I am probably alone on this one but I still like X-Men vs Street Fighter the most out of all the vs games. Nothing will match the excitement of walking into the arcade and seeing Ryu do a team super with Cyclops for the first time and then a year later importing it on Saturn with the 4MB RAM cartridge. Plunking that translucent blue cartridge in and effectively having the arcade game at home was very special.
I'm with you on that. Playing Street Fighter vs X-men at home was super fun... Except, at the time, my brothers would whine to me that they wanted to take the game with them to college, leaving me without anything to play. I went out of my way to buy the game so it felt very unjust.
That sucks, I hope you got your copy back in the end.
Does anyone have any experience with the Hori fighting stick that you can get relatively cheap (compared to the Mad Katz ones anyway)? How do they compare to say the PS1 Namco sticks or the official Dreamcast sticks?
The Hori EX2? It's what I used before I got a TE. It's not bad for a cheap stick, but if you plan on playing any fighting game for more than a couple months buy the TE.
The Hori EX2? It's what I used before I got a TE. It's not bad for a cheap stick, but if you plan on playing any fighting game for more than a couple months buy the TE.
It's just called Hori arcade fighting stick for PS3 on Amazon. Buying a TE isn't an option, I'd like to eventually buy 2 sticks for local play and I can't really afford to drop three figures on a controller.
The Hori EX2? It's what I used before I got a TE. It's not bad for a cheap stick, but if you plan on playing any fighting game for more than a couple months buy the TE.
It's just called Hori arcade fighting stick for PS3 on Amazon. Buying a TE isn't an option, I'd like to eventually buy 2 sticks for local play and I can't really afford to drop three figures on a controller.
Well, that's not the one I had then. So I don't know anything about it.
I must say, there is quite a bit of downtime on this tourney. Is it super big? how many people approx are playing?
Hiryu02 on
Sev: Your gameplay is the most heavily yomi based around. Usually you look for characters that allow you to force guessing situations for big dmg. Even if the guess is mathematically nowhere near in your favor lol. You're happiest when you have either a 50/50, 33/33/33 or even a 75/25 situation to go crazy with. And you will take big risks to force those situations to come up.
some dude posted some Hakan impressions. Spoilered for size:
Hakan
-HE CAN NOT FADC OIL, perhaps he can from a buffer or from a stronger oil (only tried short) for some odd reason, but I wasn't able to experiment with that.
-He can FADC slide from anywhere on the screen.
-According to Seth Killian, Hakan’s SPD has more start-up frames than a normal throw. This was evident to me as I was b.thrown by Gouken many, many times by another player during otherwise viable setups.
-According to Seth Killian, Hakan’s LVL1 focus bears neutral frames. Though I forgot to ask whether that was on hit or block. Even if it’s only on hit, that’s still better than most of the cast’s focus. If that’s on block, that’s pretty phenomenal.
-Jab 360 has awful (yes bad) range, possibly has the same range as his normal throw. Upon being oiled, this is a very different story, the range is pretty ridiculous.
-He can do short oil twice, doubling the longevity. Any further shorts oils, do not stack. This means that other combinations could stack though (possibly short oil, forward oil).
-f.MP has an extremely long cancel window allowing you to verify a hit into slide with relative ease, however the move has sub-par priority and slow startup. Expect to be counter-hit.
-His “Oil Combination Hold” works with an opponent extremely close to the ground (after a jump).
-His j.MP allows for a juggle state combo and appears to be more reliable than his slow j.FP.
-His back dash is horrible, don’t expect to get out of anything unless it’s a throw. It stays grounded for what seemed to be the whole animation, moves an embarrassingly short distance backward, and has very few frames of invincibility.
-jFP is not nearly as effective as E. Honda's. It has slow startup and I was counter-hit out of it by half the cast. It cannot sway like Honda’s or Balrog’s. The (slow to access) active frames of the move are extremely effective. Jump back.FP works well to prevent jump ins.
-Heavy oil (even medium) after jab 360 (the most practical time to oil up) on certain characters is very risky. Makoto can EX hayate on reaction easily. Short oil is very unsafe against characters like Chun-Li for obvious reasons..
