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Spanish Guitar

GodfatherGodfather Registered User regular
edited January 2007 in Help / Advice Forum
So i've been thinking about picking up the guitar. Nothing fancy, just some casual playing here and there.

Now one style of guitar that really appeals to me is the style that the Spanish play in; it's just very casual to listen to, relaxes the nerves and sounds generally fun to play. Problem is, I really have no idea where to start. I'm sure getting basic guitar lessons won't be a problem (I do live in Texas after all), but are there places that teach an actual style? This obviously isn't going to happen for a while, but it'd be helpful to know where to go from here once I have the basics down.

You know, this can pretty much be a general guitar thread. If I could get answers to basic questions, like the difficulty of playing/learning guitar, some fun beginner pieces to play, the works. My plate is already full with my senior year, two college classes i'm taking on tuesdays and thursdays, and working at a wedding reception/event business on the weekends, so scheduling might be a problem here.

I'm really starting to get into art, but since I spend most of my time either drawing or thinking about drawing, it'd be nice to be able to pull out the guitar and just start playing a casual style. Although I can only think of two artist who play what i'm going for here, the only one that I can remember is Govi. Whether he's popular here or not is of no concern to me, but it would help if you could hear a sample of his tracks to make sure that i'm not barking up the wrong tree.

That's pretty much it.

Godfather on

Posts

  • MunroMunro Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    I'm not familiar with any Spanish guitarists after Isaac Albeniz (but look into his work, he's good), but I do know that the style I believe you're referring to is classical guitar study, which you'd definitely want a teacher for. Ask your teacher and he should know what you're talking about. If not, ask around about classical guitar lessons.

    Munro on
  • IcemopperIcemopper Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Spanish guitar is difficult yes. It is generally called flamenco and you can probably find somebody in the area that specializes in it. The style of playing is similar to classical, but very different from rock or anything like that. You will work your right hand as much as your left, probably grow your fingernails out and work at least 2-3 hours a day on your stuff. It can be extremely discouraging for a beginner, but do not give up if you love doing it. Seriously, there is not a better reward than hearing the music coming from your own fingers rather than the speakers on your computer.

    EDIT: Good luck, definitely, and as the above poster stated, flamenco is similar to classical, but very different, you'll get more of what you want with that.

    Icemopper on
  • GodfatherGodfather Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Flaminco huh? The ironic thing is that I actually heard a flaminco guitar player live in a small jazz jam session, but I doubt he has the time to teach, seeing as he's always busy with gigs. The fingernails thing could be a problem though; my main priority is drawing, and growing those suckers out might create some problems.

    Still, I really think that I should take advantage of spanish guitar, seeing as how I have a number of traits going my way. For example, I have long, slim-built fingers, perfect for piano playing or guitar, I have a tendancy to play by ear (but can read music as well), and if it's interesting enough I tend to go a little overboard with practicing.

    Decisions decisions. Any way to play this style without the long nails, or is that pretty much the staple here?

    Godfather on
  • MunroMunro Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    I'm not familiar enough with it to answer that question but I will say that if you can, find someone that will help you develop your ability to play by ear. If your goal is to eventually pick up a guitar, noodle around and improvise, then being able to play what you're hearing in your mind is essential. Don't think that because sheet music is what you're supposed to do that it's what you should do.

    Munro on
  • Mad JazzMad Jazz gotta go fast AustinRegistered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Munro wrote:
    Don't think that because sheet music is what you're supposed to do that it's what you should do.

    Except in this case, it is what you should do. For this style, almost all of the material out there uses musical notation as opposed to tablature (that I've seen, anyway). If you don't learn to read music, you'll probably seriously hamstring yourself when it comes to getting material you want to play. Plus, musical notation has information in it that tabs don't, like rhythm, which will be important for you.

    Also, it's not like it will take you any extra time to learn to read music if you're just picking up guitar.

    Mad Jazz on
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  • Chop LogicChop Logic Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    The only people I've ever seen tell other people that they really don't need to know how to read music are people who don't know how to read music.

