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Would like some feedback on my webcomic...

The WarmasterThe Warmaster Registered User
edited August 2007 in Artist's Corner
Howdy, I'm new on the forums (although I've been a PA reader for a few years now), and I was wondering if anyone here could give some feedback on my webcomics (the link can be found in my signature). I know they're not as good as they could be, but that's due to a lack of resources more than anything. Feedback would be greatly appreciated.

Oh, and yes, PA has been a big influence, although I have not "copied", so to speak.

- N.

P.S: The current "dreaded continuity" (which will either be a 4 or 5-part strip) is still WIP, although there have been delays in the creation of part III. That shall be up soon.

Edit: Removed the link from my signature.

The Warmaster on

Posts

  • BananaChipsBananaChips Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Get out while you still can, and never look back.

    BananaChips on
    bananagr9.png
  • The WarmasterThe Warmaster Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Get out while you still can, and never look back.

    And that's supposed to mean what, exactly?

    - N.

    The Warmaster on
  • UncleSamUncleSam Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Ehh... It doesn't seem all that funny to me, although that's probably me. Seems to be more of the random for random's sake kind of deal. The poses are canned, a few strips back it looks like the characters are literally copy and pasted through the frames, expression and all. More visual jokes and less talking? Or maybe just more jokes. I don't mean to be harsh, I just didn't laugh. Or crack a smile. Nothing really stood out.

    EDIT: The comic with cut-and-paste characters.

    ff788797faa64dbd3731f230b1c9841a.jpg

    UncleSam on
    SteamID : sammer105
  • lyriumlyrium Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    I recommend the following steps for you.

    1. Read the rules. Making a new thread with no art in it is generally frowned upon, and just trying to get a lot of people to click on your link is site whoring, which is much worse than frowned upon.

    2. Post your comic right in this thread. If you do not know how to do this, I'm sure you can find the answer in the questions thread.

    3. Accept right now that the comics aren't as good as they could be not because of a lack of resources, but because there are things you need to practice (which is true for practically everybody). If you post the pictures, you will probably receive a lot of good advice, and you should follow it.


    Oh, and:
    Get out while you still can, and never look back.

    And that's supposed to mean what, exactly?

    - N.

    He means that we get a lot of people in here who refuse to accept advice on their utterly horrible web comics, plus since you just posted a link you obviously haven't lurked and may be in for a few surprises.

    lyrium on
  • MKRMKR Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    lyrium wrote: »
    I recommend the following steps for you.

    1. Read the rules. Making a new thread with no art in it is generally frowned upon, and just trying to get a lot of people to click on your link is site whoring, which is much worst than frowned upon.

    2. Post your comic right in this thread. If you do not know how to do this, I'm sure you can find the answer in the questions thread.

    3. Accept right now that the comics aren't as good as they could be not because of a lack of resources, but because there are things you need to practice (which is true for practically everybody). If you post the pictures, you will probably receive a lot of good advice, and you should follow it.

    Addendum:
    The signature function is there for a reason.

    MKR on
  • The WarmasterThe Warmaster Registered User
    edited July 2007
    UncleSam wrote: »
    Ehh... It doesn't seem all that funny to me, although that's probably me. Seems to be more of the random for random's sake kind of deal. The poses are canned, a few strips back it looks like the characters are literally copy and pasted through the frames, expression and all. More visual jokes and less talking? Or maybe just more jokes. I don't mean to be harsh, I just didn't laugh. Or crack a smile. Nothing really stood out.

    EDIT: The comic with cut-and-paste characters.

    ff788797faa64dbd3731f230b1c9841a.jpg

    Hmmm, I know what you mean here. Thing is, I find that redrawing the same scene is rather pointless, especially when it can result in mismatched art. Not that I'm not taking your criticisms into account or anything (I am, which is why I posted the thread in the first place), but sometimes it's rather pointless to do it the hard way. I mean, even PA has done it at times (there was a strip I read last night from 2002 - the one where Gabe "got a new hat" - which only had slight variations on facial expressions - I'm not going to bother browsing through the archives for it right now). But, I get what you mean.

    As for the jokes and whatnot, I'm currently working on refining the whole "idea" of the comic, to focus more on a single topic. Problem is, I'm not sure which one. And I definately don't want it to become a PA knockoff.

    As for lyrium's comment on "site whoring", I fail to see the point of re-posting the art when it's already on the Interweb (and thus accessible by a link). I suppose I could put it up on Photobucket or something, if it's that much of a problem.

    - N.

    The Warmaster on
  • Highlander_77Highlander_77 Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    As for lyrium's comment on "site whoring", I fail to see the point of re-posting the art when it's already on the Interweb (and thus accessible by a link). I suppose I could put it up on Photobucket or something, if it's that much of a problem.

