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Watchmen.

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    Herr CaesarHerr Caesar Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    Needed more talking dogs.

    Herr Caesar on
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    Calamity JaneCalamity Jane That Wrong Love Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    Guuud dog?

    Edit: I want a poster of those bullets going through that guy.

    Calamity Jane on
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    AlgertmanAlgertman Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    Anjin-San wrote: »
    Guuud dog?

    Edit: I want a poster of those bullets going through that guy.

    I'd frame that bitch and put it on my living room wall for all to masturbate over

    Algertman on
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    CharmyCharmy Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    Easily among the greatest works ever created for the medium. I guess you can always argue that some other book is a little better, but it's pretty much indisputable that Watchmen is among the best.

    Yeah. That's pretty much it. I love the whole thing to death.

    Charmy on
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    PJBROWNPJBROWN Registered User new member
    edited March 2007
    2 years ago, I read Watchmen for the third time, and that book was even better than the previous 2 times. I seriously felt that if it were worth the effort, I would've gone home, taken all of my comics and trades(barring Garth Ennis stuff and DKR) and set them on fire, and just keep Watchmen. There are comics...and then there's the Watchmen.

    PJBROWN on
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    Red or AliveRed or Alive Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    From Hell's better, but doesn't quite use the medium as well.

    Clearly, Alan Moore must be cloned. For the good of the land.

    Red or Alive on
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    DoodmannDoodmann Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    I'm gonna go ahead and throw out Dark Knight Returns. I enjoyed reading it more. I think a lot of watchman love also comes from groups that read it when it came out. I just read it this fall.

    Doodmann on
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    HooraydiationHooraydiation Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    Was the average comics reader reading books like Watchmen when Watchmen first came out? I know the people who consume comics most are males in the late 20's to early 30's, but I'm not sure if that means they were reading comics for as long as they've been able to read.

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    Red or AliveRed or Alive Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    DKR's a lot more visceral. It embraces costumed bad-assery, while Watchmen really just mocks it.

    Ultimately, they're two very different books doing two very different things.

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    Sharp101Sharp101 TorontoRegistered User regular
    edited March 2007
    Well, watchmen came out 21 years ago (1986)

    That would make the average Comic Demographic of the time (lets say 18-25) now be around 39-46 years old.

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    DoodmannDoodmann Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    Ok I was more thinking that I didn't even exist in 1984 and even if you were younger than 18 when it came out and read it later you were alive at the time. I am just pointing out it is a cold war era story and the current average comic demographic wasnt there.

    Doodmann on
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    LanglyLangly Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    Doodmann wrote: »
    Ok I was more thinking that I didn't even exist in 1984 and even if you were younger than 18 when it came out and read it later you were alive at the time. I am just pointing out it is a cold war era story and the current average comic demographic wasnt there.

    That's true, but the fear that's running through the book isn't totally inaccessible. It's about the cold war, but the build up is WW3 and nuclear war. I was looking through it the other day, and it still gives me the heebie jeebies. There's still easy comparisons to draw, even if it's not exactly the same.

    Langly on
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    SonosSonos Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    Sharp101 wrote: »
    Well, watchmen came out 21 years ago (1986)

    That would make the average Comic Demographic of the time (lets say 18-25) now be around 39-46 years old.

    fun fact: i read it first at 13 around '87 but didn't get it till i read it in college a few years later. interesting? no.

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    Bob The MonkeyBob The Monkey Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    The "Russian invades Afghanistan" (God I hope I've quoted that right) panel had more of an impact on me than anything else I've read in comics.

    The power of those three words on the front of a newspaper, and their implications, is immeasurable.

    Bob The Monkey on
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    BitstreamBitstream Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    This book gets better every time I read it. Every panel is packed with little clues and subtle hints to what's going on. Plus, after reading through once all of the signs and posters and such take on whole new meanings. I'm with the "best use of the comic book medium" camp, though I really can't think of another book I like quite as well.

    Maybe 1602, but that's for entirely different and nerdy reasons.

    [Edit] - I should add that this book also wins my "best visceral gut-punch moment" award. The first time I read the last chapter was amazing.

    Bitstream on
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    LuxLux Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    Bitstream wrote: »
    This book gets better every time I read it. Every panel is packed with little clues and subtle hints to what's going on. Plus, after reading through once all of the signs and posters and such take on whole new meanings. I'm with the "best use of the comic book medium" camp, though I really can't think of another book I like quite as well.

    Maybe 1602, but that's for entirely different and nerdy reasons.

    [Edit] - I should add that this book also wins my "best visceral gut-punch moment" award. The first time I read the last chapter was amazing.

    Ah, yeah. Probably one of the best parts of the book. I remember wondering why all of these familiar supporting characters were being brought together in the same place and then - oh, shit. Those full page shots of the city after were amazing. The only other time I can remember being hit like that by a comic book was in Kingdom Come.

    Lux on
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    jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited March 2007
    Dave Gibbons really doesn't get as much credit as he should for Watchmen. A whole issue's worth of pages and panels layed out like a Rorscharch test? All of the little nick-nacks packed in every panel? The different designs for the different eras of heroes? Just phenomenal work.

    jkylefulton on
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    hambonehambone Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    I read an interview with Gibbons where he was talking about the happy face motif.

