The General [Coronavirus] Discussion Thread can't open until schools do.

ceresceres When the last moon is cast over the last star of morningAnd the future has past without even a last desperate warningRegistered User, Moderator mod
edited July 10 in Debate and/or Discourse
This thread is like the other discussion threads, but without the "Democrats are awesome/evil" which is extremely tiring, and enough about covid is extremely tiring.

This thread is different from the updates thread. The updates thread is for posting updates (new news) so that people who just want new information (or clarification of it) don't need to dig through posts about your uncle to get to it; this one is for discussing how we are affected as individuals, and families, and communities. Feel free to cross-post from there to continue discussions.

Oh yeah, and if you are throwing a bunch of numbers out there, or info not everyone might have, cite your sources. It helps keep confusion/misinformation to a minimum and people will like you slightly more.

And it seems like all is dying, and would leave the world to mourn
ceres on
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  • Captain InertiaCaptain Inertia Registered User regular
    Just adding that DeWine is sucking an enormous amount of shit lately and pretending that COVID isn’t a thing, but at least while he’s doing nothing at the state level, he’s letting local folks enact the restrictions he should be doing anyway

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  • ForarForar #432 Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    edited July 3
    Watching the US's numbers explode, and knowing they're even worse than what is being shared, sure is a thing as someone in a neighbouring country.

    Canada has its own share of cases for sure, and a mixed bag of responses, but overall with ~10 times the population and ~100 times the cases, it's... not great.

    So, like, a year or two at this rate (even steady, not increasing as it has been) before the US has endured more cases than Canada has people.

    I hope that's the only number substantially comparable, before we start getting into the 'potentially X% dead' style contrasts, which would be all the more horrifying than those lost to this already are.

    Forar on
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  • OrcaOrca Registered User regular
    edited July 3
    Looking at the Google dashboard for today, we're at 2.8 million confirmed cases in the US and 131K deaths. And those numbers are almost certainly undercounts.

    This thing is still burning its way through 1% of the population. So we've only got another...oh...60-70% before herd immunity, depending on how much overshoot we get.

    And so many of these deaths are preventable it's absolutely infuriating.

    Orca on
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  • ceresceres When the last moon is cast over the last star of morning And the future has past without even a last desperate warningRegistered User, Moderator mod
    edited July 3
    NV gov put out a video literally begging people to keep their July 4th gatherings small and keep their stupid masks on when they go out.

    Establishments are required to ensure their customers/guests wear masks. There is an initial warning, then a followup inspection, then OSHA gets involved, and if they need to stay involved, fines. There are more exceptions to the mask mandate than I would like but it's still really good and around here, at least at the few places we ever go, we've seen really good compliance! So that's good!

    ceres on
    And it seems like all is dying, and would leave the world to mourn
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  • TomantaTomanta Registered User regular
    The Texas GOP voted yesterday to continue with their contention in Houston in a couple of weeks. This is after the Governor issued his orders (and refused to give the convention any guidance).

  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Cases still higher than they have been in Michigan, though not as bad as yesterday. 460. Looks like it's being driven by Grand Rapids this time.

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  • Captain InertiaCaptain Inertia Registered User regular
    Well hopefully all those dipshits get out of Houston before infecting too many Houstonians

  • JavenJaven Registered User regular
    The longer this goes on the more inclined I am to believe that true US death numbers are being are being misrepresented in some way

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  • daveNYCdaveNYC Why universe hate Waspinator? Registered User regular
    Javen wrote: »
    The longer this goes on the more inclined I am to believe that true US death numbers are being are being misrepresented in some way

    Pretty much every state is under testing, so I’d bet money that there are a fair number of people who die at home untested and are chalked up as generic pneumonia.

    Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
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  • PaladinPaladin Registered User regular
    I'm going to look for this stuff myself, but if you guys have found good studies that specifically mention risk factors and incidence numbers for non-death complications of covid I'd be much obliged and happy to condense it for you.

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  • kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    I read somewhere that there was a study that said opening schools was better for kids due to social/physical risks from staying isolated at home, even considering Covid. I can't remember where that was so I'm uncertain how reliable that was. Anyone know?

