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[Nosgoth] Summoner out, vampire spellcaster shenanigans ensue

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Posts

  • GaslightGaslight Registered User regular
    edited August 2014
    Truth be told pounce doesn't do that much damage. It is not going to result in your death unless you were already low health or the vampires immediately follow-up. If you are outnumbered by vampires and don't have a way to create time and space with AoE you are probably fucked anyway, that's the nature of playing Human in this game. If you are one-on-one with a vamp, don't forget to make use of your dodge (spacebar by default). Also don't forget/fail to realize that humans can melee (like I did for my first several hours in the game). It's not nearly as good as a vamp melee attack of course and you shouldn't be spamming it but it's better than waiting to reload while you get torn apart.

    If you happen to be playing Scout, the default primary (Q) ability, the knife throw, is a good "Get out of my face" tool because it causes a brief interrupt/stun. If you're a Hunter, try to hit somebody with your Bolas and take them out of the fight as soon as you get back up from the pounce. If you're outnumbered and going down is pretty much guaranteed, try to drop your AoE if you have one before expiring... Volley/Turret if you're a Scout for example... to deny the vampire team executions, or so you get to watch in the killcam and laugh as they get riddled when they do try an execution.

    Gaslight on
  • Blue mapBlue map Hello darkness, my old friend. Registered User regular
    Invisible wrote: »
    Invisible wrote: »
    Nosgoth codes:
    PEGODA-275-CATANE-005
    NEJULE-755-JAGAVA-005
    TAJOFA-227-CODOCE-010
    DABOFA-225-GAGAPA-200
    VENOMA-955-BATOCE-211
    DACUMA-927-CAYOTE-225
    BAJOLA-375-JAWATA-201
    VEBODA-977-BOTOFE-226

    BAGULA-205-JODOBA-231
    FENUFA-205-CAWOCA-020

    Enjoy! Comes with 250 gold.

    As far as I'm aware the codes that do not have a strikethrough are still good. If you use one or if one doesn't work, let me know so I can remove it.
    Hey thanks for the code. I'll make sure to put it to good use.

    My Steam profile thing: http://steamcommunity.com/id/Blue_map/ Battlenet: BlueMap#1493
  • StericaSterica Yes Registered User, Moderator mod
    If a vampire gets a pounce off then the other three vampires will probably immediately get in on that shit. The fight is effectively 3v4 for a few seconds, which is a definite advantage for the vampires.

    YL9WnCY.png
  • Ratsult2Ratsult2 Registered User regular
    edited August 2014
    Patch today:


    Boosters

    Fixed another bug causing some users to be unable to successfully equip boosters, causing you to "see" the booster as equipped but not receive the correct bonuses.


    Matchmaking

    Fixed an issue with party matchmaking causing permanent 4v3 matches.
    Optimized how we retrieve the list of servers to reduce impact on internet connections when searching
    While the full overhaul to matchmaking is still in the works, tweaks have been made to the existing system to improve the chances of finding an ideal match (nearby, of similar level). Searches may take longer to complete as a result as the system now spends longer widening your search incrementally.


    Parties and Playlist Level Requirements

    Players too low level to join a specific playlist will now be allowed to if a member of their party is qualified for that playlist.
    For example, a level 2 will be able to play in the "Team Deathmatch" playlist if a higher level friend invites him to a party and searches for it. We want friends to be able to play together and never see a screen where they are ineligible for all playlists on offer.
    We still prevent players from joining a playlist they are too high level to join. Players above level 10 cannot play "New Recruit" regardless of who they party with.


    Optimization

    Further optimization on Sommerdamm and The Fane maps


    Perks and Item Statistics

    Fixed a bug causing Vampire Special Abilities to not receive the correct random buff and debuff values. They are meant to be identical to those Human weapons receive, but they were using the "minor" versions of buff/debuffs instead. This has been corrected and your items will automatically update.
    Cooldown perks and random item stats have been reduced in effectiveness as they were too powerful relative to other options.
    "Undying Wisdom" and "Quick Wits" perks now reduce cooldowns by 10% (was 15%) (NOTE: Quick Wits change did not make it into this build, but will be reduced next patch).
    Random item statistics now reduce or increase cooldowns by 5% (was 10%)


    Bugs

    Fixed multiple bugs with Siege Mode objectives not displaying correctly.
    Fixed a corpse in Sommerdamm that was preventing damage from grenades and other AOE effects
    Fixed Deceiver's default armor not properly using APEX cloth
    Fixed a bug with Deceiver's silhouette outline interacting poorly with Backstab
    Fixed a bug preventing Sentinels from flying for half a second after vaulting over a wall or obstacle


    Ratsult2 on
  • DocshiftyDocshifty Registered User regular
    If a vampire gets a pounce off then the other three vampires will probably immediately get in on that shit. The fight is effectively 3v4 for a few seconds, which is a definite advantage for the vampires.