    Chop Logic on
  • DaySleeperDaySleeper regular
    edited January 2007
    I'd suggest either taking lessons or buying a book on classical guitar to get some of the basics down (music reading, proper posture, etc. etc.). From there you can move into more advanced books. You will almost certainly need to grow your right-hand nails out at least somewhat if you want nice, clear sound.

    Get a nylon-string classical guitar. Takamine makes them for reasonably cheaply, Ovation makes more expensive ones.

    DaySleeper on
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  • MunroMunro Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    I read sheet... I've played piano for five years now. I just meant exclusively... as in, don't give up ear training, as it is essential to improvisation. I already said to go with a teacher, so in my mind "both" was implied. Just a bit of miscommunication on my part.

    Munro on
  • GodfatherGodfather Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    So the fingernails thing is a must; as long as it doesn't get in the way of my arts stuff, i'm all for it. Might need to find a happy medium length so I can work both in as well.

    Sheet music I have no problem with; although there's quite a bit of difference between guitar sheet music and, oh, saxaphone for example, it shouldn't be a big enough challenge to really get worried about. Also, i'm going to strongly look for a teacher rather than purchase a book; I can grasp a subject at a much more accelerated rate when I have hands on teaching rather than reading what to do from a book.

    Those nylon-string classical guitars previously mentions, specificially the Takamine; what's the average price on one of these things, and would this be a solid beginner's guitar to work with?

    Godfather on
  • DaySleeperDaySleeper regular
    edited January 2007
    Godfather wrote:
    So the fingernails thing is a must; as long as it doesn't get in the way of my arts stuff, i'm all for it. Might need to find a happy medium length so I can work both in as well.

    Sheet music I have no problem with; although there's quite a bit of difference between guitar sheet music and, oh, saxaphone for example, it shouldn't be a big enough challenge to really get worried about. Also, i'm going to strongly look for a teacher rather than purchase a book; I can grasp a subject at a much more accelerated rate when I have hands on teaching rather than reading what to do from a book.

    Those nylon-string classical guitars previously mentions, specificially the Takamine; what's the average price on one of these things, and would this be a solid beginner's guitar to work with?

    I got mine for $225 (I'm fairly certain my guitar teacher ripped me off, though. I had to get new machine heads for it in <2 years). Sam Ash seems to have some nylon strings for about $150 or so (Though they are not Taks). That seems more in line with a beginner guitar to me.

    DaySleeper on
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  • SamSam Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Take classical guitar lessons, ask your instructor to let you work on more stuff from spanish composers and he/she would be likely to comply.

    If you can develop the skills, you'll be ready to start actually playing flamenco guitar. I never went through with it, because I was 16 and discovered Led Zeppelin. I'm regretting it now.

    Composers to look for music from- Francesco Tarrega, Isaac Albeniz, Joaquin Rodrigo

    Sam on
  • IcemopperIcemopper Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    You will definitely have to grow your fingernails out, sorry, but they don't have to be super long, just a length where you can comfortably strike the string and not hold the guitar in an awkward position. There is a very very good book called "Pumping Nylon" by Scott Tennant, which I highly recommend. You should most definitely also get lessons, as learning posture and style will be extremely difficult to do on your own. If you're near a college or university see if there are student teachers there. I'm about to start teaching kids from around this area, and I'm only a student, but the information you can learn from even a guitarist in training could be invaluable later on.
    Also a decent beginner's guitar can go for around 130 USD, which is what I got my first one for. It lasted a good while and helped considerably in my skill, even for a crappy guitar.

    I wish you the best of luck, my friend, now get out there and practice.

    Icemopper on
  • GodfatherGodfather Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Quick question for the Florida residents: what are my chances of continuing flaminco in this area? I ask because come fall i'll be attending Full Sail for two years, and given the requirements of the school (40 hour weeks!) I might have trouble furthering these studies. I was thinking that since it'll probably be just like a regular school week (pre college of course), i'll get saturdays and sundays off, so i'd have to postpone the lessons until then. I'm positive that i'll have no trouble at all finding a teacher in flaminco in my side of the fence, but in Florida the demand might be a tad bit more difficult.

    Another thing regarding the nails bit: I still have that habit of biting them off like so many others that I know of, so needless to say i'm gonna need to kick the habit. Isn't there some nail polish stuff that trains you to stop doing this, and if so where can I get some?


