Sega of America's President: "Sonic's only cool until you're 12"

Samir Duran Duran

Cervetus wrote: »

E-102 needs his own game. I don't care if you disagree. :x Actually, I liked Big too. And running around the world to the stages.

E-102 is the pimpbot, no doubt.

But an enormous retarded cat?

Timestones

Big is awesome. Just not as a playable character. I'd be perfectly happy if he was a reoccurring character in the series who has no actual relevance to the actual events of the games, and just appears randomly in the stages, maybe even having his own "story" that you get bits and pieces of every time you manage to spot him. Sort of like what they did in Sonic Adventure 2 (and I believe they did this in Secret Rings if I'm not mistaken?). In a way he'd be the Homsar of the Sonic universe.

LBD_Nytetrayn

KungFu wrote: »

Well sure, the shitty Sonics that have been coming out are only good for 12yr olds.

Funny, even at 12 years, I wouldn't have played the Sonic games that are as bad as some of what we've gotten lately.

OmegaVelocity wrote: »

http://img488.imageshack.us/img488/3857/omgwtfhowcouldthisbedi6.png

And then suddenly the topic took a bit of a twist.

Source is here.

I was hoping someone would have found that. Shitty half-assed reporting by Kotaku and others, natch.

malerik wrote: »

Master Chief does what he does to save humanity, Mario does it for cake, Duke Nukem does it for chicks, Solid Snake does it because he doesn't know anything else. Sonic used to do it because he was the only one left who could. Thats cool. Now he does it because it's 'radical' and he 'feels the need for speed'. Thats not cool. Thats posing like a prick when your friends need you.

Mario and Sonic's stories were a little closer than that, actually:

One day the kingdom of the peaceful mushroom people was invaded by the Koopaa tribe of turtles famous for their black magic. The quiet, peace-loving Mushroom People were turned into mere stones, bricks and even field horse-hair plants, and the Mushroom Kingdom fell into ruin.

The only one who can undo the magic spell on the Mushroom People and return them to their normal selves is the Princess Toadstool, the daughter of the Mushroom King. Unfortunately, she is presently in the hands of the great Koopa turtle king.

Mario, the hero of this story (maybe) hears about the Mushroom People's plight and sets out on a quest to free the Mushroom Princess from the evil Koopa and restore the fallen kingdom of the Mushroom People.

You are Mario! It's up to you to save the Mushroom People from the black magic of the Koopa!

C'mon... that's always been cool.

Timestones wrote: »

Big is awesome. Just not as a playable character. I'd be perfectly happy if he was a reoccurring character in the series who has no actual relevance to the actual events of the games, and just appears randomly in the stages, maybe even having his own "story" that you get bits and pieces of every time you manage to spot him. Sort of like what they did in Sonic Adventure 2 (and I believe they did this in Secret Rings if I'm not mistaken?). In a way he'd be the Homsar of the Sonic universe.

I like the character enough, but hated playing his part of SA.

In tune with your idea, make him like Luigi in The Thousand Year Door.

Daedalus

DrDizaster wrote: »

The Adventure games were 80% shit. There was more content in them that was almost unplayably bad than there was good content. Yes the good content was remarkably good. But even then the camera sucked.

They were complete failures in terms of execution.

The second one, definitely, but SA1 was probably only like 20% shit.

No wait, I forgot Big The Cat, aka "Buy Our Dreamcast Fishing Rod Controller, Too". Make that 40% shit. Still, pretty good unless you compare it against other, better Dreamcast launch titles like Soul Calibur or Power Stone...

I don't really know where I went with that. My point is that Sonic Adventure The First One was no Super Mario 64 but it was still pretty good and more importantly showed a lot of potential for future 3D Sonic games, and if the series had gotten better from there instead of (far, far) worse, well, Sega wouldn't have its current problem.

The Wolfman

malerik wrote: »

My problem was sonic was always that I was told he was cool.

Think of it like this: if Halo had adverts saying 'here is master chief, he's a super cool cyborg dude with an attitude' I think people would like the character distinctly less. As it stands we are only told who master chief is, not what he's like. He's not super chatty, but he does cool stuff and that makes him cool.