    Not really, since the pouncer is taken out of the fight as well.

  • CorehealerCorehealer The Apothecary The softer edge of the universe.Registered User regular
    1) Don't get pounced: May seem harsh but pouncing makes a really big, obvious growling noise when they set up. You should be instinctively dodging if you think you're at risk.

    Always be running when you hear the noise, as an added percaution to avoid being pounced if you can hear them but can't see them. Always be moving in general to avoid things like pounces and Sentinel dives, but:
    2) Don't be alone: Because you're a human and vampires will eat you for breakfast pounce or no if no one can support you

    The above is important. Only be alone if you see all the vampires near or on your team, and your trying to flank one or more of them. Otherwise always be looking out for each other and watching the skies and rooftops.
    3) Drop Fire wall if you're an Alch to force them to back off

    Position it at doorways or alleyways or in the path of charging Tyrants for the best effect.
    Though yeah, if you get pounced and no one gets them off early you're absolutely dead and the vampire deserves that kill.

    If you get pounced, usually you will die quickly after, yes. Especially if they are using savage pounce, which is a big damage dealer. If other vampires are around and have finished off your team your 100% screwed. However, if they are still busy with their own targets or aren't there for whatever reason, and it's you and the Reaver, try:

    - Flinging a bolus at him as Hunter, preferably a poison one, and avoid contact with him while shooting.

    - Fire wall as Alchemist. If other vampires are present, it is especially important.

    - Life Drain and Hex Shot/Disabling Vice as Prophet, to put the hurt on him and get some health back as well as remove his dodge or speed boost if he puts it up.

    - Scouts should GTFO and lay an arrow volley down while running, being careful to avoid said volley. DO NOT KNIFE THE REAVER, 9 times out of 10 it will miss or not kill the vampire outright and then you've got no other options or time and end up dead.

    488W936.png
  • Ratsult2Ratsult2 Registered User regular
    Docshifty wrote: »
    If a vampire gets a pounce off then the other three vampires will probably immediately get in on that shit. The fight is effectively 3v4 for a few seconds, which is a definite advantage for the vampires.

    Not really, since the pouncer is taken out of the fight as well.

    Well, the Reaver doesn't have control, but I wouldn't call doing constant damage "taken out of the fight". I get what you are saying though.

    I think the point is still valid. In that situation, the vampires have the advantage. 1v1, 2v2, and 3v3 the vampires have the advantage, it's not until 4v4 that the humans have enough firepower to kill the vampires fast enough. If the vampire team is fast enough to go in as the Reaver pounces, it's a good initiation.

  • Albino BunnyAlbino Bunny Jackie Registered User regular
    Human's job is to keep moving and position such that they can continually force 2v1's through range advantage.

    The vamps job is to lock down humans individually into 1v1's with no supporting fire.

    If you get pounced the vampires are achieving their goal super hard in that it's a 1v1 situation and you can't provide support.

  • DocshiftyDocshifty Registered User regular
    Ratsult2 wrote: »
    Docshifty wrote: »
    If a vampire gets a pounce off then the other three vampires will probably immediately get in on that shit. The fight is effectively 3v4 for a few seconds, which is a definite advantage for the vampires.

    Not really, since the pouncer is taken out of the fight as well.

    Well, the Reaver doesn't have control, but I wouldn't call doing constant damage "taken out of the fight". I get what you are saying though.

    I think the point is still valid. In that situation, the vampires have the advantage. 1v1, 2v2, and 3v3 the vampires have the advantage, it's not until 4v4 that the humans have enough firepower to kill the vampires fast enough. If the vampire team is fast enough to go in as the Reaver pounces, it's a good initiation.

    Yeah, number wise, the larger, the better for humans.

    Now as for the pounce, your team has to essentially be initiating when you land the pounce, or little more than a second after, because you are going to get fucking smashed by the human's teammates. So many times a vamps has pounced a teammate only to eat a Hex Shot immediately, because his team was waiting for the pounce to land before initiating.

