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[Hiberno-Britannic Politics] Million To One Shot Now Odds On Favourite

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Posts

  • jaziekjaziek Bad at everything And mad about it.Registered User regular
    Sky news and the BBC serve much the same purpose

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  • PlatyPlaty Registered User regular
    I always thought the Sun cover had something to do with Miliband being Jewish

  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    No-Quarter wrote: »
    KetBra wrote: »
    shryke wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    These were the front pages 48 hours before 2015's closely polled election: https://www.theguardian.com/media/2015/may/06/sun-ed-miliband-labour-mail-telegraph-election

    Had Miliband and Labour won that election, David Cameron would have been out, and thus no referendum, no Brexit and no potential disintegration of the UK. Had Labour at least managed to force a hung Parliament again (as in 2010), as was expected to happen, the Conservatives would have probably ended up in coalition with the Lib Dems again, and indeed were expecting that result. The price for that coalition would likely have included dropping the referendum pledge in the Conservative manifesto; again, no Brexit, etc, etc.

    But on such small things does history turn.

    I still literally cannot understand the existence of this scandal.

    Rupert Murdoch

    From across the sea- The Obama Mustard "scandal".

    The problem, then as here, are rightwingers acting in bad faith.

    I mean, yeah. But nobody cared about that except the Fox News crowd.

  • tynictynic PICNIC BADASS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    Platy wrote: »
    I always thought the Sun cover had something to do with Miliband being Jewish

    nothing that coherent, I'm afraid.

  • Desktop HippieDesktop Hippie Registered User regular
    tynic wrote: »
    Platy wrote: »
    I always thought the Sun cover had something to do with Miliband being Jewish

    nothing that coherent, I'm afraid.

    Some of it was.

    The rest of it was to do with Miliband's dad being too "socialist". As was illustrated in that Sun "expose" on him that ran with the screaming headline "THE MAN WHO HATED BRITAIN!"

    You know... years after Miliband's dad had passed.

  • tynictynic PICNIC BADASS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    Oh, no, I'm sure some people at the Sun had their panties in a knot about Milliband being jewish.
    But the whole bacon sarnie thing was just optics.

  • BurnageBurnage Registered User regular
    jaziek wrote: »
    Sky news and the BBC serve much the same purpose

    Bear in mind that Sky was Murdoch-owned for most of its existence as well.

    The BBC's historically been good but I think there's some compelling evidence that something's gone wrong with its political slant in recent years.

  • V1mV1m Registered User regular
    tynic wrote: »
    Oh, no, I'm sure some people at the Sun had their panties in a knot about Milliband being jewish.
    But the whole bacon sarnie thing was just optics.

    With the benefits of hindsight I think we can infer that quite a few people in the Labour party had significantly rumpled underwear also.

  • BogartBogart Streetwise Hercules Registered User, Moderator Mod Emeritus
    jaziek wrote: »
    Sky news and the BBC serve much the same purpose

    There is absolutely no comparison between Fox News and either Sky or the BBC, for all the recent faults of the latter.

  • klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    Burnage wrote: »
    The BBC's historically been good but I think there's some compelling evidence that something's gone wrong with its political slant in recent years.

    Fear is what's gone wrong with them. They're fully aware that the government in power would happily take them apart the moment they had enough justification to do so, and they're desperately trying not to give them that chance.

    Failure to keep to their commitment to be impartial (ie; give coverage to the far-right swivel-eyed loons) would get the Murdoch Empire using the same rhetoric on them that they use on judges and MPs who had the sheer gall to acknowledge reality and/or 48% of the voting public and start calling them Enemies of Britain, and the government would start looking at ways to cut them down.

    The BBC's currant approach is to huddle in the corner and say please don't hurt me, in the hope that they'll survive until things will change politically enough for them not to have to do that anymore.

    (And despite all of this, they are the sole source of information that my parents get, and they still get the impression that this entire thing is a disaster, so they're not even close to the tabloids level.)

    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
  • JazzJazz Registered User regular
    I like how The Guardian still has the same main headline as a few hours ago, but changed the image with it:

    9audzr0jr9fo.jpg

    Someone must be trolling. :lol:

  • japanjapan Registered User regular
    edited April 2019
    Not the focus right now but rail franchise tendering is getting weird

    In particular, Stagecoach (most visibly the operator of Virgin trains) seems to have really taken the piss this time around



    (FT transport correspondent)

    tl;dr: there is an ongoing dispute as to who has overall responsibility for funding the rail pension scheme, currently in deficit by some £6 billion. This is in part due to historic underfunding by rail franchise operators. It is a condition of the current bidding rules that prospective franchise operators take on responsibility for funding the pension scheme at a sustainable level.

