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[US Foreign Policy] A Generation of War
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Because it would be the right thing to do.
Gotta say I don't think censuring the young muslim woman who just got elected is going to stop any fracturing!
Not according to most of the party it isn't.
The idea that this is the party line that Pelosi is enforcing is baffling. Omar criticized the fact that Israel is dumping money on politicians via lobbying. This is such an atrocity she is being censured. Why is it not Pelosi that is the problem here?
Why do you believe Israel lobbying should be immune to criticism?
What kind of moral framework is this supposed to be?
most of them probably wouldn't even agree with the notion that the camps are bad, or that West Bank colonization is bad
It's a zugzwang at this point, I'd say. The DNC is thinking that censuring her is going to fracture less support than not appeasing the Israel lobby... which is probably correct in the numbers game. It's also, again, morally garbage.
I don't blame Omar for giving voice to the problem at hand, but as soon as she did she started this path. I can't see a present where her actions led to any other result than where we are right now with the current political stance in the US. If she started this fight when the democrats controlled multiple houses or the presidency and had a solid league of fellow representatives willing to spend political capital correcting the issue, she would have been able to accomplish something. Right now is just not the right time to actually achieve any sort of limitation against the Israel lobby.
At the same time, she is entirely correct that the only moral decision here is to point out the corruption at hand and expose it to sunlight. She may, in sacrificing herself in this manner, lead others to eventually have the momentum to take real action against the lobby.
Your point about her timing assumes this outrage isn't honestly held. Maybe they're condemning her because, like she said, they're fully in the tank for a foreign government and one more electoral cycle won't change that.
Why is it baffling? It is demonstratively the party line. Look how the party is voting on it. Saying Pelosi is the problem is like blaming Trump for the GOP being racist. Pelosi is just representing the general views of the party itself on this matter.
I never said this though. So whence comes this strawman?
1) political capital is a fake idea, especially when it's being used to justify unethical policy and behavior
2) Omar categorically did not "pick a fight"--she said, in effect, that the Israel lobby spends money in DC and that this has a real influence, a flatly true statement.
This isn't a moral question, it's a political one. And the Democratic party is acting according to it's stated positions. One can disagree with those positions but one can't be surprised they are following them.
I assure you no one is surprised that the Democrats are going after a black leftist on behalf of the Israeli lobby.
Pelosi should not be criticized for her decision? She has agency as a leader. As to the second part you are choosing to defend this decision and carry water for it. Otherwise what do you believe?
That means the Democratic party can investigate Trump on several fronts while also pushing some legislative agendas. It doesn't mean they can start an internal fight over a relatively unpopular position (especially with the media and the political class) while also maintaining support for more important issues like said investigations and legislation.
Pelosi is not responsible for the stances of the Democratic Party and the people it represents. It's not like this is all just her idea. Pelosi is not the person who's mind you need to change here. Or rather, she's only one of many many many many minds you need to change. Focusing the blame on her misses the larger picture.
You dont see what the opposition crushing all criticism of Israel has to do with foreign policy unlike our unwavering support for hard right israeli politics?
Pelosi is a human being and not a monolith she could shut this down. It is a very apparent she wants to prove her loyalty by using her powers to the fullest to attack Omar.
She's literally the leader of a body that looks to be advancing censure. I dont get how someone can be grossed out by the Democratic reponse to Omar and also carry water for its leadership.
Dude, she could be the whitest malest rightest motherfucker in congress and they'd still be giving her the same treatment. This is just not a stance you can have and not expect to get slapped down for given the current US political culture. It's got nothing to do with who's saying it, it's just the position itself.
Yes, she's the leader of the body and she is representing that body. That's the point. The problem is not leadership and a change in leadership will not solve it. The problem is the views of the party as a whole.
This chain began with the comment "This Omar situation is why Pelosi has to go." I'm simply pointing out the ways in which this stance is foolish. Pelosi is not the problem here, the party and the political culture as a whole is.
Given the content of the words she said? Yes.
As you agreed with a page ago:
So.....press (x) for doubt
I don't think the outrage from the democrats against her is honestly held in most cases. It's a sham to support the lobby, their influence in the New England electorate, and the considerable money they use towards the party.
I believe Omar's position against the lobby, and the vast majority of democrats (I think the last polling I saw was something like less than 33% of democrats support israel over palestine), is totally honestly held.
In short, to summarize my position and my previous posts, I think Omar did what is right, and what is right is presently politically inconvenient to the party and exposed vulnerabilities that will be exposed and used against the already weak Democratic position without some sort of political theater taken against her. What's more, the political theater is all bullshit and mostly to satisfy the lobby rather than the base, and they are correct in assuming only high-information voters even know its happening and those are probably going to stay with the DNC because the alternative is worse (more Trump control).
Which I absolutely hate them for but at the same time is not incorrect.
Its sorta the same situation with everything with Pelosi. She's highly effective at what she does, but her political positions are still 30 years too old and ill equipped to deal with our current needs in the DNC. And I say that as a self-described moderate democrat.
Pelosi should act like a leader and do what she thinks is right. I just happen to believe she thinks this is right and that is the reason she has to go.
I don't really agree with 1, but that's a philosophy thing.
On 2, pointing out that truth to the general public as a means to draw attention to and limit the lobby absolutely is picking that fight.
Steve King would absolutely get censured for speaking out against Israel. He won't get censured for being a white nationalist though because half the government is white nationalists. I don't see how the difference here isn't super obvious. It's the ideology in question.
That Members of Congress have literally sworn allegiance to Israel in abandonment of their oath of office in order to get paid.
Come on man, King has spent a career being an actual anti-semite and even the Democrats do nothing about it, but here comes the young black muslim woman saying things about the nature of our relationship with Israel that are objectively true and her own party is preparing to throw her under the bus.
It doesn't take a brain genius to notice the difference between how Omar and King will be treated in America.
Did she ever say "literally sworn allegiance"
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Tlaib has been going to bat hard for her and its been nice to see.
Pelosi is acting like a leader by representing the interests and views of her party. Pelosi doesn't "have to go" here because literally nothing will change on this issue if she does and you would be just not paying attention to think otherwise.
What needs to happen is that the views on this issue within the electorate and withing the political class especially have to change. And what Omar is saying is definitely a good start to that but that's all it is: a start. And it's one anyone would be foolish to expect her not to get slapped down for. I'm glad someone is saying it but, as with everyone who's said this before her, the reaction is wholely and completely expected.
it is perverse to say that taking the morally correct position, accurately describing reality, and finally pushing back against the dominant narrative is "picking a fight"
the power dynamics of this situation are so clearly not in Omar's favor, as evidenced by the thing that happened which started this discussion, not to mention the people she's standing up for
e: I did not see moderation before I finished writing this. I will not be responding further.
"has to go" can reasonably be construed to include "and replaced by someone with better foreign policy views on Israel".