  • Ratsult2Ratsult2 Registered User regular
    Backstab is better, but still really hard to land. All of my vampire items got a nice boost.

    ... but matchmaking takes a while now, they say they are working on it though

    Overall a great patch.

  • DocshiftyDocshifty Registered User regular
    I got utterly demolished after the patch, just kept getting matched with immortal founder level 40s. Was somewhat demoralizing.

  • WingedWeaselWingedWeasel Registered User regular
    So I am comfortable at the rate my tyrant play is improving, however on the human side I am a drain on my team every game I think. My biggest issues I think show up when all 4 vamps join the party and there's a bazillion effects all over.

    I am working on my aim which is definitely a problem (prophet), but has anyone else experienced issues with stuttering in these situations. I have a really hard time targeting down vamps. I wanted to play around with video settings last night but didn't get the chance. Maybe I will have to switch back to kbam from controller since it often feels like the vampire movement is too quick for me to really get a solid shot off, don't remember if there are sensitivity settings for controller (can only assume there are). Lot of things to test.

  • DocshiftyDocshifty Registered User regular
    So, apparently if you're a deceiver and you're waiting with your team for the Tyrant to engage so you can stealth up and infect the human team while noming on the scouts picking your bruisers, you're a shitty team baiter. Whatever the fuck that means.

  • TOGSolidTOGSolid Drunk sailor Seattle, WashingtonRegistered User regular
    Docshifty wrote: »
    So, apparently if you're a deceiver and you're waiting with your team for the Tyrant to engage so you can stealth up and infect the human team while noming on the scouts picking your bruisers, you're a shitty team baiter. Whatever the fuck that means.

    You know

    "Teambaiter"

    :winky:

    wWuzwvJ.png
  • DocshiftyDocshifty Registered User regular
    TOGSolid wrote: »
    Docshifty wrote: »
    So, apparently if you're a deceiver and you're waiting with your team for the Tyrant to engage so you can stealth up and infect the human team while noming on the scouts picking your bruisers, you're a shitty team baiter. Whatever the fuck that means.

    You know

    "Teambaiter"

    :winky:

    Like, if the humans were at the blood fountain on The Fane (Uhm...I think the southern end? Near the giant, well, blood fountain, with barricades nearby), I would be standing RIGHT NEXT to our Reaver, literally just above the humans, and the entire team would rag on me for standing so far back and baiting the team.

    My only conclusion is they didn't see my initial engagement and only saw me come back at 250 health to find a snack.

  • XaviarXaviar Registered User regular
    edited August 2014
    So this my friends, is how you reaver:
    3D911149EDF6FC3B3D2A688B66B9E5DA6B26F362
    But not how you human:
    B5AE03AE6BE32A7594865AB33641E182D59D2A3E
    DC5200ADA1739E866921ADC95DC81010B2260625
    At least it was a tie?

    Seriously though, a good tyrant may not show up on the leaderboard, but his engages are what let me do so well. So thank you, tyrants who aren't afraid of dying.

    Xaviar on
  • StericaSterica Yes Registered User, Moderator mod
    I basically can't play since some maps just turn my framerate into a random number generator. Seemingly no rhyme or reason for it, as I can be far away from any fighting and suddenly everything's gone all powerpoint on me.

    YL9WnCY.png
  • Ratsult2Ratsult2 Registered User regular
    edited August 2014
    m9afxJG.jpg

    Also, got picked up by a Sentinel, dropped and caught by another Sentinel before I hit the ground. It was crazy. Then the same thing happened an hour later. :o

    Ratsult2 on
  • GaslightGaslight Registered User regular
    New favorite thing: if you kill a Tyrant at the exact moment he starts his leap attack, he'll still spring into the air, then plummet to the ground as a limp corpse.

  • KonphujunKonphujun Illinois, USARegistered User regular
    edited August 2014
    Gaslight wrote: »
    New favorite thing: if you kill a Tyrant at the exact moment he starts his leap attack, he'll still spring into the air, then plummet to the ground as a limp corpse.

    Similarly, if you get a direct hit on a reaver with the alchemist's primary grenade launcher while he is crouched for a pounce and it kills him, the pounce fires for a split second, the body planks out and it falls to the floor like a normal corpse instead of turning into gibs.