    - N.

    You don't even have to do that, as your site appears to allow hotlinking directly from the site. Just post the images directly in the thread using the URL of the picture along with the "" tags. Easy as pie. See?fb2767b943ac8c31985868b198324561.jpg

    Highlander_77 on
    El_Pollo_Diablo.jpg"Madre de Dios! Es el Pollo Diablo!"
  • Stupid Mr Whoopsie NameStupid Mr Whoopsie Name Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited July 2007
    I love Penny-Arcade as much as the next guy but it drives me up a fucking wall when Tycho says "Dreaded Continuity" and even more so when people copy him. Look at me! I'm stuck up here now, driven up a goddamn wall.

    Stupid Mr Whoopsie Name on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • UncleSamUncleSam Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Hmmm, I know what you mean here. Thing is, I find that redrawing the same scene is rather pointless, especially when it can result in mismatched art. Not that I'm not taking your criticisms into account or anything (I am, which is why I posted the thread in the first place), but sometimes it's rather pointless to do it the hard way. I mean, even PA has done it at times (there was a strip I read last night from 2002 - the one where Gabe "got a new hat" - which only had slight variations on facial expressions - I'm not going to bother browsing through the archives for it right now). But, I get what you mean.

    As for the jokes and whatnot, I'm currently working on refining the whole "idea" of the comic, to focus more on a single topic. Problem is, I'm not sure which one. And I definately don't want it to become a PA knockoff.

    As for lyrium's comment on "site whoring", I fail to see the point of re-posting the art when it's already on the Interweb (and thus accessible by a link). I suppose I could put it up on Photobucket or something, if it's that much of a problem.

    - N.

    Well, if drawing the characters consistently from panel to panel is a problem... well, that's a problem. It instantly pops out to the reader, and comes across as lazy. The character seem very static if they're just copied. And I know it's just one strip, but it still stands out.

    As for the jokes, I guess you'll just have to figure out which audience you're going for. A few of the comic go right over my head, and would only make sense to someone into whatever specific war gaming system you're referencing . That's fine, but it's only funny to people that have the background to get those jokes.

    UncleSam on
    SteamID : sammer105
  • NakedElfNakedElf Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Some comics are too wide. Generally speaking, you shouldn't go over 800 pixels.

    Most of the jokes, frankly, make no sense to me.

    You seem to have switched over to a completely different comic about halfway through--one which makes at least vague sense. It seems to be about some people who know each other and are nerdy/geeky in various ways. I'd say cut everything before that switch.

    Figure out the comic you want to do first and *then* do it.


    "Lack of resources" should never hold you back. I've seen people do amazing shit with pencils and crayons.

    NakedElf on
  • ShiboeShiboe Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Hmmm, I know what you mean here. Thing is, I find that redrawing the same scene is rather pointless, especially when it can result in mismatched art. Not that I'm not taking your criticisms into account or anything (I am, which is why I posted the thread in the first place), but sometimes it's rather pointless to do it the hard way. I mean, even PA has done it at times (there was a strip I read last night from 2002 - the one where Gabe "got a new hat" - which only had slight variations on facial expressions - I'm not going to bother browsing through the archives for it right now). But, I get what you mean.

    It's not about citing reference to other places where something bad has been done. From a purely "reader" viewpoint, it makes things ultra boring. Why would you use 3 panels, when you're really only drawing one? Why do you think people want to look at the same panel 3 times? Apart from that, you're panels are, by themselves pretty boring and simple.

    So what is to be done? Change the angles! I don't think a sideshot that's perfectly parallel to everything was ever interesting. Hell, even if you can't be bothered with moving your characters around or even changing their poses, at least change the angle of a cameral. Think of it like this: would you watch a movie where EVERY scene was shot from the side of the main character at eye level?

    Once you have worked on that, study some anatomy as per standard response, and get those characters more interesting and less static. Might also want to choose a font that doesn't read like a computer is talking.

    Shiboe on
  • The WarmasterThe Warmaster Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Shiboe wrote: »
    Hmmm, I know what you mean here. Thing is, I find that redrawing the same scene is rather pointless, especially when it can result in mismatched art. Not that I'm not taking your criticisms into account or anything (I am, which is why I posted the thread in the first place), but sometimes it's rather pointless to do it the hard way. I mean, even PA has done it at times (there was a strip I read last night from 2002 - the one where Gabe "got a new hat" - which only had slight variations on facial expressions - I'm not going to bother browsing through the archives for it right now). But, I get what you mean.

    It's not about citing reference to other places where something bad has been done. From a purely "reader" viewpoint, it makes things ultra boring. Why would you use 3 panels, when you're really only drawing one? Why do you think people want to look at the same panel 3 times? Apart from that, you're panels are, by themselves pretty boring and simple.