Sonic runs really fast and bops robots. Thats great. That has the startings of cool. But being force-fed someone else's idea of cool is annoying. Sonic has always been wearing headphones, listening to rock and rap music, doing XTREME sports, talking in slang and acting like a dick because 'he has an attitude'. These things don't really make him cool. Being told by Sega that these things make him cool makes him seem like a shell.

If sega just let the character be what he was set up to be in the first game, a citizen of a small planet who comes home from a run to find all his friends have been turned into robots and decides to do something about it, then I think the public perception of sonic would be a lot more positive.

Master Chief does what he does to save humanity, Mario does it for cake, Duke Nukem does it for chicks, Solid Snake does it because he doesn't know anything else. Sonic used to do it because he was the only one left who could. Thats cool. Now he does it because it's 'radical' and he 'feels the need for speed'. Thats not cool. Thats posing like a prick when your friends need you.

For some reason, this reminds me of the Simpsons episode where they discussed "cool"

Homer: So I realized that being with my family is more important
than being cool.
Bart: Dad, what you just said was powerfully uncool.
Homer: You know what the song says: "It's hip to be square."
Lisa: That song is so lame.
Homer: So lame that it's... cool?
Bart and Lisa: No.
Marge: Am I cool, kids?
Bart and Lisa: No.
Marge: Good. I'm glad. And that's what makes me cool—not caring, right?
Bart and Lisa: No.
Marge: Well, how the hell do you be cool? I feel like we've tried
everything here.
Homer: Wait, Marge. Maybe if you're truly cool, you don't need to
be told you're cool.
Bart: Well, sure you do.
Lisa: How else would you know?

Local H Jay

desperaterobots wrote: »

I never liked sonic because the character was cool. I liked the games because they were stupidly fast exploration gem-hoarding robot-destroying animal-saving knuckle-gliding fun.

With pinball bits.

Agreed.
I love the sense of speed and ring collection system.

Htown

The Sonic levels in Sonic Adventure were fantastically fun. The camera had problems, but the game managed to deliver a genuine sense of scale and speed. The E-102 levels were pretty fun as well.

But here's the problem. If you're doing different genres for each character, why on Earth would you make the Knuckles levels a dumb treasure hunt instead of, I don't know, A BEAT 'EM UP?

Frem

The sad thing is, the only thing that really ruined the games for me was poor level design and a complete lack of beta testing.

Example: Sonic Heroes.
I can deal with a camera that randomly looks at the sky when the characters get in a go-cart on a track elevated 3 miles over the ground. Just put in a stupid checkpoint before that happens. Is it really so hard?

Also, the explanatory voice that tells me that the red lines on the track aren't just for decoration. That should really play like five seconds *before* the cart starts going over them. Not afterwards, as my characters plummet to the ground screaming.

Cervetus

Timestones wrote: »

Big is awesome. Just not as a playable character. I'd be perfectly happy if he was a reoccurring character in the series who has no actual relevance to the actual events of the games, and just appears randomly in the stages, maybe even having his own "story" that you get bits and pieces of every time you manage to spot him. Sort of like what they did in Sonic Adventure 2 (and I believe they did this in Secret Rings if I'm not mistaken?). In a way he'd be the Homsar of the Sonic universe.

I can dig it. After reading your thing I realized that I really did just like Big as a character, not necessarily as a playable one.

Htown wrote: »

But here's the problem. If you're doing different genres for each character, why on Earth would you make the Knuckles levels a dumb treasure hunt instead of, I don't know, A BEAT 'EM UP?

Maybe it hsouldn't have been Knuckles doing it, (maybe; gliding around looking for stuff is pretty fun) but I really did like the treasure hunt levels.

LBD_Nytetrayn

I liked the treasure hunt levels, too.

Gliding and climbing is just so much fun... it made a good transition from 2D to 3D.

Samir Duran Duran

Yeah the treasure hunt levels weren't bad really. The main offenders are fishing and stupid tails/robotnik walkers.

I mean, knuckles raps ABOUT THE LEVELS, come on.

Lewisham

The treasure hunt levels were absolutely horrific. I'd rather have stabbed myself in the thighs with cocktail sticks. They were absolutely devoid of skill, gameplay, narrative or interest.

Are you all on pills?