-f.RH, s.MP and s.FP appear to be his best pokes. s.FP has incredible priority and range, however at max range only the last hit (of two) has a tendency to connect, making it do awful damage.
-Without oil Hakan is very, very weak. With oil, it provides marginal buffs to priority and frame advantage, with obvious buffs to range. The buff on his focus and grabs appear the most beneficial. The supposed “frame advantage,” his normals gain off oil, was so insignificant, I couldn't actually tell if there was any.
-Hakan's best combos are simple two-in-one combos (c.mk > slide)
-Hakan's links are more difficult and unfulfilling than most. IE: s.jab > s.short > s.jab > f.jab is pretty difficult with no real reason or reward for doing it. His links are very poor and strict even with oil.
-His heavy attacks do around 200 stun.
-f.FP has insane priority but an odd hit box and mediocre range. Will have uses in certain unforeseen match-ups.
-c.FP has a lot of range but I wasn’t able to experiment much with its effectiveness.
-His super doesn’t appear to have the ability to AA jump-ins.
-His jump is very, very low to the ground causing dramatic problems with certain characters. The timing to jump over Sagat’s high tiger shot is fairly strict because of its low altitude. Makoto can also punish him jumping a near full screen away, almost at the peak of his jump (perhaps even that), with her EX hayate. Makoto was able to anti-air him with f.FP and even s.MP with relative ease. Chun can punish him from at nearly any point during his jump with her s.RH.
Note: with regard to level 1 FA's, the block/hit stun are exactly the same. So if he's neutral on block, he's also neutral on hit. For comparison, there are only 4 characters who are neutral (or better) with level 1 FA's... chun, gouken, abel, and fuete (only chun is +1 rest are 0). This means Hakan likely has a very fast forward dash.
And his opinion on him:
MY OPINION
He, at this point, appears to be a very good contender for worst character in the game. With the very little knowledge I have of Guile and Vega, I was more able to win against the inexperienced players I was fighting. At one point I lost 13-0 to one unknown mediocre player, matches of 2/3 rounds, against his Makoto and Chun. You can take that as a testament to the lack of compatibility I have with Hakan or the glaring possibility of his inefficiency. I was able to play with him for about 3 hours straight, completing his entire trial “challenge” in about 10 minutes.
I was originally planning on maining Hakan myself, so there is no bias here. I am very displeased with what I discovered.
If Hakan is not oiled up. He is free. He has no good reversal options without oil. His 360’s range and startup is so bad Makoto was able to wildly spam all of her normals at relatively close range, seemingly without risk of being thrown out startup, extension or recovery. He is no Zangief… and not even as effective as Abel or E. Honda in terms of grappling. I was able to have some luck with his EX 360 which more than likely has hit invincibility like Abel’s command grab. I have a feeling any character who has good pressure options will destroy Hakan. His amazingly bad back dash (without oil) makes it very difficult to relieve pressure. He stays grounded for the most part and I don’t even think it moves backward out of most character’s c.jab range.
Conversely, people who can keep Hakan out will also destroy him. IE: characters with fireballs and reliable AA normals. His jump is horrible. In combination with what I’ve listed before, his low jump height will surely cause problems with other characters, possibly even worse than what‘s been currently discovered. You’ll be very, very surprised what normals will AA Hakan at the height of his jump. Ryu’s far s.FP could potentially AA him. I have a feeling Sagat’s far s.FP will shut him down completely. The sad thing is, it’s pretty slow as well, so don’t expect to surprise anyone…
Even upon being oiled up it is extremely hard to apply pressure or keep the opponent out. Jumping out of Hakan’s terribly slow throw setups bear little risk, apart from an equally risky psychic 360K or a random jumping air throw. His moves gain absurd range, but that will only cause temporary problems until players figure out how to space him, then even that is of little consequence. His focus is definitely has some intriguing possibility.
