I've been playing this a while. I've been concentrating on German tanks and I think I've probably put most time into the TD line. I've got the JagdPz. I'm also packing a fully pimped out Leopard scout tank, a VK3601, and a pimped out Stug.
I find the ammo costs for any cannon 88mm or larger are a bit stupid. I mostly load HE since it seems to be the only way you can do damage as a TD. My favorite trick is to use the Leopard and just speed around the maps detecting enemies (and taking out any arty I come across). The 88 is brutal but when you play a game and end up making only 2k credits on it because of ammo and repair costs, it's a bit silly.
The game is OK but I think there's still a few problems with shell penetration, and camo is obviously broken, otherwise TDs would be a lot more effective.
One thing I *have* noticed is that crew experience makes an absolutely massive difference. Once I'd saved enough gold I upgraded my stug crew to 100% and I was doing much better in games.
I've been playing WoT for a few months, since I saw the thread (that has since died) in SE++. The IS is my baby. Sure, now and then I'll get faced against 4 IS-7's and a VK4502, but rarely I'll be the biggest tank in the game against a bunch of KV-3s and below.
That game was incredible. Steel Wall, Sniper, and a medal for killing most enemies (at least 9) or something crazy like that.
Anyway, other tanks I quite enjoy are the PzIII (zoom zoom baby), even if it dies at a sneeze, and boy does the PzIII/IV feel like a downgrade. Those tanks have such horrible gun options. Also currently tooling around in a PzJg IV, quite fun, just got an acceptable gun in it. Though I tend to be faced against stuff that I can hardly scratch.
If anyone wants a tank that is just hilarious, crazy fun to use, buy a T-28 and slap the 85mm (I think thats the one) into it and use only HE. You'll one-shot anything same or lower tier, and sometimes a tier above as well. Fast as hell, but a terrible glass cannon.
I'm still saving up for the T-28, but my T-46 is really fun to play. With the short 76mm cannon it hits pretty hard for a light tank. When I'm in a lower tier game I feel like a shark, cruising around knowing I can put the hurt on anything I see.
I like how the random games make you change your playstyle, even when you use the same tank. Up against a lot of TD's, move in close and flank. Weak armored lights? Find a good spot and snipe.
I'm starting to get bigger guns now and I love the sound the large calibers make. It makes me wish I had a better sound system.
EDIT: What is steel wall awarded for? That's the only one I haven't received yet.
I'm really bad at this, interrupted briefly by moments of success. Not too surprising, I'm approaching this way too much like T-34 vs Tiger and not like an MMO. Plus, I'm just bad at it. That being said, I'm hopeful for slowing working my way out of the light tanks.
That, and being in a BT-7 and going against Panzer IV with Panther turrets and SU-85s is absolutely terrifying.
I'm still saving up for the T-28, but my T-46 is really fun to play. With the short 76mm cannon it hits pretty hard for a light tank. When I'm in a lower tier game I feel like a shark, cruising around knowing I can put the hurt on anything I see.
I like how the random games make you change your playstyle, even when you use the same tank. Up against a lot of TD's, move in close and flank. Weak armored lights? Find a good spot and snipe.
I'm starting to get bigger guns now and I love the sound the large calibers make. It makes me wish I had a better sound system.
EDIT: What is steel wall awarded for? That's the only one I haven't received yet.
Steel Wall is awarded for taking or deflecting 1000hp worth of damage. Now you have to survive to get it too
EDIT: nvm it's been answered before me >.> anyway, the fully upgraded IS is beast mode
Need the tracks to fit the bigger guns, anyway. Already have the 10.5 from the JP, but I'm looking forward to the 12.8. Only, uh, ~80,000 experience to get that. :shock:
So, I'd love to enjoy this game. Sadly, whenever I open the launcher, not only do I get a message box ominously titled Critical Error, but my computer gets disconnected from my wireless network. This is more than a little odd.
I'm digging the light tanks, and how quickly they get around. The past few games I have been rushing ahead to the enemy flag area and taking pot shots at the stragglers.
I still don't get how experience works, though. Some games I get a lot, other games I get very little.
I'm a little angry though, at the fact that I often spend a few shots to take an enemy tank down to ~10%, only to have another tank show up and finish them off. It hurts, just a little, to not have that one "destroyed" added on.
