Garlic Breadi'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm aRegistered User, Disagreeableregular
edited September 2010
apparently since Diamond delays shipments a day due to holidays, DC's digital store is delaying comics until Thursday.
you know what's great about digital comics? not having to worry about shipping them
Justice League: Generation Lost has been put up on the store as soon as it hits shops, but I guess we don't want to give digital comics an advantage over comic shops
wouldn't want them to look outdated or anything
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sportzboytjwsqueeeeeezzeeeesome more tax breaks outRegistered Userregular
What do you consider long running though, especially in this era of the industry? Steel and Black Panther both got to #50 once, BP got to 42 issues two series ago, those are healthy runs, and is something that would be on the higher end of expectations for any B-list hero.
Not to mention series like 100 Bullets, Scalped, and Green Lantern that either starred or heavily featured minorities. i think we have a ways to go, but it's not unviable to do well.
sportzboytjw on
Walkerdog on MTGO
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
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mojojoeoA block off the park, living the dream.Registered Userregular
edited September 2010
So like Spawn 199 tomorrow, almost a milestone... what uh..... what's Spawn up to these days? things?
<< this seemed like the appropriate place for the question given spawns history >>
mojojoeo on
Chief Wiggum: "Ladies, please. All our founding fathers, astronauts, and World Series heroes have been either drunk or on cocaine."
im bitching about comic book prices. i know most books have been 3.99 for several months now, but its finally starting to affect me enough financially that im gonna have to drop birds of prey, booster, red robin, and star wars old republic immediately, plus cap and iron man soon. that blows, considering im still getting OMIT and BD (even though they suck) because i consider them required reading for characters i care about. i may drop generation lost even though its been better recently, and kevin smiths green hornet because it just doesnt seem to matter.
You really don't have a right to bitch. You're dropping books you enjoy, and that are genrally considered to be of pretty good quality, and keeping two books that you don't enjoy at all. This is why we can't have nice things.
apparently since Diamond delays shipments a day due to holidays, DC's digital store is delaying comics until Thursday.
you know what's great about digital comics? not having to worry about shipping them
Justice League: Generation Lost has been put up on the store as soon as it hits shops, but I guess we don't want to give digital comics an advantage over comic shops
wouldn't want them to look outdated or anything
Doing this seems to concede defeat in terms of pirating, as I'm sure there's a way some people have hacked the digital store files that Comixology has to get the pages online.
I can't believe they didn't think about the other side of it; with all the books delayed a day, having GL sit there on the digital store would be a pretty tempting thing for people to purchase, just sitting there all by its lonesome. Sugah.
im bitching about comic book prices. i know most books have been 3.99 for several months now, but its finally starting to affect me enough financially that im gonna have to drop birds of prey, booster, red robin, and star wars old republic immediately, plus cap and iron man soon. that blows, considering im still getting OMIT and BD (even though they suck) because i consider them required reading for characters i care about. i may drop generation lost even though its been better recently, and kevin smiths green hornet because it just doesnt seem to matter.
You really don't have a right to bitch. You're dropping books you enjoy, and that are genrally considered to be of pretty good quality, and keeping two books that you don't enjoy at all. This is why we can't have nice things.
Seriously, are you broken? "This sucks, but it's required reading" is insane. Comics aren't fucking homework.
Read things you enjoy, while you enjoy them. It costs nothing to Wiki whatever the shitty arc altered, and it doesn't support idea you dislike.
durandal4532 on
Do what you can to elect Harris/Walz and downticket Dem candidates in your area by doorknocking, phonebanking, or postcarding: https://www.mobilize.us/
im bitching about comic book prices. i know most books have been 3.99 for several months now, but its finally starting to affect me enough financially that im gonna have to drop birds of prey, booster, red robin, and star wars old republic immediately, plus cap and iron man soon. that blows, considering im still getting OMIT and BD (even though they suck) because i consider them required reading for characters i care about. i may drop generation lost even though its been better recently, and kevin smiths green hornet because it just doesnt seem to matter.
You really don't have a right to bitch. You're dropping books you enjoy, and that are genrally considered to be of pretty good quality, and keeping two books that you don't enjoy at all. This is why we can't have nice things.
Seriously, are you broken? "This sucks, but it's required reading" is insane. Comics aren't fucking homework.