    So what is to be done? Change the angles! I don't think a sideshot that's perfectly parallel to everything was ever interesting. Hell, even if you can't be bothered with moving your characters around or even changing their poses, at least change the angle of a cameral. Think of it like this: would you watch a movie where EVERY scene was shot from the side of the main character at eye level?

    Once you have worked on that, study some anatomy as per standard response, and get those characters more interesting and less static. Might also want to choose a font that doesn't read like a computer is talking.

    I agree with you on the angles thing. As for the poses, I agree too. Fonts have irritated me to no end, as the school computers have limitations that don't let us add more.

    - N.

    The Warmaster on
  • The WarmasterThe Warmaster Registered User
    edited July 2007
    NakedElf wrote: »
    Some comics are too wide. Generally speaking, you shouldn't go over 800 pixels.

    Most of the jokes, frankly, make no sense to me.

    You seem to have switched over to a completely different comic about halfway through--one which makes at least vague sense. It seems to be about some people who know each other and are nerdy/geeky in various ways. I'd say cut everything before that switch.

    Figure out the comic you want to do first and *then* do it.


    "Lack of resources" should never hold you back. I've seen people do amazing shit with pencils and crayons.

    "The switch" that you refer to was when I got sick of the style I was using - took way too long to ink, especially with the bold lineart. I'm considering adding in some character bios very soon, which will help people get a greater understanding of the comic itself (I might also shift all the older stuff into an archive-type thing). It should also help with a lot of the jokes, which centre around their personal interests and whatnot. And, pencils and crayons? Those rarely ever look good on computer (although I'm only referring to pencils of the coloured vatiety here).

    Sorry if I'm going on and on a bit... I'm trying to go easy on the caffeine.

    - N.

    The Warmaster on
  • The WarmasterThe Warmaster Registered User
    edited July 2007
    I love Penny-Arcade as much as the next guy but it drives me up a fucking wall when Tycho says "Dreaded Continuity" and even more so when people copy him. Look at me! I'm stuck up here now, driven up a goddamn wall.

    The phrase doesn't particularly appeal to me, either. I don't even know why I use it (and I only use it rarely). The phrase "driven up a wall", and any of its variants, also irritate me (not having a go at you or anything, just the truth).

    - N.

    P.S: I'm thinking of giving the comic a new, "geek-political" type of persona (like, politics, but from the view of geeks). I wonder if that would work?

    The Warmaster on
  • MKRMKR Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    I love Penny-Arcade as much as the next guy but it drives me up a fucking wall when Tycho says "Dreaded Continuity" and even more so when people copy him. Look at me! I'm stuck up here now, driven up a goddamn wall.

    The phrase doesn't particularly appeal to me, either. I don't even know why I use it (and I only use it rarely). The phrase "driven up a wall", and any of its variants, also irritate me (not having a go at you or anything, just the truth).

    - N.

    P.S: I'm thinking of giving the comic a new, "geek-political" type of persona (like, politics, but from the view of geeks). I wonder if that would work?

    http://forums.penny-arcade.com/profile.php?do=editsignature

    MKR on
  • NakedElfNakedElf Registered User
    edited July 2007
    "The switch" that you refer to was when I got sick of the style I was using - took way too long to ink, especially with the bold lineart. I'm considering adding in some character bios very soon, which will help people get a greater understanding of the comic itself (I might also shift all the older stuff into an archive-type thing). It should also help with a lot of the jokes, which centre around their personal interests and whatnot. And, pencils and crayons? Those rarely ever look good on computer (although I'm only referring to pencils of the coloured vatiety here).

    Sorry if I'm going on and on a bit... I'm trying to go easy on the caffeine.

    - N.

    I think it was a good switch, overall.

    Developing personalities for your characters is a good idea, but the reader should be able to glean everything they need to know from the comic itself. 'Character Bios' and things of that nature are extras and shouldn't be necessary to understand the comic.

    Colored pencils and crayons, yup. Pretty much anything can be awesome if you just keep working at it.

    NakedElf on
  • MaydayMayday Cutting edge goblin tech Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    The camera behaviour is boring.

    Get back to work.

    Mayday on
  • The WarmasterThe Warmaster Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Mayday wrote: »
    The camera behaviour is boring.

    Get back to work.

    We've established that, but thanks for pointing it out.

    - N.

    The Warmaster on
  • CrowlestonCrowleston Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    MKR wrote: »
    I love Penny-Arcade as much as the next guy but it drives me up a fucking wall when Tycho says "Dreaded Continuity" and even more so when people copy him. Look at me! I'm stuck up here now, driven up a goddamn wall.

    The phrase doesn't particularly appeal to me, either. I don't even know why I use it (and I only use it rarely). The phrase "driven up a wall", and any of its variants, also irritate me (not having a go at you or anything, just the truth).

