The new forums will be named Coin Return (based on the most recent vote)! You can check on the status and timeline of the transition to the new forums here.
Please vote in the Forum Structure Poll. Polling will close at 2PM EST on January 21, 2025.
The Legend of Vox Machina: It Has Begin! Again! For the third time!
Thinking way ahead here (spoilers for endgame CRS1):
I am wondering how they're going to handle animating Scanlan's sacrifice in counterspelling Vecna's teleport. That was a really powerful scene in the campaign videos.
Speculatively, they could introduce a consumable magic item to take the place of a high level spell slot.
Thinking way ahead here (spoilers for endgame CRS1):
I am wondering how they're going to handle animating Scanlan's sacrifice in counterspelling Vecna's teleport. That was a really powerful scene in the campaign videos.
Speculatively, they could introduce a consumable magic item to take the place of a high level spell slot.
Which misses the point. Scanlan had to make a choice - burn that ninth level slot on counterspelling the teleport to guarantee it failed, or risk letting Vecna escape (which would be game over - if he escaped, he would become too powerful to counter.) And to Scanlan's credit, he makes the hero's choice - he counterspells at ninth level, stopping Vecna's escape and letting Vox Machina finish things.
It's just that he had intended to use that slot after the fight for a single purpose - to cast wish to nullify Vex's contract with the Raven Queen and let him actually live. Without it, he's unable to do anything when she comes to take her due.
The point is that he has a choice - his friend, or the world. And to his credit, he makes the right choice, but boy does it suck.
Thinking way ahead here (spoilers for endgame CRS1):
I am wondering how they're going to handle animating Scanlan's sacrifice in counterspelling Vecna's teleport. That was a really powerful scene in the campaign videos.
Speculatively, they could introduce a consumable magic item to take the place of a high level spell slot.
Which misses the point. Scanlan had to make a choice - burn that ninth level slot on counterspelling the teleport to guarantee it failed, or risk letting Vecna escape (which would be game over - if he escaped, he would become too powerful to counter.) And to Scanlan's credit, he makes the hero's choice - he counterspells at ninth level, stopping Vecna's escape and letting Vox Machina finish things.
It's just that he had intended to use that slot after the fight for a single purpose - to cast wish to nullify Vex's contract with the Raven Queen and let him actually live. Without it, he's unable to do anything when she comes to take her due.
The point is that he has a choice - his friend, or the world. And to his credit, he makes the right choice, but boy does it suck.
Yeah, I was proposing a solution to make the mechanical significance of the choice clear to the audience.
They're not going to use game language like spell slots in the show.
It's not at all clear that by casting one spell, Scanlan loses the opportunity to cast a different spell, later. They get that he uses magic, and that he can only do so much magic before he needs to recover somehow. But communicating that he has one special spell, that can do very different things, but only once per day, and also bringing Vax back won't work tomorrow because a god says so... that's a lot of exposition. And all of those details aren't necessary to the story beat.
What's necessary is that Scanlan is fighting for the lives of everyone on the planet, against the most terrifying and dangerous foe imaginable, but he still holds his most powerful weapon in reserve until the last possible instant, in vain hope that he can use it to bring back his friend instead.
An item can be used to show that, rather than tell it. There's even canonically find a 9th level spell scroll on Ripley's body- Scanlan uses that to summon the Yenk to fight Vorugal and simultaneously bring with it the Spire of Conflux. They could have him find an even more powerful scroll later on, for example.
Thinking way ahead here (spoilers for endgame CRS1):
I am wondering how they're going to handle animating Scanlan's sacrifice in counterspelling Vecna's teleport. That was a really powerful scene in the campaign videos.
Guessing they'll be cancelled before they get anywhere near that far sadly.
In the newest batch of episodes, did anyone else hear Delilah say
Omin Dran (the name of Tycho's character from Acquisitions, Inc) while casting a spell? I saw at least one other person on the Critical Role subreddit mention this as well. It seemed too specific to be a coincidence, but I'm also unaware of the Penny Arcade guys having any connection with the Critical Role cast.
