sticky range is Mid range and in so its nearly impossible to avoid that range. I mean hear what you want but it's the least fun ability type in the game.
Your defense of it seems to be "your just mad it killed you" which isn't right. I'm just bored it killed me. The existence of those nades do not change anyone's gameplay other than adding an audible sigh every few matches.
Edit: Except maybe in trials because double sucky nade is a great orb attack or defense move and in 3on3 you can keep track of who has what abilities up so there is counter play
"I'm bored" is hardly a rational basis to call for a nerf. Though, sadly it has worked in other games. el oh el.
To be fair I haven't Asked for a nerf but for them to be replaced with more interesting abilities
Sticky grenades are a bad mechanic from a gameplay perspective. I am hoping they get tuned down. Either no longer ohk or need to charge to do so or have a longer charge time or all of the above.
They already have a built in balance. If you miss the stick, they do practically nothing. Tiny explosion radius + very little damage. Reducing them from a one hit kill would make sticky grenades completely useless in PvP.
This is late, but what are you even talking about. The idea that there a guaranteed damage spike that cannot be avoided once it sticks is "useless in PVP" is nonsense. There are loads of grenades that CAN be avoided and don't one hit kill.
That said, not only that they reward bad play as well.
Stickies are fine. Grenades should be able to kill, not inconvenience. When I see an Axion Bolt I book the hell out of dodge. In a game with tons of OHKO moves like Shoulder Charge, Blink Strike, Wombo Combo, numerous supers, and everyone's favorite- ridiculous snipers... sticky grenades are not an issue.
In the words of MLG dudebros: git gud
I don't understand what the argument is here, axion bolts "inconvenience" rather than kill? A sticky that didn't kill work work in the opposite way to an axion, one work have to carefully consider joining a firefight instead of charging away.
And you can't git gud out of it.
I like my grenades to actually do something. Axion Bolt works as an area denial tool, but doesn't deal lethal damage. Lighting Grenades are bonkers but you have to be careful with placement, so they are also about area denial. almost every grenade in Destiny does something other than simply kill the enemy.
The tracking on a sticky can be a bit much but you still have to actually throw it at the enemy. Stickies aren't ruining the game, I only rarely see them in Crucible. I can count on one hand how many times I died to them in the last IB. I would much rather see snipers get looked at way before they ruin the only lethal grenades. Destiny is more of an arcade shooter and the abilities should feel fun and powerful. It's satisfying to stick someone on the face, or shotgun them, snipe them, Shoulder Charge, etc. It's annoying when effectively used against you, yeah. But I don't think Stickies really need a nerf. Even if you tone down the tracking at close ranges, it's still gonna be as annoying to fight against when someone is using them effectively. Being mad because it has a low skill ceiling isn't a very good complaint.
Fusion/Flux grenade take the most skill to use IMO, even taking into consideration the small amount of tracking it gives you. Yeah, you can just run at people and stick them and get a terrible K/D and not contribute much at all... or you can use them smartly to quickly kill close-range opponents. Just like you can mindlessly Shoulder Charge or Shotgun rush, it may work sometimes but it's a risk/reward scenario. It's a pretty good hard counter to shotgun rushers (and a good compliment, too). Basically if you are close enough to me to get stuck it was your fault, not the grenade's.
Abilities should feel like they actually do something, not feel worthless. The only good grenade for PvP Sunsingers currently is Fusion, the other two are pretty worthless right now post-Viking Funeral nerf. Making Fusions any less powerful would basically make grenades worthless for that class. Same goes for Hammerbro, as well.
Regarding Shoulder Charge being 'different' because it requires set-up... is a pretty moot point if you have ever played with Booker. Dude can do a tight turn and Tiger Knee a fresh Sunsinger into nothing in no time. There's plenty of low-skill ceiling OHKO's. Wombo combo is pretty simple and effective way to murder someone in seconds. Blink Strike, while nerfed, still absolutely wrecks people.