Ferdi has similar problems, though for very differnt reasons, to the t44 when i drove one. Both are very good in certain circumstances, just those cases are rare these days.
Ferdi is good as long as it can stay way away from things so they can only shoot front armor (somewhat easy with how common camping is) and not have to face anything bigger than itself (rare now). Back when most people had VKs of some kind it was great as few things could pen it from the front. Now most tier 8+ heavies can penetrate it from any side, and there are a buch of those in every match. Its still good, till I'm seen, then I am just arty/heavy bait. In which case I may as well go back to the Jpanther. The last gun may change things, but I am still using the 88 as I can never make money with the 105 since the shells are insanly overpriced on that gun. Actually I dont see a reason to drive my jpanther either, tiger has the same playstyle and the same gun but with a turret.
I drove a T44 before the last softwipe. I could murder anything lower tier than it once you let the enemy spread out. But run in to an equal tier or higher heavy, dead. You dont have the dps/penetration to hurt them fast enough, and you cant out run an IS3's turret. Course now the T44 has the same problem as all the "brawler" mediums too, good luck even getting into close range as visibility is so in favor of the campers. T44 moves up to get in close range, gets seen by 4-5 tanks, is tracked, blows up. I use to not be afraid of tigers in my t44, now I am not afraid of T44s in my tiger.
Ogotai on
0
Custom SpecialI know I am, I'm sure I am,I'm Sounders 'til I die!Registered Userregular
edited December 2010
I got my beta key yesterday and downloaded the game. I'll probably fire it up this afternoon.
Tanks = good. Hope it's fun.
How are you guys getting platoons up and running without going premium? I need all those credits for my personal armor division, and apparently you have to drop gold to get premium, and credits to get gold.
Am I missing something?
Also...to hell with the Russian medium/heavy tanks. Those things are NASTY. Of course, my puny little M2 Light Tank can only take about 1 or 2 hits before it turns into a flaming pile of crap.
You shouuld be getting 150 gold each day. If you didnt get the 5k from last soft wipe, your best bet is just to save it up till you can afford the 1 month of premium. By the time it runs out you will have enough for another month, plus some crew or tank slots.
I just got a Tiger 2. Still have the 88 on it, so its basically a bigger, slower tiger that can can ocasionally bounce shots from smaller tanks, if shot in the front.
So just for lulz I searched my g-mail archive and found a beta invite purportedly sent to me back in September which I have absolutely no memory of ever getting. I don't even remember asking for one...it seems like the last time I investigated this game I was under the impression that keys were only being doled out exclusively on certain sites and whatnot.
Anyway, long story short, torrenting the client now.
I refuse to go the Russian route just because they're clearly supposed to be best. Do I go German or American? The American tanks honestly have more appeal for me and I'm more familiar with them but apparently the devs hate them and God knows if there will ever be any American TDs.
Although in fairness I guess American TDs might upset the whole balance of the game since they all 1) had turrets! and 2) didn't suck (at least the M18 Hellcat was a little beast and the M10 and M36 were both apparently at least decent).
I've been putting my gold towards credits for better tanks, though even after losses, recently, it hasn't been as necessary--since all my research goes into the path for new tanks.
Basically, I need to get a better tank than the BT-7. Or, on the other hand, stop getting pitted against Su-85s, American heavy tanks, and KV tanks.
Synthesis on
0
Der Waffle MousBlame this on the misfortune of your birth.New Yark, New Yark.Registered Userregular
edited December 2010
Its a wierd thing with the matchmaking.
There aren't any high-tier light tanks, so if you're in a Teir 3 light, you're going to get shunted into a high tier match because scouts are pretty much a necessity.
Which wouldn't be so bad if the spotting distances between tanks wasn't so back-asswards.
I on't see the appeal to the American TDs. They seem like they will just be a medium with mabe one tier higher gun and even less armor. Fast tanks with thin armor just are not much of a threat anymore unless they hang back and snipe. Then having a turret dosn't matter that much. Though if they are still cheaper to repair than mediums they will probably make us mediums pointless, their armor is so low it may as well be zero anyway.
Tried out the t2 us arty, nice little tank. Can even use it as a td at times
So I'm up to the T2 Medium on the American tree now. It's alright for what it's matched up against I suppose. I still die in 90% of my games and only manage a kill in maybe 40% but it's pretty common for me to get damage credit for plinking 2-3 of the OPFOR even if I don't get the finishing blow. Wasted a bunch of money on a couple abortive buys of the M2 Light before I got the whole "experience vs. free experience" thing figured out.