Htown

They really were pretty bad.

FyreWulff

I liked Adbenture 2, thought Adventure was a piece of crap, but the treasure hunting levels are still better than SA2's driving levels.

seriously Sega, stop at 3 genres

Shadowfire

The treasure hunting was fine in SA, but in the sequel, the levels were really too big for them to be fun.

Of course, I guess that seems to be the norm for SA2... Tails' levels in the first one were great, but boring in the second.

I liked the Big levels...

Speed Racer

My old girlfriend had memorized everywhere an emerald could potentially be in every treasure hunt level of SA2. She could finish most of them in 30-45 seconds.

ben0207

I liked the Tails race levels in SA1, but those stupid walkers were shit.

Also, I was 12 in 98, so this guy is about 3 years wrong.

AJAlkaline40

The Wolfman wrote: »

I still think it's hilarious that Sega's idea of "rebooting the series" was to add ANOTHER character. Another hedgehog no less.

Honest to god, and please don't make fun of me, but I found playing as Silver really, really fun. Horrible character with horrible character design, but the game play was actually really fun in my opinion.

Actually, people might crucify me for this, but I thought a lot of that game was actually really fun. It is not intuitive, and the difficulty was surprising (especially when the difficulty fluctuates from literally not touching the controller to Ninja Gaiden within seconds in some areas), but I still thought it was fundamentally enjoyable. I really liked how they employed the majority of the side characters, which was to throw them in at different points of some of the levels for some variation, and they were just that, variation on Sonic's game play, not some damn treasure hunt or shooting gallery. Yeah the plot was painful and the game had serious issues as far as bugs and poor design choices, it was enjoyable enough.

Also, I think the way Sega is going, if they keep wanting to have Sonic interact with people and have players take him seriously, they ought to just make him a human. Perhaps do something like redesign the Sonic characters in the style of Jet Set Radio, but retain the game play and basic plot. I don't know how I'd feel about it, it would either rape or revitalize the series, based on how you look at it.

Glal

UnbreakableVow wrote: »

Whenever I think of Sonic, I think of the Poochy episode of The Simpsons.

"He needs to have more attitude!"

*Darkens the shades*

"Yes, that's the perfect amount of attitude!"

Attitude!

LBD_Nytetrayn

AJAlkaline40 wrote: »

The Wolfman wrote: »

I still think it's hilarious that Sega's idea of "rebooting the series" was to add ANOTHER character. Another hedgehog no less.

Honest to god, and please don't make fun of me, but I found playing as Silver really, really fun. Horrible character with horrible character design, but the game play was actually really fun in my opinion.

Actually, people might crucify me for this, but I thought a lot of that game was actually really fun. It is not intuitive, and the difficulty was surprising (especially when the difficulty fluctuates from literally not touching the controller to Ninja Gaiden within seconds in some areas), but I still thought it was fundamentally enjoyable. I really liked how they employed the majority of the side characters, which was to throw them in at different points of some of the levels for some variation, and they were just that, variation on Sonic's game play, not some damn treasure hunt or shooting gallery. Yeah the plot was painful and the game had serious issues as far as bugs and poor design choices, it was enjoyable enough.

Also, I think the way Sega is going, if they keep wanting to have Sonic interact with people and have players take him seriously, they ought to just make him a human. Perhaps do something like redesign the Sonic characters in the style of Jet Set Radio, but retain the game play and basic plot. I don't know how I'd feel about it, it would either rape or revitalize the series, based on how you look at it.

Playing the demo of Sonic 360 for the first time felt like trying to control one of those puppets with the different sticks... it didn't go well.

And I've played my share of 3D Sonics, so its not like inexperience with Sonic was a factor...

TheSonicRetard

slash000

You know you still own one of those sweaters, TSR.

TheSonicRetard

slash000 wrote: »

You know you still own one of those sweaters, TSR.

I have this shirt:



and another brown shirt which I can't find a picture of online. I also had a sonic 2 jacket when I was younger which said "R U UP 2 IT?" on it.

elkatas

TheSonicRetard wrote: »

Incorrect. Main reason why their games suck is that they test them with members of Sonic Passion (NSFW) forums. Easily the greatest forum on the whole web.

scootch

what the fuck....

