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Being threatened with a class B misdemeanor
Element Brian
Peanut Butter ShillRegistered User regular
Peanut Butter ShillRegistered User regular
So this is carried over from the GOP thread. I essentially got detained from school, and the campus police send a report to the city attorney stemming from me bringing a can of soda into the school library.
The school library has a rule that you can bring drinks with lids in, but you cant bring cans.
I walked into the library with a can in my pocket. After about fifty feet a security guard stopped me, told me he wasn't stupid and new I had a drink with me. I asked him if I could just keep it in my backpack and he said no that I had to leave. As he was escorting me out of the library he decided to lecture me about the rules, i said that I think not being able to bring a can of soda into the library is a stupid rule, to which he responded by saying that if I didn't want to follow the rules then I shouldn't be at school. At this point when he kept lecturing me I put my headphones on since we were near the exit and I didn't want to listen to him anymore. He grabbed my headphones off of me to which I responded "dont fucking touch me." At that point he refused to let me leave and called his seargant over and they detained me so they could lecture me for an hour about how bad a person I was, that i was wrong for putting my headphones on because I had to respect them and the claiming that I was throwing a fit (even though i complied to everything they asked me to, i left when they asked me to and the only time I got upset was when he grabbed my headphones off of me). The officer decided he wanted to send it to the city attorney and have them decide if they want to charge me with a b misdemeanor for 'making a scene' at school or public nusance, whatever it is.
So now I'm freaking out. My oldest brother spoke with the school to see if they could drop it but the Seargent isn't backing down. So hopefully the city attorney doesn't pursue it. If he does however I'm most likely facing a plea bargain, and probably a fine, i think class b's go up to $1000. Most of all I am terrified of how this may effect my record. I'm graduating in April in Teaching Social Sciences, so I was hoping to be teaching high school next year, but with this on my record I'm worried how hard it will make for me to find a job.
I guess i'm just looking for legal advice right now, and how this is going to affect me. People have brought up charging the guard for assault for touching my headphones, however I highly doubt that that avenue would have any good result, especially since i just want to graduate from the school. the school cares most about their image, more than anything, so attempting to sue them or the gaurd for anything would most likely fail and turn on my face.
What i want to know is how i can get through this as unscathed as possible.
The school library has a rule that you can bring drinks with lids in, but you cant bring cans.
I walked into the library with a can in my pocket. After about fifty feet a security guard stopped me, told me he wasn't stupid and new I had a drink with me. I asked him if I could just keep it in my backpack and he said no that I had to leave. As he was escorting me out of the library he decided to lecture me about the rules, i said that I think not being able to bring a can of soda into the library is a stupid rule, to which he responded by saying that if I didn't want to follow the rules then I shouldn't be at school. At this point when he kept lecturing me I put my headphones on since we were near the exit and I didn't want to listen to him anymore. He grabbed my headphones off of me to which I responded "dont fucking touch me." At that point he refused to let me leave and called his seargant over and they detained me so they could lecture me for an hour about how bad a person I was, that i was wrong for putting my headphones on because I had to respect them and the claiming that I was throwing a fit (even though i complied to everything they asked me to, i left when they asked me to and the only time I got upset was when he grabbed my headphones off of me). The officer decided he wanted to send it to the city attorney and have them decide if they want to charge me with a b misdemeanor for 'making a scene' at school or public nusance, whatever it is.
So now I'm freaking out. My oldest brother spoke with the school to see if they could drop it but the Seargent isn't backing down. So hopefully the city attorney doesn't pursue it. If he does however I'm most likely facing a plea bargain, and probably a fine, i think class b's go up to $1000. Most of all I am terrified of how this may effect my record. I'm graduating in April in Teaching Social Sciences, so I was hoping to be teaching high school next year, but with this on my record I'm worried how hard it will make for me to find a job.
I guess i'm just looking for legal advice right now, and how this is going to affect me. People have brought up charging the guard for assault for touching my headphones, however I highly doubt that that avenue would have any good result, especially since i just want to graduate from the school. the school cares most about their image, more than anything, so attempting to sue them or the gaurd for anything would most likely fail and turn on my face.
What i want to know is how i can get through this as unscathed as possible.
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This discussion has been closed.
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Seriously, considering that you want to teach, having a lawyer will get you the best advice.
There is seriously no better advice this forum can offer you than this. Do this first before you take another breath.
Was the can even open?
Get a lawyer. Definitely get a lawyer. This sounds to me like a case of the security guard being a stupid asshole and taking his job waaaay too seriously, I think you should be fine but lawyer up and deal with it seriously.
BYU is a weird place.
EB, get a lawyer and then talk to some people at the school.
Specifically, the Dean of Students Office may provide some help.
https://ccr.byu.edu/
Their website promotes conflict resolution through mediators. Who knows, they might facilitate a session with you and the security officer where you can apologize for your behavior and this could be settled in a non-legal way. Unlikely, from your description, but maybe some pressure from the Deans office will bring this guy around. I highly doubt it is the officer's intention to ruin your career. He probably felt you bucked his authority, and he wanted ramifications, which by your attitude seemed like you wouldn't face. So he took action in the only way he could. By agreeing to this meeting, maybe you can convince him you've learned your lesson and further pressing of the issue is not required.
Now get me straight: you shouldn't have to grovel, but sometimes that's the easiest way out of a bind in a matter as silly as pop in library.