Basically, I don't think nerfs should come down because something is personally annoying for you to fight against. Snipers are the one thing the community agrees needs to be addressed, everything else is pretty subjective to our own experiences. I, for one, cannot stand the Rez Snipe mechanic but, rather than demand a solution I simply
Got gud?
I don't know what you think of this was actually relevant.
For example, part of it was flat wrong - a sticky does nothing to counter a competent shotgun rush it forces a trade, if you have enough time to throw a grenade and back up enough to not get taken out then you have more than enough time to counter by simply back peddling and employing your primary. Incendiary grenades ar one of the most powerful grenades in the game - but don't have the same synergy with cauterise as do fusions and most gunslingers still want area denial it seems.
You bring up the example of Booker, a highly skilled player, highly skilled at shoulder charge (an ability considered weak due to how situational its primary function is - get the sc kill, get shot gunned by the guy next door, it's more generally used in high level play as simply a movement tool). Booker (and I, sometimes I am not as good as Booker) can do an emergency knee - after a 1 second wind up, in a game where TTK sits at on average 0.9 seconds. I have no idea how this relates to any argument - it is completely rewarded or thwarted by approach, positioning and anticipation on both sides. Yes, it straight up murders a self res, but that is, again simply a timing and anticipation problem on behalf of the warlock in the same way that self res in the middle of a couple of guys with shotguns is a bad play.
Likewise, I don't see the relevance of fusion rifles, blink strikes, or the wombo combo? They can all be avoided and don't change the outcome of a well executed approach (in that they don't force a trade), and punish a poorly executed approach (in that they allow the approachee to kill the approacher without trading) and can be avoided - fusions have windup time and make a lot of noise, blink strike needs to be behind to be a OHKO and if it's just a killing blow then the victim needs to already be hurt, the wombo combo can simply be avoided or baited and CAN a be escaped even once it triggers (even though it is difficult and confusing). Though blink strike still kills from the front occasionally which it certainly should not. The point is that each of them have counter plays or are counter plays.
I maintain that having a sticky on you even if it doesn't kill you is going to be a big problem and will not be remotely useless, my preferred balance is to have a counterplay once stuck, like sliding at exactly the right time mean that you will prevent just enough damage to not be dead. Or, that they should work like a scorch cannon, they one hit kill if you hold are button until they reach max arming. All the talk of "they will be useless" just isn't as obvious as the assertion would say would suggest and the contra positives simply don't address the breadth of possibilities (from my suggestions for tuning to disrupter's suggestion that they are simply replaced).
I partly agree on res sniping, though I think it's actually a good mechanic implemented poorly - it should still be possible but resurrections should either place the player randomly in a small radius, somewhere behind the player performing the res or randomly within a wide but short cone extending from the centre of the player being revived point of view.
Edit: which isn't to say to don't need to git gud, I definitely do. Most of what I say above isn't even to say that your central point is wrong - that I am misplaying (it seems strange though, given one can kill someone, take no damage and die to a last moment Hail Mary sticky grenade (or later, due to lag)) - perhaps it is actually an issue with the consistency of shotguns. Perhaps it is something else entirely, but the arguments given don't make that case, or as far as I can see, any case at all
Part of me wants to get back into this, but another part remembers what an in fun rng grind the game could be, especially for Exotics. Have they said anything about a dressing this?
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Apothe0sisHave you ever questioned the nature of your reality?Registered Userregular
Part of me wants to get back into this, but another part remembers what an in fun rng grind the game could be, especially for Exotics. Have they said anything about a dressing this?
Literally everything is so much more fun now in terms of the grind.
Exotics drop like candy (if you want them), drop at up to max light and can be retrieved if you dismantle them.
Nowadays if you're grinding you're probably grinding for things like better stat rolls, everything else just happens if you do the right things. And max light stuff drops from the raid, the challenge of elders, exotic engrams, the court of oryx, the nightfall, iron banner and PVP bounties, trials of Osiris win rewards.
Near max stuff drops from the nightfall and faction packages and Trials bounties
Infusion doesn't lose light level anymore.
