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Concerning college, careers, and uncertainty
OtistheGuard
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
I don't know what I want to do with my life.
Ever since early High School I had the idea of being a programmer stuck in my head. It basically was the only job I could see myself making some money, and actually creating something. I wanted to make video games. I wanted to create the next Starcraft or Half-life. However, as I've grown up I'm apprehensive of being another cubical occupant. The chances of getting a job with the right company, or getting myself in a position to influence design is low. So basically I've written off programming to a hobby only. Perhaps I'll make mods, but that has yet to be seen.
Since college I've also gotten a number of new interests: partying, the environment, reading, writing, fitness, music, politics, philosophy, outdoor sports. I can't decide which one to follow, and how. So what I am asking you all is for advice. Have you felt the same thing before? Did you have one of the above interests? Did you follow it, and become successful?
All I'm looking for is a moderately successful career where I have time to do the side projects and hobbies I enjoy, while not totally despising my job. I don't want to look back at my life at age 50 and feel that I wasted my best potential at a desk.
Thanks for any and all advice. If you have any questions, be free to ask. I'm desperate for help in working this out.
Ever since early High School I had the idea of being a programmer stuck in my head. It basically was the only job I could see myself making some money, and actually creating something. I wanted to make video games. I wanted to create the next Starcraft or Half-life. However, as I've grown up I'm apprehensive of being another cubical occupant. The chances of getting a job with the right company, or getting myself in a position to influence design is low. So basically I've written off programming to a hobby only. Perhaps I'll make mods, but that has yet to be seen.
Since college I've also gotten a number of new interests: partying, the environment, reading, writing, fitness, music, politics, philosophy, outdoor sports. I can't decide which one to follow, and how. So what I am asking you all is for advice. Have you felt the same thing before? Did you have one of the above interests? Did you follow it, and become successful?
All I'm looking for is a moderately successful career where I have time to do the side projects and hobbies I enjoy, while not totally despising my job. I don't want to look back at my life at age 50 and feel that I wasted my best potential at a desk.
Thanks for any and all advice. If you have any questions, be free to ask. I'm desperate for help in working this out.
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Lotro (Landroval): Cleomenes [Champion], Ilithano [Captain]
OtistheGuard on
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Don't think you have to find your path right away and follow it hard. Yes, some people do that, and if it works for them, then thats awesome, but don't feel you have to. Just live life, work a job to make money but still lets you live your life, and just try and find what you want to do. That's what I'm doing now, and it's working fine.
Just remember: I don't mean ditch all responsibilities you have and become a hippie. I mean, just don't take life too seriously. You still have to work to make a living, but don't work a job that you are going to have to pull long weeks and stressful hours if you don't love it. Just find a job to make a living and then live your life, write, play sports, whatever you feel you want to try until you find that one spark that makes you want to go right after life.
What tipped me in the right direction was an internship working with .NET programming and databases. Not very exciting but I really enjoyed doing it and ended up searching for a job within the .NET field. Got kinda lucky and wound up with a .NET job writing software on a small team. I really enjoy it and definitely attribute it to the internship.
The point is, if you're looking into the IT world, internships are a great introduction so you can determine if this is a hobby or you can do this as a career.
Programmer in a larger state or government agency. Typically no OT or on-call required, good benifits, good job security, decent pay.
Cons would be lower pay than in the private sector, working for "The Man", possibly be forced to work on Cobol/Pascal.
It is pretty hard to avoid working in a cubicle regardless of which industry you go into. There are exceptions, but almost all of them are non-office jobs. Despite the negative rep that cubicles receive, they really aren't as bad as they are typically portrayed. Also, many programming positions that I've been in have had some time spent in cubicles and some spent in the lab.
but basically just take classes, see which ones you prefer most, and you can always double major or have a minor in one thing or another. i'm still deciding whether i should minor in industrial technology, or maybe have my major be industrial tech and my minor be english. we're all in this together, so good luck.
When I was in my adolescence/midteens I thought I was going to be such an awesome programmer (of games of course, nobody wants to write the next spreadsheet software). Programming was so fun and creative and powerful... and then I tried to do it for other people. Oh man, the love affair was over. It's understandable really, if you want to be a professional programmer it ceases to be about you, and you have to learn all the boring methodology and more importantly how to work on, in, or with other people's code without just reverse engineering it and starting from scratch like I always wanted to do.
But you've already said you wanted to make it a hobby, so what to do with the rest of your life?
