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American Presidency: McCain picks Palin

ThanatosThanatos Registered User regular
edited August 2008 in Debate and/or Discourse
Dems say Palin is 'risky,' could be a disaster

(CNN) – A leading House Democrat said Friday John McCain's choice of Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin is a "risky" move that could ultimately prove disastrous to the Republican prospects in November.

Meanwhile, a top Senate Democrat said the pick is a "Hail Mary pass" and a "roll of the dice," in what is the initial reactions from McCain's rival party.

Speaking to South Carolina ETV Radio, House Majority Whip Jim Clyburn likened the choice of Palin to Walter Mondale's choice of Geraldine Ferraro in 1984 and George H.W. Bush's pick of Dan Quayle in 1988. Both picks — relatively unknown political figures at the time — generated initial excitement but were ultimately deemed poor choices by many political observers.

"I think (her selection) would be something similar to Dan Quayle — Dan Quayle proved to be sort of an embarrassment as a campaigner, being thrust on a national stage like that could be very tough," Clyburn said. "Now Mondale tried to shake things up by going with Geraldine Ferraro, she proved to be a disaster as a running mate. And as a campaigner, she was absolutely awful."

"And so I just think that it is very risky for McCain to do this, but it may be all he has left," Clyburn also said.

In an issued statement, Sen. Chuck Schumer said Palin is significantly mismatched to Democratic VP candidate Joe Biden and said the prospect of her becoming president is "troubling."

"It is a real role of the dice and shows how John McCain, Karl Rove et al realize what a strong position the Obama-Biden team and Democrats in general are in in this election," Schumer said. "Certainly the choice of Palin puts to rest any argument about inexperience on the Democratic team and while Palin is a fine person, her lack of experience makes the thought of her assuming the presidency troubling. I particularly look forward to the Biden-Palin debate in Missouri.”

The Obama campaign also told CNN Friday the choice of Palin takes the question of experience "off the table."

"Experience is being taken off the table considering you're putting someone within a heartbeat of the presidency with the thinnest foreign policy experience in history," spokesman Bill Burton said.

Update: Rep. Rahm Emanuel, the 4th ranking House Democrat, said in a statement the choice of Palin "shows political panic."

"Is this really who the Republican Party wants to be one heartbeat away from the Presidency? Given Sarah Palin's lack of experience on every front and on nearly every issue, this Vice Presidential pick doesn't show judgment: it shows political panic," he said.

Thanatos on
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    DeaconBluesDeaconBlues __BANNED USERS regular
    edited August 2008
    Why'd you lock the other thread?

    DeaconBlues on
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    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited August 2008
    more executive experience than obama, biden, and mccain, right? I just want to make sure I have this shit clear.

    Variable on
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    Monolithic_DomeMonolithic_Dome Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Man making fun of her for being hot is one thing. But comparing her to Dan Quayle? That's just fucking mean.

    Monolithic_Dome on
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    PeekingDuckPeekingDuck __BANNED USERS regular
    edited August 2008
    Why did the other one get locked?

    Anyway - I didn't see anywhere in that article that she supported the windfall tax legislation. Just that she approved it. I would honestly like to see something if she supported it though as that would surely adjust my opinion of her.

    PeekingDuck on
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    DeaconBluesDeaconBlues __BANNED USERS regular
    edited August 2008
    Technically true! (variable)

    DeaconBlues on
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    galenbladegalenblade Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    IN NON-PALIN NEWS:
    Obama's speech seen by 38 million viewers

    NEW YORK (AP) — Barack Obama's acceptance speech at the Democratic National Convention was seen by more than 38 million people.

    Nielsen Media Research said more people watched Obama speak than watched the Olympics opening ceremony in Beijing, the final "American Idol" or the Academy Awards this year. Obama talked before a live audience of 80,000 people in Denver.

    His TV audience nearly doubled the amount of people who watched John Kerry accept the Democratic nomination to run against President Bush four years ago. Kerry's speech was seen by just over 20 million people.