Long-term the American tree seems like a career in misery though so I've been trying to get going with the Germans too, but good God the Loltraktor is horrific. If the damn thing will break 25 kp/h I haven't figured out a way to make it do it yet.
Apparently they're adding French tanks next. Why the hell anybody wanted French stuff ahead of, say, British and when the nations that are already in the game don't even have their trees completed yet absolutely boggles my mind.
Apparently they're adding French tanks next. Why the hell anybody wanted French stuff ahead of, say, British and when the nations that are already in the game don't even have their trees completed yet absolutely boggles my mind.
Might have something to do with...
*A large portion of british tanks, particularly the better known ones, are already in the game, in one way or another
*Up until their defeat, the french arguably had the best tanks in the world, though hampered by doctrine and a few small design flaws
*The french have a lot of interesting prototypes and shortly post-war designs that give the devs room to work with
*French tanks are pretty distinct visually, whereas british tanks followed a few broad templates a lot of the time
Unfortunately not yet. I can see how that would suck for a left handed person.
About the French tanks, I wasn't aware that there would be designs for the upper tiers, even on paper. They must be pulling high level tanks out of their asses, or just using way post war designs. Other than the Char, H39, S35, and R35 I don't know what they are going to add. The little tankettes they had in the interwar years would seem like toys compared to even the starter tanks.
On the other hand the only other countries to choose from would be Italy or Japan, as they are the only ones that fielded tanks in any significant numbers, and Japan only marginally. The main British designs are already in, unless people really want to drive a Crusader (or a Vickers, lol .50 cal main gun). People already bitch that American tanks are made of paper, I'd like to see them get a hold of a Crusader A series. I guess they could add the Matilda (unless that's in already, I'm not sure). But that thing makes a KV look like a sports car in comparison. It got a whopping 9 mph off road, in game it would basically be a stationary turret.
Ok, so I finally jumped up to my Tier 3 medium USA tank. Worst...investment...ever. The matchmaking is so horrible lol. I was hiding on the side of the road ahead of everyone else, waiting on some easy pot shots...and what do I see? Some gargantuan Soviet behemoth rolling down the street eating puppy dogs and unicorns while pissing diesel all over the opposition. I took one shot at his treads. Know what my crewmen said, "That one bounced off!".
It was at this point, that I had to stick my head between my legs and kiss my ass goodbye. 1 shot. That's all it took. Direct hit to the side, I was gone.
On another note, Tier 2 is fun as hell. I have my M2 Light Tank and that thing is basically the most annoying thing on the battlefield. I can reach their flag before their light tanks and mediums even touch the midfield. Which leaves their succulent artillery open for happy fun-time. Of course...if you don't get SUPER close to the arty and stick it where the sun don't shine, they'll just direct fire your ass for a 1-hit kill.
So just for lulz I searched my g-mail archive and found a beta invite purportedly sent to me back in September which I have absolutely no memory of ever getting. I don't even remember asking for one...it seems like the last time I investigated this game I was under the impression that keys were only being doled out exclusively on certain sites and whatnot.
Anyway, long story short, torrenting the client now.
I refuse to go the Russian route just because they're clearly supposed to be best. Do I go German or American? The American tanks honestly have more appeal for me and I'm more familiar with them but apparently the devs hate them and God knows if there will ever be any American TDs.
Although in fairness I guess American TDs might upset the whole balance of the game since they all 1) had turrets! and 2) didn't suck (at least the M18 Hellcat was a little beast and the M10 and M36 were both apparently at least decent).
About the TDs, I dunno man. Hetzer and Stug should be better in the game than they are if we're going by historical performance. Hetzer especially was supposed to be fairly capable, but it's an abomination in the game. Stug is good, but gets matched against stuff that's way out of its league, like IS-4 and the like.
What TDs really need is more powerful guns, since they are already inferior in hitpoints, armor and speed to many tanks of the same tier, while some of the tanks get equivalent guns on top of this. Also, lack of turret. I really like the way TDs are played, but damn they need more powerful guns.