    It started as just a little piece of "flair" for the comedian, to contrast against his black leather costume and flamethrower and such, but then Moore turned it into a major theme of the book.

    The happy face is the most basic "comic" in existence, it's perhaps the first drawing that a baby can recognize as a symbol of a person. Splattering it with blood was a way of showing the reader what Moore and Gibbons were doing with Watchmen.

    Rorshach's mask takes the theme in the opposite direction, moving from the symbolic representation of humanity to the abstract concepts of anger and fear.

    You just don't get that kind of depth out of other comics. If I'm wrong about that, I'd sure like to know.

    hambone on
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    Herr CaesarHerr Caesar Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    I still think that over half of "genius literary devices" that authors employ are pure coincidences.

    Herr Caesar on
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    jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited March 2007
    In the afterward of the Graphitti HC, both Moore and Gibbons say as much (ie there was a lot of coincidence involved).

    jkylefulton on
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    Herr CaesarHerr Caesar Registered User regular
    edited March 2007
    In the afterward of the Graphitti HC, both Moore and Gibbons say as much (ie there was a lot of coincidence involved).
    I should probably get around to reading all that supplemental material. I did spend $50 on that book.

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    Disturbed_1Disturbed_1 Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    I just finished it like ten mintues ago and it is truly a GREAT MINDFUCK!

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    HooraydiationHooraydiation Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    I just finished it like ten mintues ago and it is truly a GREAT MINDFUCK!

    Really? I'd have considered it fairly straightforward compared to something like, say, The Filth.

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    Disturbed_1Disturbed_1 Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Havent read that. Is that one good?

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    HooraydiationHooraydiation Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Havent read that. Is that one good?

    Yeah, but obviously it's a mindfuck.

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    Disturbed_1Disturbed_1 Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Whats it about?

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    AlgertmanAlgertman Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Whats it about?

    fucking with your mind

    Algertman on
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    augustaugust where you come from is gone Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Filth.

    In every sense of the word.

    august on
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    Disturbed_1Disturbed_1 Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    What company published it? ANd how much?

    Disturbed_1 on
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    HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Watchmen is good but its goodness completely varies on the situation of the person reading it, in every possible way.

    If you read it when it came out in 81, you're right in the middle of the cold war. The soviest invading Afghanistan, and then starting world war 3 was a very real possibility. Everything in that book was very real in 81.

    I missed it and didn't read it until recently. The Cold War ended, Russia in fact DID invade Afghanistan, and World War 3 didn't happen. Sure it still could, but the possibility seems far less real now, than it did in the 80s.

    And this is just one example. Watchmen is a great read, but I can't think of any other book that has become more overhyped and eventually overrated in the entire medium. That doesn't mean it's bad, it's not, it's great! but I don't think it's nearly as good as most people seem to.

    Hardtarget on
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    The LuggageThe Luggage Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    '81, eh?

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    MenaceMenace regular
    edited April 2007
    I dunno. I just finished reading it for the first time a few minutes ago and I thought it was fantastic.

    Menace on
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    Disturbed_1Disturbed_1 Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    I wasent around in 81 but i still know about cold war and all that so as the talked about it and you saw the paper that said Russian invade it still was VERY shocking.

    Disturbed_1 on
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    HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    edited April 2007
    '81, eh?


    It turns out it was 87! for some reason I always thought it originally came out in 81. wierd

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    HooraydiationHooraydiation Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    Watchmen is a great read, but I can't think of any other book that has become more overhyped and eventually overrated in the entire medium.

    Dark Knight Returns gets my vote.

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    CharmyCharmy Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    Watchmen is a great read, but I can't think of any other book that has become more overhyped and eventually overrated in the entire medium.

    Dark Knight Returns gets my vote.

    Seconded.

    From what I've seen, Watchmen deserves every bit of praise heaped on it; it passes the literary test in that the deeper you dig, the more complex and rich and relevant it all seems. On the other hand, if you dig too far into The Dark Knight Returns, all you get is a hole.

    Miller's recent work is bad in the way that it calls attention to the flaws in his earlier work. Seeing what he's doing now encourages people to go back and realize, hey, he was doing the same thing all along.

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    DJ EebsDJ Eebs Moderator, Administrator admin
    edited April 2007
    I was kind of underwhelmed by Dark Knight Returns. I really liked Year One, though.

    Although it's hard to argue against the effect DKR had on the industry. Same with Watchmen.

    DJ Eebs on
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    jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited April 2007
    People that were around DC offices at the time will tell you that Watchmen had a direct impact on DKR - editors were spreading photocopied pages of Watchmen around to the other talent, and Miller changed parts of DKR in response. That's why the tone changes from the first two issues to the last two.

    jkylefulton on
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    MenaceMenace regular
    edited April 2007
    Has Hayter's script for the movie been released/leaked at all or anything?

    I am curious to see how they will be able to adapt this for the big screen.

    Menace on
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    hughtronhughtron __BANNED USERS regular
    edited April 2007
    Watchmen might be really literary and deep and trend-setting, but it's also not a very fun comic to read. I am 100% sure that it is because I am functionally twelve-years-old, but I'd rather read pretty much anything else than slog through Watchmen again.

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