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  • GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Javen wrote: »
    The longer this goes on the more inclined I am to believe that true US death numbers are being are being misrepresented in some way

    Iirc excess deaths has us at 200k+ and even that is a lagging indicator.

    https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamainternalmedicine/fullarticle/2767980

    This is a paper which takes the dumb count of deaths for March and May and finds that it was 122k above normal compared to the 95k reported deaths.

    And since that is the dumb count and does not account for lockdown effects its likely an underestimation. Which is to say that if we’re at 130k officially then our real count almost cannot be lower than 167

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  • HandkorHandkor Registered User regular
    Why is there an unmasked lineup of people at the local Bingo Hall. I don't think your weekly bingo is worth dying for.

  • WACriminalWACriminal Dying Is Easy, Young Man Living Is HarderRegistered User regular
    Handkor wrote: »
    Why is there an unmasked lineup of people at the local Bingo Hall. I don't think your weekly bingo is worth dying for.

    "That's I-19, as in, I have Covid-19!" [/Saul Goodman]

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  • November FifthNovember Fifth Registered User regular
    kime wrote: »
    I read somewhere that there was a study that said opening schools was better for kids due to social/physical risks from staying isolated at home, even considering Covid. I can't remember where that was so I'm uncertain how reliable that was. Anyone know?

    The American Academy of Pediatrics has recommended reopening schools in the US.

    "With the above principles in mind, the AAP strongly advocates that all policy considerations for the coming school year should start with a goal of having students physically present in school. The importance of in-person learning is well-documented, and there is already evidence of the negative impacts on children because of school closures in the spring of 2020. Lengthy time away from school and associated interruption of supportive services often results in social isolation, making it difficult for schools to identify and address important learning deficits as well as child and adolescent physical or sexual abuse, substance use, depression, and suicidal ideation. This, in turn, places children and adolescents at considerable risk of morbidity and, in some cases, mortality. Beyond the educational impact and social impact of school closures, there has been substantial impact on food security and physical activity for children and families."

    kime
  • tbloxhamtbloxham Registered User regular
    Orca wrote: »
    Looking at the Google dashboard for today, we're at 2.8 million confirmed cases in the US and 131K deaths. And those numbers are almost certainly undercounts.

    This thing is still burning its way through 1% of the population. So we've only got another...oh...60-70% before herd immunity, depending on how much overshoot we get.

    And so many of these deaths are preventable it's absolutely infuriating.

    We do know that the cases is a pretty massive undercount too though, we're probably at 25 million cases at least.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.businessinsider.com/real-number-of-coronavirus-cases-underreported-us-china-italy-2020-4?amp

    There are lots of solid articles like this, and the numbers line up for this being true in all well tested populations.

    So, 5-10% down only 55-65% of the population to go...


    Oh, and as an aside, people wanted some links for my "hold on now, other diseases are also terrible" post in the last thread.

    Diarrhea diseases in India in 2012 in children

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4367049/

    Diarrheal diseases kill 300k children a year in 2012.

    Cancer deaths in the USA

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cancer.org/research/cancer-facts-statistics/all-cancer-facts-figures/cancer-facts-figures-2019.html

    All cancers kill 610k a year in the USA, lung cancer kills 140k

    Tuberculosis burden worldwide

    https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/tuberculosis

    Tuberculosis kills 1.5 million per year.

    Now, coronavirus is going to have a solid shot at killing 100 million of us around the world this year but, its not in the lead yet.

    "That is cool" - Abraham Lincoln
  • silence1186silence1186 Character shields down! As a wingmanRegistered User regular
    kime wrote: »
    I read somewhere that there was a study that said opening schools was better for kids due to social/physical risks from staying isolated at home, even considering Covid. I can't remember where that was so I'm uncertain how reliable that was. Anyone know?

    The American Academy of Pediatrics has recommended reopening schools in the US.

    "With the above principles in mind, the AAP strongly advocates that all policy considerations for the coming school year should start with a goal of having students physically present in school. The importance of in-person learning is well-documented, and there is already evidence of the negative impacts on children because of school closures in the spring of 2020. Lengthy time away from school and associated interruption of supportive services often results in social isolation, making it difficult for schools to identify and address important learning deficits as well as child and adolescent physical or sexual abuse, substance use, depression, and suicidal ideation. This, in turn, places children and adolescents at considerable risk of morbidity and, in some cases, mortality. Beyond the educational impact and social impact of school closures, there has been substantial impact on food security and physical activity for children and families."

