[Supernatural]: This is why we can't have nice things, Sam.

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  • DarkWarriorDarkWarrior __BANNED USERS
    edited May 2010
    Reznik wrote: »
    Ive also got to call out the stupidity of their plan. Dean has BEEN to a future where Sam said Yes and it did not end well for Future Dean. Where was Sam to hold him back then?

    Do we know that was the actual future and not Zachariah engineering a situation to push Dean towards saying yes to Michael?

    You basically can't trust anything the angels have said on this show.

    Seeing how things are working out, i.e. Castiel, and how they have obvious control over time, I wouldn't be very surprised if it was real. It doesn;'t even matter that much, Sam might have good in him but only last episode they were going on about what a raging prick he is and at the end of the day he is just a vessel and even in extreme circumstances, before Bobby, I've never seen anyone break possession and thats just regular Black-Eyed demons.

    DarkWarrior on
  • LanzLanz Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    Reznik wrote: »
    Ive also got to call out the stupidity of their plan. Dean has BEEN to a future where Sam said Yes and it did not end well for Future Dean. Where was Sam to hold him back then?

    Do we know that was the actual future and not Zachariah engineering a situation to push Dean towards saying yes to Michael?

    You basically can't trust anything the angels have said on this show.

    He seems to be forgetting that Sam's yes in that timeline was hinted at being A) Completely alone and B) from when he and Dean were split up. Basically, Sam caved.

    In this instance, Sam saying "Yes" wouldn't be caving into becoming a vessel, but setting himself up as a trap. The difference is in the will to fight.

    Lanz on
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  • Bionic MonkeyBionic Monkey Registered User, ClubPA
    edited May 2010
    Ive also got to call out the stupidity of their plan. Dean has BEEN to a future where Sam said Yes and it did not end well for Future Dean. Where was Sam to hold him back then?

    Did you forget the whole plot point that they'd abandoned each other, and in despair that's why Sam said yes?

    Frankly, your constant whining about this season is getting old. I think it's been fucking fantastic, and some of us like the stand-alone episodes.

    Bionic Monkey on
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  • WishpigWishpig Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    Cade wrote: »
    Why would Death be be the big bad next season?

    To him such little things like Lucifer is doing is beneath him, as he pointed out this was just one planet in one galaxy and to him people were like dust basically.

    He's beyond being a bad guy, he's something else entirely.

    If he's telling the truth... you can't picture him playing Dean for a fool? We don't know anything about him besides the fact he claims to be the big man on campus. Supernatural has had plenty of plot twists and shit you generally don't see coming. With Death being such a damn awesome character I can totally picture them coming up with a way to keep him around. It may be tricky if he really is what he claims, but it's the writer's world to mold.
    Ive also got to call out the stupidity of their plan. Dean has BEEN to a future where Sam said Yes and it did not end well for Future Dean. Where was Sam to hold him back then?

    Did you forget the whole plot point that they'd abandoned each other, and in despair that's why Sam said yes?

    Frankly, your constant whining about this season is getting old. I think it's been fucking fantastic, and some of us like the stand-alone episodes.

    Most people think it's fuckin fantastic, I have seen very little negative feedback.

    And while I'm no fan of stand-alone episodes in any series, Supernatural's pacing feels perfect.



    Question... are the horsemen dead? What happened after they were defeated?

    Wishpig on
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  • ArkasArkas Registered User
    edited May 2010
    Supernatural is the one show where I like standalone episodes better than plot episodes. Which is why I'm so psyched about season 6.

    And the demon-guy from Stanford said something about how the other two horsemen were alive but were basically comatose and useless. All their power comes from their rings (at least in the case of the 3 non-death dudes).


    EDIT:
    Warcry wrote: »
    Bethryn wrote: »
    Wonder what happened to the real Loki.

    That was Gabriel all along. God I loved that character.

    It's up to 2300, you never know...!

    Getting a Trickster episode in season 6 would seriously make my year.

    Arkas on
  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    yeah it sure seems like death didn't fit in with the other horsemen, who were fairly weak and called each other brothers

    death seemed to rank higher than anything we've seen in the show, including archangels

    if they were all even close to equivalent, war should have been making countries fire nukes with a wave of his hand, pestilence should have been making everyone on the continent puke their guts out, and famine should have dried up every farm and turned every grocery store aisle to dust in the hemisphere

    Evil Multifarious on
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  • DarkWarriorDarkWarrior __BANNED USERS
    edited May 2010
    Ive also got to call out the stupidity of their plan. Dean has BEEN to a future where Sam said Yes and it did not end well for Future Dean. Where was Sam to hold him back then?