    The rail industry argues (with some justification) that swings in pension deficit over the life of a typical franchise are primarily the product of investment movements, and so the potential liability they'd be accepting is practically unlimited and not manageable over a franchise term.

    However it appears that Stagecoach specifically has been pushing to transfer all of this risk (and other, unrelated risks per the article) back onto the government.

    japan on
  • ElldrenElldren Is a woman dammit ceterum censeoRegistered User regular
    edited April 2019
    japan wrote: »
    Not the focus right now but rail franchise tendering is getting weird

    In particular, Stagecoach (most visibly the operator of Virgin trains) seems to have really taken the piss this time around



    (FT transport correspondent)

    tl;dr: there is an ongoing dispute as to who has overall responsibility for funding the rail pension scheme, currently in deficit by some £6 billion. This is in part due to historic underfunding by rail franchise operators. It is a condition of the current bidding rules that prospective franchise operators take on responsibility for funding the pension scheme at a sustainable level.

    The rail industry argues (with some justification) that swings in pension deficit over the life of a typical franchise are primarily the product of investment movements, and so the potential liability they'd be accepting is practically unlimited and not manageable over a franchise term.

    However it appears that Stagecoach specifically has been pushing to transfer all of this risk (and other, unrelated risks per the article) back onto the government.

    We’ll just take the profits, please, none of these risks or expenses thank you

    Elldren on
    fuck gendered marketing
  • JazzJazz Registered User regular
    Elldren wrote: »
    japan wrote: »
    Not the focus right now but rail franchise tendering is getting weird

    In particular, Stagecoach (most visibly the operator of Virgin trains) seems to have really taken the piss this time around



    (FT transport correspondent)

    tl;dr: there is an ongoing dispute as to who has overall responsibility for funding the rail pension scheme, currently in deficit by some £6 billion. This is in part due to historic underfunding by rail franchise operators. It is a condition of the current bidding rules that prospective franchise operators take on responsibility for funding the pension scheme at a sustainable level.

    The rail industry argues (with some justification) that swings in pension deficit over the life of a typical franchise are primarily the product of investment movements, and so the potential liability they'd be accepting is practically unlimited and not manageable over a franchise term.

    However it appears that Stagecoach specifically has been pushing to transfer all of this risk (and other, unrelated risks per the article) back onto the government.

    We’ll just take the profits, please, none of these risks or expenses thank you

    That's the conservative way!

  • jaziekjaziek Bad at everything And mad about it.Registered User regular
    Bogart wrote: »
    jaziek wrote: »
    Sky news and the BBC serve much the same purpose

    There is absolutely no comparison between Fox News and either Sky or the BBC, for all the recent faults of the latter.

    Of course they are not equivalent, but I think they are comparable.

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  • CasualCasual Wiggle Wiggle Wiggle Flap Flap Flap Registered User regular
    jaziek wrote: »
    Bogart wrote: »
    jaziek wrote: »
    Sky news and the BBC serve much the same purpose

    There is absolutely no comparison between Fox News and either Sky or the BBC, for all the recent faults of the latter.

    Of course they are not equivalent, but I think they are comparable.

    The BBC for all its faults is not in the same ballpark of awful as Fox News. I get it's pissed off a lot of people for it's skewed brexit coverage but delving into that sort of hyperbole just weakens legitimate criticism of them.

    Comparing every mildly shitty news outlet to Fox/Daily Mail is the media criticism equivalent of Godwining the thread. Not everything bad is Nazis*.


    *except these days when they sometimes are**

    **which is all the more reason not to muddy the waters with hyperbole

  • CroakerBCCroakerBC TorontoRegistered User regular
    Stephen Dorrell has split from the Conservatives and joined ChUK, per the Grauniad. That majority is now wafer-thin.

  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    A whafer-thin meent

  • JazzJazz Registered User regular
    edited April 2019
    Fuck off, I'm full.

    *explodes*

    Jazz on
  • JazzJazz Registered User regular
    edited April 2019
    Casual wrote: »
    jaziek wrote: »
    Bogart wrote: »
    jaziek wrote: »
    Sky news and the BBC serve much the same purpose

    There is absolutely no comparison between Fox News and either Sky or the BBC, for all the recent faults of the latter.

