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Traffic Ticket
Dalboz
Resident Puppy EaterRight behind you...Registered User regular
Resident Puppy EaterRight behind you...Registered User regular
I just got my first traffic ticket in my entire life (after 17 years of driving). So, I have some questions. FYI, the ticket was in California (Ventura County on PCH), and there's some suspicious stuff about it.
1) a) Is it worth bothering to fight it? The officer claimed I was going 70 mph in a 55 zone. I honestly cannot confirm or deny this because I wasn't looking at the speedometer but was keeping my eyes on the road. For those who don't know, that area of PCH can get curvy without warning. I was driving what felt to be a safe speed in sunny, clear conditions with little to no traffic.
b) In terms of fighting it, the CHP officer seemed a bit rushed. Aside from that, after he gave me the ticket he stuck his head near the window for a few seconds, then started asking if I have marijuana in the car or smoke at all (no). He asked what was in my messenger bag on the passenger seat (books and papers). He then asked if I'd been smoking marijuana (no; neither my girlfriend or I smoke at all; I was driving my girlfriend's car at the time). He then said, and I quote, "I smell marijuana." He then seemed to stop and think for a minute, then let me go. I'm sure he was thinking about whether to search the vehicle, but, of course, since there's nothing in there, he would have come up empty and would have basically performed an illegal search. Now, it could be argued that he was simply fishing with his questions. However, that would be speculation. He said directly "I smell marijuana." Could this be used as evidence that the officer's judgment was impaired since there is no reason that he should be smelling marijuana?
2) What kind of fines can I expect from something like this if I don't contest it? The research I've done online so far has produced wildly inconsistent results. Do I risk increasing the fines if I do contest it?
3) In the same vein as question 2, I've seen several recommendations online to do a Trial by Declaration, claiming that it's basically a freebie and you have nothing to lose. Is this true? Do I risk anything by doing the TBD, like traffic school to remove a potential point on my license?
4) I'm currently unemployed. Can I claim financial difficulty with the fine, especially since I have a clean record so far and am obviously not a repeat offender?
5) I've seen some advice that says to request a county seat, basically getting it moved to a more convenient location for me. I live in Los Angeles County. The advice I've seen seems to indicate that it should be done at the site when you're getting the ticket. Is it too late to change venues and could I get it moved to an LA courthouse?
Any other advice that I haven't thought of would be appreciated, too. Like I said, this is my first ticket and I have no experience dealing with these things at all. I'm asking for technical legal advice, since I know that it can't really be given, and am fine with answers based on experience.
1) a) Is it worth bothering to fight it? The officer claimed I was going 70 mph in a 55 zone. I honestly cannot confirm or deny this because I wasn't looking at the speedometer but was keeping my eyes on the road. For those who don't know, that area of PCH can get curvy without warning. I was driving what felt to be a safe speed in sunny, clear conditions with little to no traffic.
b) In terms of fighting it, the CHP officer seemed a bit rushed. Aside from that, after he gave me the ticket he stuck his head near the window for a few seconds, then started asking if I have marijuana in the car or smoke at all (no). He asked what was in my messenger bag on the passenger seat (books and papers). He then asked if I'd been smoking marijuana (no; neither my girlfriend or I smoke at all; I was driving my girlfriend's car at the time). He then said, and I quote, "I smell marijuana." He then seemed to stop and think for a minute, then let me go. I'm sure he was thinking about whether to search the vehicle, but, of course, since there's nothing in there, he would have come up empty and would have basically performed an illegal search. Now, it could be argued that he was simply fishing with his questions. However, that would be speculation. He said directly "I smell marijuana." Could this be used as evidence that the officer's judgment was impaired since there is no reason that he should be smelling marijuana?
2) What kind of fines can I expect from something like this if I don't contest it? The research I've done online so far has produced wildly inconsistent results. Do I risk increasing the fines if I do contest it?
3) In the same vein as question 2, I've seen several recommendations online to do a Trial by Declaration, claiming that it's basically a freebie and you have nothing to lose. Is this true? Do I risk anything by doing the TBD, like traffic school to remove a potential point on my license?
4) I'm currently unemployed. Can I claim financial difficulty with the fine, especially since I have a clean record so far and am obviously not a repeat offender?
5) I've seen some advice that says to request a county seat, basically getting it moved to a more convenient location for me. I live in Los Angeles County. The advice I've seen seems to indicate that it should be done at the site when you're getting the ticket. Is it too late to change venues and could I get it moved to an LA courthouse?
Any other advice that I haven't thought of would be appreciated, too. Like I said, this is my first ticket and I have no experience dealing with these things at all. I'm asking for technical legal advice, since I know that it can't really be given, and am fine with answers based on experience.
Dalboz on
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The marijuana comment is irrelevant unless California has some law that no other state I've heard of has. It's common procedure to use empty non-threats to get a reaction. The fact that you had nothing wouldn't have made the search illegal, either. If he actually smelled marijuana, there's probable cause. If you acted shifty or defensive when he said he did, there's probable cause. A search doesn't have to find something to be a legal search. In some states implied consent laws extend to drug and alcohol related searches and not just tests anyway, in which cases probable cause be damned, submit to the search or relinquish your license.
Edit: I will toss out re: 4). In Michigan at least, you can claim financial hardship from a fine. On its own you'll rarely get rid of the fine entirely this way, but you can get it reduced or most likely get a payment plan - a friend of mine got a $650 fine, claimed financial hardship and now he's paying $400 at $15 a month.
Nolo has a very good book about fighting California traffic tickets, and they nicely post the first part on their website about "Should you fight your ticket?" Go have a look at that, I don't want to put a link in my first post & look like a spammer.
My take on it is that since you're unemployed, it might be worth putting in the time to try to beat the ticket or reduce it. It is a very time-consuming process, so you have to figure out what your time is worth versus what it would cost you in fines and insurance premium increases. The last time I beat a ticket, it took somewhere between 15 and 20 hours, including preparing a trial by declaration, then spending most of a day at the courthouse for a live hearing - and that was for a ticket where I was so obviously innocent the judge dismissed the ticket as soon as she read it. For a more complicated matter, and without any experience, it might take you longer.
Too late, and unlikely to help here. You have to request it at the time the ticket is issued, and it moves it to the seat of the county where you got the ticket, not just any county you want. So, you would end up at the Government Center in Ventura, which might be where your appearance already was set.
2) Your ticket should tell you the fine amount already. If you don't contest it, it should be that amount. I've never heard of the fine increasing from contesting it, unless you show up in court and confess to some extra charges.
4) I doubt it. But they will probably be willing to work out a payment system for you. You might be able to get the judge to let you do traffic school instead of the fine, but I think that costs money too.
Not sure how it works in California, but in Indiana I can just go online and pay my ticket and be done with it. If I want to fight it, I have to drive to the area the ticket was issued and wait all day just to have my court date set. Then I have to come back again on that date, and wait all day. So that's at least 2 days of missed work for me. It was cheaper for me to just pay the ticket.