Read things you enjoy, while you enjoy them. It costs nothing to Wiki whatever the shitty arc altered, and it doesn't support idea you dislike.
i mean, youre both kind of right, but im dropping stuff like iron man and booster because they arent as good as they used to be. i dont absolutely hate them, but they obviously arent good enough in my mind to compete with the GL books and such. As far as OMIT goes, its only one more issue, and i want to keep buying ASM because i love the character, regardless of whether a particular arc is good. i can stick it through 3 or 4 issues. and my bitch was just as much aimed at myself as it was at comics.
as far as trade-waiting goes, i will definitely keep that in mind, but i feel like trade-waiting for everything takes some of the fun out of reading comics, which is getting a piece of the story every month as it builds to something. i read trades of the complete JMS ASM run, ultimate spiderman, ultimate xmen, and geoff johns flash run, so its not like i wont do it if i have to. probably for stuff like Iron Man.
and brightest day doesnt totally suck, but everything always seems worse when i come to this thread...
That's why I provided the Kon-El Superboy and Impulse (both spin-off characters of icons, like Steel) runs as additional examples of white male leads having longer runs, in roughly the same time-frame.
Really, I don't think it's all down to race. But people generally want to read about people who they identify with, if only on a superficial level, and most comic readers are white males. Personally, I think it's silly, but it's a pervading thought in the entertainment industry.
Back when DC was talking about how finally, with the introduction of Blue Beetle III and Atom IV, Hispanics and Asians would have their own superheroes, I said I thought that was bullshit. Because I think, for the most part, people want to identify with experiences, not skin color. I don't identify with Bruce Wayne just because he's a white guy. But Ted Kord? A dude who had weight problems as a kid, and went on to become a nerdy adult that likes to make stuff in his garage? As an overweight, nerdy kid that liked building and tinkering with stuff, that was a dude I could identify with.
But on the flipside of that, I've heard quite a few black/asian/gay/handicapped comic fans say that they like having someone who's in some way representative of them in comics.
Manga is about Japanese people and is typically set in Tokyo or other parts of Japan and routinely makes use of decidedly Japanese references and jokes, yet is quite popular in North America still. By your logic, all manga should have a hard time selling to a non-Japanese audience that can't associate with it.
Naruto and Edward Elric are both fair skinned and blonde, and hail from fictional locales, the former of which admittedly draws on both Chinese and Japanese mythology and aesthetic. Monkey D. Luffy, and most of the cast of One Piece, are also depicted as pretty racially ambiguous, with characters like Nami looking pretty Caucasian. Spike Spiegel? Vash the Stampede? Most of these characters are drawn ambiguously enough that they could be Caucasian or Asian, and exist in locations that don't make heavy use of Japanese culture or identity.
Interestingly, I recently read something that discussed how Japanese viewers of anime and manga do identify the characters as Asian, even when they have typically non-Asian features. It makes me wonder if American kids that read manga identify the protagonists as being of their own race and culture.
Interestingly, I recently read something that discussed how Japanese viewers of anime and manga do identify the characters as Asian, even when they have typically non-Asian features. It makes me wonder if American kids that read manga identify the protagonists as being of their own race and culture.
Everyone has always insisted to me that the big round eyes are a Mickey Mouse universal-appeal thing and not a faux-Caucasian thing, although I dunno to what extent that's true.
The only anime and manga series I really care about is One Piece, and maybe Berserk I guess. I don't know, now that they've shut down most of the manga scan sites maybe I should start buying One Piece again. Problem is though I already have way too many damn trades, and each OP volume is 10 bucks retail. Now true that is a lot cheaper than both Marvel and DC trades (except maybe some Vertigo stuff) but considering there are over 50 OP volumes that shit adds up quickly, even with the first half only priced at 8 retail.
Edit: Maybe AWA will have some nice manga dealers who'll price everything half off. And have plenty of OP volumes.
Interestingly, I recently read something that discussed how Japanese viewers of anime and manga do identify the characters as Asian, even when they have typically non-Asian features. It makes me wonder if American kids that read manga identify the protagonists as being of their own race and culture.
Everyone has always insisted to me that the big round eyes are a Mickey Mouse universal-appeal thing and not a faux-Caucasian thing, although I dunno to what extent that's true.
Very true. Osamu Tezuka was inspired by Walt Disney and pretty much everyone since him has been adopting parts of his style, like the eyes.
Interestingly, I recently read something that discussed how Japanese viewers of anime and manga do identify the characters as Asian, even when they have typically non-Asian features. It makes me wonder if American kids that read manga identify the protagonists as being of their own race and culture.
Everyone has always insisted to me that the big round eyes are a Mickey Mouse universal-appeal thing and not a faux-Caucasian thing, although I dunno to what extent that's true.
It's a cartooning thing. With less "realism" and more broad, vaguer, cartoony shapes, people are more easily able to project themselves (and therefor their race) onto a character.
Back when DC was talking about how finally, with the introduction of Blue Beetle III and Atom IV, Hispanics and Asians would have their own superheroes, I said I thought that was bullshit. Because I think, for the most part, people want to identify with experiences, not skin color. I don't identify with Bruce Wayne just because he's a white guy. But Ted Kord? A dude who had weight problems as a kid, and went on to become a nerdy adult that likes to make stuff in his garage? As an overweight, nerdy kid that liked building and tinkering with stuff, that was a dude I could identify with.