The fact he can’t FADC out of oil wracks my brain. This could possibly be the biggest contributing factor to a lot of his problems. If the Chun player I was fighting had some more skill he could have EASILY ultra’d me on reaction to any level of oil. They are all simply too slow. The simple fact Hakan can’t use oil against Chun once she has ultra makes me feel that Justin’s “0-10 match up” hyperbole could be true. Makoto could easily punish his heavy oil from full screen with EX hayate after a KD from jab 360. That was extremely frustrating, as you would expect that to be the optimal (only) situation to use heavy oil. If he were able to FADC oil he may not be nearly as horrible as he is. He could use oil buffer combos that could cancel into the very improved back dash slide, setting up for shenanigans putting him at optimal spacing for s.FP.
His only saving grace seems to be his f.RH once oiled up, s.FP, and the fact he can FADC slide from any point in the move, allowing him to get in. His s.FP remains effective without oil. Its HUGE hit arc and range are great, though only one of two hits has a tendency to connect from max range. With his tools, playing defensively seems to be his only viable option.
Maybe I just played against two of Hakan’s worst match ups, maybe I just couldn‘t figure out a damn useful thing with him in 3 hours, and worst of all maybe he actually is crap… Overall I still say you take a lot of this information with a grain of salt as there is still a lot of discovery to be had with this character and 3 hours of play testing isn’t a matter of fact. I at least hope you guys enjoyed reading!
The Hori EX2? It's what I used before I got a TE. It's not bad for a cheap stick, but if you plan on playing any fighting game for more than a couple months buy the TE.
It's just called Hori arcade fighting stick for PS3 on Amazon. Buying a TE isn't an option, I'd like to eventually buy 2 sticks for local play and I can't really afford to drop three figures on a controller.
thats what i use. its good enough, but you will eventually want a better stick. mainly its the buttons that arent that great. whenever i have some extra $$ im definitely going to pick up a TE, but i mean ive been rocking the fight stick 3 since SF4 came out and you know... it works.
GG's BlueDestiny. Your Boxer has improved quite a bit, your Bison is coming along as well. Thanks for the matches.
Hiryu02 on
Sev: Your gameplay is the most heavily yomi based around. Usually you look for characters that allow you to force guessing situations for big dmg. Even if the guess is mathematically nowhere near in your favor lol. You're happiest when you have either a 50/50, 33/33/33 or even a 75/25 situation to go crazy with. And you will take big risks to force those situations to come up.
GG's BlueDestiny. Your Boxer has improved quite a bit, your Bison is coming along as well. Thanks for the matches.
Yeah, it was good fun. I'm just now starting to crossup and it's working wonders when I manage it. I have a lot of trouble with certain characters though. Specifically:Honda, Gen, Chun Li and Guile. Chun Li and Guile in particular seem to be impossible to crack if they play defensively.
Posts
That sucks, I hope you got your copy back in the end.
Does anyone have any experience with the Hori fighting stick that you can get relatively cheap (compared to the Mad Katz ones anyway)? How do they compare to say the PS1 Namco sticks or the official Dreamcast sticks?
It's just called Hori arcade fighting stick for PS3 on Amazon. Buying a TE isn't an option, I'd like to eventually buy 2 sticks for local play and I can't really afford to drop three figures on a controller.
Well, that's not the one I had then. So I don't know anything about it.
Jesus fucking christ, the fat duo announcing shit is really killing this stream.
(please excuse the shitty cell phone picture)
to compare:
GT: Tanky the Tank
Black: 1377 6749 7425
I see that. Whens the SF4 start?
i almost got excited for no reason...
i read that as "Hdr on steam now"
thinking "holy shit they actually put it on steam!?"
oh well
I thought I heard someone saying Tekken 6 was up next?
Fei long prologue and colour 12 starting 2:20.
I'm going to go ahead and say that bonuses aren't worth it.
-HE CAN NOT FADC OIL, perhaps he can from a buffer or from a stronger oil (only tried short) for some odd reason, but I wasn't able to experiment with that.
-He can FADC slide from anywhere on the screen.
-According to Seth Killian, Hakan’s SPD has more start-up frames than a normal throw. This was evident to me as I was b.thrown by Gouken many, many times by another player during otherwise viable setups.
-According to Seth Killian, Hakan’s LVL1 focus bears neutral frames. Though I forgot to ask whether that was on hit or block. Even if it’s only on hit, that’s still better than most of the cast’s focus. If that’s on block, that’s pretty phenomenal.