None of the triumphs are really grinds - except the exotic sword quest and mountaintop PVP quest line (which I enjoyed but there are a few sections which might be a bit higher stress in the current scenario).
Also on the exotics front, the quests for the Black Spindle (Lost to Light) and No Time to Explain (Paradox) can now be completed at any time, not just when they are the daily.
Plus the three House of Wolves exotics which cannot actually drop from 3oC have a relatively high chance to drop each time you do Challenge of Elders. You can complete it as many times as you want a week and have a chance.
Three of Coins now works in PvP modes and drop exotics fairly frequently.
The only exotic that apparently will never drop is fucking Tarantellafuckinghellgiveittomegame. Your mileage may vary on this last one.
I love how Destiny is kinda like riding a bike. I haven't played since April, but it's such an easy game to just pick back up and play again. Getting that Challenge of Elder done to finish my Y2 Triumph made me pretty excited about September 20th. Until then... I need to save Azeroth from the Legion invasion... brb!
Some extra low quality randos in the strike playlist today. I haven't seen this many AFK jerkoffs since the eliminated the "Strike complete with no deaths" bounties.
Realizing lately that I don't really trust or respect basically any of the moderators here. So, good luck with life, friends! Hit me up on Twitter @DesertLeviathan
Also on the exotics front, the quests for the Black Spindle (Lost to Light) and No Time to Explain (Paradox) can now be completed at any time, not just when they are the daily.
Holy shit, what? BRB, turning several hours of frustration into a Black Spindle or three.
_
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Apothe0sisHave you ever questioned the nature of your reality?Registered Userregular
Also on the exotics front, the quests for the Black Spindle (Lost to Light) and No Time to Explain (Paradox) can now be completed at any time, not just when they are the daily.
Holy shit, what? BRB, turning several hours of frustration into a Black Spindle or three.
I don't know about ps4 but on xbone we have turned that mission into a fine art. I'm sure that other ps4 players could help and you'd be one and done, or one and almost done to get your hand in then get it next go.
Sticky grenades should kill you when they're touching you. The counterplay is not to get stuck, because if you don't get stuck and aren't literally standing on the grenade you'll still survive. I'd almost consider the idea of a sticky grenade a hallmark for Bungie games. The Plasma Grenade feeling of "Oh shit" being your last thought before you get turned to vapor is balanced out by the feeling of "Hell yeah!" when you stick someone at range. Trades with a sticky don't feel good, but they also punish your enemy for not killing you quicker.
The trade off of stickies is that you can't perform the old Halo Nade-BR combo with them unless the grenade lands under their feet. They're terrible at area denial, and require fine placement. The way I see it is this, Icendiary and Suppression are the Frag Grenades, and Flux and Fusion are the Plasma grenades of the Destiny universe. Everything else is area denial. They each have a role to play, they fit that role well, and I see no reason to remove the ability of the grenades to instakill you when stuck to you.
The worst I can see done to them is tuning their magnetism a little bit so they don't zip towards you the last two feet would be fine, making them non-lethal would very much be a step in the wrong direction. Sometimes you get instakilled, and that's okay. Maybe you would have otherwise completely outplayed them? Maybe they died for the throw? Either way, if an explosive is attached to you, you should die from it.
The counterplay is to Super, have a shield up, kill your opponent more quickly, change your range of engagement, or manouver better.
Also, re: Arcbolt grenades, I swear by those with Arc Web selected, and here's why:
The way I see stickies is that they're the low skill floor/low skill ceiling option.
They offer one thing. Throw blindly into the air to force a trade or a lucky kill or two.
A lower skill player can equip them and suddenly be OK with their grenade game. That is needed otherwise you get really pissy players. I used them forever because I sucked at grenades until I decided I wanted to actually play well and eqip the suppressor.
In the hands of a good player they will never be the top choice because the utility just isn't there in them that you can get with the other options.
They make a very specific instance, a trade in short to mid range, have a chance at skill equilization.
Mostly just huntin' monsters.