    Obama's audience might be higher, since Nielsen didn't have an estimate for how many people watched Obama on PBS or C-SPAN Thursday night.

    galenblade on
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    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited August 2008
    So the stock response to raising questions about Palin's qualifications seems to be to laugh in a condescending way and say, "Palin has more executive experience than Obama and Biden combined!"

    and mccain. (right?)

    so that's useless or at least easily knocked down.

    edit - okay, thanks deacon didn't know if that was to me.

    Variable on
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    RingoRingo He/Him a distinct lack of substanceRegistered User regular
    edited August 2008
    So the current thinking around the office here is that it was Palin because she was the only one who'd agree to jump aboard McCain's sinking ship.

    Ringo on
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    PotatoNinjaPotatoNinja Fake Gamer Goat Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Does my extensive experience with Sim City and Sim City 2000 give me executive experience? I'm just wondering what counts and what doesn't, in case I ever need to run for office.

    PotatoNinja on
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    ZephyrZephyr Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    galenblade wrote: »
    IN NON-PALIN NEWS:
    Obama's speech seen by 38 million viewers

    NEW YORK (AP) — Barack Obama's acceptance speech at the Democratic National Convention was seen by more than 38 million people.

    Nielsen Media Research said more people watched Obama speak than watched the Olympics opening ceremony in Beijing, the final "American Idol" or the Academy Awards this year. Obama talked before a live audience of 80,000 people in Denver.

    His TV audience nearly doubled the amount of people who watched John Kerry accept the Democratic nomination to run against President Bush four years ago. Kerry's speech was seen by just over 20 million people.

    Obama's audience might be higher, since Nielsen didn't have an estimate for how many people watched Obama on PBS or C-SPAN Thursday night.

    so like 40 million

    christ

    Zephyr on
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    PotatoNinjaPotatoNinja Fake Gamer Goat Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    galenblade wrote: »
    IN NON-PALIN NEWS:
    Obama's speech seen by 38 million viewers

    NEW YORK (AP) — Barack Obama's acceptance speech at the Democratic National Convention was seen by more than 38 million people.

    Nielsen Media Research said more people watched Obama speak than watched the Olympics opening ceremony in Beijing, the final "American Idol" or the Academy Awards this year. Obama talked before a live audience of 80,000 people in Denver.

    His TV audience nearly doubled the amount of people who watched John Kerry accept the Democratic nomination to run against President Bush four years ago. Kerry's speech was seen by just over 20 million people.

    Obama's audience might be higher, since Nielsen didn't have an estimate for how many people watched Obama on PBS or C-SPAN Thursday night.

    Voter turnout says what?

    PotatoNinja on
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    ThanatosThanatos Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Why'd you lock the other thread?
    Reboot to hopefully get rid of the stupid.

    Thanatos on
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    PeekingDuckPeekingDuck __BANNED USERS regular
    edited August 2008
    That opening post is disgusting, by the way. Change the tone with a different title, a conflicted opening in relation to the positive narrative right now. Just disgusting.

    PeekingDuck on
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    GoodOmensGoodOmens Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Anyway - I didn't see anywhere in that article that she supported the windfall tax legislation. Just that she approved it. I would honestly like to see something if she supported it though as that would surely adjust my opinion of her.

    http://www.mcclatchydc.com/260/story/50742.html

    I have no idea if that site is reliable, but it says that she proposed it in June. Other sites (including several stories that I found on Alaska newspapers sites) confirm.