Scattered Impressions from Episodes 7-9
- At some point there was a shot of Percy firing his gun where the whole screen flashed for a moment. I went back and paused it to see flames coming from the barrel with Percy himself seemingly engulfed in flame. I don't remember where this was, but I wanna go back and find it later.
- Pike's astral projection showing up wearing heavy armor and wielding a mace makes me wonder if this is supposed to be a sign of her changing her Cleric domain from Life to War.
- I kind of wish Anders had taken cover or something during the fight. As is for most of it I was wondering why they weren't targetting the guy out in the open who was clearly controlling everything.
- From what I understand they definitely changed the tone of the Scanbo sequence in the show. There he was in control most of the time, but here he was more lucking into everything. I'm also curious if they're eventually going to let him cast polymorph without having to use the scroll.
- Scanlan casting Lightning from his crotch was a reference to one of the old Critical Role live-action intros I've seen, where Sam Riegel as Scanlan shot purple beams from his crotch.
- One challenge they must have had adapting the campaign for this show is depicting how exactly Percy, Vex, and Vax are making dents in huge dragons, zombie giants, and animated armor with projectile weapons and daggers. In D&D the issue is nebulous enough that it rarely comes up.
Hexmage-PA on
+1
scherbchenAsgard (it is dead)Registered Userregular
In the newest batch of episodes, did anyone else hear Delilah say
Omin Dran (the name of Tycho's character from Acquisitions, Inc) while casting a spell? I saw at least one other person on the Critical Role subreddit mention this as well. It seemed too specific to be a coincidence, but I'm also unaware of the Penny Arcade guys having any connection with the Critical Role cast.
i assume they run into each other during stream of many eyes and other events
Thinking way ahead here (spoilers for endgame CRS1):
I am wondering how they're going to handle animating Scanlan's sacrifice in counterspelling Vecna's teleport. That was a really powerful scene in the campaign videos.
Speculatively, they could introduce a consumable magic item to take the place of a high level spell slot.
Which misses the point. Scanlan had to make a choice - burn that ninth level slot on counterspelling the teleport to guarantee it failed, or risk letting Vecna escape (which would be game over - if he escaped, he would become too powerful to counter.) And to Scanlan's credit, he makes the hero's choice - he counterspells at ninth level, stopping Vecna's escape and letting Vox Machina finish things.
It's just that he had intended to use that slot after the fight for a single purpose - to cast wish to nullify Vex's contract with the Raven Queen and let him actually live. Without it, he's unable to do anything when she comes to take her due.
The point is that he has a choice - his friend, or the world. And to his credit, he makes the right choice, but boy does it suck.
Yeah, I was proposing a solution to make the mechanical significance of the choice clear to the audience.
They're not going to use game language like spell slots in the show.
It's not at all clear that by casting one spell, Scanlan loses the opportunity to cast a different spell, later. They get that he uses magic, and that he can only do so much magic before he needs to recover somehow. But communicating that he has one special spell, that can do very different things, but only once per day, and also bringing Vax back won't work tomorrow because a god says so... that's a lot of exposition. And all of those details aren't necessary to the story beat.
What's necessary is that Scanlan is fighting for the lives of everyone on the planet, against the most terrifying and dangerous foe imaginable, but he still holds his most powerful weapon in reserve until the last possible instant, in vain hope that he can use it to bring back his friend instead.
An item can be used to show that, rather than tell it. There's even canonically find a 9th level spell scroll on Ripley's body- Scanlan uses that to summon the Yenk to fight Vorugal and simultaneously bring with it the Spire of Conflux. They could have him find an even more powerful scroll later on, for example.
They could have Ioun give him a single cast of Wish, that he ends up using to stop Vecna.
I've only played 2ed and 3rd before it went wild with expansions so I'm definitely dated.