XBL:Phenyhelm - 3DS:Phenyhelm
Sticky Grenades are better than you state. A good player will use a Fusion grenade to kill, and immediately disengage after throwing. The only way to stop him in this case is to use a weapon with one-shot capability, because he will only be visible for the split second when he is throwing, if even that. He could even make the toss from behind cover. The grenade is not so much limited as skewed entirely to killing.
Grenades exist on a continuum of damage to area denial. Stickies are full damage, Solar Grenades are full area denial, and Lightning grenades are a perfect balance between them.
Sticky grenades are not limited to trading, but to killing.
Unrelated, I played ToO with @Arteen and Jay last night, where I destroyed some noobs.
gdi Destiny, I just found out there is a shirt in it if you do the Year 2 Triumphs. How screwed am I if I start now? I've already done some of the basic ones but that Mountaintop one scares me.
gdi Destiny, I just found out there is a shirt in it if you do the Year 2 Triumphs. How screwed am I if I start now? I've already done some of the basic ones but that Mountaintop one scares me.
Yeah, you could maybe it get it done but the fragments are the most time sensitive thing right now. You only have a few chances to get some of the Court of Oryx ones now.
Looking it up, next week is the last chance to have a shot at all of them. If I do T3 court of Oryx and challange mode kings fall every week, then I can do it. And also do all those triumphs.
Oh man. Just got a gunsmith level up, and it gave me a Lyudmila with Headseeker and Counterbalance, and it doesn't have Braced Frame but it does have Injection Mold and you know what I'll take that.
The only downside is freaking out about how little ammo I have with the Universal Remote.
I think maybe I'l pair it with a sidearm just to keep myself from having a panic attack every time I look at the HUD. It didn't seem to run out though it's more perceptional. It's not like I am firing all the time and often I can pop few dudes and clean up with my melee as I have Force Barrier up almost all the time.
Mostly just huntin' monsters.
XBL:Phenyhelm - 3DS:Phenyhelm
Oh man. Just got a gunsmith level up, and it gave me a Lyudmila with Headseeker and Counterbalance, and it doesn't have Braced Frame but it does have Injection Mold and you know what I'll take that.
That's a pretty solid roll. I picked up a Lyudmila from an Armsday order about a month ago, and I'm a convert. It has SC Holo/Crowd Control/Counterbalance/HLS. I might have preferred Headseeker over CC since it makes bodyshots more forgiving, but it's still my new favorite PR in the Crucible.
Posts
damnit... I need this badly, but I'm currently at the Panthers game which is sucking the life outta me
PSN: HooverFanPA
Steam: HooverFan
@Custom Special Okay, drop a line in here, I'll probably be tooling around online until then.
Kids in bed, going to grab a BLT and hop on in a few.
I don't know what you think of this was actually relevant.
For example, part of it was flat wrong - a sticky does nothing to counter a competent shotgun rush it forces a trade, if you have enough time to throw a grenade and back up enough to not get taken out then you have more than enough time to counter by simply back peddling and employing your primary. Incendiary grenades ar one of the most powerful grenades in the game - but don't have the same synergy with cauterise as do fusions and most gunslingers still want area denial it seems.
You bring up the example of Booker, a highly skilled player, highly skilled at shoulder charge (an ability considered weak due to how situational its primary function is - get the sc kill, get shot gunned by the guy next door, it's more generally used in high level play as simply a movement tool). Booker (and I, sometimes I am not as good as Booker) can do an emergency knee - after a 1 second wind up, in a game where TTK sits at on average 0.9 seconds. I have no idea how this relates to any argument - it is completely rewarded or thwarted by approach, positioning and anticipation on both sides. Yes, it straight up murders a self res, but that is, again simply a timing and anticipation problem on behalf of the warlock in the same way that self res in the middle of a couple of guys with shotguns is a bad play.
Likewise, I don't see the relevance of fusion rifles, blink strikes, or the wombo combo? They can all be avoided and don't change the outcome of a well executed approach (in that they don't force a trade), and punish a poorly executed approach (in that they allow the approachee to kill the approacher without trading) and can be avoided - fusions have windup time and make a lot of noise, blink strike needs to be behind to be a OHKO and if it's just a killing blow then the victim needs to already be hurt, the wombo combo can simply be avoided or baited and CAN a be escaped even once it triggers (even though it is difficult and confusing). Though blink strike still kills from the front occasionally which it certainly should not. The point is that each of them have counter plays or are counter plays.