    Konphujun on
    Everything: Konphujun(#1458)
  • GaslightGaslight Registered User regular
    So people in game tonight were saying if somebody leaves a match midway through a round, it will cause that lobby to get "stuck" at 3v4 for the rest of the game. I thought this is what the patch on August 19 was supposed to fix? The patch notes on the main menu even says something about "Fixed issue with parties causing 3v4 matches."

  • DocshiftyDocshifty Registered User regular
    It might cause that on occasion, but numerous times in the middle of a round people have left, only to be replaced without incident.

  • Ratsult2Ratsult2 Registered User regular
    I've put in a lot of time since the patch and only ran into a 3v4 lobby once. I think some form of the bug still exists, but it's really rare.

  • RedthirstRedthirst Registered User regular
    It's strange that when I was using Leap Attack, I mostly attacked with melee, using jump to finish off fleeing enemies. But now I'm trying out Savage Pounce, and I always try engage with it, like I would as Hunter in L4D.

    steam_sig.png
  • Mojo_JojoMojo_Jojo We are only now beginning to understand the full power and ramifications of sexual intercourse Registered User regular
    Well, found a beta key so I'll see how this makes me feel.

    Homogeneous distribution of your varieties of amuse-gueule
  • RedthirstRedthirst Registered User regular
    edited August 2014
    Alchemist feels underpowered compared to other classes... Though I still play her.

    Redthirst on
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  • Albino BunnyAlbino Bunny Jackie Registered User regular
    Redthirst wrote: »
    Alchemist feels underpowered compared to other classes... Though I still play her.

    Alch is the strongest human class. Her weapon has solid DPS and her abilities let her put out some of the hardest burst in the game (once you swap out the flashbang).

  • RedthirstRedthirst Registered User regular
    Redthirst wrote: »
    Alchemist feels underpowered compared to other classes... Though I still play her.

    Alch is the strongest human class. Her weapon has solid DPS and her abilities let her put out some of the hardest burst in the game (once you swap out the flashbang).
    I don't know, I feel like Hunter is stronger. I guess if you hit each and every grenade, then you can deal massive damage. But if you miss, you can easily die while reloading. But I have to agree that her skills are really powerful. Though I'm running a more support build with Flashbang and Healing Mist.

    steam_sig.png
  • Albino BunnyAlbino Bunny Jackie Registered User regular
    Yeah, the Hunter's weapons better (though the Prophet's heavy pistols kind of blow everyone else out the water). It's her abilities that make her insane.

    Honestly I'd drop the support load out unless you're the second alch on the team. Lacking raw killing power will cost you engagements way more than your team having 150/200 extra HP will.

  • RedthirstRedthirst Registered User regular
    Yeah, the Hunter's weapons better (though the Prophet's heavy pistols kind of blow everyone else out the water). It's her abilities that make her insane.

    Honestly I'd drop the support load out unless you're the second alch on the team. Lacking raw killing power will cost you engagements way more than your team having 150/200 extra HP will.
    Well, Prophet can kill because of Hex most of the time.

    But it's hard to tell if her combat skills are that useful. Fire Wall can evaded by vampires pretty easily, unless it's in the chokepoint, or someone disabled vampire with something like Bola so he can't roll away. Besides, you can block youself from escaping from the chokepoint. Flamethrower can be good, but it has low range, takes a second or so to activate, and you can't fire your weapon with it. Besides, as far as I remember if you roll with Flamethrower active, you will cancel it.

    On the other hand, Healing Mist heals about 450 health, which is close to half HP for the full duration, which can really help. I guess Light Bomb is a good thing, since it's instant AoE damage, but I was able to survive some really tight situations and save teammates thanks to it. Though I guess I will try Light Bomb, since I do feel like damage from grenade launcher is not enough.

    steam_sig.png
  • Ratsult2Ratsult2 Registered User regular
    edited August 2014
    I love prophet, but no human weapon out damages the Hunter's repeater if you have deadeye equiped. Combine that with great AOE from the grenade and great control of bola and I think Hunter is the strongest human class. Prophet and Scout are in a good place, but I think Alchemist could use a little love.... mostly because right now, humans are strongest when spread out (but can cover each other) and in a wide open area. Alchemist skills and weapons need things to be bunched up to do the most damage.

    Ratsult2 on
  • Mojo_JojoMojo_Jojo We are only now beginning to understand the full power and ramifications of sexual intercourse Registered User regular
    This has some real potential.