Jesus, there's a question. After I decided programming was bad for me, I thought law and politics might be better. Working in the law school of the university I was attending killed that dream for me, as law schools are like factories designed to rip any idealism and ethics from people. So, I went into IT support, went from job to job, sometimes willingly, sometimes fired, whatever. I've held no less than 10 jobs in the last 3 years, and it's been a meaningful experience.
You need to be patient. It's kind of a cliche I know. Ultimately I've learned from all this dancing around that what you do for money means practically nothing, especially in the short term. If you don't have your dream career right out of college, it's not surprising, few people do.
You need to take a longer view of your life, and what you want it to mean. When you're several dozen years old, what do you want to be known for? If you can't answer that, just do whatever work you can tolerate until you can answer that, and then work toward it. Sometimes you must wait to find meaning.
Also, let me tell you, parenthood snaps you out of a lot things. A lot of "adults" think that "adulthood" doesn't really begin until you have kids, and now that I'm staring down the barrel of the baby gun, I'm starting to think that mindset is correct. I'm not through that transition far enough to give any advice, and you're not (to my knowledge) facing that immediate problem, but I think it requires bearing in mind when it comes to keeping perspective. Ultimately, while you begin your life learning and living for yourself, if you don't end it having taught people or living in some ways for others (most naturally for one's own children, and I don't mean this altruistically either, I'm an objectivist), than whatever you might gain dies with you. In this regard, what you learn and how you live is ultimately only as important as what you teach of it. Not that you should teach professionally, that aspect can come through parenting or mentoring, but the arch of human development is about building upon knowledge, and finding fulfillment (I think) comes in large part from finding where you want to fit in that chain.
Do politicians now-a-days still start out in another field besides law, or has it become single minded? Because maybe I'd like to pull a Benjamin Franklin.
XBL: Aspis 9
Lotro (Landroval): Cleomenes [Champion], Ilithano [Captain]
start small and get on the city council, and realize you would need to get a REAL job as a fallback. running campaigns cost a LOT of money.
Well, you certainly don't need to run for office(and be subject to all the scrutiny) to make a difference. Staffers for officeholders do very important work, and you don't need a law degree to work on government budget or policy.
You've already stated that you don't think you could stand the idea of working in a cubicle all day long. My question to this is why? Is it because its indoors or you think you wouldn't have enough interaction with other people? Once you know how you want to spend your days, try to find a job or career that is conducive to that. Also, don't be afraid to make mistakes and "quit". I know a lot of people look down on "quitting", but it can actually be a very good thing if you're quitting to move towards something else. Try out different jobs - and really try them. If after six months (when you've had time to really learn the job) you don't like it, feel free to move on to something else, but make sure you have something to move on to.
I am in the exact same boat. The question of what I should do with my life has been the hardest question to answer. I've done my 2 years and got an Associate in Arts degree, but that doesn't help me much. I've been debating for the longest time on whether to get a quick 6 month certification, or go the Bachelor's Degree route.
There have been three major rules I've been trying to follow regarding a future career.
1. It has to be a "sure thing"; A degree that guarantees me a future right away.
2. It has to play to my strengths; I don't want to struggle with a field I have no knowledge of, and end up miserable as a result.
3. It has to allow me to be creative; I don't want to be a worker bee, I want to stand out somewhat and offer my own input.
The first career I attempted after I received my AA was a film major. The classes were quite fun (horror movie class!), but before my semester was over, I had a talk with one of my professors. He admitted that getting a solid career in film was a long shot; he tried it himself, and the most he could manage was the teaching job he had now. So I dropped that dream.
I then tried to get a certification in the IT field (specifically, Management Information Systems). I figured I was good enough with computers, since my family always came to me whenever they had problems with their connection or hardware (though to be fair, my family is incredibly inept with the workings of modern PCs). I currently have about four classes left, but I feel that I've bit off more than I could chew; my last class was a nightmare, focusing on binary calculations and sub-routing a group of PCs together. I don't know if I chose the correct IT field, or if I'm just not skilled enough to continue.
Even if I do pull off the IT certification, I've been in talks with my family to pursue a bachelor's in another field. I've been told to try Graphic Design, which as far as I know involves using Photoshop and other tools to create website layouts for companies and so forth. I've been slightly hesitant with pursuing the career for the simple fact that I can't draw, but I'm not sure if that has any bearing in graphic designing.