    The virus is so widespread we missed our opportunity to eliminate it via quarantine, and the federal government won't pay for any states to manage the virus or unemployment benefits, so everyone has to go back to work and kids back to school, and we wait for covid to burn itself through the population.

    V wrote:
    Words will always retain their power. Words offer the means to meaning, and for those who will listen, the enunciation of truth.

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  • GaddezGaddez Registered User regular
    kime wrote: »
    I read somewhere that there was a study that said opening schools was better for kids due to social/physical risks from staying isolated at home, even considering Covid. I can't remember where that was so I'm uncertain how reliable that was. Anyone know?

    The American Academy of Pediatrics has recommended reopening schools in the US.

    "With the above principles in mind, the AAP strongly advocates that all policy considerations for the coming school year should start with a goal of having students physically present in school. The importance of in-person learning is well-documented, and there is already evidence of the negative impacts on children because of school closures in the spring of 2020. Lengthy time away from school and associated interruption of supportive services often results in social isolation, making it difficult for schools to identify and address important learning deficits as well as child and adolescent physical or sexual abuse, substance use, depression, and suicidal ideation. This, in turn, places children and adolescents at considerable risk of morbidity and, in some cases, mortality. Beyond the educational impact and social impact of school closures, there has been substantial impact on food security and physical activity for children and families."

    While I can certainly appreciate this, the simple fact is that Covid-19 makes schools an ideal vector for an outbreak; you have a large number of people concentrated together and then spreading out to a wider area multiple times a week.

    Richy wrote: »
    But I think the resistance I’m getting more has to do with “rawr! Loklar said it! Rage!” than anything else.

    No, it has to do with the fact that you're done nothing but throw lies, blatant flasehoods, and downright dumb statements at us so far.
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  • NobeardNobeard North Carolina: Failed StateRegistered User regular
    kime wrote: »
    I read somewhere that there was a study that said opening schools was better for kids due to social/physical risks from staying isolated at home, even considering Covid. I can't remember where that was so I'm uncertain how reliable that was. Anyone know?

    The American Academy of Pediatrics has recommended reopening schools in the US.

    "With the above principles in mind, the AAP strongly advocates that all policy considerations for the coming school year should start with a goal of having students physically present in school. The importance of in-person learning is well-documented, and there is already evidence of the negative impacts on children because of school closures in the spring of 2020. Lengthy time away from school and associated interruption of supportive services often results in social isolation, making it difficult for schools to identify and address important learning deficits as well as child and adolescent physical or sexual abuse, substance use, depression, and suicidal ideation. This, in turn, places children and adolescents at considerable risk of morbidity and, in some cases, mortality. Beyond the educational impact and social impact of school closures, there has been substantial impact on food security and physical activity for children and families."

    The virus is so widespread we missed our opportunity to eliminate it via quarantine, and the federal government won't pay for any states to manage the virus or unemployment benefits, so everyone has to go back to work and kids back to school, and we wait for covid to burn itself through the population.

    What's gonna be real funny is when some schools can't stay open because too many staff are sick/dead.

    I'm not saying we are going to have an autocratic dystopia, but things keep happening that look like they come from an autocratic dystopia.
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  • PhillisherePhillishere Registered User regular
    edited July 3
    Nobeard wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    I read somewhere that there was a study that said opening schools was better for kids due to social/physical risks from staying isolated at home, even considering Covid. I can't remember where that was so I'm uncertain how reliable that was. Anyone know?

    The American Academy of Pediatrics has recommended reopening schools in the US.

    "With the above principles in mind, the AAP strongly advocates that all policy considerations for the coming school year should start with a goal of having students physically present in school. The importance of in-person learning is well-documented, and there is already evidence of the negative impacts on children because of school closures in the spring of 2020. Lengthy time away from school and associated interruption of supportive services often results in social isolation, making it difficult for schools to identify and address important learning deficits as well as child and adolescent physical or sexual abuse, substance use, depression, and suicidal ideation. This, in turn, places children and adolescents at considerable risk of morbidity and, in some cases, mortality. Beyond the educational impact and social impact of school closures, there has been substantial impact on food security and physical activity for children and families."