    Of course they are not equivalent, but I think they are comparable.

    The BBC for all its faults is not in the same ballpark of awful as Fox News. I get it's pissed off a lot of people for it's skewed brexit coverage but delving into that sort of hyperbole just weakens legitimate criticism of them.

    Comparing every mildly shitty news outlet to Fox/Daily Mail is the media criticism equivalent of Godwining the thread. Not everything bad is Nazis*.


    *except these days when they sometimes are**

    **which is all the more reason not to muddy the waters with hyperbole

    Speaking of which...
    David Lammy has said comparing the hard Brexit European Research Group of Tory MPs with Nazis and proponents of South African apartheid was “not strong enough,” suggesting the Brexit debate had allowed proponents of hard right views to flourish.

    The Labour MP, who is a vocal campaigner for a second referendum, was asked on the BBC’s Andrew Marr show whether a comparison he previously made to the election of Adolf Hitler’s party in Germany and to South African white supremacists was appropriate, but stood by the claims.

    “I would say that that wasn’t strong enough. In 1938 there were allies who hatched a plan for Hitler to annex part of Czechoslovakia, and Churchill said no, and he stood alone,” he said.

    Asked if it was fair to make such a comment about elected politicians, he said: “I don’t care how elected they were: so was the far right in Germany.”

    Jazz on
  • CasualCasual Wiggle Wiggle Wiggle Flap Flap Flap Registered User regular
    Jazz wrote: »
    Casual wrote: »
    jaziek wrote: »
    Bogart wrote: »
    jaziek wrote: »
    Sky news and the BBC serve much the same purpose

    There is absolutely no comparison between Fox News and either Sky or the BBC, for all the recent faults of the latter.

    Of course they are not equivalent, but I think they are comparable.

    The BBC for all its faults is not in the same ballpark of awful as Fox News. I get it's pissed off a lot of people for it's skewed brexit coverage but delving into that sort of hyperbole just weakens legitimate criticism of them.

    Comparing every mildly shitty news outlet to Fox/Daily Mail is the media criticism equivalent of Godwining the thread. Not everything bad is Nazis*.


    *except these days when they sometimes are**

    **which is all the more reason not to muddy the waters with hyperbole

    Speaking of which...
    David Lammy has said comparing the hard Brexit European Research Group of Tory MPs with Nazis and proponents of South African apartheid was “not strong enough,” suggesting the Brexit debate had allowed proponents of hard right views to flourish.

    The Labour MP, who is a vocal campaigner for a second referendum, was asked on the BBC’s Andrew Marr show whether a comparison he previously made to the election of Adolf Hitler’s party in Germany and to South African white supremacists was appropriate, but stood by the claims.

    “I would say that that wasn’t strong enough. In 1938 there were allies who hatched a plan for Hitler to annex part of Czechoslovakia, and Churchill said no, and he stood alone,” he said.

    Asked if it was fair to make such a comment about elected politicians, he said: “I don’t care how elected they were: so was the far right in Germany.”

    I'm sure that won't come back to bite him in the arse.

  • JazzJazz Registered User regular
    edited April 2019
    Casual wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    Casual wrote: »
    jaziek wrote: »
    Bogart wrote: »
    jaziek wrote: »
    Sky news and the BBC serve much the same purpose

    There is absolutely no comparison between Fox News and either Sky or the BBC, for all the recent faults of the latter.

    Of course they are not equivalent, but I think they are comparable.

    The BBC for all its faults is not in the same ballpark of awful as Fox News. I get it's pissed off a lot of people for it's skewed brexit coverage but delving into that sort of hyperbole just weakens legitimate criticism of them.

    Comparing every mildly shitty news outlet to Fox/Daily Mail is the media criticism equivalent of Godwining the thread. Not everything bad is Nazis*.


    *except these days when they sometimes are**

    **which is all the more reason not to muddy the waters with hyperbole

    Speaking of which...
    David Lammy has said comparing the hard Brexit European Research Group of Tory MPs with Nazis and proponents of South African apartheid was “not strong enough,” suggesting the Brexit debate had allowed proponents of hard right views to flourish.

    The Labour MP, who is a vocal campaigner for a second referendum, was asked on the BBC’s Andrew Marr show whether a comparison he previously made to the election of Adolf Hitler’s party in Germany and to South African white supremacists was appropriate, but stood by the claims.

    “I would say that that wasn’t strong enough. In 1938 there were allies who hatched a plan for Hitler to annex part of Czechoslovakia, and Churchill said no, and he stood alone,” he said.