5E has guns, the forgotten realms anyway, technology has advanced after the weakening of magic between 3.5 and 5e's timeline, there are guns, accessible printing presses, etc (at least in the major points of civilization), guns aren't widespread though because smokepowder can be magically ignited by a cantrip and explodes
they're rare enough that only one 5e module so far really goes into them at all, Waterdeep: Dragon Heist, where the drow mercenaries carry pistols
In Exandria where the show is set, to say they're rare is an understatement
very minor spoiler:
Percy invented them, only people who have copied percy's design at the time of the show have them
I was going to say I had read the Wiki entry for Percy and
A demon seeking out Percy to give him the design to guns to hurry up the demise of humanity or whatever is a great character hook
Oh when he put that plague doctor mask on I was all like okay I don't think this guy is on the up and up
- Scanlan casting Lightning from his crotch was a reference to one of the old Critical Role live-action intros I've seen, where Sam Riegel as Scanlan shot purple beams from his crotch.
If I recall correctly, that particular spell description from Sam in-game predated the intro.
I was really excited for Pike to show up. It was such a cool moment in game and it was just wonderful here. Being a high level cleric verse a horde of undead also is like one of the best moments in gaming possible. You are a god.
Does Vox Machina just not have a lot of magic items? The barbarian couldn't damage the vampire with his normal-ass great axe until the cleric casts holy weapon on it.
But then the knife guy has returning knives and a snake belt.
Does Vox Machina just not have a lot of magic items? The barbarian couldn't damage the vampire with his normal-ass great axe until the cleric casts holy weapon on it.
But then the knife guy has returning knives and a snake belt.
More recent versions of D&D have moved away from magic items to inherent abilities (this is a bit of a bugbear for DMTuber Matt Colville.)
Does Vox Machina just not have a lot of magic items? The barbarian couldn't damage the vampire with his normal-ass great axe until the cleric casts holy weapon on it.
But then the knife guy has returning knives and a snake belt.
Vox Machina did have a chunk of magical weapons at his point, part of moving over from Pathfinder which was much more item heavy.
Some in the spoilers:
Grog actually had a magic warhammer he wasn't using. Vax's dagger are both magic (dagger of poison and dagger of drain life). Percy's gun are kind of magic. Just off the top of my head.
Does Vox Machina just not have a lot of magic items? The barbarian couldn't damage the vampire with his normal-ass great axe until the cleric casts holy weapon on it.
But then the knife guy has returning knives and a snake belt.
More recent versions of D&D have moved away from magic items to inherent abilities (this is a bit of a bugbear for DMTuber Matt Colville.)
A right. For some reason I thought they were playing Pathfinder as of this arc.
Does Vox Machina just not have a lot of magic items? The barbarian couldn't damage the vampire with his normal-ass great axe until the cleric casts holy weapon on it.
But then the knife guy has returning knives and a snake belt.
More recent versions of D&D have moved away from magic items to inherent abilities (this is a bit of a bugbear for DMTuber Matt Colville.)
A right. For some reason I thought they were playing Pathfinder as of this arc.
That's because Vox Machina started as a Pathfinder campaign before migrating to 5e, but Critical Role's contractual obligations to WOTC/Hasbro means that the series has to be built off 5e from the start.
Does Vox Machina just not have a lot of magic items? The barbarian couldn't damage the vampire with his normal-ass great axe until the cleric casts holy weapon on it.
But then the knife guy has returning knives and a snake belt.
I figured Vox was an Eldritch Knight fighter, using the weapon bond and Find Familiar.
But then, I also thought Percy was a warlock with his Pepperbox being a reflavored Rod of the Pactkeeper.
Does Vox Machina just not have a lot of magic items? The barbarian couldn't damage the vampire with his normal-ass great axe until the cleric casts holy weapon on it.
But then the knife guy has returning knives and a snake belt.
I figured Vox was an Eldritch Knight fighter, using the weapon bond and Find Familiar.
But then, I also thought Percy was a warlock with his Pepperbox being a reflavored Rod of the Pactkeeper.
Grog is a beserker barbarian
Vax is an assassination rogue
Vex is a beast master ranger
Keyleth is a circle of the moon druid
Pike is a cleric of the life domain at the start
Scanlan is a College of lore bard
Percy is a fighter with talents to use warlock spells and a custom specialization called gunslinger
Does Vox Machina just not have a lot of magic items? The barbarian couldn't damage the vampire with his normal-ass great axe until the cleric casts holy weapon on it.