    The virus is so widespread we missed our opportunity to eliminate it via quarantine, and the federal government won't pay for any states to manage the virus or unemployment benefits, so everyone has to go back to work and kids back to school, and we wait for covid to burn itself through the population.

    What's gonna be real funny is when some schools can't stay open because too many staff are sick/dead.

    The entire idea that we can return to normal at any level is a fantasy. We will try, kill thousands, break a bunch of institutions and the economy, and then finally panic back into some form of lockdown.

    That’s because the U.S. under constant waves of this virus becomes a pariah state. Investors need stability, and there will be no stability until the virus is contained.

    Maybe if the entire world was failing at containment, the U.S. strategy could work. With Arizona having more daily cases than the EU, it definitely won’t.

    Herd immunity is also a fantasy. Might as well wish for Jesus to come down and make the virus go away.

    Phillishere on
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  • daveNYCdaveNYC Why universe hate Waspinator? Registered User regular
    kime wrote: »
    I read somewhere that there was a study that said opening schools was better for kids due to social/physical risks from staying isolated at home, even considering Covid. I can't remember where that was so I'm uncertain how reliable that was. Anyone know?

    The American Academy of Pediatrics has recommended reopening schools in the US.

    "With the above principles in mind, the AAP strongly advocates that all policy considerations for the coming school year should start with a goal of having students physically present in school. The importance of in-person learning is well-documented, and there is already evidence of the negative impacts on children because of school closures in the spring of 2020. Lengthy time away from school and associated interruption of supportive services often results in social isolation, making it difficult for schools to identify and address important learning deficits as well as child and adolescent physical or sexual abuse, substance use, depression, and suicidal ideation. This, in turn, places children and adolescents at considerable risk of morbidity and, in some cases, mortality. Beyond the educational impact and social impact of school closures, there has been substantial impact on food security and physical activity for children and families."

    All that and teaching kids the knowledge and skills they need to succeed in life. No pressure!

    Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
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  • dispatch.odispatch.o Registered User regular
    edited July 3
    Quite honestly I don't give a fuck what pediatricians say right now.

    Doctors are notoriously shitty experts at anything even slightly out of their specific field.

    I bet podiatrists and plastic surgeons think it's totally cool if we open up again, too.

    dispatch.o on
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  • zagdrobzagdrob Registered User regular
    Javen wrote: »
    The longer this goes on the more inclined I am to believe that true US death numbers are being are being misrepresented in some way

    I can't say for certain, but I recall NYC was seeing about as many surplus deaths not attributed to COVID as they were reporting as confirmed COVID deaths.

    You gotta figure some decrease in accidental deaths due to accidents, workplace injuries, etc attributable to the lockdown and some increase offsetting that due to people postponing elective surgeries or avoiding hospitals...but the ballpark figures I've seen say the real number of deaths due to COVID and knock-on effects is up to double the 'confirmed' count. And that was NYC overwhelmed but not really putting their thumb on the scale like a lot of states might be inclined to do.

    The county (rural TN) we are at is reporting 21 cases, 12 recovered for the whole epidemic. Five people at the local hardware store have tested positive, and three people that our neighbor works with have tested positive.

    Its POSSIBLE out of the minimal contact we have had down we have that degree of separation for like 90% of the cases in the county having talked to like four people this whole week, but I'm pretty sure those numbers TN is reporting are pure bullshit.

  • lonelyahavalonelyahava Call me Ahava Move to New ZealandRegistered User regular
    I have decided to start yelling at people on facebook who are going out this weekend.

    i do not care, y'all are going to kill my mom.



    On schooling: would it be possible to maybe go back to a one room schoolhouse kind of thing? find a group, create a bubble, and work through teaching the group of kids that way? I dunno. was just thinking about how the homeschool kids back home used to do it. but there were liker 30 of them (farm families) and the parents took turns.

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  • kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    I have decided to start yelling at people on facebook who are going out this weekend.

    i do not care, y'all are going to kill my mom.



    On schooling: would it be possible to maybe go back to a one room schoolhouse kind of thing? find a group, create a bubble, and work through teaching the group of kids that way? I dunno. was just thinking about how the homeschool kids back home used to do it. but there were liker 30 of them (farm families) and the parents took turns.