    Did you forget the whole plot point that they'd abandoned each other, and in despair that's why Sam said yes?

    Frankly, your constant whining about this season is getting old. I think it's been fucking fantastic, and some of us like the stand-alone episodes.

    And yet they had years of being brothers before hand and this didn't perk Sam up inside Lucifer to stop him snapping his brothers neck. Whats your point?

    Stand alone episodes are fine but when the apocalypse is going on, them serving the greater arc or being comparatively LARGE would be somewhat beneficial. You can like stand-alone episodes all you want but you cannot deny they've come at the expense of actually impressive Horsemen and real character development for the latter half of this season. We had setup for Pestilence, episode about viruses associated with Pestilence but no Pestilence then Pestilence who gets owned in 2 minutes and posed less threat than the weird monster in the psychiatric ward a few episodes ago. I was sucking this shows goose before the break so lets not get confused and think I just hate on this show because. And its not whining, Im giving my opinion on an episode by episode basis, that they're failing to impress lately and squandering all their potential is not my fault.

    DarkWarrior on
  • WishpigWishpig Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    Ive also got to call out the stupidity of their plan. Dean has BEEN to a future where Sam said Yes and it did not end well for Future Dean. Where was Sam to hold him back then?

    Did you forget the whole plot point that they'd abandoned each other, and in despair that's why Sam said yes?

    Frankly, your constant whining about this season is getting old. I think it's been fucking fantastic, and some of us like the stand-alone episodes.

    And yet they had years of being brothers before hand and this didn't perk Sam up inside Lucifer to stop him snapping his brothers neck. Whats your point?

    Disliking the show is all fine and good and your points are legit, except for this one...

    Lucifer had been inside Sam for a while, Sam is long gone when he snaps Dean's neck. Furthermore, in the future, everyone ditched Sam, I'm sure that pushed him over the deep end. Now Cass, Dean, and Bobby are all in his corner and have got his back. Having the people he care's about have FAITH in him, well, that will most certainly have a major effect on him!

    Wishpig on
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  • DarkWarriorDarkWarrior __BANNED USERS
    edited May 2010
    Wishpig wrote: »
    Ive also got to call out the stupidity of their plan. Dean has BEEN to a future where Sam said Yes and it did not end well for Future Dean. Where was Sam to hold him back then?

    Did you forget the whole plot point that they'd abandoned each other, and in despair that's why Sam said yes?

    Frankly, your constant whining about this season is getting old. I think it's been fucking fantastic, and some of us like the stand-alone episodes.

    And yet they had years of being brothers before hand and this didn't perk Sam up inside Lucifer to stop him snapping his brothers neck. Whats your point?

    Disliking the show is all fine and good and your points are legit, except for this one...

    Lucifer had been inside Sam for a while, Sam is long gone when he snaps Dean's neck. Furthermore, in the future, everyone ditched Sam, I'm sure that pushed him over the deep end. Now Cass, Dean, and Bobby are all in his corner and have got his back. Having the people he care's about have FAITH in him, well, that will most certainly have a major effect on him!

    I do get the point but this is more info thats never been clarified. Demons possess humans, they can leave and they're fine. Angels the same.

    Archangels though burn through the hosts unless they have a perfect one and even then, once they leave the body may be alive but the mind is destroyed, seemingly anyway. But no time frame is given for any of this but Sam, of all people, who can barely withstand the temptation of demon blood, overcoming the archangel who defied God? Even if its 3 seconds in I'd call foul on that but I doubt this is what will happen considering the amount of setup for it.

    There are other things like reviving the third Winchester brother and making him a valid vessel for Michael while Sam is only valid for Lucifer (Yes demon blood) but why does Lucifers vessel need demon blood to survive when hes quite clearly not demonic at all and yet Michaels does not? Add in the ring solution and it just seems like they started making shit up at some point, throwing in demon blood with possession to further tempt Sam and throwing in the third Winchester and making him a valid vessel just because.

    I might be misremembering but didn't Zach say he wasn't really a vessel? It was just to tempt Dean? But Cas seems to think he is valid.

    Would liked to have seen more of Lucifers legendary temptations and corruption as well.

    DarkWarrior on
  • Venkman90Venkman90 Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    I recently read I Lucifer by Glenn Duncan (really recommend it) and I would have liked to see the slightly more tempting devil as well, he can give you anything you desire and he only wants your pesky soul.

    I also like (in that book) the hints that Hell is a great place really, why torture souls? he just wants to lure them away from God to piss him off.

    Venkman90 on
  • SloSlo Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    More Cass gold! Yes!