But then the knife guy has returning knives and a snake belt.
I figured Vox was an Eldritch Knight fighter, using the weapon bond and Find Familiar.
But then, I also thought Percy was a warlock with his Pepperbox being a reflavored Rod of the Pactkeeper.
I thought Percy was a Hexblade at first, with his high damage shots being Eldrich Smites.
I had a gunslinger in one of my games and I don't think their damage is notably higher than a bow fighter, not enough to justify the incredible punishment of the weapon jamming
I implemented a house rule where if you roll a gun jam you immediately roll the attack roll again, and can hit as normal, but the gun still needs to be kajiggered, it feels a lot better
however
Sometimes the gunslinger says "gonna use 4 grit points", fires a Bad News with sharpshooter, and crits, so does 16d12+15 damage at like level 8 and deletes your boss
I get that the show is based off of a D&D live play, which is based off of a Pathfinder home game.
But trying to decipher when and where an action packed TV show is depicting a particular game rule? Madness! A character beat, a cool moment, an easter or even an OOC gag that had legs... yeah sure. Find and enjoy those.
But looking for a rule???... you nerds are silly. :razz:
+5
Nova_CI have the needThe need for speedRegistered Userregular
edited February 2022
Not everything this show attempts hits, but the misses are rare, and the hits are
ahem critical
I'm sorry, I didn't want to do it, but when I realized it was there I didn't really have a choice.
My broad sort of simple analysis of the first campaign is also seemingly relevant to this season, and I think it was really smart to start where they did.
(Not really spoilers, but putting in tags just to be sure)
Percy was the only fully realized character in the first campaign at the start - you can tell everyone else built their characters off archetypes and tropes whereas Taliesin was old hat at TTRPGs and character creation. As the series went on, the other characters developed more, but Percy was the best character based storytelling the first campaign. And in this first season of Vox Machina, the best writing is Percy's. Which makes sense. Taliesin is doing a bang up job on his performances, and the dialogue is just the right amount of hate and rage without being comical.
Real spoiler:
Especially at the end of episode 9. "This is the only freedom I offer you."
Nova_C on
+1
Nova_CI have the needThe need for speedRegistered Userregular
Oh, and can I say, the moment I am most looking forward to seeing them animate:
Vax leaving Percy in the bath with Vex popping up out of the water a moment later. Just an inspired visual gag that hasn't gotten a visual yet.
Does Vox Machina just not have a lot of magic items? The barbarian couldn't damage the vampire with his normal-ass great axe until the cleric casts holy weapon on it.
But then the knife guy has returning knives and a snake belt.
More recent versions of D&D have moved away from magic items to inherent abilities (this is a bit of a bugbear for DMTuber Matt Colville.)
A right. For some reason I thought they were playing Pathfinder as of this arc.
That's because Vox Machina started as a Pathfinder campaign before migrating to 5e, but Critical Role's contractual obligations to WOTC/Hasbro means that the series has to be built off 5e from the start.
So expect weirdness.
Also is Critical Role have contractual obligations with WOTC in regards to the show?
I believe the timeline goes something like the very first few home sessions were D&D 4E, they they switched to Pathfinder 1E when they decided to make it a long term thing. When they started streaming they switched to 5E for reasons I don't remember, or if they've even gone into it.
+1
webguy20I spend too much time on the InternetRegistered Userregular
I believe the timeline goes something like the very first few home sessions were D&D 4E, they they switched to Pathfinder 1E when they decided to make it a long term thing. When they started streaming they switched to 5E for reasons I don't remember, or if they've even gone into it.
I think it was 5e is easier to run and makes for better viewing.
I would assume that the Geek and Sundry folks told them to switch to D&D5e to capitalize on the brand association and therefore better monetize the channel.
Yeah season 1 I think they swapped when asked to. Season 2 was sponsored by Wizards and D&D Beyond. Season 3 I think they are just so deep in the system they aren't leaving it.