-Jab 360 has awful (yes bad) range, possibly has the same range as his normal throw. Upon being oiled, this is a very different story, the range is pretty ridiculous.
-He can do short oil twice, doubling the longevity. Any further shorts oils, do not stack. This means that other combinations could stack though (possibly short oil, forward oil).
-f.MP has an extremely long cancel window allowing you to verify a hit into slide with relative ease, however the move has sub-par priority and slow startup. Expect to be counter-hit.
-His “Oil Combination Hold” works with an opponent extremely close to the ground (after a jump).
-His j.MP allows for a juggle state combo and appears to be more reliable than his slow j.FP.
-His back dash is horrible, don’t expect to get out of anything unless it’s a throw. It stays grounded for what seemed to be the whole animation, moves an embarrassingly short distance backward, and has very few frames of invincibility.
-jFP is not nearly as effective as E. Honda's. It has slow startup and I was counter-hit out of it by half the cast. It cannot sway like Honda’s or Balrog’s. The (slow to access) active frames of the move are extremely effective. Jump back.FP works well to prevent jump ins.
-Heavy oil (even medium) after jab 360 (the most practical time to oil up) on certain characters is very risky. Makoto can EX hayate on reaction easily. Short oil is very unsafe against characters like Chun-Li for obvious reasons..
-f.RH, s.MP and s.FP appear to be his best pokes. s.FP has incredible priority and range, however at max range only the last hit (of two) has a tendency to connect, making it do awful damage.
-Without oil Hakan is very, very weak. With oil, it provides marginal buffs to priority and frame advantage, with obvious buffs to range. The buff on his focus and grabs appear the most beneficial. The supposed “frame advantage,” his normals gain off oil, was so insignificant, I couldn't actually tell if there was any.
-Hakan's best combos are simple two-in-one combos (c.mk > slide)
-Hakan's links are more difficult and unfulfilling than most. IE: s.jab > s.short > s.jab > f.jab is pretty difficult with no real reason or reward for doing it. His links are very poor and strict even with oil.
-His heavy attacks do around 200 stun.
-f.FP has insane priority but an odd hit box and mediocre range. Will have uses in certain unforeseen match-ups.
-c.FP has a lot of range but I wasn’t able to experiment much with its effectiveness.
-His super doesn’t appear to have the ability to AA jump-ins.
-His jump is very, very low to the ground causing dramatic problems with certain characters. The timing to jump over Sagat’s high tiger shot is fairly strict because of its low altitude. Makoto can also punish him jumping a near full screen away, almost at the peak of his jump (perhaps even that), with her EX hayate. Makoto was able to anti-air him with f.FP and even s.MP with relative ease. Chun can punish him from at nearly any point during his jump with her s.RH.
Note: with regard to level 1 FA's, the block/hit stun are exactly the same. So if he's neutral on block, he's also neutral on hit. For comparison, there are only 4 characters who are neutral (or better) with level 1 FA's... chun, gouken, abel, and fuete (only chun is +1 rest are 0). This means Hakan likely has a very fast forward dash.
And his opinion on him:
He, at this point, appears to be a very good contender for worst character in the game. With the very little knowledge I have of Guile and Vega, I was more able to win against the inexperienced players I was fighting. At one point I lost 13-0 to one unknown mediocre player, matches of 2/3 rounds, against his Makoto and Chun. You can take that as a testament to the lack of compatibility I have with Hakan or the glaring possibility of his inefficiency. I was able to play with him for about 3 hours straight, completing his entire trial “challenge” in about 10 minutes.
I was originally planning on maining Hakan myself, so there is no bias here. I am very displeased with what I discovered.
If Hakan is not oiled up. He is free. He has no good reversal options without oil. His 360’s range and startup is so bad Makoto was able to wildly spam all of her normals at relatively close range, seemingly without risk of being thrown out startup, extension or recovery. He is no Zangief… and not even as effective as Abel or E. Honda in terms of grappling. I was able to have some luck with his EX 360 which more than likely has hit invincibility like Abel’s command grab. I have a feeling any character who has good pressure options will destroy Hakan. His amazingly bad back dash (without oil) makes it very difficult to relieve pressure. He stays grounded for the most part and I don’t even think it moves backward out of most character’s c.jab range.