    Slo on
  • Venkman90Venkman90 Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    That was as slice of fried gold right there.

    Venkman90 on
  • bloodatonementbloodatonement Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    So this is the end of Supernatural, wow, it's been a good ride. Correction, a great ride. Such a great show and such a great soundtrack. I'll take a soundtrack box set now. Once the season 5 DVD comes out, this will be the only show I have the complete set of on dvd (Firefly doesn't count). I want to get back on the ride again, I wonder if I can talk my wife in to restarting the show from the beginning.

    Man, I'm gonna miss this show.
    That could (should? depending on your views on extending the show beyond its planned run) have been the a serious post

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  • MagicPrimeMagicPrime FiresideWizard Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    I think the transition to the next season will be alright.

    There was a significant change of gears between the 2nd and 3rd season. And that turned out all right.

    MagicPrime on
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  • ReznikReznik Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    I'm cautiously optimistic about the next season, if only because I think Kripke's 'five year plan' was little more than a couple plot points scrawled on a napkin given how certain things have played out.

    Also, the lady taking over has been with the show from the start and Kripke gave her the top spot after she told him her idea for a season 6 arc.

    At any rate, it can't be worse than Buffy season 6, and I managed to soldier through that...

    Reznik on
    Do... Re.... Mi... Ti... La...
    Do... Re... Mi... So... Fa.... Do... Re.... Do...
    Forget it...
  • CadeCade Eppur si muove.Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
  • WarcryWarcry Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    That's doesn't tell me anything, Mark Pellegrino!

    Warcry on
  • bloodatonementbloodatonement Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    Warcry wrote: »
    That's doesn't tell me anything, Mark Pellegrino!

    Except a Lost spoiler. Arrrg!

    bloodatonement on
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  • WarcryWarcry Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    Christ almighty I hate Lost. The best example of bad writing I know.

    Warcry on
  • amateurhouramateurhour One day I'll be professionalhour The woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered User regular
    edited May 2010
    So wait, is tonight or next week the season finale?

    amateurhour on

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  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    So wait, is tonight or next week the season finale?

    Tonight.

    Preacher on
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  • LanzLanz Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    Was... was...
    Was Chuck... God? ohdearh.png
    ^Finale spoiler

    Lanz on
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  • ReznikReznik Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    Well! That was excellent.

    And now the hellatus until s6.
    Chuck is God, then? Huh.

    Cas molotoving Michael was brilliant. His return and departure felt a little weak after going out with a bang like he did, but I suppose it makes sense that he would be rewarded in the end.

    Jared Padalecki is awesome as Lucifer, especially when he lost his cool near the end. Kinda sad Lucifer's gone, now.

    The dun dun dunnn shot at the end of the ep is interesting. I'm gonna have to watch it again to see if I can get a better read of Sam's face. There's going to be so much speculation.

    Reznik on
    Do... Re.... Mi... Ti... La...
    Do... Re... Mi... So... Fa.... Do... Re.... Do...
    Forget it...
  • cr0wcr0w Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    edited May 2010
    I'd say based on that, it's entirely possible.

    This was pretty much the best season finale ever. It would have been the perfect series finale, too. I can't remember the last TV show I watched that had my heart racing like that.

    cr0w on
  • AeolusdallasAeolusdallas Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    So this is the end of Supernatural, wow, it's been a good ride. Correction, a great ride. Such a great show and such a great soundtrack. I'll take a soundtrack box set now. Once the season 5 DVD comes out, this will be the only show I have the complete set of on dvd (Firefly doesn't count). I want to get back on the ride again, I wonder if I can talk my wife in to restarting the show from the beginning.

    Man, I'm gonna miss this show.
    That could (should? depending on your views on extending the show beyond its planned run) have been the a serious post

    They have at least one more season. This would have been the series finale IF it had not been renewed. It's also how they wanted to end it. But the ratings and Demographics were just to good

    Aeolusdallas on
  • LynxLynx Registered User
    edited May 2010
    Best part of the episode?
    Hey. . .Assbutt!

    But, seriously, wow. Pretty amazing. Not sure what's up with everything:
    Is Chuck God? How did Sam come back? Is Cas now an Archangel? And what the fuck is next season going to be about?!

    Definitely a great finale, though.

    Lynx on
  • A Dabble Of TheloniusA Dabble Of Thelonius It has been a doozy of a dayRegistered User regular
    edited May 2010
    Damn. That was great.

    A Dabble Of Thelonius on
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  • ReznikReznik Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    Finale spoilers, s6 speculation
    Wait, what's up with Sam?