    GoodOmens on
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    Lord YodLord Yod Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Just throwing some things in there:
    Palin agrees that we should tax windfall profits from Big Oil
    Over the opposition of oil companies, Republican Gov. Sarah Palin and Alaska's Legislature last year approved a major increase in taxes on the oil industry — a step that has generated stunning new wealth for the state as oil prices soared.
    And she hates polar bears
    The state of Alaska will sue the U.S. government to stop the listing of the polar bear as a threatened species, arguing the designation will slow development in the state, Gov. Sarah Palin said on Wednesday.
    Cute-PolarBear-Cub-SittingOnSnow.jpg

    Lord Yod on
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    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited August 2008
    galenblade wrote: »
    IN NON-PALIN NEWS:
    Obama's speech seen by 38 million viewers

    NEW YORK (AP) — Barack Obama's acceptance speech at the Democratic National Convention was seen by more than 38 million people.

    Nielsen Media Research said more people watched Obama speak than watched the Olympics opening ceremony in Beijing, the final "American Idol" or the Academy Awards this year. Obama talked before a live audience of 80,000 people in Denver.

    His TV audience nearly doubled the amount of people who watched John Kerry accept the Democratic nomination to run against President Bush four years ago. Kerry's speech was seen by just over 20 million people.

    Obama's audience might be higher, since Nielsen didn't have an estimate for how many people watched Obama on PBS or C-SPAN Thursday night.

    this also would not count those streaming it online right? I assume no but figure it's worth asking.

    Variable on
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    tsmvengytsmvengy Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Man making fun of her for being hot is one thing. But comparing her to Dan Quayle? That's just fucking mean.

    I think it's an appropriate comparison; faced with only bad choices, McCain picks a nobody, someone who can't be attacked for flip flopping, and it comes out of left field so it gets media attention.

    Thanks Than for locking that crap - that other thread got stupid.


    Also, woo Rahm Emanuel!

    tsmvengy on
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    PotatoNinjaPotatoNinja Fake Gamer Goat Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Ringo wrote: »
    So the current thinking around the office here is that it was Palin because she was the only one who'd agree to jump aboard McCain's sinking ship.

    Pawlenty and Romney both would have been on board, the current rumor is they're both kind of pissed at being passed over for a lightweight. I don't think potential-VP is a job many people scoff at.

    PotatoNinja on
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    Robos A Go GoRobos A Go Go Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Variable wrote: »
    So the stock response to raising questions about Palin's qualifications seems to be to laugh in a condescending way and say, "Palin has more executive experience than Obama and Biden combined!"

    and mccain. (right?)

    so that's useless or at least easily knocked down.

    edit - okay, thanks deacon didn't know if that was to me.

    Yeah, I don't get it, but so far none of the news anchors have used that obvious response.

    Robos A Go Go on
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    CrimsondudeCrimsondude Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Heather Wilson has more experience in national security than McCain, but I don't imagine she mentions that on Fox.

    Anyway, I'm curious since I'll be damned if I vote for McCain. But what exactly do he and Palin stand for? How is the country going to be a better place if they're in office?

    Crimsondude on
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    monikermoniker Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Technically true! (variable)

    Would Obama's time chairing a board or something at UoC count as executive experience? Because I'm pretty sure he governed more people in that position than Palin did in Alaska.
    :P

    moniker on
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    FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    edited August 2008
    That opening post is disgusting, by the way. Change the tone with a different title, a conflicted opening in relation to the positive narrative right now. Just disgusting.
    Why? It's a senior democratic reaction to a republican vp pick.

    Fencingsax on
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    EndEnd Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Variable wrote: »
    galenblade wrote: »
    IN NON-PALIN NEWS:
    Obama's speech seen by 38 million viewers

    NEW YORK (AP) — Barack Obama's acceptance speech at the Democratic National Convention was seen by more than 38 million people.

    Nielsen Media Research said more people watched Obama speak than watched the Olympics opening ceremony in Beijing, the final "American Idol" or the Academy Awards this year. Obama talked before a live audience of 80,000 people in Denver.

    His TV audience nearly doubled the amount of people who watched John Kerry accept the Democratic nomination to run against President Bush four years ago. Kerry's speech was seen by just over 20 million people.

    Obama's audience might be higher, since Nielsen didn't have an estimate for how many people watched Obama on PBS or C-SPAN Thursday night.

    this also would not count those streaming it online right? I assume no but figure it's worth asking.