I agree slightly, in that experiences are more important than what hue the colorist selects in photoshop, but often the race of a character should inform what kind of experience the character has. That's why it doesn't work when you just give a minority character a generic Hal Jordan-esque personality. It doesn't have to be the central theme, but it has to have some impact on their experience.
I think you not identifying with Bruce Wayne because he's a white male also has something to do with the identity of whiteness and its less defined, more default place in our social consciousness. While being a nerd, or a punk rocker, or a gamer, or a cheerleader, are all suitable identities that can be reflected in comics, so should be being an Asian male (with a size changing science belt)
Interestingly, I recently read something that discussed how Japanese viewers of anime and manga do identify the characters as Asian, even when they have typically non-Asian features. It makes me wonder if American kids that read manga identify the protagonists as being of their own race and culture.
What are you defining as "typically non-Asian features" though? Cause I think you'll find that those features aren't exactly what the Japanese would consider their defining features.
I generally agree with your point though, that people follow characters they're similar to because it's easier to identify with them. I'd probably say that's the reason why so many people are so dumb when it comes to Superman and out-right refuse to like him even though they've no fucking clue what they're talking about.
TheSecretSeventh: Wait, you don't think Booster Gold is as good as it used to be and like GL more than it? Ugh. Ugh. But Jurgens' run on Booster was laughable and Johns' writing hasn't been remotely good for like at least a year.
I agree slightly, in that experiences are more important than what hue the colorist selects in photoshop, but often the race of a character should inform what kind of experience the character has. That's why it doesn't work when you just give a minority character a generic Hal Jordan-esque personality. It doesn't have to be the central theme, but it has to have some impact on their experience.
Definitely. But a black kid that grew up in rural Alabama on a farm, is not going to be the same as a black kid that grew up in Detroit. Race informs experience, but location, income level, education, etc. have just as great an impact.
What are you defining as "typically non-Asian features" though? Cause I think you'll find that those features aren't exactly what the Japanese would consider their defining features.
One of the most popular characters (especially outside of Japan) in Naruto right now is a black guy
Discuss.
I'm going to be honest, I had to do some Googling to figure out who you're talking about, but I guess it's this dude? Who apparently behaves like an urban stereotype, and often breaks into rhyme? Really, being that I haven't seen the character in the work itself, and that I'm not exactly in touch with the Naruto fanbase, I can't really make any kind of informed statement on him.
That's why I provided the Kon-El Superboy and Impulse (both spin-off characters of icons, like Steel) runs as additional examples of white male leads having longer runs, in roughly the same time-frame.
Really, I don't think it's all down to race. But people generally want to read about people who they identify with, if only on a superficial level, and most comic readers are white males. Personally, I think it's silly, but it's a pervading thought in the entertainment industry.
Back when DC was talking about how finally, with the introduction of Blue Beetle III and Atom IV, Hispanics and Asians would have their own superheroes, I said I thought that was bullshit. Because I think, for the most part, people want to identify with experiences, not skin color. I don't identify with Bruce Wayne just because he's a white guy. But Ted Kord? A dude who had weight problems as a kid, and went on to become a nerdy adult that likes to make stuff in his garage? As an overweight, nerdy kid that liked building and tinkering with stuff, that was a dude I could identify with.
But on the flipside of that, I've heard quite a few black/asian/gay/handicapped comic fans say that they like having someone who's in some way representative of them in comics.
Manga is about Japanese people and is typically set in Tokyo or other parts of Japan and routinely makes use of decidedly Japanese references and jokes, yet is quite popular in North America still. By your logic, all manga should have a hard time selling to a non-Japanese audience that can't associate with it.
I don't know how to correctly articulate this, but Japan has a very strong cultural appeal to many Americans. I mean, we even have the term weaboo or whatever to identify people who are deeply interested in Japanese culture. I think there's a strong enough difference there to say that people are attracted to manga for the opposite reasons Munch is talking about. Specifically because they represent (in general, obviously not ever manga incorporates Japanese culture etc.) a culture that is different from their own.
Which makes it an exception, not the rule (I think).
I read Flash Rebirth and outside of bringing a couple of cool characters back, it was terribad. Barry Allen's gritty new origin is idiotic and as a character he's even more boring than Hal Jordan, which is saying a lot.
How many blue and pink haired Asian people are there? Cause those colours are used in anime's as well, so I really wouldn't use hair colour as much of a decider. [vidurl=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKTvFhRbBt8]This is a silly video[/vidurl] but it does explain a few things decently.
Edit: Forgot to use vidurl tags, stupid embedding.