I maintain that having a sticky on you even if it doesn't kill you is going to be a big problem and will not be remotely useless, my preferred balance is to have a counterplay once stuck, like sliding at exactly the right time mean that you will prevent just enough damage to not be dead. Or, that they should work like a scorch cannon, they one hit kill if you hold are button until they reach max arming. All the talk of "they will be useless" just isn't as obvious as the assertion would say would suggest and the contra positives simply don't address the breadth of possibilities (from my suggestions for tuning to disrupter's suggestion that they are simply replaced).
I partly agree on res sniping, though I think it's actually a good mechanic implemented poorly - it should still be possible but resurrections should either place the player randomly in a small radius, somewhere behind the player performing the res or randomly within a wide but short cone extending from the centre of the player being revived point of view.
Edit: which isn't to say to don't need to git gud, I definitely do. Most of what I say above isn't even to say that your central point is wrong - that I am misplaying (it seems strange though, given one can kill someone, take no damage and die to a last moment Hail Mary sticky grenade (or later, due to lag)) - perhaps it is actually an issue with the consistency of shotguns. Perhaps it is something else entirely, but the arguments given don't make that case, or as far as I can see, any case at all
Part of me wants to get back into this, but another part remembers what an in fun rng grind the game could be, especially for Exotics. Have they said anything about a dressing this?
Literally everything is so much more fun now in terms of the grind.
Exotics drop like candy (if you want them), drop at up to max light and can be retrieved if you dismantle them.
Nowadays if you're grinding you're probably grinding for things like better stat rolls, everything else just happens if you do the right things. And max light stuff drops from the raid, the challenge of elders, exotic engrams, the court of oryx, the nightfall, iron banner and PVP bounties, trials of Osiris win rewards.
Near max stuff drops from the nightfall and faction packages and Trials bounties
Infusion doesn't lose light level anymore.
None of the triumphs are really grinds - except the exotic sword quest and mountaintop PVP quest line (which I enjoyed but there are a few sections which might be a bit higher stress in the current scenario).
Plus the three House of Wolves exotics which cannot actually drop from 3oC have a relatively high chance to drop each time you do Challenge of Elders. You can complete it as many times as you want a week and have a chance.
Three of Coins now works in PvP modes and drop exotics fairly frequently.
The only exotic that apparently will never drop is fucking Tarantellafuckinghellgiveittomegame. Your mileage may vary on this last one.
Eva has Winterborn mark, Jade Rabbit and Victory Eagle II for sale today.
(Love that jade rabbit)
Gamertag - Khraul
PSN - Razide6
Kiddo woke up with some crazy ass night terror.
Good games though, was a pleasure as always.
bnet: moss*1454
I just managed a .47k/d and second lowest score on my team because not a single shotgun blast or melee attack would do any damage.
Like... just come on....
Please... Have dedicated servers for D2... just PLEASE
Gamertag - Khraul
PSN - Razide6
It's amazing when paired with NBP.
XBL:Phenyhelm - 3DS:Phenyhelm
Holy shit, what? BRB, turning several hours of frustration into a Black Spindle or three.
Your Ad Here! Reasonable Rates!
Sticky grenades should kill you when they're touching you. The counterplay is not to get stuck, because if you don't get stuck and aren't literally standing on the grenade you'll still survive. I'd almost consider the idea of a sticky grenade a hallmark for Bungie games. The Plasma Grenade feeling of "Oh shit" being your last thought before you get turned to vapor is balanced out by the feeling of "Hell yeah!" when you stick someone at range. Trades with a sticky don't feel good, but they also punish your enemy for not killing you quicker.