Yeah season 1 I think they swapped when asked to. Season 2 was sponsored by Wizards and D&D Beyond. Season 3 I think they are just so deep in the system they aren't leaving it.
I believe the timeline goes something like the very first few home sessions were D&D 4E, they they switched to Pathfinder 1E when they decided to make it a long term thing. When they started streaming they switched to 5E for reasons I don't remember, or if they've even gone into it.
I think it was 5e is easier to run and makes for better viewing.
Pretty much. Matt thought having them juggle the minutiae of Pathfinder 1e’s floating modifiers and the more complex rules system would not make for smooth or fun viewing, especially as they were gonna be getting used to streaming at the same time. So he made the decision with the group to switch.
Which is also why, if you watch the early parts of the original campaign, they don’t seem as familiar with their character abilities as you would expect and sometimes mix up how spells work compared to Pathfinder 1e.
0
webguy20I spend too much time on the InternetRegistered Userregular
I believe the timeline goes something like the very first few home sessions were D&D 4E, they they switched to Pathfinder 1E when they decided to make it a long term thing. When they started streaming they switched to 5E for reasons I don't remember, or if they've even gone into it.
I think it was 5e is easier to run and makes for better viewing.
Pretty much. Matt thought having them juggle the minutiae of Pathfinder 1e’s floating modifiers and the more complex rules system would not make for smooth or fun viewing, especially as they were gonna be getting used to streaming at the same time. So he made the decision with the group to switch.
Which is also why, if you watch the early parts of the original campaign, they don’t seem as familiar with their character abilities as you would expect and sometimes mix up how spells work compared to Pathfinder 1e.
Also, depending on what level they were when they switched, shit goes sideways around level 10-11 in Pathfinder. It was ridiculous. I was doing something like 7 attacks with my monk, and 5 with my rogue. I think If they all hit I was rolling like 30 d6 damage. I had to have printed out cheat sheets to figure out how attacks worked with haste, or other modifiers. One of the other PCs had a +35 to persuasion I think? This was just stuff out of the core book too.
Thinking way ahead here (spoilers for endgame CRS1):
I am wondering how they're going to handle animating Scanlan's sacrifice in counterspelling Vecna's teleport. That was a really powerful scene in the campaign videos.
Speculatively, they could introduce a consumable magic item to take the place of a high level spell slot.
Which misses the point. Scanlan had to make a choice - burn that ninth level slot on counterspelling the teleport to guarantee it failed, or risk letting Vecna escape (which would be game over - if he escaped, he would become too powerful to counter.) And to Scanlan's credit, he makes the hero's choice - he counterspells at ninth level, stopping Vecna's escape and letting Vox Machina finish things.
It's just that he had intended to use that slot after the fight for a single purpose - to cast wish to nullify Vex's contract with the Raven Queen and let him actually live. Without it, he's unable to do anything when she comes to take her due.
The point is that he has a choice - his friend, or the world. And to his credit, he makes the right choice, but boy does it suck.
Yeah, I was proposing a solution to make the mechanical significance of the choice clear to the audience.
They're not going to use game language like spell slots in the show.
It's not at all clear that by casting one spell, Scanlan loses the opportunity to cast a different spell, later. They get that he uses magic, and that he can only do so much magic before he needs to recover somehow. But communicating that he has one special spell, that can do very different things, but only once per day, and also bringing Vax back won't work tomorrow because a god says so... that's a lot of exposition. And all of those details aren't necessary to the story beat.
What's necessary is that Scanlan is fighting for the lives of everyone on the planet, against the most terrifying and dangerous foe imaginable, but he still holds his most powerful weapon in reserve until the last possible instant, in vain hope that he can use it to bring back his friend instead.
An item can be used to show that, rather than tell it. There's even canonically find a 9th level spell scroll on Ripley's body- Scanlan uses that to summon the Yenk to fight Vorugal and simultaneously bring with it the Spire of Conflux. They could have him find an even more powerful
scroll later on, for example.
make it clear that when Scanlan learns to wish that each time he does it, it is incredibly stressful and painful and he can permanently lose the ability to ever do it
instead of a regular counterspell, have him Wish Vecna to stay put, or Vecna gets away and Scanlan Wishes him back, and the ensuing feedback put Scanlan out, maybe give him a mark of the knowing mistress when he learns wish that burns away when he uses it on vecna
Does Vox Machina just not have a lot of magic items? The barbarian couldn't damage the vampire with his normal-ass great axe until the cleric casts holy weapon on it.