TexiKenDammit!That fish really got me!Registered Userregular
edited September 2010
The last issue of OMIT, kind of, I don't know, just that Quesada tried to make MJ be some unrealistic great person who would end a relationship like that. And quite a few reused OMD pages at the end.
She basically says to go live his life and maybe he'll find the right person ("or maybe he already met her" ooooh playing coy hyuck hyuck seriously who says that in ending a relationship?) and then Peter swings off saying it's a "Brand New Day!" three years too late.
Really bad message, probably one of the more visual "Marriage weighs you down" messages I've seen since this whole thing happened.
I get the feeling Waid gave him some ideas from his 1998 Superman pitch about breaking up Clark and Lois, it just kind of kept appearing in my head when I read the issue.
edit: The thing is, if they actually ended the Back in Black stuff with a story like this (and not so heavy handed from Quesada), it would have been more bearable than the crap OMD was and maybe people would have been more accepting of the new status quo. But it's just mashing something bad on top of something terrible and expecting that it wraps everything up, and you can't build on such a poopy foundation without that smell always being there.
I read through the end in the store, and could feel my blood pressure spike.
I don't know if it's just because I read Spider-Man a lot as a kid, but I have a strangely emotional connection to the whole Spider-Man/Mary Jane relationship, which honestly precludes me from reading any Brand New Day stuff, without wanting to hurl it into the garbage.
I read through the end in the store, and could feel my blood pressure spike.
I don't know if it's just because I read Spider-Man a lot as a kid, but I have a strangely emotional connection to the whole Spider-Man/Mary Jane relationship, which honestly precludes me from reading any Brand New Day stuff, without wanting to hurl it into the garbage.
But Munch, marriage weighs you down! He's free now, he even got her blessing! She basically gave him a condom and said "go hit some Jackpots, tiger!"
If they ever just got rid of OMD and put them back in their marriage the next issue without any context or warning, I would start picking up ASM again. I just can't do it with the current status quo, even if Peter Tomasi wrote it and Chris Giarrusso drew it.
Really, it sounds to me that this whole thing is the story Quesada wanted to tell from the start, and that he only resorted to using a supernatural explanation because the audience would find it more believable than a normal separation caused by stress, trauma, and simple pragmatism.
I mean, Kingpin going after MJ could have just as easily happened after Back in Black, and the rest could have followed as well. The only difference is that you'd need some mention of a no-contest divorce as opposed to MJ simply going on the lam.
Furthermore, MJ's reasons for leaving Peter are shown in the best light, and it's never indicated that either of them feel something has gone terribly wrong at some point in their relationship. As such, the conclusion reads like a natural ending to their years together, not the result of Satanic meddling. Unless Quesada genuinely believes they should be apart, his decision to approach things this way makes no sense.
Unfortunately for the narrative, the prior use of Mephisto makes it impossible to share Quesada's view. No matter how hard he tries to make the separation appear reasonable, we can't quite forget the fact that it, at least as far as the narrative is concerned, wasn't supposed to happen.
I actually came away feeling kind of pissed off at everything I bought this week, with the exception of Booster Gold.
Batman and Robin basically had the same scene play out twice, the stuff with Professor Pyg was incomprehensible, and the big Robin/Joker confrontation at the start fails to pay off in the issue. Maybe it's just because it feels like it's been a really long time since I read the previous issue, but I felt lost during most of this thing.
Generation Lost is officially dragging what should be twelve issues out to twenty-five, with the heroes coming off as more and more incompetent every step of the way. They're hunting down a guy they know was able to mind-control of Superman, yet none of them have put any kind of countermeasure into effect to neutralize his powers. It's ridiculous, and makes a team of intelligent and experienced heroes look like bumbling pre-schoolers.
Doom Patrol is just too many plot threads being spun together at once, with none of them really paying off so much as petering out. It feels like nothing ever gets resolved in this book, almost like Giffen gets bored halfway through exploring an idea, and just moves onto something else.
And Irredeemable is just pages upon pages of Waid finding reasons not to end the fucking thing. Last issue hooked me back in, and this one completely destroyed that goodwill.
However, Booster Gold has Ted Kord getting turned into a super-intelligent squirrel in a Blue Beetle costume, and a guest appearance by a character I rather like, so that was nice. The only major problem I had with it was that Olliffe filled in for Batista, and while his work's perfectly fine, Batista's a large part of the appeal for me.
Furthermore, MJ's reasons for leaving Peter are shown in the best light, and it's never indicated that either of them feel something has gone terribly wrong at some point in their relationship. As such, the conclusion reads like a natural ending to their years together, not the result of Satanic meddling. Unless Quesada genuinely believes they should be apart, his decision to approach things this way makes no sense.