Rhan9 on
0
Der Waffle MousBlame this on the misfortune of your birth.New Yark, New Yark.Registered Userregular
Apparently they're adding French tanks next. Why the hell anybody wanted French stuff ahead of, say, British and when the nations that are already in the game don't even have their trees completed yet absolutely boggles my mind.
Might have something to do with...
*A large portion of british tanks, particularly the better known ones, are already in the game, in one way or another
*Up until their defeat, the french arguably had the best tanks in the world, though hampered by doctrine and a few small design flaws
*The french have a lot of interesting prototypes and shortly post-war designs that give the devs room to work with
*French tanks are pretty distinct visually, whereas british tanks followed a few broad templates a lot of the time
Keep in mind that there's a lot of designs in the list that are either post-war or were never finished. So if we see French tanks, we're liable to see stuff like the Char D2 or the ARL-44, or the various aborted designs from the FCM project.
Edit: Oh hey, there's a list. A lot of their tanks T5 and up are postwar designs, well into the 50's actually.
Aye. Atleast half the Soviet line of tanks are prototypes or models only fielded in stupidly small numbers. I think the biggest SPG they get that saw real service is the SU-5, which is a tier 3?
Not that the German line is much better. They have a whole tree devoted to prototypes (the PzIII/IV onwards, minus the Panther), and anything with a VK designation never got past models for the most part. Hell, from what I understand my beloved VK(DB) was never really more than an idea; they said "Good, but lets just make a Panther instead".
Don't know anything about the American tanks though. Never really been a fan.
Aye. Atleast half the Soviet line of tanks are prototypes or models only fielded in stupidly small numbers. I think the biggest SPG they get that saw real service is the SU-5, which is a tier 3?
Not that the German line is much better. They have a whole tree devoted to prototypes (the PzIII/IV onwards, minus the Panther), and anything with a VK designation never got past models for the most part. Hell, from what I understand my beloved VK(DB) was never really more than an idea; they said "Good, but lets just make a Panther instead".
Don't know anything about the American tanks though. Never really been a fan.
The Tigers and King Tigers saw plenty service, as did their TDs. It seems that ignoring the VKs, and the Maus, the German tree is pretty good about it. The Soviet one has a quite a lot of prototypes and tanks produced after WWII.
I think I'd like this game better if light tanks could actually act as scouts. Instead its oh hey that heavy tank can see you before you can see it better get ready to get blown up in one hit.
Heh, heh, just had a game where I took 82 hits and survived in the T2 (or M2, whatever the american tank before the m3 lee is). Nice little BB ping as all those PzII autocannons bounced off me.
Apparently they're adding French tanks next. Why the hell anybody wanted French stuff ahead of, say, British and when the nations that are already in the game don't even have their trees completed yet absolutely boggles my mind.
Might have something to do with...
*A large portion of british tanks, particularly the better known ones, are already in the game, in one way or another
Um, as far as I can tell there's a grand total of four (if you count the Ram, otherwise only three) and all of them are premium. Maybe I'm overlooking something.
There's nothing from the entire "cruiser tank" development line, so if you throw in stuff like the Crusader, Cromwell/Comet, and the Centurion at the top end, and let the Brits borrow the Stuart, Grant, and Sherman, you have the core of a pretty solid tree.
I really think it's kind of lame that they're putting half the French tree together out of prototypes, many of them post-war. Actually I wish the devs weren't so obsessed with prototypes in general. It's one thing to fill out a tree, but when historically produced types that would work just as well are missing it just becomes silly and confusing. I mean, almost the entire US heavy line is prototypes and yet there's no M26 Perishing? But apparently the M26 is in never-never land along with the American TDs. I don't know, the priorities just seem strange to me.
Posts
I find the ammo costs for any cannon 88mm or larger are a bit stupid. I mostly load HE since it seems to be the only way you can do damage as a TD. My favorite trick is to use the Leopard and just speed around the maps detecting enemies (and taking out any arty I come across). The 88 is brutal but when you play a game and end up making only 2k credits on it because of ammo and repair costs, it's a bit silly.
The game is OK but I think there's still a few problems with shell penetration, and camo is obviously broken, otherwise TDs would be a lot more effective.
One thing I *have* noticed is that crew experience makes an absolutely massive difference. Once I'd saved enough gold I upgraded my stug crew to 100% and I was doing much better in games.
That game was incredible. Steel Wall, Sniper, and a medal for killing most enemies (at least 9) or something crazy like that.
