunno how I feel about that.
And, finally. It was discussed earlier in the thread, but a certain photo leaked. I am going to place a link to it in spoilers.
ABSOLUTELY DO NOT OPEN THIS SPOILER IF YOU DON'T WANT TO SEE A REAL DOOZY OF A SPOILER.
http://i.imgur.com/SuSRSHN.jpg
The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
Wii: 4521 1146 5179 1333 Pearl: 3394 4642 8367 HG: 1849 3913 3132
Not quite the same, to me anyway.
The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
Not the same, but it still works, thematically.