    Well, they mention TV, but also say they don't have all of TV, so I doubt think they have online numbers either.

    While I'm sure its a decent number, online viewers won't be that much initially anyways as it will be when people view it online to catch up if they missed it.

    End on
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    PeekingDuckPeekingDuck __BANNED USERS regular
    edited August 2008
    Okay guys, it says approved, not supported. Her job is to represent the people. I'm still not seeing the supported or proposed aspects. Am I missing something you're seeing?

    PeekingDuck on
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    Mr PinkMr Pink I got cats for youRegistered User regular
    edited August 2008
    So I read the first article this morning on CNN about this and my eyes instantly jumped to the part about her husband being a big guy in oil. I think that's probably something the Dems could latch onto pretty hard.

    Mr Pink on
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    TachTach Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    galenblade wrote: »
    IN NON-PALIN NEWS:
    Obama's speech seen by 38 million viewers

    NEW YORK (AP) — Barack Obama's acceptance speech at the Democratic National Convention was seen by more than 38 million people.

    Nielsen Media Research said more people watched Obama speak than watched the Olympics opening ceremony in Beijing, the final "American Idol" or the Academy Awards this year. Obama talked before a live audience of 80,000 people in Denver.

    His TV audience nearly doubled the amount of people who watched John Kerry accept the Democratic nomination to run against President Bush four years ago. Kerry's speech was seen by just over 20 million people.

    Obama's audience might be higher, since Nielsen didn't have an estimate for how many people watched Obama on PBS or C-SPAN Thursday night.

    image.php?u=14591&dateline=1139287766

    "Stop hiding behind those phony numbers, Obama! You know those ratings don't take into account homes with more than one television!"

    Tach on
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    PeekingDuckPeekingDuck __BANNED USERS regular
    edited August 2008
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    That opening post is disgusting, by the way. Change the tone with a different title, a conflicted opening in relation to the positive narrative right now. Just disgusting.
    Why? It's a senior democratic reaction to a republican vp pick.

    I'm not that stupid.

    PeekingDuck on
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    galenbladegalenblade Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Variable wrote: »
    galenblade wrote: »
    IN NON-PALIN NEWS:
    Obama's speech seen by 38 million viewers

    this also would not count those streaming it online right? I assume no but figure it's worth asking.

    Probably not. Nielsen only measures TV viewership, as far as I know, but what was posted was the entire text of the article.

    galenblade on
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    SenjutsuSenjutsu thot enthusiast Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Does my extensive experience with Sim City and Sim City 2000 give me executive experience? I'm just wondering what counts and what doesn't, in case I ever need to run for office.

    It depends on if you're republican or not

    Senjutsu on
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    monikermoniker Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Zephyr wrote: »
    galenblade wrote: »
    IN NON-PALIN NEWS:
    Obama's speech seen by 38 million viewers

    NEW YORK (AP) — Barack Obama's acceptance speech at the Democratic National Convention was seen by more than 38 million people.

    Nielsen Media Research said more people watched Obama speak than watched the Olympics opening ceremony in Beijing, the final "American Idol" or the Academy Awards this year. Obama talked before a live audience of 80,000 people in Denver.

    His TV audience nearly doubled the amount of people who watched John Kerry accept the Democratic nomination to run against President Bush four years ago. Kerry's speech was seen by just over 20 million people.

    Obama's audience might be higher, since Nielsen didn't have an estimate for how many people watched Obama on PBS or C-SPAN Thursday night.

    so like 40 million

    christ

    Nielsen doesn't count PBS homes? Then how the hell do they know how many people watch Sesame Street or whatever?

    moniker on
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    PotatoNinjaPotatoNinja Fake Gamer Goat Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Okay guys, it says approved, not supported. Her job is to represent the people.

    What exactly is the difference? Did she argue against it or threaten any kind of obstruction / veto?