Anyway, other tanks I quite enjoy are the PzIII (zoom zoom baby), even if it dies at a sneeze, and boy does the PzIII/IV feel like a downgrade. Those tanks have such horrible gun options.
If anyone wants a tank that is just hilarious, crazy fun to use, buy a T-28 and slap the 85mm (I think thats the one) into it and use only HE. You'll one-shot anything same or lower tier, and sometimes a tier above as well. Fast as hell, but a terrible glass cannon.
I like how the random games make you change your playstyle, even when you use the same tank. Up against a lot of TD's, move in close and flank. Weak armored lights? Find a good spot and snipe.
I'm starting to get bigger guns now and I love the sound the large calibers make. It makes me wish I had a better sound system.
EDIT: What is steel wall awarded for? That's the only one I haven't received yet.
That, and being in a BT-7 and going against Panzer IV with Panther turrets and SU-85s is absolutely terrifying.
Steel Wall is awarded for taking or deflecting 1000hp worth of damage. Now you have to survive to get it too
EDIT: nvm it's been answered before me >.> anyway, the fully upgraded IS is beast mode
Check out the Penny Arcade World of Tanks thread to join us in some fun times.
I just unlocked the Ferdinand and I think it may be the worst tank ever.
I said tank not tank destroyer
Check out the Penny Arcade World of Tanks thread to join us in some fun times.
Especially a TD since turning speed is their most important stat.
It's pretty cool.
I'm digging the light tanks, and how quickly they get around. The past few games I have been rushing ahead to the enemy flag area and taking pot shots at the stragglers.
I still don't get how experience works, though. Some games I get a lot, other games I get very little.
I'm a little angry though, at the fact that I often spend a few shots to take an enemy tank down to ~10%, only to have another tank show up and finish them off. It hurts, just a little, to not have that one "destroyed" added on.
Ferdi is good as long as it can stay way away from things so they can only shoot front armor (somewhat easy with how common camping is) and not have to face anything bigger than itself (rare now). Back when most people had VKs of some kind it was great as few things could pen it from the front. Now most tier 8+ heavies can penetrate it from any side, and there are a buch of those in every match. Its still good, till I'm seen, then I am just arty/heavy bait. In which case I may as well go back to the Jpanther. The last gun may change things, but I am still using the 88 as I can never make money with the 105 since the shells are insanly overpriced on that gun. Actually I dont see a reason to drive my jpanther either, tiger has the same playstyle and the same gun but with a turret.
I drove a T44 before the last softwipe. I could murder anything lower tier than it once you let the enemy spread out. But run in to an equal tier or higher heavy, dead. You dont have the dps/penetration to hurt them fast enough, and you cant out run an IS3's turret. Course now the T44 has the same problem as all the "brawler" mediums too, good luck even getting into close range as visibility is so in favor of the campers. T44 moves up to get in close range, gets seen by 4-5 tanks, is tracked, blows up. I use to not be afraid of tigers in my t44, now I am not afraid of T44s in my tiger.
Tanks = good. Hope it's fun.
Am I missing something?
Also...to hell with the Russian medium/heavy tanks. Those things are NASTY. Of course, my puny little M2 Light Tank can only take about 1 or 2 hits before it turns into a flaming pile of crap.
On that subject, the upcoming softwipe has been posponed, supposedly until the clan wars patch, which is sometime early next year.
I just got a Tiger 2. Still have the 88 on it, so its basically a bigger, slower tiger that can can ocasionally bounce shots from smaller tanks, if shot in the front.
Anyway, long story short, torrenting the client now.
I refuse to go the Russian route just because they're clearly supposed to be best. Do I go German or American? The American tanks honestly have more appeal for me and I'm more familiar with them but apparently the devs hate them and God knows if there will ever be any American TDs.
Although in fairness I guess American TDs might upset the whole balance of the game since they all 1) had turrets! and 2) didn't suck (at least the M18 Hellcat was a little beast and the M10 and M36 were both apparently at least decent).
Basically, I need to get a better tank than the BT-7. Or, on the other hand, stop getting pitted against Su-85s, American heavy tanks, and KV tanks.
There aren't any high-tier light tanks, so if you're in a Teir 3 light, you're going to get shunted into a high tier match because scouts are pretty much a necessity.