    Edit: After reading my posts a second time through, it sounds like i'm making an assload of excuses for myself as to why I can't just dive right in yet. Bleh, i'm terrible at wording these questions :( . What I meant to say is that if it really takes some serious time to master, much less at least play the style, then I really want to be getting the best investment out of my time/money and not something that i'll get hardly anything out of if i'll only be able to devote a few short months to.

    Hope that clears things up.

    Godfather on
  • IcemopperIcemopper Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    It's called flamenco, not flaminco, just fyi.

    As the nails go, I was a biter too. But once I picked up classical guitar the habit on my right hand just stopped. It's hard to explain but all you can do is simply stop. Yes there are ways to assist doing so, but it all comes down to just stopping.

    I still bite the crap out of my left hand fingernails, mostly for compensation, but you can find nail polish at any Walgreens or drugstore or... basically anywhere.

    And I'd agree with that final statement, if you take the time to prepare to learn it will make things much easier. There is no reason to instantly jump into it, and it sounds like you're young and have plenty of time.

    Icemopper on
  • SamSam Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Icemopper wrote:
    It's called flamenco, not flaminco, just fyi.

    As the nails go, I was a biter too. But once I picked up classical guitar the habit on my right hand just stopped. It's hard to explain but all you can do is simply stop. Yes there are ways to assist doing so, but it all comes down to just stopping.

    I still bite the crap out of my left hand fingernails, mostly for compensation, but you can find nail polish at any Walgreens or drugstore or... basically anywhere.

    Seconded. I didn't have to use nail polish or anything, my chronic biting for both hands just stopped when I was learning classical guitar, probably since I was really motivated at the time.

    Ever since I started using a pick the biting has been back with a venegance though :P

    Sam on
  • reddogreddog The Mountain Brooklyn, NYRegistered User regular
    edited January 2007
    I started off with classical guitar with my dad teaching me more of the spanish composers as well as a little flamenco here and there. Keep your fretting fingernails short and the fingernails on your "plucking" hand a tiny bit past the tip of your finger for best results. I used to bite my nails back in the day but i just stopped because I wanted to become a better guitarist.

    I started learning on songs such as Romance (might be by Terrega but I could be wrong). Learning techniques by playing classical will help you be a better guitarist. Check out Segovia's scales and works along with other guitarists such as Paco de Lucia for more of the Flamenco style.

    reddog on
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  • GodfatherGodfather Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    I am EXTREMELY sorry for bringing this topic from the dead, but I just saw this video on YouTube (http://youtube.com/watch?v=0AH5GAkcnMc) and was wondering if this was indeed Flamenco style. I only question this because Wiki states that it is Acoustic, Folk Rock, and Metal of all things, but no mention of Flamenco.

    I was thinking of picking this album up as an example of what I wanted to learn, so it'd be nice to know.

    Godfather on
  • AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Godfather wrote:
    I am EXTREMELY sorry for bringing this topic from the dead, but I just saw this video on YouTube (http://youtube.com/watch?v=0AH5GAkcnMc) and was wondering if this was indeed Flamenco style. I only question this because Wiki states that it is Acoustic, Folk Rock, and Metal of all things, but no mention of Flamenco.

    I was thinking of picking this album up as an example of what I wanted to learn, so it'd be nice to know.

    I'm not sure if that could be considered flamenco, typically you don't use a pick, rather you pluck with your fingernails. The woman appears to be mostly strumming, but she does some picking with her fingers.

    AbsoluteZero on
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  • AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3EvcL4hc4Jc

    There's some flamenco guitar playing

    AbsoluteZero on
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  • liquidloganliquidlogan Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Also, for some other Flamenco style guitar playing in rock music, you can't beat The Doors - Spanish Caravan.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jdzLWGfl5xg for a live version.

    liquidlogan on
  • GodfatherGodfather Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    The lead guitar part I agree with, but i'd wager good money that the woman is utilizing at least somewhat of a similar approach in flamenco due to her frequent transitions from strumming to slapping the guitar.

    That's an interesting technique by the way: I mean, i've heard of slapping a guitar to count off, but never utilized the way she does.

    Godfather on
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