Honestly the way it was just ret-conned seems almost even worse than "The devil did it!"
Unless I read it wrong, Dr. Strange, Reed Richards, and Tony Stark are now super-villains who can shape and change the world on a whim. And not only that, they did it easily, it took what? Five minutes to come up with that plan to erase the memories of the entire world? Based on their biased feelings for one man's hardships?
"Aw shucks, we really did screw pete over a bit kind of. Let's not take the mature and responsible path and try and help him by offering protection or aid. No, let's change the course of human history, what could possibly go wrong?"
That's usually the kind of set up that comes back to bite people in the ass. But because this was an "editorial decision" you know it won't. I mean, civil war started because of a reality show mishap that ended up in an elementary school dead. This was a conscious decision by some of the most powerful men in the Marvel Universe with a haphazard plan formulated in less than 10 minutes that "infected" the entire world.
Yet, one action caused the Hero community to almost tear itself in two, whereas the other is basically a cliff note in history.
Furthermore, MJ's reasons for leaving Peter are shown in the best light, and it's never indicated that either of them feel something has gone terribly wrong at some point in their relationship. As such, the conclusion reads like a natural ending to their years together, not the result of Satanic meddling. Unless Quesada genuinely believes they should be apart, his decision to approach things this way makes no sense.
Honestly the way it was just ret-conned seems almost even worse than "The devil did it!"
Unless I read it wrong, Dr. Strange, Reed Richards, and Tony Stark are now super-villains who can shape and change the world on a whim. And not only that, they did it easily, it took what? Five minutes to come up with that plan to erase the memories of the entire world? Based on their biased feelings for one man's hardships?
"Aw shucks, we really did screw pete over a bit kind of. Let's not take the mature and responsible path and try and help him by offering protection or aid. No, let's change the course of human history, what could possibly go wrong?"
That's usually the kind of set up that comes back to bite people in the ass. But because this was an "editorial decision" you know it won't. I mean, civil war started because of a reality show mishap that ended up in an elementary school dead. This was a conscious decision by some of the most powerful men in the Marvel Universe with a haphazard plan formulated in less than 10 minutes that "infected" the entire world.
Yet, one action caused the Hero community to almost tear itself in two, whereas the other is basically a cliff note in history.
It bugs me.
I agree. It should've taken something along the lines of the Scarlet Witch + Professor X + Dr. Strange + Magneto + Quicksilver = House of M. We are talking about shaping reality here.
And the sucky part is, you know MJ and Peter are going to get back together again. Mary Jane has grown into iconic status; she's not a character you can easily ditch.
Oh, and Daredevil is getting "Reborn" in 2011. I hope they don't do a renumbering thing. Resetting the numbering is developing into one of my pet peeves.
Furthermore, MJ's reasons for leaving Peter are shown in the best light, and it's never indicated that either of them feel something has gone terribly wrong at some point in their relationship. As such, the conclusion reads like a natural ending to their years together, not the result of Satanic meddling. Unless Quesada genuinely believes they should be apart, his decision to approach things this way makes no sense.
Honestly the way it was just ret-conned seems almost even worse than "The devil did it!"
Unless I read it wrong, Dr. Strange, Reed Richards, and Tony Stark are now super-villains who can shape and change the world on a whim. And not only that, they did it easily, it took what? Five minutes to come up with that plan to erase the memories of the entire world? Based on their biased feelings for one man's hardships?
"Aw shucks, we really did screw pete over a bit kind of. Let's not take the mature and responsible path and try and help him by offering protection or aid. No, let's change the course of human history, what could possibly go wrong?"
That's usually the kind of set up that comes back to bite people in the ass. But because this was an "editorial decision" you know it won't. I mean, civil war started because of a reality show mishap that ended up in an elementary school dead. This was a conscious decision by some of the most powerful men in the Marvel Universe with a haphazard plan formulated in less than 10 minutes that "infected" the entire world.
Yet, one action caused the Hero community to almost tear itself in two, whereas the other is basically a cliff note in history.
It bugs me.
Holy shit, this is even stupider then "mephisto made it go away."
Furthermore, MJ's reasons for leaving Peter are shown in the best light, and it's never indicated that either of them feel something has gone terribly wrong at some point in their relationship. As such, the conclusion reads like a natural ending to their years together, not the result of Satanic meddling. Unless Quesada genuinely believes they should be apart, his decision to approach things this way makes no sense.
Honestly the way it was just ret-conned seems almost even worse than "The devil did it!"
Unless I read it wrong, Dr. Strange, Reed Richards, and Tony Stark are now super-villains who can shape and change the world on a whim. And not only that, they did it easily, it took what? Five minutes to come up with that plan to erase the memories of the entire world? Based on their biased feelings for one man's hardships?