Which wouldn't be so bad if the spotting distances between tanks wasn't so back-asswards.
Tried out the t2 us arty, nice little tank. Can even use it as a td at times
Long-term the American tree seems like a career in misery though so I've been trying to get going with the Germans too, but good God the Loltraktor is horrific. If the damn thing will break 25 kp/h I haven't figured out a way to make it do it yet.
Apparently they're adding French tanks next. Why the hell anybody wanted French stuff ahead of, say, British and when the nations that are already in the game don't even have their trees completed yet absolutely boggles my mind.
Might have something to do with...
*A large portion of british tanks, particularly the better known ones, are already in the game, in one way or another
*Up until their defeat, the french arguably had the best tanks in the world, though hampered by doctrine and a few small design flaws
*The french have a lot of interesting prototypes and shortly post-war designs that give the devs room to work with
*French tanks are pretty distinct visually, whereas british tanks followed a few broad templates a lot of the time
3ds friend code: 2981-6032-4118
Oo\ Ironsizide
About the French tanks, I wasn't aware that there would be designs for the upper tiers, even on paper. They must be pulling high level tanks out of their asses, or just using way post war designs. Other than the Char, H39, S35, and R35 I don't know what they are going to add. The little tankettes they had in the interwar years would seem like toys compared to even the starter tanks.
On the other hand the only other countries to choose from would be Italy or Japan, as they are the only ones that fielded tanks in any significant numbers, and Japan only marginally. The main British designs are already in, unless people really want to drive a Crusader (or a Vickers, lol .50 cal main gun). People already bitch that American tanks are made of paper, I'd like to see them get a hold of a Crusader A series. I guess they could add the Matilda (unless that's in already, I'm not sure). But that thing makes a KV look like a sports car in comparison. It got a whopping 9 mph off road, in game it would basically be a stationary turret.
It was at this point, that I had to stick my head between my legs and kiss my ass goodbye. 1 shot. That's all it took. Direct hit to the side, I was gone.
On another note, Tier 2 is fun as hell. I have my M2 Light Tank and that thing is basically the most annoying thing on the battlefield. I can reach their flag before their light tanks and mediums even touch the midfield. Which leaves their succulent artillery open for happy fun-time. Of course...if you don't get SUPER close to the arty and stick it where the sun don't shine, they'll just direct fire your ass for a 1-hit kill.
About the TDs, I dunno man. Hetzer and Stug should be better in the game than they are if we're going by historical performance. Hetzer especially was supposed to be fairly capable, but it's an abomination in the game. Stug is good, but gets matched against stuff that's way out of its league, like IS-4 and the like.
What TDs really need is more powerful guns, since they are already inferior in hitpoints, armor and speed to many tanks of the same tier, while some of the tanks get equivalent guns on top of this. Also, lack of turret. I really like the way TDs are played, but damn they need more powerful guns.
Edit: Oh hey, there's a list. A lot of their tanks T5 and up are postwar designs, well into the 50's actually.
Not that the German line is much better. They have a whole tree devoted to prototypes (the PzIII/IV onwards, minus the Panther), and anything with a VK designation never got past models for the most part. Hell, from what I understand my beloved VK(DB) was never really more than an idea; they said "Good, but lets just make a Panther instead".
Don't know anything about the American tanks though. Never really been a fan.
The Tigers and King Tigers saw plenty service, as did their TDs. It seems that ignoring the VKs, and the Maus, the German tree is pretty good about it. The Soviet one has a quite a lot of prototypes and tanks produced after WWII.
Um, as far as I can tell there's a grand total of four (if you count the Ram, otherwise only three) and all of them are premium. Maybe I'm overlooking something.
There's nothing from the entire "cruiser tank" development line, so if you throw in stuff like the Crusader, Cromwell/Comet, and the Centurion at the top end, and let the Brits borrow the Stuart, Grant, and Sherman, you have the core of a pretty solid tree.
I really think it's kind of lame that they're putting half the French tree together out of prototypes, many of them post-war. Actually I wish the devs weren't so obsessed with prototypes in general. It's one thing to fill out a tree, but when historically produced types that would work just as well are missing it just becomes silly and confusing. I mean, almost the entire US heavy line is prototypes and yet there's no M26 Perishing? But apparently the M26 is in never-never land along with the American TDs. I don't know, the priorities just seem strange to me.