Conversely, people who can keep Hakan out will also destroy him. IE: characters with fireballs and reliable AA normals. His jump is horrible. In combination with what I’ve listed before, his low jump height will surely cause problems with other characters, possibly even worse than what‘s been currently discovered. You’ll be very, very surprised what normals will AA Hakan at the height of his jump. Ryu’s far s.FP could potentially AA him. I have a feeling Sagat’s far s.FP will shut him down completely. The sad thing is, it’s pretty slow as well, so don’t expect to surprise anyone…
Even upon being oiled up it is extremely hard to apply pressure or keep the opponent out. Jumping out of Hakan’s terribly slow throw setups bear little risk, apart from an equally risky psychic 360K or a random jumping air throw. His moves gain absurd range, but that will only cause temporary problems until players figure out how to space him, then even that is of little consequence. His focus is definitely has some intriguing possibility.
The fact he can’t FADC out of oil wracks my brain. This could possibly be the biggest contributing factor to a lot of his problems. If the Chun player I was fighting had some more skill he could have EASILY ultra’d me on reaction to any level of oil. They are all simply too slow. The simple fact Hakan can’t use oil against Chun once she has ultra makes me feel that Justin’s “0-10 match up” hyperbole could be true. Makoto could easily punish his heavy oil from full screen with EX hayate after a KD from jab 360. That was extremely frustrating, as you would expect that to be the optimal (only) situation to use heavy oil. If he were able to FADC oil he may not be nearly as horrible as he is. He could use oil buffer combos that could cancel into the very improved back dash slide, setting up for shenanigans putting him at optimal spacing for s.FP.
His only saving grace seems to be his f.RH once oiled up, s.FP, and the fact he can FADC slide from any point in the move, allowing him to get in. His s.FP remains effective without oil. Its HUGE hit arc and range are great, though only one of two hits has a tendency to connect from max range. With his tools, playing defensively seems to be his only viable option.
Maybe I just played against two of Hakan’s worst match ups, maybe I just couldn‘t figure out a damn useful thing with him in 3 hours, and worst of all maybe he actually is crap… Overall I still say you take a lot of this information with a grain of salt as there is still a lot of discovery to be had with this character and 3 hours of play testing isn’t a matter of fact. I at least hope you guys enjoyed reading!
Way too gimmicky.
Finally started the SF4 tourney here in PDX. Luckily, the guys announcing aren't the same fuckin juggalos that were gargling the mic earlier.
2 decent matchups so far.
Geek: Remixed - A Decade's worth of ruined pop culture memories
Xbox Live - Fatboy PDX
MvC2 is a hard game
thats what i use. its good enough, but you will eventually want a better stick. mainly its the buttons that arent that great. whenever i have some extra $$ im definitely going to pick up a TE, but i mean ive been rocking the fight stick 3 since SF4 came out and you know... it works.
It's not that hard, it's just fast. And a bit complex.
everyone moves so quickly and their normal attacks take up so little space
except, you know, for the guys who have giant beams as heavy punches
that's different
playing the low-end SF characters is almost entirely a different game from playing Storm/Sentinel/Cable
i am weirded out by the fact that the people playing aren't super high level
i feel like i could beat a lot of these guys
Level of play is average.
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/esc-games-360-stream
Same for me as well, though I was more than a little out of my league.
It's taunting to see people playing this so early. I kinda wish I didn't take a vacation this week. Makes the days drag longer. Oh well.
They don't seem to like any option besides "Rematch".
EDIT: There we go. Ibuki v Akuma now.
I may have let out a tiny, gleeful squeal.
He wasn't really that high on my list before but it looks like he has some really fun stuff. Also, Izuna Drop does Massive Soviet Damage.
Might have to try him out.
Yeah, it was good fun. I'm just now starting to crossup and it's working wonders when I manage it. I have a lot of trouble with certain characters though. Specifically:Honda, Gen, Chun Li and Guile. Chun Li and Guile in particular seem to be impossible to crack if they play defensively.
The red blast comes out if you do the Ultra out of throw range. It does significantly less damage.