    PotatoNinja on
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    PeekingDuckPeekingDuck __BANNED USERS regular
    edited August 2008
    Okay guys, it says approved, not supported. Her job is to represent the people.

    What exactly is the difference? Did she argue against it or threaten any kind of obstruction / veto?

    There is a huge difference, and I don't think she would if it is the people's will.

    PeekingDuck on
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    tsmvengytsmvengy Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Heather Wilson has more experience in national security than McCain, but I don't imagine she mentions that on Fox.

    Anyway, I'm curious since I'll be damned if I vote for McCain. But what exactly do he and Palin stand for? How is the country going to be a better place if they're in office?

    That is the point - they stand for nothing other than "we are not Obama/Dems." They have no plans for making America better - their plans consist of cutting taxes for the rich even more, continuing the Iraq war until we "win" (whatever that means) and protecting us from terrorists.

    tsmvengy on
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    EndEnd Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    moniker wrote: »
    Nielsen doesn't count PBS homes? Then how the hell do they know how many people watch Sesame Street or whatever?

    Why would they care? Isn't Nielsen aimed at advertisers?

    (Or is that your disguised point?)

    End on
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    PotatoNinjaPotatoNinja Fake Gamer Goat Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Senjutsu wrote: »
    Does my extensive experience with Sim City and Sim City 2000 give me executive experience? I'm just wondering what counts and what doesn't, in case I ever need to run for office.

    It depends on if you're republican or not

    I do randomly summon hurricans to my city and refuse to offer a response :winky:

    I'm also very pro-military, but mostly to respond to the imminent Godzilla threat.

    PotatoNinja on
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    SavantSavant Simply Barbaric Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Holy balls. This is crazy. Is it crazy enough that it just might work? Who knows.

    There's one thing about the blatant play to the out there disaffected Hillary supporters which could massively backfire: their crazy might cross the line twice so they go back to Obama because they sure don't want this dark horse to be the first woman P/VP over their beloved Hillary. It was a risk in the Sebelius choice, although magnified even more.

    Savant on
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    TheMarshalTheMarshal Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    I mean I read her Wiki page and some of her environmental stuff was okay. I misunderstood what "Feminists for Life" meant (ohhhh... THAT kind of "for life"), but it seems like McCain picked her pretty much because he's trying to court Hillary die-hards. Does anybody have any rational reasons why they'd pick a junior Governor from a rural state other than what has been mentioned?

    TheMarshal on
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    PantsBPantsB Fake Thomas Jefferson Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    galenblade wrote: »
    IN NON-PALIN NEWS:
    Obama's speech seen by 38 million viewers

    NEW YORK (AP) — Barack Obama's acceptance speech at the Democratic National Convention was seen by more than 38 million people.

    Nielsen Media Research said more people watched Obama speak than watched the Olympics opening ceremony in Beijing, the final "American Idol" or the Academy Awards this year. Obama talked before a live audience of 80,000 people in Denver.

    His TV audience nearly doubled the amount of people who watched John Kerry accept the Democratic nomination to run against President Bush four years ago. Kerry's speech was seen by just over 20 million people.

    Obama's audience might be higher, since Nielsen didn't have an estimate for how many people watched Obama on PBS or C-SPAN Thursday night.
    Holy crap. I knew a lot of people watched but damn.

    PantsB on
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    enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    edited August 2008
    enlightenedbum on
    Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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    RingoRingo He/Him a distinct lack of substanceRegistered User regular
    edited August 2008
    Ringo wrote: »
    So the current thinking around the office here is that it was Palin because she was the only one who'd agree to jump aboard McCain's sinking ship.

    Pawlenty and Romney both would have been on board, the current rumor is they're both kind of pissed at being passed over for a lightweight. I don't think potential-VP is a job many people scoff at.

    I guess it goes that if you're thinking that McCain is becoming an increasingly bad bet, and you still want to run for President in the future, it's best not to be found in the wreckage come November?

    Ringo on
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