    I feel like I don't want random parents teaching my kid :/

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  • jothkijothki Registered User regular
    kime wrote: »
    I have decided to start yelling at people on facebook who are going out this weekend.

    i do not care, y'all are going to kill my mom.



    On schooling: would it be possible to maybe go back to a one room schoolhouse kind of thing? find a group, create a bubble, and work through teaching the group of kids that way? I dunno. was just thinking about how the homeschool kids back home used to do it. but there were liker 30 of them (farm families) and the parents took turns.

    I feel like I don't want random parents teaching my kid :/

    Random members of the public aren't exactly making a good case that they can be trusted right now.

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  • dispatch.odispatch.o Registered User regular
    Quarantined groups of families that exist as independent pods where kids can interact and learn sound great. It only takes one parent to think going to the beach, bar, church or birthday party is no big deal though, and it's hard to trust adults to behave like adults right now.

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  • NobeardNobeard North Carolina: Failed StateRegistered User regular
    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Quite honestly I don't give a fuck what pediatricians say right now.

    Doctors are notoriously shitty experts at anything even slightly out of their specific field.

    I bet podiatrists and plastic surgeons think it's totally cool if we open up again, too.

    True and good to keep in mind. But child health is the specific field of pediatricians. I'd say thier word on on this subject is mostly trustworthy. A little less so on the mental health aspect, perhaps.

    I'm not saying we are going to have an autocratic dystopia, but things keep happening that look like they come from an autocratic dystopia.
    JaysonFour
  • NumiNumi Registered User regular
    Nobeard wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    I read somewhere that there was a study that said opening schools was better for kids due to social/physical risks from staying isolated at home, even considering Covid. I can't remember where that was so I'm uncertain how reliable that was. Anyone know?

    The American Academy of Pediatrics has recommended reopening schools in the US.

    "With the above principles in mind, the AAP strongly advocates that all policy considerations for the coming school year should start with a goal of having students physically present in school. The importance of in-person learning is well-documented, and there is already evidence of the negative impacts on children because of school closures in the spring of 2020. Lengthy time away from school and associated interruption of supportive services often results in social isolation, making it difficult for schools to identify and address important learning deficits as well as child and adolescent physical or sexual abuse, substance use, depression, and suicidal ideation. This, in turn, places children and adolescents at considerable risk of morbidity and, in some cases, mortality. Beyond the educational impact and social impact of school closures, there has been substantial impact on food security and physical activity for children and families."

    The virus is so widespread we missed our opportunity to eliminate it via quarantine, and the federal government won't pay for any states to manage the virus or unemployment benefits, so everyone has to go back to work and kids back to school, and we wait for covid to burn itself through the population.

    What's gonna be real funny is when some schools can't stay open because too many staff are sick/dead.

    When this thing first hit and schools in Sweden stayed open that was my first thought as well but it hasn't really materialised.

    From what I've seen there have been single digit publicised outbreaks and only a single death among teachers connected to those outbreaks. If anything teaching looks to be quite a bit safer than many other professions right now.

    tbloxham
  • NobeardNobeard North Carolina: Failed StateRegistered User regular
    I have decided to start yelling at people on facebook who are going out this weekend.

    i do not care, y'all are going to kill my mom.



    On schooling: would it be possible to maybe go back to a one room schoolhouse kind of thing? find a group, create a bubble, and work through teaching the group of kids that way? I dunno. was just thinking about how the homeschool kids back home used to do it. but there were liker 30 of them (farm families) and the parents took turns.

    That might be useful to keep kids from falling far behind on on knowledge, but it won't count for accreditation. And as mentioned it entirely depends on the people participating.

    Come to think of it I would love a D&D teaching group. We have scientist and professionals across lots of different fields.

    I'm not saying we are going to have an autocratic dystopia, but things keep happening that look like they come from an autocratic dystopia.
  • lonelyahavalonelyahava Call me Ahava Move to New ZealandRegistered User regular
    jothki wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    I have decided to start yelling at people on facebook who are going out this weekend.

    i do not care, y'all are going to kill my mom.



    On schooling: would it be possible to maybe go back to a one room schoolhouse kind of thing? find a group, create a bubble, and work through teaching the group of kids that way? I dunno. was just thinking about how the homeschool kids back home used to do it. but there were liker 30 of them (farm families) and the parents took turns.