The trade off of stickies is that you can't perform the old Halo Nade-BR combo with them unless the grenade lands under their feet. They're terrible at area denial, and require fine placement. The way I see it is this, Icendiary and Suppression are the Frag Grenades, and Flux and Fusion are the Plasma grenades of the Destiny universe. Everything else is area denial. They each have a role to play, they fit that role well, and I see no reason to remove the ability of the grenades to instakill you when stuck to you.
The worst I can see done to them is tuning their magnetism a little bit so they don't zip towards you the last two feet would be fine, making them non-lethal would very much be a step in the wrong direction. Sometimes you get instakilled, and that's okay. Maybe you would have otherwise completely outplayed them? Maybe they died for the throw? Either way, if an explosive is attached to you, you should die from it.
The counterplay is to Super, have a shield up, kill your opponent more quickly, change your range of engagement, or manouver better.
Also, re: Arcbolt grenades, I swear by those with Arc Web selected, and here's why:
In case you weren't counting, that was 627 damage.
Have you seen him? Now you have
They offer one thing. Throw blindly into the air to force a trade or a lucky kill or two.
A lower skill player can equip them and suddenly be OK with their grenade game. That is needed otherwise you get really pissy players. I used them forever because I sucked at grenades until I decided I wanted to actually play well and eqip the suppressor.
In the hands of a good player they will never be the top choice because the utility just isn't there in them that you can get with the other options.
They make a very specific instance, a trade in short to mid range, have a chance at skill equilization.
XBL:Phenyhelm - 3DS:Phenyhelm
Sticky Grenades are better than you state. A good player will use a Fusion grenade to kill, and immediately disengage after throwing. The only way to stop him in this case is to use a weapon with one-shot capability, because he will only be visible for the split second when he is throwing, if even that. He could even make the toss from behind cover. The grenade is not so much limited as skewed entirely to killing.
Grenades exist on a continuum of damage to area denial. Stickies are full damage, Solar Grenades are full area denial, and Lightning grenades are a perfect balance between them.
Sticky grenades are not limited to trading, but to killing.
Unrelated, I played ToO with @Arteen and Jay last night, where I destroyed some noobs.
Well sure. Anything that has such contained killing power can be used that way.
All I am saying is that stickies exist because there needs to be an option for someone who's geenade game is just not great.
The fact they can be used by a skilled player, such as yourself to effictivly kill, should be a given.
You could kill me with a rusty spoon, man. Doesn't mean the spoon is OP.
XBL:Phenyhelm - 3DS:Phenyhelm
PSN: BrightWing13 FFX|V:ARR Bright Asuna
What step are you on?
Got a guide right here - https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/4oeugh/the_mountaintop_the_never_ending_crucible_grind/
It looks insurmountable but there is a fair few you can take simultaneously.
E: To clarify, I would need to do the exotic sword line, get 50 fragments, the april quests, and Mountaintop to get everything done.
PSN: BrightWing13 FFX|V:ARR Bright Asuna
https://www.bungie.net/en/Help/Troubleshoot?oid=44927
....
Meh.
PSN: BrightWing13 FFX|V:ARR Bright Asuna
Have you seen him? Now you have
I think maybe I'l pair it with a sidearm just to keep myself from having a panic attack every time I look at the HUD. It didn't seem to run out though it's more perceptional. It's not like I am firing all the time and often I can pop few dudes and clean up with my melee as I have Force Barrier up almost all the time.
XBL:Phenyhelm - 3DS:Phenyhelm
Now to see a man about a sword.
That's a pretty solid roll. I picked up a Lyudmila from an Armsday order about a month ago, and I'm a convert. It has SC Holo/Crowd Control/Counterbalance/HLS. I might have preferred Headseeker over CC since it makes bodyshots more forgiving, but it's still my new favorite PR in the Crucible.
Wii U - 'Nocero'
XBox ID - therealmasume
PS4 ID - realmasume
Some good Pantheon tips here.
https://dm.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/4zvy95/trials_of_osiris_pantheon_tips_from_a_top_50_wl/
Wii U - 'Nocero'
XBox ID - therealmasume
PS4 ID - realmasume