    - He 'came back wrong' (likely?)
    How wrong?
    Evil? (possibly. The shattering light was ominous. The finale was kind of his redemption, though...)
    Amnesiac? (he tracked down Dean, so probably not?)
    ????? (seriously, what? That expression was really hard to pin down)
    - He's still Lucifer (unlikely, since this was supposed to wrap it all up)
    - The shattering light was just a result of his resurrection, and doesn't mean anything other than a power (God) brought him back
    If he's normal, then what's up with the ominousness?
    - He went totally badass and clawed his way out of hell (maybe. The last few episodes were rather kind to Sam. But no, they wouldn't do that.)
    - He has powers, either he's still super hopped up on the gallons of blood he chugged, or it's something new (ehh... probably not)

    Also
    Assbutt.

    Reznik on
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    Do... Re... Mi... So... Fa.... Do... Re.... Do...
    Forget it...
  • BolthornBolthorn Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    Well, will this quiet the people that were pissed because they didn't think it could be wrapped up in time? I think for this show (and its budget) the finale worked quite well. I'll be back next season.
    Have to see what's up with
    Chuck hopefully. Seriously, was he God or do prophets just vanish when they're done writing their Testament?
    And of course, what's up with Sam?
    And Bobby, does he still need to get his soul back?
    Is Castiel gone for good? I thought the actor said he was coming back in season 6.


    And I usually hate voice overs, but the ones in this episode were damn hard to complain about.

    Bolthorn on
  • LynxLynx Registered User
    edited May 2010
    Bolthorn wrote: »
    Well, will this quiet the people that were pissed because they didn't think it could be wrapped up in time? I think for this show (and its budget) the finale worked quite well. I'll be back next season.
    Have to see what's up with
    Chuck hopefully. Seriously, was he God or do prophets just vanish when they're done writing their Testament?
    And of course, what's up with Sam?
    And Bobby, does he still need to get his soul back?
    Is Castiel gone for good? I thought the actor said he was coming back in season 6.


    And I usually hate voice overs, but the ones in this episode were damn hard to complain about.

    The voice over made sense, considering who was doing it.
    As for all of your spoilers, they're all great plot hooks for Season 6. I'm actually fairly excited for the new season. If they go searching for God, it'd be a great denouement for the series.

    Lynx on
  • Look Out it's Sabs!Look Out it's Sabs! Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    This best I can think of for the end is that
    Sam checking up on Dean but not wanting to let him know he is back since Dean now has the family life he always wanted.

    Look Out it's Sabs! on
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  • Professor PhobosProfessor Phobos Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    I personally...
    Hope Chuck wasn't supposed to be God- that doesn't really jive with his previous appearances, and the character is more interesting as just this nobody who happens to become a prophet. Prophets usually raptured up when they were done, so that just as easily explains his disappearance. Also, "search for God" is a suitably epic follow-up to "fight the devil" for season six, I think, so I'm hoping God is the remaining "big question." Also nice symmetry- season 1 was "Find our father", season six is "Find our father..."

    Professor Phobos on
  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    This best I can think of for the end is that
    Sam checking up on Dean but not wanting to let him know he is back since Dean now has the family life he always wanted.

    Yes I agree with your spoiler, perhaps.

    Sam is aware of something horrible coming (an insurrection from hell now that lucifer is back in the pit?) and he needs dean. So now the conflict would be dean wanting to be left alone and sam telling him they have to hunt?

    Preacher on
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  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    Regarding chuck...

    That was the not so subtle exit of Kripke, I don't think that was supposed to be god, more that chuck knew his time was up (he had one final drink) and his story was over. One last shot for the road and away he went.

    Idle speculation of course.

    Preacher on
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  • HounHoun Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    There were some excellent music choices in this ep. I threw the horns. You all know when.

    As for the finale, eh, it wasn't bad. Left more questions than it answered, and the pacing felt odd to me. Not bad, though.

    Houn on
  • Bionic MonkeyBionic Monkey Registered User, ClubPA
    edited May 2010
    "Castiel, did you just throw a molotov at my brother?"

    "Uh... no?"

    Bionic Monkey on
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  • HounHoun Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    I'm tempted to quote your failure, and preserve your shame, but I won't.

    Houn on
  • Bionic MonkeyBionic Monkey Registered User, ClubPA
    edited May 2010
    I still have no idea what the fuck I was doing wrong. I had to use the auto tags to fix it. Odd.

    Bionic Monkey on
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  • HounHoun Registered User regular
    edited May 2010
    It appeared to me you forgot the / in the closing [/spoiler]

    Houn on
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