    I feel like I don't want random parents teaching my kid :/

    Random members of the public aren't exactly making a good case that they can be trusted right now.

    I mean, it wouldn't really be random.

    You'd be able to teach and have your kid learning with their friends.


    Like, going just from where I am now, Ellie has a group of about 5 close friends. And we actually get along with their parents pretty well. Could i theoretically see us all getting together and agreeing to be a school pod? Yes. Would I want those other parents to be teaching my kid Health and Religion or anything? No. But ABCs and 123s? Sure.

    I'm lucky in that at the moment it isn't an idea I have to worry about. But it is an idea.

  • Commander ZoomCommander Zoom Registered User regular
    From updates thread:
    Jragghen wrote: »

    So much for "it's going to disappear on its own."

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  • JavenJaven Registered User regular
    This doesn't apply to all ages, but a lot of kids are kind of screwed anyway.

    For so many subjects, learning requires a foundation of what came before, and I don't think it's good or responsible to assume a level of retention from the at-home lessons during a pandemic to in-person classrooms under normal circumstances.

    I don't see any scenario where they won't need to essentially be re-taught the cirriculum that was introduced after schools were closed, and that's going to be further compounded the longer schools remain closed.

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  • OrcaOrca Registered User regular
    Aka, just die and let me get back to golfing.

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  • VeagleVeagle Registered User regular
    edited July 3
    From "We're at war with an invisible enemy," to "welp, I guess the enemy is here to stay."

    Just in time for a nice patriotic Fourth of July surrender.

    Veagle on
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    NightslyrFencingsaxElvenshaeLucedesnever dieGnome-InterruptusAbsoluteZeroGreen
  • WACriminalWACriminal Dying Is Easy, Young Man Living Is HarderRegistered User regular
    Parent co-ops can actually be really good at teaching some subjects -- public speaking, logic, literature, etc. Maybe not as good as a trained professional, but good enough to give the kid a solid foundation of knowledge. Then if you've got a parent who works in a specific field (such as mathematics) you can do a bit better on that subject specifically.

    But yeah, the real problem is not that kids can't learn that way, but that it requires a level of quarantine trust which you can't really give in 2020 USA.

    zepherin
  • TetraNitroCubaneTetraNitroCubane The Djinnerator At the bottom of a bottleRegistered User regular
    edited July 3
    Firsthand account from someone who has "recovered" from Covid about how the disease has changed her life - and how she's not the only one:


    Hey, so, I got Covid19 in March. I’ve been sick for over 3 months w/ severe respiratory, cardiovascular & neurological symptoms. I still have a fever. I’ve been incapacitated for nearly a season of my life. It's not enough to not die. You don’t want to live thru this, either.

    I am not unique. Support groups have sprung up all over the internet because medical science doesn’t know what to do with the hundreds of thousands of Covid patients who don’t get better in the (utter and complete bullshit, and they know it) CDC guidelines of 2-6 weeks.

    The CDC is also refusing to add widely-reported, terrifying symptoms to their lists. So here’s a grab bag of what patients like me are experiencing, so you know: Extreme tachycardia. My heart rate was once 160 while I was sleeping. Chest pain, like someone’s sitting…

    ...on your sternum. Back and rib pain like someone’s taken a baseball bat to your torso. Fatigue like you’ve never felt before in your life. Fatigue like your body is shutting off. Fatigue so bad that it would often make me cry because I thought it might mean I was dying.

    GI problems, diarrhea to severe acid reflux. I had diarrhea every day for two+ months. Unbearable nausea. Also: Inexplicable rashes. For me, little broken blood vessels all over my body. For many of us, a constant shortness of breath that doctors can’t find an explanation for.

    Neurological symptoms. I had delirium & hallucinations. Many report tingling all over their body, an internal “buzzing” or “vibrating.” Also, insomnia & chronic hypnic bodily jerks. One symptom so weird that I thought it was just me, but it turns out it’s so many of us…

    was waking up in the middle of the night, gasping for breath. I also experienced tremors while trying to sleep, like someone was shaking the bed. Also: many report a “hot head.” Mine literally radiated heat, despite not hitting a high fever. Then, there’s the confusion…

    The “brain fog.” I couldn’t read or make sense of text at times. I couldn’t remember words. I’d stare at my partner at a loss for what I needed to communicate, or how to do it. Also: thickening of the blood, clotting. Weird, inexplicable changes to the menstrual cycle.