    - N.

    P.S: I'm thinking of giving the comic a new, "geek-political" type of persona (like, politics, but from the view of geeks). I wonder if that would work?

    http://forums.penny-arcade.com/profile.php?do=editsignature

    Are things still limed? I haven't seen it in a while...

    Crowleston on
    useless but necessary objects of society.
  • MKRMKR Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Crowleston wrote: »
    MKR wrote: »
    I love Penny-Arcade as much as the next guy but it drives me up a fucking wall when Tycho says "Dreaded Continuity" and even more so when people copy him. Look at me! I'm stuck up here now, driven up a goddamn wall.

    The phrase doesn't particularly appeal to me, either. I don't even know why I use it (and I only use it rarely). The phrase "driven up a wall", and any of its variants, also irritate me (not having a go at you or anything, just the truth).

    - N.

    P.S: I'm thinking of giving the comic a new, "geek-political" type of persona (like, politics, but from the view of geeks). I wonder if that would work?

    http://forums.penny-arcade.com/profile.php?do=editsignature

    Are things still limed? I haven't seen it in a while...

    Lime is so 2006.

    MKR on
  • hijinksensuehijinksensue Registered User
    edited August 2007
    Geeks and politics dont mix that well in my mind. Im bet most geeks have strong political viewpoints, but that doesnt sound like a very interesting comic (if the overall intent is to be funny). Finding a niche is hard. A lot of my comic ideas come from conversations I have with real people. It just so happens that these people are extremely witty which aides in the writing process. I often have to write and rewrite the dialog so that it makes sense in the comic format or to ensure that the "gag" is well timed.

    I agree with you that for a large chunk of 02-03 gabe was guilty of copy/pasting the panels over and over. This is BIG turn off for me, but the allure of speeding up the process is tempting. I try to at least move the "camera" in each panel even if the characters never move. It just gives the reader something new to look at. It also give the artist a reason to try harder and the end result is usually a more compelling comic.

    Not trying to whore my own stuff here but I do want to illustrate my point. In this comic, I could have done the same gag without ever moving the camera, but starting from behind the couch and panning over to the front allowed me to create a 3D space that the reader can relate to.

    2007-07-19%20home%20shopping%20baby%20jesus.jpg

    I think with practice you will have a pretty decent comic, but I would offer this advice before going any further:

    1) develop your characters. Who are they, what do they care about? How would they react in a given situation.
    2) Write before drawing, and write WITHOUT drawing. Write 30 ideas and draw the best one (or 5). Read the joke to someone before drawing it. Is it funny? Good writing can go a long way to prop up mediocre art.
    3) Move the camera. Cant stress this enough.

    Keep it up and dont get discouraged, but dont ignore the feedback just because it may also sound like criticism.

    hijinksensue on
    HijiNKS Ensue
    geek comic
    www.hijinksensue.com

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • The WarmasterThe Warmaster Registered User
    edited August 2007
    Geeks and politics dont mix that well in my mind. Im bet most geeks have strong political viewpoints, but that doesnt sound like a very interesting comic (if the overall intent is to be funny). Finding a niche is hard. A lot of my comic ideas come from conversations I have with real people. It just so happens that these people are extremely witty which aides in the writing process. I often have to write and rewrite the dialog so that it makes sense in the comic format or to ensure that the "gag" is well timed.

    I agree with you that for a large chunk of 02-03 gabe was guilty of copy/pasting the panels over and over. This is BIG turn off for me, but the allure of speeding up the process is tempting. I try to at least move the "camera" in each panel even if the characters never move. It just gives the reader something new to look at. It also give the artist a reason to try harder and the end result is usually a more compelling comic.

    Not trying to whore my own stuff here but I do want to illustrate my point. In this comic, I could have done the same gag without ever moving the camera, but starting from behind the couch and panning over to the front allowed me to create a 3D space that the reader can relate to.

    2007-07-19%20home%20shopping%20baby%20jesus.jpg

    I think with practice you will have a pretty decent comic, but I would offer this advice before going any further:

    1) develop your characters. Who are they, what do they care about? How would they react in a given situation.
    2) Write before drawing, and write WITHOUT drawing. Write 30 ideas and draw the best one (or 5). Read the joke to someone before drawing it. Is it funny? Good writing can go a long way to prop up mediocre art.
    3) Move the camera. Cant stress this enough.

    Keep it up and dont get discouraged, but dont ignore the feedback just because it may also sound like criticism.

    Thanks a lot for that advice. I've actually decided against the geek-political theme. It's just going to be geeks. Like it is already. Just with more structure.

    That strip of yours is a little disturbing, although "disturbing" doesn't necessarily translate into "not good".

    - N.

    The Warmaster on
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