Like most gamers, I've considered the thought of working in game development, especially in script or scenario writing. But I've read the horror stories and even seen a few documentaries about game development, so I know it's a nightmare profession. Probably not for me.
So basically, I have no idea what I want, and it's killing me inside, frankly. I am fairly confident in my writing skills, so I would love to turn that into a profession, but I haven't seen any oppurtunities that follow Rule #1, which I consider most important. I need to get something that's stable and will guarantee me a life on my own before I dream about writing novels or anything.
I'll be keeping a close eye on this thread, as I could use all the advice that anyone can give.
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I've had to advise people very close to me about this sort of mindset. You need to pay your dues, that requires dedication to work that is sometimes boring and/or hard as all hell. If you really want to be in that field, if it really is your dream, that won't matter. Furthermore, if your dream is a "sure thing" and/or easy ride, good luck ever finding that. I hope you're a really talented or charismatic artist, because that is the only category of work that I can think of that will give you that opportunity, but even then you will have to work very hard in the beginning to establish yourself and create an image that people will later be willing to toss wealth at whereafter you have your easy ride.
You know what would really help above all else? If there was a site that lists the kinds of degrees you can get, their descriptions, and (most importantly) the kind of classes you'll have to take. I would feel much more confident about choosing a career path if I knew what I was getting into.
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a) are so demanding or difficult or offputting in some way that demand is pretty high (because these are not glamorous jobs) and the salary is pretty high as well (or else we would have no garbage men, no king crab fishermen etc)
b) require highly specific vocational training, which is fine for the lucky people whose interests match the profession, but for the rest of us it wouldn't be worth it to pursue something outside our inclinations if it requires years of training
c) need a lot of interchangeable low-skilled manpower
I understand the desire for security, and it'd be nice to have it built in to your job title. Reality is you are far more responsible for your career than you want to be. You don't just get your degree, fill out an app, and sit on a middle class wage for the next few decades. Your value in the workplace depends directly on the quality of work you do. It doesn't matter where you go to school (with exceptions in some fields), as long as you do good work. A Harvard grad can get straight A's and still have limited opportunities beyond slinging lattes if he shows no passion outside of schoolwork.
There are limited prospects in film, writing, gaming, etc, but SOMEBODY is working these jobs. They didn't get there by taking the right courses at the right school or having the proper certs. Successful writers are writing all the time, successful filmmakers are working on a project or thinking of their next project all the time. It helps to be a talented, charismatic artist, but a mediocre artist can have success (look at Nickelback or Michael Bay or Dan Brown) if they're DOING ART ALL THE TIME
I went to a world class comp sci school and the people who graduated and were happy with their lives, with good jobs, were the people who were already coding in their free time without having to be assigned any homework. The ones who got the degree and the prestige but had no body of work or interest in the field to show for it are working shitty jobs, working in another field, or are unemployed.
Following this rule #1 and limiting yourself to "sure things" is going to kill you. While you are rejecting options that you have interest in because someone says that field has no growth, someone else, someone a little less inhibited, a little more of a risk-taker, is taking all the good work. Risk, within reason, is a good thing. It's scary and you'd have had a hell of a time telling me this 2 years ago, but it really makes life more fulfilling.
I can't stress enough the importance of going to a good school (like say for film) for the importance of developing early industry connections, having a good reputation and for networking with your peers who will be future leaders in your field.
Also, there is no such thing as a sure thing...ever. My college class graduated in 2002 - we were the graduating class immediately following 9/11. What this meant was that the economy was crap and the job market for new grads even worse - no matter what you got your degree in. I knew a ton of people who were unable to get a job in any field, whether there had been demand there before or not. Most of them job hunted for a year and then went back to school to do something to improve their chances of getting a decent job while waiting for the economy to improve. Before 9/11 I would say about half of these people would have been able to find a job relatively easily. So again, no such thing as a sure thing.
http://fantasy.premierleague.com/my-leagues/
The join code for the CLASSIC league: 214755-65927
The join code for the HEAD-TO-HEAD league: 5294-3346
Like I said, I'd love to just pick something and stick with it, but I'm constantly afraid of picking a subject that may be out of my league. If there was a site or something that told you in detail the kind of classes you'd have to take for each degree, it would help me a lot.
Also, I just had a talk with my mom over how I should spend the summer taking various courses in fields such as writing or photography, of which I have interest in. It's a pretty good idea, but what kind of courses should I take? I want to benefit from them, especially if they help me in making a permanent decision.
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Your institution's course catalog should have it.