    Asked if it was fair to make such a comment about elected politicians, he said: “I don’t care how elected they were: so was the far right in Germany.”

    I'm sure that won't come back to bite him in the arse.

    Oh, doubtless in this day and age.
    Asked if he was saying that Rees-Mogg [someone who is happy to put on to his web pages the horrible, racist AfD party] and Johnson were the modern-day equivalent of Nazis, Lammy said: “Ask Boris Johnson why he’s hanging out with Steve Bannon.”

    But, hyperbole (& Godwin) aside, he has a point...

    Jazz on
  • PLAPLA The process.Registered User regular
    edited April 2019
    Hey, now, Rees-Mogg and Johnson are only Grand Wizards informally.

    PLA on
  • BurnageBurnage Registered User regular
    Sargon of Akkad is already getting UKIP into trouble, as their leader was apparently having to justify on the BBC this morning that rape threats are just "satire".

    In case you missed the news and are wondering what Sargon of Akkad has to do with UKIP, yes, he's an MEP candidate for them. Because that's the world we live in now, apparently.

  • RMS OceanicRMS Oceanic Registered User regular
    Burnage wrote: »
    Sargon of Akkad is already getting UKIP into trouble, as their leader was apparently having to justify on the BBC this morning that rape threats are just "satire".

    In case you missed the news and are wondering what Sargon of Akkad has to do with UKIP, yes, he's an MEP candidate for them. Because that's the world we live in now, apparently.

    Is it in bad taste to say "I wouldn't even vote for you"?

  • japanjapan Registered User regular
    I feel like the BBC needs an editorial decision on how to refer to stuff like this, in the same way that their guidance advises presenters to say "so-called people's vote" for impartiality reasons

    Something like "rape threats claimed to be satire", maybe

    At the moment, of they confront these issues at all, they invariably get bogged down as interviewees play semantic games

  • BethrynBethryn Unhappiness is Mandatory Registered User regular
    Can we call him by his proper name, Carl of Swindon?

    ...and of course, as always, Kill Hitler.
  • BogartBogart Streetwise Hercules Registered User, Moderator Mod Emeritus
    CroakerBC wrote: »
    Stephen Dorrell has split from the Conservatives and joined ChUK, per the Grauniad. That majority is now wafer-thin.

    Dorrell is not a sitting MP, though he’s considering standing in the European elections. He was an MP a while ago.

  • CasualCasual Wiggle Wiggle Wiggle Flap Flap Flap Registered User regular
    Bogart wrote: »
    CroakerBC wrote: »
    Stephen Dorrell has split from the Conservatives and joined ChUK, per the Grauniad. That majority is now wafer-thin.

    Dorrell is not a sitting MP, though he’s considering standing in the European elections. He was an MP a while ago.

    I thought something seemed odd about that when I couldn't find mention of it anywhere in the news, I'd have thought losing an MP would have been a bigger deal.

  • JazzJazz Registered User regular
    Casual wrote: »
    Bogart wrote: »
    CroakerBC wrote: »
    Stephen Dorrell has split from the Conservatives and joined ChUK, per the Grauniad. That majority is now wafer-thin.

    Dorrell is not a sitting MP, though he’s considering standing in the European elections. He was an MP a while ago.

    I thought something seemed odd about that when I couldn't find mention of it anywhere in the news, I'd have thought losing an MP would have been a bigger deal.

    It feels like it's now common enough to barely warrant a shrug.

  • CroakerBCCroakerBC TorontoRegistered User regular
    Bogart wrote: »
    CroakerBC wrote: »
    Stephen Dorrell has split from the Conservatives and joined ChUK, per the Grauniad. That majority is now wafer-thin.

    Dorrell is not a sitting MP, though he’s considering standing in the European elections. He was an MP a while ago.

    Ah, I forgot he (somehow( lost his seat in the last election, my bad.

  • klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    UKIP: Gerard Batten says Nigel Farage trying to 'discredit' party
    UKIP leader Gerard Batten has accused his predecessor Nigel Farage of "smearing" the party, while defending his own links to Tommy Robinson.

    He said Mr Farage, who launched the rival Brexit Party on Friday, wanted to "discredit" UKIP by claiming Mr Batten was condoning violence by working with the ex-English Defence League leader.

    He said UKIP had always been, and would remain, a "non-racist" organisation.

    While not a member, Mr Robinson was a "useful source of research", he said.