But then the knife guy has returning knives and a snake belt.
More recent versions of D&D have moved away from magic items to inherent abilities (this is a bit of a bugbear for DMTuber Matt Colville.)
A right. For some reason I thought they were playing Pathfinder as of this arc.
That's because Vox Machina started as a Pathfinder campaign before migrating to 5e, but Critical Role's contractual obligations to WOTC/Hasbro means that the series has to be built off 5e from the start.
So expect weirdness.
Also is Critical Role have contractual obligations with WOTC in regards to the show?
WOTC has nothing to do with the show and they are deliberately avoiding any copyrights, despite the fact that WOTC would likely let them be used, presumably to maintain creative control of the show no matter what changes going forward
Does Vox Machina just not have a lot of magic items? The barbarian couldn't damage the vampire with his normal-ass great axe until the cleric casts holy weapon on it.
But then the knife guy has returning knives and a snake belt.
More recent versions of D&D have moved away from magic items to inherent abilities (this is a bit of a bugbear for DMTuber Matt Colville.)
A right. For some reason I thought they were playing Pathfinder as of this arc.
That's because Vox Machina started as a Pathfinder campaign before migrating to 5e, but Critical Role's contractual obligations to WOTC/Hasbro means that the series has to be built off 5e from the start.
So expect weirdness.
Also is Critical Role have contractual obligations with WOTC in regards to the show?
WOTC has nothing to do with the show and they are deliberately avoiding any copyrights, despite the fact that WOTC would likely let them be used, presumably to maintain creative control of the show no matter what changes going forward
Honestly, it doesn't make sense to tie it to D&D brand-wise, anyway. Like, the only benefit would be using spell names or deity names that are in the books. The story and characters and setting all belong to Critical Role, and that's what the animated series is about.
Does Vox Machina just not have a lot of magic items? The barbarian couldn't damage the vampire with his normal-ass great axe until the cleric casts holy weapon on it.
But then the knife guy has returning knives and a snake belt.
More recent versions of D&D have moved away from magic items to inherent abilities (this is a bit of a bugbear for DMTuber Matt Colville.)
A right. For some reason I thought they were playing Pathfinder as of this arc.
That's because Vox Machina started as a Pathfinder campaign before migrating to 5e, but Critical Role's contractual obligations to WOTC/Hasbro means that the series has to be built off 5e from the start.
So expect weirdness.
Also is Critical Role have contractual obligations with WOTC in regards to the show?
WOTC has nothing to do with the show and they are deliberately avoiding any copyrights, despite the fact that WOTC would likely let them be used, presumably to maintain creative control of the show no matter what changes going forward
Honestly, it doesn't make sense to tie it to D&D brand-wise, anyway. Like, the only benefit would be using spell names or deity names that are in the books. The story and characters and setting all belong to Critical Role, and that's what the animated series is about.
Right and if Hasbro decided to, for no reason, become copyright assholes like Games Workshop because they want to launch a bunch of crappy web series and charge $25 a month to see them, it would put future seasons in jeopardy or make them weird
CR media made the right call
On the flip side, Hasbro was crazy to not drive a bus full of money to CR studios to try and get their copyright all over this thing. Unlike any D&D movie they're making, it's actually really good
Does Vox Machina just not have a lot of magic items? The barbarian couldn't damage the vampire with his normal-ass great axe until the cleric casts holy weapon on it.
But then the knife guy has returning knives and a snake belt.
More recent versions of D&D have moved away from magic items to inherent abilities (this is a bit of a bugbear for DMTuber Matt Colville.)
A right. For some reason I thought they were playing Pathfinder as of this arc.