"Aw shucks, we really did screw pete over a bit kind of. Let's not take the mature and responsible path and try and help him by offering protection or aid. No, let's change the course of human history, what could possibly go wrong?"
That's usually the kind of set up that comes back to bite people in the ass. But because this was an "editorial decision" you know it won't. I mean, civil war started because of a reality show mishap that ended up in an elementary school dead. This was a conscious decision by some of the most powerful men in the Marvel Universe with a haphazard plan formulated in less than 10 minutes that "infected" the entire world.
Yet, one action caused the Hero community to almost tear itself in two, whereas the other is basically a cliff note in history.
It bugs me.
Holy shit, this is even stupider then "mephisto made it go away."
Just finished it and AGREED.
See, I had come to terms with, and it'd even grown on me, the scene where pete and MJ hold each other in OMD before The Devil does his bad-thang. And then in this it's made to be remembered as a selfish dick move on Peters behalf. Thanks Marvel. Again.
This had better be one huge build up that eventually has the marvel universe turn against mephisto and remove him completely. Undoing all the shit.
seriously? Strange, tony and richards just build a forgetatron because peter had a shitty day?
If they are capable of doing this kind of shit why aren't they mind blanking all the stupid shits they have to deal with (doom, loki, osbourn, the king pin, ect.) who consistently fuck shit up?
And MJ just says "fuck it. pete is a swell guy and needs to be a bachelor" has got to be the ultimate cop out given the genuine love these two have had for each other.
Guh... Someone needs to go down to marvel and tell Quesada to never write anything again. this was beyond dumb.
I ... wow. I am at a loss to formulate a response to what you guys are saying.
Agreed that Peter and MJ just drifting apart and getting divorced would have been a thousand times better.
"Look, you're always, always, always gone being a superhero. And I'm a cardboard cutout with a nonexistent spunky personality and red hair. It's just not working out anymore, Peter."
That would be interesting and would at least give Peter something new to whine and mope about.
Retconning his big reveal I have no ideas about. Every step of this from unmasking till now has been dumb.
Posts
you know what's great about digital comics? not having to worry about shipping them
Justice League: Generation Lost has been put up on the store as soon as it hits shops, but I guess we don't want to give digital comics an advantage over comic shops
wouldn't want them to look outdated or anything
Not to mention series like 100 Bullets, Scalped, and Green Lantern that either starred or heavily featured minorities. i think we have a ways to go, but it's not unviable to do well.
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
<< this seemed like the appropriate place for the question given spawns history >>
You really don't have a right to bitch. You're dropping books you enjoy, and that are genrally considered to be of pretty good quality, and keeping two books that you don't enjoy at all. This is why we can't have nice things.
Doing this seems to concede defeat in terms of pirating, as I'm sure there's a way some people have hacked the digital store files that Comixology has to get the pages online.
I can't believe they didn't think about the other side of it; with all the books delayed a day, having GL sit there on the digital store would be a pretty tempting thing for people to purchase, just sitting there all by its lonesome. Sugah.
Seriously, are you broken? "This sucks, but it's required reading" is insane. Comics aren't fucking homework.
Read things you enjoy, while you enjoy them. It costs nothing to Wiki whatever the shitty arc altered, and it doesn't support idea you dislike.
i mean, youre both kind of right, but im dropping stuff like iron man and booster because they arent as good as they used to be. i dont absolutely hate them, but they obviously arent good enough in my mind to compete with the GL books and such. As far as OMIT goes, its only one more issue, and i want to keep buying ASM because i love the character, regardless of whether a particular arc is good. i can stick it through 3 or 4 issues. and my bitch was just as much aimed at myself as it was at comics.
as far as trade-waiting goes, i will definitely keep that in mind, but i feel like trade-waiting for everything takes some of the fun out of reading comics, which is getting a piece of the story every month as it builds to something. i read trades of the complete JMS ASM run, ultimate spiderman, ultimate xmen, and geoff johns flash run, so its not like i wont do it if i have to. probably for stuff like Iron Man.
and brightest day doesnt totally suck, but everything always seems worse when i come to this thread...
XBL: MightyManotaur
PA: TheSecretSeventh
wait....
Manga is about Japanese people and is typically set in Tokyo or other parts of Japan and routinely makes use of decidedly Japanese references and jokes, yet is quite popular in North America still. By your logic, all manga should have a hard time selling to a non-Japanese audience that can't associate with it.
Naruto and Edward Elric are both fair skinned and blonde, and hail from fictional locales, the former of which admittedly draws on both Chinese and Japanese mythology and aesthetic. Monkey D. Luffy, and most of the cast of One Piece, are also depicted as pretty racially ambiguous, with characters like Nami looking pretty Caucasian. Spike Spiegel? Vash the Stampede? Most of these characters are drawn ambiguously enough that they could be Caucasian or Asian, and exist in locations that don't make heavy use of Japanese culture or identity.