    Mr Farage quit UKIP earlier this year in protest at the direction of the Eurosceptic party, saying it had become obsessed under Mr Batten's leadership with the threat Islam posed to UK society.

    Launching his new party on Friday, Mr Farage said the UKIP leader's decision to appoint Mr Robinson as an adviser on grooming gangs and prison conditions tarnished his former party and associated it with "extremism, violence, criminal records and thuggery".

    Nigel has the proper concern of being obsessed with the threat that everyone not British poses to UKEnglish society, those other guys are too focused.

    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
  • altidaltid Registered User regular
    Casual wrote: »
    jaziek wrote: »
    Bogart wrote: »
    jaziek wrote: »
    Sky news and the BBC serve much the same purpose

    There is absolutely no comparison between Fox News and either Sky or the BBC, for all the recent faults of the latter.

    Of course they are not equivalent, but I think they are comparable.

    The BBC for all its faults is not in the same ballpark of awful as Fox News. I get it's pissed off a lot of people for it's skewed brexit coverage but delving into that sort of hyperbole just weakens legitimate criticism of them.

    Comparing every mildly shitty news outlet to Fox/Daily Mail is the media criticism equivalent of Godwining the thread. Not everything bad is Nazis*.


    *except these days when they sometimes are**

    **which is all the more reason not to muddy the waters with hyperbole

    That the BBC isn't viewed as such is in some ways much more worrying. With the likes of fox news the bias is clear and obvious (I'd hope anyway) but with the BBC being seen as impartial, any bias has a much greater effect on influencing the population. Not to mention the huge reach and market share it has.

    One of the many problems with the BBC is how readily they follow the news agenda set by the (largely right wing) papers. They're a massive echo chamber that promotes the paper's agenda. Hell, I'm largely only aware of the newspaper headlines due to the BBC covering what's on the front pages...

    The idea of the BBC is a good one but when something goes wrong (and it has gone wrong) it has massive effect.

  • CasualCasual Wiggle Wiggle Wiggle Flap Flap Flap Registered User regular
    When BBC news 24 gives Nigel Farrage his own "infotainment" segment I'll concede it's gone Fox News.

  • jaziekjaziek Bad at everything And mad about it.Registered User regular
    Casual wrote: »
    When BBC news 24 gives Nigel Farrage his own "infotainment" segment I'll concede it's gone Fox News.

    They did, it's called question time.

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  • japanjapan Registered User regular
    Farage is claiming that the brexit party has raised £750k in ten days, all in donations of less than £500

    If true, that's faster than the rate at which Labour were raising money at the height of the Momentum frenzy

    The significance of the £500 is that is the threshold at which you have to carry out donor ID procedures and inform the electoral commission of the donation

  • V1mV1m Registered User regular
    japan wrote: »
    Farage is claiming that the brexit party has raised £750k in ten days, all in donations of less than £500

    If true, that's faster than the rate at which Labour were raising money at the height of the Momentum frenzy

    The significance of the £500 is that is the threshold at which you have to carry out donor ID procedures and inform the electoral commission of the donation
    Aaron Banks: 1 £499.99
    Arron Banks: 1 £499.99
    Aroon Banks: 1 £499.99
    Aarnn Banks: 1 £499.99
    Aaroo Banks: 1 £499.99
    Arroo Banks: 1 £499.99
    Aarno Banks: 1 £499.99
    Arrno Banks: 1 £499.99
    Baron Banks: 1 £499.99
    Brron Banks: 1 £499.99
    Broon Banks: 1 £499.99
    Barnn Banks: 1 £499.99
    Baroo Banks: 1 £499.99
    Brroo Banks: 1 £499.99
    Barno Banks: 1 £499.99
    Brrno Banks: 1 £499.99
    ....

  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    Presumably multiple donations of £499 and such would get tagged?

  • japanjapan Registered User regular
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    Presumably multiple donations of £499 and such would get tagged?

    The electoral commission only have direct oversight of what is reported to them. In any case, an investigation likely wouldn't reveal much unless the party kept detailed records of the source of the donations, which they aren't required to.

  • LiiyaLiiya Registered User regular


    To cheer things up a bit, Manchester Mayor Andy Burnham is running the Boston Marathon to raise funds for the Manchester Arena bomb victims and their families. I think that's pretty great. I know mayors don't have the same issues/restraints as an MP but I appreciate things like this. It's nice to know someone in power gives a hoot.

This discussion has been closed.