And if they cannot help directly, they provide links for legal matters. I'm sure they could direct you on the correct next step regarding your legal council. The Dean's office has handled MUCH larger issues than your case, so I can't imagine they wouldn't be able to help in some regard.
Warframe: TheBaconDwarf
100% agreement on this point.
If it doesn't, then check for a local free legal clinic. As a student, you generally qualify for their services and there's no better way to get free, real advice and representation.
If you have actually been charged, it is time to pursue legal counsel (through your school is probably the easiest/cheapest way to do this.) If you haven't been charged, don't have any further communication with law enforcement on this topic until you have been charged.
ed: pursuing some charge against the officer in question is almost certainly not worth your time, but if you're inclined to waste his in return feel free to pursue your options here (again, probably through school legal dept. first, then complaint to city attorney/PD.)
that's why we call it the struggle, you're supposed to sweat
I ascribe to the philosophy that when it's a situation that could render one unable to pursue the career one is training for, the bolded is never true.
With that in mind, lawyer up and keep lawyered up through any future communication.
1. Don't talk to police beyond that initial communication without a lawyer. They aren't there to be your friends, and you can get in some deep shit if you don't understand the legal system.
2. Don't be a dick to the police, ever. Even if they're being unfair or silly, they're still the police and have way more power to make trouble for you than you have time to deal with. Especially in a case like this, where you were breaking a rule. Yeah, it was a dumb rule, but life is full of dumb rules. Say, "Sorry, sir" and get on with your day.
Also, consider pushing for assault and harassment in a legal way. There is a scale of necessary force and grabbing someone for carrying soda and putting on headphones isn't necessary force. Pretty sure security guards don't have the right to detain you.
If it was me, and I wanted to be a mega ultra dick, I'd put forth to the ombudsman/dean that I wouldn't push for assault and harassment against the school unless the security guard were let go. That is, if my lawyer told me I had a case.
I personally would talk to a lawyer (you can probably find one that provides free consultations) and explain the situation and your concerns. Like Druhim explained, it's a good idea to know ahead of time who your lawyer is and make sure they are familiar with the situation in case you do need them. They should be able to give you good advice or recommendations as well.
Ideally, you want this situation to die where it's at now...the security guard 'scared' you, but nothing comes of it. That means keeping as low a profile as possible, not antagonizing anybody, and hoping you graduate and get a job without ever hearing anything else. Don't try and press charges against the security guard, don't try and go and 'apologize' to him, don't even let him see you or remember you exist if you can help it. Just keep your head down and wait until you hear more. Your university / city may have some kind of online incident report where you can check the status of the incident...find it if you can.
If you do get a summons / ticket / citation / etc, talk to your lawyer again. Suggest going to the Dean of Student's office to have this handled as a school disciplinary issue instead of a criminal / legal issue. Follow the lawyer's advice. Don't talk to anyone about this, no matter how 'informal' it is without your lawyer present. Be very nice and polite about it though, play a concerned and professional, but not scared kid, maybe even tell them 'I talked to my parents and we agreed it would be best not to talk to anyone without our lawyer present.' That implies your parents are involved and will probably pay for your lawyer...that tells the investigator you're not an easy mark and not going to just plea down.
No matter what, be ready to do whatever it takes for this to go away. Apologize, grovel, take full responsibility. IF your lawyer thinks that's best. If you do end up in court or a hearing, take full responsibility for 'being rude and losing your composure'.
If you ARE convicted, never, ever, lie about it on a job application. Minor charges like this aren't something you WANT, but they aren't that big of a deal in most hiring. A ton of people have underage drinking, public nuisance / intoxication, even drunk driving charges and it doesn't matter much when getting a job.
Also, in Utah you can get your record expunged for a Class B misdemeanor after 4 years. So the absolute worst case scenario is that in 4 years after finishing any probation / paying your fine / etc, it's gone forever. Three years if you plea down to a other misdemeanor or infraction.
So, I took a look at BYU and it looks like their campus officers are considered police officers with full law enforcement powers. So they can issue a citation and the appropriate local, state, or federal authority would review the citation / report, and pursue charges if they choose.
The disciplinary process at BYU appears to be a completely separate track, and the Review Council Procedures explicitly state that disciplinary sanctions aren't subject to change because criminal charges are dismissed / reduced / resolved for or against the student.
If the officers actually filed a report with the city attorney, they would file a report with the university as well. Element Brian will probably hear something in the next few days to week about it.
The school will schedule a hearing within a few weeks, which can suck because anything he says to defend himself there can be used against him in a possible criminal case. That's why it's important he talk to a lawyer about his options.
I'd try to speak with the Seargent myself and see if an personally delivered apology would be enough to put this ordeal behind.
Note, this code is probably crazy unconstitutional..
Do not do this.
And when you flash the cash don't say anything, let their eyes do the talking.
Second'd. Just. Get. The lawyer. If you're being charged with something and you think your job might be at stake, then the first thing you do needs to be to at least consult a lawyer. Do not talk to anyone else before you do this. Very few of us are lawyers who can really say "yeah, talking to this person or that who happens to be a police officer totally won't be taken as an admission or held against you in any way." And since they are affiliated with the school, the same goes for anyone there.
We absolutely, positively, 100% CANNOT give you legal advice here. Even the few who are actually qualified CANNOT LEGALLY advise you because you are not their client. Your OP says that you are asking for legal advice (which escaped my notice the first time I read it through, or I would have closed it then), and there is no one here who can give you that. No one SHOULD be giving it to you except a qualified lawyer. You need to go find one of those.