In this day and age, a diploma in something computing based will set you up well for pretty much any other line of employment. So IMO you may as well do the course, gain some more knowledge for your hobby, get a useful diploma and the option to start making more money than you ever would working part/full time somewhere that doesn't require you to have a recognised skill set.
I started college majoring in computer science and quickly became disinterested. I didn't know what I wanted to do. I wanted to drop out of college but didn't want to disapoint my family by leaving early. I was on scholarship so it wasn't really costing my anything to continue on at school. I changes majors 3 or 4 times. I tried computer graphics, engineering, chemistry. Eventually I just sat down with the catalogue and figured out what I was closest to actually graduating in, registered for all the classes I needed to graduate that semester (22 hours worth) and got a B.S.in Psychology.
Graduating didn't fix anything. I still didn't know what I wanted to be doing. I quickly learned you can't really get a job doing anything with a B.S. in psychology. I went to work doing tech support, and after a few years working for a few different companies, I'd managed to work my way up to being a network administrator for a fortune 500 company. I was making a good living, but I didn't really like my job. I still didn't really know what I wanted to be doing, but I knew I didn't want to be doing that.
I eventually quit my job and went to law school, which has been the best thing I've ever done. I didn't figure out that this was what I wanted to do until I was 30.
So I guess I'd better get around to some advice. My advice is not to worry about it right now, and just keep your options open. If you don't know what you want to do, you don't know. Know one else can tell you, and you might not figure it out on your own for a while. Get a degree in something. Anything. Keep your grades up. You never know when you might want to go to grad school, and they actually care about your grades. Major in something you enjoy studying, and don't worry about what job might actually go with it. Seriously consider going to law school, as that will definately give you the option to explore several of the areas you've shown interest in (writing, politics, the enviornment, philosophy). If you're worried about your ability to make a difference in this life, it's a good way to go. Good lawyers can not only make a decent living, but they can have a positive effect on a wide range of areas.
I hope this helps. I know it's frustrating. All you can do is keep your mind and your options open and wait for things to sort themselves out.
Do you still have/know where I can find those documentaries ? Why was it a nightmare profession ?
http://briankim.net/blog/2006/07/how-to-find-what-you-love-to-do
I went to that site and just followed through with it and I came to a conclusion that somewhat led me in a direction, maybe it'll produce different results for you. I'm in the same boat as you.. too many things I want to do, thus I'm an undeclared/undecided major.
As the horror stories go, you get 80 hour weeks of unpaid overtime, of mindless soulbreaking work that has none of the fun of the end product.
Plus there's only millions of kids out there with CS degrees who want to make video games, so it's tough to get into and you're easily replaced.
So as far as degrees go, I've been leaning toward Graphic Design or Criminal Justice.
It's been said that graphic designing might be a good fit for me, as it focuses on my enjoyment of using a PC, my creative impulse, and that according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics page, expected to have the most new jobs in the future. I had taken a Flash course while I was majoring in film, and while I didn't think much of it then, I feel that if the majority of classes were similar to that, I might have a lot of fun as well as do well once I get the hang of Photoshop and other designer tools.
I have no real knowledge of the kind of courses or employment involved with Criminal Justice, as most of my interest comes from my love of the criminal field. I daydream about what it's like to work in the law enforcement, but I'm not sure if it's really the career path for me. I know the TV shows like Law and Order, CSI and especially 24 exaggerate, but I still revel in the idea of working in a team to help sweep the scum off th streets. But again, I have no idea what kind of classes would be involved. All I can guess is that it would involve a lot of heavy reading and memorization.
Aside from making a decision between those two choices, I'm also debating whether to finish my four or five remaining classes for my Managment Information Systems technical degree, or give it up and focus elsewhere. The last class I took was incredibly difficult, and I keep fearing that I've gotten way over my head as things could get far more complex (router maintenence, workgroups, pinging, binary, etc). Should I finish what I started as well as working toward graphic design or criminal justice.
Finally, I'm wondering whether I should spend the summer to start on one of my two chosen degrees, or join up in various courses that could either help me learn some new skills (photography, photoshop) or give me a sneak peek at the degrees I've considered taking.
I'd love to hear your opinions on the matter. I'm planning to see a consoler tomorrow, but I haven't entirely decided what questions to ask.
Also, what's the story on online courses? There seem to be a varied selection relating to graphic design.
http://www.allgraphicdesign.com/onlinecourses.html
Given that it's a computer course, would it work out?
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