    Everyone knows the lung stuff already, so I won't elaborate. But it doesn’t just go away. I wake up every morning & when I breathe in, it feels like someone is crinkling plastic in my chest. And these are just the symptoms. I’m not even touching the physical damage done…

    ...to patients’ organs and bodily systems. I’m also not touching the mental component of this, which is compounded by the very virtue of not knowing if it’ll eventually kill you. But long-term covid sufferers all report the same thing: that the recovery is non-linear.

    You’ll wake up feeling better and assume, like would be true for the flu or a cold, you’re on the mend. But then... you get worse. & then you're feeling better again! & then you’re bedridden, worse than before. It makes no sense. You start to think you’re losing your grip...

    or maybe it’s all in your head. It isn’t. Thousands & thousands are experiencing these cycles. At some point, I realized that this was causing a trauma response in my body, which only seemed to worsen recovery. And I’m someone who’s learned over the years how to tend to...

    their mental health needs pretty well. This experience is a whole other ball game. It is terrifying what it did to my mind. There are parts of the experience I am well aware I've blocked out in order to function, and times my partner has to remind me of things I've shut out.

    There's so much we don't know — including if these physical damages are permanent or, for some, will lead to chronic illness. But one thing we do know is this isn’t the fucking flu. Those of you taking risks (yes, you in masks, as well), please, please weigh them against...

    ...experiences like mine. It's not "well, a tiny fraction of people die, and most people are better in two weeks." This is simply untrue. So many of us have suffered for months. Ask yourselves: is going to get a coffee, or getting a haircut worth being debilitatingly ill...

    ...for 4+ months of your life? Or, is it worth condemning someone else to this experience? Tending to your critical needs (grocery, medicine) is a necessary risk. So is fighting for the lives of others (protesting, organizing). But I promise you, the risk is too great...

    ...for a birthday party. Or a fucking bar night. Or visiting your fav restaurant. Good lord, I cannot stress this enough. Please. Wear a mask. Stay home as much as you can. And know that the recovery times associated with this illness are wrong. That people are suffering.

    I presume we're going to see more data about this as time evolves, but we might take years to get a clear picture.

    Terrifying symptoms. Remember that "Recovered" is an arbitrary distinction. The lasting impacts go beyond the initial infection.

    I'm particularly freaked out, personally, because periodic extreme tachycardia is already something that's landed me in the ER, and got me wearing a heart monitor for 30 days without interruption. That's not something I want to make any worse than it already is.

    This is what people are going to have to "Live with". Perhaps for the rest of their lives.

    TetraNitroCubane on
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  • CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    Officials also plan to emphasize high survival rates, particularly for Americans who are within certain age groups and don't have underlying conditions. The overall death rate from COVID-19 in the U.S. has been on the decline. More than 130,000 Americans have died of the virus.
    "most people don't die (long term effects on health vary but ignore that)!" is not reassuring

    ElvenshaeGnome-InterruptusGreen
  • ceresceres When the last moon is cast over the last star of morning And the future has past without even a last desperate warningRegistered User, Moderator mod
    Has he said anything about Cain? I'm guessing he won't even if the guy dies. Barely knew him, and all that.

    And it seems like all is dying, and would leave the world to mourn
    Ticaldfjam
  • GaddezGaddez Registered User regular
    edited July 4
    From updates thread:
    Jragghen wrote: »

    So much for "it's going to disappear on its own."

    To be fair, at this point there isn't exactly a lot the federal government can actually do given how widely this shit has spread and how many people are refusing to use common sense for dealing with it.

    Like, if trump had taken put forthe the most basic effort to corral this thing back in january or early febuary you could have probably been ahead of europe at this point.

    Gaddez on
    Richy wrote: »
    But I think the resistance I’m getting more has to do with “rawr! Loklar said it! Rage!” than anything else.

    No, it has to do with the fact that you're done nothing but throw lies, blatant flasehoods, and downright dumb statements at us so far.
    Smrtnik
This discussion has been closed.