Interestingly, I recently read something that discussed how Japanese viewers of anime and manga do identify the characters as Asian, even when they have typically non-Asian features. It makes me wonder if American kids that read manga identify the protagonists as being of their own race and culture.
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Everyone has always insisted to me that the big round eyes are a Mickey Mouse universal-appeal thing and not a faux-Caucasian thing, although I dunno to what extent that's true.
Edit: Maybe AWA will have some nice manga dealers who'll price everything half off. And have plenty of OP volumes.
Very true. Osamu Tezuka was inspired by Walt Disney and pretty much everyone since him has been adopting parts of his style, like the eyes.
It's a cartooning thing. With less "realism" and more broad, vaguer, cartoony shapes, people are more easily able to project themselves (and therefor their race) onto a character.
I agree slightly, in that experiences are more important than what hue the colorist selects in photoshop, but often the race of a character should inform what kind of experience the character has. That's why it doesn't work when you just give a minority character a generic Hal Jordan-esque personality. It doesn't have to be the central theme, but it has to have some impact on their experience.
I think you not identifying with Bruce Wayne because he's a white male also has something to do with the identity of whiteness and its less defined, more default place in our social consciousness. While being a nerd, or a punk rocker, or a gamer, or a cheerleader, are all suitable identities that can be reflected in comics, so should be being an Asian male (with a size changing science belt)
One of the most popular characters (especially outside of Japan) in Naruto right now is a black guy
Discuss.
What are you defining as "typically non-Asian features" though? Cause I think you'll find that those features aren't exactly what the Japanese would consider their defining features.
I generally agree with your point though, that people follow characters they're similar to because it's easier to identify with them. I'd probably say that's the reason why so many people are so dumb when it comes to Superman and out-right refuse to like him even though they've no fucking clue what they're talking about.
TheSecretSeventh: Wait, you don't think Booster Gold is as good as it used to be and like GL more than it? Ugh. Ugh. But Jurgens' run on Booster was laughable and Johns' writing hasn't been remotely good for like at least a year.
Rock Lee isn't black.
No see this character is relevant
And awesome.
Wait isn't naruto about ninjas?
Is he a black ninja?
Is naruto secretly a 70s martial arts blaxploitation manga and I never knew?
Dark hair, dark eyes, a certain stature, skin tone, and the usual facial features common among Asians. I feel like I'm veering dangerously close to, "They all look alike!" territory, but really, there's not a lot of blonde, redheaded, or blue-eyed Asian people, unless they dye their hair or wear contacts.
I'm going to be honest, I had to do some Googling to figure out who you're talking about, but I guess it's this dude? Who apparently behaves like an urban stereotype, and often breaks into rhyme? Really, being that I haven't seen the character in the work itself, and that I'm not exactly in touch with the Naruto fanbase, I can't really make any kind of informed statement on him.
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I don't know how to correctly articulate this, but Japan has a very strong cultural appeal to many Americans. I mean, we even have the term weaboo or whatever to identify people who are deeply interested in Japanese culture. I think there's a strong enough difference there to say that people are attracted to manga for the opposite reasons Munch is talking about. Specifically because they represent (in general, obviously not ever manga incorporates Japanese culture etc.) a culture that is different from their own.
Which makes it an exception, not the rule (I think).
I read Flash Rebirth and outside of bringing a couple of cool characters back, it was terribad. Barry Allen's gritty new origin is idiotic and as a character he's even more boring than Hal Jordan, which is saying a lot.
How many blue and pink haired Asian people are there? Cause those colours are used in anime's as well, so I really wouldn't use hair colour as much of a decider. [vidurl=
Edit: Forgot to use vidurl tags, stupid embedding.
Really bad message, probably one of the more visual "Marriage weighs you down" messages I've seen since this whole thing happened.
I get the feeling Waid gave him some ideas from his 1998 Superman pitch about breaking up Clark and Lois, it just kind of kept appearing in my head when I read the issue.
edit: The thing is, if they actually ended the Back in Black stuff with a story like this (and not so heavy handed from Quesada), it would have been more bearable than the crap OMD was and maybe people would have been more accepting of the new status quo. But it's just mashing something bad on top of something terrible and expecting that it wraps everything up, and you can't build on such a poopy foundation without that smell always being there.
I don't know if it's just because I read Spider-Man a lot as a kid, but I have a strangely emotional connection to the whole Spider-Man/Mary Jane relationship, which honestly precludes me from reading any Brand New Day stuff, without wanting to hurl it into the garbage.
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But Munch, marriage weighs you down! He's free now, he even got her blessing! She basically gave him a condom and said "go hit some Jackpots, tiger!"