That's because Vox Machina started as a Pathfinder campaign before migrating to 5e, but Critical Role's contractual obligations to WOTC/Hasbro means that the series has to be built off 5e from the start.
So expect weirdness.
Also is Critical Role have contractual obligations with WOTC in regards to the show?
WOTC has nothing to do with the show and they are deliberately avoiding any copyrights, despite the fact that WOTC would likely let them be used, presumably to maintain creative control of the show no matter what changes going forward
Honestly, it doesn't make sense to tie it to D&D brand-wise, anyway. Like, the only benefit would be using spell names or deity names that are in the books. The story and characters and setting all belong to Critical Role, and that's what the animated series is about.
Right and if Hasbro decided to, for no reason, become copyright assholes like Games Workshop because they want to launch a bunch of crappy web series and charge $25 a month to see them, it would put future seasons in jeopardy or make them weird
CR media made the right call
On the flip side, Hasbro was crazy to not drive a bus full of money to CR studios to try and get their copyright all over this thing. Unlike any D&D movie they're making, it's actually really good
Hasbro money would come with a ton of catches. I wouldn't want all the purile humor and dark themes to go away for better animation or whatever.
Posts
Speculatively, they could introduce a consumable magic item to take the place of a high level spell slot.
Ungh
It's just that he had intended to use that slot after the fight for a single purpose - to cast wish to nullify Vex's contract with the Raven Queen and let him actually live. Without it, he's unable to do anything when she comes to take her due.
The point is that he has a choice - his friend, or the world. And to his credit, he makes the right choice, but boy does it suck.
Yeah, I was proposing a solution to make the mechanical significance of the choice clear to the audience.
It's not at all clear that by casting one spell, Scanlan loses the opportunity to cast a different spell, later. They get that he uses magic, and that he can only do so much magic before he needs to recover somehow. But communicating that he has one special spell, that can do very different things, but only once per day, and also bringing Vax back won't work tomorrow because a god says so... that's a lot of exposition. And all of those details aren't necessary to the story beat.
What's necessary is that Scanlan is fighting for the lives of everyone on the planet, against the most terrifying and dangerous foe imaginable, but he still holds his most powerful weapon in reserve until the last possible instant, in vain hope that he can use it to bring back his friend instead.
An item can be used to show that, rather than tell it. There's even canonically find a 9th level spell scroll on Ripley's body- Scanlan uses that to summon the Yenk to fight Vorugal and simultaneously bring with it the Spire of Conflux. They could have him find an even more powerful scroll later on, for example.
Why?
Scattered Impressions from Episodes 7-9
- Pike's astral projection showing up wearing heavy armor and wielding a mace makes me wonder if this is supposed to be a sign of her changing her Cleric domain from Life to War.
- I kind of wish Anders had taken cover or something during the fight. As is for most of it I was wondering why they weren't targetting the guy out in the open who was clearly controlling everything.
- From what I understand they definitely changed the tone of the Scanbo sequence in the show. There he was in control most of the time, but here he was more lucking into everything. I'm also curious if they're eventually going to let him cast polymorph without having to use the scroll.
- Scanlan casting Lightning from his crotch was a reference to one of the old Critical Role live-action intros I've seen, where Sam Riegel as Scanlan shot purple beams from his crotch.
- One challenge they must have had adapting the campaign for this show is depicting how exactly Percy, Vex, and Vax are making dents in huge dragons, zombie giants, and animated armor with projectile weapons and daggers. In D&D the issue is nebulous enough that it rarely comes up.
I was going to say I had read the Wiki entry for Percy and
Oh when he put that plague doctor mask on I was all like okay I don't think this guy is on the up and up
If I recall correctly, that particular spell description from Sam in-game predated the intro.
But then the knife guy has returning knives and a snake belt.
More recent versions of D&D have moved away from magic items to inherent abilities (this is a bit of a bugbear for DMTuber Matt Colville.)
Vox Machina did have a chunk of magical weapons at his point, part of moving over from Pathfinder which was much more item heavy.
Some in the spoilers:
A right. For some reason I thought they were playing Pathfinder as of this arc.