    I've only played a few rounds so far, and I sort of wish the asymmetry between teams was more pronounced but it's sufficient to create some great moments.

    Playing as human all five of us huddled inside a building. Which I spotted the problem with slightly too late. Surprise spy vampire, a smoke bomb and then one of the Johnny-charge-alots came barging in. Total wipeout in a few seconds.

    Pouncing seems a little flakey, but it's early days.

    Homogeneous distribution of your varieties of amuse-gueule
  • RedthirstRedthirst Registered User regular
    Mojo_Jojo wrote: »
    This has some real potential.

    I've only played a few rounds so far, and I sort of wish the asymmetry between teams was more pronounced but it's sufficient to create some great moments.

    Playing as human all five of us huddled inside a building. Which I spotted the problem with slightly too late. Surprise spy vampire, a smoke bomb and then one of the Johnny-charge-alots came barging in. Total wipeout in a few seconds.

    Pouncing seems a little flakey, but it's early days.

    Yeah, apparently the best tactic for humans is to stay in the open and keep distance between yourselves, at the same time maintaining line of sight with your teammates. That way grenades and charges won't hit you, and it will be harder for Deciever to come there unnoticed, since you know where each of your teammates are.

    steam_sig.png
  • Albino BunnyAlbino Bunny Jackie Registered User regular
    I've found the best tactic (but which only really works with a pre-made) is to try and stay mobile and migrate between the open areas a whole bunch. Basically the same strategy but adds two advantages:

    1) Vampires don't get set up time to go in on you because you keep moving

    2) You can shamelessly spam healing shrines because you wont be in the area long

    Which really help keep the humans ranged edge. If you force the vamps to chase you it'll stretch out their engage and open them up to poke alot of the time.

  • RedthirstRedthirst Registered User regular
    I've found the best tactic (but which only really works with a pre-made) is to try and stay mobile and migrate between the open areas a whole bunch. Basically the same strategy but adds two advantages:

    1) Vampires don't get set up time to go in on you because you keep moving

    2) You can shamelessly spam healing shrines because you wont be in the area long

    Which really help keep the humans ranged edge. If you force the vamps to chase you it'll stretch out their engage and open them up to poke alot of the time.

    I guess that could work, but one tyrant can catch your team when you are moving through tight passage, and charge, thus initiating attack of other vampires. But it also requires coordination from vampires.

    On a somewhat related note, do we run PA pre-mades?

    steam_sig.png
  • Albino BunnyAlbino Bunny Jackie Registered User regular
    Not sure, I mostly play with Blue Map and a few other guys from SE++. I'll happily form a group if you see me on though.

    In general the way we deal with Tyrants when moving is to just turn and burn on him. You can hear the charge coming so scattering and dumping everything into him so he dies hitting maybe one or two people is a win for you (especially because you can just spam a shrine).

  • RedthirstRedthirst Registered User regular
    Yeah, I guess we should play together sometime.

    And right now I'm also looking into Prophet. It seems he can heal really well with his Sacrifice, but it can be pretty useless in TDM, since you will save your teammate but endanger yourself at the same time. Not sure about Siege, since I still haven't played it.

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  • Albino BunnyAlbino Bunny Jackie Registered User regular
    Siege is still deathmatch based for vampires.

    Humans get 5 points for every KOTH capture point they take. Vamps get a point for every hunter they kill. First to 30 wins.

    And prophets heal is pretty terrible. In general take either drain life or the shield (which shields for 350 and costs no health).

  • RedthirstRedthirst Registered User regular
    And prophets heal is pretty terrible. In general take either drain life or the shield (which shields for 350 and costs no health).
    I guess that explains it why I only saw one Prophet who had this skill. Maybe they should make it to heal about 1k HP in a second, in cost of HP. That way it can be a good emergency heal.

    steam_sig.png
  • BloodsheedBloodsheed Registered User regular
    The way I've been Tyrant-ing when Humans try the "spread out in the open" tactic is setting up my Charge so that it will push and carry one of the humans on the flanks out of sight from the rest of the team, kind of using it like a Sentinel kidnap. What then usually happens is the human team starts to get out of position to save whoever I just charged off with or attempt to turn and burn me while the rest of the Vamps attack from the other side, breaking the human coordination and usually getting a wipe. This of course doesn't work if they huddle up or hide in a building, but then you just use the other tools that can deal with those situations.

    Xbox Live, Steam, PSN: Eclibull
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