If they ever just got rid of OMD and put them back in their marriage the next issue without any context or warning, I would start picking up ASM again. I just can't do it with the current status quo, even if Peter Tomasi wrote it and Chris Giarrusso drew it.
I mean, Kingpin going after MJ could have just as easily happened after Back in Black, and the rest could have followed as well. The only difference is that you'd need some mention of a no-contest divorce as opposed to MJ simply going on the lam.
Furthermore, MJ's reasons for leaving Peter are shown in the best light, and it's never indicated that either of them feel something has gone terribly wrong at some point in their relationship. As such, the conclusion reads like a natural ending to their years together, not the result of Satanic meddling. Unless Quesada genuinely believes they should be apart, his decision to approach things this way makes no sense.
Unfortunately for the narrative, the prior use of Mephisto makes it impossible to share Quesada's view. No matter how hard he tries to make the separation appear reasonable, we can't quite forget the fact that it, at least as far as the narrative is concerned, wasn't supposed to happen.
https://twitter.com/Hooraydiation
Batman and Robin basically had the same scene play out twice, the stuff with Professor Pyg was incomprehensible, and the big Robin/Joker confrontation at the start fails to pay off in the issue. Maybe it's just because it feels like it's been a really long time since I read the previous issue, but I felt lost during most of this thing.
Generation Lost is officially dragging what should be twelve issues out to twenty-five, with the heroes coming off as more and more incompetent every step of the way. They're hunting down a guy they know was able to mind-control of Superman, yet none of them have put any kind of countermeasure into effect to neutralize his powers. It's ridiculous, and makes a team of intelligent and experienced heroes look like bumbling pre-schoolers.
Doom Patrol is just too many plot threads being spun together at once, with none of them really paying off so much as petering out. It feels like nothing ever gets resolved in this book, almost like Giffen gets bored halfway through exploring an idea, and just moves onto something else.
And Irredeemable is just pages upon pages of Waid finding reasons not to end the fucking thing. Last issue hooked me back in, and this one completely destroyed that goodwill.
However, Booster Gold has Ted Kord getting turned into a super-intelligent squirrel in a Blue Beetle costume, and a guest appearance by a character I rather like, so that was nice. The only major problem I had with it was that Olliffe filled in for Batista, and while his work's perfectly fine, Batista's a large part of the appeal for me.
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Honestly the way it was just ret-conned seems almost even worse than "The devil did it!"
"Aw shucks, we really did screw pete over a bit kind of. Let's not take the mature and responsible path and try and help him by offering protection or aid. No, let's change the course of human history, what could possibly go wrong?"
That's usually the kind of set up that comes back to bite people in the ass. But because this was an "editorial decision" you know it won't. I mean, civil war started because of a reality show mishap that ended up in an elementary school dead. This was a conscious decision by some of the most powerful men in the Marvel Universe with a haphazard plan formulated in less than 10 minutes that "infected" the entire world.
Yet, one action caused the Hero community to almost tear itself in two, whereas the other is basically a cliff note in history.
It bugs me.
I agree. It should've taken something along the lines of the Scarlet Witch + Professor X + Dr. Strange + Magneto + Quicksilver = House of M. We are talking about shaping reality here.
And the sucky part is, you know MJ and Peter are going to get back together again. Mary Jane has grown into iconic status; she's not a character you can easily ditch.
Oh, and Daredevil is getting "Reborn" in 2011. I hope they don't do a renumbering thing. Resetting the numbering is developing into one of my pet peeves.
Diablo 3 - ArtfulDodger#1572
Minecraft - ArtfulDodger42
Holy shit, this is even stupider then "mephisto made it go away."
Just finished it and AGREED.
See, I had come to terms with, and it'd even grown on me, the scene where pete and MJ hold each other in OMD before The Devil does his bad-thang. And then in this it's made to be remembered as a selfish dick move on Peters behalf. Thanks Marvel. Again.
This had better be one huge build up that eventually has the marvel universe turn against mephisto and remove him completely. Undoing all the shit.
If they are capable of doing this kind of shit why aren't they mind blanking all the stupid shits they have to deal with (doom, loki, osbourn, the king pin, ect.) who consistently fuck shit up?
And MJ just says "fuck it. pete is a swell guy and needs to be a bachelor" has got to be the ultimate cop out given the genuine love these two have had for each other.
Agreed that Peter and MJ just drifting apart and getting divorced would have been a thousand times better.
"Look, you're always, always, always gone being a superhero. And I'm a cardboard cutout with a nonexistent spunky personality and red hair. It's just not working out anymore, Peter."
That would be interesting and would at least give Peter something new to whine and mope about.
Retconning his big reveal I have no ideas about. Every step of this from unmasking till now has been dumb.