BubbaT

DrDizaster wrote: »

BubbaT wrote: »

Sonic was cool? He was a short fat animal whose body type made you wonder how he could run fast. Sonic had the same pot belly Mario did.

It wasn't until Sonic Adventure that he became a tall, skinny, breakdancing, rail-grinding DJ.

This is either revisionist history or history from someone who doesn't remember the early 90s clearly

I remember SEGA trying to be cool with their "in your face" yelling and "Nintendon't" stuff, but I don't recall the early Sonic character as cool.

What, because he wagged his finger and tapped his foot? That doesn't make up for the fact that he floated around the special stages to decidedly uncool dreamtastic music. Cool kids only listened to rock, pop or rap. Or that he was stopping fluffy widdle animals from becoming badass cyborgs, also uncool.

Sonic on Genesis probably watched America's Funniest Home Videos instead of In Living Color.

MinionOfCthulhu

elkatas wrote: »

TheSonicRetard wrote: »

[img][/img]

Incorrect. Main reason why their games suck is that they test them with members of Sonic Passion (NSFW) forums. Easily the greatest forum on the whole web.

Oh god what the fuck why can't I unsee that why did I click that

NofrikinfuN

Man. I think I need to cut down on my internet intake.

TheBlackWind

The saddest thing about that article was the painful reminder that we have not gotten a new Jet Set game in a while.

Stigma

BubbaT wrote: »

DrDizaster wrote: »

BubbaT wrote: »

Sonic was cool? He was a short fat animal whose body type made you wonder how he could run fast. Sonic had the same pot belly Mario did.

It wasn't until Sonic Adventure that he became a tall, skinny, breakdancing, rail-grinding DJ.

This is either revisionist history or history from someone who doesn't remember the early 90s clearly

I remember SEGA trying to be cool with their "in your face" yelling and "Nintendon't" stuff, but I don't recall the early Sonic character as cool.

What, because he wagged his finger and tapped his foot? That doesn't make up for the fact that he floated around the special stages to decidedly uncool dreamtastic music. Cool kids only listened to rock, pop or rap. Or that he was stopping fluffy widdle animals from becoming badass cyborgs, also uncool.

Sonic on Genesis probably watched America's Funniest Home Videos instead of In Living Color.

Cool kids listened to pop?

Ragnar Dragonfyre

Why can't Sega make a good Fantasy Star game anymore?

HallowedFaith

Sonic Passion...


Wow.

TheSonicRetard

Ragnar Dragonfyre wrote: »

Why can't Sega make a good Fantasy Star game anymore?

Sega has never made a Fantasy Star game before.

gilrain

TheSonicRetard wrote: »

Ragnar Dragonfyre wrote: »

Why can't Sega make a good Fantasy Star game anymore?

Sega has never made a Fantasy Star game before.

Man, everyone knows Fantasy Star was phat!

jahchief212

Funny thing is that Sega hasn't been cool since I was 12. Coincidence?

maximumzero

TheSonicRetard wrote: »

slash000 wrote: »

You know you still own one of those sweaters, TSR.

I have this shirt:



and another brown shirt which I can't find a picture of online. I also had a sonic 2 jacket when I was younger which said "R U UP 2 IT?" on it.

Excuse the shitty picture quality--my girlfriend currently has my digital camera.



That's the three I have.

LBD_Nytetrayn

Nice shirts, where do you get them?

maximumzero

The right two were hot topic and the black one was Sears.

Sears one was a christmas gift, though I remember seeing it in the store before I received it, and I didn't even ask. How my sister knew still boggles my mind. The white one is a "jersey" shirt. Thin annoying material with 3/4 sleeves.

Waka Laka

maximumzero wrote: »

That's the three I have.

Do WANT!

maximumzero

Waka Laka wrote: »

maximumzero wrote: »

That's the three I have.

Do WANT!

I found a Blue Version of it online, but I have to say that I do like the red metallic lettering better.

There's apparently also a Shadow one, though I like this one considerably less.

Also, check your local K-Mart...if there is a local K-Mart for you. I've seen the blue Sonic one there recently.

There's also a hideous version of the jersey shirt (that's not actually a jersey shirt) I have apparently, as well as whatever the fuck this is.