That's because Vox Machina started as a Pathfinder campaign before migrating to 5e, but Critical Role's contractual obligations to WOTC/Hasbro means that the series has to be built off 5e from the start.
So expect weirdness.
I figured Vox was an Eldritch Knight fighter, using the weapon bond and Find Familiar.
But then, I also thought Percy was a warlock with his Pepperbox being a reflavored Rod of the Pactkeeper.
Grog is a beserker barbarian
Vax is an assassination rogue
Vex is a beast master ranger
Keyleth is a circle of the moon druid
Pike is a cleric of the life domain at the start
Scanlan is a College of lore bard
Percy is a fighter with talents to use warlock spells and a custom specialization called gunslinger
I thought Percy was a Hexblade at first, with his high damage shots being Eldrich Smites.
Which is why there was a running gag during the campaign of Scanlan trying to get Vex to leave him behind.
I implemented a house rule where if you roll a gun jam you immediately roll the attack roll again, and can hit as normal, but the gun still needs to be kajiggered, it feels a lot better
however
Sometimes the gunslinger says "gonna use 4 grit points", fires a Bad News with sharpshooter, and crits, so does 16d12+15 damage at like level 8 and deletes your boss
Thankfully as of the tashas book, beast rangers are actually not terrible
But trying to decipher when and where an action packed TV show is depicting a particular game rule? Madness! A character beat, a cool moment, an easter or even an OOC gag that had legs... yeah sure. Find and enjoy those.
But looking for a rule???... you nerds are silly. :razz:
ahem
critical
My broad sort of simple analysis of the first campaign is also seemingly relevant to this season, and I think it was really smart to start where they did.
(Not really spoilers, but putting in tags just to be sure)
Real spoiler:
Does it even matter?
I believe the first two episodes were the pathfinder home game and then everything after that is the show and 5e
Also is Critical Role have contractual obligations with WOTC in regards to the show?
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
Untappd ID: Discgolfer1981
I think it was 5e is easier to run and makes for better viewing.
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
Untappd ID: Discgolfer1981
Ah the way 5e gets ya
Pretty much. Matt thought having them juggle the minutiae of Pathfinder 1e’s floating modifiers and the more complex rules system would not make for smooth or fun viewing, especially as they were gonna be getting used to streaming at the same time. So he made the decision with the group to switch.
Which is also why, if you watch the early parts of the original campaign, they don’t seem as familiar with their character abilities as you would expect and sometimes mix up how spells work compared to Pathfinder 1e.
Also, depending on what level they were when they switched, shit goes sideways around level 10-11 in Pathfinder. It was ridiculous. I was doing something like 7 attacks with my monk, and 5 with my rogue. I think If they all hit I was rolling like 30 d6 damage. I had to have printed out cheat sheets to figure out how attacks worked with haste, or other modifiers. One of the other PCs had a +35 to persuasion I think? This was just stuff out of the core book too.
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
Untappd ID: Discgolfer1981
instead of a regular counterspell, have him Wish Vecna to stay put, or Vecna gets away and Scanlan Wishes him back, and the ensuing feedback put Scanlan out, maybe give him a mark of the knowing mistress when he learns wish that burns away when he uses it on vecna
something like that
WOTC has nothing to do with the show and they are deliberately avoiding any copyrights, despite the fact that WOTC would likely let them be used, presumably to maintain creative control of the show no matter what changes going forward
Nope.
Honestly, it doesn't make sense to tie it to D&D brand-wise, anyway. Like, the only benefit would be using spell names or deity names that are in the books. The story and characters and setting all belong to Critical Role, and that's what the animated series is about.
Right and if Hasbro decided to, for no reason, become copyright assholes like Games Workshop because they want to launch a bunch of crappy web series and charge $25 a month to see them, it would put future seasons in jeopardy or make them weird
CR media made the right call
On the flip side, Hasbro was crazy to not drive a bus full of money to CR studios to try and get their copyright all over this thing. Unlike any D&D movie they're making, it's actually really good
Hasbro money would come with a ton of catches. I wouldn't want all the purile humor and dark themes to go away for better animation or whatever.